I've never had occasion to use dye so don't know how strong a color one can
get.

I have need to get some work to a semi-gloss jet black. I had planned to
use black paint topped with poly - and if I can find some black, alkyd
enameI probably will - but I hate the idea of having to use acrylic...I
don't have spray equipment so will need something I can sand to get a nice
surface.

Would black dye get me a jet black? I don't mind wood texture showing but
not grain pattern. How about dye topped with poly that has some black tint
in it? Would light wood (eg, poplar) work better or a dark one (eg, walnut
or mahogany)? Maybe Peruvian walnut?

All opinions welcome but experience gets extra points

--

dadiOH
____________________________

Winters getting colder? Tired of the rat race?
Taxes out of hand? Maybe just ready for a change?
Check it out... http://www.floridaloghouse.net

"dadiOH" wrote:
I've never had occasion to use dye so don't know how strong a color one can
get.

I have need to get some work to a semi-gloss jet black. I had planned to
use black paint topped with poly - and if I can find some black, alkyd
enameI probably will - but I hate the idea of having to use acrylic...I
don't have spray equipment so will need something I can sand to get a nice
surface.

Would black dye get me a jet black? I don't mind wood texture showing but
not grain pattern. How about dye topped with poly that has some black tint
in it? Would light wood (eg, poplar) work better or a dark one (eg, walnut
or mahogany)? Maybe Peruvian walnut?

All opinions welcome but experience gets extra points


Hummmmm. I have used General Finishes expresso dye on occasion, premixed,
and followed up with a gel varnish. The dye raised the grain some what.

I have used a lamp black milk paint followed with gel varnish. The milk
paint really raised the grain.

Why not have a local Sherman Williams mix you an Alkid oil based semigloss
jet black paint and skip the varnish?

The more closed grain the wood, the smoother the results will look.

"Leon" wrote in message

"dadiOH" wrote:
I've never had occasion to use dye so don't know how strong a color one
can get.

I have need to get some work to a semi-gloss jet black. I had planned
to use black paint topped with poly - and if I can find some black,
alkyd enameI probably will - but I hate the idea of having to use
acrylic...I don't have spray equipment so will need something I can
sand to get a nice surface.

Would black dye get me a jet black? I don't mind wood texture showing
but not grain pattern. How about dye topped with poly that has some
black tint in it? Would light wood (eg, poplar) work better or a dark
one (eg, walnut or mahogany)? Maybe Peruvian walnut?

All opinions welcome but experience gets extra points

Why not have a local Sherman Williams mix you an Alkid oil based semigloss
jet black paint and skip the varnish?

That would work, I MUST get out of the HD/Lowes mindset

--

dadiOH
____________________________

Winters getting colder? Tired of the rat race?
Taxes out of hand? Maybe just ready for a change?
Check it out... http://www.floridaloghouse.net

On 6/24/2014 3:37 AM, dadiOH wrote:
I've never had occasion to use dye so don't know how strong a color one can
get.

I have need to get some work to a semi-gloss jet black. I had planned to
use black paint topped with poly - and if I can find some black, alkyd
enameI probably will - but I hate the idea of having to use acrylic...I
don't have spray equipment so will need something I can sand to get a nice
surface.

Would black dye get me a jet black? I don't mind wood texture showing but
not grain pattern. How about dye topped with poly that has some black tint
in it? Would light wood (eg, poplar) work better or a dark one (eg, walnut
or mahogany)? Maybe Peruvian walnut?

All opinions welcome but experience gets extra points

I have used dyes for many years. I settled on Transtint mainly because
they seem to have quality control from batch to batch. I generally
scrape or sand to the 120 to 150 range. I mix the dyes in shellac so as
to minimize the "grain raising". The key here is to use eyedroppers or
measuring spoons (the cooking kind), apply the result to some scrap
(cutoffs of your project piece), and add more of this dye or that to
home in on the color you want. Write everything down to get the final
formula. Important: Make enough in a batch to cover your entire
project because even with meticulous measuring/recording, no two batches
are ever quite the same.

Can you get a jet black? I doubt it since you are adding dyes to a
carrier (shellac or water) and hence diluting the color. For example,
my formula for a walnut color (always a popular choice) is a mix of dark
brown, black, and red. Unfortunately my modest collection of test
boards with compositions was discarded in our downsizing move.

I have also found that Klingspor has a good selection of finishing
goodies besides dyes (e.g. sandpaper, shellacs, sanders, etc.).

Anyway, you can wile away a lot of time coming up with your own
formulae. Have fun.
mahalo,
jo4hn

On 6/24/2014 6:37 AM, dadiOH wrote:
I've never had occasion to use dye so don't know how strong a color one can
get.

I have need to get some work to a semi-gloss jet black. I had planned to
use black paint topped with poly - and if I can find some black, alkyd
enameI probably will - but I hate the idea of having to use acrylic...I
don't have spray equipment so will need something I can sand to get a nice
surface.

Would black dye get me a jet black? I don't mind wood texture showing but
not grain pattern. How about dye topped with poly that has some black tint
in it? Would light wood (eg, poplar) work better or a dark one (eg, walnut
or mahogany)? Maybe Peruvian walnut?

All opinions welcome but experience gets extra points

I use dye often as a toner in topcoating.
I also use it for staining (dyeing).

For jet black, the best way is to get some india ink, that WILL get it
jet black.

Dye will not get it jet black. It will turn it black but it won't look
JET black.

--
Jeff

On Tuesday, June 24, 2014 8:47:57 AM UTC-5, woodchucker wrote:
For jet black, the best way is to get some india ink, that WILL get it jet black. Dye will not get it jet black. It will turn it black but it won't look JET black. -- Jeff

I vote for India ink, as well, though I have no experience.

Sonny

On Tuesday, June 24, 2014 6:55:05 AM UTC-5, Leon wrote:

Why not have a local Sherman Williams mix you an Alkid oil based semigloss

jet black paint and skip the varnish?



The more closed grain the wood, the smoother the results will look.

That's the ticket. No stain or dye will get you to Jet Black. They aren't designed to do it, so they won't. To get to dead black, you need to completely obscure the grain and the texture, otherwise ambient light will trick your eye with reflectivity issues.

About 30 years ago I was still afraid to shoot lacquer, and colored lacquer was out of the question. I had to match some furniture (remember all the black stuff back then?) and all I could find was "piano black" lacquer which completely intimidated me. Spray only, too. My skills weren't up to speed for non-latex products then.

In comes the cavalry. I called a finisher (not a painter...) and had him come over. After a few ideas were tossed around, he worked me up a test piece of his proposal and I liked it. The wood pieces in question (a cube coffee table and lamp table) finished according to his process and the client was thrilled.

The wood was sanded to 220gr. A coat of sanding sealer was applied, sanded, recoated, then resanded. A coat of "long oil" (what they used to call the oil based products before they all became alkyd resin) oil based paint was applied with a hair (oil base specific china bristle)brush. Coat #2 was applied, and allowed to set for 24 hours before handling. I had the client wait one week before putting anything on either table, and the paint worked out great.

Since it was a table, if I wasn't going to spray, I would pad the paint on the large surfaces and brush in the details. Due to their long layout time, using a pad with oil based products can yield near spray quality (and in come cases the same!) for flat surfaces. Economical, too. I use the pad once, and toss it with no clean up. Note I am saying "pad" not foam. You can find something similar to this at the big box stores:

http://www.homedepot.com/p/Shur-Line...500H/100186429

If your project isn't too large, you might consider black lacquer that comes in rattle cans. I finished a fireplace mantle with some spray lacquer they sold me at one of the local paint stores (think you could probably buy it at a box store) and it turned out very well. I don't know about the availability in your area, but I used this:

http://www.amazon.com/Rust-Oleum-190.../dp/B000C01534

Good stuff.

Robert

On 6/24/2014 11:04 AM, wrote:


Good stuff.

And likewise for your post!

--
eWoodShop: www.eWoodShop.com
Wood Shop: www.e-WoodShop.net
https://www.google.com/+eWoodShop
https://plus.google.com/+KarlCaillouet/posts
http://www.custommade.com/by/ewoodshop/
KarlCaillouet@ (the obvious)

For jet black, the best way is to get some india ink, that WILL get it
jet black.
Dye will not get it jet black. It will turn it black but it won't look
JET black.
woodchucker

x2 on the India ink. Works great.
http://community.woodmagazine.com/t5...ax/td-p/253204

In article
, Leon
wrote:

"dadiOH" wrote:
I've never had occasion to use dye so don't know how strong a color one can
get.

I have need to get some work to a semi-gloss jet black. I had planned to
use black paint topped with poly - and if I can find some black, alkyd
enameI probably will - but I hate the idea of having to use acrylic...I
don't have spray equipment so will need something I can sand to get a nice
surface.

Would black dye get me a jet black? I don't mind wood texture showing but
not grain pattern. How about dye topped with poly that has some black tint
in it? Would light wood (eg, poplar) work better or a dark one (eg, walnut
or mahogany)? Maybe Peruvian walnut?

All opinions welcome but experience gets extra points


Hummmmm. I have used General Finishes expresso dye on occasion, premixed,
and followed up with a gel varnish. The dye raised the grain some what.

I have used a lamp black milk paint followed with gel varnish. The milk
paint really raised the grain.

Why not have a local Sherman Williams mix you an Alkid oil based semigloss
jet black paint and skip the varnish?

The more closed grain the wood, the smoother the results will look.

Didn't JOAT experiment with shoe polish? I don't recall how that worked
out for him.

--
³Youth ages, immaturity is outgrown, ignorance can be educated, and drunkenness
sobered, but stupid lasts forever.² -- Aristophanes

In article ,
woodchucker wrote:

On 6/24/2014 6:37 AM, dadiOH wrote:
I've never had occasion to use dye so don't know how strong a color one can
get.

I have need to get some work to a semi-gloss jet black. I had planned to
use black paint topped with poly - and if I can find some black, alkyd
enameI probably will - but I hate the idea of having to use acrylic...I
don't have spray equipment so will need something I can sand to get a nice
surface.

Would black dye get me a jet black? I don't mind wood texture showing but
not grain pattern. How about dye topped with poly that has some black tint
in it? Would light wood (eg, poplar) work better or a dark one (eg, walnut
or mahogany)? Maybe Peruvian walnut?

All opinions welcome but experience gets extra points

I use dye often as a toner in topcoating.
I also use it for staining (dyeing).

For jet black, the best way is to get some india ink, that WILL get it
jet black.

Dye will not get it jet black. It will turn it black but it won't look
JET black.

Darker then any wood-dye I have used

--
--------------------------------------------------------
Personal e-mail is the n7bsn but at amsat.org
This posting address is a spam-trap and seldom read
RV and Camping FAQ can be found at
http://www.ralphandellen.us/rv

On Thu, 26 Jun 2014 11:15:16 -0700, Ralph E Lindberg
wrote:

In article ,
woodchucker wrote:

On 6/24/2014 6:37 AM, dadiOH wrote:
I've never had occasion to use dye so don't know how strong a color one can
get.

I have need to get some work to a semi-gloss jet black. I had planned to
use black paint topped with poly - and if I can find some black, alkyd
enameI probably will - but I hate the idea of having to use acrylic...I
don't have spray equipment so will need something I can sand to get a nice
surface.

Would black dye get me a jet black? I don't mind wood texture showing but
not grain pattern. How about dye topped with poly that has some black tint
in it? Would light wood (eg, poplar) work better or a dark one (eg, walnut
or mahogany)? Maybe Peruvian walnut?

All opinions welcome but experience gets extra points

I use dye often as a toner in topcoating.
I also use it for staining (dyeing).

For jet black, the best way is to get some india ink, that WILL get it
jet black.

Dye will not get it jet black. It will turn it black but it won't look
JET black.

Darker then any wood-dye I have used
Black lacquer - piano finish - then rub with rottenstone or similar
to dull the gloss

On 6/24/14 4:37 AM, dadiOH wrote:
I've never had occasion to use dye so don't know how strong a color one can
get.

I have need to get some work to a semi-gloss jet black. I had planned to
use black paint topped with poly - and if I can find some black, alkyd
enameI probably will - but I hate the idea of having to use acrylic...I
don't have spray equipment so will need something I can sand to get a nice
surface.

Would black dye get me a jet black? I don't mind wood texture showing but
not grain pattern. How about dye topped with poly that has some black tint
in it? Would light wood (eg, poplar) work better or a dark one (eg, walnut
or mahogany)? Maybe Peruvian walnut?

All opinions welcome but experience gets extra points



I needed jet black shelves for an entertainment center and any dye or
stain I tried failed to get a true black.

The wood was Baltic birch plywood so hiding the grain was not an issue,
otherwise I would have tried a grain filler as the first step. The color
was off-the-shelf flat black rattle can paint (I had plenty on hand).
After several coats to get a good build, I sanded everything flat with a
sanding block to level out any grain showing through and then applied a
final coat. After this had dried a day or so, I removed any nubs and
smoothed the surface with a gentle rubdown using #0000 steel wool. A
final few coats of poly sealed the deal. The flat black turned to a deep
gloss and the poly left a dead smooth surface. If I ever need to do this
again on grainy wood, I'd dig out my stash of grey lacquer primer/filler
from my auto painting days to get a smooth, grain free surface and do
the black paint trick again.

YMMV
-BR


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