Swingman wrote:
On 3/4/2013 10:38 PM, wrote:

Personally, I'd get a plumber, an electrician, and a good handiman or
contractor to look it over if I didn't have the knowledge myself.

Yeah, that's real smart ... considering that a POS house was built by
plumbers, electricians and contractors.

MOST
home inspectors have no in-depth knowledge of either electrical,
plumbing, framing, concrete, or finishing.

In Canada, perhaps ... then again, truth dies at the lips of the
utterer blanket statements.

I find that statements like Clare's and those from a couple of others which
express the same feelings about Home Inspectors must be from anecdotal
experiences, local experiences, or uninformed fears. I can only speak for
the area of the country that I am familiar with, but for a certainty, our
Home Inspectors in NY are very informed, and have a great deal of knowledge
of the trades - at least to the extent that they need to perform their jobs
on behalf of the consumer. Seeing your comments, it's clear that NY is not
alone in its requirements for Home Inspectors, and that at least one other
area of the country places requirements on them to insure they are
qualified. I know several people who are Home Inspectors and I have looked
into doing that sort of work myself. I have never spoken with one who was
not fully qualified, and as for going into that myself, the investment in
time and understudy is more than I wanted to invest in. It is certainly not
a matter of printing up business cards in NY and calling yourself a Home
Inspector.

--

-Mike-

"Mike Marlow" wrote in message ...

Home Inspectors in NY are very informed, and have a great deal of knowledge
of the trades - at least to the extent that they need to perform their jobs
on behalf of the consumer. Seeing your comments, it's clear that NY is not
alone in its requirements for Home Inspectors, and that at least one other
area of the country places requirements on them to insure they are
qualified. I know several people who are Home Inspectors and I have looked
into doing that sort of work myself. I have never spoken with one who was
not fully qualified, and as for going into that myself, the investment in
time and understudy is more than I wanted to invest in. It is certainly
not a matter of printing up business cards in NY and calling yourself a
Home Inspector.

Credentialing is a good step in the right direction but there is still an
element of luck with finding a good one here in NY... I have two associates
whom encountered what my kids would refer to as "epic fails" on home
inspections.

The most egregious of the two completely missed serious, readily visible,
code and structural problems resulting from water leaks in shower/tub tiles.
What was noted as "loose tiles" in one of the two back-to-back bathrooms
wasn't even mentioned from the perspective of the missing drywall in the
ceiling of the garage below.

The missing drywall in the garage ceiling was a code violation all by
itself. Without removing anything or using a ladder or even a flashlight, a
look up in the hole revealed the subfloor and joists were rotten and covered
with mold... not a single word about any of that in the report. There were
other problems too... unvented washer/laundry sink drains, grading problems
that sent water into the basement, deck steps that were so rotten they
barely supported themselves, etc. About $30K to fix everything.... no
recourse! The two back-to-back bathrooms had to be gutted, the joists
repaired, the sub-floor replaced and the wall between the rooms replaced as
the studs were rotted off and covered with mold. From that starting point
the rooms were renovated...

The other house was similar in that water damage was readily visible from
the basement... the toilet waste line was no longer connected to the toilet
as it dropped away from the toilet as the floor and toilet flange bolts
rotted away. It was the smell that the new homeowners noticed that led to
this discovery... I'd have thought the inspector would have noticed that the
toilet rocked even if he didn't look up in the basement. Things were so
rotten they were lucky they didn't end up in the basement while using the
toilet! The inspector refunded his $300 fee... they ate the rest.

Anyhow, like with any service provider, it pays to check them out before
committing!

John

On 3/6/2013 10:43 AM, John Grossbohlin wrote:

Anyhow, like with any service provider, it pays to check them out before
committing!

If there is an Angie's List in an area, folks might want to check to see
if they list home inspectors.

Here are the applicable Texas rules/regs on real estate inspection:

http://www.trec.state.tx.us/inspecto...inspectors.asp

And mandatory continuing education:

http://info.sos.state.tx.us/pls/pub/readtac$ext.TacPage?sl=R&app=9&p_dir=&p_rloc=&p_tl oc=&p_ploc=&pg=1&p_tac=&ti=22&pt=23&ch=535&rl=92

The available public information on an inspector who has been used by
some of my buyers just to give you an idea:

http://www.trec.state.tx.us/newsandp... xtSearch=7669

This guys also has noting but "A" reviews on Angie's List.

Looks like some parts of North America would do well to take a page or
two from Texas in this regard.

--
eWoodShop: www.eWoodShop.com
Wood Shop: www.e-WoodShop.net
https://plus.google.com/114902129577517371552/posts
http://www.custommade.com/by/ewoodshop/
KarlCaillouet@ (the obvious)

On Mar 6, 1:23*pm, Swingman wrote:

Looks like some parts of North America would do well to take a page or
two from Texas in this regard.

As a follow up to Karl's post...

Not so hard to find the right guys down here in sunny South Texas. We
are a big state, so I won't comment on every corner of every city.

Licensing and continuing education are a requirement here, as well as
a period of time working under a licensed inspector before one can
go out on their own. IIRC, to be a licensed inspector now, you must
have a certification from a college that encompasses that aspect (such
as a degree in residential home building) or a degree from a junior
college that offers a State certified diploma in home inspection.
There are alternate paths and certifications, but all end with testing
and certification.

Like contractors, you have to find a qualified guy to do the work.
Because one has a personal experience with an idiot doesn't mean
everyone in a profession is an idiot.

The guys that inspect here are focused on structure, safety,
sanitation, damage, infestation, and remaining life of certain items,
proper operation of mechanical equipment, and poisons. People do not
understand that hey do no do cosmetics such as bad color of carpet,
poor paint choices, ugly counter tops, outdated hardware, etc. Some
of these guys are quite good and have spent years of their time on
education and thousands in testing equipment.

http://www.scottsinspections.com

I knew this guy when he started out, and I have used him myself and
don't hesitate to recommend him anytime anyone I know needs and
inspector. He isn't perfect, but he is pretty close.

Robert

John Grossbohlin wrote:
"Mike Marlow" wrote in message ...

Home Inspectors in NY are very informed, and have a great deal of
knowledge of the trades - at least to the extent that they need to
perform their jobs on behalf of the consumer. Seeing your comments,
it's clear that NY is not alone in its requirements for Home
Inspectors, and that at least one other area of the country places
requirements on them to insure they are qualified. I know several
people who are Home Inspectors and I have looked into doing that
sort of work myself. I have never spoken with one who was not fully
qualified, and as for going into that myself, the investment in time
and understudy is more than I wanted to invest in. It is certainly
not a matter of printing up business cards in NY and calling
yourself a Home Inspector.

Credentialing is a good step in the right direction but there is
still an element of luck with finding a good one here in NY... I have
two associates whom encountered what my kids would refer to as "epic
fails" on home inspections.

The most egregious of the two completely missed serious, readily
visible, code and structural problems resulting from water leaks in
shower/tub tiles. What was noted as "loose tiles" in one of the two
back-to-back bathrooms wasn't even mentioned from the perspective of
the missing drywall in the ceiling of the garage below.

The missing drywall in the garage ceiling was a code violation all by
itself. Without removing anything or using a ladder or even a
flashlight, a look up in the hole revealed the subfloor and joists
were rotten and covered with mold... not a single word about any of
that in the report. There were other problems too... unvented
washer/laundry sink drains, grading problems that sent water into the
basement, deck steps that were so rotten they barely supported
themselves, etc. About $30K to fix everything.... no recourse! The
two back-to-back bathrooms had to be gutted, the joists repaired, the
sub-floor replaced and the wall between the rooms replaced as the
studs were rotted off and covered with mold. From that starting point
the rooms were renovated...
The other house was similar in that water damage was readily visible
from the basement... the toilet waste line was no longer connected to
the toilet as it dropped away from the toilet as the floor and toilet
flange bolts rotted away. It was the smell that the new homeowners
noticed that led to this discovery... I'd have thought the inspector
would have noticed that the toilet rocked even if he didn't look up
in the basement. Things were so rotten they were lucky they didn't
end up in the basement while using the toilet! The inspector refunded
his $300 fee... they ate the rest.
Anyhow, like with any service provider, it pays to check them out
before committing!


As I had said much earlier in this commentary - Work Ethic not
withstanding...

--

-Mike-

"Mike Marlow" wrote in message ...

As I had said much earlier in this commentary - Work Ethic not
withstanding...

Yup.... sort of a random variable!

John

On Wed, 6 Mar 2013 21:57:41 -0500, "John Grossbohlin"
wrote:

"Mike Marlow" wrote in message ...

As I had said much earlier in this commentary - Work Ethic not
withstanding...

Yup.... sort of a random variable!

John

Sometimes you have to read all the paper work. If it sounds like they
take no responsibility ask questions, pay a lawyer to read it. I know
when I bought this place it is still my first place it was money well
spent. Since I didn't understand some terms in terms of mineral
rights and some of the escrow companies exclusions. He got the escrow
company to take responsibilty for everything and had a mobile home
converted to real property. It was well worth the money.

Mike M

On Wed, 6 Mar 2013 08:01:29 -0500, "Mike Marlow"
wrote:




I find that statements like Clare's and those from a couple of others which
express the same feelings about Home Inspectors must be from anecdotal
experiences, local experiences, or uninformed fears. I can only speak for
the area of the country that I am familiar with, but for a certainty, our
Home Inspectors in NY are very informed, and have a great deal of knowledge
of the trades - at least to the extent that they need to perform their jobs
on behalf of the consumer. Seeing your comments, it's clear that NY is not
alone in its requirements for Home Inspectors, and that at least one other
area of the country places requirements on them to insure they are
qualified. I know several people who are Home Inspectors and I have looked
into doing that sort of work myself. I have never spoken with one who was
not fully qualified, and

I'm not going to check out each state, but evidently some are rather
lax in their requirements. Good to see that Texas and NY have real
requirements.


as for going into that myself, the investment in
time and understudy is more than I wanted to invest in. It is certainly not
a matter of printing up business cards in NY and calling yourself a Home
Inspector.

You can do it in your spare time
http://www.ahit.com/index.htm

Once you complete the course, you get your business card printed.

Then you have people like this to tarnish the reputation of the good
ones.
http://www.wtsp.com/news/local/artic...2-M-fraud-case

On 3/6/2013 11:02 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
On Wed, 6 Mar 2013 08:01:29 -0500, "Mike Marlow"
wrote:




I find that statements like Clare's and those from a couple of others which
express the same feelings about Home Inspectors must be from anecdotal
experiences, local experiences, or uninformed fears. I can only speak for
the area of the country that I am familiar with, but for a certainty, our
Home Inspectors in NY are very informed, and have a great deal of knowledge
of the trades - at least to the extent that they need to perform their jobs
on behalf of the consumer. Seeing your comments, it's clear that NY is not
alone in its requirements for Home Inspectors, and that at least one other
area of the country places requirements on them to insure they are
qualified. I know several people who are Home Inspectors and I have looked
into doing that sort of work myself. I have never spoken with one who was
not fully qualified, and

I'm not going to check out each state, but evidently some are rather
lax in their requirements. Good to see that Texas and NY have real
requirements.


as for going into that myself, the investment in
time and understudy is more than I wanted to invest in. It is certainly not
a matter of printing up business cards in NY and calling yourself a Home
Inspector.

You can do it in your spare time
http://www.ahit.com/index.htm

Once you complete the course, you get your business card printed.

Then you have people like this to tarnish the reputation of the good
ones.
http://www.wtsp.com/news/local/artic...2-M-fraud-case

I don't know about other states but usually some where in the contract
there is a phase that says the inspector can only be held liable for the
obvious, easily found problems. If you have a wall full of bees, that
are not obviously swarming on the outside that is your problem and the
inspector can not be held liable for it.

If you have a broken sewer pipe where the leak is not visible on the
surface of the ground, same.

On Thu, 07 Mar 2013 08:25:39 -0500, Keith Nuttle
If you have a broken sewer pipe where the leak is not visible on the
surface of the ground, same.

What about inspectors noting *possible* problems? Water not draining
properly because of insufficient air flow? Do inspectors ever scope
drains? Noting that an electrical panel is mostly full?

Is there an above average level of inspection available? Something
along the lines of
http://www.mikeholmesinspections.com...FWGrPAodU28A9A

Agreed, he is promoting his own organization, but a lot of what he
states certainly sounds reasonable.

I've lived in apartments for the last several decades, but should I
ever go housing hunting again, I'm going to go with all the inspection
knowledge I can hire to back me up. IOW, I'd be sh*t scared about what
I don't see when viewing a home for purchase.

Dave wrote:
On Thu, 07 Mar 2013 08:25:39 -0500, Keith Nuttle
If you have a broken sewer pipe where the leak is not visible on the
surface of the ground, same.

What about inspectors noting *possible* problems? Water not draining
properly because of insufficient air flow? Do inspectors ever scope
drains? Noting that an electrical panel is mostly full?

Don't know about the drains thing - I believe though, that they would stop
at simply noting a dimished flow if that is what they observed, with the
recommendation to have a tradesman look at it. That would be about the
extent of their obligation. As for an electrical panel mostly full - there
is nothing to note in that. You have to keep in mind what they are there
for.


--

-Mike-

Dave wrote:

Is there an above average level of inspection available? Something
along the lines of
http://www.mikeholmesinspections.com...FWGrPAodU28A9A

Agreed, he is promoting his own organization, but a lot of what he
states certainly sounds reasonable.

Above average? No thanks ... more TV bark than bite?

Click on his "Standards of Practice" link and see where that takes you.

--
www.ewoodshop.com (Mobile)

On Thu, 07 Mar 2013 09:17:22 -0600, Swingman wrote:

Dave wrote:

Is there an above average level of inspection available? Something
along the lines of
http://www.mikeholmesinspections.com...FWGrPAodU28A9A

Agreed, he is promoting his own organization, but a lot of what he
states certainly sounds reasonable.

Above average? No thanks ... more TV bark than bite?

Click on his "Standards of Practice" link and see where that takes you.

I haven't looked at any of his practices, but have seen parts of a couple
of his shows. There seems to be no balance between what is practical and
what is safe and reasonable to his methods. I know, it's TV.

basilisk

On Thu, 07 Mar 2013 09:17:22 -0600, Swingman wrote:
Above average? No thanks ... more TV bark than bite?
Click on his "Standards of Practice" link and see where that takes you.

Maybe, but I've seen several of his constructions around the Toronto
area. Taking into account my limited experience with repairs around
the home, it all looks very well built to me.

On 3/7/2013 1:17 PM, Dave wrote:
On Thu, 07 Mar 2013 09:17:22 -0600, Swingman wrote:
Above average? No thanks ... more TV bark than bite?
Click on his "Standards of Practice" link and see where that takes you.

Maybe, but I've seen several of his constructions around the Toronto
area. Taking into account my limited experience with repairs around
the home, it all looks very well built to me.

It damn well better be ... with an audience ready to pick you off, you
better have the cream de la cream of consulting expertise to keep the ox
between the ditches.

--
eWoodShop: www.eWoodShop.com
Wood Shop: www.e-WoodShop.net
https://plus.google.com/114902129577517371552/posts
http://www.custommade.com/by/ewoodshop/
KarlCaillouet@ (the obvious)