I must be getting old, I've been in a relflective mood...



Once upon a time, I did a 3 year stint as an electrician, this was mixed
in with various carpentry and masonry jobs.

We did mostly industrial work but filled in with new house work and
rewiring old houses.

One job was the rewiring of a 30's era house, the lady that owned the
place had a minor electrical fire and wanted everything replaced and
brought up to code, all light fixtures with the exception of one was to be
replaced.

The fixture in question was a huge, many socketed affair made of cast
brass, probably weighed 50 lbs, a price was agreed on to repair the
fixture and one rainy day work began.

Some one in the past had painted the fixture with a brown enamel paint,
we disassembled the fixture, soaked the whole thing in stripper. cleaned
it up, polished it with a buffing wheel, reassmbled with new wiring and
sockets, and finally give the whole thing a clear coat to prevent
tarnishing.

It was a work of art and shone like new money.

Made the trip to hang the refurbished fixture and unboxed it in front
of the owner, she turned white, then red, sputtering in anger
saying that it had to be painted brown.

A can of brown spray paint returned the fixture to its former
tacky glory and everyone was happy.

Main lesson learned: never assume anything when dealing
with a client.

basilisk

On 3/4/2013 9:10 AM, basilisk wrote:

Main lesson learned: never assume anything when dealing
with a client.

Especially when it requires doing something stupid/unsafe. That is when
you can righteously thank gawd for building codes, and inspectors.

--
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Wood Shop: www.e-WoodShop.net
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KarlCaillouet@ (the obvious)

On Mon, 04 Mar 2013 09:30:21 -0600, Swingman wrote:

On 3/4/2013 9:10 AM, basilisk wrote:

Main lesson learned: never assume anything when dealing
with a client.

Especially when it requires doing something stupid/unsafe. That is when
you can righteously thank gawd for building codes, and inspectors.

The county I live in has no rural permitting/inspection structure, there
are some rules that apply to general contractors for construction for
resale.

Basically, anyone can build anything on their property for their use in
any way they see fit, this is nice from a freedom point of view, but many
of these properties eventually come on the market and leave buyers with a
pile of crap that is expensive to fix.

I am never in favor of more gov't intervention, but the unsuspecting
buyer can get burned badly.

When i worked in the trades here, there was no enforcement of any branch
of building codes, the only thing that controlled the quality of the work
was a GC's moral character.

The electrician I worked with held a master license first in TX and then
in AL, he was a sticlker for abiding by the code. We lost a lot of work to
those willing to cut corners.

basilisk

On 3/4/2013 10:07 AM, basilisk wrote:
On Mon, 04 Mar 2013 09:30:21 -0600, Swingman wrote:

On 3/4/2013 9:10 AM, basilisk wrote:

Main lesson learned: never assume anything when dealing
with a client.

Especially when it requires doing something stupid/unsafe. That is when
you can righteously thank gawd for building codes, and inspectors.

The county I live in has no rural permitting/inspection structure, there
are some rules that apply to general contractors for construction for
resale.

Basically, anyone can build anything on their property for their use in
any way they see fit, this is nice from a freedom point of view, but many
of these properties eventually come on the market and leave buyers with a
pile of crap that is expensive to fix.

I am never in favor of more gov't intervention, but the unsuspecting
buyer can get burned badly.

When i worked in the trades here, there was no enforcement of any branch
of building codes, the only thing that controlled the quality of the work
was a GC's moral character.

The electrician I worked with held a master license first in TX and then
in AL, he was a sticlker for abiding by the code. We lost a lot of work to
those willing to cut corners.

Know the feeling ... those who have the ultimate responsibility, and
LIABILITY, call the shots ... it would be foolish to expect otherwise,
something not always appreciated by clients, architects and other
wannabe builders. (Architects are the worst, and I have turned down many
a job because of the project Architect)

Also, there is an upside to rigidly enforced building codes that the
fly-by-night GC doesn't appreciate it:

... not only does it protect the home owner, it protects the
builder/GC in just as many, if not more, ways, particularly when it
comes to enforcing performance clauses in contracts ... it is
impossible/futile for a subcontractor to argue if his works fails to
pass inspection because it does not meet code.

That alone has done wonders for job site relationships and harmony in
pursuit of getting the job done right, if you know what I mean ... it
takes a bit of "BTDT" to appreciate that point fully.

--
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Wood Shop: www.e-WoodShop.net
https://plus.google.com/114902129577517371552/posts
http://www.custommade.com/by/ewoodshop/
KarlCaillouet@ (the obvious)

"basilisk" wrote:

The county I live in has no rural permitting/inspection structure,
there
are some rules that apply to general contractors for construction
for
resale.

Basically, anyone can build anything on their property for their use
in
any way they see fit, this is nice from a freedom point of view, but
many
of these properties eventually come on the market and leave buyers
with a
pile of crap that is expensive to fix.
--------------------------------------------------

I'm surprised the insurance companies will write policies given the
above.

Lew

"Lew Hodgett" wrote:
"basilisk" wrote:

The county I live in has no rural permitting/inspection structure,
there
are some rules that apply to general contractors for construction
for
resale.

Basically, anyone can build anything on their property for their use
in
any way they see fit, this is nice from a freedom point of view, but
many
of these properties eventually come on the market and leave buyers
with a
pile of crap that is expensive to fix.
--------------------------------------------------

I'm surprised the insurance companies will write policies given the
above.

That is one of the main reasons why, for any house I build in a rural area
with no code or inspection requirements, I hire, FBO homeowner, a licensed,
third party inspector to inspect every step of the construction process
before going on to the next, including a formal Building Final.

Not that I need one, but It is naive to think that any third party, from
insurer to future homebuyer, is going to take the word of any GC that
everything was done correctly. Not only does it benefit me as a double
check, but the client is protected, now and in the future.

I also insist the PE make foundation and framing visits so that he can
issue 'wet stamp', "As Built" letters for both foundation and framing, as
well as I photographically document all Engineering plan specification
requirements for both structures:

https://picasaweb.google.com/1113554...RgCOaP_82H94IW

Only a damned fool, or a crook, would do otherwise.

--
www.ewoodshop.com (Mobile)

How does one get financing to build or purchase a house with no
certification as to it soundness[for lack of a better word]?
CP

"Swingman" wrote in message
...

Only a damned fool, or a crook, would do otherwise.

There seems to be an abundance of both from what I've seen. Sometimes it is
hard to tell if ignorance, dollars, or dishonesty are driving the decisions
and actions... in other cases it is clearly all three. The homeowners I feel
sorry for are those who try to do the right thing and bring in inspectors
and professionals and still end up with problems. The stories I'm hearing
from associates in FL suggest that the elderly are being preyed upon with
pretty much no recourse. Things may look OK cosmetically but fail quickly...

I wonder how the masses in the younger generations can avoid being taken
since they themselves generally do not know how to use tools or understand
how things work. It is probably fair to say that in general the trades have
become "installers" rather than "builders" and that leads to problems on
both sides. I've had discussions with my sons about what their friends and
classmates can do and the response is that they generally don't know how to
do anything... except push buttons perhaps. My sales and service business
owning friends have been saying for years they cannot find youth whom know
enough to train let alone possess skills. Perhaps in the future the ruling
class will be those who can actually do something... everyone will be at
their mercy! LOL

John

On Monday, March 4, 2013 4:32:40 PM UTC-6, Swingman wrote:
https://picasaweb.google.com/1113554...RgCOaP_82H94IW


And that's just the chicken coup, right?

Sonny

On Mon, 4 Mar 2013 13:50:32 -0800, Lew Hodgett wrote:

"basilisk" wrote:

The county I live in has no rural permitting/inspection structure,
there
are some rules that apply to general contractors for construction
for
resale.

Basically, anyone can build anything on their property for their use
in
any way they see fit, this is nice from a freedom point of view, but
many
of these properties eventually come on the market and leave buyers
with a
pile of crap that is expensive to fix.
--------------------------------------------------

I'm surprised the insurance companies will write policies given the
above.

Lew

Not a problem getting insurance, but it is expensive relative to
city dwellers, my homeowners would be 1/3 it's present cost if
I lived in the city. And that is with a large deductable that would leave
me almost on my own should the roof get blown off.

Not surprising, the nearest accredited fire station is 14 miles away,
and it isn't a manned firehouse.

There are some downsides to living out and away, but worth it IMHO.

With all that said, ALFA, one of the big insurers in AL, culled 60,000
older properties in AL last year. State Farm picked up most of the slack
and life goes on.

basilisk

"Lew Hodgett" wrote in news:5135171c$0$7657$c3e8da3
:


"basilisk" wrote:

The county I live in has no rural permitting/inspection structure, there
are some rules that apply to general contractors for construction for
resale.

Basically, anyone can build anything on their property for their use in
any way they see fit, this is nice from a freedom point of view, but many
of these properties eventually come on the market and leave buyers
with a pile of crap that is expensive to fix.
--------------------------------------------------

I'm surprised the insurance companies will write policies given the
above.

Why does that surprise you? It would be surprising only if they did so without adjusting the
premiums to take those factors into account.

basilisk wrote:


Basically, anyone can build anything on their property for their use
in any way they see fit, this is nice from a freedom point of view,
but many of these properties eventually come on the market and leave
buyers with a pile of crap that is expensive to fix.


Just one man's opinion of course, but I'm fine with that. The couple of
thoughts that I have on that matter are that it should not be the business
of any government agency, what the resale issues with any private property
are. Beyond that, I believe that if a prospective buyer elects to be so
uninformed as to be generally unaware, then they should simply hire a home
inspector for a few hundred bucks, to ensure their investment. That should
not be a consdieration or a concern of building permits, or government
agencies. Like I said - it's just my opinion.


I am never in favor of more gov't intervention, but the unsuspecting
buyer can get burned badly.

That's why home inspectors are worth their weight in gold, or the simple few
hundred bucks they charge.


--

-Mike-

On Mon, 4 Mar 2013 20:54:37 -0500, "Mike Marlow"
wrote:

basilisk wrote:


Basically, anyone can build anything on their property for their use
in any way they see fit, this is nice from a freedom point of view,
but many of these properties eventually come on the market and leave
buyers with a pile of crap that is expensive to fix.


Just one man's opinion of course, but I'm fine with that. The couple of
thoughts that I have on that matter are that it should not be the business
of any government agency, what the resale issues with any private property
are. Beyond that, I believe that if a prospective buyer elects to be so
uninformed as to be generally unaware, then they should simply hire a home
inspector for a few hundred bucks, to ensure their investment. That should
not be a consdieration or a concern of building permits, or government
agencies. Like I said - it's just my opinion.


I am never in favor of more gov't intervention, but the unsuspecting
buyer can get burned badly.

That's why home inspectors are worth their weight in gold, or the simple few
hundred bucks they charge.
I've never met one who was WORTH a few hundred bucks, personally.

wrote:
On Mon, 4 Mar 2013 20:54:37 -0500, "Mike Marlow"


That's why home inspectors are worth their weight in gold, or the
simple few hundred bucks they charge.

I've never met one who was WORTH a few hundred bucks, personally.

I have - for those who don't know what to look for, or know anything about
construction.

--

-Mike-

On 3/4/2013 10:10 AM, basilisk wrote:

it had to be painted brown.

Yup. One man's beauty is another's trash. And vice versa.

The very first non-critical task I did when we bought our house was to
replace the light fixture from over the kitchen table. My wife and I
shuddered a little each time we looked at it, especially when it was
lit. It was wrought iron, designed to look like a bouquet of
long-stemmed flowers that splayed out on curving stems "tied" together
in the middle. It was painted in numerous loud colors, each flower (10
or so) with a candelabra bulb.

I put it out with the recyclables at maybe 9pm for the next morning's
trash pickup. It wasn't out there fifteen minutes before someone had
snatched it up. I picture the picker chuckling at his good fortune.
"These people musta been CRAZY to throw this out". "Hey honey, you're
never gonna be-LIEVE what I got for free!".

And I'm glad frankly that someone got some use out of it. Someone other
than us, of course.

On Mon, 04 Mar 2013 14:24:51 -0500, Greg Guarino wrote:

On 3/4/2013 10:10 AM, basilisk wrote:

it had to be painted brown.

Yup. One man's beauty is another's trash. And vice versa.

The very first non-critical task I did when we bought our house was to
replace the light fixture from over the kitchen table. My wife and I
shuddered a little each time we looked at it, especially when it was
lit. It was wrought iron, designed to look like a bouquet of
long-stemmed flowers that splayed out on curving stems "tied" together
in the middle. It was painted in numerous loud colors, each flower (10
or so) with a candelabra bulb.

I put it out with the recyclables at maybe 9pm for the next morning's
trash pickup. It wasn't out there fifteen minutes before someone had
snatched it up. I picture the picker chuckling at his good fortune.
"These people musta been CRAZY to throw this out". "Hey honey, you're
never gonna be-LIEVE what I got for free!".

And I'm glad frankly that someone got some use out of it. Someone other
than us, of course.

LOL,

At a yard sale local to where I work, there was a picture
frame made from a toilet seat, recessed in back and glass
cut to fit hole. That takes recycling just a hair too far.

basilisk

basilisk wrote in news:a_aZs.214031$Yp1.147753@en-
nntp-13.dc1.easynews.com:


LOL,

At a yard sale local to where I work, there was a picture
frame made from a toilet seat, recessed in back and glass
cut to fit hole. That takes recycling just a hair too far.

basilisk


That's one of those shock things... The appeal isn't in the recycling,
but the surprise someone gets when they see it for the first time.

I was looking at pinball machine parts yesterday, and there was one place
selling a decal set so you can decorate your toilet with a pinball theme.
(It was in the appropriate section, though: Stupid things you don't
need.) DAGS for "Poop bumper" if you're so inclined.

Puckdropper
--
Make it to fit, don't make it fit.

On Mon, 04 Mar 2013 14:24:51 -0500, Greg Guarino wrote:

On 3/4/2013 10:10 AM, basilisk wrote:

it had to be painted brown.

Yup. One man's beauty is another's trash. And vice versa.

The very first non-critical task I did when we bought our house was to
replace the light fixture from over the kitchen table. My wife and I
shuddered a little each time we looked at it, especially when it was
lit. It was wrought iron, designed to look like a bouquet of
long-stemmed flowers that splayed out on curving stems "tied" together
in the middle. It was painted in numerous loud colors, each flower (10
or so) with a candelabra bulb.

I put it out with the recyclables at maybe 9pm for the next morning's
trash pickup. It wasn't out there fifteen minutes before someone had
snatched it up. I picture the picker chuckling at his good fortune.
"These people musta been CRAZY to throw this out". "Hey honey, you're
never gonna be-LIEVE what I got for free!".

And I'm glad frankly that someone got some use out of it. Someone other
than us, of course.

LOL,

At a yard sale local to where I work, there was a picture
frame made from a toilet seat, recessed in back and glass
cut to fit hole. That takes recycling just a hair too far.

basilisk

On 3/4/2013 6:28 PM, basilisk wrote:
At a yard sale local to where I work, there was a picture
frame made from a toilet seat, recessed in back and glass
cut to fit hole. That takes recycling just a hair too far.

Where the photo of the ex goes?

--
eWoodShop: www.eWoodShop.com
Wood Shop: www.e-WoodShop.net
https://plus.google.com/114902129577517371552/posts
http://www.custommade.com/by/ewoodshop/
KarlCaillouet@ (the obvious)

On Mon, 04 Mar 2013 18:31:13 -0600, Swingman wrote:

On 3/4/2013 6:28 PM, basilisk wrote:
At a yard sale local to where I work, there was a picture frame made
from a toilet seat, recessed in back and glass cut to fit hole. That
takes recycling just a hair too far.

Where the photo of the ex goes?

That was the first thing that crossed my mind as well,
but I don't have a picture of her

basilisk

On 3/4/2013 7:38 PM, basilisk wrote:
On Mon, 04 Mar 2013 18:31:13 -0600, Swingman wrote:

On 3/4/2013 6:28 PM, basilisk wrote:
At a yard sale local to where I work, there was a picture frame made
from a toilet seat, recessed in back and glass cut to fit hole. That
takes recycling just a hair too far.

Where the photo of the ex goes?

That was the first thing that crossed my mind as well,
but I don't have a picture of her

You flushed them?

--
Froz...


The system will be down for 10 days for preventive maintenance.

Greg Guarino wrote:
On 3/4/2013 10:10 AM, basilisk wrote:

it had to be painted brown.

Yup. One man's beauty is another's trash. And vice versa.

The very first non-critical task I did when we bought our house was to
replace the light fixture from over the kitchen table. My wife and I
shuddered a little each time we looked at it, especially when it was
lit. It was wrought iron, designed to look like a bouquet of
long-stemmed flowers that splayed out on curving stems "tied" together
in the middle. It was painted in numerous loud colors, each flower (10
or so) with a candelabra bulb.

My former step father in law generaled the log house my wife wound up with a
couple of years ago. In addition to his general stupidity and incompetency
he must have been short in the esthetics department too because he used 3'
shop-type fluorescent fixtures as vanity lights in all the bathrooms.

--

dadiOH
____________________________

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