There's an old Craftsman table saw in the basement of the building my Dad had his office in. It's probably 30 years old, and never saw much use. I'm trying to fix it up a bit to use it on occasion.

I know that Craftsman is held in low regard here, but perhaps I can prevail on the nice folks here for some advice.

Rust:
The main table surface had a fair amount of surface rust, but hardly any "bubbling". The "wings", if that's the right term were more badly rusted around the edges, which had been bare metal.

I went at it with Scotch-Brite and a rotary wire brush. The main table surface came out passably well, I think. The wing edges still look rusty, but I flattened them down enough, I think.

I had doused the whole thing pretty liberally with WD-40 a couple of weeks ago, before I did any brushing. So now I have a slurry of rust particles and WD-40 covering the table top. I could use some sort of degreaser to get it off, but then I imagine I'd need to cover it with something to keep it from rusting again. Wax, I'm thinking.

Any better ideas?

On Sat, 11 Feb 2012 13:45:50 -0800 (PST), Greg Guarino
I had doused the whole thing pretty liberally with WD-40 a couple of weeks ago,

Boeshield T-9® Protectant and Lubricant
http://www.leevalley.com/en/wood/pag...=1,43415,43440

On Feb 11, 3:45*pm, Greg Guarino wrote:
There's an old Craftsman table saw in the basement of the building my Dad had his office in. It's probably 30 years old, and never saw much use. I'm trying to fix it up a bit to use it on occasion.

I know that Craftsman is held in low regard here, but perhaps I can prevail on the nice folks here for some advice.

Rust:
The main table surface had a fair amount of surface rust, but hardly any "bubbling". The "wings", if that's the right term were more badly rusted around the edges, which had been bare metal.

I went at it with Scotch-Brite and a rotary wire brush. The main table surface came out passably well, I think. The wing edges still look rusty, but I flattened them down enough, I think.

I had doused the whole thing pretty liberally with WD-40 a couple of weeks ago, before I did any brushing. So now I have a slurry of rust particles and WD-40 covering the table top. I could use some sort of degreaser to get it off, but then I imagine I'd need to cover it with something to keep it from rusting again. Wax, I'm thinking.

Any better ideas?

Does it have cast iron wings or stamped metal? If cast iron, it is
probably more like 40+ years old and you might have one of the older,
better Craftsman saws. Many of the iron extension tables had a open
triangular grid design. If it is one of the older ones it probably
has a cast fence vs the sheet metal fence of the 70's and later saws.
Craftsman did make pretty good machine tools prior to the 1970's when
they apparently sold out to their accountants.

Try naval gel, scotchbrite and lots of elbow grease. BUT make sure
you get the gel off because it can corrode.

RonB

On Sat, 11 Feb 2012 13:45:50 -0800 (PST), Greg Guarino
wrote:

There's an old Craftsman table saw in the basement of the building my Dad had his office in. It's probably 30 years old, and never saw much use. I'm trying to fix it up a bit to use it on occasion.

I know that Craftsman is held in low regard here, but perhaps I can prevail on the nice folks here for some advice.

Rust:
The main table surface had a fair amount of surface rust, but hardly any "bubbling". The "wings", if that's the right term were more badly rusted around the edges, which had been bare metal.

I went at it with Scotch-Brite and a rotary wire brush. The main table surface came out passably well, I think. The wing edges still look rusty, but I flattened them down enough, I think.

I had doused the whole thing pretty liberally with WD-40 a couple of weeks ago, before I did any brushing. So now I have a slurry of rust particles and WD-40 covering the table top. I could use some sort of degreaser to get it off, but then I imagine I'd need to cover it with something to keep it from rusting again. Wax, I'm thinking.

Any better ideas?

As RonB noted some of the older C'man table saws were not bad at all.
You may have a keeper.

Clean your "slurry" off with paper towels and paint thinner (PT)
(assuming you have adequate ventalation). Feel the metal with the palm
of your hand. Think "smooth" rather than "flat" - it's unlikely that
your scothbrite action has made it much less flat than it was to start
with. If you find rough spots or see obvious rust (not pitting, but
rust) try naval jelly (as RonB suggested) or a product called RustFree
from the makers of Boeshield T-9. in extremous, don't be afraid to use
400 grit wet-dry sandpaper on a flat block lubed with PT. Just get the
rust off or it WILL spread.

Once it's rust free, clean again with PT. Someone suggested Boeshield
T-9 as a top coat. It's great stuff for rust prevention, but it's not
real slick. Johnson's paste wax works fine, but needs to be redone
after use as it wears off quickly where the boards slide over it. I
use Bostick TopCote on my saws, jointer, planer table, etc. and have
been very happy. It's slick, it lasts, and I have no problems with
rust. I do rub the surfaces down with white metal polish (a 9" orbital
buffer works great!), clean with PT, and redo the TopCote every 3 or 4
months, but that is, for me, just basic field maintenance.

Regards.

Tom

On Sat, 11 Feb 2012 16:58:07 -0600, Tom wrote:

Johnson's paste wax works fine, but needs to be redone after use as it
wears off quickly where the boards slide over it. I use Bostick TopCote
on my saws, jointer, planer table, etc. and have been very happy. It's
slick, it lasts, and I have no problems with rust.

Topcote is great stuff. But wax (I use Trewax) works fine and seems to
build in the pores over time. When I wax a new saw I have to redo soon
as you say. After the first few times though, the interval gradually
increases from weekly to monthly to quarterly to annually.

--
Intelligence is an experiment that failed - G. B. Shaw

"Greg Guarino" wrote in message
news:18976815.1506.1328996750253.JavaMail.geo-discussion-forums@vbbgq7...

There's an old Craftsman table saw in the basement of the building my Dad
had his office in. It's probably 30 years old, and never saw much use. I'm
trying to fix it up a bit to use it on occasion.

I know that Craftsman is held in low regard here, but perhaps I can prevail
on the nice folks here for some advice.

Rust:
The main table surface had a fair amount of surface rust, but hardly any
"bubbling". The "wings", if that's the right term were more badly rusted
around the edges, which had been bare metal.

I went at it with Scotch-Brite and a rotary wire brush. The main table
surface came out passably well, I think. The wing edges still look rusty,
but I flattened them down enough, I think.

I had doused the whole thing pretty liberally with WD-40 a couple of weeks
ago, before I did any brushing. So now I have a slurry of rust particles and
WD-40 covering the table top. I could use some sort of degreaser to get it
off, but then I imagine I'd need to cover it with something to keep it from
rusting again. Wax, I'm thinking.

Any better ideas?
================================================== ========
Kerosene. It will clean up the old crud and won't cause rust.

"RonB" wrote in message
...

On Feb 11, 3:45 pm, Greg Guarino wrote:
There's an old Craftsman table saw in the basement of the building my Dad
had his office in. It's probably 30 years old, and never saw much use. I'm
trying to fix it up a bit to use it on occasion.

I know that Craftsman is held in low regard here, but perhaps I can
prevail on the nice folks here for some advice.

Rust:
The main table surface had a fair amount of surface rust, but hardly any
"bubbling". The "wings", if that's the right term were more badly rusted
around the edges, which had been bare metal.

I went at it with Scotch-Brite and a rotary wire brush. The main table
surface came out passably well, I think. The wing edges still look rusty,
but I flattened them down enough, I think.

I had doused the whole thing pretty liberally with WD-40 a couple of weeks
ago, before I did any brushing. So now I have a slurry of rust particles
and WD-40 covering the table top. I could use some sort of degreaser to
get it off, but then I imagine I'd need to cover it with something to keep
it from rusting again. Wax, I'm thinking.

Any better ideas?

Does it have cast iron wings or stamped metal? If cast iron, it is
probably more like 40+ years old and you might have one of the older,
better Craftsman saws. Many of the iron extension tables had a open
triangular grid design. If it is one of the older ones it probably
has a cast fence vs the sheet metal fence of the 70's and later saws.
Craftsman did make pretty good machine tools prior to the 1970's when
they apparently sold out to their accountants.

Try naval gel, scotchbrite and lots of elbow grease. BUT make sure
you get the gel off because it can corrode.
================================================== ==========
Navel jelly will etch the surfaces. Just kerosene and scotchbrite. No matter
if the metal gets shiny or not, smooth is what you are after.

RonB

On Sat, 11 Feb 2012 13:45:50 -0800 (PST), Greg Guarino
wrote:

There's an old Craftsman table saw in the basement of the building my Dad had his office in. It's probably 30 years old, and never saw much use. I'm trying to fix it up a bit to use it on occasion.

I know that Craftsman is held in low regard here, but perhaps I can prevail on the nice folks here for some advice.

Rust:
The main table surface had a fair amount of surface rust, but hardly any "bubbling". The "wings", if that's the right term were more badly rusted around the edges, which had been bare metal.

I went at it with Scotch-Brite and a rotary wire brush. The main table surface came out passably well, I think. The wing edges still look rusty, but I flattened them down enough, I think.

I had doused the whole thing pretty liberally with WD-40 a couple of weeks ago, before I did any brushing. So now I have a slurry of rust particles and WD-40 covering the table top. I could use some sort of degreaser to get it off, but then I imagine I'd need to cover it with something to keep it from rusting again. Wax, I'm thinking.

Any better ideas?


Wipe off what you can with rags or paper towel, then use Top Saver on
it to get the rest of the rust. Incredible stuff.
http://ns2.42l.com/Lubricant-TopSaver/TopSaver.html


Wax works, but, IMO, Boeshield (spray can stuff) is better. Do not
use automotive wax with silicone.

On Feb 11, 4:45*pm, Greg Guarino wrote:
There's an old Craftsman table saw in the basement of the building my Dad had his office in. It's probably 30 years old, and never saw much use. I'm trying to fix it up a bit to use it on occasion.

I know that Craftsman is held in low regard here, but perhaps I can prevail on the nice folks here for some advice.

Rust:
The main table surface had a fair amount of surface rust, but hardly any "bubbling". The "wings", if that's the right term were more badly rusted around the edges, which had been bare metal.

I went at it with Scotch-Brite and a rotary wire brush. The main table surface came out passably well, I think. The wing edges still look rusty, but I flattened them down enough, I think.

I had doused the whole thing pretty liberally with WD-40 a couple of weeks ago, before I did any brushing. So now I have a slurry of rust particles and WD-40 covering the table top. I could use some sort of degreaser to get it off, but then I imagine I'd need to cover it with something to keep it from rusting again. Wax, I'm thinking.

Any better ideas?

Drench the top with WD-40. Slap a gray Scotchbrite pad onto the
bottom of your radial orbit sander and go at it. Wipe dry and hit
it with a couple of coats of paste wax.

On Sat, 11 Feb 2012 13:45:50 -0800 (PST), Greg Guarino
wrote:

There's an old Craftsman table saw in the basement of the building my Dad had his office in. It's probably 30 years old, and never saw much use. I'm trying to fix it up a bit to use it on occasion.

I know that Craftsman is held in low regard here, but perhaps I can prevail on the nice folks here for some advice.

Rust:
The main table surface had a fair amount of surface rust, but hardly any "bubbling". The "wings", if that's the right term were more badly rusted around the edges, which had been bare metal.

I went at it with Scotch-Brite and a rotary wire brush. The main table surface came out passably well, I think. The wing edges still look rusty, but I flattened them down enough, I think.

I had doused the whole thing pretty liberally with WD-40 a couple of weeks ago, before I did any brushing. So now I have a slurry of rust particles and WD-40 covering the table top. I could use some sort of degreaser to get it off, but then I imagine I'd need to cover it with something to keep it from rusting again. Wax, I'm thinking.

Any better ideas?
Boesheild???

"Greg Guarino" wrote:

There's an old Craftsman table saw in the basement of the building
my Dad had his office in. It's probably 30 years old, and never saw
much use. I'm trying to fix it up a bit to use it on occasion.

Rust:
The main table surface had a fair amount of surface rust, but hardly
any "bubbling". The "wings", if that's the right term were more
badly rusted around the edges, which had been bare metal.
-------------------------------------
Use any of the phosphoric acid based rust desolvers such as navel
jelly.

Sand with 150 grit and WD40.

Wipe clean and wax frequently until wax build up has happened.

Have fun.

Lew

On 2/11/2012 3:45 PM, Greg Guarino wrote:
There's an old Craftsman table saw in the basement of the building my Dad had his office in. It's probably 30 years old, and never saw much use. I'm trying to fix it up a bit to use it on occasion.

I know that Craftsman is held in low regard here, but perhaps I can prevail on the nice folks here for some advice.

Rust:
The main table surface had a fair amount of surface rust, but hardly any "bubbling". The "wings", if that's the right term were more badly rusted around the edges, which had been bare metal.

I went at it with Scotch-Brite and a rotary wire brush. The main table surface came out passably well, I think. The wing edges still look rusty, but I flattened them down enough, I think.

I had doused the whole thing pretty liberally with WD-40 a couple of weeks ago, before I did any brushing. So now I have a slurry of rust particles and WD-40 covering the table top. I could use some sort of degreaser to get it off, but then I imagine I'd need to cover it with something to keep it from rusting again. Wax, I'm thinking.

Any better ideas?

get a grill stone for the final polish, then cut the mess (after rags)
with brake cleaner. Have the wings sandblasted, and powdercoated, and
protect by keeping dry.

--
Steve Barker
remove the "not" from my address to email

Tom wrote:


As RonB noted some of the older C'man table saws were not bad at all.
You may have a keeper.

Indeed. The Craftsman table saws of the 50's and 60's were quite
servicable. A little finicky to setup properly, owing to the trunions under
the table, but a couple of hours invested in researching this topic on
google, and taking one's time in implementing the suggested practices are
well rewarded by a saw that performs quite nicely.


Clean your "slurry" off with paper towels and paint thinner (PT)
(assuming you have adequate ventalation). Feel the metal with the palm
of your hand. Think "smooth" rather than "flat" - it's unlikely that
your scothbrite action has made it much less flat than it was to start
with.

In fact - it is quite impossible that the scotchbrite pad will affect
flatness at all. Go at it with a vengance - you can't cause any harm with a
scotchbrite pad.

If you find rough spots or see obvious rust (not pitting, but
rust)

Same thing. Pitting is rust at advanced stages. Rust is just pitting that
hasn't happened yet. Pitting is a pain, but it's pretty much just something
you live with. No real harm in small areas.

try naval jelly (as RonB suggested) or a product called RustFree
from the makers of Boeshield T-9. in extremous, don't be afraid to use
400 grit wet-dry sandpaper on a flat block lubed with PT. Just get the
rust off or it WILL spread.

Rust will always spread, will always exist, and will always come back.
Regardless of the claims of the manufacurers of products like converters,
sealants, etc., rust will always come back. Products like I mentioned can
delay that return, and periodic maintenance can make the issue of rust seem
like it's not an issue, but left alone - rust will come back. Leave it
alone longer and it will spread. It's like your ex-wife's legs - you just
can't keep it from spreading.


Once it's rust free, clean again with PT. Someone suggested Boeshield
T-9 as a top coat. It's great stuff for rust prevention, but it's not
real slick. Johnson's paste wax works fine, but needs to be redone
after use as it wears off quickly where the boards slide over it.

I use Johnson's and just resign myself to doing it once or twice a year.
Personally - I'm fine with that. I've never used Boeshield so I can't
comment on it.

I
use Bostick TopCote on my saws, jointer, planer table, etc. and have
been very happy. It's slick, it lasts, and I have no problems with
rust. I do rub the surfaces down with white metal polish (a 9" orbital
buffer works great!), clean with PT, and redo the TopCote every 3 or 4
months, but that is, for me, just basic field maintenance.

And that is why you have no problem with rust. It's not the product you
use, but rather, it's your routine maintenance that is benefitting you. No
matter - you go with what works.


--

-Mike-

Steve Barker wrote:


get a grill stone for the final polish, then cut the mess (after
rags) with brake cleaner. Have the wings sandblasted, and
powdercoated, and protect by keeping dry.

Sandblasting - the best hope for fighting rust. Not a complete rust
solution, since rust is... well, it's rust and it will come back even with
sandblasting. That said - sandblasting does the best job of giving the
metal a longer lasting chance before the rust inevitably comes back.

If you could (afford to...) have the table milled below the depth of the
established rust, then you'd have your best chance at not seeing rust again
in the future - but it's hardly worth it. Maintain the saw once or twice a
year and you'll be fine.

--

-Mike-

On 2/11/2012 11:15 PM, Mike Marlow wrote:
Steve Barker wrote:


get a grill stone for the final polish, then cut the mess (after
rags) with brake cleaner. Have the wings sandblasted, and
powdercoated, and protect by keeping dry.

Sandblasting - the best hope for fighting rust. Not a complete rust
solution, since rust is... well, it's rust and it will come back even with
sandblasting. That said - sandblasting does the best job of giving the
metal a longer lasting chance before the rust inevitably comes back.

If you could (afford to...) have the table milled below the depth of the
established rust, then you'd have your best chance at not seeing rust again
in the future - but it's hardly worth it. Maintain the saw once or twice a
year and you'll be fine.


I do what has been recommend but have a piece of plywood cut to the size
of the table saw, that keep the humid air from directly contacting the
table.

On 2/11/2012 4:45 PM, Greg Guarino wrote:
There's an old Craftsman table saw in the basement of the building my Dad had his office in. It's probably 30 years old, and never saw much use. I'm trying to fix it up a bit to use it on occasion.

I know that Craftsman is held in low regard here, but perhaps I can prevail on the nice folks here for some advice.

Well it doesn't have Saw Stop tech, so use it at your own risk.

Rust:
The main table surface had a fair amount of surface rust, but hardly any "bubbling". The "wings", if that's the right term were more badly rusted around the edges, which had been bare metal.

The best way to remove serious rust is with Naval Jell. It works
effortlessly, even on thick rust.

I went at it with Scotch-Brite and a rotary wire brush. The main table surface came out passably well, I think. The wing edges still look rusty, but I flattened them down enough, I think.

This is OK on rust that began a few minutes ago. Rust that is starting
to "bubble" needs Naval Jell.

I had doused the whole thing pretty liberally with WD-40 a couple of weeks ago, before I did any brushing. So now I have a slurry of rust particles and WD-40 covering the table top. I could use some sort of degreaser to get it off, but then I imagine I'd need to cover it with something to keep it from rusting again. Wax, I'm thinking.

Get all the WD-40 off (lacquer thinner works for me) before using the
Naval Jell. After cleaning off all the naval jell with rags and water,
wipe down with lacquer thinner and immediately spray with Bostik
TopCote. Your top will be slick as ICE and rust will be history with
some minor maintenance. (Spray on a another coat every few months,
takes a few seconds and no effort.) If any of the rust "bubbled", the
jell will remove it, but the rust pits will remain. No biggie, just
looks a little funky.

Any better ideas?

No. I've been through all this and speak from experience. TopCote will
prevent rust and is slick as ice. In a normal environment it will last
a long time. My first shop was in a basement with water problems and I
became an expert on this. Wax does not cut it, it is not as slick as
TopCote, and is harder to apply, and does not last. I even went so far
as to melt wax in lacquer thinner and paint it on my tops, still got
rust as the wax quickly wears off. Some say to use Boseshield T-9, but
in some very lengthy discussions on this subject in the rec, I don't
think it's as good as Topcote, not slick enough among other things. I
never used it though, so I have to go by what was said about it in the rec.

--
Jack
Add Life to your Days not Days to your Life.
http://jbstein.com

On Sun, 12 Feb 2012 10:06:33 -0500, Keith Nuttle wrote:

I do what has been recommend but have a piece of plywood cut to the size
of the table saw, that keep the humid air from directly contacting the
table.

That may not hurt, but unless the fit of plywood to table is airtight and
the plywood is sealed (and *not* with latex) I don't think it'll do any
good.

In some environments it may even trap moisture.

If it works for you, great. But I wouldn't suggest it as a general
solution.

--
Intelligence is an experiment that failed - G. B. Shaw

On Sat, 11 Feb 2012 23:11:47 -0500, Mike Marlow wrote:

Rust will always spread, will always exist, and will always come back.
Regardless of the claims of the manufacurers of products like
converters, sealants, etc., rust will always come back.

I have never seen any rust on my 1948 Delta saw except when I first
rescued it at an estate sale. And it was minimal then despite having set
outside under a canopy for at least a year. I have no idea what the
prior owner(s) used on the top, if anything, but all I've ever used is
wax.

Makes me wonder if old cast iron was more resistant than the new stuff.

The top does have this nice patina that old metal gets and that
collectors adore. Maybe that helps protect it.

--
Intelligence is an experiment that failed - G. B. Shaw

Larry Blanchard wrote:
On Sat, 11 Feb 2012 23:11:47 -0500, Mike Marlow wrote:

Rust will always spread, will always exist, and will always come
back. Regardless of the claims of the manufacurers of products like
converters, sealants, etc., rust will always come back.

I have never seen any rust on my 1948 Delta saw except when I first
rescued it at an estate sale. And it was minimal then despite having
set outside under a canopy for at least a year. I have no idea what
the prior owner(s) used on the top, if anything, but all I've ever
used is wax.

Makes me wonder if old cast iron was more resistant than the new
stuff.

The top does have this nice patina that old metal gets and that
collectors adore. Maybe that helps protect it.

Where do you live Larry? Dry climate? I'm in Central NY and we have enough
humidity that rust is of some concern - but not like the people who live in
the south east. My table saw sees too little love and attention and might
get cleaned and waxed every... so often. In fact - it usually is covered
with crap that finds its way to flat surfaces... That said - I don't have
what I would call any significant rust problem with my saw top either. Mine
is a 50-60's Craftsman. It will rust over lightly, but it's not like it is
rusting heavily, or pitting. When I do clean mine up, all it gets is a coat
of Johnson's paste wax.

--

-Mike-

On 2/11/2012 3:45 PM, Greg Guarino wrote:
There's an old Craftsman table saw in the basement of the building my Dad had his office in. It's probably 30 years old, and never saw much use. I'm trying to fix it up a bit to use it on occasion.

I know that Craftsman is held in low regard here, but perhaps I can prevail on the nice folks here for some advice.

Rust:
The main table surface had a fair amount of surface rust, but hardly any "bubbling". The "wings", if that's the right term were more badly rusted around the edges, which had been bare metal.

I went at it with Scotch-Brite and a rotary wire brush. The main table surface came out passably well, I think. The wing edges still look rusty, but I flattened them down enough, I think.

I had doused the whole thing pretty liberally with WD-40 a couple of weeks ago, before I did any brushing. So now I have a slurry of rust particles and WD-40 covering the table top. I could use some sort of degreaser to get it off, but then I imagine I'd need to cover it with something to keep it from rusting again. Wax, I'm thinking.

Any better ideas?

I have tried several products for preventing rust. Wax and Bowshield
are popular but did not work for me. I use Bostitch TopCote.
Empire TopSaver is another good brand but a bit more trouble to use.

Odd things that I have learned through the years.

Elmers, and Titebond wood glues will remove rust from the iron top, so
well that the finish relieved will be silver.

Have I ever use glue to restore a finish? NO! But drips of glue hit
the surface and when I remove the glue some time later the surface is
like new.

A flat card scraper will make a top, in pretty good shape, as smooth as
a baby's butt very quickly with a pass or two.

On 2/12/2012 12:55 PM, Mike Marlow wrote:
Larry Blanchard wrote:
On Sat, 11 Feb 2012 23:11:47 -0500, Mike Marlow wrote:

Rust will always spread, will always exist, and will always come
back. Regardless of the claims of the manufacurers of products like
converters, sealants, etc., rust will always come back.

I have never seen any rust on my 1948 Delta saw except when I first
rescued it at an estate sale. And it was minimal then despite having
set outside under a canopy for at least a year. I have no idea what
the prior owner(s) used on the top, if anything, but all I've ever
used is wax.

Makes me wonder if old cast iron was more resistant than the new
stuff.

The top does have this nice patina that old metal gets and that
collectors adore. Maybe that helps protect it.

Where do you live Larry? Dry climate? I'm in Central NY and we have enough
humidity that rust is of some concern - but not like the people who live in
the south east. My table saw sees too little love and attention and might
get cleaned and waxed every... so often. In fact - it usually is covered
with crap that finds its way to flat surfaces... That said - I don't have
what I would call any significant rust problem with my saw top either. Mine
is a 50-60's Craftsman. It will rust over lightly, but it's not like it is
rusting heavily, or pitting. When I do clean mine up, all it gets is a coat
of Johnson's paste wax.


Oddly, humidity alone is not much of a problem, at least in Houston
where humidity is a constant thing. Condensing moisture is the problem
and that is normally associated with quick temperature change in a humid
environment.

Right Swingman?

On 2/11/2012 9:33 PM, Lew Hodgett wrote:
"Greg Guarino" wrote:

There's an old Craftsman table saw in the basement of the building
my Dad had his office in. It's probably 30 years old, and never saw
much use. I'm trying to fix it up a bit to use it on occasion.

Rust:
The main table surface had a fair amount of surface rust, but hardly
any "bubbling". The "wings", if that's the right term were more
badly rusted around the edges, which had been bare metal.
-------------------------------------
Use any of the phosphoric acid based rust desolvers such as navel
jelly.


I have a neighbor that is a gun engraver. He claims that after using
naval jelly that he never has a rust problem, with no further treatment
of any kind.

My application of wd-40, Scotch Brite and a little rotary wire brushing seems to have rendered most of the top serviceable. As per the tips here, I cleaned up the rusty goo with paint thinner, making several passes. I applied some paste wax because that's what I had handy, but I may try some of the specialized spray-on stuff later on. I may also use some naval jelly on the one really damaged edge of the right-hand "wing".

So here's the next problem. I have not yet found a blade guard anywhere near this saw. I think it may have come with one, so searching around may yet turn it up. But it certainly did not have a "riving knife", if that's the right term.

I remember being taught about kickback in high school; mostly the stern admonition never to be in the path of the wood. I've done just a little bit of research, and I'm wondering what the knowledgeable folks here think would be a reasonable and cost effective solution.

2 products from Micro-Jig look interesting, at least to my untutored eye. They make two different splitters (although I'd also have to buy a zero-clearance insert) and their "Grr-ripper" (silly name, IMO). I'm sure there are dozens of others. I'm looking for safety and ease of use for reasonable cost; cost commensurate with my intermittent woodworking.

On 2/12/2012 2:46 PM, Greg Guarino wrote:
My application of wd-40, Scotch Brite and a little rotary wire brushing seems to have rendered most of the top serviceable. As per the tips here, I cleaned up the rusty goo with paint thinner, making several passes. I applied some paste wax because that's what I had handy, but I may try some of the specialized spray-on stuff later on. I may also use some naval jelly on the one really damaged edge of the right-hand "wing".

So here's the next problem. I have not yet found a blade guard anywhere near this saw. I think it may have come with one, so searching around may yet turn it up. But it certainly did not have a "riving knife", if that's the right term.

I remember being taught about kickback in high school; mostly the stern admonition never to be in the path of the wood. I've done just a little bit of research, and I'm wondering what the knowledgeable folks here think would be a reasonable and cost effective solution.

2 products from Micro-Jig look interesting, at least to my untutored eye. They make two different splitters (although I'd also have to buy a zero-clearance insert) and their "Grr-ripper" (silly name, IMO). I'm sure there are dozens of others. I'm looking for safety and ease of use for reasonable cost; cost commensurate with my intermittent woodworking.

I use the Microjig splitter, the on with the steel center core.

On Sun, 12 Feb 2012 16:23:37 -0600, Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet
I use the Microjig splitter, the on with the steel center core.

I didn't know they made ones with a metal component. Here's the
plastic ones so he knows what you're talking about.
http://www.leevalley.com/en/wood/pag...=1,41080,51225

On Sun, 12 Feb 2012 12:46:29 -0800 (PST), Greg Guarino
wrote:

My application of wd-40, Scotch Brite and a little rotary wire brushing seems to have rendered most of the top serviceable. As per the tips here, I cleaned up the rusty goo with paint thinner, making several passes. I applied some paste wax because that's what I had handy, but I may try some of the specialized spray-on stuff later on. I may also use some naval jelly on the one really damaged edge of the right-hand "wing".

So here's the next problem. I have not yet found a blade guard anywhere near this saw. I think it may have come with one, so searching around may yet turn it up. But it certainly did not have a "riving knife", if that's the right term.

I remember being taught about kickback in high school; mostly the stern admonition never to be in the path of the wood. I've done just a little bit of research, and I'm wondering what the knowledgeable folks here think would be a reasonable and cost effective solution.

2 products from Micro-Jig look interesting, at least to my untutored eye. They make two different splitters (although I'd also have to buy a zero-clearance insert) and their "Grr-ripper" (silly name, IMO). I'm sure there are dozens of others. I'm looking for safety and ease of use for reasonable cost; cost commensurate with my intermittent woodworking.

Greg:

You remember right, stay out of the "throw line" of the work. That
being said, you can still get wacked by a "top of the blade"
throw-back because the wood may come sideways off the blade. Don't ask
how I know this. If you want to see it in action, just forget to lock
down the rip fence when cutting a 48" square of 3/4 MDF. THe balde
teeth leave really neat tracks across the bottom of the board as they
chuck it at you.

The Micro Jig splitters work quite well, though you need to be careful
in drilling the holes that they snap into in your ZCI . The splitter
has to line up just about perfectly with the kerf line on the saw.
Follow the instructions and you'll be OK.

Others will disagree (and some of them can still count to ten without
taking off their shoes and socks), but operating without a blade guard
of any kind is, IMHO, a bad idea. Sure there are times when not using
one is maybe OK, but not having the option would be, for me, scary.
Look at the Delta overarm guard ($$) and the Excaliber (sp?, $$$).
Either may give you ideas on how to engineer some kind of blade guard
that isn't too much of a hassle to use. I have a Jet TS and replaced
the stock hunk-a-junk with the Delta overarm many years ago and I
haven't regretted it. I also installed a Biesmeyer splitter that is
great 'cause it's easy on, easy off. Neither may be an option on your
old C'man.

Making a ZCI is not all that tough, especially if you have a router
and a flush trim bit - just trace the existing insert onto a piece of
baltic birch ply (a flat piece!), rough cut outside the line with a
sabre saw (or coping saw), then use the existing insert as a template
fastened down with double sided tape or even a clamp (that you'll have
to move a couple of times) and rout around it with the trim bit. Make
1/2 dozen at one time and you can cut a ZCI for common angle cuts and
dado widths.

The Grr-ripper may have a silly name, but it is a GREAT piece of gear.
I have and use 2 of them on most cutting projects and on the router
table. It's one of those things you won't regret paying for over time.
The folks that designed it thought it through and it damn well works!
Little things like the O rings that keep the threaded fasteners from
falling out - brilliant and simple solution to a really irritating
problem.

Regards.

Tom

On Sun, 12 Feb 2012 13:55:51 -0500, Mike Marlow wrote:

Where do you live Larry? Dry climate? I'm in Central NY and we have
enough humidity that rust is of some concern - but not like the people
who live in the south east.

Yes and no. I'm in eastern WA and our wet/dry seasons are reversed.
Humidity is very low in the summer and quite high in the winter. I just
checked and the current humidity here is 76%.

With the dry summers we don't get much sweating of the metal but in the
winter we do get condensation.

But as I mentioned in another post, it's filling the pores with wax that
is probably responsible for the lack of rust.

--
Intelligence is an experiment that failed - G. B. Shaw

On Sun, 12 Feb 2012 12:46:29 -0800, Greg Guarino wrote:

I remember being taught about kickback in high school; mostly the stern
admonition never to be in the path of the wood. I've done just a little
bit of research, and I'm wondering what the knowledgeable folks here
think would be a reasonable and cost effective solution.

As far as kickback, a splitter or riving knife is all that's needed. A
blade guard is to protect the operator.

My old Delta has an overarm guard that works well for ripping as long as
the wood is wider than the guard. It's a pain for crosscutting because
it's metal and heavy. The link below isn't the greatest picture, but it
shows the guard. Shouldn't be too hard to make something similar. But
make it from plastic so it's light.

http://vintagemachinery.org/photoind....aspx?id=13355

Found another picture from the side:

http://vintagemachinery.org/photoind....aspx?id=11117

--
Intelligence is an experiment that failed - G. B. Shaw

On 2/12/2012 3:10 PM, Leon wrote:
On 2/11/2012 9:33 PM, Lew Hodgett wrote:
"Greg Guarino" wrote:

There's an old Craftsman table saw in the basement of the building
my Dad had his office in. It's probably 30 years old, and never saw
much use. I'm trying to fix it up a bit to use it on occasion.

Rust:
The main table surface had a fair amount of surface rust, but hardly
any "bubbling". The "wings", if that's the right term were more
badly rusted around the edges, which had been bare metal.
-------------------------------------
Use any of the phosphoric acid based rust desolvers such as navel
jelly.


I have a neighbor that is a gun engraver. He claims that after using
naval jelly that he never has a rust problem, with no further treatment
of any kind.

Phosphoric acid is a pickling agent use in the metal processing
industry. So the slight coating of iron phosphate may last a long time
preventing oxidation.

On 2/12/2012 6:56 PM, Larry Blanchard wrote:
On Sun, 12 Feb 2012 13:55:51 -0500, Mike Marlow wrote:

Where do you live Larry? Dry climate? I'm in Central NY and we have
enough humidity that rust is of some concern - but not like the people
who live in the south east.

Yes and no. I'm in eastern WA and our wet/dry seasons are reversed.
Humidity is very low in the summer and quite high in the winter. I just
checked and the current humidity here is 76%.

With the dry summers we don't get much sweating of the metal but in the
winter we do get condensation.

But as I mentioned in another post, it's filling the pores with wax that
is probably responsible for the lack of rust.


As said humidity is not necessarily the culprit, as the percent humidity
is a function of the ambient temperature and the dew point. The %
humidity is a compares the dew point to the air temperature. A 76%
humidity at 50F is not the same as a 76% humidity at 80F.

The dew point is the most important measure of water in the air. When
the dew points reach 76F, it does not matter what the temperature it is,
it is going to be uncomfortable, and you are more likely to have
condensation.

Sand that baby down.

I sanded my Delta down, I wanted the powermatic 66 look (polished, no
machine marks) . I just kept going at it. I put a few different grits,
starting with 220 alum oxide, progressing to 800 wet dry on my Random
Orbit Sander. It is smooth as silk.... Every now and then a coat of
paste wax. Johnsons, or butchers wax....

On 2/11/2012 9:14 PM, CW wrote:


"Greg Guarino" wrote in message
news:18976815.1506.1328996750253.JavaMail.geo-discussion-forums@vbbgq7...

There's an old Craftsman table saw in the basement of the building my
Dad had his office in. It's probably 30 years old, and never saw much
use. I'm trying to fix it up a bit to use it on occasion.

I know that Craftsman is held in low regard here, but perhaps I can
prevail on the nice folks here for some advice.

Rust:
The main table surface had a fair amount of surface rust, but hardly any
"bubbling". The "wings", if that's the right term were more badly rusted
around the edges, which had been bare metal.

I went at it with Scotch-Brite and a rotary wire brush. The main table
surface came out passably well, I think. The wing edges still look
rusty, but I flattened them down enough, I think.

I had doused the whole thing pretty liberally with WD-40 a couple of
weeks ago, before I did any brushing. So now I have a slurry of rust
particles and WD-40 covering the table top. I could use some sort of
degreaser to get it off, but then I imagine I'd need to cover it with
something to keep it from rusting again. Wax, I'm thinking.

Any better ideas?
================================================== ========
Kerosene. It will clean up the old crud and won't cause rust.

"Larry Blanchard" wrote in message ...

On Sun, 12 Feb 2012 10:06:33 -0500, Keith Nuttle wrote:

I do what has been recommend but have a piece of plywood cut to the size
of the table saw, that keep the humid air from directly contacting the
table.

That may not hurt, but unless the fit of plywood to table is airtight and
the plywood is sealed (and *not* with latex) I don't think it'll do any
good.

In some environments it may even trap moisture.

If it works for you, great. But I wouldn't suggest it as a general
solution.
================================================== ====================
It works very well. Even a cloth thrown over the table will do it.

On 2/12/2012 6:22 PM, Keith Nuttle wrote:
On 2/12/2012 6:56 PM, Larry Blanchard wrote:
On Sun, 12 Feb 2012 13:55:51 -0500, Mike Marlow wrote:

Where do you live Larry? Dry climate? I'm in Central NY and we have
enough humidity that rust is of some concern - but not like the people
who live in the south east.

Yes and no. I'm in eastern WA and our wet/dry seasons are reversed.
Humidity is very low in the summer and quite high in the winter. I just
checked and the current humidity here is 76%.

With the dry summers we don't get much sweating of the metal but in the
winter we do get condensation.

But as I mentioned in another post, it's filling the pores with wax that
is probably responsible for the lack of rust.


As said humidity is not necessarily the culprit, as the percent humidity
is a function of the ambient temperature and the dew point. The %
humidity is a compares the dew point to the air temperature. A 76%
humidity at 50F is not the same as a 76% humidity at 80F.

The dew point is the most important measure of water in the air. When
the dew points reach 76F, it does not matter what the temperature it is,
it is going to be uncomfortable, and you are more likely to have
condensation.

And to take that a little further, Humid day and warm so the metal is
warm. A cold front blows in bringing a 20 degree temperatures in 15
minutes. That cool air hitting the warm iron results in almost instant
condensation on the iron.

On 2/12/2012 4:33 PM, Dave wrote:
On Sun, 12 Feb 2012 16:23:37 -0600, Leonlcb11211@swbelldotnet
I use the Microjig splitter, the on with the steel center core.

I didn't know they made ones with a metal component. Here's the
plastic ones so he knows what you're talking about.
http://www.leevalley.com/en/wood/pag...=1,41080,51225

http://microjig.com/products/mj-splitter-steel-pro/

This has been around 4~5 years.

Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet wrote in
:

That cool air hitting the warm iron results in almost instant
condensation on the iron.

Generally, warm and moist air hitting a cool surface is what cuases
condensation on the cool object. Cool air hitting a warm surface does NOT
give condensation.

--
Best regards
Han
email address is invalid

On 2/13/2012 7:12 AM, Han wrote:
Leonlcb11211@swbelldotnet wrote in
:

That cool air hitting the warm iron results in almost instant
condensation on the iron.

Generally, warm and moist air hitting a cool surface is what cuases
condensation on the cool object. Cool air hitting a warm surface does NOT
give condensation.


Bull ****!

Han wrote:
Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet wrote in
:

That cool air hitting the warm iron results in almost instant
condensation on the iron.

Generally, warm and moist air hitting a cool surface is what cuases
condensation on the cool object. Cool air hitting a warm surface does NOT
give condensation.

So, when it is zero outside and 70 inside my house with 70% humidity,
the wet stuff on my windows (inside) is NOT condensation???

On 2/12/2012 6:08 PM, Tom wrote:
The Grr-ripper may have a silly name, but it is a GREAT piece of gear.
I have and use 2 of them on most cutting projects and on the router
table.

Do you use this in lieu of a guard? Sorry for the stupid question, but
it certainly looks like you couldn't use both, except perhaps when
cutting wide stock (when you might not need it at all?)

On 2/13/2012 8:39 AM, Norvin Gordon wrote:
Han wrote:
Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet wrote in
:

That cool air hitting the warm iron results in almost instant
condensation on the iron.

Generally, warm and moist air hitting a cool surface is what cuases
condensation on the cool object. Cool air hitting a warm surface does
NOT give condensation.

So, when it is zero outside and 70 inside my house with 70% humidity,
the wet stuff on my windows (inside) is NOT condensation???

Han is correct.

What you describe is the result of the warmer air inside the building
hitting the colder surface of a cold window, not the reverse.

Condensation generally happens when warm, moisture laden air hits a
cooler service.

When is the last time you saw condensation forming on a mug of hot
coffee on a cold day?

--
www.eWoodShop.com
Last update: 4/15/2010
KarlCaillouet@ (the obvious)
http://gplus.to/eWoodShop

Norvin Gordon wrote in
:

Han wrote:
Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet wrote in
:

That cool air hitting the warm iron results in almost instant
condensation on the iron.

Generally, warm and moist air hitting a cool surface is what cuases
condensation on the cool object. Cool air hitting a warm surface does
NOT give condensation.

So, when it is zero outside and 70 inside my house with 70% humidity,
the wet stuff on my windows (inside) is NOT condensation???

Please re-read what I said. Inside your house it is 70% relative humidity,
and outside it is zero Fahrenheit? You must have 17humifiers going full
blast!! No wonder that the warm, moist air in your rooms condenses on the
cold windows ...

--
Best regards
Han
email address is invalid