On Feb 17, 5:53*pm, wrote:
[snipped a whole lot of common sense]

I like the work, but don't like the attitude that comes with it.
That's one area that maybe holds me back. *I'm not going to talk about
myself as if what I am doing is museum quality this and finest that,
and maybe the people with the $$ need to hear that kind of stuff, but
they won't hear it from me. *I just want to smack that guy. *


Tell you what. I'll hold him, you smack him. Then we switch.
What a snooty douche-nozzle.
But wait! I'm just too brilliantly fantastic and talented to do that.
And too good-looking too! I could muss up my Birkies!! I'm so upset, I
think I'll throw tofu at him instead!!

wrote in message
...

I like the work, but don't like the attitude that comes with it.
That's one area that maybe holds me back. I'm not going to talk about
myself as if what I am doing is museum quality this and finest that,
and maybe the people with the $$ need to hear that kind of stuff, but
they won't hear it from me. I just want to smack that guy. But he's
probably only saying it because that's what he thinks people want to
hear, and maybe he's right.

I guess I would rather sell things that maybe they are under priced
but it's still a lot of money to the person buying it and something
they will really appreciate and love, than something somebody bought
because it was expensive which is the feeling I get from a lot of
these sites. But I get more messages from people saying how they love
one of the boxes and would buy it if they had the money than I do
sales. In a way I appreciate those messages more than the sales, but
at the same time it doesn't pay the bills.

-Kevin


Wellllllll you have to sell yourself, I have done plenty of that in the
past. Fortunately I have reoccurring customers and referrals from them. I
wonder what would happen with your pieces if you put them on another
unrelated site and doubled the price. I have learned that you can scare
business off if you are too cheap or don't display enough confidence in your
pricing. Very often I get jobs that I an not interested in doing until I
actually up the price to what I am comfortable with. I think a customer can
read your discomfort in your pricing. I "try" not to let pricing limit what
I want to do in a project.

http://www.krtwood.com/curves.html
http://www.krtwood.com/mission.html

http://www.alladd.com/index.htm


-Kevin


Now you're just ****ing me off. :-)


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com

---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

"Upscale" writes:

wrote in message
My three latest jewelry boxes:
http://www.krtwood.com/recent.html

Very nice. My first thought was that you should get together with an
architect and build a few houses similar in shape to those jewelry boxes.

:-) Just don't end up on a list like

http://www.darkroastedblend.com/2009...rb-series.html

Leon wrote:
wrote in message
...
My three latest jewelry boxes:

http://www.krtwood.com/recent.html

First one was a real challenge. Second one is pretty simple but my
favorite of the three. It's just 3 layers of 1/8" baltic birch bent
over a board at the center and clamped down, no complicated bending
jig required. And the third one also pretty simple, and the most
functional of the group. I really like using the full extension
slides for access to the whole drawer. This was a bit interesting
because the inside of the box is at about a 4 degree angle, the guides
are at that angle as well. Made fitting the drawers a little
interesting.


-Kevin


Absolutely great Kevin but I was really turned off with the mechanical steel
slides on the last one. May I suggest sliding dado's next time?

Thats the only thing I liked... Those slides looked like something I'd
do, the rest of it made me feel like, inferior....

Honestly, those slides really looked out of place on such nice, creative
work. The first two appear to have some creative and unusual slides, so
I can't help wondering why the metalware on the last one?

--
Jack
Using FREE News Server: http://Motzarella.org
http://jbstein.com

wrote:
On Feb 17, 9:16 am, wrote:
I'm disgusted! Those projects must have been done with Magic! I now
don't feel qualified to wipe down the toolbox of such a Master
Woodworker.

Ha ha! Actually from a woodworking perspective everything is very
simple. There are a lot of half lap joints and pocket screws in what
I do. If I can do it, you can do it.

I don't think so Kevin. The designs are very appealing and creative. I
could probably do the work, but not the design. For example, the little
wave on the last box top is special, I doubt I would ever have come up
with doing that, very artistic. Don't under sell yourself, any one can
build stuff, you have to be special to design stuff that pleasing to the
eye.

--
Jack
Using FREE News Server: http://Motzarella.org
http://jbstein.com

On Feb 18, 11:57 am, Jack Stein wrote:
Leon wrote:
wrote in message
...
My three latest jewelry boxes:

http://www.krtwood.com/recent.html

First one was a real challenge. Second one is pretty simple but my
favorite of the three. It's just 3 layers of 1/8" baltic birch bent
over a board at the center and clamped down, no complicated bending
jig required. And the third one also pretty simple, and the most
functional of the group. I really like using the full extension
slides for access to the whole drawer. This was a bit interesting
because the inside of the box is at about a 4 degree angle, the guides
are at that angle as well. Made fitting the drawers a little
interesting.

-Kevin

Absolutely great Kevin but I was really turned off with the mechanical steel
slides on the last one. May I suggest sliding dado's next time?

Thats the only thing I liked... Those slides looked like something I'd
do, the rest of it made me feel like, inferior....

Honestly, those slides really looked out of place on such nice, creative
work. The first two appear to have some creative and unusual slides, so
I can't help wondering why the metalware on the last one?

Well everyone feels strongly about the slides I have had feedback
from customers that they don't like short drawers that fall out when
you try to get to the back of them. As I said elsewhere, the main
problem is the top drawer where the top overhangs, especially if you
have a drawer that is inset to the frame of the box rather than
overlapping the front, the wood slides have to end the thickness of
the front of the drawer plus the reveal from the front edge, the top
overhangs the front of the box perhaps 1/2" to 3/4", and you need a
good 1/2" to 3/4" of the drawer still on the slides to support it
without falling out. Add all that up and you have an inch and half or
more of the drawer still under the top.

The other alternative is to make the top drawer not actually a drawer
but fixed and have the top hinged. That's doable on a rectangular
box, but when you start throwing in angles and curves as I like to do
it starts getting tricky. Plus when you have a solid wood top that is
just a single board I want that attached to some structure to help
limit any warping it wants to do.

-Kevin

On Feb 18, 12:06 pm, Jack Stein wrote:
wrote:
On Feb 17, 9:16 am, wrote:
I'm disgusted! Those projects must have been done with Magic! I now
don't feel qualified to wipe down the toolbox of such a Master
Woodworker.

Ha ha! Actually from a woodworking perspective everything is very
simple. There are a lot of half lap joints and pocket screws in what
I do. If I can do it, you can do it.

I don't think so Kevin. The designs are very appealing and creative. I
could probably do the work, but not the design. For example, the little
wave on the last box top is special, I doubt I would ever have come up
with doing that, very artistic. Don't under sell yourself, any one can
build stuff, you have to be special to design stuff that pleasing to the
eye.

Well I was referring more to the techniques involved. I still have
miters give me fits from time to time and I am generally going to ruin
something if hand tools are involved. Master woodworker I am not.

From the design/creativity side, that's really something hard to
define. I see it as I have an understanding of what the wood can and
cannot do, what my tools and skills can and cannot do, and a library
of techniques to deal with about any situation that is going to come
up. I have learned to not let my fear of things not turning out right
stop me and to just go with it. I don't see it as me doing
something special, more that most everyone else is holding themselves
back. It's probably a little of both.

The example you gave, well I bought that board which was intended to
be used for a guitar by the guy who cut it. It was longer with a
natural edge along part of it, rough cut straight for maybe 3/4s of
the edge. He did it that way because he had a template for half a
guitar and was minimizing waste. I looked at it and my first thoughts
were probably what anyone else would think, trying to decide which
rectangle I wanted to take from it. The full width and stop at the
natural edge, or a longer length and rip it narrower. But it was
already not as wide as I would like, and not as long as I'd like if I
cut it at the natural edge. So I was just open at that point to
considering a different option, go longer and leave a bit of the
natural edge. Is this going to look stupid? Let's find out! I ended
up deciding to leave the rough cut on the edge so it would blend in
better with the natural edge, and as a bonus - less work for me. From
there having that bit of asymmetry allowed me to consider doing the
pulls in that asymmetrical layout around the swirl of the grain. If
it wasn't for that first choice I wouldn't have made the second
one.

-Kevin

wrote

Well everyone feels strongly about the slides I have had feedback
from customers that they don't like short drawers that fall out when
you try to get to the back of them. As I said elsewhere, the main
problem is the top drawer where the top overhangs, especially if you
have a drawer that is inset to the frame of the box rather than
overlapping the front, the wood slides have to end the thickness of
the front of the drawer plus the reveal from the front edge, the top
overhangs the front of the box perhaps 1/2" to 3/4", and you need a
good 1/2" to 3/4" of the drawer still on the slides to support it
without falling out. Add all that up and you have an inch and half or
more of the drawer still under the top.

OK, I am moving rapidly into an area I know nothing about. But I have seen
some kind of double dovetail slides out of wood. This would essentially be
a full extension slide. No idea how to make them (obviously a jig of some
kind) or how durable they would be. You obviously don't want to produce
something that would break easily.

Lee Michaels wrote:

wrote

Well everyone feels strongly about the slides I have had feedback
from customers that they don't like short drawers that fall out when
you try to get to the back of them. As I said elsewhere, the main

OK, I am moving rapidly into an area I know nothing about. But I have seen
some kind of double dovetail slides out of wood. This would essentially be
a full extension slide. No idea how to make them (obviously a jig of some
kind) or how durable they would be. You obviously don't want to produce
something that would break easily.

I think I saw some full extension slides made from wood in a Fine Woodworking
a few (maybe 10, maybe less) years back. But, those were on a full size
chest-of-drawers and were kind of big as I remember. Might be hard to do
on a jewelry box, except for that guy who does the minatures of course . . .

Bill Ranck
Blacksburg, Va.

In article
writes:
On Feb 18, 11:57 am, Jack Stein wrote:

Honestly, those slides really looked out of place on such nice, creative
work. The first two appear to have some creative and unusual slides, so
I can't help wondering why the metalware on the last one?

Well everyone feels strongly about the slides I have had feedback

I'll take the risk of disagreeing with everyone. It may be my
beginner perspective, so I don't have any baggage attached to the
drawer slide issue. Whatever the reason, my first reaction to the
drawer slides was that the combination of beautiful wood and shiney
industrial parts was kind of cool.

Maybe I'd react differently to the box, but that was my reaction
to the pictures. Doesn't matter much. I can't afford your stuff,
so I'm not the customer you need to please.


--
| Stories of tortures used by debauchers
Drew Lawson | lurid, licentious and vile
| make me smile

Drew Lawson wrote:
In article
writes:
On Feb 18, 11:57 am, Jack Stein wrote:

Honestly, those slides really looked out of place on such nice, creative
work. The first two appear to have some creative and unusual slides, so
I can't help wondering why the metalware on the last one?

Well everyone feels strongly about the slides I have had feedback

I'll take the risk of disagreeing with everyone. It may be my
beginner perspective, so I don't have any baggage attached to the
drawer slide issue. Whatever the reason, my first reaction to the
drawer slides was that the combination of beautiful wood and shiney
industrial parts was kind of cool.

It might look better if you could get brass, or at least brass
plated, slides. I always think brass looks better with wood.
But, hey, it's your stuff and you have to satisfy yourself first.

Bill Ranck
Blacksburg, Va.

wrote:

It might look better if you could get brass, or at least brass
plated, slides. I always think brass looks better with wood.

Wow - I've never seen brass slides (but I haven't looked either) but
that's the best suggestion I've seen!

Brass would work, but even just a couple of microinches of gold (like
1/1000 of an ounce, worth about US$1.00) would dress up a steel slide
enough to make it worthy of the box.

(tuppence)

--
Morris Dovey
DeSoto Solar
DeSoto, Iowa USA
http://www.iedu.com/DeSoto/

On Feb 19, 11:47 am, wrote:
Lee Michaels wrote:
wrote

Well everyone feels strongly about the slides I have had feedback
from customers that they don't like short drawers that fall out when
you try to get to the back of them. As I said elsewhere, the main

OK, I am moving rapidly into an area I know nothing about. But I have seen
some kind of double dovetail slides out of wood. This would essentially be
a full extension slide. No idea how to make them (obviously a jig of some
kind) or how durable they would be. You obviously don't want to produce
something that would break easily.

I think I saw some full extension slides made from wood in a Fine Woodworking
a few (maybe 10, maybe less) years back. But, those were on a full size
chest-of-drawers and were kind of big as I remember. Might be hard to do
on a jewelry box, except for that guy who does the minatures of course . . .

I've googled previously on the subject, but haven't experimented with
it. My concern is there's got to be some free sliding middle part to
accomplish it, and at this scale that could easily warp. I don't have
a lot of confidence it's going to keep working well over time, but
that's just my gut feeling.

-Kevin

On Feb 20, 11:43 am, (Drew Lawson) wrote:
In article
writes:

On Feb 18, 11:57 am, Jack Stein wrote:
Honestly, those slides really looked out of place on such nice, creative
work. The first two appear to have some creative and unusual slides, so
I can't help wondering why the metalware on the last one?

Well everyone feels strongly about the slides I have had feedback

I'll take the risk of disagreeing with everyone. It may be my
beginner perspective, so I don't have any baggage attached to the
drawer slide issue. Whatever the reason, my first reaction to the
drawer slides was that the combination of beautiful wood and shiney
industrial parts was kind of cool.

Maybe I'd react differently to the box, but that was my reaction
to the pictures. Doesn't matter much. I can't afford your stuff,
so I'm not the customer you need to please.

Thanks for that! I think it would look pretty out of place on say a
more rustic looking piece with a big natural edge top or something,
but I don't think it looks bad in and of itself.

A lot of it is about perception. I don't _need_ to dovetail the
drawers, but that is perceived to be a standard of quality. It's
actually pretty darn easy to dado in wood slides and they make
everything line up perfectly without any fiddling. I had to muck
around adjusting the steel slides to get everything aligned to the
degree needed here for quite a while, and I had to modify the plastic
bumpers at the back that hold the drawer in the closed position
because they required too much force as is. So it's actually a lot
more work to do it, but the perception may be the reverse, so I need
to make sure if I do use them that I try to explain that.

-Kevin

On Feb 20, 2:40 pm, Morris Dovey wrote:
wrote:
It might look better if you could get brass, or at least brass
plated, slides. I always think brass looks better with wood.

Wow - I've never seen brass slides (but I haven't looked either) but
that's the best suggestion I've seen!

Brass would work, but even just a couple of microinches of gold (like
1/1000 of an ounce, worth about US$1.00) would dress up a steel slide
enough to make it worthy of the box.

Believe it or not I was just googling brass full extension slides this
afternoon, but I didn't come up with anything. Anything is possible
for the right amount of $$$ but for the tiny volume I do if it works
out to $100/pr it aint worth it.

For the amount of weight involved it ought to be possible to make an
undermount slide that isn't huge either.


-Kevin

wrote:
On Feb 20, 2:40 pm, Morris Dovey wrote:
wrote:
It might look better if you could get brass, or at least brass
plated, slides. I always think brass looks better with wood.

Wow - I've never seen brass slides (but I haven't looked either) but
that's the best suggestion I've seen!

Believe it or not I was just googling brass full extension slides this
afternoon, but I didn't come up with anything. Anything is possible
for the right amount of $$$ but for the tiny volume I do if it works
out to $100/pr it aint worth it.

Yeah, I don't know if anyone makes brass full extension slides, I was
just saying that I prefer brass hardware with wood if it's available.
You have to work with what you can get. Like you say, money-no-object
is not a real game plan for staying in business.

For the amount of weight involved it ought to be possible to make an
undermount slide that isn't huge either.

For what it's worth, I don't think the steel slides looked all
that bad. Brass would look better, and black would too, but
you'd probably have a harder time finding slides in black than
in brass.

Bill Ranck
Blacksburg, Va.

"Morris Dovey" wrote in message
Wow - I've never seen brass slides (but I haven't looked either) but
that's the best suggestion I've seen!

Probably not too much market for brass slides (even if they do exist)
because of the lack of strength factor. But, for the OP's creations,
something as simple as brass type angle iron and a simple slot cut in the
wood to let it slide might look half decent.

On Feb 20, 4:25 pm, wrote:
wrote:
On Feb 20, 2:40 pm, Morris Dovey wrote:
wrote:
It might look better if you could get brass, or at least brass
plated, slides. I always think brass looks better with wood.

Wow - I've never seen brass slides (but I haven't looked either) but
that's the best suggestion I've seen!
Believe it or not I was just googling brass full extension slides this
afternoon, but I didn't come up with anything. Anything is possible
for the right amount of $$$ but for the tiny volume I do if it works
out to $100/pr it aint worth it.

Yeah, I don't know if anyone makes brass full extension slides, I was
just saying that I prefer brass hardware with wood if it's available.
You have to work with what you can get. Like you say, money-no-object
is not a real game plan for staying in business.

For the amount of weight involved it ought to be possible to make an
undermount slide that isn't huge either.

For what it's worth, I don't think the steel slides looked all
that bad. Brass would look better, and black would too, but
you'd probably have a harder time finding slides in black than
in brass.

I can get black and white epoxy coated, but not in the smaller 75 lb
rated slides. The one time I tried epoxy coated slides the epoxy
started to wear off in the bearing track before I even got the project
fully assembled, and the epoxy that wore off got gummed up into the
bearings which made them seize, which made the slides not function
smoothly and only made the wear problem worse. I don't know if it was
a bad batch or what, I sent them back and replaced with the regular
zinc.

-Kevin

On Feb 16, 10:37*pm, wrote:
My three latest jewelry boxes:
Nice work.
Which one holds the family jewels?

On Feb 16, 10:37 pm, wrote:
My three latest jewelry boxes:

http://www.krtwood.com/recent.html

First one was a real challenge. Second one is pretty simple but my
favorite of the three. It's just 3 layers of 1/8" baltic birch bent
over a board at the center and clamped down, no complicated bending
jig required. And the third one also pretty simple, and the most
functional of the group. I really like using the full extension
slides for access to the whole drawer. This was a bit interesting
because the inside of the box is at about a 4 degree angle, the guides
are at that angle as well. Made fitting the drawers a little
interesting.

-Kevin


v nice - one day I'll be that good! (maybe)