I just bought a used but in beautiful shape old craftsman radial arm saw
and here's what I've learned so far,
It's heavy, I won't ever be moving it alone again.
It starts with a key.
It purrs like a kitten.

Now I just need to learn everything else about it, particularly in regards
to keeping all the parts I was born with attached. Anyone know of any good
books available that cover these saws or have any personal advice they want
to share?

I believe the saw is from around 1959, it came with some accessories, most
original and new in the box. If anyone's intersted I can post some pictures
in abpw.

Thanks for taking the time to read this,
Adam

In article ,
Adam wrote:

Now I just need to learn everything else about it, particularly in regards
to keeping all the parts I was born with attached.

RAS's are a nasty piece of gear. A blade with sharp teeth at 3500 RPM is
not only dangerous as is..but now we're hanging that on a little
carriage?!?!?!
It's no secret that I thoroughly dislike the beasts.

Be careful, Adam.... concentrate, focus and you'll be fine.

Robatoy wrote:
RAS's are a nasty piece of gear. A blade with sharp teeth at 3500 RPM is
not only dangerous as is..but now we're hanging that on a little
carriage?!?!?!
It's no secret that I thoroughly dislike the beasts.


I don't understand what the big deal is with RAS. My first big tool was a RAS
(which in hindsight was a mistake). The only operation I didn't think was safe
was ripping. Everything else was fine with normal care being taken.



--
Mortimer Schnerd, RN

VE

"Mortimer Schnerd, RN" wrote in
:

I don't understand what the big deal is with RAS. My first big tool
was a RAS (which in hindsight was a mistake).

snip

Since an RAS is in the list of possible first fixed saws I've been
thinking about, could you please elaborate on this? Thanks.

Kurt

The best RAS you can buy is a "used" DeWalt here in the US or a new RAS from
"Original Saw Company" There are no other RAS's worth buying IMHO.

Join us to find out why: Radial Arm Saw Forum:
http://forums.delphiforums.com/woodbutcher/start


--

Rumpty

Radial Arm Saw Forum: http://forums.delphiforums.com/woodbutcher/start

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -


"Kurt" wrote in message
...
"Mortimer Schnerd, RN" wrote in
:

I don't understand what the big deal is with RAS. My first big tool
was a RAS (which in hindsight was a mistake).

snip

Since an RAS is in the list of possible first fixed saws I've been
thinking about, could you please elaborate on this? Thanks.

Kurt

In article ,
"Rumpty" wrote:

The best RAS you can buy is a "used" DeWalt here in the US or a new RAS from
"Original Saw Company" There are no other RAS's worth buying IMHO.

IF, I were to re-invest in a RAS..and I mean *IF*.. I'd be wanting an
Original Saw Company 12" No doubt about it. Wonderfully built.

In article , Robatoy wrote:
In article ,
Adam wrote:

Now I just need to learn everything else about it, particularly in regards
to keeping all the parts I was born with attached.

RAS's are a nasty piece of gear. A blade with sharp teeth at 3500 RPM is
not only dangerous as is..but now we're hanging that on a little
carriage?!?!?!

I'm always mystified at the prejudice displayed toward RASs by those who have
never owned and rarely used one.

Radial arm saws are WAAAAAY safer than table saws. When operating the RAS, one
hand is *always* on the handle of the saw and it is therefore impossible to
amputate that hand or any of its digits - and to keep the other hand safe, all
you have to do it put it someplace that isn't in the path of the blade, and
keep it there.

Kickback is a rare event, and if it occurs, the workpiece is thrown *away*
from the operator, not *toward* him as with a TS.

Crosscutting long boards on a table saw is insane by comparison with doing the
same on a radial arm saw.

Ripping looks scary... but think about it - there's less blade exposed during
rip operations on a RAS than on a TS (assuming you haven't done something
stupid like removing the guard).

I know I'm coming perilously close to violating the Usenet Prime Directive by
attempting to inject a dose of reality into a discussion, but, please, let's
at least attempt to be a little bit objective here.


--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)

Nobody ever left footprints in the sands of time by sitting on his butt.
And who wants to leave buttprints in the sands of time?

I agree with you.

"Doug Miller" wrote in message
. ..

Radial arm saws are WAAAAAY safer than table saws. When operating the RAS,
one
hand is *always* on the handle of the saw and it is therefore impossible
to
amputate that hand or any of its digits - and to keep the other hand safe,
all
you have to do it put it someplace that isn't in the path of the blade,
and
keep it there.

Kickback is a rare event, and if it occurs, the workpiece is thrown *away*
from the operator, not *toward* him as with a TS.

Crosscutting long boards on a table saw is insane by comparison with doing
the
same on a radial arm saw.

Ripping looks scary... but think about it - there's less blade exposed
during
rip operations on a RAS than on a TS (assuming you haven't done something
stupid like removing the guard).

I know I'm coming perilously close to violating the Usenet Prime Directive
by
attempting to inject a dose of reality into a discussion, but, please,
let's
at least attempt to be a little bit objective here.


--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)

Nobody ever left footprints in the sands of time by sitting on his butt.
And who wants to leave buttprints in the sands of time?

So crosscut very long boards on a CMS. Using the right tool for the job
is part of "safety first". If I can maintain control of a board on my
TS sled, I'll cross cut on the TS for critical cuts. I don't get
perfectly straight cuts on my CMS, because it isn't a slider. if I had
a slider, the movement of the blade would insure a straight cut. Plus
the quality of cut is better on my TS w/ WWII or the double sided
melamine blade.

I spoke with a neighbor about his dust-gathering RAS. He confirmed for
me that it won't stay adjusted. One of the bugaboos that afflict all
but the very best models according to many reports. Since I don't (and
won't) own one, I have no personal experience with one. I'd like to
keep it that way.

Did Rumpty pay you for the RAS plug? (VBG)


Dave

Doug Miller wrote:


Crosscutting long boards on a table saw is insane by comparison with doing the
same on a radial arm saw.

In article ,
(Doug Miller) wrote:


I know I'm coming perilously close to violating the Usenet Prime Directive by
attempting to inject a dose of reality into a discussion, but, please, let's
at least attempt to be a little bit objective here.

I wasn't trying to get into a RAS vs TS safety discussion, Doug.
Both can be very dangerous. To get into a ****ing contest about which
one is more dangerous, is futile.

My message to the OP was:
and I quote:
"Be careful, Adam.... concentrate, focus and you'll be fine."

*I* don't like RAS's...and used plenty of them for many years.

Robatoy wrote in
:

In article ,
(Doug Miller) wrote:


I know I'm coming perilously close to violating the Usenet Prime
Directive by attempting to inject a dose of reality into a
discussion, but, please, let's at least attempt to be a little bit
objective here.

I wasn't trying to get into a RAS vs TS safety discussion, Doug.
Both can be very dangerous. To get into a ****ing contest about which
one is more dangerous, is futile.

My message to the OP was:
and I quote:
"Be careful, Adam.... concentrate, focus and you'll be fine."

*I* don't like RAS's...and used plenty of them for many years.



Thanks for the advice & opinions everyone (the book will be a definite
purchase Darrell).

The part about the RAS that makes me nervous is that it's just a
different operation than I'm used to - with a circular saw I'm moving
the blade away from me, with a table saw I'm moving the workpiece over a
stationary blade while the RAS has a blade moving towards me. I guess
everyone has certain operations they're more comfortable with on various
equipment.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not starting out prejudiced against the RAS (I
wouldn't have bought it if that was the case) I just don't have any
experience with them and there are alot of folks in this group with an
impressive amount of experience (& opinions lol).

Thanks again everyone for taking the time to reply,
Adam

In article , Robatoy wrote:
In article ,
(Doug Miller) wrote:


I know I'm coming perilously close to violating the Usenet Prime Directive by
attempting to inject a dose of reality into a discussion, but, please, let's
at least attempt to be a little bit objective here.

I wasn't trying to get into a RAS vs TS safety discussion, Doug.
Both can be very dangerous. To get into a ****ing contest about which
one is more dangerous, is futile.

My message to the OP was:
and I quote:
"Be careful, Adam.... concentrate, focus and you'll be fine."

Not really. Your *entire* message to the OP was, and I quote:

"RAS's are a nasty piece of gear. A blade with sharp teeth at 3500 RPM is
not only dangerous as is..but now we're hanging that on a little
carriage?!?!?!
It's no secret that I thoroughly dislike the beasts.
Be careful, Adam.... concentrate, focus and you'll be fine."

Let's keep things in perspective. With even minimal attention to what
you're doing, it's almost impossible to hurt yourself with a RAS. It's *far*
safer than a TS for most operations.

So how does it qualify as "a nasty piece of gear"?

--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)

Nobody ever left footprints in the sands of time by sitting on his butt.
And who wants to leave buttprints in the sands of time?

In article ,
(Doug Miller) wrote:

So how does it qualify as "a nasty piece of gear"?

I have never heard of a table saw lurching up somebody's arm before.
I have never head of an arm being cut-off above the wrist on a table saw.

Stupid careless people will always be stupid careless people.
In their hands, a fork is dangerous.

A table saw has a limited amount of blade exposed unlike a RAS

Don't even talk to me about work getting pinched between the table and
the blade.

The guys who crosses-over a left hand to the right of the blade to hold
a small piece and run the blade with their right hand towards their arm.

I have seen these moves in real life.

I have stood there, aghast at the stupidity.....going WTF???

BUT.. in a perfect world, where one safety-conscience operator who is
not careless and not stupid extolls the virtues of a RAS because that
has been HIS experience... that in itself, does not make my concerns
invalid.

In the hands of a stupid, careless moron, the RAS is an extremely
dangerous piece of ****. Period. Much more so than a TS.

Exactly the same argument as 1100cc crotch rockets being sold to 16-year
old kids.... The brakes are excellent, the horn works.... but don't try
to tell me that it is safe. Not when the safety aspect rests entirely on
the shoulders of the operator like in the case of a RAS.

I'm done ****ing now.

On Tue, 14 Jun 2005 03:03:28 GMT, (Doug Miller)
wrote:
RAS's are a nasty piece of gear. A blade with sharp teeth at 3500 RPM is
not only dangerous as is..but now we're hanging that on a little
carriage?!?!?!

I'm always mystified at the prejudice displayed toward RASs by those who have
never owned and rarely used one.

Radial arm saws are WAAAAAY safer than table saws.

Aside from the OP possibly being a troll ...otherwise he should take
up knitting ... How do you compare when ripping? I watched a
neighbour trying to manipulate with one arm on either side of the
blade. I *gave* him a table saw. Now he's making money. The RAS has
its uses which improve on the TS, but the TS is my choice for ripping,
and a few other odds and sods. Safety is not so much the tool as the
idiot using it [been there in spades.]

Guess who wrote:

Aside from the OP possibly being a troll ...otherwise he should take
up knitting ... How do you compare when ripping? I watched a
neighbour trying to manipulate with one arm on either side of the
blade.

I grant you that it is easier/better to rip on a table saw - should be,
that's what it is meant to do - put ripping on a RAS isn't all that hard
and no more dangerous than on a table saw...one keeps one's hands and
body where they should be (out of the way of danger) in both cases.

--
dadiOH
____________________________

dadiOH's dandies v3.06...
....a help file of info about MP3s, recording from
LP/cassette and tips & tricks on this and that.
Get it at http://mysite.verizon.net/xico

In article , Guess who wrote:
On Tue, 14 Jun 2005 03:03:28 GMT, (Doug Miller)
wrote:
RAS's are a nasty piece of gear. A blade with sharp teeth at 3500 RPM is
not only dangerous as is..but now we're hanging that on a little
carriage?!?!?!

I'm always mystified at the prejudice displayed toward RASs by those who have
never owned and rarely used one.

Radial arm saws are WAAAAAY safer than table saws.

Aside from the OP possibly being a troll ...otherwise he should take
up knitting ... How do you compare when ripping? I watched a
neighbour trying to manipulate with one arm on either side of the
blade. I *gave* him a table saw. Now he's making money. The RAS has
its uses which improve on the TS, but the TS is my choice for ripping,
and a few other odds and sods. Safety is not so much the tool as the
idiot using it [been there in spades.]

TS is my choice when ripping, too, but that's more a matter of convenience
than one of safety IMO. It's just easier to reach. And of course a TS offers a
wider rip capacity.

As far as safety is concerned, I think they're comparable.

--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)

Nobody ever left footprints in the sands of time by sitting on his butt.
And who wants to leave buttprints in the sands of time?

On Tue, 14 Jun 2005 03:03:28 GMT, (Doug Miller)
wrote:

I'm always mystified at the prejudice displayed toward RASs by those who have
never owned and rarely used one.

Well, I've owned three of them, used them a lot in the past, and I
think they suck.

Radial arm saws are WAAAAAY safer than table saws.

An interesting claim but one not carefully supported by data.

When operating the RAS, one
hand is *always* on the handle of the saw and it is therefore impossible to
amputate that hand or any of its digits

Are you suggesting that most table saw accidents result in double
amputation?

- and to keep the other hand safe, all
you have to do it put it someplace that isn't in the path of the blade, and
keep it there.

Well, Golly Gee, isn't that the whole game with any tool?

Kickback is a rare event, and if it occurs, the workpiece is thrown *away*
from the operator, not *toward* him as with a TS.

It is not the workpiece that must be feared but the whirling blade
that self feeds towards the operator, perhaps not by intent, but
surely by design.

Crosscutting long boards on a table saw is insane by comparison with doing the
same on a radial arm saw.

Are you not available to the joy and safety of cutting with a sled and
outfeed table?

Ripping looks scary... but think about it - there's less blade exposed during
rip operations on a RAS than on a TS (assuming you haven't done something
stupid like removing the guard).

In the act of ripping with a table saw the work is directed down and
towards the table, whereas the work is naturally thrown up when using
a radial arm saw.

In what way do you think that having the work directed away from the
table is more safe than having it inherently directed towards it?


I know I'm coming perilously close to violating the Usenet Prime Directive by
attempting to inject a dose of reality into a discussion

Not so far.

, but, please, let's
at least attempt to be a little bit objective here.


I agree totally with Robatoy on this and I will be glad to tell you,
in the spirit of objectivity, that you will never see one of these
widowmaker pieces of **** in a professional shop, excepting the
instances where it is dedicated to crosscutting, usually close to the
lumber rack, so that it can buck things up into rough lengths. And
that is only the case because they already owned the pig and did not
want to sell it for scrap to have a down payment on a SCMS.

Radial Arm Saws are the Swiss Army Knives of the amateur wooddorking
world and suffer from the same affliction as their referent; they
don't do anything well but are often asked to do many things poorly.

If radial arm saws had a corkscrew, I might consider putting one back
in my shop.

I long ago traded a RAS, allegedly capable of cutting 25" in crosscut,
for a 12" SCMS. The reason was that what was alleged did not prove
true, to a usable accurate degree, under daily use, and that work went
back to the TS.


A careful thinking about the geometry and stresses under load of a
contraption such as the RAS would inevitably lead a thoughtful and
prudent person to give theirs away to their dearest enemy.






Tom Watson - WoodDorker
tjwatson1ATcomcastDOTnet (email)
http://home.comcast.net/~tjwatson1/ (website)

LOL!! I can't WAIT to see Rumpty's response. The gloves are off! You
go, Tom.

Dave

Tom Watson wrote:

On Tue, 14 Jun 2005 03:03:28 GMT, (Doug Miller)
wrote:


I'm always mystified at the prejudice displayed toward RASs by those who have
never owned and rarely used one.


Well, I've owned three of them, used them a lot in the past, and I
think they suck.

Radial arm saws are WAAAAAY safer than table saws.


An interesting claim but one not carefully supported by data.


When operating the RAS, one
hand is *always* on the handle of the saw and it is therefore impossible to
amputate that hand or any of its digits


Are you suggesting that most table saw accidents result in double
amputation?


- and to keep the other hand safe, all
you have to do it put it someplace that isn't in the path of the blade, and
keep it there.


Well, Golly Gee, isn't that the whole game with any tool?

Kickback is a rare event, and if it occurs, the workpiece is thrown *away*

from the operator, not *toward* him as with a TS.

It is not the workpiece that must be feared but the whirling blade
that self feeds towards the operator, perhaps not by intent, but
surely by design.

Crosscutting long boards on a table saw is insane by comparison with doing the
same on a radial arm saw.


Are you not available to the joy and safety of cutting with a sled and
outfeed table?

Ripping looks scary... but think about it - there's less blade exposed during
rip operations on a RAS than on a TS (assuming you haven't done something
stupid like removing the guard).


In the act of ripping with a table saw the work is directed down and
towards the table, whereas the work is naturally thrown up when using
a radial arm saw.

In what way do you think that having the work directed away from the
table is more safe than having it inherently directed towards it?


I know I'm coming perilously close to violating the Usenet Prime Directive by
attempting to inject a dose of reality into a discussion


Not so far.


, but, please, let's
at least attempt to be a little bit objective here.



I agree totally with Robatoy on this and I will be glad to tell you,
in the spirit of objectivity, that you will never see one of these
widowmaker pieces of **** in a professional shop, excepting the
instances where it is dedicated to crosscutting, usually close to the
lumber rack, so that it can buck things up into rough lengths. And
that is only the case because they already owned the pig and did not
want to sell it for scrap to have a down payment on a SCMS.

Radial Arm Saws are the Swiss Army Knives of the amateur wooddorking
world and suffer from the same affliction as their referent; they
don't do anything well but are often asked to do many things poorly.

If radial arm saws had a corkscrew, I might consider putting one back
in my shop.

I long ago traded a RAS, allegedly capable of cutting 25" in crosscut,
for a 12" SCMS. The reason was that what was alleged did not prove
true, to a usable accurate degree, under daily use, and that work went
back to the TS.


A careful thinking about the geometry and stresses under load of a
contraption such as the RAS would inevitably lead a thoughtful and
prudent person to give theirs away to their dearest enemy.






Tom Watson - WoodDorker
tjwatson1ATcomcastDOTnet (email)
http://home.comcast.net/~tjwatson1/ (website)

"Tom Watson" wrote in message =
news | On Tue, 14 Jun 2005 03:03:28 GMT, (Doug Miller)
| wrote:
|=20
| I'm always mystified at the prejudice displayed toward RASs by those =
who have=20
| never owned and rarely used one.
|=20
| Well, I've owned three of them, used them a lot in the past, and I
| think they suck.
|
| Radial arm saws are WAAAAAY safer than table saws.
|=20
| An interesting claim but one not carefully supported by data.
|=20
| When operating the RAS, one=20
| hand is *always* on the handle of the saw and it is therefore =
impossible to=20
| amputate that hand or any of its digits
|=20
| Are you suggesting that most table saw accidents result in double
| amputation?
|=20
| - and to keep the other hand safe, all=20
| you have to do it put it someplace that isn't in the path of the =
blade, and=20
| keep it there.
|=20
| Well, Golly Gee, isn't that the whole game with any tool?
|
| Kickback is a rare event, and if it occurs, the workpiece is thrown =
*away*=20
| from the operator, not *toward* him as with a TS.
|=20
| It is not the workpiece that must be feared but the whirling blade
| that self feeds towards the operator, perhaps not by intent, but
| surely by design.
|
| Crosscutting long boards on a table saw is insane by comparison with =
doing the=20
| same on a radial arm saw.
|=20
| Are you not available to the joy and safety of cutting with a sled and
| outfeed table?
|
| Ripping looks scary... but think about it - there's less blade =
exposed during=20
| rip operations on a RAS than on a TS (assuming you haven't done =
something=20
| stupid like removing the guard).
|=20
| In the act of ripping with a table saw the work is directed down and
| towards the table, whereas the work is naturally thrown up when using
| a radial arm saw.
|=20
| In what way do you think that having the work directed away from the
| table is more safe than having it inherently directed towards it?
|=20
|
| I know I'm coming perilously close to violating the Usenet Prime =
Directive by=20
| attempting to inject a dose of reality into a discussion
|=20
| Not so far.
|=20
| , but, please, let's=20
| at least attempt to be a little bit objective here.
|=20
|=20
| I agree totally with Robatoy on this and I will be glad to tell you,
| in the spirit of objectivity, that you will never see one of these
| widowmaker pieces of **** in a professional shop, excepting the
| instances where it is dedicated to crosscutting, usually close to the
| lumber rack, so that it can buck things up into rough lengths. And
| that is only the case because they already owned the pig and did not
| want to sell it for scrap to have a down payment on a SCMS.
|=20
| Radial Arm Saws are the Swiss Army Knives of the amateur wooddorking
| world and suffer from the same affliction as their referent; they
| don't do anything well but are often asked to do many things poorly.
|=20
| If radial arm saws had a corkscrew, I might consider putting one back
| in my shop.
|=20
| I long ago traded a RAS, allegedly capable of cutting 25" in crosscut,
| for a 12" SCMS. The reason was that what was alleged did not prove
| true, to a usable accurate degree, under daily use, and that work went
| back to the TS.
|=20
|=20
| A careful thinking about the geometry and stresses under load of a
| contraption such as the RAS would inevitably lead a thoughtful and
| prudent person to give theirs away to their dearest enemy.
|=20
|=20
|=20
|=20
|=20
|=20
| Tom Watson - WoodDorker
| tjwatson1ATcomcastDOTnet (email)
| http://home.comcast.net/~tjwatson1/ (website)

Being as objective as one can, I must honestly declare that I have both =
in my shop. I started with a RAS and added a "cabinet" saw shortly =
after I discovered the thrill(?) of a RAS RIP. I later added a slider.

Anyone in the London ON area like a really good, hardly used RAS?

--=20
PDQ

In article , Tom Watson wrote:
On Tue, 14 Jun 2005 03:03:28 GMT, (Doug Miller)
wrote:

I'm always mystified at the prejudice displayed toward RASs by those who have
never owned and rarely used one.

Well, I've owned three of them, used them a lot in the past, and I
think they suck.

Radial arm saws are WAAAAAY safer than table saws.

An interesting claim but one not carefully supported by data.

When operating the RAS, one
hand is *always* on the handle of the saw and it is therefore impossible to
amputate that hand or any of its digits

Are you suggesting that most table saw accidents result in double
amputation?

Obviously not, and I can't even begin to imagine what you might have thought
you read that suggested that.

- and to keep the other hand safe, all
you have to do it put it someplace that isn't in the path of the blade, and
keep it there.

Well, Golly Gee, isn't that the whole game with any tool?

Not quite. On other tools - tablesaws and shapers, for example - the cutter is
stationary, and one's hands move past it. The risk of moving the hand into the
cutter is obviously higher than on a tool such as the RAS, in which the cutter
moves in a straight line on a fixed and unchangeable path. All you gotta do to
avoid a hand injury is to put your hand somewhere that's not in that path, and
keep it put.

Kickback is a rare event, and if it occurs, the workpiece is thrown *away*
from the operator, not *toward* him as with a TS.

It is not the workpiece that must be feared but the whirling blade
that self feeds towards the operator, perhaps not by intent, but
surely by design.

Nonsense. The blade on an RAS is no more to be feared than that on a TS. The
blade is contained in a steel guard attached to the motor housing, which rides
on rails. Yes, it can move, but where it's gonna move isn't exactly a mystery.

Crosscutting long boards on a table saw is insane by comparison with doing the
same on a radial arm saw.

Are you not available to the joy and safety of cutting with a sled and
outfeed table?

I am. I'm also well acquainted with the joy and safety of crosscutting long
and heavy boards without having to deal with their large moment of inertia.

Ripping looks scary... but think about it - there's less blade exposed during
rip operations on a RAS than on a TS (assuming you haven't done something
stupid like removing the guard).

In the act of ripping with a table saw the work is directed down and
towards the table, whereas the work is naturally thrown up when using
a radial arm saw.

Sorry, but you're wrong. In *both* cases, the teeth on the leading edge of the
blade are moving *down* and thus exerting a downward force on the wood.

In what way do you think that having the work directed away from the
table is more safe than having it inherently directed towards it?

I don't think that for a moment. But as I've pointed out, that's not what
happens on a RAS.


I know I'm coming perilously close to violating the Usenet Prime Directive by
attempting to inject a dose of reality into a discussion

Not so far.

, but, please, let's
at least attempt to be a little bit objective here.


I agree totally with Robatoy on this and I will be glad to tell you,
in the spirit of objectivity, that you will never see one of these
widowmaker pieces of **** in a professional shop, excepting the
instances where it is dedicated to crosscutting, usually close to the
lumber rack, so that it can buck things up into rough lengths. And
that is only the case because they already owned the pig and did not
want to sell it for scrap to have a down payment on a SCMS.

Radial Arm Saws are the Swiss Army Knives of the amateur wooddorking
world and suffer from the same affliction as their referent; they
don't do anything well but are often asked to do many things poorly.

If radial arm saws had a corkscrew, I might consider putting one back
in my shop.

I long ago traded a RAS, allegedly capable of cutting 25" in crosscut,
for a 12" SCMS. The reason was that what was alleged did not prove
true, to a usable accurate degree, under daily use, and that work went
back to the TS.


A careful thinking about the geometry and stresses under load of a
contraption such as the RAS would inevitably lead a thoughtful and
prudent person to give theirs away to their dearest enemy.

Careful thinking about the geometry would also lead to correct conclusions
about the direction of the force exerted on the work by the blade.

It's quite clear that your position is, like Robatoy's, the result of
prejudice, and not of logic.

--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)

Nobody ever left footprints in the sands of time by sitting on his butt.
And who wants to leave buttprints in the sands of time?

On Fri, 17 Jun 2005 01:48:49 GMT, (Doug Miller)
wrote:

In article , Tom Watson wrote:
On Tue, 14 Jun 2005 03:03:28 GMT, (Doug Miller)
wrote:

I'm always mystified at the prejudice displayed toward RASs by those who have
never owned and rarely used one.

Well, I've owned three of them, used them a lot in the past, and I
think they suck.

Strike One.


Radial arm saws are WAAAAAY safer than table saws.

An interesting claim but one not carefully supported by data.

Strike Two.


When operating the RAS, one
hand is *always* on the handle of the saw and it is therefore impossible to
amputate that hand or any of its digits

Are you suggesting that most table saw accidents result in double
amputation?

Obviously not, and I can't even begin to imagine what you might have thought
you read that suggested that.

Foul Ball.

- and to keep the other hand safe, all
you have to do it put it someplace that isn't in the path of the blade, and
keep it there.

Well, Golly Gee, isn't that the whole game with any tool?

Not quite. On other tools - tablesaws and shapers, for example - the cutter is
stationary, and one's hands move past it. The risk of moving the hand into the
cutter is obviously higher than on a tool such as the RAS, in which the cutter
moves in a straight line on a fixed and unchangeable path. All you gotta do to
avoid a hand injury is to put your hand somewhere that's not in that path, and
keep it put.

Another foul. This one tingled the hands a bit.

Kickback is a rare event, and if it occurs, the workpiece is thrown *away*
from the operator, not *toward* him as with a TS.

It is not the workpiece that must be feared but the whirling blade
that self feeds towards the operator, perhaps not by intent, but
surely by design.

Nonsense. The blade on an RAS is no more to be feared than that on a TS. The
blade is contained in a steel guard attached to the motor housing, which rides
on rails. Yes, it can move, but where it's gonna move isn't exactly a mystery.

That one rode the corner. I'll call it a ball, just to keep the AB
going.

Crosscutting long boards on a table saw is insane by comparison with doing the
same on a radial arm saw.

Are you not available to the joy and safety of cutting with a sled and
outfeed table?

I am. I'm also well acquainted with the joy and safety of crosscutting long
and heavy boards without having to deal with their large moment of inertia.

OK. Ball Two.

Ripping looks scary... but think about it - there's less blade exposed during
rip operations on a RAS than on a TS (assuming you haven't done something
stupid like removing the guard).

In the act of ripping with a table saw the work is directed down and
towards the table, whereas the work is naturally thrown up when using
a radial arm saw.

Sorry, but you're wrong. In *both* cases, the teeth on the leading edge of the
blade are moving *down* and thus exerting a downward force on the wood.

Strike Three. And that wasn't even a good junk pitch.

In what way do you think that having the work directed away from the
table is more safe than having it inherently directed towards it?

I don't think that for a moment. But as I've pointed out, that's not what
happens on a RAS.

Don't argue with the ump.


I know I'm coming perilously close to violating the Usenet Prime Directive by
attempting to inject a dose of reality into a discussion

Not so far.

, but, please, let's
at least attempt to be a little bit objective here.


I agree totally with Robatoy on this and I will be glad to tell you,
in the spirit of objectivity, that you will never see one of these
widowmaker pieces of **** in a professional shop, excepting the
instances where it is dedicated to crosscutting, usually close to the
lumber rack, so that it can buck things up into rough lengths. And
that is only the case because they already owned the pig and did not
want to sell it for scrap to have a down payment on a SCMS.

Radial Arm Saws are the Swiss Army Knives of the amateur wooddorking
world and suffer from the same affliction as their referent; they
don't do anything well but are often asked to do many things poorly.

If radial arm saws had a corkscrew, I might consider putting one back
in my shop.

I long ago traded a RAS, allegedly capable of cutting 25" in crosscut,
for a 12" SCMS. The reason was that what was alleged did not prove
true, to a usable accurate degree, under daily use, and that work went
back to the TS.


A careful thinking about the geometry and stresses under load of a
contraption such as the RAS would inevitably lead a thoughtful and
prudent person to give theirs away to their dearest enemy.

Careful thinking about the geometry would also lead to correct conclusions
about the direction of the force exerted on the work by the blade.

It's quite clear that your position is, like Robatoy's, the result of
prejudice, and not of logic.

Sigh. Off to the showers with ya.

Don't despair, it's hard to come back from an 0-2 count.


"Have faith my son, remember the great Dimaggio."

(E.H., TOMATS)



Tom Watson - WoodDorker
tjwatson1ATcomcastDOTnet (email)
http://home.comcast.net/~tjwatson1/ (website)

"Doug Miller" wrote in message
. ..
In the act of ripping with a table saw the work is directed down and
towards the table, whereas the work is naturally thrown up when using
a radial arm saw.

Sorry, but you're wrong. In *both* cases, the teeth on the leading edge of
the
blade are moving *down* and thus exerting a downward force on the wood.


HUH????????

LOL!,...Well said,...and o-so-true!

Schroeder


"Tom Watson" wrote in message
news
On Tue, 14 Jun 2005 03:03:28 GMT, (Doug Miller)

This is supposedly some good info on RAS's. I dont have one but hope to get
my dad's old saw some day.

http://www.wired-2-shop.com/joneakes...ageID=&CatID=3

Darrell

"Adam" wrote in message
. 6...
I just bought a used but in beautiful shape old craftsman radial arm saw
and here's what I've learned so far,
It's heavy, I won't ever be moving it alone again.
It starts with a key.
It purrs like a kitten.

Now I just need to learn everything else about it, particularly in regards
to keeping all the parts I was born with attached. Anyone know of any good
books available that cover these saws or have any personal advice they
want
to share?

I believe the saw is from around 1959, it came with some accessories, most
original and new in the box. If anyone's intersted I can post some
pictures
in abpw.

Thanks for taking the time to read this,
Adam

So a friend of mine offered me a RAS, as he's got two sitting in his garage
(in pieces). I've got a tablesaw, a miter saw, but I'm thinking this saw
could still be a useful addition to my arsenal. Or am I dreaming? I was
thinking it would be as useful as having a crosscut sled set up, and useful
for cutting dado's and rabbets. Probably keep it at 90 degrees almost all
the time.

Clint

"Adam" wrote in message
. 6...
I just bought a used but in beautiful shape old craftsman radial arm saw
and here's what I've learned so far,
It's heavy, I won't ever be moving it alone again.
It starts with a key.
It purrs like a kitten.

Now I just need to learn everything else about it, particularly in regards
to keeping all the parts I was born with attached. Anyone know of any good
books available that cover these saws or have any personal advice they
want
to share?

I believe the saw is from around 1959, it came with some accessories, most
original and new in the box. If anyone's intersted I can post some
pictures
in abpw.

Thanks for taking the time to read this,
Adam

I have had mine for about 6 years and I realy like it. However I don't use
it on a daily basis it comes in very handy.
"Clint" wrote in message
news:Ugsre.54264$HI.23677@edtnps84...
So a friend of mine offered me a RAS, as he's got two sitting in his
garage
(in pieces). I've got a tablesaw, a miter saw, but I'm thinking this saw
could still be a useful addition to my arsenal. Or am I dreaming? I was
thinking it would be as useful as having a crosscut sled set up, and
useful
for cutting dado's and rabbets. Probably keep it at 90 degrees almost all
the time.

Clint

"Adam" wrote in message
. 6...
I just bought a used but in beautiful shape old craftsman radial arm saw
and here's what I've learned so far,
It's heavy, I won't ever be moving it alone again.
It starts with a key.
It purrs like a kitten.

Now I just need to learn everything else about it, particularly in
regards
to keeping all the parts I was born with attached. Anyone know of any
good
books available that cover these saws or have any personal advice they
want
to share?

I believe the saw is from around 1959, it came with some accessories,
most
original and new in the box. If anyone's intersted I can post some
pictures
in abpw.

Thanks for taking the time to read this,
Adam

On Tue, 14 Jun 2005 03:36:20 GMT, "Clint"
wrote:

So a friend of mine offered me a RAS, as he's got two sitting in his garage
(in pieces). I've got a tablesaw, a miter saw, but I'm thinking this saw
could still be a useful addition to my arsenal. Or am I dreaming? I was
thinking it would be as useful as having a crosscut sled set up, and useful
for cutting dado's and rabbets. Probably keep it at 90 degrees almost all
the time.

Clint
=================
I have owned a RAS for at least 40 years and it has not moved off a 90
degree cut for the last 30 years....I also own a CMS and a couple of
Tablesaws..which are both used...

The RAS is pretty useful for dado's especially if they do not need to
be dead on accurate...89.90 degrees or so... lol...

Sorry but my old Delta Contractors saw is set up with a dead on
adjustabe sled just for doing crosscuts of less then 30 inches in
lenght... the RAS is used ONLY for rough cutting crosscuts...
anything over 30 inches that I need super accurate cross cuts is done
on my Cabinet saw also with a sled....

Actually my CMS is only used ocassionaly and also never for accurate
cuts.... I just prefer the feel of using the RAS over the CMS.... BUT
If I were a young man and just starting out I would go for the CMS to
save space...

Bob G.

Well, that's probably my biggest issue with getting the RAS; the space
required for it. But I was thinking that the RAS, CMS, and drill press all
have similar "long board" requirements, so maybe they can co-exist on a wall
somewhere.

Clint

"Bob G." wrote in message
...
On Tue, 14 Jun 2005 03:36:20 GMT, "Clint"
wrote:

So a friend of mine offered me a RAS, as he's got two sitting in his
garage
(in pieces). I've got a tablesaw, a miter saw, but I'm thinking this saw
could still be a useful addition to my arsenal. Or am I dreaming? I was
thinking it would be as useful as having a crosscut sled set up, and
useful
for cutting dado's and rabbets. Probably keep it at 90 degrees almost
all
the time.

Clint
=================
I have owned a RAS for at least 40 years and it has not moved off a 90
degree cut for the last 30 years....I also own a CMS and a couple of
Tablesaws..which are both used...

The RAS is pretty useful for dado's especially if they do not need to
be dead on accurate...89.90 degrees or so... lol...

Sorry but my old Delta Contractors saw is set up with a dead on
adjustabe sled just for doing crosscuts of less then 30 inches in
lenght... the RAS is used ONLY for rough cutting crosscuts...
anything over 30 inches that I need super accurate cross cuts is done
on my Cabinet saw also with a sled....

Actually my CMS is only used ocassionaly and also never for accurate
cuts.... I just prefer the feel of using the RAS over the CMS.... BUT
If I were a young man and just starting out I would go for the CMS to
save space...

Bob G.

On Tue, 14 Jun 2005 00:26:21 GMT, Adam
wrote:

I just bought a used but in beautiful shape old craftsman radial arm saw
and here's what I've learned so far,
It's heavy, I won't ever be moving it alone again.
It starts with a key.
It purrs like a kitten.

Now I just need to learn everything else about it, particularly in regards
to keeping all the parts I was born with attached. Anyone know of any good
books available that cover these saws or have any personal advice they want
to share?

I believe the saw is from around 1959, it came with some accessories, most
original and new in the box. If anyone's intersted I can post some pictures
in abpw.

Don't listen to chicken littles about the RAS. It's as safe as any
other powered, toothed implement in your shop. Operator stupidity,
now; that's another matter.

However, get the book by Wally Kunkel ("Mr. Sawdust") at
http://www.mrsawdust.com. It's focus is on Dewalt RAS' and their
structure, but much of the material is useful to any RAS owner.
$29.95, but worth it. You'll certainly get something out of it.

--
LRod

Master Woodbutcher and seasoned termite

Shamelessly whoring my website since 1999

http://www.woodbutcher.net

Proud participant of rec.woodworking since February, 1997

I've got a RAS and find it to be very useful, and safe. I don't rip on it
only because I'm used to using my table saw for that. It allows me to cut
miters in an easier fashion than fidling with the miter gauge on the table
saw though. It's invaluable for cutting down stock to length when the
boards are long.
As for keeping it in adjustment, well I have a craftsman from around 1984
maybe and I set it up myself then. Today, not a single adjustment has
needed to be made and it still cuts dead on. Clean it up, plug it in, and
give a go!
Cheers,
cc

"Adam" wrote in message
. 6...
I just bought a used but in beautiful shape old craftsman radial arm saw
and here's what I've learned so far,
It's heavy, I won't ever be moving it alone again.
It starts with a key.
It purrs like a kitten.

Now I just need to learn everything else about it, particularly in regards
to keeping all the parts I was born with attached. Anyone know of any good
books available that cover these saws or have any personal advice they
want
to share?

I believe the saw is from around 1959, it came with some accessories, most
original and new in the box. If anyone's intersted I can post some
pictures
in abpw.

Thanks for taking the time to read this,
Adam

I have and use a RAS. My only discomfort is that work other than cutting,
e.g., molding, rabitting etc., if the work shifts it will shift into the
cutter and get gouged. Doing the same operation on a Table Saw, if the work
shifts, you cut less than you had intended and can take a second pass.
Otherwise, I like and use RAS.

Ivan Vegvary
"Adam" wrote in message
. 6...
I just bought a used but in beautiful shape old craftsman radial arm saw
and here's what I've learned so far,
It's heavy, I won't ever be moving it alone again.
It starts with a key.
It purrs like a kitten.

Now I just need to learn everything else about it, particularly in regards
to keeping all the parts I was born with attached. Anyone know of any good
books available that cover these saws or have any personal advice they
want
to share?

I believe the saw is from around 1959, it came with some accessories, most
original and new in the box. If anyone's intersted I can post some
pictures
in abpw.

Thanks for taking the time to read this,
Adam

On Tue, 14 Jun 2005 00:26:21 GMT, Adam
wrote:

I just bought a used but in beautiful shape old craftsman radial arm saw
and here's what I've learned so far,
It's heavy, I won't ever be moving it alone again.
It starts with a key.
It purrs like a kitten.

Now I just need to learn everything else about it, particularly in regards
to keeping all the parts I was born with attached. Anyone know of any good
books available that cover these saws or have any personal advice they want
to share?

Keep your thumb outta the way, and you should be fine.

I believe the saw is from around 1959, it came with some accessories, most
original and new in the box. If anyone's intersted I can post some pictures
in abpw.

Thanks for taking the time to read this,
Adam

"Prometheus" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 14 Jun 2005 00:26:21 GMT, Adam
wrote:
Now I just need to learn everything else about it, particularly in
regards
to keeping all the parts I was born with attached. Anyone know of any
good
books available that cover these saws or have any personal advice they
want
to share?

Keep your thumb outta the way, and you should be fine.


That's the one. Too many stupid people put their hand where the blade's
going.

Mine's been with me thirty years - Montgomery Ward - and I didn't get it
new. You check the sets prior to cutting, just as you do your table saw,
and it shouldn't be a problem. Every RAS is capable of holding a setting,
the rub is how long.

If God had meant for us to rip on a RAS, he'd never have given us the
tablesaw.

Been using mine painlessly for 30+ years!
With a long table, it rips far more easily than a TS, except for very small
stuff.
I usually stop the cut when I get near the end and go around to the outfeed
side to pull the final bit through. When I can, I get a wife or kid to do
the final pull. I've done lots of 8-20 ft rips in rough 2X lumber with no
problem.
When I was building my house, the saw was far from the power source, so I
put it on 240V and fed it with 12ga Romex to prevent sag. Worked fine. If
you have serious heavy ripping to do, get a 20-24 tooth blade.
That said, I DO NOT like the molding head rig, although I have used it with
success.
Wilson
"George" wrote in message
...

"Prometheus" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 14 Jun 2005 00:26:21 GMT, Adam
wrote:
Now I just need to learn everything else about it, particularly in
regards
to keeping all the parts I was born with attached. Anyone know of any
good
books available that cover these saws or have any personal advice they
want
to share?

Keep your thumb outta the way, and you should be fine.


That's the one. Too many stupid people put their hand where the blade's
going.

Mine's been with me thirty years - Montgomery Ward - and I didn't get it
new. You check the sets prior to cutting, just as you do your table saw,
and it shouldn't be a problem. Every RAS is capable of holding a setting,
the rub is how long.

If God had meant for us to rip on a RAS, he'd never have given us the
tablesaw.

In article ,
"George" wrote:

Keep your thumb outta the way, and you should be fine.


That's the one. Too many stupid people put their hand where the blade's
going.






yup

I rest my case.

On Tue, 14 Jun 2005 00:26:21 GMT, Adam
wrote:

I just bought a used but in beautiful shape old craftsman radial arm saw
and here's what I've learned so far,
It's heavy, I won't ever be moving it alone again.
It starts with a key.
It purrs like a kitten.

Now I just need to learn everything else about it, particularly in regards
to keeping all the parts I was born with attached. Anyone know of any good
books available that cover these saws or have any personal advice they want
to share?

I believe the saw is from around 1959, it came with some accessories, most
original and new in the box. If anyone's intersted I can post some pictures
in abpw.

Thanks for taking the time to read this,
Adam
\
Do a search on DeCristiforo and Radial Arm Saw. I think his RAS book
is something like "The Magic of your Radial Arm Saw" or similar. It is
a pretty good book although like all the other RAS books I have seen
says nothing about the Craftsman model. I think his is written around
a DeWalt RAS. I like DeCristiforo's style but that may be because THE
book on my Shopsmith was written by him.

Dave Hall

Such useless dribble! Join us an learn how:

Radial Arm Saw Forum: http://forums.delphiforums.com/woodbutcher/start


--

Rumpty

Radial Arm Saw Forum: http://forums.delphiforums.com/woodbutcher/start

(psst......I know it's a repeated post)
--

Rumpty

On Tue, 14 Jun 2005 14:29:00 -0400, "Rumpty"
wrote:

Radial Arm Saw Forum: http://forums.delphiforums.com/woodbutcher/start

(psst......I know it's a repeated post)

I was hoping the second post was going to correct "dribble" to drivel.

--
LRod

Master Woodbutcher and seasoned termite

Shamelessly whoring my website since 1999

http://www.woodbutcher.net

Proud participant of rec.woodworking since February, 1997

I built my RAS into an 18 foot workbench. I can rip a 4x8 sheet with
one hand (no I didn't chop the other off!) with the help of a couple of
rollers. It is my primary saw.

Any saw is dangerous if you don't know how to use it.