Some sage advice from a member of the turning club
of which I am a member -

IF YOU'RE GOING TO SAND, USE SANDPAPER AS IF IT'S FREE.

Now think about how you use sandpaper.

Do you pay a bit more to get very uniform abrasive
particle sizes? Are you even aware of the different
grades of sandpaper, not "grits", but the degree of
uniformity of the particle sizes for a specific grit?
Doesn't take many particles of "190 grit" in your
"200 grit" paper to show.

When the piece of sandpaper you're sanding with
starts "loading up", do you chuck it and grab a
new one? Or do you try and wring every bit of
abrassive out of each piece 'til it stops cutting
and starts burnishing - or worse yet - burning?

If you've gotten to "320" and notice a ding you
missed, will you go back to 180 or even 150 to
get it out - or hope your finish will hide it?

Like all other forms of woodworking (OK so
maybe chainsaw carving is an exception), if
you're going to do a piece, start to finish,
EVERY step along the way will show in the
finished piece. If you have to sand, remeber
"Penny Wise, Pound Foolish"? Well that might
be another way of putting

IF YOU'RE GOING TO SAND, USE SANDPAPER AS IF IT'S FREE.

You'll be amazed at the finsih you can get
BEFORE you "apply a finish" - IF you take
this sage advice to heart.

Oh, and if "Abralon" doesn't mean anything to you
you might look into it. You'd be amazed how smooth
and shiny you can get a piece of wood.

charlie b

Charlie,

Hey, how do you know the quality of size consistency? Or how well a given
grit, in fact, cuts? Size might not mean the same as cutting ability.

Oh, and "Abralon" means nothing to me :-) Is it a brand? I guess I can
google it when I get a chance.

IMHO walnut tells the tale of good tool technique and sanding. Like a black
car versus white it shows everything. One catch seems to bruise the wood
deeply. And sanding sealer followed with Briwax has a fantastic feel and
sheen. Having a reversible and variable speed lathe sure helps get a great
finish if you're looking for more than OK. All the sanding isn't done in the
same direction and that seems best to show on endgrain.

Enjoy your posts, Charlie, keep up the good work.

TomNie


"charlieb" wrote in message
...
Some sage advice from a member of the turning club
of which I am a member -

IF YOU'RE GOING TO SAND, USE SANDPAPER AS IF IT'S FREE.

Now think about how you use sandpaper.

Do you pay a bit more to get very uniform abrasive
particle sizes? Are you even aware of the different
grades of sandpaper, not "grits", but the degree of
uniformity of the particle sizes for a specific grit?
Doesn't take many particles of "190 grit" in your
"200 grit" paper to show.

When the piece of sandpaper you're sanding with
starts "loading up", do you chuck it and grab a
new one? Or do you try and wring every bit of
abrassive out of each piece 'til it stops cutting
and starts burnishing - or worse yet - burning?

If you've gotten to "320" and notice a ding you
missed, will you go back to 180 or even 150 to
get it out - or hope your finish will hide it?

Like all other forms of woodworking (OK so
maybe chainsaw carving is an exception), if
you're going to do a piece, start to finish,
EVERY step along the way will show in the
finished piece. If you have to sand, remeber
"Penny Wise, Pound Foolish"? Well that might
be another way of putting

IF YOU'RE GOING TO SAND, USE SANDPAPER AS IF IT'S FREE.

You'll be amazed at the finsih you can get
BEFORE you "apply a finish" - IF you take
this sage advice to heart.

Oh, and if "Abralon" doesn't mean anything to you
you might look into it. You'd be amazed how smooth
and shiny you can get a piece of wood.

charlie b

Good one Charlie. I have to agree. Add in there that you should find a good
brand of sandpaper and stick with it. Cheap stuff is just that, cheap. Also,
every second grit, give the piece a run with 800 or so grit. It will show up
all those scratches that are still there for anything under 600. The first
two or three times you try it it is a real education.
---
God bless and safe turning
Darrell Feltmate
Truro, NS
http://aroundthewoods.com
http://roundopinions.blogspot.com

"charlieb" wrote in message
...
Some sage advice from a member of the turning club
of which I am a member -

IF YOU'RE GOING TO SAND, USE SANDPAPER AS IF IT'S FREE.

Now think about how you use sandpaper.

Do you pay a bit more to get very uniform abrasive
particle sizes? Are you even aware of the different
grades of sandpaper, not "grits", but the degree of
uniformity of the particle sizes for a specific grit?
Doesn't take many particles of "190 grit" in your
"200 grit" paper to show.

When the piece of sandpaper you're sanding with
starts "loading up", do you chuck it and grab a
new one? Or do you try and wring every bit of
abrassive out of each piece 'til it stops cutting
and starts burnishing - or worse yet - burning?

If you've gotten to "320" and notice a ding you
missed, will you go back to 180 or even 150 to
get it out - or hope your finish will hide it?

Like all other forms of woodworking (OK so
maybe chainsaw carving is an exception), if
you're going to do a piece, start to finish,
EVERY step along the way will show in the
finished piece. If you have to sand, remeber
"Penny Wise, Pound Foolish"? Well that might
be another way of putting

IF YOU'RE GOING TO SAND, USE SANDPAPER AS IF IT'S FREE.

You'll be amazed at the finsih you can get
BEFORE you "apply a finish" - IF you take
this sage advice to heart.

Oh, and if "Abralon" doesn't mean anything to you
you might look into it. You'd be amazed how smooth
and shiny you can get a piece of wood.

charlie b

The variation of that saying that I heard was "use the sandpaper like
some one else was buying it". As far as the best sanding discs that I
have found, the ones from www.VincesWoodNWonders.com. They are on a
plastic film, and have the most consistant grain of anything I have
used. They also outlast anything else that I have ever used about 2 to
1. No affiliation other than a happy customer. Also having a good
light really helps you see those marks that you don't spot until you
take it out in the sunlight to inspect the finish. One of the full
spectrum lights. As far as knowing when to throw a disc away, it has
taken a while for me to recoginze when, but when in doubt, I hit the
disc with one of the cleaning sticks, and then feel it with my
fingers. If it doesn't feel sharp, then toss it.
robo hippy

On Apr 26, 7:38 am, "Darrell Feltmate"
wrote:
Good one Charlie. I have to agree. Add in there that you should find a good
brand of sandpaper and stick with it. Cheap stuff is just that, cheap. Also,
every second grit, give the piece a run with 800 or so grit. It will show up
all those scratches that are still there for anything under 600. The first
two or three times you try it it is a real education.
---
God bless and safe turning
Darrell Feltmate
Truro, NShttp://aroundthewoods.comhttp://roundopinions.blogspot.com

"charlieb" wrote in message

...

Some sage advice from a member of the turning club
of which I am a member -

IF YOU'RE GOING TO SAND, USE SANDPAPER AS IF IT'S FREE.

Now think about how you use sandpaper.

Do you pay a bit more to get very uniform abrasive
particle sizes? Are you even aware of the different
grades of sandpaper, not "grits", but the degree of
uniformity of the particle sizes for a specific grit?
Doesn't take many particles of "190 grit" in your
"200 grit" paper to show.

When the piece of sandpaper you're sanding with
starts "loading up", do you chuck it and grab a
new one? Or do you try and wring every bit of
abrassive out of each piece 'til it stops cutting
and starts burnishing - or worse yet - burning?

If you've gotten to "320" and notice a ding you
missed, will you go back to 180 or even 150 to
get it out - or hope your finish will hide it?

Like all other forms of woodworking (OK so
maybe chainsaw carving is an exception), if
you're going to do a piece, start to finish,
EVERY step along the way will show in the
finished piece. If you have to sand, remeber
"Penny Wise, Pound Foolish"? Well that might
be another way of putting

IF YOU'RE GOING TO SAND, USE SANDPAPER AS IF IT'S FREE.

You'll be amazed at the finsih you can get
BEFORE you "apply a finish" - IF you take
this sage advice to heart.

Oh, and if "Abralon" doesn't mean anything to you
you might look into it. You'd be amazed how smooth
and shiny you can get a piece of wood.

charlie b

On 27 Apr 2007 08:44:26 -0700, robo hippy
wrote:

The variation of that saying that I heard was "use the sandpaper like
some one else was buying it". As far as the best sanding discs that I
have found, the ones from www.VincesWoodNWonders.com. They are on a
plastic film, and have the most consistant grain of anything I have
used. They also outlast anything else that I have ever used about 2 to
1. No affiliation other than a happy customer.

I've been using an ummm.... "Mini pistol grip pneumatic sander" (also
known as a right-angle die grinder to the rest of the world) for
power carving for a while now. I have been using the quick-lock
discs, but for close to $.50 each, they're quite an investment every
time I have to buy another box of them. They last long enough that
it's not putting me into the poorhouse, but they're still just a
little pricey.

The reason I mention this is because this velcro stuff is a whole lot
less expensive, and the sander he's selling appears to be a
standard-issue die grinder. Since I've already got two of them, I'm
wondering if you think they'd fit a standard 1/4" collet. Normally,
I'd assume that was the case, but the shanks look pretty thin in the
pictures.

Prometheus
I am using a variation on the 3M sanding/grinding system that sounds very
much like what you are using in the die grinder. The holders and sanding
disks and grinding pads are rated for 20,000 rpm at least, maybe more as I
recollect. I use a velcro pad system that I adapted. I am sure it would fit
the die grinder but I am not sure how well the Velcro would hold up to the
high heat of the die grinder rpm. The link for the system is
http://aroundthewoods.com/sanding.shtml
---
God bless and safe turning
Darrell Feltmate
Truro, NS
http://aroundthewoods.com
http://roundopinions.blogspot.com

"Prometheus" wrote in message
...
On 27 Apr 2007 08:44:26 -0700, robo hippy
wrote:

The variation of that saying that I heard was "use the sandpaper like
some one else was buying it". As far as the best sanding discs that I
have found, the ones from www.VincesWoodNWonders.com. They are on a
plastic film, and have the most consistant grain of anything I have
used. They also outlast anything else that I have ever used about 2 to
1. No affiliation other than a happy customer.

I've been using an ummm.... "Mini pistol grip pneumatic sander" (also
known as a right-angle die grinder to the rest of the world) for
power carving for a while now. I have been using the quick-lock
discs, but for close to $.50 each, they're quite an investment every
time I have to buy another box of them. They last long enough that
it's not putting me into the poorhouse, but they're still just a
little pricey.

The reason I mention this is because this velcro stuff is a whole lot
less expensive, and the sander he's selling appears to be a
standard-issue die grinder. Since I've already got two of them, I'm
wondering if you think they'd fit a standard 1/4" collet. Normally,
I'd assume that was the case, but the shanks look pretty thin in the
pictures.

On Sat, 28 Apr 2007 01:56:36 GMT, "Darrell Feltmate"
wrote:

Prometheus
I am using a variation on the 3M sanding/grinding system that sounds very
much like what you are using in the die grinder. The holders and sanding
disks and grinding pads are rated for 20,000 rpm at least, maybe more as I
recollect. I use a velcro pad system that I adapted. I am sure it would fit
the die grinder but I am not sure how well the Velcro would hold up to the
high heat of the die grinder rpm. The link for the system is
http://aroundthewoods.com/sanding.shtml

I would imagine that the RPMs would be similar- they're both air
turbines rated for 90 psi. I don't go all out when using it on wood,
either- usually, half speed is plenty to get the job done!

The 3M system is precisely what I am using, though I order the disks
through work in bulk. Grit assortment isn't nearly as important with
what I do, as I just use it for medium-level hogging after getting it
roughed out with a saw and drill. Final finish on my stuff is always
a chiseled surface or hand sanded. (The power carving is nice for
taking off a lot of material to reduce the risk of shearing off a bit
hunk of something you wanted to leave on, but not much beats a good
chisel for the fine work!)

I'll try out what you've got listed on your site- nice description and
instructions, btw! I've already got a couple of the holders, and I
think I've even got a little felt laying around somewhere, so it
should be easy enough to get together with a little velcro.

If I get really ambitious, I might turn some rubber on the lathe to
replace the felt as well. It's stinky, but works. I only know that
little tidbit because had a belt sander at work that had an unbalanced
tire a few weeks ago that was shaking the thing like crazy, and a
little temporary tool rest and a bit of sharpened scrap metal made
quick work of truing it. Might make for a good pad if I can find some
soft rubber, and be little easier to glue than felt.

somewhat OT --- I don't know about you, but "use it like someone else was
buying it" tells me to use it up until it's totally dead so I don't wast
what someone else was paying for - whereas if I am buying it, I can toss it
when it's starting to get dull - in fact now that I think about it, I
actually resent that expression due to the disregard for value to others
that it implies - and yes, I've heard it and it annoys me every time.

"robo hippy" wrote in message
oups.com...
The variation of that saying that I heard was "use the sandpaper like
some one else was buying it".

snip------------o



--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

Good original post and responses. I've come to love Norton's 3x Premium
paper. Seems to be graded very well compared to the Klingspor junk I used
to use and it does last a long time and resists clogging. I agree that
sandpaper is the last place a woodturner should cheap out.
Tony Manella
ndd1"at"prolog.net (remove "at")
http://home.ptd.net/~ndd1/
Lehigh Valley Woodturners

"charlieb" wrote in message
...
Some sage advice from a member of the turning club
of which I am a member -

IF YOU'RE GOING TO SAND, USE SANDPAPER AS IF IT'S FREE.

Now think about how you use sandpaper.

Do you pay a bit more to get very uniform abrasive
particle sizes? Are you even aware of the different
grades of sandpaper, not "grits", but the degree of
uniformity of the particle sizes for a specific grit?
Doesn't take many particles of "190 grit" in your
"200 grit" paper to show.

When the piece of sandpaper you're sanding with
starts "loading up", do you chuck it and grab a
new one? Or do you try and wring every bit of
abrassive out of each piece 'til it stops cutting
and starts burnishing - or worse yet - burning?

If you've gotten to "320" and notice a ding you
missed, will you go back to 180 or even 150 to
get it out - or hope your finish will hide it?

Like all other forms of woodworking (OK so
maybe chainsaw carving is an exception), if
you're going to do a piece, start to finish,
EVERY step along the way will show in the
finished piece. If you have to sand, remeber
"Penny Wise, Pound Foolish"? Well that might
be another way of putting

IF YOU'RE GOING TO SAND, USE SANDPAPER AS IF IT'S FREE.

You'll be amazed at the finsih you can get
BEFORE you "apply a finish" - IF you take
this sage advice to heart.

Oh, and if "Abralon" doesn't mean anything to you
you might look into it. You'd be amazed how smooth
and shiny you can get a piece of wood.

charlie b

I have used the Klingspoor red and white aluminum oxide, and the
Norton 3x, and the yellow, the wave,and just about everything else.
Vinces discs are 2 3/8, and 3 3/8 inch disce, and the 3 inch discs
were $10 per 50, but I think the prices went up a bit. Really, they
are better than anything I have ever used. Again, I am a happy
customer.
robo hippy

On Apr 30, 6:23 am, "TonyM" tonym.le"at"comcast.net wrote:
Good original post and responses. I've come to love Norton's 3x Premium
paper. Seems to be graded very well compared to the Klingspor junk I used
to use and it does last a long time and resists clogging. I agree that
sandpaper is the last place a woodturner should cheap out.
Tony Manella
ndd1"at"prolog.net (remove "at")http://home.ptd.net/~ndd1/
Lehigh Valley Woodturners

"charlieb" wrote in message

...

Some sage advice from a member of the turning club
of which I am a member -

IF YOU'RE GOING TO SAND, USE SANDPAPER AS IF IT'S FREE.

Now think about how you use sandpaper.

Do you pay a bit more to get very uniform abrasive
particle sizes? Are you even aware of the different
grades of sandpaper, not "grits", but the degree of
uniformity of the particle sizes for a specific grit?
Doesn't take many particles of "190 grit" in your
"200 grit" paper to show.

When the piece of sandpaper you're sanding with
starts "loading up", do you chuck it and grab a
new one? Or do you try and wring every bit of
abrassive out of each piece 'til it stops cutting
and starts burnishing - or worse yet - burning?

If you've gotten to "320" and notice a ding you
missed, will you go back to 180 or even 150 to
get it out - or hope your finish will hide it?

Like all other forms of woodworking (OK so
maybe chainsaw carving is an exception), if
you're going to do a piece, start to finish,
EVERY step along the way will show in the
finished piece. If you have to sand, remeber
"Penny Wise, Pound Foolish"? Well that might
be another way of putting

IF YOU'RE GOING TO SAND, USE SANDPAPER AS IF IT'S FREE.

You'll be amazed at the finsih you can get
BEFORE you "apply a finish" - IF you take
this sage advice to heart.

Oh, and if "Abralon" doesn't mean anything to you
you might look into it. You'd be amazed how smooth
and shiny you can get a piece of wood.

charlie b

I have had great service and results from Royce Sales in Ontario. They have
a full range of sanding products and stand behind their products. No
affiliation et. etc. but they do have some of my cash :-)
http://store.sandpaper.ca/catalogue/default.php

---
God bless and safe turning
Darrell Feltmate
Truro, NS
http://aroundthewoods.com
http://roundopinions.blogspot.com

"robo hippy" wrote in message
ups.com...
I have used the Klingspoor red and white aluminum oxide, and the
Norton 3x, and the yellow, the wave,and just about everything else.
Vinces discs are 2 3/8, and 3 3/8 inch disce, and the 3 inch discs
were $10 per 50, but I think the prices went up a bit. Really, they
are better than anything I have ever used. Again, I am a happy
customer.
robo hippy

On Apr 30, 6:23 am, "TonyM" tonym.le"at"comcast.net wrote:
Good original post and responses. I've come to love Norton's 3x Premium
paper. Seems to be graded very well compared to the Klingspor junk I
used
to use and it does last a long time and resists clogging. I agree that
sandpaper is the last place a woodturner should cheap out.
Tony Manella
ndd1"at"prolog.net (remove "at")http://home.ptd.net/~ndd1/
Lehigh Valley Woodturners

"charlieb" wrote in message

...

Some sage advice from a member of the turning club
of which I am a member -

IF YOU'RE GOING TO SAND, USE SANDPAPER AS IF IT'S FREE.

Now think about how you use sandpaper.

Do you pay a bit more to get very uniform abrasive
particle sizes? Are you even aware of the different
grades of sandpaper, not "grits", but the degree of
uniformity of the particle sizes for a specific grit?
Doesn't take many particles of "190 grit" in your
"200 grit" paper to show.

When the piece of sandpaper you're sanding with
starts "loading up", do you chuck it and grab a
new one? Or do you try and wring every bit of
abrassive out of each piece 'til it stops cutting
and starts burnishing - or worse yet - burning?

If you've gotten to "320" and notice a ding you
missed, will you go back to 180 or even 150 to
get it out - or hope your finish will hide it?

Like all other forms of woodworking (OK so
maybe chainsaw carving is an exception), if
you're going to do a piece, start to finish,
EVERY step along the way will show in the
finished piece. If you have to sand, remeber
"Penny Wise, Pound Foolish"? Well that might
be another way of putting

IF YOU'RE GOING TO SAND, USE SANDPAPER AS IF IT'S FREE.

You'll be amazed at the finsih you can get
BEFORE you "apply a finish" - IF you take
this sage advice to heart.

Oh, and if "Abralon" doesn't mean anything to you
you might look into it. You'd be amazed how smooth
and shiny you can get a piece of wood.

charlie b

Thanks Darrell, I'll take a look at their site.
Tony Manella

"Darrell Feltmate" wrote in message
news:IpoZh.14490$JF6.12100@edtnps90...
I have had great service and results from Royce Sales in Ontario. They have
a full range of sanding products and stand behind their products. No
affiliation et. etc. but they do have some of my cash :-)
http://store.sandpaper.ca/catalogue/default.php

---
God bless and safe turning
Darrell Feltmate
Truro, NS
http://aroundthewoods.com
http://roundopinions.blogspot.com

"robo hippy" wrote in message
ups.com...
I have used the Klingspoor red and white aluminum oxide, and the
Norton 3x, and the yellow, the wave,and just about everything else.
Vinces discs are 2 3/8, and 3 3/8 inch disce, and the 3 inch discs
were $10 per 50, but I think the prices went up a bit. Really, they
are better than anything I have ever used. Again, I am a happy
customer.
robo hippy

On Apr 30, 6:23 am, "TonyM" tonym.le"at"comcast.net wrote:
Good original post and responses. I've come to love Norton's 3x Premium
paper. Seems to be graded very well compared to the Klingspor junk I
used
to use and it does last a long time and resists clogging. I agree that
sandpaper is the last place a woodturner should cheap out.
Tony Manella
ndd1"at"prolog.net (remove "at")http://home.ptd.net/~ndd1/
Lehigh Valley Woodturners

"charlieb" wrote in message

...

Some sage advice from a member of the turning club
of which I am a member -

IF YOU'RE GOING TO SAND, USE SANDPAPER AS IF IT'S FREE.

Now think about how you use sandpaper.

Do you pay a bit more to get very uniform abrasive
particle sizes? Are you even aware of the different
grades of sandpaper, not "grits", but the degree of
uniformity of the particle sizes for a specific grit?
Doesn't take many particles of "190 grit" in your
"200 grit" paper to show.

When the piece of sandpaper you're sanding with
starts "loading up", do you chuck it and grab a
new one? Or do you try and wring every bit of
abrassive out of each piece 'til it stops cutting
and starts burnishing - or worse yet - burning?

If you've gotten to "320" and notice a ding you
missed, will you go back to 180 or even 150 to
get it out - or hope your finish will hide it?

Like all other forms of woodworking (OK so
maybe chainsaw carving is an exception), if
you're going to do a piece, start to finish,
EVERY step along the way will show in the
finished piece. If you have to sand, remeber
"Penny Wise, Pound Foolish"? Well that might
be another way of putting

IF YOU'RE GOING TO SAND, USE SANDPAPER AS IF IT'S FREE.

You'll be amazed at the finsih you can get
BEFORE you "apply a finish" - IF you take
this sage advice to heart.

Oh, and if "Abralon" doesn't mean anything to you
you might look into it. You'd be amazed how smooth
and shiny you can get a piece of wood.

charlie b