I've just had a new back door fitted, and the glass panels at the top of
the door have been padded out with about a 10mm thickness of filler as
the door seems designed to take thicker glass than what has been
supplied with it (which is supposedly 4mm, but it looks much thinner to
me). Consequently, the beading has been bent out from the glass so that
it meets with the moulded door frame properly.

A picture speaks a thousand words:
http://freestuff.grok.co.uk/door/DSCF0009.JPG
http://freestuff.grok.co.uk/door/DSCF0002.JPG
http://freestuff.grok.co.uk/door/DSCF0003.JPG

I think it looks shoddy and is potentially insecure. When I phoned to
complain I got "they all do that, sir" type noises and they told me to
push the beading in to force it against the glass (impossible without
first removing it and cutting it down, but there you go).

I am being a pedantic git or am I right to be thoroughly disappointed
and what I see as shoddy workmanship. Are the restrictions on the
thickness of glass that should be installed in external doors? I don't
buy doors very often, and am no expert so opinions would be most
appreciated.

Why is it that 9 times out of 10, "getting the professionals in" always
results in disappointment.
--
Chris Cowley

Chris Cowley wrote:

I've just had a new back door fitted, and the glass panels at the top of
the door have been padded out with about a 10mm thickness of filler as
the door seems designed to take thicker glass than what has been
supplied with it (which is supposedly 4mm, but it looks much thinner to
me). Consequently, the beading has been bent out from the glass so that
it meets with the moulded door frame properly.

A picture speaks a thousand words:
http://freestuff.grok.co.uk/door/DSCF0009.JPG
http://freestuff.grok.co.uk/door/DSCF0002.JPG
http://freestuff.grok.co.uk/door/DSCF0003.JPG

I think it looks shoddy and is potentially insecure. When I phoned to
complain I got "they all do that, sir" type noises and they told me to
push the beading in to force it against the glass (impossible without
first removing it and cutting it down, but there you go).

I am being a pedantic git or am I right to be thoroughly disappointed
and what I see as shoddy workmanship. Are the restrictions on the
thickness of glass that should be installed in external doors? I don't
buy doors very often, and am no expert so opinions would be most
appreciated.

Why is it that 9 times out of 10, "getting the professionals in" always
results in disappointment.

Looks extremely shoddy to me. Maybe the door was designed to take
double-glazed glass? It looks like a complete bodge from the photos.

--
If at first you don't succeed, give up, no use being a damn fool.

Chris Cowley wrote:

A picture speaks a thousand words:
http://freestuff.grok.co.uk/door/DSCF0009.JPG
http://freestuff.grok.co.uk/door/DSCF0002.JPG
http://freestuff.grok.co.uk/door/DSCF0003.JPG

I think it looks shoddy and is potentially insecure. When I phoned to
complain I got "they all do that, sir" type noises and they told me to
push the beading in to force it against the glass (impossible without
first removing it and cutting it down, but there you go).

It does look a bit scruffy but to be quite honest it's difficult to
tell how bad it is from those photos. Can you get a more distant but
sharper view of the door to give a better imnpression of what it looks
like as a whole?

--
Chris Green

"bigboard" wrote in message
...
Chris Cowley wrote:

I've just had a new back door fitted, and the glass panels at the top of
the door have been padded out with about a 10mm thickness of filler as
the door seems designed to take thicker glass than what has been
supplied with it (which is supposedly 4mm, but it looks much thinner to
me). Consequently, the beading has been bent out from the glass so that
it meets with the moulded door frame properly.

A picture speaks a thousand words:
http://freestuff.grok.co.uk/door/DSCF0009.JPG
http://freestuff.grok.co.uk/door/DSCF0002.JPG
http://freestuff.grok.co.uk/door/DSCF0003.JPG

I think it looks shoddy and is potentially insecure. When I phoned to
complain I got "they all do that, sir" type noises and they told me to
push the beading in to force it against the glass (impossible without
first removing it and cutting it down, but there you go).

I am being a pedantic git or am I right to be thoroughly disappointed
and what I see as shoddy workmanship. Are the restrictions on the
thickness of glass that should be installed in external doors? I don't
buy doors very often, and am no expert so opinions would be most
appreciated.

Why is it that 9 times out of 10, "getting the professionals in" always
results in disappointment.

Looks extremely shoddy to me. Maybe the door was designed to take
double-glazed glass? It looks like a complete bodge from the photos.


It does look a mess. The glass looks to be 4 mm, but the beading should at
least hold it tight in place with some putty or sealant in between. It's a
mess, and you should get it sorted.

On Thu, 16 Dec 2004 13:22:57 +0000, "Chris Cowley"
wrote:

I've just had a new back door fitted, and the glass panels at the top of
the door have been padded out with about a 10mm thickness of filler as
the door seems designed to take thicker glass than what has been
supplied with it

Sounds like it was designed for a double-glazed sealed unit. Shoddy.

BigWallop wrote:
"bigboard" wrote in message
...
Chris Cowley wrote:

I've just had a new back door fitted, and the glass panels at the
top of
the door have been padded out with about a 10mm thickness of
filler as
the door seems designed to take thicker glass than what has been
supplied with it (which is supposedly 4mm, but it looks much
thinner to
me). Consequently, the beading has been bent out from the glass
so that
it meets with the moulded door frame properly.

A picture speaks a thousand words:
http://freestuff.grok.co.uk/door/DSCF0009.JPG
http://freestuff.grok.co.uk/door/DSCF0002.JPG
http://freestuff.grok.co.uk/door/DSCF0003.JPG

I think it looks shoddy and is potentially insecure. When I
phoned to
complain I got "they all do that, sir" type noises and they told
me to
push the beading in to force it against the glass (impossible
without
first removing it and cutting it down, but there you go).

I am being a pedantic git or am I right to be thoroughly
disappointed
and what I see as shoddy workmanship. Are the restrictions on the
thickness of glass that should be installed in external doors? I
don't
buy doors very often, and am no expert so opinions would be most
appreciated.

Why is it that 9 times out of 10, "getting the professionals in"
always
results in disappointment.

Looks extremely shoddy to me. Maybe the door was designed to take
double-glazed glass? It looks like a complete bodge from the
photos.


It does look a mess. The glass looks to be 4 mm, but the beading
should at
least hold it tight in place with some putty or sealant in between.
It's a
mess, and you should get it sorted.

What was your carpenters name "bodgeit and scarper".... sure looks like
they didnt do a nice job so much puttey on the inside, the beading
should hold the glass in place with minimal putty. Loks for sure like
your door was meant to hold a double glazed unit 14mm or 16mm units are
availible.

I got my door from farringtondoors they supplied me with 16mm double
glazed glass.

"thingymagig" wrote in message
oups.com...

What was your carpenters name "bodgeit and scarper".... sure looks like


Hoodwink and Diddlem, joiners to the queer by loyal appointment. Or was it
Cash and Nashquckly, carpenters to the skint and infamous?

Looking at the first & second picture...
o Glass is fitted from the inside, retained by nailed on beading
o Corner measurement indicates a 6mm gap glass-to-beading
o Distant from that corner suggests the gap diminishes to 3mm

It does look like 4mm glass.

Glass rebate...
o Beading-to-front gap == 3mm for just below flush
o Beading-to-glass gap == 6mm
o Glass filled gap == 4mm
o Total rebate available for glass = 13mm

Could be higher - unknown is the glass-to-rebate re putty depth :-)

What is miss-fitted:
o Beading -- probably due to miss-cutting = forced-fit curvature
o Solution -- removal, shaving down & refitting

What is arguable:
o Glass thickness -- frankly 7-10mm SG would be better
o Solution -- available 13mm rules out DG, up to you re 7-10mm SG

I don't know the front glass-to-rebate putty thickness, I guess they
could have botched 4mm in there but if not then it's a bit too tight.

If the glazed area in the door is large, and it is subject to slam/wind, I
would put 7-10mm SG in. Small window in 4mm £6, 7mm £17, 10mm £21.
--
Dorothy Bradbury

On Thu, 16 Dec 2004 14:16:52 +0000, Andy Dingley
wrote:

On Thu, 16 Dec 2004 13:22:57 +0000, "Chris Cowley"
wrote:

I've just had a new back door fitted, and the glass panels at the top of
the door have been padded out with about a 10mm thickness of filler as
the door seems designed to take thicker glass than what has been
supplied with it

Sounds like it was designed for a double-glazed sealed unit. Shoddy.

Thanks for the replies everyone. At least I can ask vaguely educated
questions of the supplier/fitter now (like "Isn't this door supposed to
take double glazed panels?").

For the chap that asked for wider-angled shots showing more of the
door:-

http://freestuff.grok.co.uk/door/DSCF0014.JPG
http://freestuff.grok.co.uk/door/DSCF0017.JPG

As you can see from these shots, it has 9 glazed panels and the real
ugly part is at on the three top-most panels where the molding on the
door seems to be sized for thicker 12mm-or-so panels.

They've agreed to send the wood-butcher back on monday afternoon, so
I'll give them the opportunity to put things right. If they don't sort
it out to my satisfaction then I'll be naming and shaming them here and
fixing it myself (either by buying double glazed panels for it and
fitting them, or somehow doing a better job of bodging the putty and
beading with the existing panels...) :/

Thanks again,
Chris.
--
Chris Cowley

On Thu, 16 Dec 2004 20:57:43 GMT, "Dorothy Bradbury"
wrote:

I don't know the front glass-to-rebate putty thickness, I guess they
could have botched 4mm in there but if not then it's a bit too tight.

It looks much better from the front - no more than 1mm to 2mm putty
thickness.

If the glazed area in the door is large, and it is subject to slam/wind, I
would put 7-10mm SG in. Small window in 4mm £6, 7mm £17, 10mm £21.

It's a 9-glass-panel door, so I'd potentially be in the market for 9x
10mm SG panels if I end up having to fix this myself (which I would say
is quite likely). Are you in the business? If so, I may well have an
order for you on monday PM. If not, I'll try a local glazier - at least
I know what to ask for now.

Many thanks,
Chris.
--
Chris Cowley

It looks much better from the front - no more than 1mm to 2mm putty
thickness.

Basically the beading has been cut oversize, so rather than shave
it to size they have just forced it to fit with "They All Do That".

Just be glad he doesn't fit tyres :-)

It's a 9-glass-panel door, so I'd potentially be in the market for 9x
10mm SG panels if I end up having to fix this myself (which I would say
is quite likely). Are you in the business? If so, I may well have an
order for you on monday PM. If not, I'll try a local glazier - at least
I know what to ask for now.

No :-)
o Price out the glass carefully in the various thicknesses
---- cutting charge may be more important :-)
o You can also get bevelled flat SG which can look very nice
---- although thicker plain glass looks nice vs "a bit wimpy 4mm"

Can't recall the thermal/acoustic benefits of 4-7-10mm SG.

If you have a vapour deposited brass letterbox without a knocker,
or no knocker or doorbell, couriers *love* to bang on glass panels.
Rattling a spring loaded flap doesn't do it for them, they want to use
it as a pager to you, the dead & the next life by acoustics alone.

When they break leaded glass again they'll be put in the next life G.
--
Dorothy Bradbury

In article , "Dorothy Bradbury"
says...
snip

If you have a vapour deposited brass letterbox without a knocker,
or no knocker or doorbell, couriers *love* to bang on glass panels.
Rattling a spring loaded flap doesn't do it for them, they want to use
it as a pager to you, the dead & the next life by acoustics alone.

When they break leaded glass again they'll be put in the next life G.

The Parcelforce bloke seemed really shocked when I told him what I'd do
if he knocked on my leaded light with his keys again - it seemed to get
the message across though. :-)