Passed it on the way home today.

http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php/...inefailure.jpg


https://goo.gl/maps/7EBknYb84rb1BDG37

shows the location.



--
Adam

On 07/05/2021 18:49, ARW wrote:
Passed it on the way home today.

http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php/...inefailure.jpg


https://goo.gl/maps/7EBknYb84rb1BDG37

shows the location.



I predict we will see more. A bit of a boring failure compared to a
combusting generator and gearbox. Google Images for "burning wind turbine".

ARW wrote in news:y4flI.329750$E75e.213251
@fx21.ams4:

Passed it on the way home today.

http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php/...inefailure.jpg


Bird strike by the look of it . . .

"Peter Burke" wrote in message
...
ARW wrote in
news:y4flI.329750$E75e.213251
@fx21.ams4:

Passed it on the way home today.

http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php/...inefailure.jpg


Bird strike by the look of it . . .

Don’t tell D I M, he will have to go back to candles and firewood.

On 07/05/2021 18:49, ARW wrote:
Passed it on the way home today.

http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php/...inefailure.jpg


https://goo.gl/maps/7EBknYb84rb1BDG37

shows the location.

Nasty scratch that. Car body filler?

On Sat, 8 May 2021 13:14:07 +1000, cantankerous trolling geezer Rodent
Speed, the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:

FLUSH the trolling senile asshole's latest troll**** unread

--
Bill Wright to Rodent Speed:
"That confirms my opinion that you are a despicable little ****."
MID:

On Fri, 07 May 2021 20:47:47 GMT, Peter Burke wrote:

ARW wrote in news:y4flI.329750$E75e.213251
:

Passed it on the way home today.

http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php/...inefailure.jpg


Bird strike by the look of it . . .
Wind damage, blown the blade back into the tower. Maybe not feathered
in time, or properly.

On 08/05/2021 08:54, Richard wrote:
On 07/05/2021 18:49, ARW wrote:
Passed it on the way home today.

http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php/...inefailure.jpg


https://goo.gl/maps/7EBknYb84rb1BDG37

shows the location.

Nasty scratch that. Car body filler?

What you cannot see on that photo (as I was driving when I took it) is
that the blade has split into two. Half of it is hanging down the front
of the tower but as it is white on white you cannot see it.

--
Adam

On 08/05/2021 16:41, ARW wrote:
On 08/05/2021 08:54, Richard wrote:
On 07/05/2021 18:49, ARW wrote:
Passed it on the way home today.

http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php/...inefailure.jpg


https://goo.gl/maps/7EBknYb84rb1BDG37

shows the location.

Nasty scratch that. Car body filler?

What you cannot see on that photo (as I was driving when I took it) is
that the blade has split into two. Half of it is hanging down the front
of the tower but as it is white on white you cannot see it.

Manufacturing defect, bird-strike, overspeed, or any combination of
these by the sound of it.

newshound wrote:
On 08/05/2021 16:41, ARW wrote:
On 08/05/2021 08:54, Richard wrote:
On 07/05/2021 18:49, ARW wrote:
Passed it on the way home today.

http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php/...inefailure.jpg


https://goo.gl/maps/7EBknYb84rb1BDG37

shows the location.

Nasty scratch that. Car body filler?

What you cannot see on that photo (as I was driving when I took it) is
that the blade has split into two. Half of it is hanging down the
front of the tower but as it is white on white you cannot see it.

Manufacturing defect, bird-strike, overspeed, or any combination of
these by the sound of it.

The blades are in the furled position.

It's pretty difficult to come up with a brake for
these things.

The small wind turbines, they have a mechanical brake.
When the wind gets at those, it causes the mechanical
brake to heat up so much, the generator casing catches fire.

On the larger ones, you can short out the generator to
make a braking effect, but then if the wind gets at
it, it can overheat and destroy the generator.

Even if furled, it's probably spinning in some direction,
and if no brake was used, anything could happen.

Paul

On 08/05/2021 20:34, newshound wrote:
On 08/05/2021 16:41, ARW wrote:
On 08/05/2021 08:54, Richard wrote:
On 07/05/2021 18:49, ARW wrote:
Passed it on the way home today.

http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php/...inefailure.jpg


https://goo.gl/maps/7EBknYb84rb1BDG37

shows the location.

Nasty scratch that. Car body filler?

What you cannot see on that photo (as I was driving when I took it) is
that the blade has split into two. Half of it is hanging down the
front of the tower but as it is white on white you cannot see it.

Manufacturing defect, bird-strike, overspeed, or any combination of
these by the sound of it.

If you were an engineer, where would you most not want to put a large
dangerous piece of rotating machinery?

On the end of a cantilever shaft, out in the elements, subject to bird
strikes, insect build up, ice build up, marine spray in a high intensity
magnetic field, subject to gust loading and going in and out of
multispeed boundary layers. And 100 meters up in the air and from any
maintenance staff and equipment.

Especially when the alternative was in a nice environmentally stable
turbine hall, on finely balanced beam and centre bearing mounted shafts,
fully enclosed and subject to a constant onrush of steam...and with a
gantry crane already there to replace it if anything goes wrong...



--
€œBut what a weak barrier is truth when it stands in the way of an
hypothesis!€�

Mary Wollstonecraft

On 08/05/2021 16:41, ARW wrote:
On 08/05/2021 08:54, Richard wrote:
On 07/05/2021 18:49, ARW wrote:
Passed it on the way home today.

http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php/...inefailure.jpg


https://goo.gl/maps/7EBknYb84rb1BDG37

shows the location.

Nasty scratch that. Car body filler?

What you cannot see on that photo (as I was driving when I took it) is
that the blade has split into two. Half of it is hanging down the front
of the tower but as it is white on white you cannot see it.


Fibreglass yacht masts fail like that sometimes

On 08/05/2021 16:41, ARW wrote:
On 08/05/2021 08:54, Richard wrote:
On 07/05/2021 18:49, ARW wrote:
Passed it on the way home today.

http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php/...inefailure.jpg


https://goo.gl/maps/7EBknYb84rb1BDG37

shows the location.

Nasty scratch that. Car body filler?

What you cannot see on that photo (as I was driving when I took it) is
that the blade has split into two. Half of it is hanging down the front
of the tower but as it is white on white you cannot see it.


Better shot from today's journey

http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php/...ndturbine2.jpg

--
Adam

ARW wrote:
On 08/05/2021 16:41, ARW wrote:
On 08/05/2021 08:54, Richard wrote:
On 07/05/2021 18:49, ARW wrote:
Passed it on the way home today.

http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php/...inefailure.jpg


https://goo.gl/maps/7EBknYb84rb1BDG37

shows the location.

Nasty scratch that. Car body filler?

What you cannot see on that photo (as I was driving when I took it) is
that the blade has split into two. Half of it is hanging down the
front of the tower but as it is white on white you cannot see it.


Better shot from today's journey

http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php/...ndturbine2.jpg


Makes you wonder what that blade is made out of.

Paul

How can you tell, I've no idea what your picture shows, does it have a blade
missing and by the way why do turbines not use more blades?
Brian

--

This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...

Blind user, so no pictures please
Note this Signature is meaningless.!
"ARW" wrote in message
...
Passed it on the way home today.

http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php/...inefailure.jpg


https://goo.gl/maps/7EBknYb84rb1BDG37

shows the location.



--
Adam

Brian Gaff (Sofa) wrote

How can you tell, I've no idea what your
picture shows, does it have a blade missing

The two parts of the blade are actually hanging down limply.

and by the way why do turbines not use more blades?

Old fashioned windmills do. Interesting question actually.

"ARW" wrote in message
...
Passed it on the way home today.

http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php/...inefailure.jpg


https://goo.gl/maps/7EBknYb84rb1BDG37

shows the location.



--
Adam

On Mon, 10 May 2021 06:30:25 +1000, cantankerous trolling geezer Rodent
Speed, the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:

FLUSH the trolling senile asshole's latest troll**** unread

Get the **** out of humans-only ngs, senie trolling cretin!

--
Norman Wells addressing trolling senile Rodent:
"Ah, the voice of scum speaks."
MID:

On 09/05/2021 16:32, Paul wrote:
ARW wrote:
On 08/05/2021 16:41, ARW wrote:
On 08/05/2021 08:54, Richard wrote:
On 07/05/2021 18:49, ARW wrote:
Passed it on the way home today.

http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php/...inefailure.jpg


https://goo.gl/maps/7EBknYb84rb1BDG37

shows the location.

Nasty scratch that. Car body filler?

What you cannot see on that photo (as I was driving when I took it)
is that the blade has split into two. Half of it is hanging down the
front of the tower but as it is white on white you cannot see it.


Better shot from today's journey

http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php/...ndturbine2.jpg


Makes you wonder what that blade is made out of.

Â*Â* Paul

Glass or carbon fibre, epoxy resins in the high stress regions.

On 09/05/2021 18:49, Brian Gaff (Sofa) wrote:
How can you tell, I've no idea what your picture shows, does it have a blade
missing and by the way why do turbines not use more blades?
Brian

Googling "why do wind turbines have three blades" will give you a number
of interesting articles.

"newshound" wrote in message
o.uk...
On 09/05/2021 18:49, Brian Gaff (Sofa) wrote:
How can you tell, I've no idea what your picture shows, does it have a
blade
missing and by the way why do turbines not use more blades?
Brian

Googling "why do wind turbines have three blades" will give you a number
of interesting articles.

But none that explain why the old dutch windmills had 4.
https://www.google.com/search?q=old+...mills&tbm=isch

Presumably they were slower so the drag wasnt as important.

On Mon, 10 May 2021 08:21:29 +1000, cantankerous trolling geezer Rodent
Speed, the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:

FLUSH the trolling senile asshole's latest troll**** unread

Brian Gaff (Sofa) wrote:
How can you tell, I've no idea what your picture shows, does it have a blade
missing and by the way why do turbines not use more blades?
Brian

NASA made an experimental turbine, with just
one blade, and a counterweight. Someone has
tested that idea.

They do have turbines with two blades. The tower
wobbles more, when the top blade is in full wind, the
bottom blade is shielded by the tower. That torques
the hub and tower.

Apparently, adding the third blade only adds 3% more power.
But the torque ripple in the tower is less.

Additional blades would only add more mass and drag. The
next number of practical blades would be five.

One article on wind turbines, mentions that the design
is all about "number of flexures". And the blades are only
good for about 100 million flexures. Each rotation counts
as a flexure for the blade, it is constantly being worked
(and ruined). Same goes for the tower, it takes a lot of
abuse too.

The Dutch windmills are different. There's an entire article
on "Windmill Sail" design and mechanisms for automating the
furling in high wind (spring-loaded shutters).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windmill_sail

Paul

Paul wrote
Brian Gaff (Sofa) wrote

How can you tell, I've no idea what your picture
shows, does it have a blade missing and by the
way why do turbines not use more blades?

NASA made an experimental turbine, with just
one blade, and a counterweight. Someone has
tested that idea.

They do have turbines with two blades. The tower
wobbles more, when the top blade is in full wind, the
bottom blade is shielded by the tower. That torques
the hub and tower.

Apparently, adding the third blade only adds 3%
more power. But the torque ripple in the tower is less.

Additional blades would only add more mass and drag.

But doesn't explain why the old windmills as opposed
to windmill water pumps normally had 4.

The next number of practical blades would be five.

That's not right.

One article on wind turbines, mentions that the design
is all about "number of flexures". And the blades are only
good for about 100 million flexures. Each rotation counts
as a flexure for the blade, it is constantly being worked
(and ruined). Same goes for the tower, it takes a lot of
abuse too.

The Dutch windmills are different. There's an entire article
on "Windmill Sail" design and mechanisms for automating
the furling in high wind (spring-loaded shutters).

But doesn't explain why they had 4 and not 3.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windmill_sail

"Rod Speed" wrote in message
...
Paul wrote
Brian Gaff (Sofa) wrote

How can you tell, I've no idea what your picture shows, does it have a
blade missing and by the way why do turbines not use more blades?

NASA made an experimental turbine, with just
one blade, and a counterweight. Someone has
tested that idea.

They do have turbines with two blades. The tower
wobbles more, when the top blade is in full wind, the
bottom blade is shielded by the tower. That torques
the hub and tower.

Apparently, adding the third blade only adds 3% more power. But the
torque ripple in the tower is less.

Additional blades would only add more mass and drag.

But doesn't explain why the old windmills as opposed to windmill water
pumps normally had 4.

Maybe its as basic as that with the old windmills it was
more practical to have two very long timber beams
which crossed at the middle. Much easier to do it
like that than to do 3 sails.

The next number of practical blades would be five.

That's not right.
One article on wind turbines, mentions that the design
is all about "number of flexures". And the blades are only
good for about 100 million flexures. Each rotation counts
as a flexure for the blade, it is constantly being worked
(and ruined). Same goes for the tower, it takes a lot of
abuse too.

The Dutch windmills are different. There's an entire article
on "Windmill Sail" design and mechanisms for automating the furling in
high wind (spring-loaded shutters).

But doesn't explain why they had 4 and not 3.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windmill_sail

Rod Speed wrote:


"newshound" wrote in message
o.uk...
On 09/05/2021 18:49, Brian Gaff (Sofa) wrote:
How can you tell, I've no idea what your picture shows, does it have
a blade
missing and by the way why do turbines not use more blades?
Brian

Googling "why do wind turbines have three blades" will give you a
number of interesting articles.

But none that explain why the old dutch windmills had 4.
https://www.google.com/search?q=old+...mills&tbm=isch

Presumably they were slower so the drag wasnt as important.

How many horsepower does a dutch windmill generate ?

The wind turbines are currently 2MW to as much as 9MW.
2MW is over 2000 horsepower.

"How much horsepower did the average traditional Dutch windmill/wind pump generate?"

https://www.quora.com/How-much-horse...-pump-generate

"Somewhere between 40 and 60 horsepower, but youll lose a lot between
the sails and the gears. So €˜downstairs where the pump or the millstones
or the machinery was located, one would usually end up with around 16 ~ 18 hp."

So a factor of 40 or so.

Paul

On 09/05/2021 22:58, newshound wrote:
On 09/05/2021 18:49, Brian Gaff (Sofa) wrote:
How can you tell, I've no idea what your picture shows, does it have a
blade
missing and by the way why do turbines not use more blades?
Â* Brian

Googling "why do wind turbines have three blades" will give you a number
of interesting articles.

some dont

--
Outside of a dog, a book is a man's best friend. Inside of a dog it's
too dark to read.

Groucho Marx

The Natural Philosopher formulated on Sunday :
Especially when the alternative was in a nice environmentally stable turbine
hall, on finely balanced beam and centre bearing mounted shafts, fully
enclosed and subject to a constant onrush of steam...and with a gantry crane
already there to replace it if anything goes wrong...

+1

Paul wrote
Rod Speed wrote
newshound wrote
Brian Gaff (Sofa) wrote

How can you tell, I've no idea what your picture shows, does it have a
blade missing and by the way why do turbines not use more blades?

Googling "why do wind turbines have three blades" will give you a number
of interesting articles.

But none that explain why the old dutch windmills had 4.
https://www.google.com/search?q=old+...mills&tbm=isch

Presumably they were slower so the drag wasnt as important.

How many horsepower does a dutch windmill generate ?

No idea. It wouldnt be trivial given that they usually drove
massive great grinding stones, but likely much lower than
the best of of the current massive wind turbines.

Less clear what they both do in the lower normal winds tho.

The wind turbines are currently 2MW to as much as 9MW. 2MW is over 2000
horsepower.

"How much horsepower did the average traditional Dutch windmill/wind pump
generate?"

https://www.quora.com/How-much-horse...-pump-generate

"Somewhere between 40 and 60 horsepower, but youll lose a lot between
the sails and the gears. So €˜downstairs where the pump or the
millstones
or the machinery was located, one would usually end up with around 16
~ 18 hp."

So a factor of 40 or so.

Interesting.

On Mon, 10 May 2021 17:14:44 +1000, cantankerous trolling geezer Rodent
Speed, the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:


No idea.

Right, but you will keep smartassing about it anyway, as usual, senile
know-it-all!

--
addressing nym-shifting senile Rodent:
"You on the other hand are a heavyweight bull****ter who demonstrates
his particular prowess at it every day."
MID:

On 09/05/2021 23:53, Paul wrote:
One article on wind turbines, mentions that the design
is all about "number of flexures". And the blades are only
good for about 100 million flexures. Each rotation counts
as a flexure for the blade, it is constantly being worked
(and ruined). Same goes for the tower, it takes a lot of
abuse too.

And of course these exotic composited can't be recycled.

Green aren't they?

Andy

Vir Campestris wrote:
On 09/05/2021 23:53, Paul wrote:
One article on wind turbines, mentions that the design
is all about "number of flexures". And the blades are only
good for about 100 million flexures. Each rotation counts
as a flexure for the blade, it is constantly being worked
(and ruined). Same goes for the tower, it takes a lot of
abuse too.

And of course these exotic composited can't be recycled.

Green aren't they?

Andy

There was a claim they "grind them up and do something with them" :-)

When you need a hand-wavey story about how green you are,
claim you grind up the materials.

grinding
... \___ still working on this part
... /
profit!!!

Paul