Just had a power cut (70 minutes not too bad a fix time for an 11kV
fault I suppose)

OK, I did have to get up to silence the UPS (also shut down a couple of
unnecessary PCs while at it to extend runtime)

But most annoying is the 15 minutes of alarms sounding due to failed
batteries, then sounding again for another 15 minutes when the power
comes back ...

People seem to think this is normal/acceptable ...

"Andy Burns" wrote in message
...
Just had a power cut (70 minutes not too bad a fix time for an 11kV fault
I suppose)

OK, I did have to get up to silence the UPS (also shut down a couple of
unnecessary PCs while at it to extend runtime)

But most annoying is the 15 minutes of alarms sounding due to failed
batteries, then sounding again for another 15 minutes when the power comes
back ...

People seem to think this is normal/acceptable ...

Didnt get that alarm result here. We had a deliberate power
cut a week ago to change two power poles that lasted about
3 hours and no alarms went off on the cut or the restore.

On 07/10/2019 05:30, Andy Burns wrote:
Just had a power cut (70 minutes not too bad a fix time for an 11kV
fault I suppose)

OK, I did have to get up to silence the UPS (also shut down a couple of
unnecessary PCs while at it to extend runtime)

But most annoying is the 15 minutes of alarms sounding due to failed
batteries, then sounding again for another 15 minutes when the power
comes back ...

People seem to think this is normal/acceptable ...

No, that's why I change my battery in my alarm every 3 years.

--
mailto : news {at} admac {dot} myzen {dot} co {dot} uk

On Mon, 7 Oct 2019 16:08:11 +1100, AlexK, better known as cantankerous
trolling senile geezer Rodent Speed, wrote:


Didn¢t get that alarm result here.

Of COURSE not, you auto-contradicting senile pest from Australia!

--
Website (from 2007) dedicated to the 85-year-old trolling senile
cretin from Oz:
https://www.pcreview.co.uk/threads/r...d-faq.2973853/

In article ,
alan_m wrote:
On 07/10/2019 05:30, Andy Burns wrote:
Just had a power cut (70 minutes not too bad a fix time for an 11kV
fault I suppose)

OK, I did have to get up to silence the UPS (also shut down a couple of
unnecessary PCs while at it to extend runtime)

But most annoying is the 15 minutes of alarms sounding due to failed
batteries, then sounding again for another 15 minutes when the power
comes back ...

People seem to think this is normal/acceptable ...

No, that's why I change my battery in my alarm every 3 years.

Crikey. A decent SLA in such a friendly environment should last a lot
longer than that. Got 11 years out of one car battery.

--
*Vegetarians taste great*

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Dave Plowman wrote:

alan_m wrote:

I change my battery in my alarm every 3 years.

Crikey. A decent SLA in such a friendly environment should last a lot
longer than that. Got 11 years out of one car battery.

Some people must have had batteries replaced as I only heard one alarm
last night, when we had a power-cut this summer (windows wide open)
there were several to contend with.

I phoned-in the outage after giving it a couple of minutes (and a couple
of failed attempts at cutting back in) the 105 reporting line
automatically got my postcode from somewhere and recorded the outage,
which appeared on WPD's fault map shortly afterwards, just had a call
back from them to apologise ...

On 07/10/2019 11:09, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
alan_m wrote:
On 07/10/2019 05:30, Andy Burns wrote:
Just had a power cut (70 minutes not too bad a fix time for an 11kV
fault I suppose)

OK, I did have to get up to silence the UPS (also shut down a couple of
unnecessary PCs while at it to extend runtime)

But most annoying is the 15 minutes of alarms sounding due to failed
batteries, then sounding again for another 15 minutes when the power
comes back ...

People seem to think this is normal/acceptable ...

No, that's why I change my battery in my alarm every 3 years.

Crikey. A decent SLA in such a friendly environment should last a lot
longer than that. Got 11 years out of one car battery.

It isn't all that benign an environment especially for the external bell
battery in the external sounder. Being on float charge ready to go kills
them in 3-5 years. Worth testing before swapping out though.

--
Regards,
Martin Brown

Andy Burns wrote:
Just had a power cut (70 minutes not too bad a fix time for an 11kV
fault I suppose)

OK, I did have to get up to silence the UPS (also shut down a couple of
unnecessary PCs while at it to extend runtime)

But most annoying is the 15 minutes of alarms sounding due to failed
batteries, then sounding again for another 15 minutes when the power
comes back ...

People seem to think this is normal/acceptable ...


More likely theyve inherited an alarm after a house move and dont have a
service contract and/or dont know the service codes to allow them to
change the battery themselves.

Tim

--
Please don't feed the trolls

On 07/10/2019 05:30, Andy Burns wrote:
Just had a power cut (70 minutes not too bad a fix time for an 11kV
fault I suppose)

OK, I did have to get up to silence the UPS (also shut down a couple of
unnecessary PCs while at it to extend runtime)

But most annoying is the 15 minutes of alarms sounding due to failed
batteries, then sounding again for another 15 minutes when the power
comes back ...

People seem to think this is normal/acceptable ...

Some alarms use capacitors these days, others still use rechargeable
batteries, which decline with age. Alarms going off once in a while for
power-cuts are probably better than every housholder testing their alarm
and whether the battery has enough power to run the siren for the
alloted time, all on different days and times.

SteveW

On 07/10/2019 11:09, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
alan_m wrote:
On 07/10/2019 05:30, Andy Burns wrote:
Just had a power cut (70 minutes not too bad a fix time for an 11kV
fault I suppose)

OK, I did have to get up to silence the UPS (also shut down a couple of
unnecessary PCs while at it to extend runtime)

But most annoying is the 15 minutes of alarms sounding due to failed
batteries, then sounding again for another 15 minutes when the power
comes back ...

People seem to think this is normal/acceptable ...

No, that's why I change my battery in my alarm every 3 years.

Crikey. A decent SLA in such a friendly environment should last a lot
longer than that. Got 11 years out of one car battery.


The problem in alarm panels is the battery is never cycled - just
trickle charged 100% of the time. After a number of years the battery
still has the correct terminal voltage but cannot provide the
instantaneous backup power when the mains fails. As a result there is a
glitch in the power to the alarm panel and the alarm is triggered. The
backup batteries still can supply enough power for the sounders/lights
for a long time etc. Checking the battery afterwards will again show the
correct terminal voltage. You may only see the problem for the first
time is when the mains power fails.

--
mailto : news {at} admac {dot} myzen {dot} co {dot} uk

In article ,
Martin Brown wrote:
Crikey. A decent SLA in such a friendly environment should last a lot
longer than that. Got 11 years out of one car battery.

It isn't all that benign an environment especially for the external bell
battery in the external sounder. Being on float charge ready to go kills
them in 3-5 years. Worth testing before swapping out though.

I was assuming it was a faulty one in the panel which would cause the
alarm to go off if mains lost?

--
*If you don't like the news, go out and make some.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

alan_m wrote:
On 07/10/2019 11:09, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
alan_m wrote:
On 07/10/2019 05:30, Andy Burns wrote:
Just had a power cut (70 minutes not too bad a fix time for an 11kV
fault I suppose)

OK, I did have to get up to silence the UPS (also shut down a couple of
unnecessary PCs while at it to extend runtime)

But most annoying is the 15 minutes of alarms sounding due to failed
batteries, then sounding again for another 15 minutes when the power
comes back ...

People seem to think this is normal/acceptable ...

No, that's why I change my battery in my alarm every 3 years.

Crikey. A decent SLA in such a friendly environment should last a lot
longer than that. Got 11 years out of one car battery.


The problem in alarm panels is the battery is never cycled - just
trickle charged 100% of the time. After a number of years the battery
still has the correct terminal voltage but cannot provide the
instantaneous backup power when the mains fails.

Is this a pet theory or can you provide links to this battery behaviour?
Sounds unlikely to me.

As a result there is a
glitch in the power to the alarm panel and the alarm is triggered. The
backup batteries still can supply enough power for the sounders/lights
for a long time etc.

Um, you do know that the external sounder and strobe are additionally
powered by a second non-rechargeable battery? Usually lithium I believe.
Theres no need to postulate a €œsluggish battery€� theory. The voltage from
the duff battery is just too low to run the system when theres a power cut
and this triggers the tamper circuitry.

Tim

--
Please don't feed the trolls

On 07/10/2019 18:06, Tim+ wrote:

Um, you do know that the external sounder and strobe are additionally
powered by a second non-rechargeable battery?

My bell box has a rechargeable battery that is also trickle charged in
my wired system via the alarm panel. My bell box also has red flashing
LEDs so a self contained non-rechargeable battery may not last that long.

The tamper circuit in a bell box is often a spring loaded mechanical
switch which when the box is removed from the wall is activated.


Theres no need to postulate a €œsluggish battery€� theory. The voltage from
the duff battery is just too low to run the system when theres a power cut
and this triggers the tamper circuitry.

The bell box battery doesn't power the alarm panel which, in my case,
has its own loud sounder.

Once triggered by a power cut the alarm can be disabled and run normally
from the old battery which you suggest has a voltage too low to run the
system.



--
mailto : news {at} admac {dot} myzen {dot} co {dot} uk

On Mon, 7 Oct 2019 19:38:11 +0100, alan_m wrote:

Um, you do know that the external sounder and strobe are
additionally
powered by a second non-rechargeable battery?

My bell box has a rechargeable battery that is also trickle charged in
my wired system via the alarm panel. My bell box also has red flashing
LEDs so a self contained non-rechargeable battery may not last that
long.

The bell box is normally powered from the panel to keep rechargeables
charged or flash pretty lights. It also "holds off" the sounder
and/or strobe. If the panel voltage drops to low, the sounder and
strobe trigger and run from the battery in the bell box. Once this is
triggered I'd expct it to run for several minutes before trying to
reset and retrigger if the panel volts are still low/abscent. You
don't want a scrote to be able to shut up the sounder simply by
feeding it volts from another source...

The tamper circuit in a bell box is often a spring loaded mechanical
switch which when the box is removed from the wall is activated.

And hopefully the cover... this should trigger a full tamper alarm
condition. Which may or may not cause the sounder/strobe to be
triggered.

Once triggered by a power cut the alarm can be disabled and run normally
from the old battery which you suggest has a voltage too low to run the
system.

Voltage too low when the sounder and strobe are drawing power...

--
Cheers
Dave.

On 07/10/2019 21:24, Dave Liquorice wrote:
On Mon, 7 Oct 2019 19:38:11 +0100, alan_m wrote:

Um, you do know that the external sounder and strobe are
additionally
powered by a second non-rechargeable battery?

My bell box has a rechargeable battery that is also trickle charged in
my wired system via the alarm panel. My bell box also has red flashing
LEDs so a self contained non-rechargeable battery may not last that
long.

The bell box is normally powered from the panel to keep rechargeables
charged or flash pretty lights. It also "holds off" the sounder
and/or strobe. If the panel voltage drops to low, the sounder and
strobe trigger and run from the battery in the bell box. Once this is
triggered I'd expct it to run for several minutes before trying to
reset and retrigger if the panel volts are still low/abscent.

Commonly adjustable from 1 minute to 20 minutes (the legal maximum).
Some also limit the number of re-triggers, while more basic ones don't.

You
don't want a scrote to be able to shut up the sounder simply by
feeding it volts from another source...

They can do that, but usually the wiring comes through the wall from
inside the house, so they'd need to be inside or they'd have to pull the
box off the wall or open it first (either of which triggers them
immediately). Far easier and quieter to squirt foam inside.

The tamper circuit in a bell box is often a spring loaded mechanical
switch which when the box is removed from the wall is activated.

And hopefully the cover... this should trigger a full tamper alarm
condition. Which may or may not cause the sounder/strobe to be
triggered.

Usually it would directly trigger the sounder/strobe of the bell box,
without needing the alarm panel to signal one and then it'd continue to
run on its internal battery. It would also give a tamper alert at the
panel, which may well no longer have a sounder/strobe connected, but as
its going off anyway, that doesn't matter.

SteveW

In article ,
alan_m wrote:
My bell box has a rechargeable battery that is also trickle charged in
my wired system via the alarm panel. My bell box also has red flashing
LEDs so a self contained non-rechargeable battery may not last that long.

The tamper circuit in a bell box is often a spring loaded mechanical
switch which when the box is removed from the wall is activated.

I thought the bell box battery is only there so it will sound if it or the
wiring to it is tampered with. Under other circumstances, the panel
supplies the ringing volts to it - either from mains or its battery.

--
*Lottery: A tax on people who are bad at math.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In article ,
alan_m wrote:
The problem in alarm panels is the battery is never cycled - just
trickle charged 100% of the time. After a number of years the battery
still has the correct terminal voltage but cannot provide the
instantaneous backup power when the mains fails.

Assuming an SLA, they don't need cycling. What you are talking about is
suphation of the plates, and if that has happened the battery is basically
scrap.

--
*If you ate pasta and anti-pasta, would you still be hungry?

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On 08/10/2019 11:20, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
alan_m wrote:
My bell box has a rechargeable battery that is also trickle charged in
my wired system via the alarm panel. My bell box also has red flashing
LEDs so a self contained non-rechargeable battery may not last that long.

The tamper circuit in a bell box is often a spring loaded mechanical
switch which when the box is removed from the wall is activated.

I thought the bell box battery is only there so it will sound if it or the
wiring to it is tampered with. Under other circumstances, the panel
supplies the ringing volts to it - either from mains or its battery.


Self Actuating Bells do not ring when voltage is supplied from the panel.
The 12v from the panel stops them ringing and charges the battery.

When an alarm condition exists the 12V is removed and they bell rings
until it comes back or the battery goes flat or if its a modern one a
timer expires.


Only cheap and nasty DIY alarms need 12V to operate the bell.
If you have one then get rid of it as it takes seconds to cut the wires
and then there is no external bell.

The old fashioned strobes may be powered from the box, mine are, they
take too much power for the battery.

Its not the same 12V that operates the rest of the box.

On 07/10/2019 07:42, alan_m wrote:
On 07/10/2019 05:30, Andy Burns wrote:
Just had a power cut (70 minutes not too bad a fix time for an 11kV
fault I suppose)

OK, I did have to get up to silence the UPS (also shut down a couple
of unnecessary PCs while at it to extend runtime)

But most annoying is the 15 minutes of alarms sounding due to failed
batteries, then sounding again for another 15 minutes when the power
comes back ...

People seem to think this is normal/acceptable ...

No, that's why I change my battery in my alarm every 3 years.


Power to Auckley (a village in Doncaster) was to be cut off for a day to
allow power lines to be changed.

Just before 9am I had wired a 3ph generator up ready to power the local pub.

At bang on 9am all the alarms went off.

--
Adam

On 07/10/2019 13:00, Tim+ wrote:
Andy Burns wrote:
Just had a power cut (70 minutes not too bad a fix time for an 11kV
fault I suppose)

OK, I did have to get up to silence the UPS (also shut down a couple of
unnecessary PCs while at it to extend runtime)

But most annoying is the 15 minutes of alarms sounding due to failed
batteries, then sounding again for another 15 minutes when the power
comes back ...

People seem to think this is normal/acceptable ...


More likely theyve inherited an alarm after a house move and dont have a
service contract and/or dont know the service codes to allow them to
change the battery themselves.



It's more likely to be a knackered battery.

Wait until cars that use batteries to drive them are knackered.

It's not £6 plus VAT for a new one then.




--
Adam

ARW wrote:

Wait until cars that use batteries to drive them are knackered.
It's not £6 plus VAT for a new one then.

33 grand (oz dollars?) for a Leaf battery I hear ...

On 08/10/2019 20:58, Andy Burns wrote:
ARW wrote:

Wait until cars that use batteries to drive them are knackered.
It's not £6 plus VAT for a new one then.

33 grand (oz dollars?) for a Leaf battery I hear ...

And the CO2 cost to make/replace them?



--
Adam

"ARW" wrote in message
...
On 07/10/2019 07:42, alan_m wrote:
On 07/10/2019 05:30, Andy Burns wrote:
Just had a power cut (70 minutes not too bad a fix time for an 11kV
fault I suppose)

OK, I did have to get up to silence the UPS (also shut down a couple of
unnecessary PCs while at it to extend runtime)

But most annoying is the 15 minutes of alarms sounding due to failed
batteries, then sounding again for another 15 minutes when the power
comes back ...

People seem to think this is normal/acceptable ...

No, that's why I change my battery in my alarm every 3 years.


Power to Auckley (a village in Doncaster) was to be cut off for a day to
allow power lines to be changed.

Just before 9am I had wired a 3ph generator up ready to power the local
pub.

At bang on 9am all the alarms went off.

Didnt happen here. We had the mains off for 3 hours to replace a couple
of power poles which have the 11KV distribution line on the top with the
4 wire 240/415 service below that. When the mains went off at the
announced 9:30 presumably to minimise any disruption for those who
had kids going to school etc, not one alarm went off. And none when
the power came back at 12:30 either.

I didnt bother setting up the generator, decided to have my usual
daytime nap at 9:30 and planned to read some ebooks on the kindle
when I woke up. They said the power would be out till 4pm. Was
dozing at 12:30 when the google home mini announced that the
power was back, asked the monkeys of the power was back for good
and they said that it was.

On Wed, 9 Oct 2019 08:34:05 +1100, cantankerous trolling geezer Rodent
Speed, the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:


At bang on 9am all the alarms went off.

Didn¢t happen here.

Nobody asked you anything, you obnoxious senile Ozzie cretin! tsk

--
Sqwertz to Rot Speed:
"This is just a hunch, but I'm betting you're kinda an argumentative
asshole.
MID:

What a refreshing change to have a non political thread.

On 08/10/2019 22:34, Rod Speed wrote:
8

Didnt happen here. We had the mains off for 3 hours to replace a couple
of power poles which have the 11KV distribution line on the top with the
4 wire 240/415 service below that.

That sound stupid, if the 11kV falls down you could get contact with the
240V and give someone a good shock.

In article ,
dennis@home wrote:
On 08/10/2019 11:20, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
alan_m wrote:
My bell box has a rechargeable battery that is also trickle charged
in my wired system via the alarm panel. My bell box also has red
flashing LEDs so a self contained non-rechargeable battery may not
last that long.

The tamper circuit in a bell box is often a spring loaded mechanical
switch which when the box is removed from the wall is activated.

I thought the bell box battery is only there so it will sound if it or
the wiring to it is tampered with. Under other circumstances, the
panel supplies the ringing volts to it - either from mains or its
battery.


Self Actuating Bells do not ring when voltage is supplied from the
panel. The 12v from the panel stops them ringing and charges the battery.

OK.

When an alarm condition exists the 12V is removed and they bell rings
until it comes back or the battery goes flat or if its a modern one a
timer expires.


Only cheap and nasty DIY alarms need 12V to operate the bell.
If you have one then get rid of it as it takes seconds to cut the wires
and then there is no external bell.

But if you remove the 12v the sounder sounds?

No expert on alarm internals since I've only ever followed a wiring
diagram. But with your method, it would mean the sounder no longer works
if the internal battery is kaput?

The old fashioned strobes may be powered from the box, mine are, they
take too much power for the battery.

Its not the same 12V that operates the rest of the box.

Thing is the bell box should be situated where it's difficult to get at.
Which means changing it or the battery equally difficult?

And anyone who feeds it with accessible cabling should be shot. ;-)

--
*Never miss a good chance to shut up.*

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

dennis@home wrote
Rod Speed wrote

Didnt happen here. We had the mains off for 3 hours to replace a couple
of power poles which have the 11KV distribution line on the top with the
4 wire 240/415 service below that.

That sound stupid,

Everyone does it that way, including you lot, for a reason.

if the 11kV falls down

Normally only happens when some fool drives into a
power pole and the breaker on the 11KV line triggers.

Much less often you can get a tree branch come down
on the line in a big storm and see 11KV on the you could
get contact with the 4 wire 240/415 service below that.

240V and give someone a good shock.

In practice even stupid poms are hardly ever grabbing the 240V line.

There is no alternative when the power lines are on poles There will always
be some 11KV lines above or crossing a 4 wire 240/415 service below that.

On Wed, 9 Oct 2019 21:00:59 +1100, cantankerous trolling geezer Rodent
Speed, the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:

FLUSH more of the abnormal senile cretin's troll****

....and nothing's left!

--
Website (from 2007) dedicated to the 85-year-old trolling senile
cretin from Oz:
https://www.pcreview.co.uk/threads/r...d-faq.2973853/

On 09/10/2019 10:26, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
dennis@home wrote:
On 08/10/2019 11:20, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
alan_m wrote:
My bell box has a rechargeable battery that is also trickle charged
in my wired system via the alarm panel. My bell box also has red
flashing LEDs so a self contained non-rechargeable battery may not
last that long.

The tamper circuit in a bell box is often a spring loaded mechanical
switch which when the box is removed from the wall is activated.

I thought the bell box battery is only there so it will sound if it or
the wiring to it is tampered with. Under other circumstances, the
panel supplies the ringing volts to it - either from mains or its
battery.


Self Actuating Bells do not ring when voltage is supplied from the
panel. The 12v from the panel stops them ringing and charges the battery.

OK.

When an alarm condition exists the 12V is removed and they bell rings
until it comes back or the battery goes flat or if its a modern one a
timer expires.


Only cheap and nasty DIY alarms need 12V to operate the bell.
If you have one then get rid of it as it takes seconds to cut the wires
and then there is no external bell.

But if you remove the 12v the sounder sounds?

It does on a decent one.


No expert on alarm internals since I've only ever followed a wiring
diagram. But with your method, it would mean the sounder no longer works
if the internal battery is kaput?

That's why you can test them.

Its how all the bell boxes on banks work so it can't be the worst way.
No banks use one that rings when it is powered by 12v in an alarm condition.

I have actually installed some for Chubb alarms but it was a long time
ago and I quit as I didn't like the training bloke as he was getting
things wrong about mains and didn't like being corrected.

It was my first proper job before I moved the GEC telecomms.


The old fashioned strobes may be powered from the box, mine are, they
take too much power for the battery.

Its not the same 12V that operates the rest of the box.

Thing is the bell box should be situated where it's difficult to get at.
Which means changing it or the battery equally difficult?

The battery is fine for years.
Not all buildings have somewhere difficult to get to.


And anyone who feeds it with accessible cabling should be shot. ;-)


crowbar, rip box off wall cut wires and one that needs power from the
panel goes quiet.

On 07/10/2019 05:30, Andy Burns wrote:

People seem to think this is normal/acceptable ...

Yep.

A housing estate was built around our small row of terraces about 12
years ago.

For whatever reason (Faulty? Windows open? Pets left in? Insensibly
placed sensors? Power outages?), I can't remember the last time I went
more than a few hours without hearing an alarm wail.

Sometimes just for a couple of minutes, sometimes all day/night.

Makes me dread summer.

On 09/10/2019 12:53, R D S wrote:
On 07/10/2019 05:30, Andy Burns wrote:

People seem to think this is normal/acceptable ...

Yep.

A housing estate was built around our small row of terraces about 12
years ago.

For whatever reason (Faulty? Windows open? Pets left in? Insensibly
placed sensors? Power outages?), I can't remember the last time I went
more than a few hours without hearing an alarm wail.

Sometimes just for a couple of minutes, sometimes all day/night.

Makes me dread summer.

If one sounds for more than 20 minutes you can get the council to
silence it, and bill the owner for doing so.

That will probably get them fixed.

dennis@home wrote:
On 09/10/2019 12:53, R D S wrote:
On 07/10/2019 05:30, Andy Burns wrote:

People seem to think this is normal/acceptable ...

Yep.

A housing estate was built around our small row of terraces about 12
years ago.

For whatever reason (Faulty? Windows open? Pets left in? Insensibly
placed sensors? Power outages?), I can't remember the last time I went
more than a few hours without hearing an alarm wail.

Sometimes just for a couple of minutes, sometimes all day/night.

Makes me dread summer.

If one sounds for more than 20 minutes you can get the council to
silence it, and bill the owner for doing so.

How will they silence it? Long ladder and a can of squirty foam?
Personally I dont think councils would put workers lives at risk (working
at height) just to deal with a self limiting nuisance. I could be wrong
though.

Tim


--
Please don't feed the trolls

In article ,
dennis@home wrote:
Thing is the bell box should be situated where it's difficult to get
at. Which means changing it or the battery equally difficult?

The battery is fine for years.
Not all buildings have somewhere difficult to get to.

Handy for a can of foam, then?

--
*I'll try being nicer if you'll try being smarter

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On 09/10/2019 09:52, dennis@home wrote:
On 08/10/2019 22:34, Rod Speed wrote:
8

Didnt happen here. We had the mains off for 3 hours to replace a couple
of power poles which have the 11KV distribution line on the top with the
4 wire 240/415 service below that.

That sound stupid, if the 11kV falls down you could get contact with the
240V and give someone a good shock.


Round here, where that occurs there is an earthed bare copper wire
above the 240/415 lines so that a breaker will blow before the
low voltage lines are hit.

On 08/10/2019 22:10, ARW wrote:
On 08/10/2019 20:58, Andy Burns wrote:
ARW wrote:

Wait until cars that use batteries to drive them are knackered.
It's not £6 plus VAT for a new one then.

33 grand (oz dollars?) for a Leaf battery I hear ...

And the CO2 cost to make/replace them?




And the CO2 and other stuff when they catch fire :-)

Apparently some EU countries have special mobile tanks to
dump an entire Tesla car into and flood it, because those
Lithium batteries are sods to put out after a vehicle fire.

On 09/10/2019 14:15, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
dennis@home wrote:
Thing is the bell box should be situated where it's difficult to get
at. Which means changing it or the battery equally difficult?

The battery is fine for years.
Not all buildings have somewhere difficult to get to.

Handy for a can of foam, then?


When chubb fitted real bells they had a special box specifically made to
stop expanding foam from getting in. They were the triangular ones. I
won't comment on what they did as they may still use them for all I know.

On 09/10/2019 15:04, Andrew wrote:
On 08/10/2019 22:10, ARW wrote:
On 08/10/2019 20:58, Andy Burns wrote:
ARW wrote:

Wait until cars that use batteries to drive them are knackered.
It's not £6 plus VAT for a new one then.

33 grand (oz dollars?) for a Leaf battery I hear ...

And the CO2 cost to make/replace them?




And the CO2 and other stuff when they catch fire :-)

Apparently some EU countries have special mobile tanks to
dump an entire Tesla car into and flood it, because those
Lithium batteries are sods to put out after a vehicle fire.

water of course makes it worse.

In article ,
dennis@home wrote:
And the CO2 and other stuff when they catch fire :-)

Apparently some EU countries have special mobile tanks to
dump an entire Tesla car into and flood it, because those
Lithium batteries are sods to put out after a vehicle fire.

water of course makes it worse.


And a full tank of petrol is safe as houses? ;-)

--
*See no evil, Hear no evil, Date no evil.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On 09/10/2019 13:50, Tim+ wrote:
dennis@home wrote:
On 09/10/2019 12:53, R D S wrote:
On 07/10/2019 05:30, Andy Burns wrote:

People seem to think this is normal/acceptable ...

Yep.

A housing estate was built around our small row of terraces about 12
years ago.

For whatever reason (Faulty? Windows open? Pets left in? Insensibly
placed sensors? Power outages?), I can't remember the last time I went
more than a few hours without hearing an alarm wail.

Sometimes just for a couple of minutes, sometimes all day/night.

Makes me dread summer.

If one sounds for more than 20 minutes you can get the council to
silence it, and bill the owner for doing so.

How will they silence it? Long ladder and a can of squirty foam?
Personally I dont think councils would put workers lives at risk (working
at height) just to deal with a self limiting nuisance. I could be wrong
though.

It is a requirement for owners of properties with alarms to register
them with the police and nominate two keyholders. Most people probably
don't, but report the alarm to the police and request that they contact
the keyholders. If it turns out (most likely) that they have not
nominated any, reporting a noise nuisance (not as a one off) to the
council and pointing out the lack of nominated keyholders may get them
to at least contact the owners and make threats of action.

SteveW