It's a while since I did domestic work.

So I was really looking forward to todays job which was domestic.

Well the customers fanny licker of a dog (it had been running around
uncontrolled and yapping for about 10 minutes) decided to bite me so I
said a very loud "OUCH". Customer makes no comment or ignores me and the
fanny licker runs around for a few more minutes before biting me again.

This time I hoof it with my steel toe tapped boot across the room, the
dog yelps and the customer starts to complain.

Customer wants me off offsite and threatens to call the police and
report me to the RSCPA. The MD arrives and assures the customer it was
not deliberate and that I had accidentally stood on the dogs paw.

The cheeky **** of a customer then asks the MD for a discount and about
10 seconds after him asking the fanny licker then bites the MD in full
view of the customer and the dog gets kicked across the room for the
second time in a half an hour.



--
Adam

ARW wrote

It's a while since I did domestic work.

So I was really looking forward to todays job which was domestic.

So you could **** SWMBO presumably.

Well the customers fanny licker of a dog (it had been running around
uncontrolled and yapping for about 10 minutes) decided to bite me

Because it twigged that you were gunna **** its owner.

so I said a very loud "OUCH". Customer makes no
comment or ignores me and the fanny licker runs
around for a few more minutes before biting me again.

This time I hoof it with my steel toe tapped boot across the
room, the dog yelps and the customer starts to complain.

There goes the ****.

Customer wants me off offsite and threatens to call the police and
report me to the RSCPA. The MD arrives and assures the customer it
was not deliberate and that I had accidentally stood on the dogs paw.

The cheeky **** of a customer then asks the MD for a discount
and about 10 seconds after him asking the fanny licker then
bites the MD in full view of the customer and the dog gets
kicked across the room for the second time in a half an hour.

So what happened next ?

On 22/08/2018 19:28, Rod Speed wrote:
ARW wrote
It's a while since I did domestic work.

So I was really looking forward to todays job which was domestic.

So you could **** SWMBO presumably.
Well the customers fanny licker of a dog (it had been running around
uncontrolled and yapping for about 10 minutes) decided to bite me

Because it twigged that you were gunna **** its owner.
so I said a very loud "OUCH". Customer makes no comment or ignores me
and the fanny licker runs around for a few more minutes before biting
me again.

This time I hoof it with my steel toe tapped boot across the room, the
dog yelps and the customer starts to complain.

There goes the ****.
Customer wants me off offsite and threatens to call the police and
report me to the RSCPA. The MD arrives and assures the customer it was
not deliberate and that I had accidentally stood on the dogs paw.

The cheeky **** of a customer then asks the MD for a discount and
about 10 seconds after him asking the fanny licker then bites the MD
in full view of the customer and the dog gets kicked across the room
for the second time in a half an hour.

So what happened next ?

we all smile ...

In article , ARW
writes
It's a while since I did domestic work.

So I was really looking forward to todays job which was domestic.

Well the customers fanny licker of a dog (it had been running around
uncontrolled and yapping for about 10 minutes) decided to bite me so I
said a very loud "OUCH". Customer makes no comment or ignores me and
the fanny licker runs around for a few more minutes before biting me
again.

This time I hoof it with my steel toe tapped boot across the room, the
dog yelps and the customer starts to complain.

Customer wants me off offsite and threatens to call the police and
report me to the RSCPA. The MD arrives and assures the customer it was
not deliberate and that I had accidentally stood on the dogs paw.

The cheeky **** of a customer then asks the MD for a discount and about
10 seconds after him asking the fanny licker then bites the MD in full
view of the customer and the dog gets kicked across the room for the
second time in a half an hour.



ROTFL
--
bert

On Wednesday, 22 August 2018 19:16:07 UTC+1, ARW wrote:
Well the customers fanny licker of a dog (it had been running around
uncontrolled and yapping for about 10 minutes) decided to bite me

Probably annoyed that you didn't have a fanny

Owain

On 22/08/2018 19:16, ARW wrote:
It's a while since I did domestic work.

So I was really looking forward to todays job which was domestic.

Well the customers fanny licker of a dog (it had been running around
uncontrolled and yapping for about 10 minutes) decided to bite me so I
said a very loud "OUCH". Customer makes no comment or ignores me and the
fanny licker runs around for a few more minutes before biting me again.

This time I hoof it with my steel toe tapped boot across the room, the
dog yelps and the customer starts to complain.

Customer wants me off offsite and threatens to call the police and
report me to the RSCPA. The MD arrives and assures the customer it was
not deliberate and that I had accidentally stood on the dogs paw.

The cheeky **** of a customer then asks the MD for a discount and about
10 seconds after him asking the fanny licker then bites the MD in full
view of the customer and the dog gets kicked across the room for the
second time in a half an hour.



Assuming you witnessed the dog bite the MD then a complaint to the
police seems a good idea. There are still too any people ignorant of
the fact the Dangerous Dogs law was extended to dogs on private
property. With a bit of luck the customer will get a visit from the
constabulary. And may even be inclined to offer suitable compensation
without the need for a letter before action.



--
Robin
reply-to address is (intended to be) valid

On Wednesday, 22 August 2018 21:33:08 UTC+1, Robin wrote:
On 22/08/2018 19:16, ARW wrote:
It's a while since I did domestic work.

So I was really looking forward to todays job which was domestic.

Well the customers fanny licker of a dog (it had been running around
uncontrolled and yapping for about 10 minutes) decided to bite me so I
said a very loud "OUCH". Customer makes no comment or ignores me and the
fanny licker runs around for a few more minutes before biting me again.

This time I hoof it with my steel toe tapped boot across the room, the
dog yelps and the customer starts to complain.

Customer wants me off offsite and threatens to call the police and
report me to the RSCPA. The MD arrives and assures the customer it was
not deliberate and that I had accidentally stood on the dogs paw.

The cheeky **** of a customer then asks the MD for a discount and about
10 seconds after him asking the fanny licker then bites the MD in full
view of the customer and the dog gets kicked across the room for the
second time in a half an hour.



Assuming you witnessed the dog bite the MD then a complaint to the
police seems a good idea. There are still too any people ignorant of
the fact the Dangerous Dogs law was extended to dogs on private
property. With a bit of luck the customer will get a visit from the
constabulary. And may even be inclined to offer suitable compensation
without the need for a letter before action.

Going that route is likely to result in the dog's death, which seems rather harsh. The problem is nearly always the owner, not the dog.


NT

On Wednesday, 22 August 2018 23:53:41 UTC+1, tabby wrote:
On Wednesday, 22 August 2018 21:33:08 UTC+1, Robin wrote:
On 22/08/2018 19:16, ARW wrote:
It's a while since I did domestic work.

So I was really looking forward to todays job which was domestic.

Well the customers fanny licker of a dog (it had been running around
uncontrolled and yapping for about 10 minutes) decided to bite me so I
said a very loud "OUCH". Customer makes no comment or ignores me and the
fanny licker runs around for a few more minutes before biting me again.

This time I hoof it with my steel toe tapped boot across the room, the
dog yelps and the customer starts to complain.

Customer wants me off offsite and threatens to call the police and
report me to the RSCPA. The MD arrives and assures the customer it was
not deliberate and that I had accidentally stood on the dogs paw.

The cheeky **** of a customer then asks the MD for a discount and about
10 seconds after him asking the fanny licker then bites the MD in full
view of the customer and the dog gets kicked across the room for the
second time in a half an hour.



Assuming you witnessed the dog bite the MD then a complaint to the
police seems a good idea. There are still too any people ignorant of
the fact the Dangerous Dogs law was extended to dogs on private
property. With a bit of luck the customer will get a visit from the
constabulary. And may even be inclined to offer suitable compensation
without the need for a letter before action.

Going that route is likely to result in the dog's death, which seems rather harsh. The problem is nearly always the owner, not the dog.


NT

Bill her for the callout & the medical expenses. Maybe point out that if she wants to make an issue of it dangerous dogs routinely get sentenced to death under the dangerous dogs act.

The thing about dogs is that they are pack animals and can be aggressive
toward interlopers who are not pack members. Most people would not let their
dogs loose when stranger are about.
Brian

--
----- --
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...

Blind user, so no pictures please
Note this Signature is meaningless.!
"ARW" wrote in message
...
It's a while since I did domestic work.

So I was really looking forward to todays job which was domestic.

Well the customers fanny licker of a dog (it had been running around
uncontrolled and yapping for about 10 minutes) decided to bite me so I
said a very loud "OUCH". Customer makes no comment or ignores me and the
fanny licker runs around for a few more minutes before biting me again.

This time I hoof it with my steel toe tapped boot across the room, the dog
yelps and the customer starts to complain.

Customer wants me off offsite and threatens to call the police and report
me to the RSCPA. The MD arrives and assures the customer it was not
deliberate and that I had accidentally stood on the dogs paw.

The cheeky **** of a customer then asks the MD for a discount and about 10
seconds after him asking the fanny licker then bites the MD in full view
of the customer and the dog gets kicked across the room for the second
time in a half an hour.



--
Adam

On Wednesday, 22 August 2018 23:53:41 UTC+1, wrote:
On Wednesday, 22 August 2018 21:33:08 UTC+1, Robin wrote:

Assuming you witnessed the dog bite the MD then a complaint to the
police seems a good idea. There are still too any people ignorant of
the fact the Dangerous Dogs law was extended to dogs on private
property. With a bit of luck the customer will get a visit from the
constabulary. And may even be inclined to offer suitable compensation
without the need for a letter before action.

Going that route is likely to result in the dog's death, which seems rather
harsh. The problem is nearly always the owner, not the dog.

However, beyond a certain point, the dog becomes essentially irredeemable as
you pretty much can't teach old dogs new tricks, and in particular you can't
unteach them their current ones. If it will attack an adult human, it's quite
likely to do a lot worse to a child - we've seem a fair number of cases over
recent years.

The world isn't short of dogs, so (while I'm actually something of a dog-lover)
I'm not particularly worried about having some of the excess removed.

On Wed, 22 Aug 2018 19:16:04 +0100, ARW wrote:

Well the customers fanny licker of a dog (it had been running around
uncontrolled and yapping for about 10 minutes) decided to bite me so I
said a very loud "OUCH". Customer makes no comment or ignores me and the
fanny licker runs around for a few more minutes before biting me again.

I'd have got the owner to remove the dog from the working area in the
first place, not safe for many reasons being bitten is just one of
them.

With no response from the owner after the first bite I'd have simply,
packed up, sat in the van, photographed the bite and called the boss.

Reporting to the Police may mean curtains for the dog, which is a bit
unfair. Nearly always badly behaved dogs are only badly behaved
because the owners don't take and hold the position of "pack leader"
from the point of view of the dog.

--
Cheers
Dave.

Brian Gaff wrote

The thing about dogs is that they are pack animals and can be aggressive
toward interlopers who are not pack members.

Most arent.

Most people would not let their dogs loose when stranger are about.

I always did. Corse one time the neighbour's kids thought
it was hilarious to have the patio door open only a slight
amount and sting him on the nose with rubber bands.

One of them discovered that that wasn’t a great approach
when the next time that stupid kid was sitting in a deep
armchair at my place and the ****ing great alsatian walked
up and bit him in the stomach. The stupid kid nearly died of
fright and wasn’t actually stupid enough to do that again.

"ARW" wrote in message
...
It's a while since I did domestic work.

So I was really looking forward to todays job which was domestic.

Well the customers fanny licker of a dog (it had been running around
uncontrolled and yapping for about 10 minutes) decided to bite me so I
said a very loud "OUCH". Customer makes no comment or ignores me and the
fanny licker runs around for a few more minutes before biting me again.

This time I hoof it with my steel toe tapped boot across the room, the
dog yelps and the customer starts to complain.

Customer wants me off offsite and threatens to call the police and report
me to the RSCPA. The MD arrives and assures the customer it was not
deliberate and that I had accidentally stood on the dogs paw.

The cheeky **** of a customer then asks the MD for a discount and about
10 seconds after him asking the fanny licker then bites the MD in full
view of the customer and the dog gets kicked across the room for the
second time in a half an hour.



--
Adam

wrote in message
...
On Wednesday, 22 August 2018 23:53:41 UTC+1, wrote:
On Wednesday, 22 August 2018 21:33:08 UTC+1, Robin wrote:

Assuming you witnessed the dog bite the MD then a complaint to the
police seems a good idea. There are still too any people ignorant of
the fact the Dangerous Dogs law was extended to dogs on private
property. With a bit of luck the customer will get a visit from the
constabulary. And may even be inclined to offer suitable compensation
without the need for a letter before action.

Going that route is likely to result in the dog's death, which seems
rather
harsh. The problem is nearly always the owner, not the dog.

However, beyond a certain point, the dog becomes essentially
irredeemable as you pretty much can't teach old dogs new tricks,
and in particular you can't unteach them their current ones.

But it isnt hard to shut it up in a room when someone like Adam shows up.

If it will attack an adult human, it's quite likely to do a lot worse to a
child

But if kids dont visit, unlikely to be a problem.

- we've seem a fair number of cases over recent years.

Yep, and some dead kids too. But that unlikely if its
a small dog that can be kicked across the room, twice.

The world isn't short of dogs, so (while I'm actually something of a
dog-lover)
I'm not particularly worried about having some of the excess removed.

The owner might well be tho.

On Thu, 23 Aug 2018 19:27:28 +1000, cantankerous senile geezer Rot Speed
blabbered, again:

One of them discovered that that wasn¢t a great approach
when the next time that stupid kid was sitting in a deep
armchair at my place and the ****ing great alsatian walked
up and bit him in the stomach. The stupid kid nearly died of
fright and wasn¢t actually stupid enough to do that again.

Sure sounds like your dogs are as much of a pest as their senile
cantankerous master, Rot!

--
Sqwertz to Rot Speed:
"This is just a hunch, but I'm betting you're kinda an argumentative
asshole.
MID:

On Thu, 23 Aug 2018 09:18:27 +0100 (BST), "Dave Liquorice"
wrote:

On Wed, 22 Aug 2018 19:16:04 +0100, ARW wrote:

Well the customers fanny licker of a dog (it had been running around
uncontrolled and yapping for about 10 minutes) decided to bite me so I
said a very loud "OUCH". Customer makes no comment or ignores me and the
fanny licker runs around for a few more minutes before biting me again.

I'd have got the owner to remove the dog from the working area in the
first place,

Agreed, even if the dog was highly unlikely to have bitten anyone
(none of ours ever would) you don't know if the person themselves
likes dogs, wants the dog under their feet or it may be dangerous for
the dog (bare wires, blowlamps, sharps saws etc).

not safe for many reasons being bitten is just one of
them.

Quite.


With no response from the owner after the first bite I'd have simply,
packed up, sat in the van, photographed the bite and called the boss.

I guess that depends if it was 'a bite' (as in an attack) or 'a nip'
as in 'I'm not sure if you are a friend in my house'? I know it
wouldn't make much difference legally but might to most people.

As an aside, daughter is a part time animal warden and is often
collecting all sorts of animals (dead, alive and injured) and the
other day collected a dog that was fundamentally 'gentle' but because
it was both injured (only internal bruising as it turns out) and
frightened, softly bit her on her hand as she was getting the dog in
the van a warning that is was in pain.

Reporting to the Police may mean curtains for the dog, which is a bit
unfair.

Potentially unfair on the dog.

Nearly always badly behaved dogs are only badly behaved
because the owners don't take and hold the position of "pack leader"
from the point of view of the dog.

Agreed.

For all our dogs, if someone came to the door, simple instructions
like 'stay' or 'in your bed' was all it took to remind them I was
there, I was aware someone was at the door and that it was ok.

If we knew the people and that they liked dogs, I knew the dogs knew
them and it was appropriate, I would let the dogs greet them. If it
wasn't I would remind the dogs to stay where they were (like if the
visitors had brought in food etc).


Cheers, T i m

On Thursday, 23 August 2018 11:06:10 UTC+1, Peeler wrote:
On Thu, 23 Aug 2018 19:27:28 +1000, cantankerous senile geezer Rot Speed
blabbered, again:

One of them discovered that that wasnt a great approach
when the next time that stupid kid was sitting in a deep
armchair at my place and the ****ing great alsatian walked
up and bit him in the stomach. The stupid kid nearly died of
fright and wasnt actually stupid enough to do that again.

Sure sounds like your dogs are as much of a pest as their senile
cantankerous master, Rot!


Not that you'd reply to him or them of course.

On Thursday, 23 August 2018 09:17:15 UTC+1, wrote:
On Wednesday, 22 August 2018 23:53:41 UTC+1, tabby wrote:
On Wednesday, 22 August 2018 21:33:08 UTC+1, Robin wrote:

Assuming you witnessed the dog bite the MD then a complaint to the
police seems a good idea. There are still too any people ignorant of
the fact the Dangerous Dogs law was extended to dogs on private
property. With a bit of luck the customer will get a visit from the
constabulary. And may even be inclined to offer suitable compensation
without the need for a letter before action.

Going that route is likely to result in the dog's death, which seems rather
harsh. The problem is nearly always the owner, not the dog.

However, beyond a certain point, the dog becomes essentially irredeemable as
you pretty much can't teach old dogs new tricks, and in particular you can't
unteach them their current ones.

their ways can be changed, but only if you remove them from the problem human or teach the problem human some sense. Generally neither of those happens.


If it will attack an adult human, it's quite
likely to do a lot worse to a child - we've seem a fair number of cases over
recent years.

The world isn't short of dogs, so (while I'm actually something of a dog-lover)
I'm not particularly worried about having some of the excess removed.

Dangerous dogs can be safe IF handled correctly. An example is police attack dogs, trained to attack people but don't kill people or attack the officers.


NT

On 22/08/2018 19:16, ARW wrote:
It's a while since I did domestic work.

So I was really looking forward to todays job which was domestic.

Earning brownie points for a GF reconciliation :-) ?

How did you get home ?.

On 22/08/2018 23:53, wrote:
On Wednesday, 22 August 2018 21:33:08 UTC+1, Robin wrote:
On 22/08/2018 19:16, ARW wrote:
It's a while since I did domestic work.

So I was really looking forward to todays job which was domestic.

Well the customers fanny licker of a dog (it had been running around
uncontrolled and yapping for about 10 minutes) decided to bite me so I
said a very loud "OUCH". Customer makes no comment or ignores me and the
fanny licker runs around for a few more minutes before biting me again.

This time I hoof it with my steel toe tapped boot across the room, the
dog yelps and the customer starts to complain.

Customer wants me off offsite and threatens to call the police and
report me to the RSCPA. The MD arrives and assures the customer it was
not deliberate and that I had accidentally stood on the dogs paw.

The cheeky **** of a customer then asks the MD for a discount and about
10 seconds after him asking the fanny licker then bites the MD in full
view of the customer and the dog gets kicked across the room for the
second time in a half an hour.



Assuming you witnessed the dog bite the MD then a complaint to the
police seems a good idea. There are still too any people ignorant of
the fact the Dangerous Dogs law was extended to dogs on private
property. With a bit of luck the customer will get a visit from the
constabulary. And may even be inclined to offer suitable compensation
without the need for a letter before action.

Going that route is likely to result in the dog's death, which seems rather harsh. The problem is nearly always the owner, not the dog.


NT


OK, save the dog, cull the owner.

On 23/08/2018 09:17, wrote:
as
you pretty much can't teach old dogs new tricks, and in particular you can't
unteach them their current ones.

I wonder how many 'tradesmen' that comment applies to as well ?.

On 22/08/2018 21:17, wrote:

Probably annoyed that you didn't have a fanny

Strnge... Adam's usually got an apprentice in tow.

On 23/08/2018 12:46, wrote:

However, beyond a certain point, the dog becomes essentially irredeemable as
you pretty much can't teach old dogs new tricks, and in particular you can't
unteach them their current ones.

their ways can be changed, but only if you remove them from the problem human or teach the problem human some sense. Generally neither of those happens.

Wholeheartedly agree. People are always the issue. Always expecting dogs
to act and understand "human" It's humans that need to act and become
"dog" The amount of people that think just because someone's owned a
dog should read "been owned by a dog" in the past makes then an
authority on dogs... and stupid people that see size of dog as the issue
letting small dogs get away with dominant, possessive, aggressive
behaviour because they don't see it for what it actually is.

Dangerous dogs can be safe IF handled correctly. An example is police attack dogs, trained to attack people but don't kill people or attack the officers.

My mate had a GSD that failed Police training because it couldn't clear
the highest obstacle. It had had it's teeth filed to give them flat
tops but the surprise that they found out by accident was when someone
pulled out a toy gun and the dog jumped and grabbed the gun. Did it
every time without fail.

All dogs can be re-calibrated given the correct leader unless they have
underlying medical issues, people on the other hand let emotion get in
the way thereby creating a pathetic, weak and feeble pack member that
Dog will instinctively need to take over the role as "pack leader"
generally without any leadership qualities that would be learnt from
early pack life.

On Thu, 23 Aug 2018 14:38:27 +0100, "www.GymRatZ.co.uk"
wrote:

On 23/08/2018 12:46, wrote:

However, beyond a certain point, the dog becomes essentially irredeemable as
you pretty much can't teach old dogs new tricks, and in particular you can't
unteach them their current ones.

their ways can be changed, but only if you remove them from the problem human or teach the problem human some sense. Generally neither of those happens.

Wholeheartedly agree. People are always the issue. Always expecting dogs
to act and understand "human" It's humans that need to act and become
"dog" The amount of people that think just because someone's owned a
dog should read "been owned by a dog" in the past makes then an
authority on dogs... and stupid people that see size of dog as the issue
letting small dogs get away with dominant, possessive, aggressive
behaviour because they don't see it for what it actually is.

Dangerous dogs can be safe IF handled correctly. An example is police attack dogs, trained to attack people but don't kill people or attack the officers.

My mate had a GSD that failed Police training because it couldn't clear
the highest obstacle. It had had it's teeth filed to give them flat
tops but the surprise that they found out by accident was when someone
pulled out a toy gun and the dog jumped and grabbed the gun. Did it
every time without fail.

All dogs can be re-calibrated given the correct leader unless they have
underlying medical issues, people on the other hand let emotion get in
the way thereby creating a pathetic, weak and feeble pack member that
Dog will instinctively need to take over the role as "pack leader"
generally without any leadership qualities that would be learnt from
early pack life.


+1

I only had to look at our dogs for them to 'get' my mood or desired
intention and trained them so with reward and understanding.

That said, dogs do differ and some are more trainable than others (for
the same level of input).

My whippet terrier would sit instantly just if I got her attention and
raised a finger and would jump from the floor into my arms with a
equally simple instruction. She was rarely on the lead, would walk to
heel or run free if you told her (but would always stay within ear or
eye shot).

She would hang in the air from a 'puller' but never bit anyone (only
cats that were in her garden). ;-)

She was what we called a 'with you' dog. It didn't matter what you
were doing (or the weather) she would want to be with you doing it
(where possible / practical).

Just what a companion animal is all about of course. ;-)


Cheers, T i m

On Thursday, 23 August 2018 14:38:34 UTC+1, www.GymRatZ.co.uk wrote:
On 23/08/2018 12:46, tabbypurr wrote:
someone:

However, beyond a certain point, the dog becomes essentially irredeemable as
you pretty much can't teach old dogs new tricks, and in particular you can't
unteach them their current ones.

their ways can be changed, but only if you remove them from the problem human or teach the problem human some sense. Generally neither of those happens.

Wholeheartedly agree. People are always the issue. Always expecting dogs
to act and understand "human" It's humans that need to act and become
"dog" The amount of people that think just because someone's owned a
dog should read "been owned by a dog" in the past makes then an
authority on dogs... and stupid people that see size of dog as the issue
letting small dogs get away with dominant, possessive, aggressive
behaviour because they don't see it for what it actually is.

Dangerous dogs can be safe IF handled correctly. An example is police attack dogs, trained to attack people but don't kill people or attack the officers.

My mate had a GSD that failed Police training because it couldn't clear
the highest obstacle. It had had it's teeth filed to give them flat
tops but the surprise that they found out by accident was when someone
pulled out a toy gun and the dog jumped and grabbed the gun. Did it
every time without fail.

All dogs can be re-calibrated given the correct leader unless they have
underlying medical issues, people on the other hand let emotion get in
the way thereby creating a pathetic, weak and feeble pack member that
Dog will instinctively need to take over the role as "pack leader"
generally without any leadership qualities that would be learnt from
early pack life.

Dogs have a certain mentality that the human needs to understand. Lots of people want dogs to be something else: they're not, they're dogs, and nothing ever changes their mentality. It's just how they are.

IMLE small dogs are the most aggressive. I guess they have to be to survive in the wild.


NT

On Thursday, 23 August 2018 15:47:37 UTC+1, wrote:
On Thursday, 23 August 2018 14:38:34 UTC+1, www.GymRatZ.co.uk wrote:
On 23/08/2018 12:46, tabbypurr wrote:
someone:

However, beyond a certain point, the dog becomes essentially irredeemable as
you pretty much can't teach old dogs new tricks, and in particular you can't
unteach them their current ones.

their ways can be changed, but only if you remove them from the problem human or teach the problem human some sense. Generally neither of those happens.

Wholeheartedly agree. People are always the issue. Always expecting dogs
to act and understand "human" It's humans that need to act and become
"dog" The amount of people that think just because someone's owned a
dog should read "been owned by a dog" in the past makes then an
authority on dogs... and stupid people that see size of dog as the issue
letting small dogs get away with dominant, possessive, aggressive
behaviour because they don't see it for what it actually is.

Dangerous dogs can be safe IF handled correctly. An example is police attack dogs, trained to attack people but don't kill people or attack the officers.

My mate had a GSD that failed Police training because it couldn't clear
the highest obstacle. It had had it's teeth filed to give them flat
tops but the surprise that they found out by accident was when someone
pulled out a toy gun and the dog jumped and grabbed the gun. Did it
every time without fail.

All dogs can be re-calibrated given the correct leader unless they have
underlying medical issues, people on the other hand let emotion get in
the way thereby creating a pathetic, weak and feeble pack member that
Dog will instinctively need to take over the role as "pack leader"
generally without any leadership qualities that would be learnt from
early pack life.

Dogs have a certain mentality that the human needs to understand.

It's eeven more so with cats, dogs have had 10s of thousands of years with humans cats just a few thousand.
Dogs empathise with humans, they tend to do what the humans want, which is why they are far more easy to train than cats are. Most cats train their humans.


Lots of people want dogs to be something else: they're not, they're dogs, and nothing ever changes their mentality. It's just how they are.

But it is easier to control their behavoiur good or bad.
Also differnt breeds behave differntly and are differnt in more than just their physical appeance.
One thing I heard recently is that small dogs tend to raise their leg higher when ****ing to mark their territory, so other dogs think they are taller.
While tall dogs don't bother to outsize each other.

This was discovered by someone carful watching dogs of differnt sizes taking a **** and measuring the angle the leg was raised against the post or wall.
Note it doesn't mean the **** goes higher just that the dog tries to make it go higher. So before someone like wodney says a terrier can never **** higher than a great dane is NOT the point from the dogs perspective.

Also that the original dogs in/from the USA died out when Britain and the like settled in the USA with our dog breeds all native dogs died, so there;s no trruely american dog breeds.



IMLE small dogs are the most aggressive. I guess they have to be to survive in the wild.

Not sure what you mean by in the wild.



NT

On Thu, 23 Aug 2018 03:49:14 -0700 (PDT), whisky-dave, obviously a
completely senile idiot, blathered:


Sure sounds like your dogs are as much of a pest as their senile
cantankerous master, Rot!


Not that you'd reply to him or them of course.

Point out ONE example where I fed a troll the way you consistently keep
doing, you braindamaged senile idiot! tsk

On Thu, 23 Aug 2018 08:23:25 -0700 (PDT), whisky-dave wrote:

It's eeven more so with cats, dogs have had 10s of thousands of years
with humans cats just a few thousand. Dogs empathise with humans, they
tend to do what the humans want,

Only if the humans take on and maintain a dominant role in "the pack"
of humans and dogs. A dog will do what it wants with any human it
feels is "below" them in the pack.

which is why they are far more easy to train than cats are.

Cats don't have a pack structure, they are semi social but within the
group are far more individualistic than dogs.

Most cats train their humans.

Yep.

--
Cheers
Dave.

On 23/08/2018 12:48, Andrew wrote:
On 22/08/2018 19:16, ARW wrote:
It's a while since I did domestic work.

So I was really looking forward to todays job which was domestic.

Earning brownie points for a GF reconciliation :-)Â* ?

How did you get home ?.

On the Friday I got a lift with the the landlord of one of the pubs to
Normanton and then caught the train home from there.

--
Adam

In article 6b50ab5b-a72d-4c50-82c1-ffc3716aed19
@googlegroups.com, says...

Dogs empathise with humans, they tend to do what the humans want, which is why they are far more easy to train than cats are. Most cats train their humans.

Dogs have owners, cats have staff.


--

Terry

---
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
https://www.avg.com

On 22/08/2018 21:33, Robin wrote:
On 22/08/2018 19:16, ARW wrote:
It's a while since I did domestic work.

So I was really looking forward to todays job which was domestic.

Well the customers fanny licker of a dog (it had been running around
uncontrolled and yapping for about 10 minutes) decided to bite me so I
said a very loud "OUCH". Customer makes no comment or ignores me and
the fanny licker runs around for a few more minutes before biting me
again.

This time I hoof it with my steel toe tapped boot across the room, the
dog yelps and the customer starts to complain.

Customer wants me off offsite and threatens to call the police and
report me to the RSCPA. The MD arrives and assures the customer it was
not deliberate and that I had accidentally stood on the dogs paw.

The cheeky **** of a customer then asks the MD for a discount and
about 10 seconds after him asking the fanny licker then bites the MD
in full view of the customer and the dog gets kicked across the room
for the second time in a half an hour.



Assuming you witnessed the dog bite the MD then a complaint to the
police seems a good idea.Â* There are still too any people ignorant of
the fact the Dangerous Dogs law was extended to dogs on private
property.Â* With a bit of luck the customer will get a visit from the
constabulary.Â* And may even be inclined to offer suitable compensation
without the need for a letter before action.



It's only a fanny licker bite.

I have more damage done to my skin when play fighting with the cat.


--
Adam

The world isn't short of dogs, so (while I'm actually something of a dog-lover)
I'm not particularly worried about having some of the excess removed.


I've always wondered; do you dog-lovers use s lubricant, or isn't it necessary?

On 23/08/2018 15:29, T i m wrote:
On Thu, 23 Aug 2018 14:38:27 +0100, "www.GymRatZ.co.uk"
wrote:

On 23/08/2018 12:46, wrote:

However, beyond a certain point, the dog becomes essentially irredeemable as
you pretty much can't teach old dogs new tricks, and in particular you can't
unteach them their current ones.

their ways can be changed, but only if you remove them from the problem human or teach the problem human some sense. Generally neither of those happens.

Wholeheartedly agree. People are always the issue. Always expecting dogs
to act and understand "human" It's humans that need to act and become
"dog" The amount of people that think just because someone's owned a
dog should read "been owned by a dog" in the past makes then an
authority on dogs... and stupid people that see size of dog as the issue
letting small dogs get away with dominant, possessive, aggressive
behaviour because they don't see it for what it actually is.

Dangerous dogs can be safe IF handled correctly. An example is police attack dogs, trained to attack people but don't kill people or attack the officers.

My mate had a GSD that failed Police training because it couldn't clear
the highest obstacle. It had had it's teeth filed to give them flat
tops but the surprise that they found out by accident was when someone
pulled out a toy gun and the dog jumped and grabbed the gun. Did it
every time without fail.

All dogs can be re-calibrated given the correct leader unless they have
underlying medical issues, people on the other hand let emotion get in
the way thereby creating a pathetic, weak and feeble pack member that
Dog will instinctively need to take over the role as "pack leader"
generally without any leadership qualities that would be learnt from
early pack life.


+1

I only had to look at our dogs for them to 'get' my mood or desired
intention and trained them so with reward and understanding.

That said, dogs do differ and some are more trainable than others (for
the same level of input).

My whippet terrier would sit instantly just if I got her attention and
raised a finger and would jump from the floor into my arms with a
equally simple instruction. She was rarely on the lead, would walk to
heel or run free if you told her (but would always stay within ear or
eye shot).

She would hang in the air from a 'puller' but never bit anyone (only
cats that were in her garden). ;-)

She was what we called a 'with you' dog. It didn't matter what you
were doing (or the weather) she would want to be with you doing it
(where possible / practical).

Just what a companion animal is all about of course. ;-)


When I had dogs one of the first things I liked to train them to do was
walk at heel, sit and stay. I could then take the dog on my paper round
without having to use a lead.


--
Adam

"T i m" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 23 Aug 2018 09:18:27 +0100 (BST), "Dave Liquorice"
wrote:

On Wed, 22 Aug 2018 19:16:04 +0100, ARW wrote:

Well the customers fanny licker of a dog (it had been running around
uncontrolled and yapping for about 10 minutes) decided to bite me so I
said a very loud "OUCH". Customer makes no comment or ignores me and the
fanny licker runs around for a few more minutes before biting me again.

I'd have got the owner to remove the dog from the working area in the
first place,

Agreed, even if the dog was highly unlikely to have bitten anyone
(none of ours ever would) you don't know if the person themselves
likes dogs, wants the dog under their feet or it may be dangerous for
the dog (bare wires, blowlamps, sharps saws etc).

not safe for many reasons being bitten is just one of
them.

Quite.


With no response from the owner after the first bite I'd have simply,
packed up, sat in the van, photographed the bite and called the boss.

I guess that depends if it was 'a bite' (as in an attack) or 'a nip'
as in 'I'm not sure if you are a friend in my house'? I know it
wouldn't make much difference legally but might to most people.

As an aside, daughter is a part time animal warden and is often
collecting all sorts of animals (dead, alive and injured) and the
other day collected a dog that was fundamentally 'gentle' but because
it was both injured (only internal bruising as it turns out) and
frightened, softly bit her on her hand as she was getting the dog in
the van a warning that is was in pain.

Reporting to the Police may mean curtains for the dog, which is a bit
unfair.

Potentially unfair on the dog.

Nearly always badly behaved dogs are only badly behaved
because the owners don't take and hold the position of "pack leader"
from the point of view of the dog.

Agreed.

For all our dogs, if someone came to the door, simple instructions
like 'stay' or 'in your bed' was all it took to remind them I was
there, I was aware someone was at the door and that it was ok.

If we knew the people and that they liked dogs, I knew the dogs knew
them and it was appropriate, I would let the dogs greet them. If it
wasn't I would remind the dogs to stay where they were (like if the
visitors had brought in food etc).

Stupid approach. I never do anything special. Mine was keen on
greeting people it knew well with a nip on the visitor's cheek and
did that to me too. Could be a bit of a surprise with a ****ing
great alsatian. Trouble was that it was very hard to predict
when he would decide that they were a well known visitor.

Even odder, when out for a walk, never ever on a lead, he
would just ignore anyone who tried to call him over to pat him
and just keep doing his usual sniffing of everything in sight.

wrote in message
...
On Thursday, 23 August 2018 09:17:15 UTC+1, wrote:
On Wednesday, 22 August 2018 23:53:41 UTC+1, tabby wrote:
On Wednesday, 22 August 2018 21:33:08 UTC+1, Robin wrote:

Assuming you witnessed the dog bite the MD then a complaint to the
police seems a good idea. There are still too any people ignorant of
the fact the Dangerous Dogs law was extended to dogs on private
property. With a bit of luck the customer will get a visit from the
constabulary. And may even be inclined to offer suitable
compensation
without the need for a letter before action.

Going that route is likely to result in the dog's death, which seems
rather
harsh. The problem is nearly always the owner, not the dog.

However, beyond a certain point, the dog becomes essentially irredeemable
as
you pretty much can't teach old dogs new tricks, and in particular you
can't
unteach them their current ones.

their ways can be changed,

They can indeed and that yankee dog trainer Cesar Millan on
reality TV is shown doing it very effectively indeed with most dogs.

**** google is one hell of a resource now. I couldnt
remember his name and again first hit with google.

but only if you remove them from the problem human

Thats bull****, he does it with the problem human all the time.

or teach the problem human some sense.

Ditto.

Generally neither of those happens.

It does with the best of the dog trainers.

If it will attack an adult human, it's quite
likely to do a lot worse to a child - we've seem a fair number of cases
over
recent years.

The world isn't short of dogs, so (while I'm actually something of a
dog-lover)
I'm not particularly worried about having some of the excess removed.

Dangerous dogs can be safe IF handled correctly.

Yeah, saw one hell of a dog at a garage sale. His master was a young
girl who must have been about 8, did exactly what he was told,
going bananas at the visitors before she told it to behave.

An example is police attack dogs, trained to attack
people but don't kill people or attack the officers.

wrote in message
...
On Thursday, 23 August 2018 14:38:34 UTC+1, www.GymRatZ.co.uk wrote:
On 23/08/2018 12:46, tabbypurr wrote:
someone:

However, beyond a certain point, the dog becomes essentially
irredeemable as
you pretty much can't teach old dogs new tricks, and in particular you
can't
unteach them their current ones.

their ways can be changed, but only if you remove them from the problem
human or teach the problem human some sense. Generally neither of those
happens.

Wholeheartedly agree. People are always the issue. Always expecting dogs
to act and understand "human" It's humans that need to act and become
"dog" The amount of people that think just because someone's owned a
dog should read "been owned by a dog" in the past makes then an
authority on dogs... and stupid people that see size of dog as the issue
letting small dogs get away with dominant, possessive, aggressive
behaviour because they don't see it for what it actually is.

Dangerous dogs can be safe IF handled correctly. An example is police
attack dogs, trained to attack people but don't kill people or attack
the officers.

My mate had a GSD that failed Police training because it couldn't clear
the highest obstacle. It had had it's teeth filed to give them flat
tops but the surprise that they found out by accident was when someone
pulled out a toy gun and the dog jumped and grabbed the gun. Did it
every time without fail.

All dogs can be re-calibrated given the correct leader unless they have
underlying medical issues, people on the other hand let emotion get in
the way thereby creating a pathetic, weak and feeble pack member that
Dog will instinctively need to take over the role as "pack leader"
generally without any leadership qualities that would be learnt from
early pack life.

Dogs have a certain mentality that the human needs to understand. Lots of
people want dogs to be something else: they're not, they're dogs, and
nothing ever changes their mentality. It's just how they are.

IMLE small dogs are the most aggressive.

Thats not true of the worst of the breeds
that have been bred to be very aggressive.

I guess they have to be to survive in the wild.

Dog behaviour is much more about
the breed, what they have been bred for.

"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Thursday, 23 August 2018 15:47:37 UTC+1, wrote:
On Thursday, 23 August 2018 14:38:34 UTC+1, www.GymRatZ.co.uk wrote:
On 23/08/2018 12:46, tabbypurr wrote:
someone:

However, beyond a certain point, the dog becomes essentially
irredeemable as
you pretty much can't teach old dogs new tricks, and in particular
you can't
unteach them their current ones.

their ways can be changed, but only if you remove them from the
problem human or teach the problem human some sense. Generally
neither of those happens.

Wholeheartedly agree. People are always the issue. Always expecting
dogs
to act and understand "human" It's humans that need to act and become
"dog" The amount of people that think just because someone's owned a
dog should read "been owned by a dog" in the past makes then an
authority on dogs... and stupid people that see size of dog as the
issue
letting small dogs get away with dominant, possessive, aggressive
behaviour because they don't see it for what it actually is.

Dangerous dogs can be safe IF handled correctly. An example is police
attack dogs, trained to attack people but don't kill people or attack
the officers.

My mate had a GSD that failed Police training because it couldn't clear
the highest obstacle. It had had it's teeth filed to give them flat
tops but the surprise that they found out by accident was when someone
pulled out a toy gun and the dog jumped and grabbed the gun. Did it
every time without fail.

All dogs can be re-calibrated given the correct leader unless they have
underlying medical issues, people on the other hand let emotion get in
the way thereby creating a pathetic, weak and feeble pack member that
Dog will instinctively need to take over the role as "pack leader"
generally without any leadership qualities that would be learnt from
early pack life.

Dogs have a certain mentality that the human needs to understand.

It's eeven more so with cats, dogs have had 10s of thousands of years with
humans cats just a few thousand.
Dogs empathise with humans, they tend to do what the humans want, which is
why they are far more easy to train than cats are. Most cats train their
humans.


Lots of people want dogs to be something else: they're not, they're dogs,
and nothing ever changes their mentality. It's just how they are.

But it is easier to control their behavoiur good or bad.
Also differnt breeds behave differntly and are differnt in more than just
their physical appeance.
One thing I heard recently is that small dogs tend to raise their leg
higher when ****ing to mark their territory, so other dogs think they are
taller.
While tall dogs don't bother to outsize each other.

This was discovered by someone carful watching dogs of differnt sizes
taking a **** and measuring the angle the leg was raised against the post
or wall.
Note it doesn't mean the **** goes higher just that the dog tries to make
it go higher. So before someone like wodney says a terrier can never ****
higher than a great dane is NOT the point from the dogs perspective.

Also that the original dogs in/from the USA died out when Britain and the
like settled in the USA with our dog breeds all native dogs died, so
there;s no trruely american dog breeds.



IMLE small dogs are the most aggressive. I guess they have to be to
survive in the wild.

Not sure what you mean by in the wild.

Yeah, thats a massive brain fart. There were no small
dogs in the wild, before they were bred by humans.

"Terry Casey" wrote in message
...
In article 6b50ab5b-a72d-4c50-82c1-ffc3716aed19
@googlegroups.com, says...

Dogs empathise with humans, they tend to do what the humans want, which
is why they are far more easy to train than cats are. Most cats train
their humans.

Dogs have owners, cats have staff.

Dogs come when they are called. Cats have answering machines.

On 23/08/2018 09:17, wrote:
On Wednesday, 22 August 2018 23:53:41 UTC+1, wrote:
On Wednesday, 22 August 2018 21:33:08 UTC+1, Robin wrote:

Assuming you witnessed the dog bite the MD then a complaint to the
police seems a good idea. There are still too any people ignorant of
the fact the Dangerous Dogs law was extended to dogs on private
property. With a bit of luck the customer will get a visit from the
constabulary. And may even be inclined to offer suitable compensation
without the need for a letter before action.

Going that route is likely to result in the dog's death, which seems rather
harsh. The problem is nearly always the owner, not the dog.

However, beyond a certain point, the dog becomes essentially irredeemable as
you pretty much can't teach old dogs new tricks, and in particular you can't
unteach them their current ones. If it will attack an adult human, it's quite
likely to do a lot worse to a child - we've seem a fair number of cases over
recent years.

The world isn't short of dogs, so (while I'm actually something of a dog-lover)
I'm not particularly worried about having some of the excess removed.


https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/newsbeat-45085514

--
Adam

On Fri, 24 Aug 2018 04:50:37 +1000, cantankerous senile geezer Rot Speed
blabbered, again:

FLUSH the sick senile idiot's usual sick senile BULL**** unread again

So, at what time did you get up TODAY, you senile cretin? At FOUR o'clock?
You HAVE to, right? It's the ONLY way for you to cope with it that NO ONE in
real is talking to you self-opinionated senile wisenheimer! LOL

--
Bill Wright to Rot Speed:
"That confirms my opinion that you are a despicable little ****."
MID:

On Fri, 24 Aug 2018 05:23:34 +1000, cantankerous senile geezer Rot Speed
blabbered, again:


IMLE small dogs are the most aggressive. I guess they have to be to
survive in the wild.

Not sure what you mean by in the wild.

Yeah, that¢s a massive brain fart. There were no small
dogs in the wild, before they were bred by humans.

Actually, there were and there still are! Just HOW retarded are you,
Ozzietard?

--
dennis@home to know-it-all Rot Speed:
"You really should stop commenting on things you know nothing about."
Message-ID: