https://www.jihadwatch.org/2016/09/g...c-state-attack

Nope, it is doing nothing of the sort, bigot boy.

harry wrote

https://www.jihadwatch.org/2016/09/g...c-state-attack

On 09-Sep-16 7:16 AM, harry wrote:
https://www.jihadwatch.org/2016/09/g...c-state-attack


'The countrys armed forces will hold joint drills with police early
next year, officials confirmed.'

If that is martial law, we have been under martial law for about the
last half century.

--
--

Colin Bignell

On 09/09/16 07:16, harry wrote:
https://www.jihadwatch.org/2016/09/g...c-state-attack

Harry still trying to spread the word of the criminal and racist right
wing. The author of this one, American loony Robert Spencer, due to
speak at an English Defence League march was banned from entering the UK
by Teresa May. And still is.

To right wing even for the right wing? Get out of here with your
extremist crap Harry.

TW

On 09/09/16 09:39, Nightjar wrote:
On 09-Sep-16 7:16 AM, harry wrote:
https://www.jihadwatch.org/2016/09/g...c-state-attack



'The countrys armed forces will hold joint drills with police early
next year, officials confirmed.'

If that is martial law, we have been under martial law for about the
last half century.

I see the state education system has let you down again. and you are
unable to distinguish between the bottom of the hole, being half way
down, or being halfway down and moving further...

Or was your straw man deliberate?

--
"When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign,
that the dunces are all in confederacy against him."

Jonathan Swift.

On 09/09/16 10:04, TimW wrote:
On 09/09/16 07:16, harry wrote:
https://www.jihadwatch.org/2016/09/g...c-state-attack


Harry still trying to spread the word of the criminal and racist right
wing. The author of this one, American loony Robert Spencer, due to
speak at an English Defence League march was banned from entering the UK
by Teresa May. And still is.

To right wing even for the right wing? Get out of here with your
extremist crap Harry.

TW
Harry isn't extremist. You should get out more. There's a lot weirder
opinions than that out there.

Neither is he particularly right wing. Indeed extremist right wing is
largely an invention of the left


To challenge the view that all change is for the better, is to be
labelled as extremist right wing, these days.

--
"What do you think about Gay Marriage?"
"I don't."
"Don't what?"
"Think about Gay Marriage."

On 09-Sep-16 10:12 AM, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
....
I see the state education system has let you down again. and you are
unable to distinguish between the bottom of the hole, being half way
down, or being halfway down and moving further...
....

Did that actually make sense to you when you wrote it?


--
--

Colin Bignell

On 09/09/16 10:21, Nightjar wrote:
On 09-Sep-16 10:12 AM, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
....
I see the state education system has let you down again. and you are
unable to distinguish between the bottom of the hole, being half way
down, or being halfway down and moving further...
....

Did that actually make sense to you when you wrote it?


yes, and it still does.

I see the sate education system has let you down again....

--
Those who want slavery should have the grace to name it by its proper
name. They must face the full meaning of that which they are advocating
or condoning; the full, exact, specific meaning of collectivism, of its
logical implications, of the principles upon which it is based, and of
the ultimate consequences to which these principles will lead. They must
face it, then decide whether this is what they want or not.

Ayn Rand.

On 09/09/2016 10:20, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 09/09/16 10:04, TimW wrote:
On 09/09/16 07:16, harry wrote:
https://www.jihadwatch.org/2016/09/g...c-state-attack



Harry still trying to spread the word of the criminal and racist right
wing. The author of this one, American loony Robert Spencer, due to
speak at an English Defence League march was banned from entering the UK
by Teresa May. And still is.

To right wing even for the right wing? Get out of here with your
extremist crap Harry.

TW
Harry isn't extremist. You should get out more. There's a lot weirder
opinions than that out there.

Neither is he particularly right wing. Indeed extremist right wing is
largely an invention of the left


To challenge the view that all change is for the better, is to be
labelled as extremist right wing, these days.

Most left wing seem to forget that Hitler was a socialist.

On 09/09/2016 10:25, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 09/09/16 10:21, Nightjar wrote:
On 09-Sep-16 10:12 AM, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
....
I see the state education system has let you down again. and you are
unable to distinguish between the bottom of the hole, being half way
down, or being halfway down and moving further...
....

Did that actually make sense to you when you wrote it?


yes, and it still does.

I see the sate education system has let you down again....

I think it has let many down.

It does seem strange when someone points out an undeniable fact, that
can only be a result of the education system.

Are you suggesting the education system should teach people to ignore
simple facts involving police and armed forces?

Fredxxx wrote:
On 09/09/2016 10:20, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 09/09/16 10:04, TimW wrote:
On 09/09/16 07:16, harry wrote:
https://www.jihadwatch.org/2016/09/g...c-state-attack




Harry still trying to spread the word of the criminal and racist right
wing. The author of this one, American loony Robert Spencer, due to
speak at an English Defence League march was banned from entering the UK
by Teresa May. And still is.

To right wing even for the right wing? Get out of here with your
extremist crap Harry.

TW
Harry isn't extremist. You should get out more. There's a lot weirder
opinions than that out there.

Neither is he particularly right wing. Indeed extremist right wing is
largely an invention of the left


To challenge the view that all change is for the better, is to be
labelled as extremist right wing, these days.

Most left wing seem to forget that Hitler was a socialist.

Seems like a strange mixture of left and right to me. National
Socialist German Workers Party sounds contradictory, since I think
socialism is supposed to promote internationalism. He did at least
admit that he intended to end democracy, though, and I think that
socialism can only be fully implemented if people do not have the chance
to vote against it.

In article ,
Fredxxx wrote:
On 09/09/2016 10:20, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 09/09/16 10:04, TimW wrote:
On 09/09/16 07:16, harry wrote:
https://www.jihadwatch.org/2016/09/g...c-state-attack



Harry still trying to spread the word of the criminal and racist right
wing. The author of this one, American loony Robert Spencer, due to
speak at an English Defence League march was banned from entering the UK
by Teresa May. And still is.

To right wing even for the right wing? Get out of here with your
extremist crap Harry.

TW
Harry isn't extremist. You should get out more. There's a lot weirder
opinions than that out there.

Neither is he particularly right wing. Indeed extremist right wing is
largely an invention of the left


To challenge the view that all change is for the better, is to be
labelled as extremist right wing, these days.

Most left wing seem to forget that Hitler was a socialist.

Don't forget North Korea too. And lots of African republics. If someone
calls themselves a socialist or their country one, it must be so. Just
like democratic.

After all, Turnip calls himself a Philosopher. I rest my case.

--
*If you can't see my mirrors, I'm doing my hair*

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On 09/09/2016 12:37, Dan S. MacAbre wrote:
Fredxxx wrote:
On 09/09/2016 10:20, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 09/09/16 10:04, TimW wrote:
On 09/09/16 07:16, harry wrote:
https://www.jihadwatch.org/2016/09/g...c-state-attack





Harry still trying to spread the word of the criminal and racist right
wing. The author of this one, American loony Robert Spencer, due to
speak at an English Defence League march was banned from entering
the UK
by Teresa May. And still is.

To right wing even for the right wing? Get out of here with your
extremist crap Harry.

TW
Harry isn't extremist. You should get out more. There's a lot weirder
opinions than that out there.

Neither is he particularly right wing. Indeed extremist right wing is
largely an invention of the left


To challenge the view that all change is for the better, is to be
labelled as extremist right wing, these days.

Most left wing seem to forget that Hitler was a socialist.

Seems like a strange mixture of left and right to me. National
Socialist German Workers Party sounds contradictory, since I think
socialism is supposed to promote internationalism. He did at least
admit that he intended to end democracy, though, and I think that
socialism can only be fully implemented if people do not have the chance
to vote against it.

The difference between communism and fascism is that under fascism you
would be expected to be rewarded by how hard you work. Otherwise I can't
see any difference. Both promote an authoritarian state.

As you rightly say that is hardly a current socialist philosophy where
your reward should be independent on how hard you work.

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
Fredxxx wrote:
On 09/09/2016 10:20, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 09/09/16 10:04, TimW wrote:
On 09/09/16 07:16, harry wrote:
https://www.jihadwatch.org/2016/09/g...c-state-attack



Harry still trying to spread the word of the criminal and racist right
wing. The author of this one, American loony Robert Spencer, due to
speak at an English Defence League march was banned from entering the UK
by Teresa May. And still is.

To right wing even for the right wing? Get out of here with your
extremist crap Harry.

TW
Harry isn't extremist. You should get out more. There's a lot weirder
opinions than that out there.

Neither is he particularly right wing. Indeed extremist right wing is
largely an invention of the left


To challenge the view that all change is for the better, is to be
labelled as extremist right wing, these days.

Most left wing seem to forget that Hitler was a socialist.

Don't forget North Korea too. And lots of African republics. If someone
calls themselves a socialist or their country one, it must be so. Just
like democratic.

After all, Turnip calls himself a Philosopher. I rest my case.


I think one of the hardest things in history is to try to understand
what people thought of Hitler in the 30's. I'm sure he considered
himself to be something of a socialist, as least as far as native
Germans were concerned. Less so when it came to his plans for the
disabled. People didn't seem to be so keen to distance themselves from
his ideas then. But cleverer people than me seem still unable to
understand what happened - I don't think I really have much of a chance,
try as I might :-)

In article ,
Fredxxx wrote:
The difference between communism and fascism is that under fascism you
would be expected to be rewarded by how hard you work.

Can you name any communist state where all are/were equal?

You simply can't have it both ways.

Either talk about the principles of a doctrine or how it is in practice.

Of course it suits many a dictator to call his country democratic and or
socialist. Merely window dressing to cover up the true facts.

--
*Don't use no double negatives *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On 09/09/2016 14:17, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
Fredxxx wrote:
The difference between communism and fascism is that under fascism you
would be expected to be rewarded by how hard you work.

Can you name any communist state where all are/were equal?

You simply can't have it both ways.

When did I say I could?

Chip on shoulder comes to mind.

On 09/09/16 12:32, Fredxxx wrote:
On 09/09/2016 10:25, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 09/09/16 10:21, Nightjar wrote:
On 09-Sep-16 10:12 AM, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
....
I see the state education system has let you down again. and you are
unable to distinguish between the bottom of the hole, being half way
down, or being halfway down and moving further...
....

Did that actually make sense to you when you wrote it?


yes, and it still does.

I see the sate education system has let you down again....

I think it has let many down.

It does seem strange when someone points out an undeniable fact, that
can only be a result of the education system.

Are you suggesting the education system should teach people to ignore
simple facts involving police and armed forces?

I see the sate education system has let you down again....

No, I am suggest8ing nothing of te kind.

I am suggesting that anyone who cannot understand the following :

"you are unable to distinguish between the bottom of the hole, being
half way down, or being halfway down and moving further..."

Has an inadequate grasp of English, due to the state education system
having abandoned English grammar and comprehension as a subject deemed
worth studying.




--
"When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign,
that the dunces are all in confederacy against him."

Jonathan Swift.

In article ,
Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
Fredxxx wrote:
The difference between communism and fascism is that under fascism you
would be expected to be rewarded by how hard you work.

Can you name any communist state where all are/were equal?

some are more equal than others

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England

On 09/09/2016 13:59, Dan S. MacAbre wrote:
Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article , Fredxxx
wrote:
On 09/09/2016 10:20, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 09/09/16 10:04, TimW wrote:
On 09/09/16 07:16, harry wrote:
https://www.jihadwatch.org/2016/09/g...c-state-attack






Harry still trying to spread the word of the criminal and racist right
wing. The author of this one, American loony Robert Spencer,
due to speak at an English Defence League march was banned
from entering the UK by Teresa May. And still is.

To right wing even for the right wing? Get out of here with
your extremist crap Harry.

TW
Harry isn't extremist. You should get out more. There's a lot
weirder opinions than that out there.

Neither is he particularly right wing. Indeed extremist right
wing is largely an invention of the left


To challenge the view that all change is for the better, is to
be labelled as extremist right wing, these days.

Most left wing seem to forget that Hitler was a socialist.

Don't forget North Korea too. And lots of African republics. If
someone calls themselves a socialist or their country one, it must
be so. Just like democratic.

After all, Turnip calls himself a Philosopher. I rest my case.


I think one of the hardest things in history is to try to understand
what people thought of Hitler in the 30's.

That is quite easy. The Great Depression started in 1929 and continued
for most countries until the late 30's.

There were no state benefits payable to anyone who was out of work. We
have also conveniently forgotten who invented and ran the banking
system. They were vilified in much the same way bankers are today for
the 2007/8 bank bailouts. People lost their life saving and the blame
was firmly placed on bankers at that time. In those days bankers were
not a protected characteristic.

Hitler had various socialist policies. One of which was a Christian
tradition that interest should not be charged, and that there should be
no return on capital; where only labours were remunerated. If Corbyn
adopted those policies, who knows!

On top of that Hitler spent his way out any economic disaster, the
opposite of austerity and used the resource to arm Germany.

I'm sure he considered himself to be something of a socialist, as
least as far as native Germans were concerned.

He was very much a socialist and was voted in on that basis.

In article ,
Fredxxx wrote:
On 09/09/2016 14:17, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
Fredxxx wrote:
The difference between communism and fascism is that under fascism you
would be expected to be rewarded by how hard you work.

Can you name any communist state where all are/were equal?

You simply can't have it both ways.

When did I say I could?

You were quoting some supposed difference between fascism and communism.
As if they defined them.

Chip on shoulder comes to mind.

Excuse me for expecting an understanding of principles on here. I should
know better by now.

--
*Windows will never cease *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On 09/09/16 13:59, Dan S. MacAbre wrote:
I think one of the hardest things in history is to try to understand
what people thought of Hitler in the 30's. I'm sure he considered
himself to be something of a socialist, as least as far as native
Germans were concerned. Less so when it came to his plans for the
disabled. People didn't seem to be so keen to distance themselves from
his ideas then. But cleverer people than me seem still unable to
understand what happened - I don't think I really have much of a chance,
try as I might

Most people regarded Hitler as a lot better alternative than Communism
or Bolshevism, which had destroyed Russia and its ruling class.

At that time Communism was seen as part of 'the Jewish conspiracy' to
foment dissent and wars and make profits out of it. Anti-Semitism was
pretty rife, not helped by the clannishness ghetto-isation and refusal
to integrate of the European Jewish communities.

It was only when he developed delusions of Empire, invading his
neighbours, that people got upset.

They were very happy to see him and Mussolini trounce the commies in
Spain and Italy.

It was a pair of Italian communists that drew up the EU manifesto of course.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ventotene_Manifesto

Anyway, the point is simply this. More than a few people were more or
less anti semitic - suspicious and distrustful of Jews, and so that part
of Nazism wasn't seen as more than just a bit politically extreme. The
Anti- Bolshevik sentiment was widely applauded, as was the patriotism
and nationalism. Only when various political figures started getting
murdered, and other countries started getting invaded did people begin
to wonder, and then of course it was too late.

I don't think you can get close to understanding the whole thing unless
you spend time reading the causal literature of the time, and forming
your own opinions on the attitudes and ideas of the people then, rather
than taking the view of some historian - who perforce must needs
introduce a 'new perspective that informs' in order to make his career.

I can fully understand why people supported Hitler. And why people
support Corbyn.

And why Lefty****s are ****s.

I don't excuse it though.



--
Ideas are more powerful than guns. We would not let our enemies have
guns, why should we let them have ideas?

Josef Stalin

On Friday, 9 September 2016 10:04:31 UTC+1, TimW wrote:
On 09/09/16 07:16, harry wrote:
https://www.jihadwatch.org/2016/09/g...c-state-attack

Harry still trying to spread the word of the criminal and racist right
wing. The author of this one, American loony Robert Spencer, due to
speak at an English Defence League march was banned from entering the UK
by Teresa May. And still is.

To right wing even for the right wing? Get out of here with your
extremist crap Harry.

TW

They are jusT reporting the news as appears in other sources.
In this case NBC.
The link is there for you to verify.
But then you prefer to keep your head up your arse?

On Friday, 9 September 2016 12:37:44 UTC+1, Dan S. MacAbre wrote:
Fredxxx wrote:
On 09/09/2016 10:20, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 09/09/16 10:04, TimW wrote:
On 09/09/16 07:16, harry wrote:
https://www.jihadwatch.org/2016/09/g...c-state-attack




Harry still trying to spread the word of the criminal and racist right
wing. The author of this one, American loony Robert Spencer, due to
speak at an English Defence League march was banned from entering the UK
by Teresa May. And still is.

To right wing even for the right wing? Get out of here with your
extremist crap Harry.

TW
Harry isn't extremist. You should get out more. There's a lot weirder
opinions than that out there.

Neither is he particularly right wing. Indeed extremist right wing is
largely an invention of the left


To challenge the view that all change is for the better, is to be
labelled as extremist right wing, these days.

Most left wing seem to forget that Hitler was a socialist.

Seems like a strange mixture of left and right to me. National
Socialist German Workers Party sounds contradictory, since I think
socialism is supposed to promote internationalism. He did at least
admit that he intended to end democracy, though, and I think that
socialism can only be fully implemented if people do not have the chance
to vote against it.

Like North Korea?

On Friday, 9 September 2016 15:03:17 UTC+1, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 09/09/16 13:59, Dan S. MacAbre wrote:
I think one of the hardest things in history is to try to understand
what people thought of Hitler in the 30's. I'm sure he considered
himself to be something of a socialist, as least as far as native
Germans were concerned. Less so when it came to his plans for the
disabled. People didn't seem to be so keen to distance themselves from
his ideas then. But cleverer people than me seem still unable to
understand what happened - I don't think I really have much of a chance,
try as I might

Most people regarded Hitler as a lot better alternative than Communism
or Bolshevism, which had destroyed Russia and its ruling class.

At that time Communism was seen as part of 'the Jewish conspiracy' to
foment dissent and wars and make profits out of it. Anti-Semitism was
pretty rife, not helped by the clannishness ghetto-isation and refusal
to integrate of the European Jewish communities.

It was only when he developed delusions of Empire, invading his
neighbours, that people got upset.

They were very happy to see him and Mussolini trounce the commies in
Spain and Italy.

It was a pair of Italian communists that drew up the EU manifesto of course.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ventotene_Manifesto

Anyway, the point is simply this. More than a few people were more or
less anti semitic - suspicious and distrustful of Jews, and so that part
of Nazism wasn't seen as more than just a bit politically extreme. The
Anti- Bolshevik sentiment was widely applauded, as was the patriotism
and nationalism. Only when various political figures started getting
murdered, and other countries started getting invaded did people begin
to wonder, and then of course it was too late.

I don't think you can get close to understanding the whole thing unless
you spend time reading the causal literature of the time, and forming
your own opinions on the attitudes and ideas of the people then, rather
than taking the view of some historian - who perforce must needs
introduce a 'new perspective that informs' in order to make his career.

I can fully understand why people supported Hitler. And why people
support Corbyn.

And why Lefty****s are ****s.

I don't excuse it though.

Goldman Sachs sounds pretty Jewish to me.

On 09/09/16 14:46, charles wrote:
In article ,
Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
Fredxxx wrote:
The difference between communism and fascism is that under fascism you
would be expected to be rewarded by how hard you work.

Can you name any communist state where all are/were equal?

some are more equal than others

communism was never about equality. It was about abolition of private
assets, and state ownership of everything

Teh problem with that, is that governments proved even worse at running
stuff than individuals, who at least had some vested interest in success.

--
€œIt is hard to imagine a more stupid decision or more dangerous way of
making decisions than by putting those decisions in the hands of people
who pay no price for being wrong.€�

Thomas Sowell

Has he finally flipped. Maybe he needs a good hobby?
Brian

--
----- -
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...

Blind user, so no pictures please!
"Rod Speed" wrote in message
...
Nope, it is doing nothing of the sort, bigot boy.

harry wrote

https://www.jihadwatch.org/2016/09/g...c-state-attack

On 09/09/2016 07:16, harry wrote:
https://www.jihadwatch.o

LOL.
A website called jihadwatch ! not even worthy of a click-through!

On 09-Sep-16 12:29 PM, Tim Streater wrote:
In article , Nightjar
wrote:

On 09-Sep-16 10:12 AM, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
...
I see the state education system has let you down again. and you are
unable to distinguish between the bottom of the hole, being half way
down, or being halfway down and moving further...
...

Did that actually make sense to you when you wrote it?

Eh? Nothing difficult about that, although TNP might perhaps indicate
*which* hole.


Nothing apart from it being a total non sequitur.

--
--

Colin Bignell

On 09/09/16 10:20, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 09/09/16 10:04, TimW wrote:
On 09/09/16 07:16, harry wrote:
https://www.jihadwatch.org/2016/09/g...c-state-attack



Harry still trying to spread the word of the criminal and racist right
wing. The author of this one, American loony Robert Spencer, due to
speak at an English Defence League march was banned from entering the UK
by Teresa May. And still is.

To right wing even for the right wing? Get out of here with your
extremist crap Harry.

TW
Harry isn't extremist. You should get out more. There's a lot weirder
opinions than that out there.

Neither is he particularly right wing. Indeed extremist right wing is
largely an invention of the left


To challenge the view that all change is for the better, is to be
labelled as extremist right wing, these days.


I don't actually think you are stupid, so i am always fascinated when
you lose the ability to follow a simple piece of logic, or even to see
what is in front of your face.

I explained why what Harry was posting was way out of order. It isn't
easy to be too right wing for Teresa May, but you just instantly lost
the power of logical thought.

And the extremist right wing? Probably very small in number but very
dangerous. Much more violent than the tiny and elderly Trotskyist left.

You may be confused by the unwillingness of the police, press and
politicians to call a spade a spade. You are only called a terrorist if
you are a muslim in the UK. A right wing nutter caught bomb making like
Ryan McGee gets off lightly. Pavlo Lapshyn planted bombs at Birmingham
mosques and commited murder but wasn't charged with any terrorist
offences. Thomas Mair, a raving racist murdered Jo Cox MP and the press
prefer to put it down to mental health problems. right wing infiltration
of ukip is very real and well documented.

For you though, blind and blinkered this is all just the 'invention of
the left'. Cold water and a good look in the mirror is in order for you.

TW

On 09/09/16 18:13, Nightjar wrote:
On 09-Sep-16 12:29 PM, Tim Streater wrote:
In article , Nightjar
wrote:

On 09-Sep-16 10:12 AM, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
...
I see the state education system has let you down again. and you are
unable to distinguish between the bottom of the hole, being half way
down, or being halfway down and moving further...
...

Did that actually make sense to you when you wrote it?

Eh? Nothing difficult about that, although TNP might perhaps indicate
*which* hole.


Nothing apart from it being a total non sequitur.

Well in fact it wasn't, but once again your lack of intelligence failed
to make the connection.



--
"The great thing about Glasgow is that if there's a nuclear attack it'll
look exactly the same afterwards."

Billy Connolly

On 09/09/16 18:29, TimW wrote:
On 09/09/16 10:20, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 09/09/16 10:04, TimW wrote:
On 09/09/16 07:16, harry wrote:
https://www.jihadwatch.org/2016/09/g...c-state-attack




Harry still trying to spread the word of the criminal and racist right
wing. The author of this one, American loony Robert Spencer, due to
speak at an English Defence League march was banned from entering the UK
by Teresa May. And still is.

To right wing even for the right wing? Get out of here with your
extremist crap Harry.

TW
Harry isn't extremist. You should get out more. There's a lot weirder
opinions than that out there.

Neither is he particularly right wing. Indeed extremist right wing is
largely an invention of the left


To challenge the view that all change is for the better, is to be
labelled as extremist right wing, these days.


I don't actually think you are stupid, so i am always fascinated when
you lose the ability to follow a simple piece of logic, or even to see
what is in front of your face.

I explained why what Harry was posting was way out of order. It isn't
easy to be too right wing for Teresa May, but you just instantly lost
the power of logical thought.

And the extremist right wing? Probably very small in number but very
dangerous. Much more violent than the tiny and elderly Trotskyist left.

You may be confused by the unwillingness of the police, press and
politicians to call a spade a spade. You are only called a terrorist if
you are a muslim in the UK. A right wing nutter caught bomb making like
Ryan McGee gets off lightly. Pavlo Lapshyn planted bombs at Birmingham
mosques and commited murder but wasn't charged with any terrorist
offences. Thomas Mair, a raving racist murdered Jo Cox MP and the press
prefer to put it down to mental health problems. right wing infiltration
of ukip is very real and well documented.

For you though, blind and blinkered this is all just the 'invention of
the left'. Cold water and a good look in the mirror is in order for you.

TW
Keep on drinking the koolaid.

--
"The great thing about Glasgow is that if there's a nuclear attack it'll
look exactly the same afterwards."

Billy Connolly

On 09-Sep-16 2:44 PM, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 09/09/16 12:32, Fredxxx wrote:
On 09/09/2016 10:25, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 09/09/16 10:21, Nightjar wrote:
On 09-Sep-16 10:12 AM, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
....
I see the state education system has let you down again. and you are
unable to distinguish between the bottom of the hole, being half way
down, or being halfway down and moving further...
....

Did that actually make sense to you when you wrote it?


yes, and it still does.

I see the sate education system has let you down again....

I think it has let many down.

It does seem strange when someone points out an undeniable fact, that
can only be a result of the education system.

Are you suggesting the education system should teach people to ignore
simple facts involving police and armed forces?

I see the sate education system has let you down again....

No, I am suggest8ing nothing of te kind.

I am suggesting that anyone who cannot understand the following :

"you are unable to distinguish between the bottom of the hole, being
half way down, or being halfway down and moving further..."

Has an inadequate grasp of English, due to the state education system
having abandoned English grammar and comprehension as a subject deemed
worth studying.

You misunderstand. I wasn't questioning whether that was an intelligible
composition of words. I was asking whether it made sense to you to write
that as a response to my post. I was simply pointing out that Britain,
and many other countries, have been carrying out inter-service
cooperation exercises for decades without anybody claiming we were
coming under martial law. Your response seems to be completely unrelated
to that.


--
--

Colin Bignell

The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 09/09/16 13:59, Dan S. MacAbre wrote:
I think one of the hardest things in history is to try to understand
what people thought of Hitler in the 30's. I'm sure he considered
himself to be something of a socialist, as least as far as native
Germans were concerned. Less so when it came to his plans for the
disabled. People didn't seem to be so keen to distance themselves from
his ideas then. But cleverer people than me seem still unable to
understand what happened - I don't think I really have much of a chance,
try as I might

Most people regarded Hitler as a lot better alternative than Communism
or Bolshevism, which had destroyed Russia and its ruling class.

At that time Communism was seen as part of 'the Jewish conspiracy' to
foment dissent and wars and make profits out of it. Anti-Semitism was
pretty rife, not helped by the clannishness ghetto-isation and refusal
to integrate of the European Jewish communities.

It was only when he developed delusions of Empire, invading his
neighbours, that people got upset.

They were very happy to see him and Mussolini trounce the commies in
Spain and Italy.

It was a pair of Italian communists that drew up the EU manifesto of
course.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ventotene_Manifesto

Anyway, the point is simply this. More than a few people were more or
less anti semitic - suspicious and distrustful of Jews, and so that part
of Nazism wasn't seen as more than just a bit politically extreme. The
Anti- Bolshevik sentiment was widely applauded, as was the patriotism
and nationalism. Only when various political figures started getting
murdered, and other countries started getting invaded did people begin
to wonder, and then of course it was too late.

I don't think you can get close to understanding the whole thing unless
you spend time reading the causal literature of the time, and forming
your own opinions on the attitudes and ideas of the people then, rather
than taking the view of some historian - who perforce must needs
introduce a 'new perspective that informs' in order to make his career.

I can fully understand why people supported Hitler. And why people
support Corbyn.

And why Lefty****s are ****s.

I don't excuse it though.


I thank you and Fredxxx for your responses. I could talk about this
sort of stuff all day, but I don't think usenet is a great way to deal
with it.

You've clearly both studied more than me, yet I still maintain that /for
most people/, Hitler's success is something of a mystery. The very
mention of the name is too loaded for people to not believe that he
tricked his way into power. Yet it is clear that he did not. One only
has to watch Eva Braun's home movies at Berchtesgarten to see that that
these are people who do not believe that they are in any way evil.

I think it's worth mentioning the paralysis induced by Germany's system
of proportional representation as a major factor. There was one NSDAP
founding member (whose name I can't remember) who, when asked what they
stand for, simply said 'the opposite of what there is today'. I think
many people feel that right now, especially in the US.

The hyperinflation of 1923 has been mentioned, but this was got under
control when required (I think it was allowed to run away in order to
obfuscate the value of the currency at a time when they were paying
reparations), and I'd be surprised if it was still a motivating
political factor ten years later. The Great Depression, OTOH, certainly
was.

As for the anti-semitism, I think I read that even Jesse Owens was a
last-minute stand-in for a Jewish athlete whom the Americans chose not
to send for fear of upsetting Hitler. It's also odd that previously,
Germany was something of a haven for Europe's Jews.

But I don't know. Before WW2, there seem to be no great surprises in
what happened. Afterwards, it seems hardly credible. Anyway, I'm
wittering now :-)

On 09/09/16 19:31, Nightjar wrote:
On 09-Sep-16 2:44 PM, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 09/09/16 12:32, Fredxxx wrote:
On 09/09/2016 10:25, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 09/09/16 10:21, Nightjar wrote:
On 09-Sep-16 10:12 AM, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
....
I see the state education system has let you down again. and you are
unable to distinguish between the bottom of the hole, being half way
down, or being halfway down and moving further...
....

Did that actually make sense to you when you wrote it?


yes, and it still does.

I see the sate education system has let you down again....

I think it has let many down.

It does seem strange when someone points out an undeniable fact, that
can only be a result of the education system.

Are you suggesting the education system should teach people to ignore
simple facts involving police and armed forces?

I see the sate education system has let you down again....

No, I am suggest8ing nothing of te kind.

I am suggesting that anyone who cannot understand the following :

"you are unable to distinguish between the bottom of the hole, being
half way down, or being halfway down and moving further..."

Has an inadequate grasp of English, due to the state education system
having abandoned English grammar and comprehension as a subject deemed
worth studying.

You misunderstand. I wasn't questioning whether that was an intelligible
composition of words. I was asking whether it made sense to you to write
that as a response to my post. I was simply pointing out that Britain,
and many other countries, have been carrying out inter-service
cooperation exercises for decades without anybody claiming we were
coming under martial law. Your response seems to be completely unrelated
to that.


thats because you are stupid, or deliberetaly trolling

I pointed out that 'descending into' something is not the same as being
there already.

A point you either failed to grasp, or deliberately ignored





--
Those who want slavery should have the grace to name it by its proper
name. They must face the full meaning of that which they are advocating
or condoning; the full, exact, specific meaning of collectivism, of its
logical implications, of the principles upon which it is based, and of
the ultimate consequences to which these principles will lead. They must
face it, then decide whether this is what they want or not.

Ayn Rand.

On 09/09/16 19:41, Dan S. MacAbre wrote:
You've clearly both studied more than me, yet I still maintain that /for
most people/, Hitler's success is something of a mystery. The very
mention of the name is too loaded for people to not believe that he
tricked his way into power. Yet it is clear that he did not. One only
has to watch Eva Braun's home movies at Berchtesgarten to see that that
these are people who do not believe that they are in any way evil.

Same gpes for your average animal liberation front or hunt saboteur, or
hope not hate activist.

Or Corbyn supporter.


Once you decide that
Jews/Capitalists/toffs/abortionists/fascists/infidels/members of
UKIP/people with 4WD cars are 'scum', herding them into death camps
becomes the moral thing to do.


--
Canada is all right really, though not for the whole weekend.

"Saki"

On 09/09/16 20:21, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 09/09/16 19:41, Dan S. MacAbre wrote:
You've clearly both studied more than me, yet I still maintain that /for
most people/, Hitler's success is something of a mystery. The very
mention of the name is too loaded for people to not believe that he
tricked his way into power. Yet it is clear that he did not. One only
has to watch Eva Braun's home movies at Berchtesgarten to see that that
these are people who do not believe that they are in any way evil.

Same gpes for your average animal liberation front or hunt saboteur, or
hope not hate activist.

Or Corbyn supporter.


Once you decide that
Jews/Capitalists/toffs/abortionists/fascists/infidels/members of
UKIP/people with 4WD cars are 'scum', herding them into death camps
becomes the moral thing to do.


Refugee camps, immigrant camps, Calais for example, once you decide that
they are child molesters, scroungers and terrorists ... Our
grandchildren will wonder how we could be so complacent.

Tim W

On 09/09/16 20:27, TimW wrote:
On 09/09/16 20:21, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 09/09/16 19:41, Dan S. MacAbre wrote:
You've clearly both studied more than me, yet I still maintain that /for
most people/, Hitler's success is something of a mystery. The very
mention of the name is too loaded for people to not believe that he
tricked his way into power. Yet it is clear that he did not. One only
has to watch Eva Braun's home movies at Berchtesgarten to see that that
these are people who do not believe that they are in any way evil.

Same gpes for your average animal liberation front or hunt saboteur, or
hope not hate activist.

Or Corbyn supporter.


Once you decide that
Jews/Capitalists/toffs/abortionists/fascists/infidels/members of
UKIP/people with 4WD cars are 'scum', herding them into death camps
becomes the moral thing to do.


Refugee camps, immigrant camps, Calais for example, once you decide that
they are child molesters, scroungers and terrorists ... Our
grandchildren will wonder how we could be so complacent.


There are no guards keeping them there.
No one forced them to be there.
They are free to go to somewhere else.

Tim W


--
If you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it, people will
eventually come to believe it. The lie can be maintained only for such
time as the State can shield the people from the political, economic
and/or military consequences of the lie. It thus becomes vitally
important for the State to use all of its powers to repress dissent, for
the truth is the mortal enemy of the lie, and thus by extension, the
truth is the greatest enemy of the State.

Joseph Goebbels

Tim Streater wrote:
In article , Dan S. MacAbre
wrote:

The Natural Philosopher wrote:

I can fully understand why people supported Hitler. And why people
support Corbyn.

And why Lefty****s are ****s.

I don't excuse it though.

I thank you and Fredxxx for your responses. I could talk about this
sort of stuff all day, but I don't think usenet is a great way to deal
with it.

You've clearly both studied more than me, yet I still maintain that
/for most people/, Hitler's success is something of a mystery.

I've pointed out a couple of the factors that Hitler used very
effectively to rouse people up. He was a very effective orator. He also
used violence to bash the communists.

I think the Nazis invented targeted political leafletting, making
contradictory promises (high food prices to farmers/low food prices to
everyone else) to various sections of the community.

I also get the impression that the political atmosphere in general was
fairly violent, and that's why people did not find it particularly
surprising or alienating.

The very mention of the name is too loaded for people to not
believe that he tricked his way into power. Yet it is clear that
he did not.

In a way, he did. He certainly *politicked* his way in, and once he'd
been appointed as Chancellor used that position to cement his power.

He seems to have been the master of opportunity.

I think it's worth mentioning the paralysis induced by Germany's
system of proportional representation as a major factor. There was
one NSDAP founding member (whose name I can't remember) who, when
asked what they stand for, simply said 'the opposite of what there is
today'. I think many people feel that right now, especially in the US.

Well, the Nazis became the largest party but never had an absolute
majority of the vote. You also have to remember that, although Germany
had this wonderful written constitution, those responsible for guarding
it (the army, police, judiciary) all hated it. Hence Hitler only
getting 9 months for armed insurrection - treason, in fact.

Another unfortunate factor - the Weimar Republic did not purge the
judiciary.

The hyperinflation of 1923 has been mentioned, but this was got under
control when required (I think it was allowed to run away in order to
obfuscate the value of the currency at a time when they were paying
reparations), and I'd be surprised if it was still a motivating
political factor ten years later. The Great Depression, OTOH,
certainly was.

It was got under control, but it ruined the middle classes and made
them fodder for Hitler.

On 09/09/16 20:34, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 09/09/16 20:27, TimW wrote:
On 09/09/16 20:21, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
[...]
Once you decide that
Jews/Capitalists/toffs/abortionists/fascists/infidels/members of
UKIP/people with 4WD cars are 'scum', herding them into death camps
becomes the moral thing to do.


Refugee camps, immigrant camps, Calais for example, once you decide that
they are child molesters, scroungers and terrorists ... Our
grandchildren will wonder how we could be so complacent.


There are no guards keeping them there.
No one forced them to be there.
They are free to go to somewhere else.

Sure, these people have all kinds of options, like er, let me think,
....actually none.

On Friday, 9 September 2016 14:50:32 UTC+1, Fredxxx wrote:
On 09/09/2016 13:59, Dan S. MacAbre wrote:

I think one of the hardest things in history is to try to understand
what people thought of Hitler in the 30's.

That is quite easy. The Great Depression started in 1929 and continued
for most countries until the late 30's.

There were no state benefits payable to anyone who was out of work. We
have also conveniently forgotten who invented and ran the banking
system. They were vilified in much the same way bankers are today for
the 2007/8 bank bailouts. People lost their life saving and the blame
was firmly placed on bankers at that time. In those days bankers were
not a protected characteristic.

Hitler had various socialist policies. One of which was a Christian
tradition that interest should not be charged, and that there should be
no return on capital; where only labours were remunerated. If Corbyn
adopted those policies, who knows!

On top of that Hitler spent his way out any economic disaster, the
opposite of austerity and used the resource to arm Germany.

I'm sure he considered himself to be something of a socialist, as
least as far as native Germans were concerned.

He was very much a socialist and was voted in on that basis.

I always understood the main reason he was voted in is he was the only one giving Germany a hope of being great, when it was in such poverty that many had nothing like enough to eat. AIUI he made no secret of his more lunatic views, but did have some smart insights in some respects, and thus people bought into his vision as one of hope. Of course they had little clue what would really happen & how.


NT