Over the past few months, I have been gradually swapping some of the
most used lamps over to LED versions. 3.5w for those areas where a bit
of background light is needed, leaving 20w CFL's in place where
occaisional bright lights are needed. 2x 3.5w LED's to replace a 38w
double D CFL which originally illuminated the drive and is on a solar
clock.

My latest change has been to swap some ancient kitchen ES downlighters.
When I originally installed these I intended them for 100w ES reflector
flood lamps. These tended to be in use much of the day, when the
kitchen was in use, so they needed frequent replacement, expensive and
were a large consumer of watts. Several years ago I replaced them with
22w CFL's but due to the recessed fitting, the light was never that
good, so I ended up supplementing it with a concealed 70w tube.

I recently ordered up some 12w ES LED flood lamps hoping they might
provide a better light, better economy and last longer. I don't yet
know about the 'lasting longer', but they provide a much better, more
even light and brighter light than either the 100w floods, or the CFL's
gave. In addition, due to the overall lamp swapping - consumption has
gone down quite markedly.

"Harry Bloomfield" wrote in message
...
Over the past few months, I have been gradually swapping some of the most
used lamps over to LED versions. 3.5w for those areas where a bit of
background light is needed, leaving 20w CFL's in place where occaisional
bright lights are needed. 2x 3.5w LED's to replace a 38w double D CFL
which originally illuminated the drive and is on a solar clock.

My latest change has been to swap some ancient kitchen ES downlighters.
When I originally installed these I intended them for 100w ES reflector
flood lamps. These tended to be in use much of the day, when the kitchen
was in use, so they needed frequent replacement, expensive and were a
large consumer of watts. Several years ago I replaced them with 22w CFL's
but due to the recessed fitting, the light was never that good, so I ended
up supplementing it with a concealed 70w tube.

I recently ordered up some 12w ES LED flood lamps hoping they might
provide a better light, better economy and last longer. I don't yet know
about the 'lasting longer', but they provide a much better, more even
light and brighter light than either the 100w floods, or the CFL's gave.
In addition, due to the overall lamp swapping - consumption has gone down
quite markedly.

The only problem that I've had is with the angle of beam coverage. We have
GU10 mini reflector lights in the bathroom (three aimed vertically downwards
through different parts of the ceiling) and in the kitchen (five on a
horizontal strip so each one can be aimed individually).

When we changed from tungsten to LED we found that there were dark patches
in between the areas lit up by each lamp, and a much sharper cutoff at the
edge of the beam.

If GU10s could be made with a wider beam coverage and a softer edge to the
beam, they'd be even better. We've got used to the ones in the kitchen,
though when we have the kitchen cupboards changed I might see it we can have
small LED lamps fitted under the cupboards to provide more light on the work
surfaces in addition to the overhead spotlights.

On 12/08/2016 09:36, NY wrote:
"Harry Bloomfield" wrote in message
...

I recently ordered up some 12w ES LED flood lamps hoping they might
provide a better light, better economy and last longer. I don't yet
know about the 'lasting longer', but they provide a much better, more
even light and brighter light than either the 100w floods, or the
CFL's gave. In addition, due to the overall lamp swapping -
consumption has gone down quite markedly.

The only problem that I've had is with the angle of beam coverage. We
have GU10 mini reflector lights in the bathroom (three aimed vertically
downwards through different parts of the ceiling) and in the kitchen
(five on a horizontal strip so each one can be aimed individually).

When we changed from tungsten to LED we found that there were dark
patches in between the areas lit up by each lamp, and a much sharper
cutoff at the edge of the beam.

If you don't mind mixing the sort of lamp in the fixtures you can use
the rather too well collimated LED spotlights for task lighting and the
standard shaped ordinary bulbs for a more diffuse general lighting.

If GU10s could be made with a wider beam coverage and a softer edge to
the beam, they'd be even better. We've got used to the ones in the
kitchen, though when we have the kitchen cupboards changed I might see
it we can have small LED lamps fitted under the cupboards to provide
more light on the work surfaces in addition to the overhead spotlights.

Some corn on the cob type work well for ambient lighting in spotlight
type fixtures or the ones with a flat disk emitter covered in LED.

Worth experimenting to get the best lighting for the kitchen usage.

--
Regards,
Martin Brown

In article ,
Harry Bloomfield wrote:
I recently ordered up some 12w ES LED flood lamps hoping they might
provide a better light, better economy and last longer. I don't yet
know about the 'lasting longer', but they provide a much better, more
even light and brighter light than either the 100w floods, or the CFL's
gave. In addition, due to the overall lamp swapping - consumption has
gone down quite markedly.

I'd be surprised if any LED gave a better beam pattern than tungsten.
Perhaps you were using spots rather than floods before?

But they do - finally - seem to be producing LEDs which give a nearer
equivalent output to what they claim.

--
*Husbands should come with instructions

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

"Martin Brown" wrote in message
...
If you don't mind mixing the sort of lamp in the fixtures you can use the
rather too well collimated LED spotlights for task lighting and the
standard shaped ordinary bulbs for a more diffuse general lighting.

The problem is matching the colour: LED lights are daylight coloured and
tungsten lights look horribly dingy alongside them.

If GU10s could be made with a wider beam coverage and a softer edge to
the beam, they'd be even better. We've got used to the ones in the
kitchen, though when we have the kitchen cupboards changed I might see
it we can have small LED lamps fitted under the cupboards to provide
more light on the work surfaces in addition to the overhead spotlights.

Some corn on the cob type work well for ambient lighting in spotlight type
fixtures or the ones with a flat disk emitter covered in LED.

Worth experimenting to get the best lighting for the kitchen usage.

Yes. Part of the problem is getting a wire to any other fittings that we may
put on other parts of the ceiling - it would mean clearing furniture, and
lifting carpets and floorboards upstairs to run additional cables to new
holes in the kitchen ceiling. Like many 1930s houses, it just has one light
fitting in the centre of each room.

On 12/08/16 10:19, NY wrote:
"Martin Brown" wrote in message
...
If you don't mind mixing the sort of lamp in the fixtures you can use
the rather too well collimated LED spotlights for task lighting and
the standard shaped ordinary bulbs for a more diffuse general lighting.

The problem is matching the colour: LED lights are daylight coloured and
tungsten lights look horribly dingy alongside them.

No, they are not these days. a complete range of color temps is available


If GU10s could be made with a wider beam coverage and a softer edge to
the beam, they'd be even better. We've got used to the ones in the
kitchen, though when we have the kitchen cupboards changed I might see
it we can have small LED lamps fitted under the cupboards to provide
more light on the work surfaces in addition to the overhead spotlights.

Some corn on the cob type work well for ambient lighting in spotlight
type fixtures or the ones with a flat disk emitter covered in LED.

Worth experimenting to get the best lighting for the kitchen usage.

Yes. Part of the problem is getting a wire to any other fittings that we
may put on other parts of the ceiling - it would mean clearing
furniture, and lifting carpets and floorboards upstairs to run
additional cables to new holes in the kitchen ceiling. Like many 1930s
houses, it just has one light fitting in the centre of each room.


--
To ban Christmas, simply give turkeys the vote.

In article ,
NY wrote:
The problem is matching the colour: LED lights are daylight coloured and
tungsten lights look horribly dingy alongside them.

LEDs can be any colour you like. The most efficient ones tend to be rather
blue - but daylight they most certainly ain't. Most are available in so
called daylight and warm white now.

--
*I don't believe in astrology. I am a Sagittarius and we're very skeptical.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On 12/08/2016 09:20, Harry Bloomfield wrote:

I recently ordered up some 12w ES LED flood lamps hoping they might
provide a better light, better economy and last longer. I don't yet know
about the 'lasting longer', but they provide a much better, more even
light and brighter light than either the 100w floods, or the CFL's gave.
In addition, due to the overall lamp swapping - consumption has gone
down quite markedly.

What flavour did you buy?

NY formulated on Friday :
The problem is matching the colour: LED lights are daylight coloured and
tungsten lights look horribly dingy alongside them.

Not true, LED's come in a range of colour temperatures now. The E27 R80
ones I bought for the kitchen were offered as warm white or white. I
got the white ones, so as to match the existing concealed 6 foot tube's
colour.

In the rest of the house, I have used warm white and all dimable.

Dave Plowman (News) submitted this idea :
I'd be surprised if any LED gave a better beam pattern than tungsten.
Perhaps you were using spots rather than floods before?

The original lamps were definately floods, we have a few spots bought
in error still in the cupboard - which were found to be useless for the
purpose. As (temporary) replacements, I sought out the longer ES CFL's,
because lacking reflectors, the fittings absorbed all the light if they
sank all the way into the fittings.

As said, that was intended to be just a temporary solution, until I
decided how to move forward, but these LED floods seem to solve the
issue completely and for not a lot of cost or effort.

It happens that NY formulated :
The only problem that I've had is with the angle of beam coverage. We have
GU10 mini reflector lights in the bathroom (three aimed vertically downwards
through different parts of the ceiling) and in the kitchen (five on a
horizontal strip so each one can be aimed individually).

These LED lamps are E27 R80, in a high ceiling and the spread seems to
be pretty good. I bought these for the kitchen..

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/201617474793

I bought the 3.5w BC and SBC LED lamps from BHS at 50p each in their
closing down sale. Enough to do the whole house, or at least the lights
which are usually used most for long periods and a few spares.

On 12/08/2016 10:14, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
Harry Bloomfield wrote:
I recently ordered up some 12w ES LED flood lamps hoping they might
provide a better light, better economy and last longer. I don't yet
know about the 'lasting longer', but they provide a much better, more
even light and brighter light than either the 100w floods, or the CFL's
gave. In addition, due to the overall lamp swapping - consumption has
gone down quite markedly.

I'd be surprised if any LED gave a better beam pattern than tungsten.
Perhaps you were using spots rather than floods before?

But they do - finally - seem to be producing LEDs which give a nearer
equivalent output to what they claim.

The only LEDs I have been really impressed by so far are these:

https://trade.ledhut.co.uk/led-bulbs...ent-bulbs.html

They have pretty much the same radiation pattern as a GLS lamp,
comparable brightness, and for once, a reasonable CRI.

(normally I am very fussy about the light quality from LEDs - many of
the "warm white" ones appear slightly greenish, or have a noticeable
discontinuities in their spectra - these pass close enough for Tungsten
to my eye).


--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

NY wrote:
The only problem that I've had is with the angle of beam coverage. We have
GU10 mini reflector lights in the bathroom (three aimed vertically
downwards through different parts of the ceiling) and in the kitchen (five
on a horizontal strip so each one can be aimed individually).

I achieved a temporary diffuse beam on an LED lamp with a piece of milk
bottle. The permanent version was a piece of roughened acrylic cut to fit
in the bezel. Hopefully that's UV safe (it's sold for greenhouses and the
like).

Theo

En el artículo , NY
escribió:

If GU10s could be made with a wider beam coverage and a softer edge to the
beam, they'd be even better

Try a couple of Megaman ones. They're a little pricier than the others,
but look good. The light quality is indistinguishable from halogen
(perhaps very slightly warmer), and the lamp has a clear diffuser lens
which gives the light spread you want.

--
(\_/)
(='.'=) systemd: the Linux version of Windows 10
(")_(")

On Fri, 12 Aug 2016 09:36:29 +0100, NY wrote:

The only problem that I've had is with the angle of beam coverage. We have
GU10 mini reflector lights in the bathroom (three aimed vertically downwards
through different parts of the ceiling) and in the kitchen (five on a
horizontal strip so each one can be aimed individually).

When we changed from tungsten to LED we found that there were dark patches
in between the areas lit up by each lamp, and a much sharper cutoff at the
edge of the beam.

If GU10s could be made with a wider beam coverage and a softer edge to the
beam, they'd be even better. We've got used to the ones in the kitchen,
though when we have the kitchen cupboards changed I might see it we can have
small LED lamps fitted under the cupboards to provide more light on the work
surfaces in addition to the overhead spotlights.

120 degree GU10s are available - Amazon, ebay and TS, depending on what
outpuy and colour temperature you want.
I tend to avoid the very high outputs for GU10s (and G9s) as they don't have
much area for dissipation of heat; candle etc. of the COB type are better
in this respect.
--
Peter.
The gods will stay away
whilst religions hold sway

One thing I'd like to know is this. Do the led units employ some kind of
switch mode power supply, and if so, how badly designed are they?I'm looking
for lights that I can suggest to neighbours that do not put out gross hash
and interference when they are turned on in the evening. I'm not sure if the
current issue is from cfls or leds, but they are far worse than ordinary
bulbs obviously.
Brian

--
----- -
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...

Blind user, so no pictures please!
"NY" wrote in message
o.uk...
"Harry Bloomfield" wrote in message
...
Over the past few months, I have been gradually swapping some of the most
used lamps over to LED versions. 3.5w for those areas where a bit of
background light is needed, leaving 20w CFL's in place where occaisional
bright lights are needed. 2x 3.5w LED's to replace a 38w double D CFL
which originally illuminated the drive and is on a solar clock.

My latest change has been to swap some ancient kitchen ES downlighters.
When I originally installed these I intended them for 100w ES reflector
flood lamps. These tended to be in use much of the day, when the kitchen
was in use, so they needed frequent replacement, expensive and were a
large consumer of watts. Several years ago I replaced them with 22w CFL's
but due to the recessed fitting, the light was never that good, so I
ended up supplementing it with a concealed 70w tube.

I recently ordered up some 12w ES LED flood lamps hoping they might
provide a better light, better economy and last longer. I don't yet know
about the 'lasting longer', but they provide a much better, more even
light and brighter light than either the 100w floods, or the CFL's gave.
In addition, due to the overall lamp swapping - consumption has gone down
quite markedly.

The only problem that I've had is with the angle of beam coverage. We have
GU10 mini reflector lights in the bathroom (three aimed vertically
downwards through different parts of the ceiling) and in the kitchen (five
on a horizontal strip so each one can be aimed individually).

When we changed from tungsten to LED we found that there were dark patches
in between the areas lit up by each lamp, and a much sharper cutoff at the
edge of the beam.

If GU10s could be made with a wider beam coverage and a softer edge to the
beam, they'd be even better. We've got used to the ones in the kitchen,
though when we have the kitchen cupboards changed I might see it we can
have small LED lamps fitted under the cupboards to provide more light on
the work surfaces in addition to the overhead spotlights.

Brian Gaff wrote:

One thing I'd like to know is this. Do the led units employ some kind of
switch mode power supply

For the omes that look like old cage filament lights, the LED strings
contain 40-50 LEDs in series, some are just driven by a bridge
rectifier, no smoothing capacitor and a constant current chip.

On 12/08/2016 10:07, Martin Brown wrote:

The only problem that I've had is with the angle of beam coverage. We
have GU10 mini reflector lights in the bathroom (three aimed vertically
downwards through different parts of the ceiling) and in the kitchen
(five on a horizontal strip so each one can be aimed individually).

When we changed from tungsten to LED we found that there were dark
patches in between the areas lit up by each lamp, and a much sharper
cutoff at the edge of the beam.

I don't know what beam angle your LEDs are but FWIW I've found those
with 120 degree or wider better in those circs - assuming glare ain't
going to be a problem.

--
Robin

On 12/08/2016 19:03, PeterC wrote:


120 degree GU10s are available - Amazon, ebay and TS, depending on what
outpuy and colour temperature you want.
I tend to avoid the very high outputs for GU10s (and G9s) as they don't have
much area for dissipation of heat; candle etc. of the COB type are better
in this respect.

Ah. Sorry.

I must read the whole thread before posting
I must read the whole thread before posting
I must ...

--
Robin

In article ,
Harry Bloomfield wrote:
Dave Plowman (News) submitted this idea :
I'd be surprised if any LED gave a better beam pattern than tungsten.
Perhaps you were using spots rather than floods before?

The original lamps were definately floods, we have a few spots bought
in error still in the cupboard - which were found to be useless for the
purpose. As (temporary) replacements, I sought out the longer ES CFL's,
because lacking reflectors, the fittings absorbed all the light if they
sank all the way into the fittings.

If the aim was even lighting, the originals should have been installed at
a spacing which gave just that. Changing to some sort of 'all round' bulb
in a fitting designed for a reflector bulb which gives a defined beam is
going to be a compromise. As is fitting any bulb with a different beam
pattern to the original.

As said, that was intended to be just a temporary solution, until I
decided how to move forward, but these LED floods seem to solve the
issue completely and for not a lot of cost or effort.

--
*Go the extra mile. It makes your boss look like an incompetent slacker *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.