I've Dell Dimension 5000 which must be in the order of 7 or 8 years
old. There's no problems with it apart from it being bit slow on
photo processing, which is the only processor intensive activity I do
apart form a bit of SketchUp and that seems OK.

Is it new wine into old bottles to consider a motherboard/processor
upgrade ? If it's worth doing how do I work out what board type is in
it at the moment and what would I be best to look for ? I'm quite
happy to go the Ebay path and look for someone else's upgrading cast-
off.

Thanks for any help

Rob

robgraham wrote:

I've Dell Dimension 5000 which must be in the order of 7 or 8 years
old. There's no problems with it apart from it being bit slow on
photo processing, which is the only processor intensive activity I do
apart form a bit of SketchUp and that seems OK.

Is it new wine into old bottles to consider a motherboard/processor
upgrade ?

Yes - for that age...



If it's worth doing how do I work out what board type is in
it at the moment and what would I be best to look for ? I'm quite
happy to go the Ebay path and look for someone else's upgrading cast-
off.

Thanks for any help

Rob
--
Tim Watts Personal Blog: http://www.dionic.net/tim/

"It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent
moral busybodies."

"robgraham" wrote in message
...
I've Dell Dimension 5000 which must be in the order of 7 or 8 years
old. There's no problems with it apart from it being bit slow on
photo processing, which is the only processor intensive activity I do
apart form a bit of SketchUp and that seems OK.

Is it new wine into old bottles to consider a motherboard/processor
upgrade ? If it's worth doing how do I work out what board type is in
it at the moment and what would I be best to look for ? I'm quite
happy to go the Ebay path and look for someone else's upgrading cast-
off.


You will need a new mother board, processor, and memory - which is most of
the cost of a new PC.
You may well need a new PSU because the older MoBos had less power
requirements and fewer connectors so the PSU may not have enough connectors.
The hard discs may be PATA and small - somee modern MoBos only do SATA.

So you may be only saving the cost of a case.

Just keeping a friend's Dell staggering on and have been contemplating much
the same thing - with the conclusion that he'd be better off with a new
laptop. :-)

Cheers

Dave R
--
No plan survives contact with the enemy.
[Not even bunny]

Helmuth von Moltke the Elder

(\__/)
(='.'=)
(")_(")

On 18/12/2012 21:22, David WE Roberts wrote:

"robgraham" wrote in message
...
I've Dell Dimension 5000 which must be in the order of 7 or 8 years
old. There's no problems with it apart from it being bit slow on
photo processing, which is the only processor intensive activity I do
apart form a bit of SketchUp and that seems OK.

Is it new wine into old bottles to consider a motherboard/processor
upgrade ? If it's worth doing how do I work out what board type is in
it at the moment and what would I be best to look for ? I'm quite
happy to go the Ebay path and look for someone else's upgrading cast-
off.


You will need a new mother board, processor, and memory - which is most
of the cost of a new PC.
You may well need a new PSU because the older MoBos had less power
requirements and fewer connectors so the PSU may not have enough
connectors.
The hard discs may be PATA and small - somee modern MoBos only do SATA.

So you may be only saving the cost of a case.

Just keeping a friend's Dell staggering on and have been contemplating
much the same thing - with the conclusion that he'd be better off with a
new laptop. :-)

Cheers

Dave R

I build PCs as a hobby all the time. I used to at first save quite a bit
of money doing the self build route vs buying a ready built system.

Also at the time, laptops were more expensive than similar specced
desktop PCs.

Now, there's no saving in it doing self build compared to buying a
system box from Tesco's as you can re-use the keyboard, mouse and
monitor and printer. Laptops now seem to have reached parity price wise
with their similar specced desktop equivalents.

The price premium seems to have moved to the tablet and smartphone
market now. An Apple Ipad costs more than a laptop now.

Tesco do system boxes from 300 quid upwards and laptops from 270 quid
upwards. I could not match let alone beat that price wise for a self
build now.

On 18/12/2012 20:46, robgraham wrote:
I've Dell Dimension 5000 which must be in the order of 7 or 8 years
old. There's no problems with it apart from it being bit slow on
photo processing, which is the only processor intensive activity I do
apart form a bit of SketchUp and that seems OK.

Is it new wine into old bottles to consider a motherboard/processor
upgrade ? If it's worth doing how do I work out what board type is in
it at the moment and what would I be best to look for ? I'm quite
happy to go the Ebay path and look for someone else's upgrading cast-
off.

Thanks for any help

Rob

Older Dells (and possibly newer ones) use none standard motherboards and
fixings, so a generic motherboard won't be a straight replacement.

SteveW

On Tue, 18 Dec 2012 21:46:41 +0000, SteveW wrote:

On 18/12/2012 20:46, robgraham wrote:
I've Dell Dimension 5000 which must be in the order of 7 or 8 years
old. There's no problems with it apart from it being bit slow on photo
processing, which is the only processor intensive activity I do apart
form a bit of SketchUp and that seems OK.

Is it new wine into old bottles to consider a motherboard/processor
upgrade ? If it's worth doing how do I work out what board type is in
it at the moment and what would I be best to look for ? I'm quite
happy to go the Ebay path and look for someone else's upgrading cast-
off.

Thanks for any help

Rob

Older Dells (and possibly newer ones) use none standard motherboards and
fixings, so a generic motherboard won't be a straight replacement.

And some use non standard PSUs, but with a plug that fits. Lots of magic
smoke.



--
Use the BIG mirror service in the UK:
http://www.mirrorservice.org

*lightning protection* - a w_tom conductor

On 18/12/2012 20:46, robgraham wrote:
I've Dell Dimension 5000 which must be in the order of 7 or 8 years
old. There's no problems with it apart from it being bit slow on
photo processing, which is the only processor intensive activity I do
apart form a bit of SketchUp and that seems OK.

Is it new wine into old bottles to consider a motherboard/processor
upgrade ? If it's worth doing how do I work out what board type is in
it at the moment and what would I be best to look for ? I'm quite
happy to go the Ebay path and look for someone else's upgrading cast-
off.

The copy of Windows you got was a machine is locked to the Dell BIOS on
the motherboard, so if you change that to a generic motherboard you will
also need a new copy of Windows.

Have you checked to see whether you can put an upgraded processor on the
existing motherboard? That particular machine takes Pentium 4HT processors.

I thought of upgrading the processor in my own 4 year old Dell, but I am
finding that people are asking silly money for what are now second-hand
out of date CPUs.

On 18/12/2012 22:31, GB wrote:
On 18/12/2012 20:46, robgraham wrote:
I've Dell Dimension 5000 which must be in the order of 7 or 8 years
old. There's no problems with it apart from it being bit slow on
photo processing, which is the only processor intensive activity I do
apart form a bit of SketchUp and that seems OK.

Is it new wine into old bottles to consider a motherboard/processor
upgrade ? If it's worth doing how do I work out what board type is in
it at the moment and what would I be best to look for ? I'm quite
happy to go the Ebay path and look for someone else's upgrading cast-
off.

The copy of Windows you got was a machine is locked to the Dell BIOS on
the motherboard, so if you change that to a generic motherboard you will
also need a new copy of Windows.


I did a complete system change a couple of years back and, when locked
out of Windows, I phoned MS and was given a new key. ISTR something like
2 or 3 major hardware changes were allowed, bless 'em. I can't remember
the details, other than it was surprisingly painless.

Rob

The working machines are probably best left as they are, as they could be
turned into handy little servers on the network or just used for non
demanding stuff on the network. the main issue will be keeping any anti
virus up to date when microsoft stop supporting the xp systems. I recall
when 98 was stopped nobody made an anti virus after about a year or so.

Brian

--
Brian Gaff....Note, this account does not accept Bcc: email.
graphics are great, but the blind can't hear them
Email:
__________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ __________


"David WE Roberts" wrote in message
...

"robgraham" wrote in message
...
I've Dell Dimension 5000 which must be in the order of 7 or 8 years
old. There's no problems with it apart from it being bit slow on
photo processing, which is the only processor intensive activity I do
apart form a bit of SketchUp and that seems OK.

Is it new wine into old bottles to consider a motherboard/processor
upgrade ? If it's worth doing how do I work out what board type is in
it at the moment and what would I be best to look for ? I'm quite
happy to go the Ebay path and look for someone else's upgrading cast-
off.


You will need a new mother board, processor, and memory - which is most of
the cost of a new PC.
You may well need a new PSU because the older MoBos had less power
requirements and fewer connectors so the PSU may not have enough
connectors.
The hard discs may be PATA and small - somee modern MoBos only do SATA.

So you may be only saving the cost of a case.

Just keeping a friend's Dell staggering on and have been contemplating
much the same thing - with the conclusion that he'd be better off with a
new laptop. :-)

Cheers

Dave R
--
No plan survives contact with the enemy.
[Not even bunny]

Helmuth von Moltke the Elder

(\__/)
(='.'=)
(")_(")

On 18/12/2012 21:46, SteveW wrote:
On 18/12/2012 20:46, robgraham wrote:
I've Dell Dimension 5000 which must be in the order of 7 or 8 years
old. There's no problems with it apart from it being bit slow on
photo processing, which is the only processor intensive activity I do
apart form a bit of SketchUp and that seems OK.

Is it new wine into old bottles to consider a motherboard/processor
upgrade ? If it's worth doing how do I work out what board type is in
it at the moment and what would I be best to look for ? I'm quite
happy to go the Ebay path and look for someone else's upgrading cast-
off.

Thanks for any help

Rob

Older Dells (and possibly newer ones) use none standard motherboards and
fixings, so a generic motherboard won't be a straight replacement.

SteveW



I agree totally on SteveW's point on Dells.

On 18/12/2012 22:31, GB wrote:
On 18/12/2012 20:46, robgraham wrote:
I've Dell Dimension 5000 which must be in the order of 7 or 8 years
old. There's no problems with it apart from it being bit slow on
photo processing, which is the only processor intensive activity I do
apart form a bit of SketchUp and that seems OK.

Is it new wine into old bottles to consider a motherboard/processor
upgrade ? If it's worth doing how do I work out what board type is in
it at the moment and what would I be best to look for ? I'm quite
happy to go the Ebay path and look for someone else's upgrading cast-
off.

The copy of Windows you got was a machine is locked to the Dell BIOS on
the motherboard, so if you change that to a generic motherboard you will
also need a new copy of Windows.

Have you checked to see whether you can put an upgraded processor on the
existing motherboard? That particular machine takes Pentium 4HT
processors.

I thought of upgrading the processor in my own 4 year old Dell, but I am
finding that people are asking silly money for what are now second-hand
out of date CPUs.


Agree with the point regarding Windows being locked to the Dell Bios....

In message , Stephen H
writes

Tesco do system boxes from 300 quid upwards and laptops from 270 quid
upwards. I could not match let alone beat that price wise for a self
build now.

But you can tailor it to your requirements (to an extent)

--
geoff

In article 3f22127c-362a-4055-bb21-
,
says...

I've Dell Dimension 5000 which must be in the order of 7 or 8 years
old. There's no problems with it apart from it being bit slow on
photo processing, which is the only processor intensive activity I do
apart form a bit of SketchUp and that seems OK.

Is it new wine into old bottles to consider a motherboard/processor
upgrade ? If it's worth doing how do I work out what board type is in
it at the moment and what would I be best to look for ? I'm quite
happy to go the Ebay path and look for someone else's upgrading cast-
off.

Thanks for any help

Are you still using the same photo processing software?
If so, and photo processing has slowed down over time, you might get
away without spending much money - perhaps none.

Run CCleaner[1], remove any unused applications & games etc, tidy up the
Registry.
Defrag your hard disk.

If that doesn't do it, check how much RAM is fitted & see what it would
cost to double it.
(if your using 32 bit windows, there's a limit on how much RAM it can
use).


[1] When installing CCleaner, it will suggest adding a (Yahoo?) toolbar
to your browser - just say no.

--
Sam

On 18/12/2012 20:46, robgraham wrote:

I've Dell Dimension 5000 which must be in the order of 7 or 8 years
old. There's no problems with it apart from it being bit slow on
photo processing, which is the only processor intensive activity I do
apart form a bit of SketchUp and that seems OK.

Is it new wine into old bottles to consider a motherboard/processor
upgrade ? If it's worth doing how do I work out what board type is in
it at the moment and what would I be best to look for ? I'm quite
happy to go the Ebay path and look for someone else's upgrading cast-
off.

Well you would need to budget for a new mobo, proc, ram, and probably
PSU. You might even want a new HDD. New mobos usually have no floppy
drive support. So really all you get to keep is the box. An knowing Dell
that might be non standard in terms of mobo mounting holes and various
other "value added engineering" designed to get on your tits and make
upgrades a PITA.

The only attractions of doing an upgrade rather than simply getting a
new system unit is that you can (mostly) leave the software alone - so
you get to keep all your installed apps, settings, and files. You can
also specify in more detail what components you want. Since you don't
sound like you are pushing any boundaries in terms of use or performance
requirements, the latter point is probably of little benefit.

Also keep in mind that Windows XP only has support for about another 16
months - so an upgrade to Win 7 may not be a bad thing at this point
anyway. Sometimes getting dell supplied versions of windows to work on
mobos without a dell BIOS takes an extra few mins of titting about
hacking windows loader files as well.

So in summary, buy a new base unit! If you want to sprinkle a bit of
performance improving pixy dust on what you have, then get a SSD and
clone your HDD to that (but only if your existing mobo has some SATA
connectors) - that can make older slow machines seem far more rapid.






--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

On Tue, 18 Dec 2012 22:31:02 +0000, GB
wrote:

The copy of Windows you got was a machine is locked to the Dell BIOS on
the motherboard, so if you change that to a generic motherboard you will
also need a new copy of Windows.

Not so. My XP Pro I ran for years was an ex-Dell OEM disc which didn't
ever ask or give a stuff about the hardware.

On 19/12/2012 01:27, Grimly Curmudgeon wrote:
On Tue, 18 Dec 2012 22:31:02 +0000, GB
wrote:

The copy of Windows you got was a machine is locked to the Dell BIOS on
the motherboard, so if you change that to a generic motherboard you will
also need a new copy of Windows.

Not so. My XP Pro I ran for years was an ex-Dell OEM disc which didn't
ever ask or give a stuff about the hardware.


It seems that big corporate users throw stuff out after 4 years so
there's usually a glut of Dells on EBay

On 19/12/2012 01:11, John Rumm wrote:
On 18/12/2012 20:46, robgraham wrote:

I've Dell Dimension 5000 which must be in the order of 7 or 8 years
old. There's no problems with it apart from it being bit slow on
photo processing, which is the only processor intensive activity I do
apart form a bit of SketchUp and that seems OK.

Is it new wine into old bottles to consider a motherboard/processor
upgrade ? If it's worth doing how do I work out what board type is in
it at the moment and what would I be best to look for ? I'm quite
happy to go the Ebay path and look for someone else's upgrading cast-
off.

Well you would need to budget for a new mobo, proc, ram, and probably
PSU. You might even want a new HDD. New mobos usually have no floppy
drive support. So really all you get to keep is the box. An knowing Dell
that might be non standard in terms of mobo mounting holes and various
other "value added engineering" designed to get on your tits and make
upgrades a PITA.

The only attractions of doing an upgrade rather than simply getting a
new system unit is that you can (mostly) leave the software alone - so
you get to keep all your installed apps, settings, and files. You can
also specify in more detail what components you want. Since you don't
sound like you are pushing any boundaries in terms of use or performance
requirements, the latter point is probably of little benefit.

Also keep in mind that Windows XP only has support for about another 16
months - so an upgrade to Win 7 may not be a bad thing at this point
anyway. Sometimes getting dell supplied versions of windows to work on
mobos without a dell BIOS takes an extra few mins of titting about
hacking windows loader files as well.

So in summary, buy a new base unit! If you want to sprinkle a bit of
performance improving pixy dust on what you have, then get a SSD and
clone your HDD to that (but only if your existing mobo has some SATA
connectors) - that can make older slow machines seem far more rapid.


If you do a motherboard upgrade you are effectively trashing your
computer as soon as you start. Any problem that you have during the
process will delay you getting a working machine again. So if you need a
replacement motherboard, the processor blows up, or the graphics card
intermittently seizes, you don't have a working machine until it is
resolved. You set a harsh, unforgiving timetable and awkward working
conditions.

Whereas if you get a new box, switching over peripherals is easy
(assuming compatible connections are available). You retain your old box
for regression - at least for a while - and for downloading that elusive
64-bit NIC driver without which your new box won't connect to anything.

And if you were going W7,there is a not-too-bad migration tool that
picks up a lot of things from the old system if that is what you want to do.

Even into the future it could sit somewhere as an emergency box or be
re-purposed in some way.

--
Rod

On Wed, 19 Dec 2012 00:12:01 +0000, geoff wrote:

In message , Stephen H
writes

Tesco do system boxes from 300 quid upwards and laptops from 270 quid
upwards. I could not match let alone beat that price wise for a self
build now.

But you can tailor it to your requirements (to an extent)

And you can install decent components rather than an unnamed PSU and
an ECS motherboard from the cheap box shifters.
--
(\__/) M.
(='.'=) If a man stands in a forest and no woman is around
(")_(") is he still wrong?

On Wed, 19 Dec 2012 00:17:19 -0000, Sam Plusnet wrote:

In article 3f22127c-362a-4055-bb21-
,
says...

I've Dell Dimension 5000 which must be in the order of 7 or 8 years
old. There's no problems with it apart from it being bit slow on
photo processing, which is the only processor intensive activity I do
apart form a bit of SketchUp and that seems OK.

Is it new wine into old bottles to consider a motherboard/processor
upgrade ? If it's worth doing how do I work out what board type is in
it at the moment and what would I be best to look for ? I'm quite
happy to go the Ebay path and look for someone else's upgrading cast-
off.

Thanks for any help

Are you still using the same photo processing software?
If so, and photo processing has slowed down over time, you might get
away without spending much money - perhaps none.

Run CCleaner[1], remove any unused applications & games etc, tidy up the
Registry.
Defrag your hard disk.

And uninstall all the software that you don't use any more.

If that doesn't do it, check how much RAM is fitted & see what it would
cost to double it.
(if your using 32 bit windows, there's a limit on how much RAM it can
use).

[1] When installing CCleaner, it will suggest adding a (Yahoo?) toolbar
to your browser - just say no.

I hate this. I would not use software that attempts to trick people
to install crapware.
--
(\__/) M.
(='.'=) If a man stands in a forest and no woman is around
(")_(") is he still wrong?

On Dec 19, 7:56*am, stuart noble wrote:
On 19/12/2012 01:27, Grimly Curmudgeon wrote:

On Tue, 18 Dec 2012 22:31:02 +0000, GB
wrote:

The copy of Windows you got was a machine is locked to the Dell BIOS on
the motherboard, so if you change that to a generic motherboard you will
also need a new copy of Windows.

Not so. My XP Pro I ran for years was an ex-Dell OEM disc which didn't
ever ask or give a stuff about the hardware.

It seems that big corporate users throw stuff out after 4 years so
there's usually a glut of Dells on EBay

My employer now crushes absolutely everything (used to be just the
HDDs) due to an attack of corporate IT paranoia. Hugely powerful
machines when new, still very powerful after 4 years. They used to
sell them off to employess for charity...

MBQ

On 18/12/12 20:46, robgraham wrote:
I've Dell Dimension 5000 which must be in the order of 7 or 8 years
old. There's no problems with it apart from it being bit slow on
photo processing, which is the only processor intensive activity I do
apart form a bit of SketchUp and that seems OK.

Is it new wine into old bottles to consider a motherboard/processor
upgrade ? If it's worth doing how do I work out what board type is in
it at the moment and what would I be best to look for ? I'm quite
happy to go the Ebay path and look for someone else's upgrading cast-
off.

Thanks for any help

Rob

The problem I have had in the past is that old cases don't fit new
motherboards, and cases are in any case cheap.

So I generally ask the question of my PC builder, and if the answer is
'it wont fit' get a new case.

The RAM doesn't fit either, and in fact usually the only components that
are reusable are the disk and CDROM drive, and if its that old,
generally I don't want the disk anyway.

So unless you can simply replace the CPU Id say replace the whole machine.

Its less expensive than you think. A CPU/board/RAM/Case/Disk/GPU setup
is generally sub £250 where I buy. I buy what's cheap and as fast as the
money will afford.

(http://www.woc.co.uk)




--
Ineptocracy

(in-ep-toc-ra-cy) €“ a system of government where the least capable to
lead are elected by the least capable of producing, and where the
members of society least likely to sustain themselves or succeed, are
rewarded with goods and services paid for by the confiscated wealth of a
diminishing number of producers.

On 19/12/12 10:47, Man at B&Q wrote:
On Dec 19, 7:56 am, stuart noble wrote:
On 19/12/2012 01:27, Grimly Curmudgeon wrote:

On Tue, 18 Dec 2012 22:31:02 +0000, GB
wrote:

The copy of Windows you got was a machine is locked to the Dell BIOS on
the motherboard, so if you change that to a generic motherboard you will
also need a new copy of Windows.

Not so. My XP Pro I ran for years was an ex-Dell OEM disc which didn't
ever ask or give a stuff about the hardware.

It seems that big corporate users throw stuff out after 4 years so
there's usually a glut of Dells on EBay

My employer now crushes absolutely everything (used to be just the
HDDs) due to an attack of corporate IT paranoia. Hugely powerful
machines when new, still very powerful after 4 years. They used to
sell them off to employess for charity...

MBQ

My brother in law is the man who gives the order to crush..

"The cost of taking them apart to remove and crush the disks alone is
greater than the cost of crushing the whole box: And the overhead and
cost of selling the box would negate its actually resale value, without
a disk and a windows license."



--
Ineptocracy

(in-ep-toc-ra-cy) €“ a system of government where the least capable to
lead are elected by the least capable of producing, and where the
members of society least likely to sustain themselves or succeed, are
rewarded with goods and services paid for by the confiscated wealth of a
diminishing number of producers.

On Dec 19, 10:58*am, The Natural Philosopher
wrote:
On 18/12/12 20:46, robgraham wrote: I've Dell Dimension 5000 which must be in the order of 7 or 8 years
old. *There's no problems with it apart from it being bit slow on
photo processing, which is the only processor intensive activity I do
apart form a bit of SketchUp and that seems OK.

Is it new wine into old bottles to consider a motherboard/processor
upgrade ? *If it's worth doing how do I work out what board type is in
it at the moment and what would I be best to look for ? *I'm quite
happy to go the Ebay path and look for someone else's upgrading cast-
off.

Thanks for any help

Rob

The problem I have had in the past is that old cases don't fit new
motherboards, and cases are in any case cheap.

So I generally ask the question of my PC builder, and if the answer is
'it wont fit' get a new case.

The RAM doesn't fit either, and in fact usually the only components that
are reusable are the disk and CDROM drive, and if its that old,
generally I don't want the disk anyway.

So unless you can simply replace the CPU Id say replace the whole machine..

Its less expensive than you think. A CPU/board/RAM/Case/Disk/GPU setup
is generally sub £250 where I buy. I buy what's cheap and as fast as the
money will afford.

(http://www.woc.co.uk)

--
Ineptocracy

(in-ep-toc’-ra-cy) – a system of government where the least capable to
lead are elected by the least capable of producing, and where the
members of society least likely to sustain themselves or succeed, are
rewarded with goods and services paid for by the confiscated wealth of a
diminishing number of producers.

Many thanks guys - I think by the time Dell got to this design of
machine, they had moved away from their dedicated components
philosophy - it is a standard board for the period in this machine,
with standard RAM and PSU. And again there's no BIOS/OS interlink
here and the HD is SATA.

However the points that you are making are all very valid and I thank
you all for going through the 'Disadvantages'.

So
Advantages -
Low Cost
Possibly retain all applications
Retain XP (for the moment)

Disadvantages -
MB form factor
RAM incompatability
PSU ditto (chickened out of typing that twice!)
Hassle factor getting it all to work

and so on for the other ones I can't remember, but that's enough to
convince me, though I will lose the fun of doing an Ebay search, bid,
etc., and I'll need to set aside some more pennies.

Again many thanks

Rob

On 18/12/2012 21:46, SteveW wrote:
On 18/12/2012 20:46, robgraham wrote:

Older Dells (and possibly newer ones) use none standard motherboards and
fixings, so a generic motherboard won't be a straight replacement.

I have 2 "old" Dells in the shop (this being one) both of which are
apparently "non-standard" mother boards that can't be upgraded.

One good reason for an initial "build your own" with a quality case as
at least you have one component that can be re-used many times over, and
it's nice to have /exactly/ the spec you want when doing a top spec. build.

Pete @

--
http://www.GymRatZ.co.uk - Fitness+Gym Equipment.
http://www.bodysolid-gym-equipment.co.uk
http://www.trade-price-supplements.co.uk
http://www.water-rower.co.uk

On 19/12/2012 09:09, polygonum wrote:
On 19/12/2012 01:11, John Rumm wrote:
On 18/12/2012 20:46, robgraham wrote:

I've Dell Dimension 5000 which must be in the order of 7 or 8 years
old. There's no problems with it apart from it being bit slow on
photo processing, which is the only processor intensive activity I do
apart form a bit of SketchUp and that seems OK.

Is it new wine into old bottles to consider a motherboard/processor
upgrade ? If it's worth doing how do I work out what board type is in
it at the moment and what would I be best to look for ? I'm quite
happy to go the Ebay path and look for someone else's upgrading cast-
off.

Well you would need to budget for a new mobo, proc, ram, and probably
PSU. You might even want a new HDD. New mobos usually have no floppy
drive support. So really all you get to keep is the box. An knowing Dell
that might be non standard in terms of mobo mounting holes and various
other "value added engineering" designed to get on your tits and make
upgrades a PITA.

The only attractions of doing an upgrade rather than simply getting a
new system unit is that you can (mostly) leave the software alone - so
you get to keep all your installed apps, settings, and files. You can
also specify in more detail what components you want. Since you don't
sound like you are pushing any boundaries in terms of use or performance
requirements, the latter point is probably of little benefit.

Also keep in mind that Windows XP only has support for about another 16
months - so an upgrade to Win 7 may not be a bad thing at this point
anyway. Sometimes getting dell supplied versions of windows to work on
mobos without a dell BIOS takes an extra few mins of titting about
hacking windows loader files as well.

So in summary, buy a new base unit! If you want to sprinkle a bit of
performance improving pixy dust on what you have, then get a SSD and
clone your HDD to that (but only if your existing mobo has some SATA
connectors) - that can make older slow machines seem far more rapid.


If you do a motherboard upgrade you are effectively trashing your
computer as soon as you start. Any problem that you have during the
process will delay you getting a working machine again. So if you need a
replacement motherboard, the processor blows up, or the graphics card
intermittently seizes, you don't have a working machine until it is
resolved. You set a harsh, unforgiving timetable and awkward working
conditions.

This is true - a bit like working on your car - it helps to have another
one to go get bits etc. Same applies here, another working machine is
very useful.

Whereas if you get a new box, switching over peripherals is easy
(assuming compatible connections are available). You retain your old box
for regression - at least for a while - and for downloading that elusive
64-bit NIC driver without which your new box won't connect to anything.

Having said that, if gutting and rebuilding the box, you can still use
the old one as a pile of parts on the desk!

And if you were going W7,there is a not-too-bad migration tool that
picks up a lot of things from the old system if that is what you want to
do.

Its varies from "ok" to "pigs breakfast" in terms of results I find -
depending on what software stack you normally run.

Even into the future it could sit somewhere as an emergency box or be
re-purposed in some way.



--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

On 19/12/2012 01:27, Grimly Curmudgeon wrote:
On Tue, 18 Dec 2012 22:31:02 +0000, GB
wrote:

The copy of Windows you got was a machine is locked to the Dell BIOS on
the motherboard, so if you change that to a generic motherboard you will
also need a new copy of Windows.

Not so. My XP Pro I ran for years was an ex-Dell OEM disc which didn't
ever ask or give a stuff about the hardware.

It varies.... they have got less restrictive with time. Older machines
(and certainly Win2K machines) frequently looked for a Dell BIOS. More
recent stuff has got less fussy.


--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

On 19/12/2012 11:25, Huge wrote:
On 2012-12-19, Mark wrote:
On Wed, 19 Dec 2012 00:17:19 -0000, Sam Plusnet wrote:

In article 3f22127c-362a-4055-bb21-
,
says...

I've Dell Dimension 5000 which must be in the order of 7 or 8 years
old. There's no problems with it apart from it being bit slow on
photo processing, which is the only processor intensive activity I do
apart form a bit of SketchUp and that seems OK.

Is it new wine into old bottles to consider a motherboard/processor
upgrade ? If it's worth doing how do I work out what board type is in
it at the moment and what would I be best to look for ? I'm quite
happy to go the Ebay path and look for someone else's upgrading cast-
off.

Thanks for any help

Are you still using the same photo processing software?
If so, and photo processing has slowed down over time, you might get
away without spending much money - perhaps none.

Run CCleaner[1], remove any unused applications & games etc, tidy up the
Registry.
Defrag your hard disk.

And uninstall all the software that you don't use any more.

If that doesn't do it, check how much RAM is fitted & see what it would
cost to double it.
(if your using 32 bit windows, there's a limit on how much RAM it can
use).

[1] When installing CCleaner, it will suggest adding a (Yahoo?) toolbar
to your browser - just say no.

I hate this. I would not use software that attempts to trick people
to install crapware.

Problem is, even the big "reputable" players do it... download flash or
Reader from adobe - get McAfee bundled with it etc, and don't get me
started on sodding browser "toolbars"!

Apropos of nothing very much, this kind of stuff regularly reminds me
why I like Linux. And why when people tell me that Windows is "intuitive",
my response is hollow laughter.

Its not really an OS specific issue though - just a marketing one. If
they same players were promoting the same apps on Linux, you can bet the
same dodgy cross promotion deals would get done.

Apple are as bad... "Oh there is a new version of quicktime - shall I
install it for you?" (with the gimmy iTunes, and safari boxes also ready
ticked!)


--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

On 19/12/2012 13:11, John Rumm wrote:
On 19/12/2012 09:09, polygonum wrote:


And if you were going W7,there is a not-too-bad migration tool that
picks up a lot of things from the old system if that is what you want to
do.

Its varies from "ok" to "pigs breakfast" in terms of results I find -
depending on what software stack you normally run.


But at least you have the choice if the old system still exists! :-)

(Actually did an excellent copy across for last time I tried. I was
genuinely surprised.)

--
Rod

Huge wrote:
On 2012-12-19, Huge wrote:
[snip]

Sorry, I was referring to the CCCleaner stuff. And the pain of migrating
to knew hardware.

"Knew"??? ****wit.

IAWTP!

--
€¢DarWin|
_/ _/

"Bob Eager" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 18 Dec 2012 21:46:41 +0000, SteveW wrote:

On 18/12/2012 20:46, robgraham wrote:
I've Dell Dimension 5000 which must be in the order of 7 or 8 years
old. There's no problems with it apart from it being bit slow on photo
processing, which is the only processor intensive activity I do apart
form a bit of SketchUp and that seems OK.

Is it new wine into old bottles to consider a motherboard/processor
upgrade ? If it's worth doing how do I work out what board type is in
it at the moment and what would I be best to look for ? I'm quite
happy to go the Ebay path and look for someone else's upgrading cast-
off.

Thanks for any help

Rob

Older Dells (and possibly newer ones) use none standard motherboards and
fixings, so a generic motherboard won't be a straight replacement.

And some use non standard PSUs, but with a plug that fits. Lots of magic
smoke.


I am trying to fit a reasonably new PSU to an old Dell and I will have to
take tinsnips to the case to get the new PSU in.
Screw holes are in the same place but the hole for the power cable is in the
wrong place.

--
No plan survives contact with the enemy.
[Not even bunny]

Helmuth von Moltke the Elder

(\__/)
(='.'=)
(")_(")

On Wed, 19 Dec 2012 01:11:40 +0000, John Rumm
wrote:

Also keep in mind that Windows XP only has support for about another 16
months

'kin hell what a depressing thought


--

On 18/12/2012 20:46, robgraham wrote:
I've Dell Dimension 5000 which must be in the order of 7 or 8 years
old. There's no problems with it apart from it being bit slow on
photo processing, which is the only processor intensive activity I do
apart form a bit of SketchUp and that seems OK.

Is it new wine into old bottles to consider a motherboard/processor
upgrade ? If it's worth doing how do I work out what board type is in
it at the moment and what would I be best to look for ? I'm quite
happy to go the Ebay path and look for someone else's upgrading cast-
off.


Dell build good solid machines for a good price - but they tend to use
non-standard components. You may find the PSU has an odd connector, for
example.

In any case at that age _everything_ in the system will be past its
sell-by date.

Scrap, and buy new.

No. Buy new, copy all your data off, then put the old one in a cupboard
for at least a year

Andy

On Wed, 19 Dec 2012 18:40:41 +0000, David WE Roberts wrote:

"Bob Eager" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 18 Dec 2012 21:46:41 +0000, SteveW wrote:

On 18/12/2012 20:46, robgraham wrote:
I've Dell Dimension 5000 which must be in the order of 7 or 8 years
old. There's no problems with it apart from it being bit slow on
photo processing, which is the only processor intensive activity I do
apart form a bit of SketchUp and that seems OK.

Is it new wine into old bottles to consider a motherboard/processor
upgrade ? If it's worth doing how do I work out what board type is
in it at the moment and what would I be best to look for ? I'm quite
happy to go the Ebay path and look for someone else's upgrading cast-
off.

Thanks for any help

Rob

Older Dells (and possibly newer ones) use none standard motherboards
and fixings, so a generic motherboard won't be a straight replacement.

And some use non standard PSUs, but with a plug that fits. Lots of
magic smoke.


I am trying to fit a reasonably new PSU to an old Dell and I will have
to take tinsnips to the case to get the new PSU in.
Screw holes are in the same place but the hole for the power cable is in
the wrong place.

Just ensure that the PSU plug wiring matches the motherboard.

--
Use the BIG mirror service in the UK:
http://www.mirrorservice.org

*lightning protection* - a w_tom conductor

On 19/12/2012 00:12, geoff wrote:
In message , Stephen H
writes

Tesco do system boxes from 300 quid upwards and laptops from 270 quid
upwards. I could not match let alone beat that price wise for a self
build now.

But you can tailor it to your requirements (to an extent)


yes you can tailor it to ones requirements and you pay more for the
privilege of doing so

On 19/12/2012 01:27, Grimly Curmudgeon wrote:
On Tue, 18 Dec 2012 22:31:02 +0000, GB
wrote:

The copy of Windows you got was a machine is locked to the Dell BIOS on
the motherboard, so if you change that to a generic motherboard you will
also need a new copy of Windows.

Not so. My XP Pro I ran for years was an ex-Dell OEM disc which didn't
ever ask or give a stuff about the hardware.


you were lucky.....

On 19/12/2012 13:23, John Rumm wrote:
On 19/12/2012 11:25, Huge wrote:
On 2012-12-19, Mark wrote:
On Wed, 19 Dec 2012 00:17:19 -0000, Sam Plusnet wrote:

In article 3f22127c-362a-4055-bb21-
,
says...

I've Dell Dimension 5000 which must be in the order of 7 or 8 years
old. There's no problems with it apart from it being bit slow on
photo processing, which is the only processor intensive activity I do
apart form a bit of SketchUp and that seems OK.

Is it new wine into old bottles to consider a motherboard/processor
upgrade ? If it's worth doing how do I work out what board type is in
it at the moment and what would I be best to look for ? I'm quite
happy to go the Ebay path and look for someone else's upgrading cast-
off.

Thanks for any help

Are you still using the same photo processing software?
If so, and photo processing has slowed down over time, you might get
away without spending much money - perhaps none.

Run CCleaner[1], remove any unused applications & games etc, tidy up
the
Registry.
Defrag your hard disk.

And uninstall all the software that you don't use any more.

If that doesn't do it, check how much RAM is fitted & see what it would
cost to double it.
(if your using 32 bit windows, there's a limit on how much RAM it can
use).

[1] When installing CCleaner, it will suggest adding a (Yahoo?) toolbar
to your browser - just say no.

I hate this. I would not use software that attempts to trick people
to install crapware.

Problem is, even the big "reputable" players do it... download flash or
Reader from adobe - get McAfee bundled with it etc, and don't get me
started on sodding browser "toolbars"!


I've discovered Ninite (google it)

Its so flipping handy and a real time saver when building a up a new PC.

It presents a list of applications such as Java, Shockwave, Adobe
Acrobat, Flashplayer, Thunderbird, Firefox, GIMP, AVG etc etc. You
simply tick the items you want and Ninite website will build a custom
executable installer and you download it.

Simply click on the downloaded file and it will download and install all
your wanted software without all the extra rubbish like ask toolbar,
Google Chrome, Ask Jeeves etc. It "knows" where to get all the required
files from.

Its a real time saver and you can use it across several machines.

Its now the third thing I run after installing a new OS. (the second
being an AV and firewall product).

Seriously, its one of the best utilities I have seen..... :-)

Stephen.

In message , Stephen H
writes
On 19/12/2012 00:12, geoff wrote:
In message , Stephen H
writes

Tesco do system boxes from 300 quid upwards and laptops from 270 quid
upwards. I could not match let alone beat that price wise for a self
build now.

But you can tailor it to your requirements (to an extent)


yes you can tailor it to ones requirements and you pay more for the
privilege of doing so


Lets see now

£250 for something that does what I want
£200 for something that doesn't

hard call ...


--
geoff

On 19/12/2012 23:06, geoff wrote:
In message , Stephen H
writes
On 19/12/2012 00:12, geoff wrote:
In message , Stephen H
writes

Tesco do system boxes from 300 quid upwards and laptops from 270 quid
upwards. I could not match let alone beat that price wise for a self
build now.

But you can tailor it to your requirements (to an extent)


yes you can tailor it to ones requirements and you pay more for the
privilege of doing so


Lets see now

£250 for something that does what I want
£200 for something that doesn't

hard call ...

The reality is that the margin on PC components is tiny - so the cost
difference between a self built PC and a bought one *of the same spec*
will often be under 5%. The way the prebuilt systems manage to look
cheaper is usually by cutting corners on some of the components. You
also have to contend with the fact that you may spend as long
uninstalling the unwanted shovelware preloaded on a boxed system, as you
would installing the OS yourself from scratch.


--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

On 19/12/2012 22:46, Stephen H wrote:
On 19/12/2012 13:23, John Rumm wrote:
On 19/12/2012 11:25, Huge wrote:
On 2012-12-19, Mark wrote:
On Wed, 19 Dec 2012 00:17:19 -0000, Sam Plusnet wrote:

In article 3f22127c-362a-4055-bb21-
,
says...

I've Dell Dimension 5000 which must be in the order of 7 or 8 years
old. There's no problems with it apart from it being bit slow on
photo processing, which is the only processor intensive activity I do
apart form a bit of SketchUp and that seems OK.

Is it new wine into old bottles to consider a motherboard/processor
upgrade ? If it's worth doing how do I work out what board type
is in
it at the moment and what would I be best to look for ? I'm quite
happy to go the Ebay path and look for someone else's upgrading cast-
off.

Thanks for any help

Are you still using the same photo processing software?
If so, and photo processing has slowed down over time, you might get
away without spending much money - perhaps none.

Run CCleaner[1], remove any unused applications & games etc, tidy up
the
Registry.
Defrag your hard disk.

And uninstall all the software that you don't use any more.

If that doesn't do it, check how much RAM is fitted & see what it
would
cost to double it.
(if your using 32 bit windows, there's a limit on how much RAM it can
use).

[1] When installing CCleaner, it will suggest adding a (Yahoo?)
toolbar
to your browser - just say no.

I hate this. I would not use software that attempts to trick people
to install crapware.

Problem is, even the big "reputable" players do it... download flash or
Reader from adobe - get McAfee bundled with it etc, and don't get me
started on sodding browser "toolbars"!


I've discovered Ninite (google it)

Its so flipping handy and a real time saver when building a up a new PC.

It presents a list of applications such as Java, Shockwave, Adobe
Acrobat, Flashplayer, Thunderbird, Firefox, GIMP, AVG etc etc. You
simply tick the items you want and Ninite website will build a custom
executable installer and you download it.

Thanks for that, it looks like it could be handy.

Simply click on the downloaded file and it will download and install all
your wanted software without all the extra rubbish like ask toolbar,
Google Chrome, Ask Jeeves etc. It "knows" where to get all the required
files from.

Its a real time saver and you can use it across several machines.

Its now the third thing I run after installing a new OS. (the second
being an AV and firewall product).

Seriously, its one of the best utilities I have seen..... :-)


In a similar way, have a look at nlite - its a very handy tool for
integrating service packs, hot fixes and tailoring windows components
and reducing them all down to a single bootable image. If you need to
rebuild a bunch of machines, it can get them from nothing to fully
patched and ready to go in practically one hit.

--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

On 20/12/12 02:16, John Rumm wrote:
On 19/12/2012 23:06, geoff wrote:
In message , Stephen H
writes
On 19/12/2012 00:12, geoff wrote:
In message , Stephen H
writes

Tesco do system boxes from 300 quid upwards and laptops from 270 quid
upwards. I could not match let alone beat that price wise for a self
build now.

But you can tailor it to your requirements (to an extent)


yes you can tailor it to ones requirements and you pay more for the
privilege of doing so


Lets see now

£250 for something that does what I want
£200 for something that doesn't

hard call ...

The reality is that the margin on PC components is tiny - so the cost
difference between a self built PC and a bought one *of the same spec*
will often be under 5%. The way the prebuilt systems manage to look
cheaper is usually by cutting corners on some of the components. You
also have to contend with the fact that you may spend as long
uninstalling the unwanted shovelware preloaded on a boxed system, as you
would installing the OS yourself from scratch.


well I just costed up a case, PSU MB (2GHz dual core celeron) 4GB ram
DVD RW and 500GB drive Nvidia graphics at £266 all in. Thats pretty much
the same as I have here, and its plenty fast enough for all but weird
gaming ****.


http://www.woc.co.uk

Ok add another £80 for windoze, which I personally wouldn't..Linux!

You could shave a bit off that for less RAM & hard drive, and use the
rather ordinary onboard graffix.


The problem with buying an 'all in' system is you tend to get an LCD
monitor and keyboard and mouse that you probably don't need.

*shrug* its whatever turns you on...

--
Ineptocracy

(in-ep-toc-ra-cy) €“ a system of government where the least capable to
lead are elected by the least capable of producing, and where the
members of society least likely to sustain themselves or succeed, are
rewarded with goods and services paid for by the confiscated wealth of a
diminishing number of producers.