I'm thinking of replacing our rather cheap TV aerial with a new
aerial to improved channel 5 reception and hopefully allow us
to pick up digital TV.

We have two aerials on the roof the top has 10 elements with a small back
plate
and the lower has 10 elements with a larger backplate. Reception of channel
5
on the lower one is pretty good but poor on the higher one.

I notice looking in Maplin that they have several aerials which should get
much better
reception than the aerials I currently have but most don't mention a group.

Also cpc have aerials which quote different groups A,B,C/D,W/B

Questions
1. Will picking a particular aerial group be better or should I simply pick
an
aerial W/B that will? pick up a wide bandwidth.
2. I notice a large difference in the number of elements some having up to
90 elements making
the aerial 2 metres long. Is more elements better?
3. Any advice on make Triax,Antiference,Televes,funke,Maxview

Any advice please. There are simply too many aerials to choose from.

On Sun, 9 Nov 2003 21:41:12 -0000, "David Cawkwell"
wrote:

I'm thinking of replacing our rather cheap TV aerial with a new
aerial to improved channel 5 reception and hopefully allow us
to pick up digital TV.

We have two aerials on the roof the top has 10 elements with a small back
plate
and the lower has 10 elements with a larger backplate. Reception of channel
5
on the lower one is pretty good but poor on the higher one.

I notice looking in Maplin that they have several aerials which should get
much better
reception than the aerials I currently have but most don't mention a group.

Also cpc have aerials which quote different groups A,B,C/D,W/B

Questions
1. Will picking a particular aerial group be better or should I simply pick
an
aerial W/B that will? pick up a wide bandwidth.
2. I notice a large difference in the number of elements some having up to
90 elements making
the aerial 2 metres long. Is more elements better?
3. Any advice on make Triax,Antiference,Televes,funke,Maxview

Any advice please. There are simply too many aerials to choose from.


I wouldn#t bother with any of the unbranded junk in the catalogues at
contract grade prices. Triax, Televes and Antiference make good
products and I have examples of product from each in use.

If you want better results on Ch5 analogue and for digital it will
depend on the transmitter that you are using as to whether WB is
required. Generally a grouped antenna will have higher gain and give
greater signal, but this can be compensated by a higher gain WB
antenna and may well prove a better strategy. More elements or the
equivalent of more elements in some designs will improve directional
behaviour as well as gain and signal level.

For best results on digital TV, the antenna should really be aligned
with the use of an error rate tester (either a meter or spectrum
analyser). Digital TV is optimum with lowest error rate in the
derived digital signal, not the signal strength and the two do not
necessarily coincide. For example, reflected signal can spoil error
rate. So it may make more sense to go for a professional
installation.

Also, the antenna should be connected using CT100 satellite cable, not
TV coax. The latter has poor screening and other electrical
characteristics.





..andy

To email, substitute .nospam with .gl

On Sun, 9 Nov 2003 21:41:12 -0000, "David Cawkwell"
wrote:

I'm thinking of replacing our rather cheap TV aerial with a new
aerial to improved channel 5 reception and hopefully allow us
to pick up digital TV.

The type of aerial is usually dependent upon the transmitter you are
receiving a signal from. Leastways, it was about 10 years ago when I
bought a new aerial.

You also need to bear in mind what the strength of the signal is, as
the further away from the transmitter you are the more sensitive an
aerial will be needed.

Check this web site:

http://tx.mb21.co.uk/

PoP

Also cpc have aerials which quote different groups A,B,C/D,W/B



Those are standard groups, W/B is wideband, covers all the band but at a
cost of lower gain usually.

Dave
--
And you were born knowing all about ms windows....??

"David Cawkwell" wrote in message
...
I'm thinking of replacing our rather cheap TV aerial with a new
aerial to improved channel 5 reception and hopefully allow us
to pick up digital TV.

We have two aerials on the roof the top has 10 elements with a small back
plate
and the lower has 10 elements with a larger backplate. Reception of
channel
5
on the lower one is pretty good but poor on the higher one.

I notice looking in Maplin that they have several aerials which should get
much better
reception than the aerials I currently have but most don't mention a
group.

Also cpc have aerials which quote different groups A,B,C/D,W/B

Questions
1. Will picking a particular aerial group be better or should I simply
pick
an
aerial W/B that will? pick up a wide bandwidth.
2. I notice a large difference in the number of elements some having up to
90 elements making
the aerial 2 metres long. Is more elements better?
3. Any advice on make Triax,Antiference,Televes,funke,Maxview

Any advice please. There are simply too many aerials to choose from.


The BBC website has a useful page on transmitter types and locations. You'll
be able to see from the direction of your aerial and the website which one
you are using. You can then choose the aerial type.

The difference in signal quality you currently have could just be down to a
poor connection at the aerial. If water gets in the screw terminals may have
corroded.

Don't automatically assume bigger is better. If you are close to the
transmitter and install a high gain antenna, you can overload the front end
of your receiving equipment (not causing damage, but enough signal to
introduce picture quality problems).

I used Scantec to order my stuff online. Great service and prices.

Colin M

In article ,
Colin M wrote:

Don't automatically assume bigger is better. If you are close to
the transmitter and install a high gain antenna, you can overload
the front end of your receiving equipment (not causing damage,
but enough signal to introduce picture quality problems).

Other way round I think. Close to a transmitter (as we are)
there are big problems with bounces and ghosting. So most
people reduce the ghosts with a directional aerial, (which
also tends to mean high gain), and then inline attenuators
to reduce the signal.

--
Tony Williams. Change "nospam" to "ledelec" to email.

PoP wrote
"David Cawkwell" wrote:

I'm thinking of replacing our rather cheap TV aerial with a new
aerial to improved channel 5 reception and hopefully allow us
to pick up digital TV.

The type of aerial is usually dependent upon the transmitter you are
receiving a signal from. Leastways, it was about 10 years ago when I
bought a new aerial.

Indeed, from Farnborough, depending if you're pointing at the Meridian
transmitter or back to the London mast, it's two different types of
aerial.

Your local aerial installer will advise what you need and even sell
you the right one for decent reception, and let you know where to
point it.

You then need to buy the fixings from Maplin and get a long ladder

Cheers,

Paul.

It was a number of local installers that ended up giving us these
crappy ones hence my reluctance to use any aerial installed
if all they do is turn up and charge £100 for a £3 aerial.

"Zymurgy" wrote in message
om...
PoP wrote
"David Cawkwell" wrote:

I'm thinking of replacing our rather cheap TV aerial with a new
aerial to improved channel 5 reception and hopefully allow us
to pick up digital TV.

The type of aerial is usually dependent upon the transmitter you are
receiving a signal from. Leastways, it was about 10 years ago when I
bought a new aerial.

Indeed, from Farnborough, depending if you're pointing at the Meridian
transmitter or back to the London mast, it's two different types of
aerial.

Your local aerial installer will advise what you need and even sell
you the right one for decent reception, and let you know where to
point it.

You then need to buy the fixings from Maplin and get a long ladder

Cheers,

Paul.

Check out http://www.antiference.co.uk/

Mike P

Also http://www.maxview.ltd.uk/

Mike P

Further to the information you can get from the sites I posted I would check
out the following aerial, it cured all of my problems, I also recommend
using CT100 coaxial cable.

The following gives you information on the DAT45 aerial.

http://www.jwhardy.com/televes/An_Ter_1095.pdf

Mike P.

Mike P. wrote:
Also http://www.maxview.ltd.uk/

Mike P

I bought a Maxview 18 element wide-band kit at B & Q for about £9. The kit
included 10M of coaxial cable and a complete fitting kit for indoor or
outdoor use. It's mounted in my loft & the reception is excellent.

Terry D.

In article , Terry D
writes
Mike P. wrote:
Also http://www.maxview.ltd.uk/

Mike P

I bought a Maxview 18 element wide-band kit at B & Q for about £9. The kit
included 10M of coaxial cable and a complete fitting kit for indoor or
outdoor use. It's mounted in my loft & the reception is excellent.

They aren't the best aerials though - they are very big, you can get
something much more compact and mechanically better for a bit more
money. I speak as one who installed one of the twangy things recently
with the crap B&Q co ax and since wished he had spent a bit more and got
something decent.
--
Tim Mitchell

On 10 Nov 2003 03:00:20 -0800, (Zymurgy)
wrote:

Indeed, from Farnborough, depending if you're pointing at the Meridian
transmitter or back to the London mast, it's two different types of
aerial.

I'm in Bracknell and we are served by Crystal Palace - 30 miles due
east. They reckon we don't have the Freeview channels available,
however the set top box finds quite a few anyway.

PoP

"Tony Williams" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Colin M wrote:

Don't automatically assume bigger is better. If you are close to
the transmitter and install a high gain antenna, you can overload
the front end of your receiving equipment (not causing damage,
but enough signal to introduce picture quality problems).

Other way round I think. Close to a transmitter (as we are)
there are big problems with bounces and ghosting. So most
people reduce the ghosts with a directional aerial, (which
also tends to mean high gain), and then inline attenuators
to reduce the signal.

--
Tony Williams. Change "nospam" to "ledelec" to email.

Equally use an antenna with a high front-back ratio - the commonest are the
log-periodic array which also has the advantage of being wideband, or the
short-backfire array a.k.a. the 'flying bedstead.'


--
Woody

In article , Tim Mitchell
writes
In article , Terry D
writes
Mike P. wrote:
Also http://www.maxview.ltd.uk/

Mike P

I bought a Maxview 18 element wide-band kit at B & Q for about £9. The kit
included 10M of coaxial cable and a complete fitting kit for indoor or
outdoor use. It's mounted in my loft & the reception is excellent.

They aren't the best aerials though - they are very big, you can get
something much more compact and mechanically better for a bit more
money. I speak as one who installed one of the twangy things recently
with the crap B&Q co ax and since wished he had spent a bit more and got
something decent.

Get a decent aerial such as a Triax or Antiference from www.cpc.co.uk
and then make sure you use a decent downlead such as CT100 the stuff
they use for satellite connections and don't have any unnecessary
connections in that lead and you will be well connected.

Using low grade aerials and the string that the DIY sheds sell as Low-
loss will offset any advantage that a good hi-gain aerial makes.

Look upon it as a long term investment just remember how many hours you
spend in front of the box!.

Of course if you're in spitting distance of a DTV transmitter you may
well be able to get away with a lesser system. Local knowledge is useful
here...
--
Tony Sayer

"David Cawkwell" wrote
"Zymurgy" wrote

Your local aerial installer will advise what you need and even sell
you the right one for decent reception, and let you know where to
point it.

It was a number of local installers that ended up giving us these
crappy ones hence my reluctance to use any aerial installed
if all they do is turn up and charge £100 for a £3 aerial.

I really meant the local aerial/tv shop (but not Curry's/Dixons
obviously rather than a mobile installer.

Bloke I talked to was very helpful and sold me an antiference one.
Couple of quid more than Maplins, but at least I knew it was the right
gain/type !

Where are you located ?

Cheers

Paul.

East Yorkshire Near Doncaster.
"Zymurgy" wrote in message
om...
"David Cawkwell" wrote
"Zymurgy" wrote

Your local aerial installer will advise what you need and even sell
you the right one for decent reception, and let you know where to
point it.

It was a number of local installers that ended up giving us these
crappy ones hence my reluctance to use any aerial installed
if all they do is turn up and charge £100 for a £3 aerial.

I really meant the local aerial/tv shop (but not Curry's/Dixons
obviously rather than a mobile installer.

Bloke I talked to was very helpful and sold me an antiference one.
Couple of quid more than Maplins, but at least I knew it was the right
gain/type !

Where are you located ?

Cheers

Paul.

On Sun, 9 Nov 2003 21:41:12 -0000, "David Cawkwell"
wrote:

I'm thinking of replacing our rather cheap TV aerial with a new
aerial to improved channel 5 reception and hopefully allow us
to pick up digital TV.


Take a look on uk.tech.broadcast there are helpful people on there
who are very professional. Google back a bit there are references to
site planning websites.

Take a look at: http://www.wrightsaerials.tv/

DG

On Mon, 10 Nov 2003 13:06:22 -0000, "David Cawkwell"
wrote:

It was a number of local installers that ended up giving us these
crappy ones hence my reluctance to use any aerial installed
if all they do is turn up and charge £100 for a £3 aerial.


So you call several installers and get them to tell you the exact make
and model of antenna, or you specify to them what you want, including
the cable.

If they don't play ball, go elsewhere. There are professional
installers of good quality products around. You should be able to get
a good product with CT100 cable installed properly for about £120.

Don't expect quality for £50


..andy

To email, substitute .nospam with .gl

On Mon, 10 Nov 2003 13:44:55 -0000, "Terry D"
wrote:

Mike P. wrote:
Also http://www.maxview.ltd.uk/

Mike P

I bought a Maxview 18 element wide-band kit at B & Q for about £9. The kit
included 10M of coaxial cable and a complete fitting kit for indoor or
outdoor use. It's mounted in my loft & the reception is excellent.

Terry D.



Sorry, but IME, Maxview products are junk.


..andy

To email, substitute .nospam with .gl

In article , Andy Hall
writes
On Mon, 10 Nov 2003 13:06:22 -0000, "David Cawkwell"
wrote:

It was a number of local installers that ended up giving us these
crappy ones hence my reluctance to use any aerial installed
if all they do is turn up and charge £100 for a £3 aerial.


So you call several installers and get them to tell you the exact make
and model of antenna, or you specify to them what you want, including
the cable.

If they don't play ball, go elsewhere. There are professional
installers of good quality products around. You should be able to get
a good product with CT100 cable installed properly for about £120.

Don't expect quality for £50


.andy

To email, substitute .nospam with .gl


Here's yer man if you need a rigger who knows it all, and he's in
Yorkshire too!!!!!

http://www.wrightsaerials.tv/
--
Tony Sayer

On Tue, 11 Nov 2003 22:47:38 +0000, tony sayer
wrote:

Here's yer man if you need a rigger who knows it all, and he's in
Yorkshire too!!!!!

http://www.wrightsaerials.tv/

Take a look at the rogues gallery link. Gives me confidence that even
my worst bodge wasn't so bad after all

PoP

"David Cawkwell" wrote in message
...
East Yorkshire Near Doncaster.
[snip]

Hmm. As Doncaster is in South Yorkshire, you must be in the old South
Humberside - east of Thorne, north of Gainsbrough, west of Scunny-ish?

If so you have no problem as, unless you live in the only dip in the area
you probably have a choice of three sites from which to get you TV. Primary
would be Emley, secondary would be Belmont (near Market Rasen in Lincs) and
third would be Bilsdale (Tyne Tees) near Northallerton.

What was that about a rotator?


--
Woody

David Cawkwell wrote:
East Yorkshire Near Doncaster.

Try repeating your question on uk.tech.broadcast, there are some very
knowledgeable people there including one chap called Bill Wright.

If you look here

http://www.dtg.org.uk/cgi-bin/www.dt.../coverage.html

You will find out whether you have any chance of receiving digital
channels. If it says no, it may still be possible as results are very
conservative.