I need to transfer some music from LP's to MP3 files so that I can make up a
CD. The LP's were never released onto CD.

I was toying with the idea of purchasing and using one of these cheapo usb
decks, but am very reluctant to payout if they are no good.

I have the chance to purchase a Garrard ST25p record deck and my thoughts
were that I could plug it into my tape machine and then into my PC. I know
the latter works well....

Any thoughts on the subject please.

Kindest regards,

Jim

the_constructor wrote:

I was toying with the idea of purchasing and using one of these cheapo usb
decks, but am very reluctant to payout if they are no good.
I have the chance to purchase a Garrard ST25p record deck and my thoughts
were that I could plug it into my tape machine and then into my PC.

I'm imagining the USB record deck is plasticky, weighs about 2 ounces
and has horrible wow and flutter ... An older deck going through a tape
player should be better, except you don't emention whether or not you'd
have a pre-amp to do equilization, I think some packages can do that in
softare now, whether it's as good, I've no idea.

Andy Burns wrote:
the_constructor wrote:

I was toying with the idea of purchasing and using one of these
cheapo usb
decks, but am very reluctant to payout if they are no good.
I have the chance to purchase a Garrard ST25p record deck and my thoughts
were that I could plug it into my tape machine and then into my PC.

I'm imagining the USB record deck is plasticky, weighs about 2 ounces
and has horrible wow and flutter ... An older deck going through a tape
player should be better, except you don't emention whether or not you'd
have a pre-amp to do equilization, I think some packages can do that in
softare now, whether it's as good, I've no idea.



A Garrard SP25 is hardly hifi either..

On Sep 30, 6:21*am, The Natural Philosopher
wrote:
Andy Burns wrote:
the_constructor wrote:

I was toying with the idea of purchasing and using *one of these
cheapo usb
decks, but am very reluctant to payout if they are no good.
I have the chance to purchase a Garrard ST25p record deck and my thoughts
were that I could plug it into my tape machine and then into my PC.

I'm imagining the USB record deck is plasticky, weighs about 2 ounces
and has horrible wow and flutter ... An older deck going through a tape
player should be better, except you don't emention whether or not you'd
have a pre-amp to do equilization, I think some packages can do that in
softare now, whether it's as good, I've no idea.

A Garrard SP25 is hardly *hifi either..

No, but surely better than a usb deck. Forget the usb decks. If you
want something decent, get an old good quality deck & cart, and run
its output thru an amp with phono input then to the pc. Keep any tape
deck out of the loop, it will only degrade the quality a fair bit.

Be warned that with the necessary post editing and noise filtering
you're looking at about 4 hrs per album.


NT

"the_constructor" wrote in message
o.uk...

I need to transfer some music from LP's to MP3 files so that I can make up
a CD. The LP's were never released onto CD.

I was toying with the idea of purchasing and using one of these cheapo
usb decks, but am very reluctant to payout if they are no good.

I have the chance to purchase a Garrard ST25p record deck and my thoughts
were that I could plug it into my tape machine and then into my PC. I know
the latter works well....

Any thoughts on the subject please.


Many thanks guys for the advice, it was much appreciated. Off to buy the old
Garrard deck now.
Kindest regards,

Jim

On Fri, 30 Sep 2011 06:21:22 +0100, The Natural Philosopher
wrote:

Andy Burns wrote:
the_constructor wrote:

I was toying with the idea of purchasing and using one of these
cheapo usb
decks, but am very reluctant to payout if they are no good.
I have the chance to purchase a Garrard ST25p record deck and my thoughts
were that I could plug it into my tape machine and then into my PC.

I'm imagining the USB record deck is plasticky, weighs about 2 ounces
and has horrible wow and flutter ... An older deck going through a tape
player should be better, except you don't emention whether or not you'd
have a pre-amp to do equilization, I think some packages can do that in
softare now, whether it's as good, I've no idea.



A Garrard SP25 is hardly hifi either..

Neither are MP3s, so it isn't all that critical.

--
Frank Erskine

Frank Erskine wrote:

On Fri, 30 Sep 2011 06:21:22 +0100, The Natural Philosopher
wrote:

Andy Burns wrote:
the_constructor wrote:

I was toying with the idea of purchasing and using one of these
cheapo usb
decks, but am very reluctant to payout if they are no good.
I have the chance to purchase a Garrard ST25p record deck and my
thoughts were that I could plug it into my tape machine and then into
my PC.

I'm imagining the USB record deck is plasticky, weighs about 2 ounces
and has horrible wow and flutter ... An older deck going through a tape
player should be better, except you don't emention whether or not you'd
have a pre-amp to do equilization, I think some packages can do that in
softare now, whether it's as good, I've no idea.



A Garrard SP25 is hardly hifi either..

Neither are MP3s, so it isn't all that critical.


Good point.

You can jack the MP3 bitrate up though.

But to the OP - forget MP3s, use something like OGG if you are going to
spend time on this. You can always batch convert to a second copy in MP3
format if required for end player devices.

--
Tim Watts

In article ,
the_constructor wrote:

I need to transfer some music from LP's to MP3 files so that I can make
up a CD. The LP's were never released onto CD.

I was toying with the idea of purchasing and using one of these cheapo
usb decks, but am very reluctant to payout if they are no good.

I have the chance to purchase a Garrard ST25p record deck and my
thoughts were that I could plug it into my tape machine and then into
my PC. I know the latter works well....

Any thoughts on the subject please.

Strictly speaking you need a special pre-amp between pickup cartridge and
PC line in to achieve the RIAA equalisation. As well as to achieve a
decent signal to noise ratio.

--
*A person who smiles in the face of adversity probably has a scapegoat *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

the_constructor wrote:
I need to transfer some music from LP's to MP3 files so that I can make up a
CD. The LP's were never released onto CD.

I was toying with the idea of purchasing and using one of these cheapo usb
decks, but am very reluctant to payout if they are no good.

I have the chance to purchase a Garrard ST25p record deck and my thoughts
were that I could plug it into my tape machine and then into my PC. I know
the latter works well....

Any thoughts on the subject please.

If you don't aready have a deck, then buy something better than the
Garrard. That's the deck I used for disco's in the 70s, and while
they're built like a brick outhouse, making it indestuctible, they
rumble like a forty ton truck. Even the latest generation of disco deck
which you can pick up for a few quid at your local cash converters are
better, and will accept better cartridges. The better the playback, the
easier the conversion and cleaning up will be.

Also, you will need an RIAA pre-amp to get enough signal for your sound
card. Either use a hi-fi amp or buy a seperate one.

Finally, before you start,make sure the records are clean, and replace
the stylus.
--
Tciao for Now!

John.

In article ,
"the_constructor" writes:

I need to transfer some music from LP's to MP3 files so that I can make up a
CD. The LP's were never released onto CD.

I was toying with the idea of purchasing and using one of these cheapo usb
decks, but am very reluctant to payout if they are no good.

I have the chance to purchase a Garrard ST25p record deck and my thoughts
were that I could plug it into my tape machine and then into my PC. I know
the latter works well....

Any thoughts on the subject please.

Unlike RIPing CD's, RIPing LPs runs as 1x speed, and you lose all the
track boundaries, which you'll have to edit back in afterwards.
This makes it time consuming.

--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]

Now I'd look for a decent deck assuming your records are half good. IE
something like a second hand technics. Try to find someone selling an Riaa
amp or buy a cheapo old amp with a pick up input, join the line out to the
line in on the card in your machine and do it that way. I've heard some of
these crappy usb offerings, bloody rubbish. You may need a decent pick up
which are still available.
Are you absolutely sure they have never been on cd? Japanese releases of
obscure material are a rich vein. Often some folk have already done the job
of course, look on the torrents.
I don't see you can be arrested for downloading what you have already.

Brian

--
Brian Gaff -
Note:- In order to reduce spam, any email without 'Brian Gaff'
in the display name may be lost.
Blind user, so no pictures please!
"the_constructor" wrote in message
o.uk...

I need to transfer some music from LP's to MP3 files so that I can make up
a CD. The LP's were never released onto CD.

I was toying with the idea of purchasing and using one of these cheapo
usb decks, but am very reluctant to payout if they are no good.

I have the chance to purchase a Garrard ST25p record deck and my thoughts
were that I could plug it into my tape machine and then into my PC. I know
the latter works well....

Any thoughts on the subject please.

Kindest regards,

Jim

On 30/09/2011 08:54, Tim Watts wrote:
Frank Erskine wrote:

On Fri, 30 Sep 2011 06:21:22 +0100, The Natural Philosopher
wrote:

Andy Burns wrote:
the_constructor wrote:

I was toying with the idea of purchasing and using one of these
cheapo usb
decks, but am very reluctant to payout if they are no good.
I have the chance to purchase a Garrard ST25p record deck and my
thoughts were that I could plug it into my tape machine and then into
my PC.

I'm imagining the USB record deck is plasticky, weighs about 2 ounces
and has horrible wow and flutter ... An older deck going through a tape
player should be better, except you don't emention whether or not you'd
have a pre-amp to do equilization, I think some packages can do that in
softare now, whether it's as good, I've no idea.



A Garrard SP25 is hardly hifi either..

Neither are MP3s, so it isn't all that critical.


Good point.

You can jack the MP3 bitrate up though.

But to the OP - forget MP3s, use something like OGG if you are going to
spend time on this. You can always batch convert to a second copy in MP3
format if required for end player devices.

Better to record as uncompressed WAV than *any* compressed format.

Chris Bartram wrote:

On 30/09/2011 08:54, Tim Watts wrote:

But to the OP - forget MP3s, use something like OGG

Saying "use OGG" is like saying "buy a cardboard cereal box" when you
mean "buy some weetabix" ;-)

Better to record as uncompressed WAV than *any* compressed format.

or FLAC (as I think someone previously mentioned)

On 29/09/2011 23:51, the_constructor wrote:
I need to transfer some music from LP's to MP3 files so that I can make up a
CD. The LP's were never released onto CD.

I was toying with the idea of purchasing and using one of these cheapo usb
decks, but am very reluctant to payout if they are no good.

I have the chance to purchase a Garrard ST25p record deck and my thoughts
were that I could plug it into my tape machine and then into my PC. I know
the latter works well....

Any thoughts on the subject please.

I would echo the sentiment of a reasonable deck and preamp. Couple of
points to keep in mind... While its easy enough to find an amp with
with a phono input stage and hence RIAA compensation, take care, since
not all of them can provide the line level equalised version to an
output - so check the Rec Out selector will allow phono to be directed
that way.

Regarding file formats, I would suggest making initial copies to a
lossless format, then making MP3s etc from there - saves ever having to
re-digitize when you want better quality. I tend to archive stuff to
..flac format.

If doing much of this, then a decent soundcard is worth the investment,
since it will tend to acquire far less unwanted noise than the typical
motherboard sound on many PCs.

There is software out there that will find the gaps and top and tail
each track. Works ok on some source material, but not as well on
classical or anything with very quiet passages.



--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

In article ,
John Rumm wrote:
I would echo the sentiment of a reasonable deck and preamp. Couple of
points to keep in mind... While its easy enough to find an amp with
with a phono input stage and hence RIAA compensation, take care, since
not all of them can provide the line level equalised version to an
output - so check the Rec Out selector will allow phono to be directed
that way.

Eh? The record output on an amp is/was perhaps most used for dubbing
records to cassette. I've never come across any which can't. Indeed,
pretty well all such amps had a pre-amp which was only used for RIAA
equalisation and raising the cart level to that of other sources. So
unless designed to prevent LP copying, I can't see any point.

--
*'ome is where you 'ang your @ *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On Sep 30, 10:58*am, Chris Bartram
wrote:
On 30/09/2011 08:54, Tim Watts wrote:

Frank Erskine wrote:

On Fri, 30 Sep 2011 06:21:22 +0100, The Natural Philosopher
*wrote:

Andy Burns wrote:
the_constructor wrote:

I was toying with the idea of purchasing and using *one of these
cheapo usb
decks, but am very reluctant to payout if they are no good.
I have the chance to purchase a Garrard ST25p record deck and my
thoughts were that I could plug it into my tape machine and then into
my PC.

I'm imagining the USB record deck is plasticky, weighs about 2 ounces
and has horrible wow and flutter ... An older deck going through a tape
player should be better, except you don't emention whether or not you'd
have a pre-amp to do equilization, I think some packages can do that in
softare now, whether it's as good, I've no idea.

A Garrard SP25 is hardly *hifi either..

Neither are MP3s, so it isn't all that critical.

Good point.

You can jack the MP3 bitrate up though.

But to the OP - forget MP3s, use something like OGG if you are going to
spend time on this. You can always batch convert to a second copy in MP3
format if required for end player devices.

Better to record as uncompressed WAV than *any* compressed format.

Indeed, given storage is so cheap: then batch convert to MP3 or
whatever when needed (or OGG if you're confident all your playback
devices support it)

In terms of the hardware I use an external USB soundcard, 30 quid or
less, switchable between high gain RIAA or low gain flat input,
headphone monitor built in, Behringer UFO202 :-

http://preview.tinyurl.com/5wummow

On 30/09/2011 13:17, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In articleasWdnfswJLxtCRjTnZ2dnUVZ8rCdnZ2d@brightvie w.co.uk,
John wrote:
I would echo the sentiment of a reasonable deck and preamp. Couple of
points to keep in mind... While its easy enough to find an amp with
with a phono input stage and hence RIAA compensation, take care, since
not all of them can provide the line level equalised version to an
output - so check the Rec Out selector will allow phono to be directed
that way.

Eh? The record output on an amp is/was perhaps most used for dubbing
records to cassette. I've never come across any which can't. Indeed,

Hence why I mentioned it, since many assume its universal. The Kenwood
KA 3020 for example (hugely popular budget amp in its time) has no
preamp-out connection in spite of having two tape loops.

pretty well all such amps had a pre-amp which was only used for RIAA
equalisation and raising the cart level to that of other sources. So
unless designed to prevent LP copying, I can't see any point.

Spose it kept the cost and complexity down - you can do all your source
and output switching before the preamp.


--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

John Rumm wrote:
On 30/09/2011 13:17, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
[snip]

Eh? The record output on an amp is/was perhaps most used for dubbing
records to cassette. I've never come across any which can't. Indeed,

Hence why I mentioned it, since many assume its universal. The Kenwood KA
3020 for example (hugely popular budget amp in its time) has no
preamp-out connection in spite of having two tape loops.

I may be missing the point that you are trying to make. I had a 3020 for a
few years. It was jolly good. Although it didn't have a pre-amp output
suitable for driving a power amp, it was possible to get a line level
output from a phono cartridge by taking the output from the tape out
sockets. I still have a Cyrus amp that has the same arrangement. The only
drawback, if there is one, is that the volume and tone controls (where
fitted) are bypassed if the tape out is used. This is a desirable
characteristic if one wishes to record something.

At present I use a small mixing desk with phonograph input and a Dual
record deck to digitise LPs. Although even the most obscure vinyl that I
have (and some of it was very obscure) is now available on ITunes, Amazon
or as remastered CDs.

On 30/09/2011 16:45, Steve Firth wrote:
John wrote:
On 30/09/2011 13:17, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
[snip]

Eh? The record output on an amp is/was perhaps most used for dubbing
records to cassette. I've never come across any which can't. Indeed,

Hence why I mentioned it, since many assume its universal. The Kenwood KA
3020 for example (hugely popular budget amp in its time) has no
preamp-out connection in spite of having two tape loops.

I may be missing the point that you are trying to make. I had a 3020 for a
few years. It was jolly good. Although it didn't have a pre-amp output
suitable for driving a power amp, it was possible to get a line level
output from a phono cartridge by taking the output from the tape out

Yes you are right. I seem to be having a brain fart (I just had a look
my KA 3020s - one original, one "SE", and they both have phono on the
rec out selection)

So I am now not sure which amp I was actually thinking of... (I just
remember being confounded at the time since I wanted to take a line
level equalised phono output to a computer, had it all hooked up, and
then realised it was not possible to select that input to be directed to
the tape out sockets)



--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

On Sep 30, 5:19*pm, John Rumm wrote:
On 30/09/2011 16:45, Steve Firth wrote:

John *wrote:
On 30/09/2011 13:17, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
[snip]

Eh? The record output on an amp is/was perhaps most used for dubbing
records to cassette. I've never come across any which can't. Indeed,

Hence why I mentioned it, since many assume its universal. The Kenwood KA
3020 for example (hugely popular budget amp in its time) has no
preamp-out connection in spite of having two tape loops.

I may be missing the point that you are trying to make. I had a 3020 for a
few years. It was jolly good. Although it didn't have a pre-amp output
suitable for driving a power amp, it was possible to get a line level
output from a phono cartridge by taking the output from the tape out

Yes you are right. I seem to be having a brain fart (I just had a look
my KA 3020s - one original, one "SE", and they both have phono on the
rec out selection)

So I am now not sure which amp I was actually thinking of... (I just
remember being confounded at the time since I wanted to take a line
level equalised phono output to a computer, had it all hooked up, and
then realised it was not possible to select that input to be directed to
the tape out sockets)

If you're looking at really old kit, eg 1950s, it can very
occasinoally lack a tape in/out facility, so you just take your output
from any input socket and switch teh input selector to the input
socket youre using as the output socket, and it works fine. But the
chance of the OP playing with corner cutting 50s kit is pretty remote.


NT

On 30/09/2011 10:17, Andrew Gabriel wrote:
In articleLbqdnWJqb8PgaxnTnZ2dnUVZ8tmdnZ2d@brightvie w.co.uk,
.uk writes:

I need to transfer some music from LP's to MP3 files so that I can make up a
CD. The LP's were never released onto CD.

I was toying with the idea of purchasing and using one of these cheapo usb
decks, but am very reluctant to payout if they are no good.

I have the chance to purchase a Garrard ST25p record deck and my thoughts
were that I could plug it into my tape machine and then into my PC. I know
the latter works well....

Any thoughts on the subject please.

Unlike RIPing CD's, RIPing LPs runs as 1x speed, and you lose all the
track boundaries, which you'll have to edit back in afterwards.
This makes it time consuming.


Audacity does quite a good job of detecting the silences between tracks.

You may also want to consider getting a phono to usb converter such as
this one.
http://www.maplin.co.uk/ion-u-record...rchiver-225569

It'll probably be quicker and simpler than using tape

In message
,
airsmoothed writes
In terms of the hardware I use an external USB soundcard, 30 quid or
less, switchable between high gain RIAA or low gain flat input,
headphone monitor built in, Behringer UFO202 :-

http://preview.tinyurl.com/5wummow

Just to pick a few nits, that Behringer device doesn't appear to present
the correct 47k impedance to the phono cartridge, so it might not always
sound as good as it should. Also, it uses A to D converters that
apparently are fixed at 48kHz, which seems an odd, if fairly standard,
choice for equipment that is likely to end up with the CD sample rate of
44.1.
I have no idea where the sample rate conversion occurs, but nowadays one
needs to be aware that Windows 7's sample rate conversion is known to
be broken.

The advice from others to use a hi-fi amp and allow plenty of time
reflects my experience.
--
Bill

OG wrote:

It'll probably be quicker and simpler than using tape

I don't think (certainly hope not) the O/P was proposing to record to
tape and then playback to PC, merely to passthrough the tape player ...

On 30/09/2011 17:52, NT wrote:
On Sep 30, 5:19 pm, John wrote:
On 30/09/2011 16:45, Steve Firth wrote:

John wrote:
On 30/09/2011 13:17, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
[snip]

Eh? The record output on an amp is/was perhaps most used for dubbing
records to cassette. I've never come across any which can't. Indeed,

Hence why I mentioned it, since many assume its universal. The Kenwood KA
3020 for example (hugely popular budget amp in its time) has no
preamp-out connection in spite of having two tape loops.

I may be missing the point that you are trying to make. I had a 3020 for a
few years. It was jolly good. Although it didn't have a pre-amp output
suitable for driving a power amp, it was possible to get a line level
output from a phono cartridge by taking the output from the tape out

Yes you are right. I seem to be having a brain fart (I just had a look
my KA 3020s - one original, one "SE", and they both have phono on the
rec out selection)

So I am now not sure which amp I was actually thinking of... (I just
remember being confounded at the time since I wanted to take a line
level equalised phono output to a computer, had it all hooked up, and
then realised it was not possible to select that input to be directed to
the tape out sockets)

If you're looking at really old kit, eg 1950s, it can very
occasinoally lack a tape in/out facility, so you just take your output
from any input socket and switch teh input selector to the input
socket youre using as the output socket, and it works fine. But the
chance of the OP playing with corner cutting 50s kit is pretty remote.

No, this was more recent - probably similar vintage to the KA 3020...

--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

John Rumm :
On 29/09/2011 23:51, the_constructor wrote:
I need to transfer some music from LP's to MP3 files so that I can make up a
CD. The LP's were never released onto CD.

I was toying with the idea of purchasing and using one of these cheapo usb
decks, but am very reluctant to payout if they are no good.

I have the chance to purchase a Garrard ST25p record deck and my thoughts
were that I could plug it into my tape machine and then into my PC. I know
the latter works well....

Any thoughts on the subject please.

I would echo the sentiment of a reasonable deck and preamp. Couple of
points to keep in mind... While its easy enough to find an amp with
with a phono input stage and hence RIAA compensation, take care, since
not all of them can provide the line level equalised version to an
output - so check the Rec Out selector will allow phono to be directed
that way.

Regarding file formats, I would suggest making initial copies to a
lossless format, then making MP3s etc from there - saves ever having to
re-digitize when you want better quality. I tend to archive stuff to
.flac format.

If doing much of this, then a decent soundcard is worth the investment,
since it will tend to acquire far less unwanted noise than the typical
motherboard sound on many PCs.

There is software out there that will find the gaps and top and tail
each track. Works ok on some source material, but not as well on
classical or anything with very quiet passages.

Sound advice. g

My master copies are in WMA lossless. Someone mentioned .WAV but AFAIK
there's no provision for metadata tags in that format so I'd avoid it.

Software to find the gaps for you is more trouble than it's worth IMO.
Get a decent free audio editor such as Audacity or Goldwave, and DIY.

I hesitate to mention this in a DIY group but there are companies that
will do the job for you at a price. They have better equipment and
experience than you, e.g. http://www.vinylreplica.com/ and others.

--
Mike Barnes

In article
,
Owain wrote:
On Sep 30, 10:17 am, (Andrew Gabriel) wrote:
Unlike RIPing CD's, RIPing LPs runs as 1x speed, and you lose all the
track boundaries, which you'll have to edit back in afterwards.
This makes it time consuming.

I think some software allows you to play the LP (33 rpm) at 45rpm or
even 78rpm and reduce it down in software.

An LP played at 78 rpm would approximately double the highest frequencies.
Very few cartridges could reproduce these. And software can't recreate
what isn't there.

--
*When did my wild oats turn to prunes and all bran?

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

"the_constructor" wrote in message
o.uk...

I need to transfer some music from LP's to MP3 files so that I can make up
a CD. The LP's were never released onto CD.

I was toying with the idea of purchasing and using one of these cheapo
usb decks, but am very reluctant to payout if they are no good.

I have the chance to purchase a Garrard ST25p record deck and my thoughts
were that I could plug it into my tape machine and then into my PC. I know
the latter works well....

Any thoughts on the subject please.

look on torrent search and see if its already been done and can be
downloaded.
Ignore the cr@p about it being illegal to download, it isn't.
Make sure you restrict the upload bandwidth to the minimum as it is illegal
to upload the stuff and you don't want to upload a whole LP.

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article
,
Owain wrote:
On Sep 30, 10:17 am, (Andrew Gabriel) wrote:
Unlike RIPing CD's, RIPing LPs runs as 1x speed, and you lose all the
track boundaries, which you'll have to edit back in afterwards.
This makes it time consuming.

I think some software allows you to play the LP (33 rpm) at 45rpm or
even 78rpm and reduce it down in software.

An LP played at 78 rpm would approximately double the highest frequencies.
Very few cartridges could reproduce these. And software can't recreate
what isn't there.

Very few cartridges can mechnically follow such high frequencies and
will do a good job of smoothng out the groove so they're never a problem
again. 33 to 45 is just about doable, but getting the response back to
flat is "fun".

--
Tciao for Now!

John.

NT wrote:
On Sep 30, 5:19 pm, John Rumm wrote:
On 30/09/2011 16:45, Steve Firth wrote:

John wrote:
On 30/09/2011 13:17, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
[snip]
Eh? The record output on an amp is/was perhaps most used for dubbing
records to cassette. I've never come across any which can't. Indeed,
Hence why I mentioned it, since many assume its universal. The Kenwood KA
3020 for example (hugely popular budget amp in its time) has no
preamp-out connection in spite of having two tape loops.
I may be missing the point that you are trying to make. I had a 3020 for a
few years. It was jolly good. Although it didn't have a pre-amp output
suitable for driving a power amp, it was possible to get a line level
output from a phono cartridge by taking the output from the tape out
Yes you are right. I seem to be having a brain fart (I just had a look
my KA 3020s - one original, one "SE", and they both have phono on the
rec out selection)

So I am now not sure which amp I was actually thinking of... (I just
remember being confounded at the time since I wanted to take a line
level equalised phono output to a computer, had it all hooked up, and
then realised it was not possible to select that input to be directed to
the tape out sockets)

If you're looking at really old kit, eg 1950s, it can very
occasinoally lack a tape in/out facility, so you just take your output
from any input socket and switch teh input selector to the input
socket youre using as the output socket, and it works fine.

Not in any universe I have been in, it doesn't.


But the
chance of the OP playing with corner cutting 50s kit is pretty remote.


NT

On 30/09/2011 20:39, dennis@home wrote:


"the_constructor" wrote in message
o.uk...

I need to transfer some music from LP's to MP3 files so that I can
make up a CD. The LP's were never released onto CD.

I was toying with the idea of purchasing and using one of these cheapo
usb decks, but am very reluctant to payout if they are no good.

I have the chance to purchase a Garrard ST25p record deck and my
thoughts were that I could plug it into my tape machine and then into
my PC. I know the latter works well....

Any thoughts on the subject please.

look on torrent search and see if its already been done and can be
downloaded.
Ignore the cr@p about it being illegal to download, it isn't.
Make sure you restrict the upload bandwidth to the minimum as it is
illegal to upload the stuff and you don't want to upload a whole LP.



Stupid advice - well worth the money paid for it.

dennis@home wrote:


"the_constructor" wrote in message
o.uk...

I need to transfer some music from LP's to MP3 files so that I can
make up a CD. The LP's were never released onto CD.

I was toying with the idea of purchasing and using one of these
cheapo usb decks, but am very reluctant to payout if they are no good.

I have the chance to purchase a Garrard ST25p record deck and my
thoughts were that I could plug it into my tape machine and then into
my PC. I know the latter works well....

Any thoughts on the subject please.

look on torrent search and see if its already been done and can be
downloaded.
Ignore the cr@p about it being illegal to download, it isn't.
Make sure you restrict the upload bandwidth to the minimum as it is
illegal to upload the stuff and you don't want to upload a whole LP.



a) It depends where you are. (b) You ignore the fact that for you to
download, at least one person is breaking the law (By your
interpretation) by copyng and uploading.

Strictly speaking, in the UK, as the law currently stands, it is illegal
to make *any* form of copy of any copyright work. No photograph of a
recent painting/ artwork/ photograph/ piece of grafitti, no recording of
buskers without consent and payment of mechanical royalties to the
writer and publisher and performance royalties to the talent, no picture
of modern buildings from a non-public place. It has been held, though
not in the UK as far as I know, for a shop window display to be
copyright of the shop.

And no copying of vinyl records or 78s (With very few exceptions) or CDs
to listen to in your car.

Not that anyone cares, really, and it's been reported the law is about
to change anyway.
--
Tciao for Now!

John.

On 30/09/2011 18:13, Bill wrote:
Just to pick a few nits, that Behringer device doesn't appear to present
the correct 47k impedance to the phono cartridge, so it might not always
sound as good as it should. Also, it uses A to D converters that
apparently are fixed at 48kHz, which seems an odd, if fairly standard,
choice for equipment that is likely to end up with the CD sample rate of
44.1.
I have no idea where the sample rate conversion occurs, but nowadays one
needs to be aware that Windows 7's sample rate conversion is known to
be broken.

The advice from others to use a hi-fi amp and allow plenty of time
reflects my experience.

48k is IIRC the correct speed for DAT tape (remember that?) minidisc and
some TV formats.

What you want to do is pull it in at 88.1k (if you can) or some other
multiple, and at at least 20 bits. Postprocess for clicks and hiss,
normalise, _then_ down-sample to CD.

And yes, it takes B****y ages.

Andy

"the_constructor" wrote in message
o.uk...

I need to transfer some music from LP's to MP3 files so that I can make up
a CD. The LP's were never released onto CD.

I was toying with the idea of purchasing and using one of these cheapo
usb decks, but am very reluctant to payout if they are no good.

I have the chance to purchase a Garrard ST25p record deck and my thoughts
were that I could plug it into my tape machine and then into my PC. I know
the latter works well....

Any thoughts on the subject please.

Kindest regards,

Can you really not get the tracks from irc ?

On Sep 30, 9:13*pm, The Natural Philosopher
wrote:
NT wrote:
On Sep 30, 5:19 pm, John Rumm wrote:
On 30/09/2011 16:45, Steve Firth wrote:

John *wrote:
On 30/09/2011 13:17, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
[snip]
Eh? The record output on an amp is/was perhaps most used for dubbing
records to cassette. I've never come across any which can't. Indeed,
Hence why I mentioned it, since many assume its universal. The Kenwood KA
3020 for example (hugely popular budget amp in its time) has no
preamp-out connection in spite of having two tape loops.
I may be missing the point that you are trying to make. I had a 3020 for a
few years. It was jolly good. Although it didn't have a pre-amp output
suitable for driving a power amp, it was possible to get a line level
output from a phono cartridge by taking the output from the tape out
Yes you are right. I seem to be having a brain fart (I just had a look
my KA 3020s - one original, one "SE", and they both have phono on the
rec out selection)

So I am now not sure which amp I was actually thinking of... (I just
remember being confounded at the time since I wanted to take a line
level equalised phono output to a computer, had it all hooked up, and
then realised it was not possible to select that input to be directed to
the tape out sockets)

If you're looking at really old kit, eg 1950s, it can very
occasinoally lack a tape in/out facility, so you just take your output
from any input socket and switch teh input selector to the input
socket youre using as the output socket, and it works fine.

Not in any universe I have been in, it doesn't.

Yes, it does. It totally confuses people not familiar with it. The
input switch selected input is just directly connected to the amp
input along with the output of the mag cart preamp, hence you can use
an input as an output for taping. More modern kit tends to mute the
mag preamp output when not used.


But the

chance of the OP playing with corner cutting 50s kit is pretty remote.

NT

NT wrote:
On Sep 30, 9:13 pm, The Natural Philosopher
wrote:
NT wrote:
On Sep 30, 5:19 pm, John Rumm wrote:
On 30/09/2011 16:45, Steve Firth wrote:
John wrote:
On 30/09/2011 13:17, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
[snip]
Eh? The record output on an amp is/was perhaps most used for dubbing
records to cassette. I've never come across any which can't. Indeed,
Hence why I mentioned it, since many assume its universal. The Kenwood KA
3020 for example (hugely popular budget amp in its time) has no
preamp-out connection in spite of having two tape loops.
I may be missing the point that you are trying to make. I had a 3020 for a
few years. It was jolly good. Although it didn't have a pre-amp output
suitable for driving a power amp, it was possible to get a line level
output from a phono cartridge by taking the output from the tape out
Yes you are right. I seem to be having a brain fart (I just had a look
my KA 3020s - one original, one "SE", and they both have phono on the
rec out selection)
So I am now not sure which amp I was actually thinking of... (I just
remember being confounded at the time since I wanted to take a line
level equalised phono output to a computer, had it all hooked up, and
then realised it was not possible to select that input to be directed to
the tape out sockets)
If you're looking at really old kit, eg 1950s, it can very
occasinoally lack a tape in/out facility, so you just take your output
from any input socket and switch teh input selector to the input
socket youre using as the output socket, and it works fine.
Not in any universe I have been in, it doesn't.

Yes, it does. It totally confuses people not familiar with it. The
input switch selected input is just directly connected to the amp
input along with the output of the mag cart preamp, hence you can use
an input as an output for taping. More modern kit tends to mute the
mag preamp output when not used.


not it isn't. You select the input sockets OR the output of the mag preamp.

NEVER is there ANY point in leaving the preamp connected - it is noisy
and if its got anything lugged in its gonna be LOUD.

On Oct 1, 8:32*am, The Natural Philosopher
wrote:
NT wrote:
On Sep 30, 9:13 pm, The Natural Philosopher
wrote:
NT wrote:
On Sep 30, 5:19 pm, John Rumm wrote:
On 30/09/2011 16:45, Steve Firth wrote:
John *wrote:
On 30/09/2011 13:17, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
[snip]
Eh? The record output on an amp is/was perhaps most used for dubbing
records to cassette. I've never come across any which can't. Indeed,
Hence why I mentioned it, since many assume its universal. The Kenwood KA
3020 for example (hugely popular budget amp in its time) has no
preamp-out connection in spite of having two tape loops.
I may be missing the point that you are trying to make. I had a 3020 for a
few years. It was jolly good. Although it didn't have a pre-amp output
suitable for driving a power amp, it was possible to get a line level
output from a phono cartridge by taking the output from the tape out
Yes you are right. I seem to be having a brain fart (I just had a look
my KA 3020s - one original, one "SE", and they both have phono on the
rec out selection)
So I am now not sure which amp I was actually thinking of... (I just
remember being confounded at the time since I wanted to take a line
level equalised phono output to a computer, had it all hooked up, and
then realised it was not possible to select that input to be directed to
the tape out sockets)
If you're looking at really old kit, eg 1950s, it can very
occasinoally lack a tape in/out facility, so you just take your output
from any input socket and switch teh input selector to the input
socket youre using as the output socket, and it works fine.
Not in any universe I have been in, it doesn't.

Yes, it does. It totally confuses people not familiar with it. The
input switch selected input is just directly connected to the amp
input along with the output of the mag cart preamp, hence you can use
an input as an output for taping. More modern kit tends to mute the
mag preamp output when not used.

not it isn't. You select the input sockets OR the output of the mag preamp.

NEVER is there ANY point in leaving the preamp connected -

In nice equipment that holds true. A whole lot of corners were cut in
the 50s, and I've played with kit that left inputs unswitched. Leaving
the phono unswitched saves a few pence on switchgear, and the
resulting extra noise is never noticeable in practice.

it is noisy
and if its got anything lugged in its gonna be LOUD.

nonsense, the 50ks keep it happy.


NT

On 30/09/2011 19:44, Owain wrote:
On Sep 30, 10:17 am, (Andrew Gabriel) wrote:
Unlike RIPing CD's, RIPing LPs runs as 1x speed, and you lose all the
track boundaries, which you'll have to edit back in afterwards.
This makes it time consuming.

I think some software allows you to play the LP (33 rpm) at 45rpm or
even 78rpm and reduce it down in software.

I have certainly seen the reverse, where you can play an old 78 on a 33
or 45 rpm deck and adjust later. Doing it the other way may lose you
some top end.


--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

In article ,
John Rumm wrote:
I think some software allows you to play the LP (33 rpm) at 45rpm or
even 78rpm and reduce it down in software.

I have certainly seen the reverse, where you can play an old 78 on a 33
or 45 rpm deck and adjust later. Doing it the other way may lose you
some top end.

And the other way, some bottom end. You don't get owt for nowt.
Although of course with 78s, you may have little option given turntables
with that speed are more rare. But you do still need a coarse groove
stylus. An LP one will tend to 'bottom out'.

--
*Why do we say something is out of whack? What is a whack? *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

In article ,
John Rumm wrote:
I think some software allows you to play the LP (33 rpm) at 45rpm or
even 78rpm and reduce it down in software.

I have certainly seen the reverse, where you can play an old 78 on a 33
or 45 rpm deck and adjust later. Doing it the other way may lose you
some top end.

And the other way, some bottom end. You don't get owt for nowt.
Although of course with 78s, you may have little option given turntables
with that speed are more rare. But you do still need a coarse groove
stylus. An LP one will tend to 'bottom out'.

Audacity does the speeding up well enough for some home recorded discs from
1943, even though the postman had folded one.

I thought 78s were depth modulated with some sort of automatic gain control
to compress the track and stereo 33 were modulated with one channel on each
side of the track? If so a stereo nedle with more side ways bias might
work??

AJH

andrew wrote:
Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

In article ,
John Rumm wrote:
I think some software allows you to play the LP (33 rpm) at 45rpm or
even 78rpm and reduce it down in software.
I have certainly seen the reverse, where you can play an old 78 on a 33
or 45 rpm deck and adjust later. Doing it the other way may lose you
some top end.
And the other way, some bottom end. You don't get owt for nowt.
Although of course with 78s, you may have little option given turntables
with that speed are more rare. But you do still need a coarse groove
stylus. An LP one will tend to 'bottom out'.

Audacity does the speeding up well enough for some home recorded discs from
1943, even though the postman had folded one.

I thought 78s were depth modulated with some sort of automatic gain control
to compress the track and stereo 33 were modulated with one channel on each
side of the track? If so a stereo nedle with more side ways bias might
work??

78s have a large (relatively) groove which is modulated from side to
side. No compression other than that given by the lack of compliance in
the cutting head, and by the performer moving towards the mic/horn on
quiet passages and vice versa. The only relatively common mechanical
reproductions that were modulated vertically were cylinders.

Stereo LPs and singles have the audio modulated on the groove faces at
45 degrees, in such a way that a mono pickup will give a good
reproduction of the centre (mono) signal.

Because of the groove size, *all* LP styluses will bottom in the groove
of a 78, and play a good rendition of scratching the stylus across a
sheet of fine sandpaper. 78s must be played with the right size stylus,
and for the best quality, you need a selection to account for differing
cutting standards and groove wear. Record and stylus wear on 78s isn't
helped by the way a lot of cheap 78s had the shellac "stretched" by
adding fine slate dust to make it harder and more abrasive, in order to
bed in the steel or fibre needle into fitting the groove more quickly at
the start.

Another gotcha is that the equalisation varied over time and company by
company. However, get a clean early acoustically recorded 78, and it's
amazing how good the sound can be, given the right treatment.

--
Tciao for Now!

John.