I have a 5' square downstairs cloakroom. Originally I was thinking of
putting a shower cubicle in, but realise it will be a bit cramped, so am now
think of making it a wetroom. Can't see anything in
http://www.diyfaq.org.uk/ about wet rooms. Can anyone suggest a good source
of info please?

Keith

On 17 Sep, 10:57, "Keith Dunbar" wrote:
I have a 5' square downstairs cloakroom. Originally I was thinking of
putting a shower cubicle in, but realise it will be a bit cramped, so am now
think of making it a wetroom. Can't see anything inhttp://www.diyfaq.org.uk/about wet rooms. Can anyone suggest a good source
of info please?

Keith

Not sure quite what guidance you are looking for. I just used my
common sense when I did mine 15 yeas ago before we all HAD to go and
ask the interweb.

Having said that a friend having a new build done, took the general
idea but the builder has not implemented it properly and the floor
does not drain and leaves puddles against the walls.

I got my builder to lay the concrete floor with a 900mm square, 75mm
deep recess with the shower drain in the middle. This recess isn't
really necessary but it does stop most of the water escaping. You
will have to locate a suitable trap that can be cleared from above -
it's too long ago to remember where mine came from but it was not easy
to find 15 years ago. It may be that there are better traps around
now but mine tends to block every so often with hairs and the recess
in the floor becomes even more beneficial then as the whole floor
doesn't flood.

I used the 150mm fireclay coloured tiles that are smooth on one side
(used in the hallway) and have square projections on the other so that
they are anti slip in the wet room. I don't know what that range of
tiles is called or whether they are still available, but they also had
100mm skirting tiles that were very suitable for the sloping wall of
the shower area, as for the skirting generally.

You will need to lay all the tiles sloping towards the drain - 1 in 80
is what I seem to have aimed at, though is may be greater in the
shower bit.

There - saved you thinking it through for yourself !

Rob

"robgraham" wrote in message
oups.com...
On 17 Sep, 10:57, "Keith Dunbar" wrote:
I have a 5' square downstairs cloakroom. Originally I was thinking of
putting a shower cubicle in, but realise it will be a bit cramped, so am now
think of making it a wetroom. Can't see anything inhttp://www.diyfaq.org.uk/about wet rooms. Can
anyone suggest a good source
of info please?

Keith

Not sure quite what guidance you are looking for. I just used my
common sense when I did mine 15 yeas ago before we all HAD to go and
ask the interweb.

Having said that a friend having a new build done, took the general
idea but the builder has not implemented it properly and the floor
does not drain and leaves puddles against the walls.

I got my builder to lay the concrete floor with a 900mm square, 75mm
deep recess with the shower drain in the middle. This recess isn't
really necessary but it does stop most of the water escaping. You
will have to locate a suitable trap that can be cleared from above -
it's too long ago to remember where mine came from but it was not easy
to find 15 years ago. It may be that there are better traps around
now but mine tends to block every so often with hairs and the recess
in the floor becomes even more beneficial then as the whole floor
doesn't flood.

I used the 150mm fireclay coloured tiles that are smooth on one side
(used in the hallway) and have square projections on the other so that
they are anti slip in the wet room. I don't know what that range of
tiles is called or whether they are still available, but they also had
100mm skirting tiles that were very suitable for the sloping wall of
the shower area, as for the skirting generally.

You will need to lay all the tiles sloping towards the drain - 1 in 80
is what I seem to have aimed at, though is may be greater in the
shower bit.

There - saved you thinking it through for yourself !

Rob

Is that all? How about:
- waterproofing the floor
- what to use under the tiles especially the floor
- what impact is there on other things in the wet room like toilet cisterns and overflows, etc
- how about windows and ventilation

Not saying I have the answers, but at least I know the questions exist.

robgraham wrote:
On 17 Sep, 10:57, "Keith Dunbar" wrote:
I have a 5' square downstairs cloakroom. Originally I was thinking of
putting a shower cubicle in, but realise it will be a bit cramped, so am now
think of making it a wetroom. Can't see anything inhttp://www.diyfaq.org.uk/about wet rooms. Can anyone suggest a good source
of info please?

Keith

Not sure quite what guidance you are looking for. I just used my
common sense when I did mine 15 yeas ago before we all HAD to go and
ask the interweb.

Having said that a friend having a new build done, took the general
idea but the builder has not implemented it properly and the floor
does not drain and leaves puddles against the walls.

I got my builder to lay the concrete floor with a 900mm square, 75mm
deep recess with the shower drain in the middle. This recess isn't
really necessary but it does stop most of the water escaping. You
will have to locate a suitable trap that can be cleared from above -
it's too long ago to remember where mine came from but it was not easy
to find 15 years ago. It may be that there are better traps around
now but mine tends to block every so often with hairs and the recess
in the floor becomes even more beneficial then as the whole floor
doesn't flood.

I used the 150mm fireclay coloured tiles that are smooth on one side
(used in the hallway) and have square projections on the other so that
they are anti slip in the wet room. I don't know what that range of
tiles is called or whether they are still available, but they also had
100mm skirting tiles that were very suitable for the sloping wall of
the shower area, as for the skirting generally.

You will need to lay all the tiles sloping towards the drain - 1 in 80
is what I seem to have aimed at, though is may be greater in the
shower bit.

There - saved you thinking it through for yourself !

Rob

A bit of plastic sheet under the concrete and up the walls a bit is no
bad idea.
And of course tile the walls anywhere they get splashed.

Upstairs, things are a shade more complicated, as you need to arrive at
a bit of structural strength in a wooden floor to allow all the
concrete. but in essence its just like a huge shower tray. The floor iS
the shower tray..

Dave Gordon wrote:
"robgraham" wrote in message
oups.com...
On 17 Sep, 10:57, "Keith Dunbar" wrote:
I have a 5' square downstairs cloakroom. Originally I was thinking of
putting a shower cubicle in, but realise it will be a bit cramped, so am now
think of making it a wetroom. Can't see anything inhttp://www.diyfaq.org.uk/about wet rooms. Can
anyone suggest a good source
of info please?

Keith
Not sure quite what guidance you are looking for. I just used my
common sense when I did mine 15 yeas ago before we all HAD to go and
ask the interweb.

Having said that a friend having a new build done, took the general
idea but the builder has not implemented it properly and the floor
does not drain and leaves puddles against the walls.

I got my builder to lay the concrete floor with a 900mm square, 75mm
deep recess with the shower drain in the middle. This recess isn't
really necessary but it does stop most of the water escaping. You
will have to locate a suitable trap that can be cleared from above -
it's too long ago to remember where mine came from but it was not easy
to find 15 years ago. It may be that there are better traps around
now but mine tends to block every so often with hairs and the recess
in the floor becomes even more beneficial then as the whole floor
doesn't flood.

I used the 150mm fireclay coloured tiles that are smooth on one side
(used in the hallway) and have square projections on the other so that
they are anti slip in the wet room. I don't know what that range of
tiles is called or whether they are still available, but they also had
100mm skirting tiles that were very suitable for the sloping wall of
the shower area, as for the skirting generally.

You will need to lay all the tiles sloping towards the drain - 1 in 80
is what I seem to have aimed at, though is may be greater in the
shower bit.

There - saved you thinking it through for yourself !

Rob

Is that all? How about:
- waterproofing the floor

Tiles do that.

If you want a belt and braces, plastic sheet under concrete, PVA on the
screed, and tiles on top.

- what to use under the tiles especially the floor

Tile cement is pretty good.

Then use almost anything. I've got plasterboard walls with tiles over.
If the grouting is good, its fine. If the grouting isn't good, you have
problems no matter WHAT is underneath.

- what impact is there on other things in the wet room like toilet cisterns and overflows, etc

None whatsoever.


- how about windows and ventilation

As per normal shower/toilet regulations.


Not saying I have the answers, but at least I know the questions exist.

Most of them are non-questions though.

A wet room is nothing more than a huge shower enclosure.

You need a watertight tray of some sort in case of drain blockages, and
good high strength concrete is enough for that..it needs to be
waterproof, but concrete is, if enough cement is used.. If using wood,
simply lay up glass fibre over it and up the walls a bit before tiling.

Walls only need be splashproof, and tiles plus grout are more than adequate.

Ventilation is the same as for any shower room.

Sanitaryware that is glazed ceramic is fine for taking a shower!

It doesn't stay wet for long if you have good heating and ventilation.

Concealed cisterns and the like may be an issue..you will need to seal
access panels with rubber seals, and be careful around the flush levers.

As long as you tile round all your sanitary ware pipweork *properly*, a
good dousing does no harm.

In general there is very little serious dousing above waist height anyway.

Keith Dunbar wrote:
I have a 5' square downstairs cloakroom. Originally I was thinking of
putting a shower cubicle in, but realise it will be a bit cramped, so am now
think of making it a wetroom. Can't see anything in
http://www.diyfaq.org.uk/ about wet rooms. Can anyone suggest a good source
of info please?

I had one put in 2 years ago. I'm in a second floor flat so getting it
right was important.

A wedi Fundo http://www.wedi.co.uk/fundo.php tray makes the essential
floor drainage very easy to get right. It also provides insulation
making a tiled floor quite comfortable to walk on even in the early
morning. Wedi board on the walls, taped, then tiled floor to ceiling.
Seal everything with silicone. Think about splashes and drainage for
every surface: if there is a tiled top then it needs a slope for runoff.
A wall hung WC with concealed cistern removes another area where water
may hang around. Have a good extractor for ventilation so that
everything dries out quickly.
I used opaque glass for the door, in fact made the whole wall glazed
which gained a few valuable inches in a very tight space.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/djclark/438023299/





--
djc

Not gonna argue with you, but some observations seem in order. In line below.

"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message ...
Dave Gordon wrote:
some wet room details snipped
Is that all? How about:
- waterproofing the floor

Tiles do that.


and under what circumstances would grout failure be acceptable? Does the floor flex? Most houses have
an extremely bouncy first floor, and grout hates movement.


If you want a belt and braces, plastic sheet under concrete, PVA on the screed, and tiles on top.

Better, but heavy. Hope the floor is strong enough.

- what to use under the tiles especially the floor

Tile cement is pretty good.

And to make the slope down to the drain? Hope the wet room isn't too big or you might need quite a
drop to get the slope. The room also needs a sill in case of blocked drains or traps.


Then use almost anything. I've got plasterboard walls with tiles over. If the grouting is good, its
fine. If the grouting isn't good, you have problems no matter WHAT is underneath.

Then it is a disaster just waiting to happen. Dot and dab plasterboard flexes, and the best grouting
in the world will crack after 10 years of that, especially if the floor is flexing too.

- what impact is there on other things in the wet room like toilet cisterns and overflows, etc

None whatsoever.

Apart from built-in cisterns as you say below, and you can't really have any wooden or mdf cabinetry
in a wet room. No direct saturation, but 10 years of vapour will penetrate the best cabinets.

- how about windows and ventilation

As per normal shower/toilet regulations.

But you agree you need it. The OP was converting a bath to a shower.


Not saying I have the answers, but at least I know the questions exist.
Most of them are non-questions though.

A wet room is nothing more than a huge shower enclosure.

And, for example, would you have wooden cabinets inside a shower cubicle? Also, the size itself
creates issues.


You need a watertight tray of some sort in case of drain blockages, and good high strength concrete
is enough for that..it needs to be waterproof, but concrete is, if enough cement is used.. If using
wood, simply lay up glass fibre over it and up the walls a bit before tiling.

....up the walls a bit? We're talking about potentially flooding the rest of the house. Baths and
shower trays are by their nature waterproof. A wet room depends on the knowledge of the person making
it.


Walls only need be splashproof, and tiles plus grout are more than adequate.

Totally disagree, and I've had the blancmange in the shower tray to prove it. The tiles and grout were
intact, it was the plasterboard that had dissolved, due to a small failure of the grout letting water
behind the tiles. And the grout failure was caused by too much flex in the shower tray (I think). We
now have a very rigid tray made of something like a ceramic foam. Weird stuff.

Ventilation is the same as for any shower room.

Sanitaryware that is glazed ceramic is fine for taking a shower!

I was concerned about overflow pipes from the cistern. You are turning a once in a blue moon
occurrence (the ball cock failing causing water to come out of the overflow) into a daily occurrence
(your morning shower causing the cistern to overflow). If the overflow doesn't drip onto your
conservatory roof leaving a green deposit after a few years then fine.


It doesn't stay wet for long if you have good heating and ventilation.

Concealed cisterns and the like may be an issue..you will need to seal access panels with rubber
seals, and be careful around the flush levers.

What are they concealed in? mdf or wood cabinets? How do they feel about water vapour?


As long as you tile round all your sanitary ware pipweork *properly*, a good dousing does no harm.

A water softener would be a good idea though, because hard water will leave deposits on ceramic. They
recommend you squeejie your shower after every use. You can squeejie your toilet too I suppose. Oh and
watch out for where the radiator pipes come out of the floor.


In general there is very little serious dousing above waist height anyway.

This is true, and my blancmange experience came from a shower wall collapse at around knee height.
Many showers and wet rooms are made your way, but I believe they do not last long. Of course, SWMBO
will be fed up with the colour before blancmange time ;o) so problem solved.

On 2007-09-17 21:37:39 +0100, djc said:

Keith Dunbar wrote:
I have a 5' square downstairs cloakroom. Originally I was thinking of
putting a shower cubicle in, but realise it will be a bit cramped, so
am now think of making it a wetroom. Can't see anything in
http://www.diyfaq.org.uk/ about wet rooms. Can anyone suggest a good
source of info please?

I had one put in 2 years ago. I'm in a second floor flat so getting it
right was important.

A wedi Fundo http://www.wedi.co.uk/fundo.php tray makes the
essential floor drainage very easy to get right. It also provides
insulation making a tiled floor quite comfortable to walk on even in
the early morning. Wedi board on the walls, taped, then tiled floor to
ceiling. Seal everything with silicone. Think about splashes and
drainage for every surface: if there is a tiled top then it needs a
slope for runoff. A wall hung WC with concealed cistern removes another
area where water may hang around. Have a good extractor for ventilation
so that everything dries out quickly.
I used opaque glass for the door, in fact made the whole wall glazed
which gained a few valuable inches in a very tight space.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/djclark/438023299/

Interesting. I was looking at this system a while ago.

Do you have a wooden floor, and what is the construction of the walls?

On Mon, 17 Sep 2007 09:57:36 +0000, Keith Dunbar wrote:

I have a 5' square downstairs cloakroom. Originally I was thinking of
putting a shower cubicle in, but realise it will be a bit cramped, so am now
think of making it a wetroom. Can't see anything in
http://www.diyfaq.org.uk/ about wet rooms. Can anyone suggest a good source
of info please?

http://groups.google.co.uk/groups?as...=2007&safe=off

It's come up on this group before

--
John Stumbles

Bitwise, byte foolish

Dave Gordon wrote:
Not gonna argue with you, but some observations seem in order. In line below.

"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message ...
Dave Gordon wrote:
some wet room details snipped
Is that all? How about:
- waterproofing the floor
Tiles do that.


and under what circumstances would grout failure be acceptable? Does the floor flex? Most houses have
an extremely bouncy first floor, and grout hates movement.

If you want a belt and braces, plastic sheet under concrete, PVA on the screed, and tiles on top.

Better, but heavy. Hope the floor is strong enough.


Make it so. Shower trays are not light either.

- what to use under the tiles especially the floor
Tile cement is pretty good.

And to make the slope down to the drain? Hope the wet room isn't too big or you might need quite a
drop to get the slope. The room also needs a sill in case of blocked drains or traps.

Then use almost anything. I've got plasterboard walls with tiles over. If the grouting is good, its
fine. If the grouting isn't good, you have problems no matter WHAT is underneath.

Then it is a disaster just waiting to happen. Dot and dab plasterboard flexes, and the best grouting
in the world will crack after 10 years of that, especially if the floor is flexing too.


what do and dab?Its studwork silly. Been fine for 7 year already. No
issues at all.


- what impact is there on other things in the wet room like toilet cisterns and overflows, etc
None whatsoever.

Apart from built-in cisterns as you say below, and you can't really have any wooden or mdf cabinetry
in a wet room. No direct saturation, but 10 years of vapour will penetrate the best cabinets.


No it won't., any more than rood timbers in an unheated loft stay wet
and rot.

Its called VENTILATION.

The average humidity is not high. Its just the peak humidity.

You simply cover everything in tiles to avoid aaturation and build
strong so there is no flex.

- how about windows and ventilation
As per normal shower/toilet regulations.

But you agree you need it. The OP was converting a bath to a shower.

So? both need similar.


Not saying I have the answers, but at least I know the questions exist.
Most of them are non-questions though.

A wet room is nothing more than a huge shower enclosure.

And, for example, would you have wooden cabinets inside a shower cubicle? Also, the size itself
creates issues.

No I would not. Nor would anyone with any sense..wood is OK but it MUST
be covered in something impervious. The big issue is standing water in
cracks. Thts what does the damage. Hosing down a wooden structure that
immediately get dry again is absolutely a non issue.



You need a watertight tray of some sort in case of drain blockages, and good high strength concrete
is enough for that..it needs to be waterproof, but concrete is, if enough cement is used.. If using
wood, simply lay up glass fibre over it and up the walls a bit before tiling.

...up the walls a bit? We're talking about potentially flooding the rest of the house. Baths and
shower trays are by their nature waterproof. A wet room depends on the knowledge of the person making
it.


No, it depends on the nature of how its built, whether he person is
knowledgeable is not actually the point ;-)

Walls only need be splashproof, and tiles plus grout are more than adequate.

Totally disagree, and I've had the blancmange in the shower tray to prove it. The tiles and grout were
intact, it was the plasterboard that had dissolved, due to a small failure of the grout letting water
behind the tiles. And the grout failure was caused by too much flex in the shower tray (I think). We
now have a very rigid tray made of something like a ceramic foam. Weird stuff.

I dont see how you can say 'The tiles and grout were intact' and 'a
small failure of the grout' in the same sentence without looking a bit
of a dick frankly. You have proved my point. All that e.g WBP would have
done would have been take longer to rot..

The extnension of your argument would be to only construct roof trusses
and internal walls out of conrete, 'so that when the roof tiles fail and
water gets in, they won't rot'

The idea, my dear chap, is to not have the roof tiles fail...

I had an issue - quic;ly fixed - where a run dwn te side of a drormer
was getting my nice plaster wet.

The chippies stripped the tiles and laid the lead soakers CORRECTLY.

You can do the same in a shower room. Use flashing. If you want.




Ventilation is the same as for any shower room.

Sanitaryware that is glazed ceramic is fine for taking a shower!

I was concerned about overflow pipes from the cistern. You are turning a once in a blue moon
occurrence (the ball cock failing causing water to come out of the overflow) into a daily occurrence
(your morning shower causing the cistern to overflow). If the overflow doesn't drip onto your
conservatory roof leaving a green deposit after a few years then fine.

I don't see how a shower can get into a cistern frankly. Mine have lids
on. Most modern cisterns overflow into the bowl anyway. I haven't seen a
separate overflow pipe for some years now.



It doesn't stay wet for long if you have good heating and ventilation.

Concealed cisterns and the like may be an issue..you will need to seal access panels with rubber
seals, and be careful around the flush levers.

What are they concealed in? mdf or wood cabinets? How do they feel about water vapour?

They don't mind at all. Its a long term soaking that is bad news.


As long as you tile round all your sanitary ware pipweork *properly*, a good dousing does no harm.

A water softener would be a good idea though, because hard water will leave deposits on ceramic. They
recommend you squeejie your shower after every use. You can squeejie your toilet too I suppose.

Your toilet already gets a cistern full of hard water every time you
crap. Either you clean your bathroom or you don't.

Oh and
watch out for where the radiator pipes come out of the floor.


Make em come out of the wall,. tile and grout round them. Or build a
plinth with a slightly sloping top.

Its not rocket science you know.,


In general there is very little serious dousing above waist height anyway.

This is true, and my blancmange experience came from a shower wall collapse at around knee height.
Many showers and wet rooms are made your way, but I believe they do not last long. Of course, SWMBO
will be fed up with the colour before blancmange time ;o) so problem solved.



Indeed.
The issue is to build rigid enough so that tiles do NOT flex. And
silicone everything BEFORE tiling, so that minor grout failures do not
result in hidden pools. And grout properly.

What lies behind the tiles should not be subject to water any more than
roof timbers in heavy rain are.

On 17 Sep, 21:37, djc wrote:
Keith Dunbar wrote:
I have a 5' square downstairs cloakroom. Originally I was thinking of
putting a shower cubicle in, but realise it will be a bit cramped, so am now
think of making it a wetroom. Can't see anything in
http://www.diyfaq.org.uk/about wet rooms. Can anyone suggest a good source
of info please?

I had one put in 2 years ago. I'm in a second floor flat so getting it
right was important.

A wedi Fundo http://www.wedi.co.uk/fundo.php tray makes the essential
floor drainage very easy to get right. It also provides insulation
making a tiled floor quite comfortable to walk on even in the early
morning. Wedi board on the walls, taped, then tiled floor to ceiling.
Seal everything with silicone. Think about splashes and drainage for
every surface: if there is a tiled top then it needs a slope for runoff.
A wall hung WC with concealed cistern removes another area where water
may hang around. Have a good extractor for ventilation so that
everything dries out quickly.
I used opaque glass for the door, in fact made the whole wall glazed
which gained a few valuable inches in a very tight space.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/djclark/438023299/

--
djc

Any underfloor heating is useful to ensure things dry off quickly.
Simon.

In article ,
Huge writes:
On 2007-09-17, Keith Dunbar wrote:
I have a 5' square downstairs cloakroom. Originally I was thinking of
putting a shower cubicle in, but realise it will be a bit cramped, so am now
think of making it a wetroom.

Don't. I was quite taken with the idea of a wet room until we rented a holiday
cottage with one. Absolutely hopeless. Soggy footprints in the bedroom, all your
bathroom gubbins gets wet. Totally impractical.

Which is exactly my experience in hotels with shower wet-rooms,
unless they are very large such that the shower can't possibly
wet the other half of the room. If it was _only_ a shower room,
that might not matter so much, but when it's also the WC, make-
up room, wash-hand basin, etc, it becomes impractical IME.

--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]

Andy Hall wrote:
On 2007-09-17 21:37:39 +0100, djc said:
I had one put in 2 years ago. I'm in a second floor flat so getting it
right was important.

A wedi Fundo http://www.wedi.co.uk/fundo.php tray makes the
essential floor drainage very easy to get right. It also provides
insulation making a tiled floor quite comfortable to walk on even in
the early morning. Wedi board on the walls, taped, then tiled floor to
ceiling. Seal everything with silicone. Think about splashes and
drainage for every surface: if there is a tiled top then it needs a
slope for runoff. A wall hung WC with concealed cistern removes
another area where water may hang around. Have a good extractor for
ventilation so that everything dries out quickly.
I used opaque glass for the door, in fact made the whole wall glazed
which gained a few valuable inches in a very tight space.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/djclark/438023299/

Interesting. I was looking at this system a while ago.

Do you have a wooden floor, and what is the construction of the walls?

Yes, the floor is wooden (2nd floor of terrace built c.1830). The floor
needed to be raised a little to clear some awkward pipe runs. So the
joists were reinforced with 2x2 on top and an 18mm ply base placed over
the Wedi waste trap. The Wedi base was laid on a mortar bed on top of
the ply. (NB Wedi have recently changed the design of the trap so it is
no longer necessary to box it in mortar below the sub-floor.) The Wedi
base is about 40mm thick and profiled for the drainage.
Walls: at back a brick party wall, very soft render on part. To one side
plasterboard, the other an original stud wall with plaster on expanded
metal. Plywood to box in cistern and also replacing some of the worst of
the plastered wall which came away with the old tiles. All covered in
Wedi board of various thickness before sealing and tiling.
The fourth wall is all 12mm toughened glass. Expensive but one of my
better ideas I think. The problem was that as the room is very small (1m
x 2m) everything is bound to get wet so a wooden door never a
possibility. A glass door but retaining the wooden frame didn't seem
wise either. I looked at GRP doors but the only cheap ones are front
doors; the plain industrial ones with frames to match would have cost
more than glass. Apart from water resistance the glass gains a bit of
space, and lets a lot of light into a tiny internal space which makes it
much less confining.
The floor also turned out better than expected. The Wedi base is a foam
core which provides good insulation so the tiles are never cold. Having
chosen porcelain tiles with a rough 'riven slate' like surface I started
to worry that they might be too uncomfortable for bare feet, they are
not and the surface is confidently non-slip.

Apart from design, electrics and the ceiling this was not DIY. Having
taken 6 months to do a kitchen the previous year I decided I couldn't
live without a bathroom for more than a few days!

This thread has prompted me to sort out more of the photos:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/djclark...7602063596078/



--
djc

On 18 Sep, 18:49, (Andrew Gabriel) wrote:
In article ,
Huge writes:

On 2007-09-17, Keith Dunbar wrote:
I have a 5' square downstairs cloakroom. Originally I was thinking of
putting a shower cubicle in, but realise it will be a bit cramped, so am now
think of making it a wetroom.

Don't. I was quite taken with the idea of a wet room until we rented a holiday
cottage with one. Absolutely hopeless. Soggy footprints in the bedroom, all your
bathroom gubbins gets wet. Totally impractical.

Which is exactly my experience in hotels with shower wet-rooms,
unless they are very large such that the shower can't possibly
wet the other half of the room. If it was _only_ a shower room,
that might not matter so much, but when it's also the WC, make-
up room, wash-hand basin, etc, it becomes impractical IME.

--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]

Keith
Do not pay any attention to the nay-sayers. An open shower
arrangement is by far the most comfortable - no clammy shower cutains,
no sticking shower doors, etc.

I trust you are starting from scratch such that the shower area can be
recessed into the floor - you need to do this to get adequate
drainage. When the concrete was laid I included a 900mm square, 75mm
deep recess with the drain in the middle. You will need to get a
drain outlet that is accessible from the top for clearing the trap.

The floor will need about a 1 in 80 slope. I used 150mm floor tiles
that look like fire clay - they are smooth on one side and used that
way in the hall and square projections on the other for anti slip in
the wet area. This range of tiles (15 years ago) also had skirting
tiles that I used at 45 degrees for the side of the shower recess.
You don't need to slope the concrete, just build up the cement work
you lay the tiles into.

A small towell rail keeps my area warm with a wall mounted fan heated
for a boost in the winter. Also get a humidistat driven ventilator
fan - I got one of Ebay for around £30 which also has a pull cord for
dealing with smells which is the best arrangement IMO.

Certainly take on board some the doom merchants' comments but as you
are on the ground floor and I assume it's concrete there will be no
flexing of anything and silicon and grout will seal everything. I
also don't see the point of polythene under the concrete as the tiles
are waterproof and the cement grout is so too for the amount of time
that any water is lying on it.

I do think that a lot of advise given on this forum is over-the-top
and perfectionist. In that context, seeing all the options is good,
but a bit of thinking and using common sense needs to come into it as
well.

Rob

On Sep 19, 9:32 am, robgraham wrote:
On 18 Sep, 18:49, (Andrew Gabriel) wrote:





In article ,
Huge writes:

On 2007-09-17, Keith Dunbar wrote:
I have a 5' square downstairs cloakroom. Originally I was thinking of
putting a shower cubicle in, but realise it will be a bit cramped, so am now
think of making it a wetroom.

Don't. I was quite taken with the idea of a wet room until we rented a holiday
cottage with one. Absolutely hopeless. Soggy footprints in the bedroom, all your
bathroom gubbins gets wet. Totally impractical.

Which is exactly my experience in hotels with shower wet-rooms,
unless they are very large such that the shower can't possibly
wet the other half of the room. If it was _only_ a shower room,
that might not matter so much, but when it's also the WC, make-
up room, wash-hand basin, etc, it becomes impractical IME.

--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]

Keith
Do not pay any attention to the nay-sayers. An open shower
arrangement is by far the most comfortable - no clammy shower cutains,
no sticking shower doors, etc.

Don't listen to the yey-sayers. The shower area of a wet room is open
to all the draughts and cold air whereas a cubicle quickly builds up a
nice steamy micro-climate.

MBQ

On 2007-09-19 11:57:14 +0100, "
said:

On Sep 19, 9:32 am, robgraham wrote:
On 18 Sep, 18:49, (Andrew Gabriel) wrote:


Keith
Do not pay any attention to the nay-sayers. An open shower
arrangement is by far the most comfortable - no clammy shower cutains,
no sticking shower doors, etc.

Don't listen to the yey-sayers. The shower area of a wet room is open
to all the draughts and cold air whereas a cubicle quickly builds up a
nice steamy micro-climate.

MBQ

Complete with mould, floppy shower curtains sticking to your arse (I
hate that) and all the rest of it. Then the water still ****es out
over the carpet - people with shower curtains usually have carpet.
Then that gets squelchy and smelly and eventually replaced with the
equally unsuitable laminate floor. Actually laminate floor is
unsuitable period, but that's another topic.

On Sep 19, 11:57 am, "
wrote:
On Sep 19, 9:32 am, robgraham wrote:

Do not pay any attention to the nay-sayers. An open shower
arrangement is by far the most comfortable - no clammy shower cutains,
no sticking shower doors, etc.

Don't listen to the yey-sayers. The shower area of a wet room is open
to all the draughts and cold air whereas a cubicle quickly builds up a
nice steamy micro-climate.

I'm planning on both with a small wet room and frameless shower
screen.

Is this the best of both worlds or the worst?

cheers,
Pete.

wrote:
On Sep 19, 9:32 am, robgraham wrote:
On 18 Sep, 18:49, (Andrew Gabriel) wrote:





In article ,
Huge writes:
On 2007-09-17, Keith Dunbar wrote:
I have a 5' square downstairs cloakroom. Originally I was thinking of
putting a shower cubicle in, but realise it will be a bit cramped, so am now
think of making it a wetroom.
Don't. I was quite taken with the idea of a wet room until we rented a holiday
cottage with one. Absolutely hopeless. Soggy footprints in the bedroom, all your
bathroom gubbins gets wet. Totally impractical.
Which is exactly my experience in hotels with shower wet-rooms,
unless they are very large such that the shower can't possibly
wet the other half of the room. If it was _only_ a shower room,
that might not matter so much, but when it's also the WC, make-
up room, wash-hand basin, etc, it becomes impractical IME.
--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]
Keith
Do not pay any attention to the nay-sayers. An open shower
arrangement is by far the most comfortable - no clammy shower cutains,
no sticking shower doors, etc.

Don't listen to the yey-sayers. The shower area of a wet room is open
to all the draughts and cold air whereas a cubicle quickly builds up a
nice steamy micro-climate.

What draughts and cold air?

double up the radiators and inmsulation! it is by definition, not a
large room.


MBQ

Pete C wrote:
On Sep 19, 11:57 am, "
wrote:
On Sep 19, 9:32 am, robgraham wrote:

Do not pay any attention to the nay-sayers. An open shower
arrangement is by far the most comfortable - no clammy shower cutains,
no sticking shower doors, etc.
Don't listen to the yey-sayers. The shower area of a wet room is open
to all the draughts and cold air whereas a cubicle quickly builds up a
nice steamy micro-climate.

I'm planning on both with a small wet room and frameless shower
screen.

Is this the best of both worlds or the worst?


The best.

The only issue that has been mooted that I find relevant, is paddling in
wet feet into the bedroom. There should be at least one area of a wet
room that is dry enough for a bathmat.



cheers,
Pete.

On 19 Sep, 13:00, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
wrote:
On Sep 19, 9:32 am, robgraham wrote:
On 18 Sep, 18:49, (Andrew Gabriel) wrote:

In article ,
Huge writes:
On 2007-09-17, Keith Dunbar wrote:
I have a 5' square downstairs cloakroom. Originally I was thinking of
putting a shower cubicle in, but realise it will be a bit cramped, so am now
think of making it a wetroom.
Don't. I was quite taken with the idea of a wet room until we rented a holiday
cottage with one. Absolutely hopeless. Soggy footprints in the bedroom, all your
bathroom gubbins gets wet. Totally impractical.
Which is exactly my experience in hotels with shower wet-rooms,
unless they are very large such that the shower can't possibly
wet the other half of the room. If it was _only_ a shower room,
that might not matter so much, but when it's also the WC, make-
up room, wash-hand basin, etc, it becomes impractical IME.
--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]
Keith
Do not pay any attention to the nay-sayers. An open shower
arrangement is by far the most comfortable - no clammy shower cutains,
no sticking shower doors, etc.

Don't listen to the yey-sayers. The shower area of a wet room is open
to all the draughts and cold air whereas a cubicle quickly builds up a
nice steamy micro-climate.

What draughts and cold air?

double up the radiators and inmsulation! it is by definition, not a
large room.



MBQ

Agreed - interesting that the configuration has shown such a
divergence of opinion.

The one thing I would report as a "yea-sayer" is the number of people
who have stayed with us and have said what a nice shower area - I
suppose on the other hand you wouldb't criticize your host if you
didn't like it !.

Two I know of have copied the idea in new build houses. The one
improvement I must get round to is getting rid of the electric shower
and replacing it with a mains pressure / pumped one.

Rob

robgraham wrote:
On 19 Sep, 13:00, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
wrote:
On Sep 19, 9:32 am, robgraham wrote:
On 18 Sep, 18:49, (Andrew Gabriel) wrote:
In article ,
Huge writes:
On 2007-09-17, Keith Dunbar wrote:
I have a 5' square downstairs cloakroom. Originally I was thinking of
putting a shower cubicle in, but realise it will be a bit cramped, so am now
think of making it a wetroom.
Don't. I was quite taken with the idea of a wet room until we rented a holiday
cottage with one. Absolutely hopeless. Soggy footprints in the bedroom, all your
bathroom gubbins gets wet. Totally impractical.
Which is exactly my experience in hotels with shower wet-rooms,
unless they are very large such that the shower can't possibly
wet the other half of the room. If it was _only_ a shower room,
that might not matter so much, but when it's also the WC, make-
up room, wash-hand basin, etc, it becomes impractical IME.
--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]
Keith
Do not pay any attention to the nay-sayers. An open shower
arrangement is by far the most comfortable - no clammy shower cutains,
no sticking shower doors, etc.
Don't listen to the yey-sayers. The shower area of a wet room is open
to all the draughts and cold air whereas a cubicle quickly builds up a
nice steamy micro-climate.
What draughts and cold air?

double up the radiators and inmsulation! it is by definition, not a
large room.



MBQ

Agreed - interesting that the configuration has shown such a
divergence of opinion.

The one thing I would report as a "yea-sayer" is the number of people
who have stayed with us and have said what a nice shower area - I
suppose on the other hand you wouldb't criticize your host if you
didn't like it !.

Two I know of have copied the idea in new build houses. The one
improvement I must get round to is getting rid of the electric shower
and replacing it with a mains pressure / pumped one.

Rob

The better wet rooms I have seen in scandinavia, are large enough to NOT
splosh water on the way to the exit doors.

This, plus good heating, keeps the water where its supposed to be.

The use of wooden fitments is u to te individual and whether r not the
room is liable to be used by small children who want to[play 'shower
fights' and splash everything. We have an oak door that gets liberally
doused every time the shower is used in one room,but it actually shows
less problems than exteriors doors. It dries rapidly and the AVERAGE
humidity in that room is very low.

It seems that what is an issue is *prolonged* high humidity and dampness
(and UV!) which leads to swelling and rot.