What is the best temperature to keep the boiler on? What do you keep it
on?The maximum 82 degree or 60-65?
High temp = more gas but lees time to heat the house.
So how do you find it best to set?

"Golan" wrote in message
ups.com...
What is the best temperature to keep the boiler on? What do you keep it
on?The maximum 82 degree or 60-65?
High temp = more gas but lees time to heat the house.
So how do you find it best to set?

Whatever gives the max. temperature which you need for domestic hot water.
Mine is at about 70C - anything more than that and the wife complains that
it is burning her hands.

"Golan" wrote in message
ups.com...
What is the best temperature to keep the boiler on? What do you keep it
on?The maximum 82 degree or 60-65?
High temp = more gas but lees time to heat the house.
So how do you find it best to set?

I have the heating on near max ~70 (75 max)
I have the tap water on ~50 since it is very hard water and it keeps the
scale down.
Combi - I get to choose both.

--
Mike W

"visionset" wrote in message
...

"Golan" wrote in message
ups.com...
What is the best temperature to keep the boiler on? What do you keep it
on?The maximum 82 degree or 60-65?
High temp = more gas but lees time to heat the house.
So how do you find it best to set?

I have the heating on near max ~70 (75 max)
I have the tap water on ~50 since it is very hard water and it keeps the
scale down.
Combi - I get to choose both.

--
Mike W



I get to choose both, too, without a combi.

The boiler stat determines the primary ( Central Heating Loop ) temperature,
the room stats / zone valves and TRVs determine the room temperature, and
the tank stat and associated zone valve control the Domestic Hot Water
temperature.

This is not an uncommon configuration.

--
Ron

"Roger Cain" wrote in message
...

"Golan" wrote in message
ups.com...
What is the best temperature to keep the boiler on? What do you keep it
on?The maximum 82 degree or 60-65?
High temp = more gas but lees time to heat the house.
So how do you find it best to set?

Whatever gives the max. temperature which you need for domestic hot water.
Mine is at about 70C - anything more than that and the wife complains that
it is burning her hands.

You should install a cylinder thermostat then.

In message . com, Golan
writes
What is the best temperature to keep the boiler on? What do you keep it
on?The maximum 82 degree or 60-65?
High temp = more gas but lees time to heat the house.
So how do you find it best to set?

Generally, boilers are more efficient working to hotter temperatures

--
geoff

In article . com,
Golan wrote:
What is the best temperature to keep the boiler on? What do you keep it
on?The maximum 82 degree or 60-65?
High temp = more gas but lees time to heat the house.
So how do you find it best to set?

Assuming a non condenser non combi with control over the hot water
temperature via a cylinder stat and valve, maximum.

--
*Ever stop to think and forget to start again?

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Roger Cain wrote:
"Golan" wrote in message
ups.com...
What is the best temperature to keep the boiler on? What do you keep it
on?The maximum 82 degree or 60-65?
High temp = more gas but lees time to heat the house.
So how do you find it best to set?

Whatever gives the max. temperature which you need for domestic hot water.
Mine is at about 70C - anything more than that and the wife complains that
it is burning her hands.


? I have a tank stat which takes care of that..as long as the boiler
flow water is ABOVE the desired temp, its all OK.

visionset wrote:
"Golan" wrote in message
ups.com...
What is the best temperature to keep the boiler on? What do you keep it
on?The maximum 82 degree or 60-65?
High temp = more gas but lees time to heat the house.
So how do you find it best to set?

I have the heating on near max ~70 (75 max)
I have the tap water on ~50 since it is very hard water and it keeps the
scale down.
Combi - I get to choose both.

as will any other system with a hot water tank that has a stat on it.

You turn the temp up enough to get the heat output you need. lower is
more efficient at fuel use, higher is more efficient at heating the house!

"Golan" wrote in message
ups.com...
What is the best temperature to keep the boiler on? What do you keep it
on?The maximum 82 degree or 60-65?
High temp = more gas but lees time to heat the house.
So how do you find it best to set?

If there is nothing in the instruction manual you could ask the manufacturer.
FWIW the manual for my boiler suggests a high setting for winter when the C/H is
on and a low setting for summer when just the H/W is being heated.


Clearly if you use a low setting you limit the amount of heat the boiler can
output and the speed which it can raise the house temperature (and reheat the
H/W).

--

Michael Chare

"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message
...
visionset wrote:
"Golan" wrote in message
ups.com...
What is the best temperature to keep the boiler on? What do you keep it
on?The maximum 82 degree or 60-65?
High temp = more gas but lees time to heat the house.
So how do you find it best to set?

I have the heating on near max ~70 (75 max)
I have the tap water on ~50 since it is very hard water and it keeps the
scale down.
Combi - I get to choose both.

as will any other system with a hot water
tank that has a stat on it.

You turn the temp up enough to get the heat output you need. lower is more
efficient at fuel use, higher is more efficient at heating the house!

Nope. He has full independent control of CH & DHW. With a cylinder stat the
CH rad temperatures can't be less than what the DHW requires. Unless you
put in a diverter system (easy to do or convert from a non-diverter system)
with a pipe stat on the boiler flow or return for CH rad temp, controlling
the boilers temp. Then the boiler can be left on full meaning a fast warm up
fro CH.

"Michael Chare" wrote in message
...

Clearly if you use a low setting you limit the amount of heat the boiler
can
output and the speed which it can raise the house temperature (and reheat
the
H/W).

Not quite. A boiler raises the temperature of the x degrees and n water flow
through boiler. Let's say it raises the water temp 35C. On warm up from
cold, the water may be returning to the boiler at 17C. That means the boiler
will be producing 52C of flow temperature and it may be set to 65C. Until
the return reaches 30C the boiler keeps firing. Up until this point it heats
up from cold at the same rate as if the boiler is set to 82C.

I have the tap water on ~50 since it is very hard water and it keeps the
scale down.

This might not be safe, as you could easily run into leggionaires' problems.
You should really store water at about 60C (or more) and use a thermostatic
mixing valve if you want cooler water. Even 55C would be significantly safer
than 50C.

Christian.

Clearly if you use a low setting you limit the amount of heat the boiler
can
output and the speed which it can raise the house temperature (and reheat
the
H/W).

Not necessarily. That depends on whether the radiators can emit enough
energy at the lower temperature to use all the boiler's capacity.

Christian.

Generally, boilers are more efficient working to hotter temperatures

Eh?

Boilers are fundamentally more efficient at lower temperatures. This isn't a
design issue, but stems from the laws of thermodynamics. This is in addition
to the extra efficiency from condensing.

The only reasons for having high temperatures are (a) your heating won't
actually work well enough and (b) your non-condensing boiler with condense
and rot from within.

Christian.

"Christian McArdle" wrote in message
.. .
I have the tap water on ~50 since it is very hard water and it keeps the
scale down.

This might not be safe, as you could easily run into leggionaires'
problems. You should really store water at about 60C (or more) and use a
thermostatic mixing valve if you want cooler water. Even 55C would be
significantly safer than 50C.

Christian.

Yep.

Christian McArdle wrote:
Generally, boilers are more efficient working to hotter temperatures

Eh?

Boilers are fundamentally more efficient at lower temperatures. This isn't a
design issue, but stems from the laws of thermodynamics. This is in addition
to the extra efficiency from condensing.


True in theory, but some boilers work better at higher outputs due to
other factors. I.e. non modulating boilers may suffer short cycle times
at lower output temps..and the ignition process can waste fuel.

Roll on nuclear power and all electric boilers..

Cheap as chips they would be...to make anyway.

On 2006-11-13 10:43:37 +0000, The Natural Philosopher said:

Christian McArdle wrote:
Generally, boilers are more efficient working to hotter temperatures

Eh?

Boilers are fundamentally more efficient at lower temperatures. This
isn't a design issue, but stems from the laws of thermodynamics. This
is in addition to the extra efficiency from condensing.


True in theory, but some boilers work better at higher outputs due to
other factors. I.e. non modulating boilers may suffer short cycle times
at lower output temps..and the ignition process can waste fuel.

Roll on nuclear power and all electric boilers..

Cheap as chips they would be...to make anyway.

Three phase supplies....??

"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message
...
Christian McArdle wrote:
Generally, boilers are more efficient working to hotter temperatures

Eh?

Boilers are fundamentally more efficient at lower temperatures. This
isn't a design issue, but stems from the laws of thermodynamics. This is
in addition to the extra efficiency from condensing.


True in theory, but some boilers work better at higher outputs due to
other factors. I.e. non modulating boilers may suffer short cycle times at
lower output temps..and the ignition process can waste fuel.

Roll on nuclear power and all electric boilers..

Yeah .... . I remember 'Pathe News' showing that young women (HM Queen
Elizabeth) in a ceremony at Calder Hall(?) switching on a white glazed
electric stove while a six-foot(?) radius meter needle indicated that
nuclear powers was flowing to the Grid .... 'course the News-Announcer
assured us that this would probably the last meter we'd see .... because it
would be so cheap to generate electricity that they wouldn't bother to
meter it!


Cheap as chips they would be...to make anyway.

words fail me ... see sketch !

--

Brian

"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message
...
Christian McArdle wrote:
Generally, boilers are more efficient working to hotter temperatures

Eh?

Boilers are fundamentally more efficient at lower temperatures. This
isn't a design issue, but stems from the laws of thermodynamics. This is
in addition to the extra efficiency from condensing.


True in theory, but some boilers work better at higher outputs due to
other factors. I.e. non modulating boilers may suffer short cycle times at
lower output temps..and the ignition process can waste fuel.

Roll on nuclear power and all electric boilers..

Cheap as chips they would be...to make anyway.

You will find Heat Pumps will come in, and they are, with element backup,
more complex than simple gas boilers.

"Brian Sharrock" wrote in message
...

"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message
...
Christian McArdle wrote:
Generally, boilers are more efficient working to hotter temperatures

Eh?

Boilers are fundamentally more efficient at lower temperatures. This
isn't a design issue, but stems from the laws of thermodynamics. This is
in addition to the extra efficiency from condensing.


True in theory, but some boilers work better at higher outputs due to
other factors. I.e. non modulating boilers may suffer short cycle times
at lower output temps..and the ignition process can waste fuel.

Roll on nuclear power and all electric boilers..

Yeah .... . I remember 'Pathe News' showing that young women (HM Queen
Elizabeth) in a ceremony at Calder Hall(?) switching on a white glazed
electric stove while a six-foot(?) radius meter needle indicated that
nuclear powers was flowing to the Grid .... 'course the News-Announcer
assured us that this would probably the last meter we'd see .... because
it would be so cheap to generate electricity that they wouldn't bother to
meter it!

We would all have a standing charge to the size of your house, like water.


Cheap as chips they would be...to make anyway.

words fail me ... see sketch !

It wish words would fail him, as he is in cloud cuckoo land.

In article ews.net,
"Doctor Drivel" writes:

You will find Heat Pumps will come in, and they are, with element backup,
more complex than simple gas boilers.

I bought one this summer. Doesn't half pump a lot of heat out,
and heats the room extremely quickly. Would be nice if it had
the equivalent of a modulating burner, but it doesn't. I'm quite
surprised that it still manages to chuck the heat out when it's
freezing outside.

--
Andrew Gabriel

"Andrew Gabriel" wrote in message
...
In article ews.net,
"Doctor Drivel" writes:

You will find Heat Pumps will come in, and they are, with element backup,
more complex than simple gas boilers.

I bought one this summer. Doesn't half pump a lot of heat out,
and heats the room extremely quickly. Would be nice if it had
the equivalent of a modulating burner, but it doesn't. I'm quite
surprised that it still manages to chuck the heat out when it's
freezing outside.

Ground or air-sourced? When the outside air temperature is low, air-sourced
generally can't raise the temperature high enough for DHW purposes, and
maybe running at COP 1 or less (an immersion is COP 1, a gas boiler about
COP 0.9). Also a stated COP 3 is the "peak" COP, the average COP is way
lower. At least sedbuk give the average.

Best use heat pumps with a thermal store to store heat when the outside
temperatures are highest, like during the day, and stop pump cycling.

Many air sourced heat pumps reverse the cycle to de-frost the condensers,
which mean sending heat the other way. This also lower efficiciency.

If you have natural gas, heat pumps are a waste of time as gas is cheaper to
run overall and costs a hell of a lot less to install. Boilers can be picked
up from the local sheds for £300-400.

On Mon, 13 Nov 2006 14:23:15 -0000 Doctor Drivel wrote :
You will find Heat Pumps will come in, and they are, with element
backup, more complex than simple gas boilers.

There are no simple gas boilers any more. Surely a heat pump is a
fridge in reverse, CH pump and perhaps a heating element. My last
fridge had been running for 24 years without any problems when I
took it to the dump, and so far (fingers crossed) I've never had a
CH pump fail.

--
Tony Bryer SDA UK 'Software to build on' http://www.sda.co.uk

"Tony Bryer" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 13 Nov 2006 14:23:15 -0000 Doctor Drivel wrote :
You will find Heat Pumps will come in, and they are, with element
backup, more complex than simple gas boilers.

There are no simple gas boilers any more.

There are. There are a few non-modulating boilers about.

Surely a heat pump is a
fridge in reverse, CH pump and perhaps a heating element. My last
fridge had been running for 24 years without any problems when I
took it to the dump, and so far (fingers crossed) I've never had a
CH pump fail.

The controls to get it to work properly are more complex and you need auto
backup element heating as well.

No CH pump fail? After how many years? I have seen one Grundfos going for
15 years on the cooler return with a weather compensator on the system. The
return was always very cool. And it has a filter on it and always had
inhibitor too.

My compressor lasted 12 years and replacement 8.

In article ews.net,
"Doctor Drivel" writes:

No CH pump fail? After how many years? I have seen one Grundfos going for
15 years on the cooler return with a weather compensator on the system. The
return was always very cool. And it has a filter on it and always had
inhibitor too.

Parent's central heating pump did 43 years and was still working
fine when removed. It was a Sigmund, bought in the 1950's. It's
coil burned out shortly after their mains voltage changed from
200V to 240V in 1960, and my father fitted a new coil (which you
could do without draining down). The pump ran continuously on
their system, 24x7x365, which is nearly 400,000 hrs. A plumber
who came and replaced the hot water cylinder on some occation
when my father was abroad commented on the pump, saying never
to chuck it out, as those pumps never die. It outlasted a
couple of boilers, and might still have been working today if
it hadn't been removed when a small wallmount boiler was fitted
in 1999.

--
Andrew Gabriel

"Andrew Gabriel" wrote in message
...
In article ews.net,
"Doctor Drivel" writes:

No CH pump fail? After how many years? I have seen one Grundfos going
for
15 years on the cooler return with a weather compensator on the system.
The
return was always very cool. And it has a filter on it and always had
inhibitor too.

Parent's central heating pump did 43 years and was still working
fine when removed. It was a Sigmund, bought in the 1950's. It's
coil burned out shortly after their mains voltage changed from
200V to 240V in 1960, and my father fitted a new coil (which you
could do without draining down). The pump ran continuously on
their system, 24x7x365, which is nearly 400,000 hrs. A plumber
who came and replaced the hot water cylinder on some occation
when my father was abroad commented on the pump, saying never
to chuck it out, as those pumps never die. It outlasted a
couple of boilers, and might still have been working today if
it hadn't been removed when a small wallmount boiler was fitted
in 1999.

I came across a few of those in ye olden dayes. Quite big. The first real
small, pump was the SMC, which never had a shaft. The motor and water
section could be separated and the motor changed. They were common but
rattled a lot when worn. Grundfos pushed them out of the market.

Pumps are physically too big. They should be the size of the Grundfos
Comfort secondary circulation pump. The average pump is yesterday's
technology.