http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/m...de/6045028.stm


Peter Crosland

"Peter Crosland" wrote in message
...
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/m...de/6045028.stm

I knew a surgeon who repaired his own kneecap, after it had been broken in a
motorcycle accident. He happened to be the best qualified for the job and
preferred not to leave the job to any of his colleagues.

Colin Bignell

On Thu, 12 Oct 2006 17:12:23 UTC, "nightjar" nightjar@insert my
surname here.uk.com wrote:


"Peter Crosland" wrote in message
...
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/m...de/6045028.stm

I knew a surgeon who repaired his own kneecap, after it had been broken in a
motorcycle accident. He happened to be the best qualified for the job and
preferred not to leave the job to any of his colleagues.

Then there's this one...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/3606845.stm

--
The information contained in this post is copyright the
poster, and specifically may not be published in, or used by
Avenue Supplies, http://avenuesupplies.co.uk

The message
from "Peter Crosland" contains these words:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/m...de/6045028.stm

Perfectly reasonable.

My brother was wondering the other day why it is that if he'd cut his
leg and needed a couple of stitches it'd have taken a long wait in A&E
and cost the NHS a small fortune, wheras when his dog did it, even on a
Sunday dog got seen at once and bill was £17.

--
Skipweasel
Pay no attention to that man behind the curtain.

On 2006-10-12 19:34:22 +0100, Guy King said:

The message
from "Peter Crosland" contains these words:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/m...de/6045028.stm

Perfectly reasonable.
My brother was wondering the other day why it is that if he'd cut his
leg and needed a couple of stitches it'd have taken a long wait in A&E
and cost the NHS a small fortune, wheras when his dog did it, even on a
Sunday dog got seen at once and bill was £17.

... and probably saw a more skilled practitioner into the bargain.

Peter Crosland wrote:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/m...de/6045028.stm


Peter Crosland

Worked in the labs there often

"Guy King" wrote in message
...
The message
from "Peter Crosland" contains these words:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/m...de/6045028.stm

Perfectly reasonable.

My brother was wondering the other day why it is that if he'd cut his
leg and needed a couple of stitches it'd have taken a long wait in A&E
and cost the NHS a small fortune, wheras when his dog did it, even on a
Sunday dog got seen at once and bill was £17.

and, of course, the doctor in A&E would not be permitted to operate on the
dog, but the vet could have operated on the human.

Colin Bignell

Staffbull wrote:
Peter Crosland wrote:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/m...de/6045028.stm


Worked in the labs there often

Didn't even know B&Q had labs

David

On 2006-10-12 20:28:29 +0100, Lobster said:

Staffbull wrote:
Peter Crosland wrote:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/m...de/6045028.stm


Worked in the labs there often

Didn't even know B&Q had labs

David

Typo I think. "v" is next to "b" on the keyboard...... ;-)

The message
from Andy Hall contains these words:

My brother was wondering the other day why it is that if he'd cut his
leg and needed a couple of stitches it'd have taken a long wait in A&E
and cost the NHS a small fortune, wheras when his dog did it, even on a
Sunday dog got seen at once and bill was £17.

... and probably saw a more skilled practitioner into the bargain.

Certainly better a putting on dressings, in my experience.

--
Skipweasel
Pay no attention to that man behind the curtain.

The message
from Lobster contains these words:

Didn't even know B&Q had labs

Thought they'd switched entirely to poodles.

--
Skipweasel
Pay no attention to that man behind the curtain.

"Guy King" wrote in message
...
The message
from Lobster contains these words:

Didn't even know B&Q had labs

Thought they'd switched entirely to poodles.

Only when it's raining.

Mary

--
Skipweasel
Pay no attention to that man behind the curtain.

On Thu, 12 Oct 2006 18:12:23 +0100, "nightjar" nightjar@insert my
surname here.uk.com wrote:


"Peter Crosland" wrote in message
...
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/m...de/6045028.stm

I knew a surgeon who repaired his own kneecap, after it had been broken in a
motorcycle accident. He happened to be the best qualified for the job and
preferred not to leave the job to any of his colleagues.


I always wondered whether dentists fixed up their own teeth in the
bathroom mirror.

My very expensive private dentist in Bradford flew to another country
in the EU to get root canal therapy done by one of his erstwhile
fellow students at Uni. "It just died", he said, no neglect of
hygeine, lack of brushing, or owt like that, then.

Suppose that *would be* a bit too much to do with a Dremel in the
mirror.

DG

The message
from Derek ^ contains these words:

Suppose that *would be* a bit too much to do with a Dremel in the
mirror.

I've done a spot of DIY dentistry with a dremelish. Cracked a tooth
leaving a very sharp edge which was rubbing my gum really badly. Bank
holiday weekend, so just removed the edge. Very little actual enamel
ground off, perhaps 1/2mm along the edge, just enough to blunt it.
Dentist seemed to think it was a reasonable thing to have done and said
that it didn't affect how he was going to repair it anyway.

--
Skipweasel
Pay no attention to that man behind the curtain.

"nightjar .uk.com" nightjar@insert my surname here wrote in message
...

"Guy King" wrote in message
...
The message
from "Peter Crosland" contains these words:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/m...de/6045028.stm

Perfectly reasonable.

My brother was wondering the other day why it is that if he'd cut his
leg and needed a couple of stitches it'd have taken a long wait in A&E
and cost the NHS a small fortune, wheras when his dog did it, even on a
Sunday dog got seen at once and bill was £17.

and, of course, the doctor in A&E would not be permitted to operate on the
dog, but the vet could have operated on the human.

Colin Bignell
Well, the vets are more highly qualified: the patients can't explain the
symptoms and the vets need to know much more pharmacology (because drug
sensitivity varies a lot between species). Also, if you have ever seen the
damage a horse kick can do you would realise how careful vets are.

However whether, in these litigious times, a vet would have been prepared to
do the job is another question.

in 578552 20061012 193422 Guy King wrote:
The message
from "Peter Crosland" contains these words:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/m...de/6045028.stm

Perfectly reasonable.

My brother was wondering the other day why it is that if he'd cut his
leg and needed a couple of stitches it'd have taken a long wait in A&E
and cost the NHS a small fortune, wheras when his dog did it, even on a
Sunday dog got seen at once and bill was £17.

Ditto dental work - my JR had a tooth out and the rest cleaned, under general
anaesthetic, for £100, at 24 hours notice.

On Oct 12, 7:34 pm, Guy King wrote:
The message
from "Peter Crosland" contains these words:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/m...8.stmPerfectly reasonable.

My brother was wondering the other day why it is that if he'd cut his
leg and needed a couple of stitches it'd have taken a long wait in A&E
and cost the NHS a small fortune, wheras when his dog did it, even on a
Sunday dog got seen at once and bill was £17.

The repercussions had the dog died would be a lot less than if someone
had paid £17 at the hospital and died as a result.

MBQ

In article .com,
" writes:
On Oct 12, 7:34 pm, Guy King wrote:
My brother was wondering the other day why it is that if he'd cut his
leg and needed a couple of stitches it'd have taken a long wait in A&E
and cost the NHS a small fortune, wheras when his dog did it, even on a
Sunday dog got seen at once and bill was £17.
The repercussions had the dog died would be a lot less than if someone
had paid £17 at the hospital and died as a result.

If they paid £17, perhaps yes. However, there are remarkably
few repercussions for the 5000 per year who die of hospital
aquired infections, and didn't pay a penny.

--
Andrew Gabriel

Andrew Gabriel wrote:
In article .com,
" writes:
On Oct 12, 7:34 pm, Guy King wrote:
My brother was wondering the other day why it is that if he'd cut his
leg and needed a couple of stitches it'd have taken a long wait in A&E
and cost the NHS a small fortune, wheras when his dog did it, even on a
Sunday dog got seen at once and bill was £17.
The repercussions had the dog died would be a lot less than if someone
had paid £17 at the hospital and died as a result.

If they paid £17, perhaps yes. However, there are remarkably
few repercussions for the 5000 per year who die of hospital
aquired infections, and didn't pay a penny.


There's a story in the last issue of Private Eye about an anaesthetist
who was rude to a woman giving birth by C-section - she'd held up the op
by nipping off for a fag, and then he couldn't intubate her because she
was coughing so much; and he ventured to suggest that now she'd
witnessed her daughter being born, if she packed in smoking she might
live to see her getting married too - she apparently developed
post-natal depression as a result, and ended up settling for 44K with
the anaesthetist...

David

On Fri, 13 Oct 2006 22:56:13 UTC, Lobster
wrote:

There's a story in the last issue of Private Eye about an anaesthetist
who was rude to a woman giving birth by C-section - she'd held up the op
by nipping off for a fag, and then he couldn't intubate her because she
was coughing so much; and he ventured to suggest that now she'd
witnessed her daughter being born, if she packed in smoking she might
live to see her getting married too - she apparently developed
post-natal depression as a result, and ended up settling for 44K with
the anaesthetist...

As opposed to the anaesthetist who failed to do the job properly,
leaving the woman able to feel everything but unable to communicate.

--
The information contained in this post is copyright the
poster, and specifically may not be published in, or used by
Avenue Supplies, http://avenuesupplies.co.uk

Andrew Gabriel wrote:
In article .com,
" writes:
On Oct 12, 7:34 pm, Guy King wrote:
My brother was wondering the other day why it is that if he'd cut his
leg and needed a couple of stitches it'd have taken a long wait in A&E
and cost the NHS a small fortune, wheras when his dog did it, even on a
Sunday dog got seen at once and bill was £17.
The repercussions had the dog died would be a lot less than if someone
had paid £17 at the hospital and died as a result.

If they paid £17, perhaps yes. However, there are remarkably
few repercussions for the 5000 per year who die of hospital
aquired infections, and didn't pay a penny.

--
Andrew Gabriel

Most Hospitals are a little "shy" about entering any note of infection
accredited to cause of death, especially the media buzz that is MRSA.
You would be VERY surprised at the state of some hospitals behind the
scenes, theatres,labs etc. and not just the NHS, some private Hospitals
are just as bad !!. I'm surprised I never contracted something whilst
working in them for the last 10 years, especially having to lie on the
floor at times to repair a piece of equipment!

In article .com,
"Staffbull" writes:
Andrew Gabriel wrote:
In article .com,
" writes:
On Oct 12, 7:34 pm, Guy King wrote:
My brother was wondering the other day why it is that if he'd cut his
leg and needed a couple of stitches it'd have taken a long wait in A&E
and cost the NHS a small fortune, wheras when his dog did it, even on a
Sunday dog got seen at once and bill was £17.
The repercussions had the dog died would be a lot less than if someone
had paid £17 at the hospital and died as a result.

If they paid £17, perhaps yes. However, there are remarkably
few repercussions for the 5000 per year who die of hospital
aquired infections, and didn't pay a penny.

Most Hospitals are a little "shy" about entering any note of infection
accredited to cause of death, especially the media buzz that is MRSA.
You would be VERY surprised at the state of some hospitals behind the
scenes, theatres,labs etc. and not just the NHS, some private Hospitals
are just as bad !!. I'm surprised I never contracted something whilst
working in them for the last 10 years, especially having to lie on the
floor at times to repair a piece of equipment!

Although MRSA gets all the bad press, I believe it is responsible
for only 15-20% of hospital acquired infections. If you include non-
fatal cases, the figures are truely astonishing -- about 300,000
hospital acquired infections per year in the UK, with about 9% of
hospital patients at any one time having a hospital acquired infection.

--
Andrew Gabriel

In article ,
Andrew Gabriel wrote:
Although MRSA gets all the bad press, I believe it is responsible
for only 15-20% of hospital acquired infections. If you include non-
fatal cases, the figures are truely astonishing -- about 300,000
hospital acquired infections per year in the UK, with about 9% of
hospital patients at any one time having a hospital acquired infection.

It's probably to do with being surrounded by sick people.

--
*I started out with nothing... and I still have most of it.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the
drugs began to take hold. I remember Guy King
saying something like:

The message
from Andy Hall contains these words:

My brother was wondering the other day why it is that if he'd cut his
leg and needed a couple of stitches it'd have taken a long wait in A&E
and cost the NHS a small fortune, wheras when his dog did it, even on a
Sunday dog got seen at once and bill was £17.

... and probably saw a more skilled practitioner into the bargain.

Certainly better a putting on dressings, in my experience.

A vet of my acquaintance is quite verbal on this point - that human
doctors just specialise in treating one species, while vets have to know
about a helluva lot more.

Certainly, I'd trust her to treat me, it's just that her
licence/registration won't allow it.
--

Dave

A vet of my acquaintance is quite verbal on this point - that human
doctors just specialise in treating one species, while vets have to know
about a helluva lot more.

Certainly, I'd trust her to treat me, it's just that her
licence/registration won't allow it.
--

Dave

Always thought it was legal to operate on someone as long as you had their
consent, as long as you did'nt profess to be qualified or prescribe any
drugs. Or is that another urban myth?

Grimly Curmudgeon ) gurgled happily,
sounding much like they were saying :

A vet of my acquaintance is quite verbal on this point - that human
doctors just specialise in treating one species, while vets have to
know about a helluva lot more.

Certainly, I'd trust her to treat me, it's just that her
licence/registration won't allow it.

Then, of course, there's the dichotomy around Euthanasia.

If you DON'T put a pet "out of it's misery" when it gets old and decrepit,
you're cruel - and, in an extreme case, could go to prison.

If you DO put a human "out of their misery" in the same circumstances, you
can go to prison.

If/when I get to that state, I'll go with the vet's solution, please.

The message
from Grimly Curmudgeon contains these words:

Certainly, I'd trust her to treat me, it's just that her
licence/registration won't allow it.

I've been patched up by the vet a couple of times - though this was many
years ago before we all got so fussy about these things. Didn't bother
me - I'd had the opportunity to see his work many times before and knew
I could trust him. Something most people can't say about their doctors.
Helen excepted, of course. She's stitched me up quite adequately.

--
Skipweasel
Pay no attention to that man behind the curtain.

The message . 170
from Adrian contains these words:

If/when I get to that state, I'll go with the vet's solution, please.

AOL

--
Skipweasel
Pay no attention to that man behind the curtain.

On Sat, 14 Oct 2006 14:50:47 UTC, "Kay" wrote:

Always thought it was legal to operate on someone as long as you had their
consent, as long as you did'nt profess to be qualified or prescribe any
drugs. Or is that another urban myth?

Sounds a bit like the "competent person" thing again!

--
The information contained in this post is copyright the
poster, and specifically may not be published in, or used by
Avenue Supplies, http://avenuesupplies.co.uk

On Sat, 14 Oct 2006 13:39:42 +0100, "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:

In article ,
Andrew Gabriel wrote:
Although MRSA gets all the bad press, I believe it is responsible
for only 15-20% of hospital acquired infections. If you include non-
fatal cases, the figures are truely astonishing -- about 300,000
hospital acquired infections per year in the UK, with about 9% of
hospital patients at any one time having a hospital acquired infection.

It's probably to do with being surrounded by sick people.

Correct in as far as they are probably weekened and frail.

However that's not to say patients routinely transmit the same
sickness they came in with to everybody else. "Nasty epidemic of the
head stuck in saucepan syndrome on emergency ward 10 matron" :-)

In Holland a whole Hospital department is shut down "To the floor" and
they start scrubbing if a single case of MRSA is discovered. As a
consequence the incidence there is about one third of ours. My wife's
father died of MRSA in a filthy NHS Hospital six years ago. He took 6
weeks to die, she still cannot accept that he had to suffer so much
simply on account of poor cleanliness.

To be fair the indicipline which runs through our society today makes
control of infection in Hospital wards more difficult for the staff.

Visitors expect practically unlimited visiting hours and get them.
Visitors use the visitors toilets, which are usually in in a sick
making state with human waste sloshing about on the floor. The visitor
then goes to the ward and sits on the bed with his feet up, small
children become bored and fractious and are permitted to wander from
bed to bed playing with small toys. Yuck.

http://www.leedstoday.net/ViewArticle2.aspx?SectionID=39&ArticleID=876234

Oh, BTW, better be careful ...

http://society.guardian.co.uk/health...430537,00.html

"Government will have powers to control the publication of reports
into doctors' workloads, waiting times, conditions in hospitals and
the quality of care. Studies into deaths resulting from infections
picked up in hospital would be banned unless permitted by the
Minister. "

No, the date is not April the first.

DG

On 14 Oct 2006 03:20:12 -0700, "Staffbull"
wrote:


Most Hospitals are a little "shy" about entering any note of infection
accredited to cause of death, especially the media buzz that is MRSA.
You would be VERY surprised at the state of some hospitals behind the
scenes, theatres,labs etc. and not just the NHS, some private Hospitals
are just as bad !!.

Some private hospitals are actually old nursing homes in unsuitable
accomodation such as big old houses.

I'm surprised I never contracted something whilst
working in them for the last 10 years, especially having to lie on the
floor at times to repair a piece of equipment!

You can move an X-ray table, HV transformer, Control desk, and
Generator cabinets that have been in service for 14-15 years and find
their outlines marked out on the floor in 1 cm of grease + 3 cms of
fluff, even in an operating theatre.

One big hospital in Scotland specified "rodent proof" ethernet cable
for one installation. It's a miracle their patients weren't going down
with Bubonic Plague let alone MRSA.

DG

Guy King typed

I could trust him. Something most people can't say about their doctors.
Helen excepted, of course. She's stitched me up quite adequately.

You say the sweetest things!

--
Helen D. Vecht:
Edgware.

Derek ^ wrote:
On 14 Oct 2006 03:20:12 -0700, "Staffbull"
wrote:


Most Hospitals are a little "shy" about entering any note of infection
accredited to cause of death, especially the media buzz that is MRSA.
You would be VERY surprised at the state of some hospitals behind the
scenes, theatres,labs etc. and not just the NHS, some private Hospitals
are just as bad !!.

Some private hospitals are actually old nursing homes in unsuitable
accomodation such as big old houses.

I'm surprised I never contracted something whilst
working in them for the last 10 years, especially having to lie on the
floor at times to repair a piece of equipment!

You can move an X-ray table, HV transformer, Control desk, and
Generator cabinets that have been in service for 14-15 years and find
their outlines marked out on the floor in 1 cm of grease + 3 cms of
fluff, even in an operating theatre.

One big hospital in Scotland specified "rodent proof" ethernet cable
for one installation. It's a miracle their patients weren't going down
with Bubonic Plague let alone MRSA.

DG

Dont miss it a bit :-)

Oh by the way, Glasgow Royal or Yorkhill?

On 14 Oct 2006 15:06:05 -0700, "Staffbull"
wrote:


Dont miss it a bit :-)

Oh by the way, Glasgow Royal or Yorkhill?

Southside ;-)

Think Clyde Tunnel ...

8-(

DG

On 14 Oct 2006 15:06:05 -0700, "Staffbull"
wrote:


Derek ^ wrote:
On 14 Oct 2006 03:20:12 -0700, "Staffbull"
wrote:


Most Hospitals are a little "shy" about entering any note of infection
accredited to cause of death, especially the media buzz that is MRSA.
You would be VERY surprised at the state of some hospitals behind the
scenes, theatres,labs etc. and not just the NHS, some private Hospitals
are just as bad !!.

Some private hospitals are actually old nursing homes in unsuitable
accomodation such as big old houses.

I'm surprised I never contracted something whilst
working in them for the last 10 years, especially having to lie on the
floor at times to repair a piece of equipment!

You can move an X-ray table, HV transformer, Control desk, and
Generator cabinets that have been in service for 14-15 years and find
their outlines marked out on the floor in 1 cm of grease + 3 cms of
fluff, even in an operating theatre.

One big hospital in Scotland specified "rodent proof" ethernet cable
for one installation. It's a miracle their patients weren't going down
with Bubonic Plague let alone MRSA.

DG

Dont miss it a bit :-)

Oh by the way, Glasgow Royal or Yorkhill?

BTW, having re-read my own post. What made you guess Glasgow ?

The wee woman at our local fish and chip shop (Near Leeds, been down
here for 30+ years) says that "them" (the staff ?) at Raigmore,
Inverness, are "Butchers".

So there.

DG

On Sat, 14 Oct 2006 19:41:56 +0100, Derek ^
wrote:


Oh, BTW, better be careful ...

http://society.guardian.co.uk/health...430537,00.html

"Government will have powers to control the publication of reports
into doctors' workloads, waiting times, conditions in hospitals and
the quality of care. Studies into deaths resulting from infections
picked up in hospital would be banned unless permitted by the
Minister. "

Labour - the "We don't give a toss" party.

"The Government plans to make independent scrutiny of the National
Health Service a criminal offence"

Sorry, I forgot, we are now living in North Korea.
Please Mr Milburn, can I fart? In your face? Good. There you are, I
enjoyed that too, no charge, a free gift (but please make sure you
declare it to
a. the Environmental Audit committee - you are now responsible for
that fart - please recycle it, in public, live on camera)
b. the Standards and Priveleges committee, if that fart was in any way
substandard then I promise to replace it within 24 hours.


There, I feel better for that, and I did it all myself. So, back
on-topic.


--
Regards, Paul Herber, Sandrila Ltd. http://www.pherber.com/
Visio Utilities http://www.visio-utilities.sandrila.co.uk/

Bob Eager wrote:

On Sat, 14 Oct 2006 14:50:47 UTC, "Kay" wrote:

Always thought it was legal to operate on someone as long as you had their
consent, as long as you did'nt profess to be qualified or prescribe any
drugs. Or is that another urban myth?

Sounds a bit like the "competent person" thing again!

Well, I wouldn't want just _anybody_ interfering with my part P!

Chris
--
Chris J Dixon Nottingham UK


Have dancing shoes, will ceilidh.

On 14 Oct 2006 09:23:26 GMT, "Bob Eager" wrote:

On Fri, 13 Oct 2006 22:56:13 UTC, Lobster
wrote:

There's a story in the last issue of Private Eye about an anaesthetist
who was rude to a woman giving birth by C-section - she'd held up the op
by nipping off for a fag, and then he couldn't intubate her because she
was coughing so much; and he ventured to suggest that now she'd
witnessed her daughter being born, if she packed in smoking she might
live to see her getting married too - she apparently developed
post-natal depression as a result, and ended up settling for 44K with
the anaesthetist...

As opposed to the anaesthetist who failed to do the job properly,
leaving the woman able to feel everything but unable to communicate.

A little bit of pain never did anyone any harm.

--

The message
from Matt contains these words:

A little bit of pain never did anyone any harm.

I think the wife drew the line at her spinal block wearing off during a
caesarean.

--
Skipweasel
Pay no attention to that man behind the curtain.

On Mon, 16 Oct 2006 21:19:12 +0100, Matt
wrote:

On 14 Oct 2006 09:23:26 GMT, "Bob Eager" wrote:

On Fri, 13 Oct 2006 22:56:13 UTC, Lobster
wrote:

There's a story in the last issue of Private Eye about an anaesthetist
who was rude to a woman giving birth by C-section - she'd held up the op
by nipping off for a fag, and then he couldn't intubate her because she
was coughing so much; and he ventured to suggest that now she'd
witnessed her daughter being born, if she packed in smoking she might
live to see her getting married too - she apparently developed
post-natal depression as a result, and ended up settling for 44K with
the anaesthetist...

As opposed to the anaesthetist who failed to do the job properly,
leaving the woman able to feel everything but unable to communicate.

A little bit of pain never did anyone any harm.

You are Schopenhauer and I claim my 2 free philosophers



--
Regards, Paul Herber, Sandrila Ltd. http://www.pherber.com/
Electrical for Visio http://www.electrical.sandrila.co.uk/