My old B&D has seized. It's the ball race. And it appears to be turning in
the housing. I will repair it if the parts aren't too dear, but in the
meantime need another. Given I don't use one much, what's the pick of the
cheapies - more like 100 quid than 300?

--
*When companies ship Styrofoam, what do they pack it in? *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

"Dave Plowman (News)" through a haze of senile
flatulence wrote in message ...
My old B&D has seized. It's the ball race. And it appears to be turning in
the housing. I will repair it if the parts aren't too dear, but in the
meantime need another. Given I don't use one much, what's the pick of the
cheapies - more like 100 quid than 300?

PP Pro @ £49 (3 year guarantee). 1/2" so can do kitchen worktops and comes
with bits and worktop jig "guide". So all you need is a £49 Screwfix jig and
for les than £100 you can cut worktops and much more.
http://www.diy.com/diy/jsp/bq/nav/nav.jsp?action=detail&fh_secondid=7940070&fh_searc h=router&fh_eds=%c3%9f&fh_refview=search&ts=113507 5231797

Doctor Drivel wrote:

PP Pro @ £49 (3 year guarantee). 1/2" so can do kitchen worktops and

http://www.diy.com/diy/jsp/bq/nav/nav.jsp?action=detail&fh_secondid=7940070&fh_searc h=router&fh_eds=%c3%9f&fh_refview=search&ts=113507 5231797

What is the speed range supported on this?


--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

"John Rumm" wrote in message
...
Doctor Drivel wrote:

PP Pro @ £49 (3 year guarantee). 1/2" so can do kitchen worktops and

http://www.diy.com/diy/jsp/bq/nav/nav.jsp?action=detail&fh_secondid=7940070&fh_searc h=router&fh_eds=%c3%9f&fh_refview=search&ts=113507 5231797

What is the speed range supported on this?

I can't remember. The local B&Q had one on show and all the details were
there. It is about the best value for money in a router and if you only cut
2 or three worktops makes its money back.

Doctor Drivel wrote:
"John Rumm" wrote in message
...
Doctor Drivel wrote:

PP Pro @ £49 (3 year guarantee). 1/2" so can do kitchen worktops
and


http://www.diy.com/diy/jsp/bq/nav/na...econdid=794007
0&fh_search=router&fh_eds=%c3%9f&fh_refview=search &ts=1135075231797

What is the speed range supported on this?

I can't remember. The local B&Q had one on show and all the details
were there. It is about the best value for money in a router and if
you only cut 2 or three worktops makes its money back.

PP,Powerdevil,Nu-Tool and JCB are all made in the same factory in
Taiwan...now which is the best value for money?

--
Sir Benjamin Middlethwaite

"The3rd Earl Of Derby" wrote in message
. uk...
Doctor Drivel wrote:
"John Rumm" wrote in message
...
Doctor Drivel wrote:

PP Pro @ £49 (3 year guarantee). 1/2" so can do kitchen worktops
and


http://www.diy.com/diy/jsp/bq/nav/na...econdid=794007
0&fh_search=router&fh_eds=%c3%9f&fh_refview=search &ts=1135075231797

What is the speed range supported on this?

I can't remember. The local B&Q had one on show and all the details
were there. It is about the best value for money in a router and if
you only cut 2 or three worktops makes its money back.

PP,Powerdevil,Nu-Tool and JCB are all made in the same factory in
Taiwan...now which is the best value for money?

The one with the features, guarantee and best price. Can't you figure tat
out?

On Tue, 20 Dec 2005 13:53:54 GMT, "The3rd Earl Of Derby"
wrote:

PP,Powerdevil,Nu-Tool and JCB are all made in the same factory in
Taiwan...now which is the best value for money?

Who cares? They're all wobbly crap, designed to last 5 minutes in the
hands of fools like Drivel who wouldn't know a decent router from a
corkscrew.

On Tue, 20 Dec 2005 13:43:55 -0000, "Doctor Drivel"
wrote:


"John Rumm" wrote in message
...
Doctor Drivel wrote:

PP Pro @ £49 (3 year guarantee). 1/2" so can do kitchen worktops and

http://www.diy.com/diy/jsp/bq/nav/nav.jsp?action=detail&fh_secondid=7940070&fh_searc h=router&fh_eds=%c3%9f&fh_refview=search&ts=113507 5231797

What is the speed range supported on this?

I can't remember. The local B&Q had one on show and all the details were
there. It is about the best value for money in a router and if you only cut
2 or three worktops makes its money back.


For cutting worktops, it would be more cost effective to rent a proper
one.

--

..andy

In article ,
Andy Hall wrote:
On Tue, 20 Dec 2005 13:43:55 -0000, "Doctor Drivel"
wrote:


"John Rumm" wrote in message
...
Doctor Drivel wrote:

PP Pro @ £49 (3 year guarantee). 1/2" so can do kitchen worktops and

http://www.diy.com/diy/jsp/bq/nav/nav.jsp?action=detail&fh_secondid=7940070&fh_searc h=router&fh_eds=%c3%9f&fh_refview=search&ts=113507 5231797

What is the speed range supported on this?

I can't remember. The local B&Q had one on show and all the details
were there. It is about the best value for money in a router and if
you only cut 2 or three worktops makes its money back.


For cutting worktops, it would be more cost effective to rent a proper
one.

If dribble recommends PP Pro it would seem the one to avoid. And he seems
to think cutting kitchen worktops is the thing you do with a router since
he's mentioned it before.

I've had a look round the local tool stores and sheds.

The PP Pro one has the usual kit full of probably doubtful accessories -
after all more must be better.

I'm tempted by the T-tech (Trend) R127 at 100 quid. Soft start and
vari-speed - 15,000 - 27,000. 2050 watts input. It's heavy, but maybe no
bad thing for the sort of use I'll have for it. And it doesn't come with
loads of bits. Says suitable for hobby or trade use, but not continuous
pro work. Appears to be a B&Q special.

--
*"I am " is reportedly the shortest sentence in the English language. *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Doctor Drivel wrote:

What is the speed range supported on this?


I can't remember. The local B&Q had one on show and all the details

The last time I looked at a PPro 1/2" router its minimum speed was
something in the order of 15k rpm. (not saying this has the same
problem, but since you seem to be the authority on all things B&Q I
thought you might know)

were there. It is about the best value for money in a router and if you
only cut 2 or three worktops makes its money back.

Hence my question about what Dave wanted to do with it. Unless you know
that it is impossible to say if it represents good value for money or
not. To be good vlaue for money it must first be fit for purpose.

(Say for example he wanted to profile the edges of some cabinet doors
using a panel raising cutter set, a 15k rpm router would be of no value
whatsoever since it would be way above the safe maximum speed for such a
large diameter cutter).


--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

On Tue, 20 Dec 2005 23:52:28 +0000, John Rumm
wrote:

(Say for example he wanted to profile the edges of some cabinet doors
using a panel raising cutter set, a 15k rpm router would be of no value
whatsoever since it would be way above the safe maximum speed for such a
large diameter cutter).

If he's anywhere near that size of cutter then it's the Freud 2000
router mounted in a table, every time.

"John Rumm" wrote in message
...
Doctor Drivel wrote:

What is the speed range supported on this?


I can't remember. The local B&Q had one on show and all the details

The last time I looked at a PPro 1/2" router its minimum speed was
something in the order of 15k rpm. (not saying this has the same problem,
but since you seem to be the authority on all things B&Q I thought you
might know)

I do not know all about B&Q, although I would like 10% of their profits.

were there. It is about the best value for money in a router and if you
only cut 2 or three worktops makes its money back.

Hence my question about what Dave wanted to do with it. Unless you know
that it is impossible to say if it represents good value for money or not.
To be good vlaue for money it must first be fit for purpose.

(Say for example he wanted to profile the edges of some cabinet doors
using a panel raising cutter set, a 15k rpm router would be of no value
whatsoever since it would be way above the safe maximum speed for such a
large diameter cutter).

It would also be of no use for putting his Lego blocks on it too.

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
My old B&D has seized. It's the ball race. And it appears to be
turning in the housing. I will repair it if the parts aren't too
dear, but in the meantime need another. Given I don't use one much,
what's the pick of the cheapies - more like 100 quid than 300?

Homebase have a PB Excel on offer at present (bright blue colour) for less
than £20!! Was being sold around £60.

I'm well pleased with mine.

Dave

"david lang" wrote in message
. uk...
Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
My old B&D has seized. It's the ball race. And it appears to be
turning in the housing. I will repair it if the parts aren't too
dear, but in the meantime need another. Given I don't use one much,
what's the pick of the cheapies - more like 100 quid than 300?

Homebase have a PB Excel on offer at present (bright blue colour) for less
than £20!! Was being sold around £60.

1/2"?

Doctor Drivel wrote:

Homebase have a PB Excel on offer at present (bright blue colour)
for less than £20!! Was being sold around £60.

1/2"?

No only 1/4", but soft start, variable speed 11,000 - 28,000 rpm, 55mm
plunge, 1100 watt. Good plunge action, nice to use.

Good buy as a spare at that money - if they have any left.

Dave

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

My old B&D has seized. It's the ball race. And it appears to be turning in
the housing. I will repair it if the parts aren't too dear, but in the
meantime need another. Given I don't use one much, what's the pick of the
cheapies - more like 100 quid than 300?

What size machine are you looking for? (i.e. 1/4" or 1/2"). What sort of
work do you normally do with it? Do you need to mount it in a table?

--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

In article ,
John Rumm wrote:
What size machine are you looking for? (i.e. 1/4" or 1/2").

The B&D was 1/4 and 1/2 - so I'd like the same since I have a selection of
bits.

What sort of work do you normally do with it? Do you need to mount it
in a table?

I only use it hand held at the moment - although a table might be a future
option.

--
*When everything's coming your way, you're in the wrong lane *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

What size machine are you looking for? (i.e. 1/4" or 1/2").


The B&D was 1/4 and 1/2 - so I'd like the same since I have a selection of
bits.

So that is a 1/2" router with a reduction then usually. i.e. a fairly
big machine.

What sort of work do you normally do with it? Do you need to mount it
in a table?


I only use it hand held at the moment - although a table might be a future
option.

The bigger ones are at their best in tables. Used freehand they are ok
for some jobs, but a right pig to handle for others.

--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

In article ,
John Rumm wrote:
The B&D was 1/4 and 1/2 - so I'd like the same since I have a
selection of bits.

So that is a 1/2" router with a reduction then usually. i.e. a fairly
big machine.

Not really - small compared to most I've looked at yesterday. It's a KW
800 - more like the size of the 1/4" ones made today.

What sort of work do you normally do with it? Do you need to mount it
in a table?


I only use it hand held at the moment - although a table might be a
future option.

The bigger ones are at their best in tables. Used freehand they are ok
for some jobs, but a right pig to handle for others.

OK. It's not a tool I'd describe myself as an expert with. ;-)

--
*Despite the cost of living, have you noticed how it remains so popular?

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

Not really - small compared to most I've looked at yesterday. It's a KW
800 - more like the size of the 1/4" ones made today.

I find my T5 (similar sort of power but 1/4" collet) is the one I use
for pretty much all handheld stuff - it is the right size and feel - it
is also simpler to use on narrower stock without needing to add extra
battens etc to balance the weight of the router. Not sure how much use a
"big" router would be with only 800W though - it may preclude doing many
of the things that you would traditionally choose a 1/2" router for.

Remember also that many 1/4" units will also take an 8mm collet which
opens up the range of larger cutters that can be used. The only real
downside is less cutting capacity per pass.

Hence if the choice is between a good quality 1/4" machine or moderate
quality low power 1/2" unit, I would probably go with the good quality
smaller one and get the extra accuracy and rigidity.


--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

On Tue, 20 Dec 2005 10:14:03 +0000 (GMT), "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:

My old B&D has seized. It's the ball race. And it appears to be turning in
the housing. I will repair it if the parts aren't too dear, but in the
meantime need another. Given I don't use one much, what's the pick of the
cheapies - more like 100 quid than 300?

I looked at routers at the Axminster show. Really nothing much has
changed. Those in the sub £100 category continue to have poor and
sticky slide mechanisms. For a router, this makes them hard to use.

If you are looking for a viable 12.7mm model then the Freud FT2000
(Screwfix at £168) is a good buy. I've used one of these a few times
and found it smooth and adequately powered, although I have the DW625
now.

For a 6.35mm model, the Trend T5 is a good workhorse at around £110.
I've had one of these for some while and it continues to perform well.



--

..andy

On Tue, 20 Dec 2005 11:40:45 +0000, Andy Hall wrote:

If you are looking for a viable 12.7mm model then the Freud FT2000
(Screwfix at £168) is a good buy.

The Freud has got to be one of the best deals around for a decent
router.

But it's still a bit of a heavy old clunker. If you're not planning to
use it in a table, then something lighter and handier might be more
suitable. It also has a huge hole in the baseplate - one of the first
jobs is to make a new clear Perspex baseplate up, with a smaller
aperture.

On Tue, 20 Dec 2005 18:28:07 +0000, Andy Dingley
wrote:

On Tue, 20 Dec 2005 11:40:45 +0000, Andy Hall wrote:

If you are looking for a viable 12.7mm model then the Freud FT2000
(Screwfix at £168) is a good buy.

The Freud has got to be one of the best deals around for a decent
router.

But it's still a bit of a heavy old clunker. If you're not planning to
use it in a table, then something lighter and handier might be more
suitable. It also has a huge hole in the baseplate - one of the first
jobs is to make a new clear Perspex baseplate up, with a smaller
aperture.

As far as I could find, there are not substantially lighter ones
around. Freud is 5.6kg

The DW625, T9, Elu,.... is 5.1kg
The Bosch GOF 2000 is 6kg
The Bosch GOF 1300 is 4.8kg (but is a 1300W model - bit low)
The Hitachi M12SA is 5.2kg
The Makita 3612 is 6kg
The Metabo OFE1812 is 5.1kg
The Festool OF2000 is 5.1kg
The Mafell LO65 is 5.5kg

I've used a Makita 3612 a couple of times and can't say that I noticed
it to be difficult in use in comparison with the DW625 (even though a
kg more). Admittedly I didn't do a side by side trial.


--

..andy

On Tue, 20 Dec 2005 20:27:32 +0000, Andy Hall wrote:

As far as I could find, there are not substantially lighter ones
around. Freud is 5.6kg

There are plenty of smaller and lighter routers around. Now admittedly
they're of much less power, but how often do you need a really powerful
router when it's not to swing a large cutter that needs to be used in a
table anyway? Most of the time when I'm using a handheld router, I use
one of my 1/4" routers, just for the smaller footprint and lighter
weight. About the only handheld task that really _needs_ the rigiditiy
of the Freud is trimming kitchen counters - a task which a wee crappy
job like a DrivelPro is of course entirely inadequate for.

On Tue, 20 Dec 2005 23:50:16 +0000, Andy Dingley
wrote:

On Tue, 20 Dec 2005 20:27:32 +0000, Andy Hall wrote:

As far as I could find, there are not substantially lighter ones
around. Freud is 5.6kg

There are plenty of smaller and lighter routers around. Now admittedly
they're of much less power, but how often do you need a really powerful
router when it's not to swing a large cutter that needs to be used in a
table anyway? Most of the time when I'm using a handheld router, I use
one of my 1/4" routers, just for the smaller footprint and lighter
weight.

Yes, I agree. However, we had already started down the track of
talking about 12.7mm routers (or at least I had), and I was thinking
that if one had to pick between that and a smaller one (because of
only buying one) then it probably ought to be a 12.7mm machine.

About the only handheld task that really _needs_ the rigiditiy
of the Freud is trimming kitchen counters - a task which a wee crappy
job like a DrivelPro is of course entirely inadequate for.


Quite.

For some of the larger moulding bits (not in panel raising size
obviously) I tend to prefer the larger router as well, and I have a
larger collection of 12.7mm bits than 6.35mm.

The routers only get used hand held these days as I use a special
spindle in the spindle moulder which takes router cutters and has both
of these sizes in collets. I can also tilt the spindle. As a result,
I have one of the Trend router tables (which gave good service for
what it is) no longer used.

--

..andy

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
My old B&D has seized. It's the ball race. And it appears to be
turning in the housing. I will repair it if the parts aren't too
dear, but in the meantime need another. Given I don't use one much,
what's the pick of the cheapies - more like 100 quid than 300?

Funny you should say that my B&D went down 2months ago so I needed a quick
newbie, as I was out near a argos store I came across this.

http://tinyurl.com/az9uq
--
Sir Benjamin Middlethwaite

The3rd Earl Of Derby wrote:
Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
My old B&D has seized. It's the ball race. And it appears to be
turning in the housing. I will repair it if the parts aren't too
dear, but in the meantime need another. Given I don't use one much,
what's the pick of the cheapies - more like 100 quid than 300?

Funny you should say that my B&D went down 2months ago so I needed a
quick newbie, as I was out near a argos store I came across this.

http://tinyurl.com/az9uq

Erm! forget that for some reason I have "planers on the bonce", most odd.
--
Sir Benjamin Middlethwaite

On Tue, 20 Dec 2005 12:25:44 GMT, "The3rd Earl Of Derby"
wrote:

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
My old B&D has seized. It's the ball race. And it appears to be
turning in the housing. I will repair it if the parts aren't too
dear, but in the meantime need another. Given I don't use one much,
what's the pick of the cheapies - more like 100 quid than 300?

Funny you should say that my B&D went down 2months ago so I needed a quick
newbie, as I was out near a argos store I came across this.

http://tinyurl.com/az9uq


Hopefully you left it there.

It's a bit awkward to do routing with a power planer.


--

..andy

Andy Hall wrote:
On Tue, 20 Dec 2005 12:25:44 GMT, "The3rd Earl Of Derby"
wrote:

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
My old B&D has seized. It's the ball race. And it appears to be
turning in the housing. I will repair it if the parts aren't too
dear, but in the meantime need another. Given I don't use one much,
what's the pick of the cheapies - more like 100 quid than 300?

Funny you should say that my B&D went down 2months ago so I needed a
quick newbie, as I was out near a argos store I came across this.

http://tinyurl.com/az9uq


Hopefully you left it there.

It's a bit awkward to do routing with a power planer.

Leave me alone I'm having a bad day. :-(
--
Sir Benjamin Middlethwaite

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
My old B&D has seized. It's the ball race. And it appears to be
turning in the housing. I will repair it if the parts aren't too
dear, but in the meantime need another. Given I don't use one much,
what's the pick of the cheapies - more like 100 quid than 300?

http://tinyurl.com/e3fzb
--
Sir Benjamin Middlethwaite

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
My old B&D has seized. It's the ball race. And it appears to be
turning in the housing. I will repair it if the parts aren't too
dear, but in the meantime need another. Given I don't use one much,
what's the pick of the cheapies - more like 100 quid than 300?

For the B&D spares
http://www.toolshopdirect.co.uk/part...Indoor/Routers

--
Sir Benjamin Middlethwaite

In article ,
The3rd Earl Of Derby wrote:
For the B&D spares
http://www.toolshopdirect.co.uk/part...Indoor/Routers

Thanks for that. Ordered the bearing and housing for under 20 quid.

--
*How many roads must a man travel down before he admits he is lost?

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.