I just tore down a early 1960s 3/4 HP 3 phase motor to examine the
insides. It's from a drill press and has grease fittings on it, even
though it's just a 56 frame motor with a 5/8" shaft. There's nothing
special about the motor other than it has a factory paint job that matches
the rest of the machine.

Anyways, the thing was full of grease, yet had shielded (6203zz I think)
Nachi made in Japan bearings installed. They seemed too new to be
original,and why the thing was packed with grease baffles me. Nothing
looks modified in any way.

The only thing that would make even a lick of sense is there were
unshielded bearings in there originally and that's why there were grease
ports. Why the thing was pumped full of grease later is a mystery.

Anybody seen anything like this before?

"Cydrome Leader" wrote in message
...
I just tore down a early 1960s 3/4 HP 3 phase motor to examine the
insides. It's from a drill press and has grease fittings on it, even
though it's just a 56 frame motor with a 5/8" shaft. There's nothing
special about the motor other than it has a factory paint job that
matches
the rest of the machine.

Anyways, the thing was full of grease, yet had shielded (6203zz I
think)
Nachi made in Japan bearings installed. They seemed too new to be
original,and why the thing was packed with grease baffles me.
Nothing
looks modified in any way.

The only thing that would make even a lick of sense is there were
unshielded bearings in there originally and that's why there were
grease
ports. Why the thing was pumped full of grease later is a mystery.

Anybody seen anything like this before?

That's better than no lube ever, like some of the machines I bought
used. The trade school students had broken most of the oil cups off my
lathe.

--jsw

On 06/08/2016 11:13 AM, Cydrome Leader wrote:
....

... Why the thing was pumped full of grease later is a mystery.

If you got a piece of gear with grease zerks, wouldn't _you_ grease it
on the presumption they were there for a reason?

Anybody seen anything like this before?

Sure, happens not frequently but on occasion. Are the bearings really
sealed or just shielded in the latter case there is still a reason.

--

dpb wrote:
On 06/08/2016 11:13 AM, Cydrome Leader wrote:
...

... Why the thing was pumped full of grease later is a mystery.

If you got a piece of gear with grease zerks, wouldn't _you_ grease it
on the presumption they were there for a reason?

Anybody seen anything like this before?

Sure, happens not frequently but on occasion. Are the bearings really
sealed or just shielded in the latter case there is still a reason.

They're double shielded, the sealed for life throw away type. Only the
larger bearing for the variable speed drive (a sheave that slides up
and down a shaft) has a removable seal kit.

Was there a transition in the industrial motor world where they still
drilled and tapped grease ports in motor housings but just installed ball
bearings instead?

dpb on Wed, 08 Jun 2016 11:53:31 -0500 typed in
rec.crafts.metalworking the following:
On 06/08/2016 11:13 AM, Cydrome Leader wrote:
...

... Why the thing was pumped full of grease later is a mystery.

If you got a piece of gear with grease zerks, wouldn't _you_ grease it
on the presumption they were there for a reason?

Buda-bing!


And a gold plated no prize for our contestant!
--
pyotr filipivich
"With Age comes Wisdom. Although more often, Age travels alone."

Cydrome Leader on Wed, 8 Jun 2016 17:00:46
+0000 (UTC) typed in rec.crafts.metalworking the following:
dpb wrote:
On 06/08/2016 11:13 AM, Cydrome Leader wrote:
...

... Why the thing was pumped full of grease later is a mystery.

If you got a piece of gear with grease zerks, wouldn't _you_ grease it
on the presumption they were there for a reason?

Anybody seen anything like this before?

Sure, happens not frequently but on occasion. Are the bearings really
sealed or just shielded in the latter case there is still a reason.

They're double shielded, the sealed for life throw away type. Only the
larger bearing for the variable speed drive (a sheave that slides up
and down a shaft) has a removable seal kit.

Was there a transition in the industrial motor world where they still
drilled and tapped grease ports in motor housings but just installed ball
bearings instead?

Or, just as likely, the original bearings were replaced with
sealed ones. And with the zerks in place, someone thoughtfully
greased the bearings.
Whether they needed it or not.


tschus
pyotr

--
pyotr filipivich
"With Age comes Wisdom. Although more often, Age travels alone."

On 6/8/2016 12:53 PM, dpb wrote:


If you got a piece of gear with grease zerks, wouldn't _you_ grease it
on the presumption they were there for a reason?


Not if it is an old Bridgeport mill, you oil those grease fittings.....


MikeB

On 6/8/2016 12:13 PM, Cydrome Leader wrote:

The only thing that would make even a lick of sense is there were
unshielded bearings in there originally and that's why there were grease
ports. Why the thing was pumped full of grease later is a mystery.

Anybody seen anything like this before?



I've done it myself many times. I should have removed and plugged the
zerks but was too lazy.

Tom Gardner wrote:
On 6/8/2016 12:13 PM, Cydrome Leader wrote:

The only thing that would make even a lick of sense is there were
unshielded bearings in there originally and that's why there were grease
ports. Why the thing was pumped full of grease later is a mystery.

Anybody seen anything like this before?



I've done it myself many times. I should have removed and plugged the
zerks but was too lazy.

So what used to be inside this motor? The same bearings, but with no
shield, and tons of grease? What the standard pratice for fractional HP
motors 50+ years ago?

On Wed, 8 Jun 2016 16:13:42 +0000 (UTC), Cydrome Leader
wrote:

I just tore down a early 1960s 3/4 HP 3 phase motor to examine the
insides. It's from a drill press and has grease fittings on it, even
though it's just a 56 frame motor with a 5/8" shaft. There's nothing
special about the motor other than it has a factory paint job that matches
the rest of the machine.

Anyways, the thing was full of grease, yet had shielded (6203zz I think)
Nachi made in Japan bearings installed. They seemed too new to be
original,and why the thing was packed with grease baffles me. Nothing
looks modified in any way.

The only thing that would make even a lick of sense is there were
unshielded bearings in there originally and that's why there were grease
ports. Why the thing was pumped full of grease later is a mystery.

Anybody seen anything like this before?


I've seen double sealed bearings installed in place of single sealed -
the grease fitting is on the "unsealed" side. Does no good with double
sealed bearings and can pop the outer seal off single sealed bearings
in some cases.

**** like this happens all the time

welcome to corporate stupidity in action

They did not grease the motor when it had plain or unshielded bearings

Then they replaced them with shielded bearings and having been burned
by bearing failure, introduced a greasing schedule

It is easy to make fun of such people, but we make dumb mistakes of
our own

On 2016-06-08, Cydrome Leader wrote:
I just tore down a early 1960s 3/4 HP 3 phase motor to examine the
insides. It's from a drill press and has grease fittings on it, even
though it's just a 56 frame motor with a 5/8" shaft. There's nothing
special about the motor other than it has a factory paint job that matches
the rest of the machine.

Anyways, the thing was full of grease, yet had shielded (6203zz I think)
Nachi made in Japan bearings installed. They seemed too new to be
original,and why the thing was packed with grease baffles me. Nothing
looks modified in any way.

The only thing that would make even a lick of sense is there were
unshielded bearings in there originally and that's why there were grease
ports. Why the thing was pumped full of grease later is a mystery.

Anybody seen anything like this before?

On Wed, 8 Jun 2016 16:13:42 +0000 (UTC), Cydrome Leader
wrote:

I just tore down a early 1960s 3/4 HP 3 phase motor to examine the
insides. It's from a drill press and has grease fittings on it, even
though it's just a 56 frame motor with a 5/8" shaft. There's nothing
special about the motor other than it has a factory paint job that matches
the rest of the machine.

Anyways, the thing was full of grease, yet had shielded (6203zz I think)
Nachi made in Japan bearings installed. They seemed too new to be
original,and why the thing was packed with grease baffles me. Nothing
looks modified in any way.

The only thing that would make even a lick of sense is there were
unshielded bearings in there originally and that's why there were grease
ports. Why the thing was pumped full of grease later is a mystery.

Anybody seen anything like this before?


I see this all the time. Someone replaced the bearings not long ago
and used bearings that were handy. They simply didnt clean out the
gook when they did it..probably in a hurry to get it back into
production.
Shielded bearings, pre lubed are fine for this application and will
work as well as the original unshielded bearings that required you to
lube them. Nachi bearings are in the top 5 bearing manufactures..so
you are good to go.

Gunner

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On Wed, 08 Jun 2016 11:40:24 -0700, pyotr filipivich
wrote:

dpb on Wed, 08 Jun 2016 11:53:31 -0500 typed in
rec.crafts.metalworking the following:
On 06/08/2016 11:13 AM, Cydrome Leader wrote:
...

... Why the thing was pumped full of grease later is a mystery.

If you got a piece of gear with grease zerks, wouldn't _you_ grease it
on the presumption they were there for a reason?

Buda-bing!


And a gold plated no prize for our contestant!
--
pyotr filipivich
"With Age comes Wisdom. Although more often, Age travels alone."

^5 !!


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On Wed, 8 Jun 2016 21:19:35 +0000 (UTC), Cydrome Leader
wrote:

Tom Gardner wrote:
On 6/8/2016 12:13 PM, Cydrome Leader wrote:

The only thing that would make even a lick of sense is there were
unshielded bearings in there originally and that's why there were grease
ports. Why the thing was pumped full of grease later is a mystery.

Anybody seen anything like this before?



I've done it myself many times. I should have removed and plugged the
zerks but was too lazy.

So what used to be inside this motor? The same bearings, but with no
shield, and tons of grease? What the standard pratice for fractional HP
motors 50+ years ago?

You nailed it in the first part of your question.

No shields


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On Wednesday, June 8, 2016 at 6:06:35 PM UTC-4, Ignoramus27719 wrote:
**** like this happens all the time

welcome to corporate stupidity in action

They did not grease the motor when it had plain or unshielded bearings

Then they replaced them with shielded bearings and having been burned
by bearing failure, introduced a greasing schedule

It is easy to make fun of such people, but we make dumb mistakes of
our own


It is not always corporate stupidity. Where I use to work there was a motor that drove a 800 cycle generator. The 800 cycles was used during missile testing and was needed about two or three hours a week. The motor had greaseable bearings and as I remember the manufacturer recommended a couple of shots of grease every five years when the motor was used 16 hours a day. The PM schedule could be scheduled for daily, weekly, monthly , every three months , twice a year , and once a year. So what would you do? Grease the motor once a year? Or not ever grease the motor?

Dan

On Wed, 8 Jun 2016 12:33:18 -0400, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote:

"Cydrome Leader" wrote in message
...
I just tore down a early 1960s 3/4 HP 3 phase motor to examine the
insides. It's from a drill press and has grease fittings on it, even
though it's just a 56 frame motor with a 5/8" shaft. There's nothing
special about the motor other than it has a factory paint job that
matches
the rest of the machine.

Anyways, the thing was full of grease, yet had shielded (6203zz I
think)
Nachi made in Japan bearings installed. They seemed too new to be
original,and why the thing was packed with grease baffles me.
Nothing
looks modified in any way.

The only thing that would make even a lick of sense is there were
unshielded bearings in there originally and that's why there were
grease
ports. Why the thing was pumped full of grease later is a mystery.

Anybody seen anything like this before?

That's better than no lube ever, like some of the machines I bought
used. The trade school students had broken most of the oil cups off my
lathe.

And the broken nipples had been left in the holes? That sounds like
the machines I used in 8th grade metalshop. sigh

--
Energy and persistence alter all things.
--Benjamin Franklin

wrote in message
...
On Wednesday, June 8, 2016 at 6:06:35 PM UTC-4, Ignoramus27719 wrote:
**** like this happens all the time

welcome to corporate stupidity in action

They did not grease the motor when it had plain or unshielded
bearings

Then they replaced them with shielded bearings and having been
burned
by bearing failure, introduced a greasing schedule

It is easy to make fun of such people, but we make dumb mistakes of
our own


It is not always corporate stupidity. Where I use to work there was a
motor that drove a 800 cycle generator. The 800 cycles was used
during missile testing and was needed about two or three hours a
week. The motor had greaseable bearings and as I remember the
manufacturer recommended a couple of shots of grease every five years
when the motor was used 16 hours a day. The PM schedule could be
scheduled for daily, weekly, monthly , every three months , twice a
year , and once a year. So what would you do? Grease the motor once
a year? Or not ever grease the motor?

Dan

==========

The machinery in the model shop I ran was Air Force property. They
required it to be lubed weekly by a checklist no matter how little use
it got or what the maker recommended.
--jsw

"Larry Jaques" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 8 Jun 2016 12:33:18 -0400, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote:

"Cydrome Leader" wrote in message
...
I just tore down a early 1960s 3/4 HP 3 phase motor to examine the
insides. It's from a drill press and has grease fittings on it,
even
though it's just a 56 frame motor with a 5/8" shaft. There's
nothing
special about the motor other than it has a factory paint job that
matches
the rest of the machine.

Anyways, the thing was full of grease, yet had shielded (6203zz I
think)
Nachi made in Japan bearings installed. They seemed too new to be
original,and why the thing was packed with grease baffles me.
Nothing
looks modified in any way.

The only thing that would make even a lick of sense is there were
unshielded bearings in there originally and that's why there were
grease
ports. Why the thing was pumped full of grease later is a mystery.

Anybody seen anything like this before?

That's better than no lube ever, like some of the machines I bought
used. The trade school students had broken most of the oil cups off
my
lathe.

And the broken nipples had been left in the holes? That sounds like
the machines I used in 8th grade metalshop. sigh

Were you the $#!+#=@[) who beat on the tailstock spindle like an anvil
horn?

It was the only Heavy 10 among a batch of 9" South Bends and I
couldn't pass it up. The dealer swapped the spindle but it's not a
perfect fit. I haven't seen another 10L since for less than twice its
price.

When I bought it there were still industrial suppliers in town. One
had the proper Gits oil cups in stock, and a shiny new Eagle No. 66
oiler:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Eagle-No-66-...5#ht_174wt_868

--jsw

On Wed, 8 Jun 2016 21:19:35 +0000 (UTC), Cydrome Leader
wrote:

Tom Gardner wrote:
On 6/8/2016 12:13 PM, Cydrome Leader wrote:

The only thing that would make even a lick of sense is there were
unshielded bearings in there originally and that's why there were grease
ports. Why the thing was pumped full of grease later is a mystery.

Anybody seen anything like this before?



I've done it myself many times. I should have removed and plugged the
zerks but was too lazy.

So what used to be inside this motor? The same bearings, but with no
shield, and tons of grease? What the standard pratice for fractional HP
motors 50+ years ago?

No such thing as "standard practice" Cheap motors used plain bearings.
Many better motors used ball bearings. 50 years ago was only 1966
-ball bearings were pretty common - but usually not fully sealed or
double sheilded. Many would have been "oil lubricated"uising thick
oil, rather than grease - with felt or synthetic rubber seals. I
remember some old repulsion start induction motors from the late
fifties with oiled ball bearings, as well as some with oiled plain
bearings - the big ball bearing motor was on the bale elevator. I
think the motor on the pump-jack was also ball bearing, and the one on
the cement mixer was plain bearing.- oiled, not greased

Some were even ball bearing on the drive end and plain bearing on the
bell end

Cydrome Leader fired this volley in news:nj9g7l
:

The only thing that would make even a lick of sense is there were
unshielded bearings in there originally and that's why there were grease
ports. Why the thing was pumped full of grease later is a mystery.

Anybody seen anything like this before?

I think what makes more sense is that someone replaced the bearings with
sealed. Later, someone ELSE, not realizing there were sealed bearings in
there, and seeing the grease nipples, reasonably assumed it was intended to
be greased, and did so. shrug

LLoyd

wrote:
On Wed, 8 Jun 2016 21:19:35 +0000 (UTC), Cydrome Leader
wrote:

Tom Gardner wrote:
On 6/8/2016 12:13 PM, Cydrome Leader wrote:

The only thing that would make even a lick of sense is there were
unshielded bearings in there originally and that's why there were grease
ports. Why the thing was pumped full of grease later is a mystery.

Anybody seen anything like this before?



I've done it myself many times. I should have removed and plugged the
zerks but was too lazy.

So what used to be inside this motor? The same bearings, but with no
shield, and tons of grease? What the standard pratice for fractional HP
motors 50+ years ago?

No such thing as "standard practice" Cheap motors used plain bearings.
Many better motors used ball bearings. 50 years ago was only 1966
-ball bearings were pretty common - but usually not fully sealed or
double sheilded. Many would have been "oil lubricated"uising thick

Any reason for that, or why the shielded/sealed stuff took over? Was there
some incredible development in stamping out shields or lubricants?

oil, rather than grease - with felt or synthetic rubber seals. I
remember some old repulsion start induction motors from the late
fifties with oiled ball bearings, as well as some with oiled plain
bearings - the big ball bearing motor was on the bale elevator. I
think the motor on the pump-jack was also ball bearing, and the one on
the cement mixer was plain bearing.- oiled, not greased

Some were even ball bearing on the drive end and plain bearing on the
bell end

On Thu, 9 Jun 2016 17:01:36 +0000 (UTC), Cydrome Leader
wrote:

wrote:
On Wed, 8 Jun 2016 21:19:35 +0000 (UTC), Cydrome Leader
wrote:

Tom Gardner wrote:
On 6/8/2016 12:13 PM, Cydrome Leader wrote:

The only thing that would make even a lick of sense is there were
unshielded bearings in there originally and that's why there were grease
ports. Why the thing was pumped full of grease later is a mystery.

Anybody seen anything like this before?



I've done it myself many times. I should have removed and plugged the
zerks but was too lazy.

So what used to be inside this motor? The same bearings, but with no
shield, and tons of grease? What the standard pratice for fractional HP
motors 50+ years ago?

No such thing as "standard practice" Cheap motors used plain bearings.
Many better motors used ball bearings. 50 years ago was only 1966
-ball bearings were pretty common - but usually not fully sealed or
double sheilded. Many would have been "oil lubricated"uising thick

Any reason for that, or why the shielded/sealed stuff took over? Was there
some incredible development in stamping out shields or lubricants?

There have been big improvements in ball and race materials; modest
improvements in their accuracy; and huge improvements in lubricants.




oil, rather than grease - with felt or synthetic rubber seals. I
remember some old repulsion start induction motors from the late
fifties with oiled ball bearings, as well as some with oiled plain
bearings - the big ball bearing motor was on the bale elevator. I
think the motor on the pump-jack was also ball bearing, and the one on
the cement mixer was plain bearing.- oiled, not greased

Some were even ball bearing on the drive end and plain bearing on the
bell end

On Thu, 9 Jun 2016 17:01:36 +0000 (UTC), Cydrome Leader
wrote:


No such thing as "standard practice" Cheap motors used plain bearings.
Many better motors used ball bearings. 50 years ago was only 1966
-ball bearings were pretty common - but usually not fully sealed or
double sheilded. Many would have been "oil lubricated"uising thick

Any reason for that, or why the shielded/sealed stuff took over? Was there
some incredible development in stamping out shields or lubricants?
'Better bearing construction, better shielding techniques, better
design and implementation

I've read that what used to be a grade 7 bearing in 1960, is now a
grade 3 bearing and what is a grade 7 today..was considered to be a
grade 9 back then

Gunner, on the road to LA

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On 09/06/16 18:19, Ed Huntress wrote:
On Thu, 9 Jun 2016 17:01:36 +0000 (UTC), Cydrome Leader
wrote:

wrote:
On Wed, 8 Jun 2016 21:19:35 +0000 (UTC), Cydrome Leader
wrote:

Tom Gardner wrote:
On 6/8/2016 12:13 PM, Cydrome Leader wrote:
The only thing that would make even a lick of sense is there were
unshielded bearings in there originally and that's why there were grease
ports. Why the thing was pumped full of grease later is a mystery.

Anybody seen anything like this before?


I've done it myself many times. I should have removed and plugged the
zerks but was too lazy.
So what used to be inside this motor? The same bearings, but with no
shield, and tons of grease? What the standard pratice for fractional HP
motors 50+ years ago?

No such thing as "standard practice" Cheap motors used plain bearings.
Many better motors used ball bearings. 50 years ago was only 1966
-ball bearings were pretty common - but usually not fully sealed or
double sheilded. Many would have been "oil lubricated"uising thick
Any reason for that, or why the shielded/sealed stuff took over? Was there
some incredible development in stamping out shields or lubricants?
There have been big improvements in ball and race materials; modest
improvements in their accuracy; and huge improvements in lubricants.
Regarding lubricants, a mate in the automotive engine development
industry mentioned that many car engine manufacturers don't harden the
crankshafts these days as with improvements in the lubricants it isn't
necessary to get the engine life.




oil, rather than grease - with felt or synthetic rubber seals. I
remember some old repulsion start induction motors from the late
fifties with oiled ball bearings, as well as some with oiled plain
bearings - the big ball bearing motor was on the bale elevator. I
think the motor on the pump-jack was also ball bearing, and the one on
the cement mixer was plain bearing.- oiled, not greased

Some were even ball bearing on the drive end and plain bearing on the
bell end

On Thu, 09 Jun 2016 19:00:21 +0100, David Billington
wrote:

On 09/06/16 18:19, Ed Huntress wrote:
On Thu, 9 Jun 2016 17:01:36 +0000 (UTC), Cydrome Leader
wrote:

wrote:
On Wed, 8 Jun 2016 21:19:35 +0000 (UTC), Cydrome Leader
wrote:

Tom Gardner wrote:
On 6/8/2016 12:13 PM, Cydrome Leader wrote:
The only thing that would make even a lick of sense is there were
unshielded bearings in there originally and that's why there were grease
ports. Why the thing was pumped full of grease later is a mystery.

Anybody seen anything like this before?


I've done it myself many times. I should have removed and plugged the
zerks but was too lazy.
So what used to be inside this motor? The same bearings, but with no
shield, and tons of grease? What the standard pratice for fractional HP
motors 50+ years ago?

No such thing as "standard practice" Cheap motors used plain bearings.
Many better motors used ball bearings. 50 years ago was only 1966
-ball bearings were pretty common - but usually not fully sealed or
double sheilded. Many would have been "oil lubricated"uising thick
Any reason for that, or why the shielded/sealed stuff took over? Was there
some incredible development in stamping out shields or lubricants?
There have been big improvements in ball and race materials; modest
improvements in their accuracy; and huge improvements in lubricants.
Regarding lubricants, a mate in the automotive engine development
industry mentioned that many car engine manufacturers don't harden the
crankshafts these days as with improvements in the lubricants it isn't
necessary to get the engine life.

That surprises me a bit, but I suppose it shouldn't. I've seen some
performance numbers and graphs on modern lubricants versus the old
ones, and it's a jolt. Thus, we have this enormous improvement in
engine life, despite engines that put out a lot more specific power.

I had a few cars with English Ford Kent engines, and they were ready
for a ring job at 80k or 90k miles. The Duratec in my Ford Focus is
just a little bit larger, and, at just under 100k, it's just hitting
its stride.

--
Ed Huntress





oil, rather than grease - with felt or synthetic rubber seals. I
remember some old repulsion start induction motors from the late
fifties with oiled ball bearings, as well as some with oiled plain
bearings - the big ball bearing motor was on the bale elevator. I
think the motor on the pump-jack was also ball bearing, and the one on
the cement mixer was plain bearing.- oiled, not greased

Some were even ball bearing on the drive end and plain bearing on the
bell end

On Thu, 9 Jun 2016 17:01:36 +0000 (UTC), Cydrome Leader
wrote:

wrote:
On Wed, 8 Jun 2016 21:19:35 +0000 (UTC), Cydrome Leader
wrote:

Tom Gardner wrote:
On 6/8/2016 12:13 PM, Cydrome Leader wrote:

The only thing that would make even a lick of sense is there were
unshielded bearings in there originally and that's why there were grease
ports. Why the thing was pumped full of grease later is a mystery.

Anybody seen anything like this before?



I've done it myself many times. I should have removed and plugged the
zerks but was too lazy.

So what used to be inside this motor? The same bearings, but with no
shield, and tons of grease? What the standard pratice for fractional HP
motors 50+ years ago?

No such thing as "standard practice" Cheap motors used plain bearings.
Many better motors used ball bearings. 50 years ago was only 1966
-ball bearings were pretty common - but usually not fully sealed or
double sheilded. Many would have been "oil lubricated"uising thick

Any reason for that, or why the shielded/sealed stuff took over? Was there
some incredible development in stamping out shields or lubricants?

oil, rather than grease - with felt or synthetic rubber seals. I
remember some old repulsion start induction motors from the late
fifties with oiled ball bearings, as well as some with oiled plain
bearings - the big ball bearing motor was on the bale elevator. I
think the motor on the pump-jack was also ball bearing, and the one on
the cement mixer was plain bearing.- oiled, not greased

Some were even ball bearing on the drive end and plain bearing on the
bell end
Better technology - both in the stamping/seal technology, but also
lubrication, made "lifetime sealed" bearings possible - and bropught
the price WAY down. And the market ate it up - no more greasing!!!!

On Thu, 09 Jun 2016 17:24:19 -0400, wrote:

On Thu, 9 Jun 2016 17:01:36 +0000 (UTC), Cydrome Leader
wrote:

wrote:
On Wed, 8 Jun 2016 21:19:35 +0000 (UTC), Cydrome Leader
wrote:

Tom Gardner wrote:
On 6/8/2016 12:13 PM, Cydrome Leader wrote:

The only thing that would make even a lick of sense is there were
unshielded bearings in there originally and that's why there were grease
ports. Why the thing was pumped full of grease later is a mystery.

Anybody seen anything like this before?



I've done it myself many times. I should have removed and plugged the
zerks but was too lazy.

So what used to be inside this motor? The same bearings, but with no
shield, and tons of grease? What the standard pratice for fractional HP
motors 50+ years ago?

No such thing as "standard practice" Cheap motors used plain bearings.
Many better motors used ball bearings. 50 years ago was only 1966
-ball bearings were pretty common - but usually not fully sealed or
double sheilded. Many would have been "oil lubricated"uising thick

Any reason for that, or why the shielded/sealed stuff took over? Was there
some incredible development in stamping out shields or lubricants?

oil, rather than grease - with felt or synthetic rubber seals. I
remember some old repulsion start induction motors from the late
fifties with oiled ball bearings, as well as some with oiled plain
bearings - the big ball bearing motor was on the bale elevator. I
think the motor on the pump-jack was also ball bearing, and the one on
the cement mixer was plain bearing.- oiled, not greased

Some were even ball bearing on the drive end and plain bearing on the
bell end
Better technology - both in the stamping/seal technology, but also
lubrication, made "lifetime sealed" bearings possible - and bropught
the price WAY down. And the market ate it up - no more greasing!!!!

The only problem being the MFG and BUYER definitions of "lifetime".
They want to sell product, we never want to have to buy or maintain
anything else after first purchase.

--
Energy and persistence alter all things.
--Benjamin Franklin

On Wed, 8 Jun 2016 20:48:56 -0400, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote:

"Larry Jaques" wrote in message
.. .
On Wed, 8 Jun 2016 12:33:18 -0400, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote:

"Cydrome Leader" wrote in message
...
I just tore down a early 1960s 3/4 HP 3 phase motor to examine the
insides. It's from a drill press and has grease fittings on it,
even
though it's just a 56 frame motor with a 5/8" shaft. There's
nothing
special about the motor other than it has a factory paint job that
matches
the rest of the machine.

Anyways, the thing was full of grease, yet had shielded (6203zz I
think)
Nachi made in Japan bearings installed. They seemed too new to be
original,and why the thing was packed with grease baffles me.
Nothing
looks modified in any way.

The only thing that would make even a lick of sense is there were
unshielded bearings in there originally and that's why there were
grease
ports. Why the thing was pumped full of grease later is a mystery.

Anybody seen anything like this before?

That's better than no lube ever, like some of the machines I bought
used. The trade school students had broken most of the oil cups off
my
lathe.

And the broken nipples had been left in the holes? That sounds like
the machines I used in 8th grade metalshop. sigh

Were you the $#!+#=@[) who beat on the tailstock spindle like an anvil
horn?

g Oh, no. I respected the machinery much more than some of my
braindead fellow students.


It was the only Heavy 10 among a batch of 9" South Bends and I
couldn't pass it up. The dealer swapped the spindle but it's not a
perfect fit. I haven't seen another 10L since for less than twice its
price.

When I bought it there were still industrial suppliers in town. One
had the proper Gits oil cups in stock, and a shiny new Eagle No. 66
oiler:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Eagle-No-66-...5#ht_174wt_868

OMG! Are people really paying those prices? Dolts.

--
Energy and persistence alter all things.
--Benjamin Franklin

I have one - the long or down in a hole is a bit long and would tip over
when most oil was gone. I solved that. I went to the toolbox and got
a 'washer' of lead. Dropped in the tank and it sits nicely. The long
tube might have been added after sales for an operation.

Martin

On 6/10/2016 9:09 AM, Larry Jaques wrote:
On Wed, 8 Jun 2016 20:48:56 -0400, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote:

"Larry Jaques" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 8 Jun 2016 12:33:18 -0400, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote:

"Cydrome Leader" wrote in message
...
I just tore down a early 1960s 3/4 HP 3 phase motor to examine the
insides. It's from a drill press and has grease fittings on it,
even
though it's just a 56 frame motor with a 5/8" shaft. There's
nothing
special about the motor other than it has a factory paint job that
matches
the rest of the machine.

Anyways, the thing was full of grease, yet had shielded (6203zz I
think)
Nachi made in Japan bearings installed. They seemed too new to be
original,and why the thing was packed with grease baffles me.
Nothing
looks modified in any way.

The only thing that would make even a lick of sense is there were
unshielded bearings in there originally and that's why there were
grease
ports. Why the thing was pumped full of grease later is a mystery.

Anybody seen anything like this before?

That's better than no lube ever, like some of the machines I bought
used. The trade school students had broken most of the oil cups off
my
lathe.

And the broken nipples had been left in the holes? That sounds like
the machines I used in 8th grade metalshop. sigh

Were you the $#!+#=@[) who beat on the tailstock spindle like an anvil
horn?

g Oh, no. I respected the machinery much more than some of my
braindead fellow students.


It was the only Heavy 10 among a batch of 9" South Bends and I
couldn't pass it up. The dealer swapped the spindle but it's not a
perfect fit. I haven't seen another 10L since for less than twice its
price.

When I bought it there were still industrial suppliers in town. One
had the proper Gits oil cups in stock, and a shiny new Eagle No. 66
oiler:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Eagle-No-66-...5#ht_174wt_868

OMG! Are people really paying those prices? Dolts.

--
Energy and persistence alter all things.
--Benjamin Franklin

On Fri, 10 Jun 2016 21:11:46 -0500, Martin Eastburn
wrote:

I have one - the long or down in a hole is a bit long and would tip over
when most oil was gone. I solved that. I went to the toolbox and got
a 'washer' of lead. Dropped in the tank and it sits nicely. The long
tube might have been added after sales for an operation.

Martin

On 6/10/2016 9:09 AM, Larry Jaques wrote:
On Wed, 8 Jun 2016 20:48:56 -0400, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote:

"Larry Jaques" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 8 Jun 2016 12:33:18 -0400, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote:

"Cydrome Leader" wrote in message
...
I just tore down a early 1960s 3/4 HP 3 phase motor to examine the
insides. It's from a drill press and has grease fittings on it,
even
though it's just a 56 frame motor with a 5/8" shaft. There's
nothing
special about the motor other than it has a factory paint job that
matches
the rest of the machine.

Anyways, the thing was full of grease, yet had shielded (6203zz I
think)
Nachi made in Japan bearings installed. They seemed too new to be
original,and why the thing was packed with grease baffles me.
Nothing
looks modified in any way.

The only thing that would make even a lick of sense is there were
unshielded bearings in there originally and that's why there were
grease
ports. Why the thing was pumped full of grease later is a mystery.

Anybody seen anything like this before?

That's better than no lube ever, like some of the machines I bought
used. The trade school students had broken most of the oil cups off
my
lathe.

And the broken nipples had been left in the holes? That sounds like
the machines I used in 8th grade metalshop. sigh

Were you the $#!+#=@[) who beat on the tailstock spindle like an anvil
horn?

g Oh, no. I respected the machinery much more than some of my
braindead fellow students.


It was the only Heavy 10 among a batch of 9" South Bends and I
couldn't pass it up. The dealer swapped the spindle but it's not a
perfect fit. I haven't seen another 10L since for less than twice its
price.

When I bought it there were still industrial suppliers in town. One
had the proper Gits oil cups in stock, and a shiny new Eagle No. 66
oiler:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Eagle-No-66-...5#ht_174wt_868

OMG! Are people really paying those prices? Dolts.

--
Energy and persistence alter all things.
--Benjamin Franklin

Might not be so bad IF it was really a brass oiler, but that turkey is
plated steel.

On Fri, 10 Jun 2016 07:06:15 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote:

On Thu, 09 Jun 2016 17:24:19 -0400, wrote:

On Thu, 9 Jun 2016 17:01:36 +0000 (UTC), Cydrome Leader
wrote:

wrote:
On Wed, 8 Jun 2016 21:19:35 +0000 (UTC), Cydrome Leader
wrote:

Tom Gardner wrote:
On 6/8/2016 12:13 PM, Cydrome Leader wrote:

The only thing that would make even a lick of sense is there were
unshielded bearings in there originally and that's why there were grease
ports. Why the thing was pumped full of grease later is a mystery.

Anybody seen anything like this before?



I've done it myself many times. I should have removed and plugged the
zerks but was too lazy.

So what used to be inside this motor? The same bearings, but with no
shield, and tons of grease? What the standard pratice for fractional HP
motors 50+ years ago?

No such thing as "standard practice" Cheap motors used plain bearings.
Many better motors used ball bearings. 50 years ago was only 1966
-ball bearings were pretty common - but usually not fully sealed or
double sheilded. Many would have been "oil lubricated"uising thick

Any reason for that, or why the shielded/sealed stuff took over? Was there
some incredible development in stamping out shields or lubricants?

oil, rather than grease - with felt or synthetic rubber seals. I
remember some old repulsion start induction motors from the late
fifties with oiled ball bearings, as well as some with oiled plain
bearings - the big ball bearing motor was on the bale elevator. I
think the motor on the pump-jack was also ball bearing, and the one on
the cement mixer was plain bearing.- oiled, not greased

Some were even ball bearing on the drive end and plain bearing on the
bell end
Better technology - both in the stamping/seal technology, but also
lubrication, made "lifetime sealed" bearings possible - and bropught
the price WAY down. And the market ate it up - no more greasing!!!!

The only problem being the MFG and BUYER definitions of "lifetime".
They want to sell product, we never want to have to buy or maintain
anything else after first purchase.

It really depends on the manufacture and which bearing he installs.
American made motors..generally use bearings that may not be
lifetime..but certainlty a decade or more. Chinese manufactures use
bearings that may last a few hours or more.


---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus

On Fri, 10 Jun 2016 07:09:26 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote:

On Wed, 8 Jun 2016 20:48:56 -0400, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote:

"Larry Jaques" wrote in message
. ..
On Wed, 8 Jun 2016 12:33:18 -0400, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote:

"Cydrome Leader" wrote in message
...
I just tore down a early 1960s 3/4 HP 3 phase motor to examine the
insides. It's from a drill press and has grease fittings on it,
even
though it's just a 56 frame motor with a 5/8" shaft. There's
nothing
special about the motor other than it has a factory paint job that
matches
the rest of the machine.

Anyways, the thing was full of grease, yet had shielded (6203zz I
think)
Nachi made in Japan bearings installed. They seemed too new to be
original,and why the thing was packed with grease baffles me.
Nothing
looks modified in any way.

The only thing that would make even a lick of sense is there were
unshielded bearings in there originally and that's why there were
grease
ports. Why the thing was pumped full of grease later is a mystery.

Anybody seen anything like this before?

That's better than no lube ever, like some of the machines I bought
used. The trade school students had broken most of the oil cups off
my
lathe.

And the broken nipples had been left in the holes? That sounds like
the machines I used in 8th grade metalshop. sigh

Were you the $#!+#=@[) who beat on the tailstock spindle like an anvil
horn?

g Oh, no. I respected the machinery much more than some of my
braindead fellow students.


It was the only Heavy 10 among a batch of 9" South Bends and I
couldn't pass it up. The dealer swapped the spindle but it's not a
perfect fit. I haven't seen another 10L since for less than twice its
price.

When I bought it there were still industrial suppliers in town. One
had the proper Gits oil cups in stock, and a shiny new Eagle No. 66
oiler:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Eagle-No-66-...5#ht_174wt_868

OMG! Are people really paying those prices? Dolts.

CROM!! Ive got at least 6 of those out in the shop....!!! Im rich!!


---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus

On Fri, 10 Jun 2016 20:48:23 -0700, Gunner Asch
wrote:

On Fri, 10 Jun 2016 07:06:15 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote:

On Thu, 09 Jun 2016 17:24:19 -0400, wrote:

On Thu, 9 Jun 2016 17:01:36 +0000 (UTC), Cydrome Leader
wrote:

wrote:
On Wed, 8 Jun 2016 21:19:35 +0000 (UTC), Cydrome Leader
wrote:

Tom Gardner wrote:
On 6/8/2016 12:13 PM, Cydrome Leader wrote:

The only thing that would make even a lick of sense is there were
unshielded bearings in there originally and that's why there were grease
ports. Why the thing was pumped full of grease later is a mystery.

Anybody seen anything like this before?



I've done it myself many times. I should have removed and plugged the
zerks but was too lazy.

So what used to be inside this motor? The same bearings, but with no
shield, and tons of grease? What the standard pratice for fractional HP
motors 50+ years ago?

No such thing as "standard practice" Cheap motors used plain bearings.
Many better motors used ball bearings. 50 years ago was only 1966
-ball bearings were pretty common - but usually not fully sealed or
double sheilded. Many would have been "oil lubricated"uising thick

Any reason for that, or why the shielded/sealed stuff took over? Was there
some incredible development in stamping out shields or lubricants?

oil, rather than grease - with felt or synthetic rubber seals. I
remember some old repulsion start induction motors from the late
fifties with oiled ball bearings, as well as some with oiled plain
bearings - the big ball bearing motor was on the bale elevator. I
think the motor on the pump-jack was also ball bearing, and the one on
the cement mixer was plain bearing.- oiled, not greased

Some were even ball bearing on the drive end and plain bearing on the
bell end
Better technology - both in the stamping/seal technology, but also
lubrication, made "lifetime sealed" bearings possible - and bropught
the price WAY down. And the market ate it up - no more greasing!!!!

The only problem being the MFG and BUYER definitions of "lifetime".
They want to sell product, we never want to have to buy or maintain
anything else after first purchase.

It really depends on the manufacture and which bearing he installs.
American made motors..generally use bearings that may not be
lifetime..but certainlty a decade or more. Chinese manufactures use
bearings that may last a few hours or more.

I just bought 5 of those from a Chinese vendor. They were gritty and
noisy, and had apparently not been lubed prior to the metal seals
being installed. I cleaned them and lubed them with white lithium
spray grease, then installed them in my extremely high-speed glider
rocking chair. I wouldn't use them in any faster machinery, and I did
get a full $2.86/5)refund for them, to credit the vendor for his
honesty. The old chair bearings were fully Brinelled and weeping rust
dust. I'd have though the new bearings were cleaned used bearings,
but there were no installation scrape marks anywhere on any of the
outside races.

But most electrical machines from HFT (and Grizzly) I've bought have
had very decent bearings in them. I can't recall a single bearing
failure in new Chiwanese tool since I started buying them in the late
'70s. Electrical failures: yes, bad bearings: no. I lost my brand
new cutoff saw within a minute due to a loose brush contact. It fried
both the brush and commutator. But not the windings, surprisingly.

And whatever you do, stay away from the Greenlee clone knockout
punches. I think the threaded rod is 18mm and the dies 19mm, though
they both have the same thread pitch. #60575 = run away, run away!

--
Energy and persistence alter all things.
--Benjamin Franklin

On Fri, 10 Jun 2016 22:37:08 -0400, wrote:

On Fri, 10 Jun 2016 21:11:46 -0500, Martin Eastburn
wrote:

I have one - the long or down in a hole is a bit long and would tip over
when most oil was gone. I solved that. I went to the toolbox and got
a 'washer' of lead. Dropped in the tank and it sits nicely. The long
tube might have been added after sales for an operation.

Martin

On 6/10/2016 9:09 AM, Larry Jaques wrote:
On Wed, 8 Jun 2016 20:48:56 -0400, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote:

"Larry Jaques" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 8 Jun 2016 12:33:18 -0400, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote:

"Cydrome Leader" wrote in message
...
I just tore down a early 1960s 3/4 HP 3 phase motor to examine the
insides. It's from a drill press and has grease fittings on it,
even
though it's just a 56 frame motor with a 5/8" shaft. There's
nothing
special about the motor other than it has a factory paint job that
matches
the rest of the machine.

Anyways, the thing was full of grease, yet had shielded (6203zz I
think)
Nachi made in Japan bearings installed. They seemed too new to be
original,and why the thing was packed with grease baffles me.
Nothing
looks modified in any way.

The only thing that would make even a lick of sense is there were
unshielded bearings in there originally and that's why there were
grease
ports. Why the thing was pumped full of grease later is a mystery.

Anybody seen anything like this before?

That's better than no lube ever, like some of the machines I bought
used. The trade school students had broken most of the oil cups off
my
lathe.

And the broken nipples had been left in the holes? That sounds like
the machines I used in 8th grade metalshop. sigh

Were you the $#!+#=@[) who beat on the tailstock spindle like an anvil
horn?

g Oh, no. I respected the machinery much more than some of my
braindead fellow students.


It was the only Heavy 10 among a batch of 9" South Bends and I
couldn't pass it up. The dealer swapped the spindle but it's not a
perfect fit. I haven't seen another 10L since for less than twice its
price.

When I bought it there were still industrial suppliers in town. One
had the proper Gits oil cups in stock, and a shiny new Eagle No. 66
oiler:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Eagle-No-66-...5#ht_174wt_868

OMG! Are people really paying those prices? Dolts.

--
Energy and persistence alter all things.
--Benjamin Franklin

Might not be so bad IF it was really a brass oiler, but that turkey is
plated steel.

Januwine "brass look" finish, eh?

--
Energy and persistence alter all things.
--Benjamin Franklin

Cydrome Leader wrote:

I just tore down a early 1960s 3/4 HP 3 phase motor to examine the
insides. It's from a drill press and has grease fittings on it, even
though it's just a 56 frame motor with a 5/8" shaft. There's nothing
special about the motor other than it has a factory paint job that matches
the rest of the machine.

Anyways, the thing was full of grease, yet had shielded (6203zz I think)

If somebody over greased it, the grease would push through the shieleds and
then spray off the shaft all over the inside of the motor. I think I've
seen this before. The grease is not good for the windings.

Jon

First of all, a full brass anything would melt down in a few years
as the zinc would be dissolved by airborne chlorine. Brass is pretty,
but using it in the shop it can be tricky.

Martin

On 6/10/2016 9:37 PM, wrote:
On Fri, 10 Jun 2016 21:11:46 -0500, Martin Eastburn
wrote:

I have one - the long or down in a hole is a bit long and would tip over
when most oil was gone. I solved that. I went to the toolbox and got
a 'washer' of lead. Dropped in the tank and it sits nicely. The long
tube might have been added after sales for an operation.

Martin

On 6/10/2016 9:09 AM, Larry Jaques wrote:
On Wed, 8 Jun 2016 20:48:56 -0400, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote:

"Larry Jaques" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 8 Jun 2016 12:33:18 -0400, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote:

"Cydrome Leader" wrote in message
...
I just tore down a early 1960s 3/4 HP 3 phase motor to examine the
insides. It's from a drill press and has grease fittings on it,
even
though it's just a 56 frame motor with a 5/8" shaft. There's
nothing
special about the motor other than it has a factory paint job that
matches
the rest of the machine.

Anyways, the thing was full of grease, yet had shielded (6203zz I
think)
Nachi made in Japan bearings installed. They seemed too new to be
original,and why the thing was packed with grease baffles me.
Nothing
looks modified in any way.

The only thing that would make even a lick of sense is there were
unshielded bearings in there originally and that's why there were
grease
ports. Why the thing was pumped full of grease later is a mystery.

Anybody seen anything like this before?

That's better than no lube ever, like some of the machines I bought
used. The trade school students had broken most of the oil cups off
my
lathe.

And the broken nipples had been left in the holes? That sounds like
the machines I used in 8th grade metalshop. sigh

Were you the $#!+#=@[) who beat on the tailstock spindle like an anvil
horn?

g Oh, no. I respected the machinery much more than some of my
braindead fellow students.


It was the only Heavy 10 among a batch of 9" South Bends and I
couldn't pass it up. The dealer swapped the spindle but it's not a
perfect fit. I haven't seen another 10L since for less than twice its
price.

When I bought it there were still industrial suppliers in town. One
had the proper Gits oil cups in stock, and a shiny new Eagle No. 66
oiler:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Eagle-No-66-...5#ht_174wt_868

OMG! Are people really paying those prices? Dolts.

--
Energy and persistence alter all things.
--Benjamin Franklin

Might not be so bad IF it was really a brass oiler, but that turkey is
plated steel.

"Martin Eastburn" wrote in message
...
First of all, a full brass anything would melt down in a few years
as the zinc would be dissolved by airborne chlorine. Brass is
pretty,
but using it in the shop it can be tricky.

Martin

My yellow #66 oiler doesn't attract a strong magnet.
--jsw

"Jim Wilkins" fired this volley in news:njji0r$gsd
:

"Martin Eastburn" wrote in message
...
First of all, a full brass anything would melt down in a few years
as the zinc would be dissolved by airborne chlorine. Brass is
pretty,
but using it in the shop it can be tricky.

Martin

I have no idea where such an idea comes from! I have lots of little
various-geometry 'shim devices' I've had for decades (for model-making),
all made of plain yellow brass -- some as thin as 0.001".

I've got a number of non-ferrous tools, too, for working with explosives.
Most of the commercial ones are bronze, but the ones we have made in-shop
are mostly plain brass.

NONE of them have "melted down"... nor even corroded beyond plain
"tarnish".

Come to think of it, none of the brass decorative items in my home have
"melted down", either!

Lloyd

On 06/12/2016 07:13 AM, Lloyd E. Sponenburgh wrote:
"Jim Wilkins" fired this volley in news:njji0r$gsd
:

"Martin Eastburn" wrote in message
...
First of all, a full brass anything would melt down in a few years
as the zinc would be dissolved by airborne chlorine. Brass is
pretty,
but using it in the shop it can be tricky.

Martin

I have no idea where such an idea comes from! I have lots of little
various-geometry 'shim devices' I've had for decades (for model-making),
all made of plain yellow brass -- some as thin as 0.001".

I've got a number of non-ferrous tools, too, for working with explosives.
Most of the commercial ones are bronze, but the ones we have made in-shop
are mostly plain brass.

NONE of them have "melted down"... nor even corroded beyond plain
"tarnish".

Come to think of it, none of the brass decorative items in my home have
"melted down", either!

The only place I have had brass fail in that manner is when it was in
contact with aluminum. As I have learned, using brass bolts threaded
into an aluminum housing is a really bad idea.

--
Bob Nichols AT comcast.net I am "RNichols42"

"Robert Nichols" wrote
in message ...

The only place I have had brass fail in that manner is when it was
in contact with aluminum. As I have learned, using brass bolts
threaded into an aluminum housing is a really bad idea.

--
Bob Nichols AT comcast.net I am "RNichols42"

These hoses have aluminum end fittings:
https://www.apexhose.com/lightweight-hose-zero-g/

I put Ox-Gard on the end that threads to the brass faucet, to see what
happens compared to the other end attached to plastic.

LPS-3 has protected aluminum in contact with brass on my antenna
pulleys exposed to rain water, but didn't help much on a shop-made
outdoor faucet handle exposed to chlorinated town water. The outer end
of the handle, a brass rod pressed through the aluminum, has only a
little corrosion.
--jsw