I forgot if I shared this story from three years ago. It still is very
fresh in my memory.

Three years ago, I sold a completely unremarkable, used and beat up,
but working, "Sioux tools" air grinder on ebay. The buyer's email
address indicated that he is with Sioux tools. After he left me a
positive, I asked him, how come he bought this really old tool, when
they make new ones?

His answer floored me. He said that they occasionally buy old tools on
purpose, to evaluate how they wear, what parts and bits in them need
improvements to last longer for their future versions, etc.

This is so unusual.

The usual attitude, nowadays, is that if the tool lasts beyond the
three month warranty period, everything is great. Apparently, Sioux
tools does not think so and wants their toold to last forever.

i

On Tue, 29 Oct 2013 13:19:00 -0500, Ignoramus12605
wrote:

This is so unusual.

I cough know someone else who does this... cough, cough

If you are not moving forward, you are being eroded by all around you
that is - including your competitors.

--
Until you wake up, I will fight for you...

Regards,
Joe Agro, Jr.
(800) 871-5022 x113
01.908.542.0244
Flagship Site: http://www.Drill-HQ.com
Automatic / Pneumatic Drills: http://www.AutoDrill.com
Multiple Spindle Drills: http://www.Multi-Drill.com
Production Tapping: http://www.Drill-HQ.com/?page_id=226
VIDEOS: http://www.youtube.com/user/AutoDrill
FACEBOOK: http://www.facebook.com/AutoDrill
TWITTER: http://twitter.com/AutoDrill

V8013-R

On Tue, 29 Oct 2013 13:19:00 -0500, Ignoramus12605
wrote:

I forgot if I shared this story from three years ago. It still is very
fresh in my memory.

Three years ago, I sold a completely unremarkable, used and beat up,
but working, "Sioux tools" air grinder on ebay. The buyer's email
address indicated that he is with Sioux tools. After he left me a
positive, I asked him, how come he bought this really old tool, when
they make new ones?

His answer floored me. He said that they occasionally buy old tools on
purpose, to evaluate how they wear, what parts and bits in them need
improvements to last longer for their future versions, etc.

This is so unusual.

The usual attitude, nowadays, is that if the tool lasts beyond the
three month warranty period, everything is great. Apparently, Sioux
tools does not think so and wants their toold to last forever.

i

Sioux Tool is one of the old line American tool companies that
actually cared about turning out a quality product that would last a
generation. I have several, including a bench grinder, that I never
think about..but simply use.

Unfortunately...they are a rareity these days...most of their
competition having offshored long ago.

I work on 50 yr old American, and German (and to a smaller number.)
English machinery that are still cranking out quality parts. The Japs
make good quality machines as well..but dont have the long long term
manufacturing years in the US as the above 3 do.


--
"Their mommies tell them they're special, Liberals just don't understand
that "special" is a polite euphemism for;
*window licker on the short bus*"

---
This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active.
http://www.avast.com

"Ignoramus12605" wrote in message ...
I forgot if I shared this story from three years ago. It still is very
fresh in my memory.

Three years ago, I sold a completely unremarkable, used and beat up,
but working, "Sioux tools" air grinder on ebay. The buyer's email
address indicated that he is with Sioux tools. After he left me a
positive, I asked him, how come he bought this really old tool, when
they make new ones?

His answer floored me. He said that they occasionally buy old tools on
purpose, to evaluate how they wear, what parts and bits in them need
improvements to last longer for their future versions, etc.

This is so unusual.

The usual attitude, nowadays, is that if the tool lasts beyond the
three month warranty period, everything is great. Apparently, Sioux
tools does not think so and wants their toold to last forever.


We do this and also we purchase and evaluate our competor's products as soon as they are introduced to the market.

On Tue, 29 Oct 2013 14:39:33 -0400, "Joe \"Dufu\""
wrote:

On Tue, 29 Oct 2013 13:19:00 -0500, Ignoramus12605
wrote:

This is so unusual.

I cough know someone else who does this... cough, cough

If you are not moving forward, you are being eroded by all around you
that is - including your competitors.

Joe has an Excellent reputation in the industry.

Gunner

--
"Their mommies tell them they're special, Liberals just don't understand
that "special" is a polite euphemism for;
*window licker on the short bus*"

---
This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active.
http://www.avast.com

"Ignoramus12605" wrote in
message ...
I forgot if I shared this story from three years ago. It still is
very
fresh in my memory.

Three years ago, I sold a completely unremarkable, used and beat up,
but working, "Sioux tools" air grinder on ebay. The buyer's email
address indicated that he is with Sioux tools. After he left me a
positive, I asked him, how come he bought this really old tool, when
they make new ones?

His answer floored me. He said that they occasionally buy old tools
on
purpose, to evaluate how they wear, what parts and bits in them need
improvements to last longer for their future versions, etc.

This is so unusual.

The usual attitude, nowadays, is that if the tool lasts beyond the
three month warranty period, everything is great. Apparently, Sioux
tools does not think so and wants their toold to last forever.

i

The odd part of that story is that their repair department should have
all that data. When I've fixed field returns the front office
tabulated and analyzed the reasons for failure.

Subject: Why you should buy "Sioux tools" airtools
Newsgroups: earthlink:rec.crafts.metalworking
To: Jim Wilkins

"Jim Wilkins" fired this volley in news:l4pcfk$i5n
:

The odd part of that story is that their repair department should have
all that data.

No, not at all. NObody has "all the data", ever. Seeking out old, worn
tools is the best way to make sure they're as up-to-date as possible.

Maybe the tool was older than any they'd collected to-date. Maybe they
wanted to compare it to others of the same age, to confirm the data
they'd already collected. More information is never bad, unless you
don't know what to do with it.

Proactive research like that is less expensive than warantee repairs,
every time.

It's not odd, at all. It's called Q.C. What's odd, is, they're one of
the few who still do it!

Lloyd

On 10/29/2013 2:19 PM, Ignoramus12605 wrote:
I forgot if I shared this story from three years ago. It still is very
fresh in my memory.

Three years ago, I sold a completely unremarkable, used and beat up,
but working, "Sioux tools" air grinder on ebay. The buyer's email
address indicated that he is with Sioux tools. After he left me a
positive, I asked him, how come he bought this really old tool, when
they make new ones?

His answer floored me. He said that they occasionally buy old tools on
purpose, to evaluate how they wear, what parts and bits in them need
improvements to last longer for their future versions, etc.

This is so unusual.

The usual attitude, nowadays, is that if the tool lasts beyond the
three month warranty period, everything is great. Apparently, Sioux
tools does not think so and wants their toold to last forever.

i

I've heard that Beckett, the company that makes circulating
pumps for hot water heat, has been in business since,
scratches head maybe the fifties. Parts are interchangable,
since the first pump they made to the most recent ones.

--
..
Christopher A. Young
Learn about Jesus
www.lds.org
..

On Tue, 29 Oct 2013 18:23:26 -0400, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote:

"Ignoramus12605" wrote in
message ...
I forgot if I shared this story from three years ago. It still is
very
fresh in my memory.

Three years ago, I sold a completely unremarkable, used and beat up,
but working, "Sioux tools" air grinder on ebay. The buyer's email
address indicated that he is with Sioux tools. After he left me a
positive, I asked him, how come he bought this really old tool, when
they make new ones?

His answer floored me. He said that they occasionally buy old tools
on
purpose, to evaluate how they wear, what parts and bits in them need
improvements to last longer for their future versions, etc.

This is so unusual.

The usual attitude, nowadays, is that if the tool lasts beyond the
three month warranty period, everything is great. Apparently, Sioux
tools does not think so and wants their toold to last forever.


The odd part of that story is that their repair department should have
all that data. When I've fixed field returns the front office
tabulated and analyzed the reasons for failure.

The call center folks take the cause of return, but the repairs dept
get to the -real- reason it was returned. It's usually not the same
reason. Along another route, it could even be a new Repairs manager
getting his hand in and making his play for the boss' approval. Who
knows?

Whatever the reason, it's a Good Thing, don't you agree?

--
The beauty of the 2nd Amendment is that it will not be needed
until they try to take it. --Thomas Jefferson

On 10/29/2013 1:19 PM, Ignoramus12605 wrote:
I forgot if I shared this story from three years ago. It still is very
fresh in my memory.

Three years ago, I sold a completely unremarkable, used and beat up,
but working, "Sioux tools" air grinder on ebay. The buyer's email
address indicated that he is with Sioux tools. After he left me a
positive, I asked him, how come he bought this really old tool, when
they make new ones?

His answer floored me. He said that they occasionally buy old tools on
purpose, to evaluate how they wear, what parts and bits in them need
improvements to last longer for their future versions, etc.

This is so unusual.

The usual attitude, nowadays, is that if the tool lasts beyond the
three month warranty period, everything is great. Apparently, Sioux
tools does not think so and wants their toold to last forever.

Henry Ford is said to have sent his engineers out to scrap yards to buy
old Fords. They would inspect the parts to see what was worn out and
what wasn't. The idea was to determine which parts were lasting longer
than they needed to, so they could be redesigned to be made cheaper.

David

"Larry Jaques" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 29 Oct 2013 18:23:26 -0400, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote:


The odd part of that story is that their repair department should
have
all that data. When I've fixed field returns the front office
tabulated and analyzed the reasons for failure.

The call center folks take the cause of return, but the repairs dept
get to the -real- reason it was returned. It's usually not the same
reason. Along another route, it could even be a new Repairs manager
getting his hand in and making his play for the boss' approval. Who
knows?

Whatever the reason, it's a Good Thing, don't you agree?

My guess is that the repairmen hate paperwork and haven't recorded and
passed on their experience. The equipment I fixed was electronic so I
didn't have to wash greasy hands to write down what I found.

On Wed, 30 Oct 2013 08:22:13 -0400, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote:

"Larry Jaques" wrote in message
.. .
On Tue, 29 Oct 2013 18:23:26 -0400, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote:


The odd part of that story is that their repair department should
have
all that data. When I've fixed field returns the front office
tabulated and analyzed the reasons for failure.

The call center folks take the cause of return, but the repairs dept
get to the -real- reason it was returned. It's usually not the same
reason. Along another route, it could even be a new Repairs manager
getting his hand in and making his play for the boss' approval. Who
knows?

Whatever the reason, it's a Good Thing, don't you agree?

My guess is that the repairmen hate paperwork and haven't recorded and
passed on their experience. The equipment I fixed was electronic so I
didn't have to wash greasy hands to write down what I found.

I always did. shrug But repairmen now wear _gloves_ when working
on greasy things. Imagine that! Back in the day, we never even
thought of wearing gloves unless something was too hot to handle
without them. Like installing air conditioning compressors on a tuck
which just drove in out of the 120F Phoenix sun. (BTDT for a summer
and hated it. With the hot engines, the shop never dropped below
105F. No wonder they couldn't keep people.)

I think the phone guys just write what the unknowledgeable customer
passes on, or write what's easiest for them. If my recollector
recollects correctly, it remembers that most of the repairmen were
conscientious in writing down their findings, though some were pretty
sparse in their writing.

--
The beauty of the 2nd Amendment is that it will not be needed
until they try to take it. --Thomas Jefferson

"Larry Jaques" wrote in message
...

I think the phone guys just write what the unknowledgeable customer
passes on, or write what's easiest for them. If my recollector
recollects correctly, it remembers that most of the repairmen were
conscientious in writing down their findings, though some were
pretty
sparse in their writing.

When I deal with utility repairmen I drop some insider tech term like
dBm, 48V or 19.9 Kilovolt, then they switch from giving me BS to
useful help, such as "I removed a bridge tap and a short to ground",
or "We'll give you a midspan drop".

jsw

On Wed, 30 Oct 2013 11:36:15 -0400, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote:

"Larry Jaques" wrote in message
.. .

I think the phone guys just write what the unknowledgeable customer
passes on, or write what's easiest for them. If my recollector
recollects correctly, it remembers that most of the repairmen were
conscientious in writing down their findings, though some were
pretty
sparse in their writing.

When I deal with utility repairmen I drop some insider tech term like
dBm, 48V or 19.9 Kilovolt, then they switch from giving me BS to
useful help, such as "I removed a bridge tap and a short to ground",
or "We'll give you a midspan drop".

Yes, speaking the language makes it a whole lot easier to get
meaningful info from them.

--
The beauty of the 2nd Amendment is that it will not be needed
until they try to take it. --Thomas Jefferson

On Tue, 29 Oct 2013 13:19:00 -0500, Ignoramus12605
wrote:

I forgot if I shared this story from three years ago. It still is very
fresh in my memory.

Three years ago, I sold a completely unremarkable, used and beat up,
but working, "Sioux tools" air grinder on ebay. The buyer's email
address indicated that he is with Sioux tools. After he left me a
positive, I asked him, how come he bought this really old tool, when
they make new ones?

His answer floored me. He said that they occasionally buy old tools on
purpose, to evaluate how they wear, what parts and bits in them need
improvements to last longer for their future versions, etc.

This is so unusual.

The usual attitude, nowadays, is that if the tool lasts beyond the
three month warranty period, everything is great. Apparently, Sioux
tools does not think so and wants their toold to last forever.

i
So you would not say that they are not Apache on Ingersoll? Sorry
could not resist. Will now retire away from the flames...

Michael Koblic,
Campbell River, BC

On Tue, 29 Oct 2013 13:19:00 -0500, Ignoramus12605
wrote:

Apparently, Sioux
tools does not think so and wants their toold to last forever.

Worked in a plastics factory for six years. Dozens and dozens of the $10
to $15 Harbor Freight die grinders. (Owner was a bit cheap...) While
some broke while new, amazingly many of them ran for *years* on wet
nasty unfiltered air with only occasional oiling.

What they all lacked was the power to take a heavy cut. The lone Sioux
in the plant was passed around constantly for heavy cuts and it too
survived on unfiltered compressed air. Sioux makes good stuff! Wish I
could afford to buy a dozen:-(
--
William

On 10/31/2013 9:03 PM, William Bagwell wrote:

Worked in a plastics factory for six years. Dozens and dozens of the $10
to $15 Harbor Freight die grinders. (Owner was a bit cheap...) While
some broke while new, amazingly many of them ran for *years* on wet
nasty unfiltered air with only occasional oiling.

What they all lacked was the power to take a heavy cut. The lone Sioux
in the plant was passed around constantly for heavy cuts and it too
survived on unfiltered compressed air. Sioux makes good stuff! Wish I
could afford to buy a dozen:-(

Thanks for the field report. Glad to hear some
thing actually works.

--
..
Christopher A. Young
Learn about Jesus
www.lds.org
..