Larry Jaques fired this volley in
:

Does every new soldier know all of that?

By the time they've handled any, yep... every man above them who's ever
done will (faithfully) pass it on.

OK, but I'll bet you either researched it prior to burning it, or took
someone else's demonstration of burning it before you lit your own C4,

Nope... took it on faith. One thing a well-indoctrinated soldier does is
believe what he's told by anyone with one more stripe than his. He
believes, because that's part of his job description.

Lloyd

On Wed, 22 May 2013 08:50:04 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote:

On Wed, 22 May 2013 09:51:53 -0500, "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"
lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote:

Larry Jaques fired this volley in
m:

"I think I'll light my high-explosive plastique on fire." is not a
sane concept, sir. Even a super-small test piece would have blown his
hands clean off if he guessed wrong about it not exploding. shrug
I mean, you wouldn't just shave a slice off your stick of dynamite to
start a fire, would you? And it's less explosive.

Horse crap and bull dingles, Larry.
C-4 is mostly RDX, waxes, oils, and dioctyl adapate. RDX, like HMX, burns
quietly unless shocked by an initiator. C-4 burns like a fast version of
sterno, with a perfectly quiet blue flame (tiniest bit of sizzle), no
soot, and no explosions.

To my knowlege, the US military does not employ any HE materials that
will DDT under open-air burning of small quantities. Bets are off if you
light a 100lb pile of the stuff.

Does every new soldier know all of that?


And yes, even dynamite can burn, if it's actually dynamite and not one of
the AN 'dynamite-like' stuffs, and it has a high-enough nitro content.
The lower 15% stuff won't burn for **** (or explode when you try to
ignite it). Diatomacious earth/clay/compacted sawdust has a tendency not
to burn very vigorously.

Of course, you wouldn't know this, but even nitroglycerine (IF very pure
and free of any acids or undesirable organic ligands from nitration)
burns like vigorous alcohol. In this case, it would be tempting fate to
arrange a puddle of it, and ignite it by hand.

Fear not. I won't try it. g


An urban legend I have not confirmed (but is probably true) has the
chemist who first compounded TNT casting an ashtray of the stuff, just to
demonstrate how insensitive it was.

I've cooked many a C-rat and LRPs on C-4. I still have all my digits.

OK, but I'll bet you either researched it prior to burning it, or took
someone else's demonstration of burning it before you lit your own C4,
Lloyd.

\It was a common way to heat coffee or rations during the Vietnam era,
at least among the Marines. 'Don't know about the army.

My cousin, a Marine sniper, told me much the same story as the one
Lloyd related above. Like you, I expressed concern that he was
carrying a kilo of it in his pack when he went out on sniper missions.
Then he explained that it really was for heating coffee. g

--
Ed Huntress

On Wed, 22 May 2013 06:59:54 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote:

On Tue, 21 May 2013 22:15:13 -0700, Gunner Asch
wrote:

On Tue, 21 May 2013 21:21:44 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote:

On Tue, 21 May 2013 18:51:04 -0500, "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"
lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote:

"Snag" fired this volley in news:XkTmt.3828$cs.3131
:

Hey Lloyd , will
HMX DDT ?


Actually, it burns pretty politely until it's shocked strongly.
G

I hear C4 is great campfire starter, too. (What brilliant person first
thought of that one, eh?)


The first GI that was wet, cold and hungry.

"I think I'll light my high-explosive plastique on fire." is not a
sane concept, sir. Even a super-small test piece would have blown his
hands clean off if he guessed wrong about it not exploding. shrug
I mean, you wouldn't just shave a slice off your stick of dynamite to
start a fire, would you? And it's less explosive.

Yes..dynamite burns well, though not as fast as C4


--
"You guess the truth hurts?

Really?

"Hurt" aint the word.

For Liberals, the truth is like salt to a slug.
Sunlight to a vampire.
Raid® to a cockroach.
Sheriff Brody to a shark
Bush to a Liberal

The truth doesn't just hurt. It's painful, like a red hot poker shoved
up their ass. Like sliding down a hundred foot razor blade using their
dick as a brake.

They HATE the truth."

Gunner Asch fired this volley in
:

Yes..dynamite burns well, though not as fast as C4

15% won't. The low-percentage heaving grades have so much inert filler
as to render them impervious to anything but a cap -- except for those
that are 'filled' with nitrocellulose for gas production. Those burn
like a candle.


Lloyd

On 5/22/2013 11:06 AM, Lloyd E. Sponenburgh wrote:
Larry fired this volley in
:

Does every new soldier know all of that?

By the time they've handled any, yep... every man above them who's ever
done will (faithfully) pass it on.

OK, but I'll bet you either researched it prior to burning it, or took
someone else's demonstration of burning it before you lit your own C4,

Nope... took it on faith. One thing a well-indoctrinated soldier does is
believe what he's told by anyone with one more stripe than his. He
believes, because that's part of his job description.

Lloyd

Same here.

On Wed, 22 May 2013 12:42:13 -0700, Gunner Asch
wrote:

On Wed, 22 May 2013 06:59:54 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote:

On Tue, 21 May 2013 22:15:13 -0700, Gunner Asch
wrote:

On Tue, 21 May 2013 21:21:44 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote:

On Tue, 21 May 2013 18:51:04 -0500, "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"
lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote:

"Snag" fired this volley in news:XkTmt.3828$cs.3131
:

Hey Lloyd , will
HMX DDT ?


Actually, it burns pretty politely until it's shocked strongly.
G

I hear C4 is great campfire starter, too. (What brilliant person first
thought of that one, eh?)


The first GI that was wet, cold and hungry.

"I think I'll light my high-explosive plastique on fire." is not a
sane concept, sir. Even a super-small test piece would have blown his
hands clean off if he guessed wrong about it not exploding. shrug
I mean, you wouldn't just shave a slice off your stick of dynamite to
start a fire, would you? And it's less explosive.

Yes..dynamite burns well, though not as fast as C4

blink I guess I knew less about dynamite than I thought, thinking
that fire or shock could detonate it.

--
Tomorrow is the most important thing in life. Comes into us at midnight
very clean. It's perfect when it arrives and it puts itself in our hands.
It hopes we've learned something from yesterday.
-- John Wayne

Larry Jaques fired this volley in
:

blink I guess I knew less about dynamite than I thought, thinking
that fire or shock could detonate it.

Heh!

Larry, "shock" IS what detonates it. But not the sort of shock it would
get from dropping, or even pounding a stick (not on a steel plate) with a
hammer.

Detonators' and blasting caps' primary purpose is to supply a shock of
such a magnitude and rise time that it initiates explosive decomposition
of the compound your using for blasting.

Some materials (most 'hand-carry' HEs) are totally insensitive to
mishandling, and only capable of being detonated with a cap or
detonator/booster, or with fire in a LARGE mass.

The old saw about "sweating" dynamite is true. If you see a stick of old
stuff with glistening yellow droplets on the outside, then avoid it. The
NG has migrated through the paper to the surface; and NOW it's sensitive
to handling shock!

That happens rarely today. Most "dynamites" aren't even Dynamite, any
more (which is nitroglycerine dispersed in inert fillers and gas-
producing compounds). Most modern _so_called_ "dynamites" are ammonium
nitrate/metal/oil/water emulsions that don't initiate at all - ever -
without a strong cap or a booster.

Lloyd


LLoyd

"Lloyd E. Sponenburgh" lloydspinsidemindspring.com fired this volley in
. 3.70:

Detonators' and blasting caps' primary purpose is to supply a shock of
such a magnitude and rise time that it initiates explosive
decomposition
of the compound your using for blasting.

I should add this:

Blasting caps are made with "primary explosives". These chemicals DO
detonate instantly upon being set on fire. They require no shock -- so a
fuse or an electrical resistance wire heater is enough. (yes, they're
also sensitive to mechanical shock).

It's the detonation of the cap which sets off the detonation of the
larger mass of high explosive, like C-4.

Caps use things similar to what's in percussion caps for firearms (but
there are several compounds that work better for blasting, and would be
injurious to the bores of guns, because of corrosion issues).

LLoyd

On May 22, 5:32*pm, Larry Jaques
wrote:



blink *I guess I knew less about dynamite than I thought, thinking
that fire or shock could detonate it.

--


Du Pont came up with a explosive that is called Tovex. I am
reasonably sure it is TNT with some additions. Anyway they wanted to
make a film showing how safe it was and so had a demonstration where
a case of dynamite and a case of tovex were burned. And lo and behold
the dynamite exploded. Wonderful public relations.

However it turned out that the men setting up the demonstration knew
that the PR types wanted the dynamite to explode and so had put some
caps in with the dynamite. They did not want to keep setting up the
demonstation until the dynamite happened to explode.

The story may not be true, but it ought to be true.


Dan

On Wed, 22 May 2013 15:05:27 -0500, "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"
lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote:

Gunner Asch fired this volley in
:

Yes..dynamite burns well, though not as fast as C4

15% won't. The low-percentage heaving grades have so much inert filler
as to render them impervious to anything but a cap -- except for those
that are 'filled' with nitrocellulose for gas production. Those burn
like a candle.


Lloyd

Ive never used 15%, only 30 (rarely) and 60% most often.


--
"You guess the truth hurts?

Really?

"Hurt" aint the word.

For Liberals, the truth is like salt to a slug.
Sunlight to a vampire.
Raid® to a cockroach.
Sheriff Brody to a shark
Bush to a Liberal

The truth doesn't just hurt. It's painful, like a red hot poker shoved
up their ass. Like sliding down a hundred foot razor blade using their
dick as a brake.

They HATE the truth."

On Wed, 22 May 2013 14:32:37 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote:

On Wed, 22 May 2013 12:42:13 -0700, Gunner Asch
wrote:

On Wed, 22 May 2013 06:59:54 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote:

On Tue, 21 May 2013 22:15:13 -0700, Gunner Asch
wrote:

On Tue, 21 May 2013 21:21:44 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote:

On Tue, 21 May 2013 18:51:04 -0500, "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"
lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote:

"Snag" fired this volley in news:XkTmt.3828$cs.3131
:

Hey Lloyd , will
HMX DDT ?


Actually, it burns pretty politely until it's shocked strongly.
G

I hear C4 is great campfire starter, too. (What brilliant person first
thought of that one, eh?)


The first GI that was wet, cold and hungry.

"I think I'll light my high-explosive plastique on fire." is not a
sane concept, sir. Even a super-small test piece would have blown his
hands clean off if he guessed wrong about it not exploding. shrug
I mean, you wouldn't just shave a slice off your stick of dynamite to
start a fire, would you? And it's less explosive.

Yes..dynamite burns well, though not as fast as C4

blink I guess I knew less about dynamite than I thought, thinking
that fire or shock could detonate it.

Shock "can"...and the higher the nitro percentage...the more likely

This of course does not include frozen then thawed dynamite...which
can have a very hairy trigger...very dangerous stuff.

Old nitro...can have a significant amount of nitroglycerin leaking out
of the individual sticks and into the sawdust in the box. I dont know
what they use these days for packaging if anything..but when I worked
for the Atlas Powder company dealer...nearly all true dynamite still
came in wooden boxes filled with sawdust. Prills, nitramons etc
etc...all came in cardboard.


--
"You guess the truth hurts?

Really?

"Hurt" aint the word.

For Liberals, the truth is like salt to a slug.
Sunlight to a vampire.
Raid® to a cockroach.
Sheriff Brody to a shark
Bush to a Liberal

The truth doesn't just hurt. It's painful, like a red hot poker shoved
up their ass. Like sliding down a hundred foot razor blade using their
dick as a brake.

They HATE the truth."

On Monday, May 20, 2013 10:09:40 AM UTC-7, Lloyd E. Sponenburgh wrote:
Ok, 'solutions guys'...



I have some 0.010" phosphor bronze (spring temper) in rolls 6" wide x

80" long.



I need to cleanly slit some 3/8" strips x 80" from this without any edge

distortion.

In addition to laser and water jet, there's electrochemical machining; you could
print it like a printed circuit board, and etch with ferrous chloride to part the strip.

Unrolling it and getting a photographic negative that long for an exposure, though,
isnt an easy print process in this case. I've done smaller parts this way.

whit3rd fired this volley in news:cc7dd172-8168-44f4-
:

ferrous chloride

Ferrous chloride doesn't rapidly enter into a double-displacement
reaction with copper. It's corrosive to most metals, but not like Ferric
chloride.

Ferric chloride works to etch copper alloys, aluminum, some stainless,
zinc...just about any alloy with metals more active than iron, but it
undercuts...

Why would you do a photo-resist for something like that?

If I were inclined to try to etch an 80" long piece, it would be with a
PSA resist film. (not ordinary 'tape', but a plastic resist with a
special adhesive that doesn't bleed underneath like regular tapes do.)

Lloyd

On Wed, 22 May 2013 16:50:18 -0500, "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"
lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote:

Larry Jaques fired this volley in
:

blink I guess I knew less about dynamite than I thought, thinking
that fire or shock could detonate it.

Heh!

Larry, "shock" IS what detonates it. But not the sort of shock it would
get from dropping, or even pounding a stick (not on a steel plate) with a
hammer.

Detonators' and blasting caps' primary purpose is to supply a shock of
such a magnitude and rise time that it initiates explosive decomposition
of the compound your using for blasting.

Yes, I knew that much.


Some materials (most 'hand-carry' HEs) are totally insensitive to
mishandling, and only capable of being detonated with a cap or
detonator/booster, or with fire in a LARGE mass.

The old saw about "sweating" dynamite is true. If you see a stick of old
stuff with glistening yellow droplets on the outside, then avoid it. The
NG has migrated through the paper to the surface; and NOW it's sensitive
to handling shock!

Yeah, I've seen that a lot in westerns and knew it was true, too.


That happens rarely today. Most "dynamites" aren't even Dynamite, any
more (which is nitroglycerine dispersed in inert fillers and gas-
producing compounds). Most modern _so_called_ "dynamites" are ammonium
nitrate/metal/oil/water emulsions that don't initiate at all - ever -
without a strong cap or a booster.

Thanks for the info.

--
Tomorrow is the most important thing in life. Comes into us at midnight
very clean. It's perfect when it arrives and it puts itself in our hands.
It hopes we've learned something from yesterday.
-- John Wayne

On Wed, 22 May 2013 18:11:22 -0700, Gunner Asch
wrote:

On Wed, 22 May 2013 14:32:37 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote:
blink I guess I knew less about dynamite than I thought, thinking
that fire or shock could detonate it.

Shock "can"...and the higher the nitro percentage...the more likely

This of course does not include frozen then thawed dynamite...which
can have a very hairy trigger...very dangerous stuff.

Old nitro...can have a significant amount of nitroglycerin leaking out
of the individual sticks and into the sawdust in the box. I dont know
what they use these days for packaging if anything..but when I worked
for the Atlas Powder company dealer...nearly all true dynamite still
came in wooden boxes filled with sawdust. Prills, nitramons etc
etc...all came in cardboard.

I wish I had your experience there. Sounds like fun.

Me like things go boom.

--
Tomorrow is the most important thing in life. Comes into us at midnight
very clean. It's perfect when it arrives and it puts itself in our hands.
It hopes we've learned something from yesterday.
-- John Wayne

Larry Jaques fired this volley in
:

Me like things go boom.

That's why I do what I do! G

Lloyd

Lloyd E. Sponenburgh wrote:
BQ340 fired this volley in news:519ac9f9$0$9480
:

I don't have my familiar reference book at home to check, but
books.google.com/books?isbn=0871707268 page 79 claims roll slitting
will
not distort the edge of hard bronze.

Ok... have a roll slitter just sitting around (in 3/8" width roll-to-roll
spacing)?

The mill that does the conversion doesn't, and they're a high-volume
cutter.

LLoyd


You can stack the cutters and get just about any size you need. I have
about 160 lbs of cutters stored in the back.

John

On Wed, 22 May 2013 19:22:32 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote:

On Wed, 22 May 2013 18:11:22 -0700, Gunner Asch
wrote:

On Wed, 22 May 2013 14:32:37 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote:
blink I guess I knew less about dynamite than I thought, thinking
that fire or shock could detonate it.

Shock "can"...and the higher the nitro percentage...the more likely

This of course does not include frozen then thawed dynamite...which
can have a very hairy trigger...very dangerous stuff.

Old nitro...can have a significant amount of nitroglycerin leaking out
of the individual sticks and into the sawdust in the box. I dont know
what they use these days for packaging if anything..but when I worked
for the Atlas Powder company dealer...nearly all true dynamite still
came in wooden boxes filled with sawdust. Prills, nitramons etc
etc...all came in cardboard.

I wish I had your experience there. Sounds like fun.

Me like things go boom.

HE is fun, no matter if you use store bought or make your own.

Prima cord..is another fun toy.

Gunner

--
"You guess the truth hurts?

Really?

"Hurt" aint the word.

For Liberals, the truth is like salt to a slug.
Sunlight to a vampire.
Raid® to a cockroach.
Sheriff Brody to a shark
Bush to a Liberal

The truth doesn't just hurt. It's painful, like a red hot poker shoved
up their ass. Like sliding down a hundred foot razor blade using their
dick as a brake.

They HATE the truth."

Gunner Asch wrote:

Prima cord..is another fun toy.


Bolo ties for loons?

On Thu, 23 May 2013 03:36:32 -0400, "Michael A. Terrell"
wrote:


Gunner Asch wrote:

Prima cord..is another fun toy.


Bolo ties for loons?

Lifts their chins right up! Better than plastic surgery!

Orbital!!!


--
"You guess the truth hurts?

Really?

"Hurt" aint the word.

For Liberals, the truth is like salt to a slug.
Sunlight to a vampire.
Raid® to a cockroach.
Sheriff Brody to a shark
Bush to a Liberal

The truth doesn't just hurt. It's painful, like a red hot poker shoved
up their ass. Like sliding down a hundred foot razor blade using their
dick as a brake.

They HATE the truth."

John fired this volley in
:

You can stack the cutters and get just about any size you need. I
have
about 160 lbs of cutters stored in the back.


Apparently with cheap Chinkalloy cutters, stacking two 1" cutters end-to-
end doesn't get you anything smaller... I tried. The stupid math keeps
coming out 1 TIMES 2 instead of 1 divided by 2. But they're cheap
cutters... probably defective cutters. I'm sure that good American
cutters would divide by length when stacked.

The VAR who actually _does_ the conversion of that stock probably doesn't
know how to use slitting cutters. And they aren't wealthy enough to have
cutters "stored in the back", they have to keep theirs in use.

But I still believe them when they say they cannot slit anything narrower
than 1", I tend to believe them.

LLoyd

On Wed, 22 May 2013 21:23:42 -0500, "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"
lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote:

Larry Jaques fired this volley in
:

Me like things go boom.

That's why I do what I do! G

You suck!

--
Tomorrow is the most important thing in life. Comes into us at midnight
very clean. It's perfect when it arrives and it puts itself in our hands.
It hopes we've learned something from yesterday.
-- John Wayne

On Thu, 23 May 2013 03:36:32 -0400, "Michael A. Terrell"
wrote:


Gunner Asch wrote:

Prima cord..is another fun toy.


Bolo ties for loons?

We're telling PETA on you, Mikey.

(no, the other one, which looks after animals...supposedly)

--
Tomorrow is the most important thing in life. Comes into us at midnight
very clean. It's perfect when it arrives and it puts itself in our hands.
It hopes we've learned something from yesterday.
-- John Wayne

On Monday, May 20, 2013 1:09:40 PM UTC-4, Lloyd E. Sponenburgh wrote:
Ok, 'solutions guys'...



I have some 0.010" phosphor bronze (spring temper) in rolls 6" wide x

80" long.



I need to cleanly slit some 3/8" strips x 80" from this without any edge

distortion.



We tried taking one a sheet metal house that had a long scissor-type

shear, and it cut it, but also curled the edge too much for our

application. It has to wind flat in a coil when finished.



I've tried sheet metal hand shears without much joy, a nibbler just chews

it, and sawing it on anything we've got is impossible.



We must not heat it. Also cost is an issue, or I'd have it done at a

waterjet and laser house down the road, but they want a couple-hundred

just to set up a job. For only five strips, that's not in budget.



A virgin roll has perfect edges, and rolls tightly. The mill that makes

the rolls from larger sheet stock cannot go narrower than 1".



Any ideas?



Thanks,

Lloyd

http://www.azcocorp.com/ Andy is a slitting genius, and a nice guy. Give him a call and I'm sure he'll have a suggestion.

rangerssuck fired this volley in
:

Andy is a slitting genius, and a nice guy. Give him a call and I'm
sure he'll have a suggestion.


Thanks; I will.

Lloyd