Steve B made me recall something.

I watched the Gold Rush series made by Discovery channel.

It was, of course, very interesting. I was shocked, though, about the
following:

1) How little money they made in the end
2) How hard they had to work
3) How much risk they had to take to make so little money.

Here, I am talking about two kinds of risk, first, financial risk, and
second, working with dangerous equipment in very iffy conditions,
being rushed, fatigued etc. I personally think that they were lucky
not to suffer any injury or worse, given how they had to work,
operator fatigue, uneven terrain etc.

i

Ignoramus30559 wrote:
Steve B made me recall something.

I watched the Gold Rush series made by Discovery channel.

(...)

I personally think that they were lucky
not to suffer any injury or worse, given how they had to work,
operator fatigue, uneven terrain etc.

...Becoming a Grizzly Snack...
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/03/06/john-wallace-yellowstone-bear-attack_n_1322533.html

I think there is a market for an ATV radar to
determine the real contour of features below
ground. It would be cool to bore a small hole
and drop in a device capable of generating a
3D point cloud showing the density of material
in the vicinity.

Working blind is rarely productive.

--Winston

Ignoramus30559 wrote:

Steve B made me recall something.

I watched the Gold Rush series made by Discovery channel.

It was, of course, very interesting. I was shocked, though, about the
following:

1) How little money they made in the end
2) How hard they had to work
3) How much risk they had to take to make so little money.

Here, I am talking about two kinds of risk, first, financial risk, and
second, working with dangerous equipment in very iffy conditions,
being rushed, fatigued etc. I personally think that they were lucky
not to suffer any injury or worse, given how they had to work,
operator fatigue, uneven terrain etc.

Well, in this sort of show, I would take everything they show with at
least a small grain of salt. Sometimes it seems like they could make
two weeks of drama about a fuel truck being 1/2 hour later than
expected.

But as well, if it was easy everyone would be doing it.

You don't know that the guys 5 miles away didn't make 10 or 100 times
as much.

It also (according to my Alaskan friends) isn't all that unusual to
work very hard for relatively short periods in Alaska. Usually for
good pay or payback though.
jk

Winston wrote:



..Becoming a Grizzly Snack...
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/03/06/john-wallace-yellowstone-bear-attack_n_1322533.html

Probably takes the fun out of your day, indeed.

I think there is a market for an ATV radar to
determine the real contour of features below
ground. It would be cool to bore a small hole
and drop in a device capable of generating a
3D point cloud showing the density of material
in the vicinity.


Just how would one do that?

All technologies I can think of would require at least two holes and
would only tell you about what was between them.



Working blind is rarely productive.

--Winston
jk

"jk" wrote in message
...
...
I think there is a market for an ATV radar to
determine the real contour of features below
ground. It would be cool to bore a small hole
and drop in a device capable of generating a
3D point cloud showing the density of material
in the vicinity.

Just how would one do that?

All technologies I can think of would require at least two holes and
would only tell you about what was between them.
--Winston
jk

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ground-penetrating_radar

jsw

"jk" wrote


It also (according to my Alaskan friends) isn't all that unusual to
work very hard for relatively short periods in Alaska. Usually for
good pay or payback though.
jk

I had the chance to go on a trip to Alaska with the Gold Prospector's
Association of America. You basically go and work your ass off for two
weeks and took whatever was given to you.

After much investigation, which included many former members who had ponied
up big bux, and went on this two week trip, I had one stark realization:

NO ONE EXCEPT GPAA OFFICIALS WERE ALLOWED IN THE CLEANOUT.

That was the odor of a four day old opossum in the Texas sun.

If any member of the job is excluded from the cleanup, it is questionable.

Steve

On 2012-03-21, Steve B wrote:

"jk" wrote


It also (according to my Alaskan friends) isn't all that unusual to
work very hard for relatively short periods in Alaska. Usually for
good pay or payback though.
jk

I had the chance to go on a trip to Alaska with the Gold Prospector's
Association of America. You basically go and work your ass off for two
weeks and took whatever was given to you.

After much investigation, which included many former members who had ponied
up big bux, and went on this two week trip, I had one stark realization:

NO ONE EXCEPT GPAA OFFICIALS WERE ALLOWED IN THE CLEANOUT.

That was the odor of a four day old opossum in the Texas sun.

If any member of the job is excluded from the cleanup, it is questionable.

What is that cleanout that you are referring to?

i

On Tue, 20 Mar 2012 16:47:17 -0700, the renowned Winston
wrote:

I think there is a market for an ATV radar to
determine the real contour of features below
ground. It would be cool to bore a small hole
and drop in a device capable of generating a
3D point cloud showing the density of material
in the vicinity.

Working blind is rarely productive.

--Winston

There are a variety of such techniques- and I'm involved in some
ground breaking (haha) development on a method that works from fixed
wing aircraft. To say there is a market is an IMMENSE understatement.
Resources are white hot, and anything that helps find them is valuable
almost beyond imagination.


Best regards,
Spehro Pefhany
--
"it's the network..." "The Journey is the reward"
Info for manufacturers: http://www.trexon.com
Embedded software/hardware/analog Info for designers: http://www.speff.com

Jim Wilkins wrote:
wrote in message
...
...
I think there is a market for an ATV radar to
determine the real contour of features below
ground. It would be cool to bore a small hole
and drop in a device capable of generating a
3D point cloud showing the density of material
in the vicinity.

Just how would one do that?

All technologies I can think of would require at least two holes and
would only tell you about what was between them.
--Winston
jk

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ground-penetrating_radar


What Jim said.

(http://www.dot.state.fl.us/statemate...(borehole).pdf)

--Winston

"Ignoramus30559" wrote in message
...
On 2012-03-21, Steve B wrote:

"jk" wrote


It also (according to my Alaskan friends) isn't all that unusual to
work very hard for relatively short periods in Alaska. Usually for
good pay or payback though.
jk

I had the chance to go on a trip to Alaska with the Gold Prospector's
Association of America. You basically go and work your ass off for two
weeks and took whatever was given to you.

After much investigation, which included many former members who had
ponied
up big bux, and went on this two week trip, I had one stark realization:

NO ONE EXCEPT GPAA OFFICIALS WERE ALLOWED IN THE CLEANOUT.

That was the odor of a four day old opossum in the Texas sun.

If any member of the job is excluded from the cleanup, it is
questionable.

What is that cleanout that you are referring to?

i

The point at which the sluices are emptied, the gold recovered, and a final
declaration of what was found is made. To be divided among the participants
by some predetermined formula. But, if you don't see the gold getting
counted, you aren't sure you are getting your "fair" share.

Steve

On 3/20/2012 9:35 PM, Steve B wrote:
id wrote in message
...
On 2012-03-21, Steve wrote:

wrote


It also (according to my Alaskan friends) isn't all that unusual to
work very hard for relatively short periods in Alaska. Usually for
good pay or payback though.
jk

I had the chance to go on a trip to Alaska with the Gold Prospector's
Association of America. You basically go and work your ass off for two
weeks and took whatever was given to you.

After much investigation, which included many former members who had
ponied
up big bux, and went on this two week trip, I had one stark realization:

NO ONE EXCEPT GPAA OFFICIALS WERE ALLOWED IN THE CLEANOUT.

That was the odor of a four day old opossum in the Texas sun.

If any member of the job is excluded from the cleanup, it is
questionable.

What is that cleanout that you are referring to?

i

The point at which the sluices are emptied, the gold recovered, and a final
declaration of what was found is made. To be divided among the participants
by some predetermined formula. But, if you don't see the gold getting
counted, you aren't sure you are getting your "fair" share.

Steve




I'm so glad I broke that bad habit...

TV - it could have be so great.

Spehro Pefhany wrote:
On Tue, 20 Mar 2012 16:47:17 -0700, the renowned Winston
wrote:

I think there is a market for an ATV radar to
determine the real contour of features below
ground. It would be cool to bore a small hole
and drop in a device capable of generating a
3D point cloud showing the density of material
in the vicinity.

Working blind is rarely productive.

--Winston

There are a variety of such techniques- and I'm involved in some
ground breaking (haha) development on a method that works from fixed
wing aircraft.

Do tell.

To say there is a market is an IMMENSE understatement.
Resources are white hot, and anything that helps find them is valuable
almost beyond imagination.

I recall a couple conversations with friends about
the use of molecular resonance to locate specific
minerals. This stuff is 'way above my head.

--Winston

On 2012-03-21, Steve B wrote:

"Ignoramus30559" wrote in message
...
On 2012-03-21, Steve B wrote:

"jk" wrote


It also (according to my Alaskan friends) isn't all that unusual to
work very hard for relatively short periods in Alaska. Usually for
good pay or payback though.
jk

I had the chance to go on a trip to Alaska with the Gold Prospector's
Association of America. You basically go and work your ass off for two
weeks and took whatever was given to you.

After much investigation, which included many former members who had
ponied
up big bux, and went on this two week trip, I had one stark realization:

NO ONE EXCEPT GPAA OFFICIALS WERE ALLOWED IN THE CLEANOUT.

That was the odor of a four day old opossum in the Texas sun.

If any member of the job is excluded from the cleanup, it is
questionable.

What is that cleanout that you are referring to?

i

The point at which the sluices are emptied, the gold recovered, and a final
declaration of what was found is made. To be divided among the participants
by some predetermined formula. But, if you don't see the gold getting
counted, you aren't sure you are getting your "fair" share.

Steve



Hard to disagree!

i

The point at which the sluices are emptied, the gold recovered, and a
final
declaration of what was found is made. To be divided among the
participants
by some predetermined formula. But, if you don't see the gold getting
counted, you aren't sure you are getting your "fair" share.

Steve

You will notice that in ALL shows, there is a HUGE level of ambiguity when
it comes to "THE CLEANOUT". It is a situation where there are no IRS men,
no lackeys, and barely enough people to put up with the 24-36 hour marathon
of separating black sand and gold bearing ore.

If you are up there, sleeping in an unheated space, eating whatever you can
get, paying $40 for breakfast and $100 for a steak dinner, wearing the same
clothes for a week, being cold and wet down to the crack in your ass, going
week upon week with NO pay but only the promise, wouldn't you like to at
least be there when the gold is counted? Even if there is a "vig" for fuel,
parts, etc?

Or are you willing to take someone's word for it?

Anything less than being a party to the count is being a fool for nationwide
TV.

Steve

On 2012-03-21, Steve B wrote:

The point at which the sluices are emptied, the gold recovered, and a
final
declaration of what was found is made. To be divided among the
participants
by some predetermined formula. But, if you don't see the gold getting
counted, you aren't sure you are getting your "fair" share.

Steve

You will notice that in ALL shows, there is a HUGE level of ambiguity when
it comes to "THE CLEANOUT". It is a situation where there are no IRS men,
no lackeys, and barely enough people to put up with the 24-36 hour marathon
of separating black sand and gold bearing ore.

There may not be an IRS man, but these prospectors need to turn this
gold into a check, so the IRS may get some clue later.

If you are up there, sleeping in an unheated space, eating whatever you can
get, paying $40 for breakfast and $100 for a steak dinner, wearing the same
clothes for a week, being cold and wet down to the crack in your ass, going
week upon week with NO pay but only the promise, wouldn't you like to at
least be there when the gold is counted? Even if there is a "vig" for fuel,
parts, etc?

Or are you willing to take someone's word for it?

Anything less than being a party to the count is being a fool for nationwide
TV.

I agree. I think that any time you have "partners", you have to watch
out.

I greatly prefer dealing with used industrial surplus though, it
offers the same feeling of rush and fun. At least comparable, if not
better money, sleeping in a warm bed, and much safer also.

i

On 3/20/2012 10:04 PM, Steve B wrote:
The point at which the sluices are emptied, the gold recovered, and a
final
declaration of what was found is made. To be divided among the
participants
by some predetermined formula. But, if you don't see the gold getting
counted, you aren't sure you are getting your "fair" share.

Steve

You will notice that in ALL shows, there is a HUGE level of ambiguity when
it comes to "THE CLEANOUT". It is a situation where there are no IRS men,
no lackeys, and barely enough people to put up with the 24-36 hour marathon
of separating black sand and gold bearing ore.

If you are up there, sleeping in an unheated space, eating whatever you can
get, paying $40 for breakfast and $100 for a steak dinner, wearing the same
clothes for a week, being cold and wet down to the crack in your ass, going
week upon week with NO pay but only the promise, wouldn't you like to at
least be there when the gold is counted? Even if there is a "vig" for fuel,
parts, etc?

Or are you willing to take someone's word for it?

Anything less than being a party to the count is being a fool for nationwide
TV.

Steve





Repeating!

I'm so glad I broke that bad habit...

TV - it could have be so great.
BUT it isn't.

On Tue, 20 Mar 2012 22:30:33 -0400, Spehro Pefhany
wrote:

On Tue, 20 Mar 2012 16:47:17 -0700, the renowned Winston
wrote:

I think there is a market for an ATV radar to
determine the real contour of features below
ground. It would be cool to bore a small hole
and drop in a device capable of generating a
3D point cloud showing the density of material
in the vicinity.

Working blind is rarely productive.

--Winston

There are a variety of such techniques- and I'm involved in some
ground breaking (haha) development on a method that works from fixed
wing aircraft. To say there is a market is an IMMENSE understatement.
Resources are white hot, and anything that helps find them is valuable
almost beyond imagination.


Best regards,
Spehro Pefhany


I thought that airborne Ground Penetration Radar had been used in
petroleum exploration for some time?
--
Cheers,

John B.

In article ,
Spehro Pefhany wrote:

There are a variety of such techniques- and I'm involved in some
ground breaking (haha) development on a method that works from fixed
wing aircraft. To say there is a market is an IMMENSE understatement.
Resources are white hot, and anything that helps find them is valuable
almost beyond imagination.

An old fixed wing technique is to fly a veeeeery sensitive magentometer
around and look for anomalies.

--
Cats, coffee, chocolate...vices to live by
Please don't feed the trolls. Killfile and ignore them so they will go away.

Richard on Tue, 20 Mar 2012 23:37:57 -0500
typed in rec.crafts.metalworking the following:


Repeating!

I'm so glad I broke that bad habit...

TV - it could have be so great.
BUT it isn't.

Television: a sword rusting in the scabbard in the battle for
survival. Rod Sterling
--
pyotr
Go not to the Net for answers, for it will tell you Yes and no. And
you are a bloody fool, only an ignorant cretin would even ask the
question, forty two, 47, the second door, and how many blonde lawyers
does it take to change a lightbulb.

"Ignoramus30559" wrote


There may not be an IRS man, but these prospectors need to turn this
gold into a check, so the IRS may get some clue later.

No, you go to a gold convention, held just like gun shows all around the
country, and sell it for cash.


I greatly prefer dealing with used industrial surplus though, it
offers the same feeling of rush and fun. At least comparable, if not
better money, sleeping in a warm bed, and much safer also.

i

I am reluctant to go to Nome on this venture. Even if I don't get in the
water (and there's no chance of that), it's going to be cold enough just
getting around day to day. I hate the cold, particularly when there is any
precipitation mixed in with it.

Steve

I think there is a market for an ATV radar to
determine the real contour of features below
ground. It would be cool to bore a small hole
and drop in a device capable of generating a
3D point cloud showing the density of material
in the vicinity.

The Meteorite Men series used a simple PVC frame on wheels towed behind an
atv. The "loop" consisted of one wire hooked to some electronic device. It
was very simple, and not very expensive. They found a lot of BIG meteorites
with it. That was a very interesting series, and I hope it comes on again.
I use a high power magnet while walking around, and have picked up metal
particles. We are in iron rich country, so I am not sure any of these are
meteorites or not. But meteorites are pretty distinct, and when you find
one, there's little doubt.

Steve

On 3/21/2012 11:08 AM, Steve B wrote:
id wrote


There may not be an IRS man, but these prospectors need to turn this
gold into a check, so the IRS may get some clue later.

No, you go to a gold convention, held just like gun shows all around the
country, and sell it for cash.


I greatly prefer dealing with used industrial surplus though, it
offers the same feeling of rush and fun. At least comparable, if not
better money, sleeping in a warm bed, and much safer also.

i

I am reluctant to go to Nome on this venture. Even if I don't get in the
water (and there's no chance of that), it's going to be cold enough just
getting around day to day. I hate the cold, particularly when there is any
precipitation mixed in with it.

Steve



It's really quite nice during the day.
Interesting place.
Interesting people.
And, in your case, and interesting job.
I'd say go for it!


But don't hang around for night.
It get' pretty seriously cold (and Dark!) then.

On 3/21/2012 10:37 AM, pyotr filipivich wrote:
on Tue, 20 Mar 2012 23:37:57 -0500
typed in rec.crafts.metalworking the following:


Repeating!

I'm so glad I broke that bad habit...

TV - it could have be so great.
BUT it isn't.

Television: a sword rusting in the scabbard in the battle for
survival. Rod Sterling
--
pyotr

Nice one...