Last night the republicans defeated a "clean" bill to raise the debt
ceiling. Today the stock market took a 250 point drop. Last time the
republicans failed to act on a similar bill the market dropped 500
points before they changed their minds and passed the bill.


When is the GOP going to understand that when they refuse to raise the
debt ceiling it's going to send the economy into the dumpster? They're
playing a game but we're the ones who are going to lose.

Hawke

Hawke wrote:
Last night the republicans defeated a "clean" bill to raise the debt
ceiling. Today the stock market took a 250 point drop. Last time the
republicans failed to act on a similar bill the market dropped 500
points before they changed their minds and passed the bill.


When is the GOP going to understand that when they refuse to raise the
debt ceiling it's going to send the economy into the dumpster? They're
playing a game but we're the ones who are going to lose.

Hawke

So what you seem to be sayin' is that the way to get our country out of
debt is to borrow more money ?
That seems to be a little backward to me ... but then what do I know ,
other than it's been a lot less stressful around here since we paid off
everything but the mortgage .
--
Snag
Learning keeps
you young !

On Jun 1, 4:05*pm, Hawke wrote:
Last night the republicans defeated a "clean" bill to raise the debt
ceiling. Today the stock market took a 250 point drop. Last time the
republicans failed to act on a similar bill the market dropped 500
points before they changed their minds and passed the bill.

When is the GOP going to understand that when they refuse to raise the
debt ceiling it's going to send the economy into the dumpster? They're
playing a game but we're the ones who are going to lose.

Hawke

I do not think the market is reacting to the fact that the debt
ceiling has not been raised. There is some bad economic data that
came out. And it is a short week which does not help.

"The U.S. could lose more than $10 billion in General Motors Co.
alone if the government sold its remaining shares of the auto maker at
current share prices. The Obama administration has signaled it wants
to divest its remaining GM shares within the next few months. Under
terms of GM's November initial public offering, U.S. could begin
selling additional GM holdings late last month. Mr. Bloom said on
Wednesday the administration has not settled on a price or date for
selling its remaining shares, but said the administration may accept a
loss."

Besides the Republicans have not said they are not going to approve
raising the debt limit. They have said they are not going to raise
it without some reduction in government spending.

If anything it is the Democrats that are game playing.

Dan

wrote in message
...


Besides the Republicans have not said they are not going to approve
raising the debt limit. They have said they are not going to raise
it without some reduction in government spending.

Roll federal taxes back to pre-Bush levels=end of problem.

If anything it is the Democrats that are game playing.

Those pesky Democrats...if they could have just simply allowed the bush tax
breaks to expire....

http://preview.tinyurl.com/3cczlpj

I find it stupid when people attribute daily stock market movements to
any specific things that occurred on a particular day, especially if
they were expected to occur.

In addition, a stock market drop is not a disaster, it makes some
people worse off and some people better off.

i

Hawke wrote:
Last night the republicans defeated a "clean" bill to raise the debt
ceiling. Today the stock market took a 250 point drop. Last time the
republicans failed to act on a similar bill the market dropped 500
points before they changed their minds and passed the bill.


When is the GOP going to understand that when they refuse to raise the
debt ceiling it's going to send the economy into the dumpster? They're
playing a game but we're the ones who are going to lose.

Hawke

So what you seem to be sayin' is that the way to get our country out of
debt is to borrow more money ?
That seems to be a little backward to me ... but then what do I know ,
other than it's been a lot less stressful around here since we paid off
everything but the mortgage .

Hawke wrote:

Last night the republicans defeated a "clean" bill to raise the debt
ceiling. Today the stock market took a 250 point drop. Last time the
republicans failed to act on a similar bill the market dropped 500
points before they changed their minds and passed the bill.


40% of the democrats voted with the republicans. What's wrong with that. That shows a
bit of bipartisanism.

Wes
--
"Additionally as a security officer, I carry a gun to protect
government officials but my life isn't worth protecting at home
in their eyes." Dick Anthony Heller

"Wes" wrote in message
...
Hawke wrote:

Last night the republicans defeated a "clean" bill to raise the debt
ceiling. Today the stock market took a 250 point drop. Last time the
republicans failed to act on a similar bill the market dropped 500
points before they changed their minds and passed the bill.


40% of the democrats voted with the republicans. What's wrong with that.
That shows a
bit of bipartisanism.

Wes
--

More likely it is politically expedient for them, they know it will be used
against them in the next election if they vote to raise the debt limit.

"ATP" wrote in message
...

"Wes" wrote in message
...
Hawke wrote:

Last night the republicans defeated a "clean" bill to raise the debt
ceiling. Today the stock market took a 250 point drop. Last time the
republicans failed to act on a similar bill the market dropped 500
points before they changed their minds and passed the bill.


40% of the democrats voted with the republicans. What's wrong with that.
That shows a
bit of bipartisanism.

Wes
--

More likely it is politically expedient for them, they know it will be
used against them in the next election if they vote to raise the debt
limit.

That's what it was all about. The Republicans are trying to force a vote in
favor of Ryan's plan by way of budget posturing, just like the Democrats did
with the forced vote for the plan itself.

It's pure gamesmanship on both sides.

--
Ed Huntress

On Thu, 2 Jun 2011 07:12:09 -0400, "Ed Huntress"
wrote:


"ATP" wrote in message
...

"Wes" wrote in message
...
Hawke wrote:

Last night the republicans defeated a "clean" bill to raise the debt
ceiling. Today the stock market took a 250 point drop. Last time the
republicans failed to act on a similar bill the market dropped 500
points before they changed their minds and passed the bill.


40% of the democrats voted with the republicans. What's wrong with that.
That shows a
bit of bipartisanism.

Wes
--

More likely it is politically expedient for them, they know it will be
used against them in the next election if they vote to raise the debt
limit.

That's what it was all about. The Republicans are trying to force a vote in
favor of Ryan's plan by way of budget posturing, just like the Democrats did
with the forced vote for the plan itself.

It's pure gamesmanship on both sides.

AND, unfortunately, both parties find gamesmanship more important than
working together to solve a crisis sized problem.

Karl

Karl Townsend wrote:
On Thu, 2 Jun 2011 07:12:09 -0400, "Ed Huntress"
wrote:


"ATP" wrote in message
...

"Wes" wrote in message
...
Hawke wrote:

Last night the republicans defeated a "clean" bill to raise the
debt ceiling. Today the stock market took a 250 point drop. Last
time the republicans failed to act on a similar bill the market
dropped 500 points before they changed their minds and passed the
bill.


40% of the democrats voted with the republicans. What's wrong
with that. That shows a
bit of bipartisanism.

Wes
--

More likely it is politically expedient for them, they know it will
be used against them in the next election if they vote to raise the
debt limit.

That's what it was all about. The Republicans are trying to force a
vote in favor of Ryan's plan by way of budget posturing, just like
the Democrats did with the forced vote for the plan itself.

It's pure gamesmanship on both sides.

AND, unfortunately, both parties find gamesmanship more important than
working together to solve a crisis sized problem.

Karl

DING DING DING give that man a prize off the top shelf !!

Likely to be a bit dusty , we don't give out a lotta these !
--
Snag
Learning keeps
you young !

"Karl Townsend" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 2 Jun 2011 07:12:09 -0400, "Ed Huntress"
wrote:


"ATP" wrote in message
...

"Wes" wrote in message
...
Hawke wrote:

Last night the republicans defeated a "clean" bill to raise the debt
ceiling. Today the stock market took a 250 point drop. Last time the
republicans failed to act on a similar bill the market dropped 500
points before they changed their minds and passed the bill.


40% of the democrats voted with the republicans. What's wrong with
that.
That shows a
bit of bipartisanism.

Wes
--

More likely it is politically expedient for them, they know it will be
used against them in the next election if they vote to raise the debt
limit.

That's what it was all about. The Republicans are trying to force a vote
in
favor of Ryan's plan by way of budget posturing, just like the Democrats
did
with the forced vote for the plan itself.

It's pure gamesmanship on both sides.

AND, unfortunately, both parties find gamesmanship more important than
working together to solve a crisis sized problem.

Karl

Well, we know what their first priority is, right?

--
Ed Huntress

Ed Huntress wrote:
"Karl Townsend" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 2 Jun 2011 07:12:09 -0400, "Ed Huntress"
wrote:


"ATP" wrote in message
...

"Wes" wrote in message
...
Hawke wrote:

Last night the republicans defeated a "clean" bill to raise the
debt ceiling. Today the stock market took a 250 point drop. Last
time the republicans failed to act on a similar bill the market
dropped 500 points before they changed their minds and passed
the bill.

40% of the democrats voted with the republicans. What's wrong
with that.
That shows a
bit of bipartisanism.

Wes
--

More likely it is politically expedient for them, they know it
will be used against them in the next election if they vote to
raise the debt limit.

That's what it was all about. The Republicans are trying to force a
vote in
favor of Ryan's plan by way of budget posturing, just like the
Democrats did
with the forced vote for the plan itself.

It's pure gamesmanship on both sides.

AND, unfortunately, both parties find gamesmanship more important
than working together to solve a crisis sized problem.

Karl

Well, we know what their first priority is, right?

--
Ed Huntress

Yup , the only thing they really care about is getting re-elected so they
can continue to ride the Gravy Train .
Professional politicians are *NOT* what our forefathers had in mind , in
fact this is the very thing they warned us about ... because they all too
readily start to think of themselves as a ruling class rather than a serving
class . "We're doing this to you for *our* own good" is much closer to the
mark ...
--
Snag
Learning keeps
you young !

John R. Carroll wrote:
Snag wrote:
Hawke wrote:
Last night the republicans defeated a "clean" bill to raise the debt
ceiling. Today the stock market took a 250 point drop. Last time the
republicans failed to act on a similar bill the market dropped 500
points before they changed their minds and passed the bill.


When is the GOP going to understand that when they refuse to raise
the debt ceiling it's going to send the economy into the dumpster?
They're playing a game but we're the ones who are going to lose.

Hawke

So what you seem to be sayin' is that the way to get our country out
of debt is to borrow more money ?
That seems to be a little backward to me ...

Yeah, but it works if you invest the borrowed money wisely in your
future. Bill Ford was running the Ford motor Company until 2006, when
Ford hired Alan Mulally, a former Boeing Co. senior executive, as CEO.
They then went to a consortium of banks to borrow money, literally
"hocking the farm", to restructure the company.
Every asset on Ford's books was used to collateralize their borrowing.
Plants, equipment, inventory, intellectual property - everything.
Ford survived the recession and auto industry downturn without the
need for government financing or the need to be "bailed out".
The company earned a profit of $6.6 billion in 2010, its best year
since 1999, and it has steadily gained market share in the U.S.

America needs to do the exact same thing.


--
John R. Carroll

Yeah , well , if you look at the track record our politicians apparently
don't have the same commitment the Ford execs did . I haven't seen a lot of
"wise investment in our future" from that sector in a long long time .

--
Snag
Learning keeps
you young !

Ed Huntress wrote:

Karl

Well, we know what their first priority is, right?

Congress does whatever it takes to get elected.
the current dog and pony show is what it takes
Eventually after entertaining the masses
They will raise the debt ceiling and life will go on


The trade deficit is the real source of the excess debt
somebody has to go into debt if you are going to be
trading IOU's for foreign made goods

The private sector is no longer willing to carry this
trade deficit debt
They did it for the past 20 years and now they are done
Anybody with a brain would know this day was coming
you can't expect the private sector to increase their debt
by 300% every 20 years indefinitely

So Congress knows that either the federal govt
carries this debt or they allow the economy to
collapse into a deflationary spiral
where losing your house and job becomes
much more widespread than it already is

If they go that route the public will
throw the bums out of Washington
so it is a pretty safe bet they bums aren't going to do that

The growing federal debt will mean that foreign goods
will become more expensive relative to US made goods
Which means consumers will purchase more US goods and
the US manufacturing will start to grow instead of shrink

Eventually, this growth in manufacturing will
reduce or eliminate the trade deficit
And then since the US will no longer have IOU's
as the main thing the US exports
there will be no need to go into debt

On 6/2/2011 7:31 AM, John R. Carroll wrote:
Snag wrote:
Hawke wrote:
Last night the republicans defeated a "clean" bill to raise the debt
ceiling. Today the stock market took a 250 point drop. Last time the
republicans failed to act on a similar bill the market dropped 500
points before they changed their minds and passed the bill.


When is the GOP going to understand that when they refuse to raise
the debt ceiling it's going to send the economy into the dumpster?
They're playing a game but we're the ones who are going to lose.

Hawke

So what you seem to be sayin' is that the way to get our country out
of debt is to borrow more money ?
That seems to be a little backward to me ...

Yeah, but it works if you invest the borrowed money wisely in your future.
Bill Ford was running the Ford motor Company until 2006, when Ford hired
Alan Mulally, a former Boeing Co. senior executive, as CEO.
They then went to a consortium of banks to borrow money, literally "hocking
the farm", to restructure the company.
Every asset on Ford's books was used to collateralize their borrowing.
Plants, equipment, inventory, intellectual property - everything.
Ford survived the recession and auto industry downturn without the need for
government financing or the need to be "bailed out".
The company earned a profit of $6.6 billion in 2010, its best year since
1999, and it has steadily gained market share in the U.S.

America needs to do the exact same thing.

Not a bad idea. But that's not going to happen if the U.S. defaults on
it's obligations because it failed to raise the debt ceiling. It's a
matter of losing an arm or losing your life. It would be a financial
fiasco of giant proportions if America loses it's reputation for
financial stability. It wouldn't be that big a deal to extend the debt
ceiling one more time.

To me the choice is an easy one. You don't chance losing your shirt
because you're too foolish to borrow some more money. But the truth is
this is an example of the republicans trying to force their will on the
Democrats. The republicans are using the debt ceiling issue to force the
Democrats to cut entitlement programs from the budget. They would gladly
do that while they cut taxes even more for the wealthy.

So you don't give in to that kind of pressure. If the republicans want
to play "chicken" with our finances over cutting the budget, I say let
them. But don't be surprised when it ruins the economy. Last time the
republicans made our financial decisions look what happened. Want to let
them try it again? Not me.

Hawke

On 6/2/2011 4:12 AM, Ed Huntress wrote:
wrote in message
...

wrote in message
...
wrote:

Last night the republicans defeated a "clean" bill to raise the debt
ceiling. Today the stock market took a 250 point drop. Last time the
republicans failed to act on a similar bill the market dropped 500
points before they changed their minds and passed the bill.


40% of the democrats voted with the republicans. What's wrong with that.
That shows a
bit of bipartisanism.

Wes
--

More likely it is politically expedient for them, they know it will be
used against them in the next election if they vote to raise the debt
limit.

That's what it was all about. The Republicans are trying to force a vote in
favor of Ryan's plan by way of budget posturing, just like the Democrats did
with the forced vote for the plan itself.

It's pure gamesmanship on both sides.



That's true, but it doesn't change the fact that if the debt ceiling
doesn't get raised it has the potential to damage the economy and our
financial situation in a big way.

We're the world's reserve currency. Think the rest of the world will
want to continue that if we stop paying our debts? Interest rates will
go up if we don't raise the debt ceiling. That will cost everyone and it
will probably slow the economy, which we can't take at this time. The
point is the results of not raising the debt ceiling will be very bad.

The republicans are willing to do it. That's their judgment. The
Democrats say we have to raise it. That's their judgment. I've seen what
happens when we do what the republicans want. It is a disaster. Listen
to the republicans' advice all you want. You'll be sorry.

Hawke

AN INTERESTING OBSERVATION

1. The sport of choice for the urban poor is BASKETBALL.

2. The sport of choice for maintenance level employees is BOWLING.

3. The sport of choice for front-line workers is FOOTBALL.

4. The sport of choice for supervisors is BASEBALL.

5. The sport of choice for middle management is TENNIS.

And....

6. The sport of choice for corporate executives and officers is GOLF.

THE AMAZING CONCLUSION:

The higher you go in the corporate structure, the smaller your balls become.

There must be a ton of people in Washington playing marbles!

CaveLamb wrote:
AN INTERESTING OBSERVATION

1. The sport of choice for the urban poor is BASKETBALL.

2. The sport of choice for maintenance level employees is BOWLING.

3. The sport of choice for front-line workers is FOOTBALL.

4. The sport of choice for supervisors is BASEBALL.

5. The sport of choice for middle management is TENNIS.

And....

6. The sport of choice for corporate executives and officers is GOLF.

THE AMAZING CONCLUSION:

The higher you go in the corporate structure, the smaller your balls
become.
There must be a ton of people in Washington playing marbles!

You mind if I steal that ??

--
Snag
Learning keeps
you young !

On 2011-06-02, CaveLamb wrote:
AN INTERESTING OBSERVATION

1. The sport of choice for the urban poor is BASKETBALL.

2. The sport of choice for maintenance level employees is BOWLING.

3. The sport of choice for front-line workers is FOOTBALL.

4. The sport of choice for supervisors is BASEBALL.

5. The sport of choice for middle management is TENNIS.

And....

6. The sport of choice for corporate executives and officers is GOLF.

THE AMAZING CONCLUSION:

The higher you go in the corporate structure, the smaller your balls become.

There must be a ton of people in Washington playing marbles!

This is most hilarious.

i

Snag wrote:
CaveLamb wrote:
AN INTERESTING OBSERVATION

1. The sport of choice for the urban poor is BASKETBALL.

2. The sport of choice for maintenance level employees is BOWLING.

3. The sport of choice for front-line workers is FOOTBALL.

4. The sport of choice for supervisors is BASEBALL.

5. The sport of choice for middle management is TENNIS.

And....

6. The sport of choice for corporate executives and officers is GOLF.

THE AMAZING CONCLUSION:

The higher you go in the corporate structure, the smaller your balls
become.
There must be a ton of people in Washington playing marbles!

You mind if I steal that ??



LOL, not at all, Snag.
I did!



--

Richard Lamb
http://www.home.earthlink.net/~cavelamb
http://www.home.earthlink.net/~sv_temptress

Hawke wrote:
On 6/2/2011 7:31 AM, John R. Carroll wrote:
Snag wrote:
Hawke wrote:
Last night the republicans defeated a "clean" bill to raise the debt
ceiling. Today the stock market took a 250 point drop. Last time the
republicans failed to act on a similar bill the market dropped 500
points before they changed their minds and passed the bill.


When is the GOP going to understand that when they refuse to raise
the debt ceiling it's going to send the economy into the dumpster?
They're playing a game but we're the ones who are going to lose.

Hawke

So what you seem to be sayin' is that the way to get our country out
of debt is to borrow more money ?
That seems to be a little backward to me ...

Yeah, but it works if you invest the borrowed money wisely in your
future.
Bill Ford was running the Ford motor Company until 2006, when Ford hired
Alan Mulally, a former Boeing Co. senior executive, as CEO.
They then went to a consortium of banks to borrow money, literally
"hocking
the farm", to restructure the company.
Every asset on Ford's books was used to collateralize their borrowing.
Plants, equipment, inventory, intellectual property - everything.
Ford survived the recession and auto industry downturn without the
need for
government financing or the need to be "bailed out".
The company earned a profit of $6.6 billion in 2010, its best year since
1999, and it has steadily gained market share in the U.S.

America needs to do the exact same thing.

Not a bad idea. But that's not going to happen if the U.S. defaults on
it's obligations because it failed to raise the debt ceiling. It's a
matter of losing an arm or losing your life. It would be a financial
fiasco of giant proportions if America loses it's reputation for
financial stability. It wouldn't be that big a deal to extend the debt
ceiling one more time.

To me the choice is an easy one. You don't chance losing your shirt
because you're too foolish to borrow some more money. But the truth is
this is an example of the republicans trying to force their will on the
Democrats. The republicans are using the debt ceiling issue to force the
Democrats to cut entitlement programs from the budget. They would gladly
do that while they cut taxes even more for the wealthy.

So you don't give in to that kind of pressure. If the republicans want
to play "chicken" with our finances over cutting the budget, I say let
them. But don't be surprised when it ruins the economy. Last time the
republicans made our financial decisions look what happened. Want to let
them try it again? Not me.

Hawke



Problem is simply this...

Ford looked at their own bad selves and figures it out that they could
do that and survive - even get stronger.

BEFORE the fall.

Now? We be after the fall.

Figer it out...



--

Richard Lamb
http://www.home.earthlink.net/~cavelamb
http://www.home.earthlink.net/~sv_temptress

John R. Carroll wrote:
Snag wrote:
So what you seem to be sayin' is that the way to get our country out
of debt is to borrow more money ?
That seems to be a little backward to me ...

Yeah, but it works if you invest the borrowed money wisely in your future.
Bill Ford was running the Ford motor Company until 2006, when Ford hired
Alan Mulally, a former Boeing Co. senior executive, as CEO.
They then went to a consortium of banks to borrow money, literally "hocking
the farm", to restructure the company.
Every asset on Ford's books was used to collateralize their borrowing.
Plants, equipment, inventory, intellectual property - everything.
Ford survived the recession and auto industry downturn without the need for
government financing or the need to be "bailed out".
The company earned a profit of $6.6 billion in 2010, its best year since
1999, and it has steadily gained market share in the U.S.

America needs to do the exact same thing.

The only problem with the government borrowing more money
is they will spend it on more welfare and that wont
make more money. It's just a sink hole for the money.
...lew...

Lewis Hartswick wrote:
John R. Carroll wrote:
Snag wrote:
So what you seem to be sayin' is that the way to get our country out
of debt is to borrow more money ?
That seems to be a little backward to me ...

Yeah, but it works if you invest the borrowed money wisely in your
future.
Bill Ford was running the Ford motor Company until 2006, when Ford hired
Alan Mulally, a former Boeing Co. senior executive, as CEO.
They then went to a consortium of banks to borrow money, literally
"hocking
the farm", to restructure the company.
Every asset on Ford's books was used to collateralize their borrowing.
Plants, equipment, inventory, intellectual property - everything.
Ford survived the recession and auto industry downturn without the
need for
government financing or the need to be "bailed out".
The company earned a profit of $6.6 billion in 2010, its best year since
1999, and it has steadily gained market share in the U.S.

America needs to do the exact same thing.

The only problem with the government borrowing more money
is they will spend it on more welfare and that wont
make more money. It's just a sink hole for the money.
...lew...

Full marks, Lewis!

Welcome to government 101.
--

Richard Lamb
http://www.home.earthlink.net/~cavelamb
http://www.home.earthlink.net/~sv_temptress

CaveLamb wrote:

AN INTERESTING OBSERVATION

1. The sport of choice for the urban poor is BASKETBALL.

2. The sport of choice for maintenance level employees is BOWLING.

3. The sport of choice for front-line workers is FOOTBALL.


At this point, I started wondering, "Is he talking about _playing_,
or _watching_?" ;-)

Thanks!
Rich

Good on the Reps! Block any further debt spending. Then,
maybe congress can reduce spending, live within its means
like the rest of us.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..

"Stormin Mormon" wrote in message
...
Good on the Reps! Block any further debt spending. Then,
maybe congress can reduce spending, live within its means
like the rest of us.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org

They'll have no choice, Chris. Debt service will balloon so high that there
won't be much left to spend for anything -- defense, health care, or social
security. It's a teabagger's dream: poverty for all.

--
Ed Huntress

On Wed, 01 Jun 2011 13:05:10 -0700, Hawke
wrote:

Last night the republicans defeated a "clean" bill to raise the debt
ceiling. Today the stock market took a 250 point drop. Last time the
republicans failed to act on a similar bill the market dropped 500
points before they changed their minds and passed the bill.


When is the GOP going to understand that when they refuse to raise the
debt ceiling it's going to send the economy into the dumpster? They're
playing a game but we're the ones who are going to lose.

Hawke
=============

One way or another the governmental debt binge will stop.
You are indeed correct to observe that refusal to raise the
debt ceiling is likely to put the economy in the dumpster.
The problem is that even with a raised [or even eliminated]
debt ceiling, the economy is going over the cliff. Thus the
choice is a serious, even critical problem now, and a
catastrophe later. This is not a new problem but occurs
again and again in history.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Republic_of_Venice#Decline
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Portuguese_Empire
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/French_colonial_empire
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spanish_Empire
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dutch_Empire
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Empire

Insolvency, in the sense of being unable to redeem due bonds
and pay interest is the little boy shouting wolf again. As
Senator Toomey [R-Penn] points out the federal government's
free cash flow is more than adequate to not only redeem due
bonds and pay accrued interest of the publicly traded bonds,
but also to take care of the trust fund bonds [e.g. social
security], medicare and military pensions/healthcare.
http://keystoneconservative.com/2011...eral-spending/

What is required is a series of furloughs [one day a week?]
of federal workers as was done by the state of California
during the current budget impasse, and possible a salary cap
of the median US wage [c. 50k$/yr] on all governmental
employees, all civil service, all elected
politicians/legislators, all federal judges, etc.


-- Unka George (George McDuffee)
...............................
The past is a foreign country;
they do things differently there.
L. P. Hartley (1895-1972), British author.
The Go-Between, Prologue (1953).

On Jun 3, 7:25*am, "Stormin Mormon"
wrote:
Good on the Reps! Block any further debt spending. Then,
maybe congress can reduce spending, live within its means
like the rest of us.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
*www.lds.org
.

Or watch the economy crash...just like we have seen with the Bush
Crash of '08.

TMT

On Jun 3, 7:23*pm, F. George McDuffee gmcduf...@mcduffee-
associates.us wrote:
On Wed, 01 Jun 2011 13:05:10 -0700, Hawke

wrote:
Last night the republicans defeated a "clean" bill to raise the debt
ceiling. Today the stock market took a 250 point drop. Last time the
republicans failed to act on a similar bill the market dropped 500
points before they changed their minds and passed the bill.

When is the GOP going to understand that when they refuse to raise the
debt ceiling it's going to send the economy into the dumpster? They're
playing a game but we're the ones who are going to lose.

Hawke

=============

One way or another the governmental debt binge will stop.
You are indeed correct to observe that refusal to raise the
debt ceiling is likely to put the economy in the dumpster.
The problem is that even with a raised [or even eliminated]
debt ceiling, the economy is going over the cliff. Thus the
choice is a serious, even critical problem now, and a
catastrophe later. *This is not a new problem but occurs
again and again in history.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Republi...British_Empire

Insolvency, in the sense of being unable to redeem due bonds
and pay interest is the little boy shouting wolf again. *As
Senator Toomey [R-Penn] points out the federal government's
free cash flow is more than adequate to not only redeem due
bonds and pay accrued interest of the publicly traded bonds,
but also to take care of the trust fund bonds [e.g. social
security], medicare and military pensions/healthcare.http://keystoneconservative.com/2011...ey-introduces-...

What is required is a series of furloughs [one day a week?]
of federal workers as was done by the state of California
during the current budget impasse, and possible a salary cap
of the median US wage [c. 50k$/yr] on all governmental
employees, all civil service, all elected
politicians/legislators, all federal judges, etc.

-- Unka George *(George McDuffee)
..............................
The past is a foreign country;
they do things differently there.
L. P. Hartley (1895-1972), British author.
The Go-Between, Prologue (1953).

How about cutting Social Security/Medicare/VA benefits in half and
double every one's taxes?

TMT

F. George McDuffee wrote:

One way or another the governmental debt binge will stop.
You are indeed correct to observe that refusal to raise the
debt ceiling is likely to put the economy in the dumpster.

Uh, have you been asleep for the last two, two and a half years?
The economy went into the dumpster the day Obama started bailing
out all his union cronies with your money.

Sheesh!
Rich

CaveLamb wrote:

AN INTERESTING OBSERVATION

1. The sport of choice for the urban poor is BASKETBALL.

2. The sport of choice for maintenance level employees is BOWLING.

3. The sport of choice for front-line workers is FOOTBALL.

4. The sport of choice for supervisors is BASEBALL.

5. The sport of choice for middle management is TENNIS.

And....

6. The sport of choice for corporate executives and officers is GOLF.

THE AMAZING CONCLUSION:

The higher you go in the corporate structure, the smaller your balls become.

There must be a ton of people in Washington playing marbles!


They shoot BB guns.


--
It's easy to think outside the box, when you have a cutting torch.

On 6/3/2011 10:20 PM, Too_Many_Tools wrote:
On Jun 3, 7:23 pm, F. George McDuffeegmcduf...@mcduffee-
associates.us wrote:
On Wed, 01 Jun 2011 13:05:10 -0700, Hawke

wrote:
Last night the republicans defeated a "clean" bill to raise the debt
ceiling. Today the stock market took a 250 point drop. Last time the
republicans failed to act on a similar bill the market dropped 500
points before they changed their minds and passed the bill.

When is the GOP going to understand that when they refuse to raise the
debt ceiling it's going to send the economy into the dumpster? They're
playing a game but we're the ones who are going to lose.

Hawke

=============

One way or another the governmental debt binge will stop.
You are indeed correct to observe that refusal to raise the
debt ceiling is likely to put the economy in the dumpster.
The problem is that even with a raised [or even eliminated]
debt ceiling, the economy is going over the cliff. Thus the
choice is a serious, even critical problem now, and a
catastrophe later. This is not a new problem but occurs
again and again in history.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/

Insolvency, in the sense of being unable to redeem due bonds
and pay interest is the little boy shouting wolf again. As
Senator Toomey [R-Penn] points out the federal government's
free cash flow is more than adequate to not only redeem due
bonds and pay accrued interest of the publicly traded bonds,
but also to take care of the trust fund bonds [e.g. social
security], medicare and military pensions/healthcare.http:

What is required is a series of furloughs [one day a week?]
of federal workers as was done by the state of California
during the current budget impasse, and possible a salary cap
of the median US wage [c. 50k$/yr] on all governmental
employees, all civil service, all elected
politicians/legislators, all federal judges, etc.

-- Unka George (George McDuffee)
..............................
The past is a foreign country;
they do things differently there.
L. P. Hartley (1895-1972), British author.
The Go-Between, Prologue (1953).

How about cutting Social Security/Medicare/VA benefits in half and
double every one's taxes?

TMT


There's all kinds of ways to bring our finances into order. We can raise
taxes. We can end our wars and bring our troops home. We can cut back on
how much we pay seniors in entitlements. We can choose to do a bit of
all of these things. It's a simple matter of spending a little less and
bringing in a little more. It doesn't take a meat axe and it doesn't
have to be done instantly. But it does need to be done.

We ran up the debt incrementally and we can lower it the same way. But
we do need to start the process. Unfortunately, when you have the
republicans all signing a pledge to never raise taxes that automatically
makes the number of solutions much smaller.

During Eisenhower's term the top tax bracket was 91%. The republicans
today want it at 25% for the wealthiest Americans. Businesses used to
pay almost 30% of the total revenue to the government. Now it only pays
less than 7%. So the revenue is now coming mainly from the middle and
lower classes. That is what the republicans want. They don't want the
rich or business to pay any taxes.

That's the problem. As long as the republicans want that our chances of
fixing our financial problems are damn small. They need to be told the
wars are coming to and end now and the taxes on the rich are going up.
If they won't compromise on those things then let the chips fall where
they may.

Hawke

On 6/3/2011 10:45 PM, Rich Grise wrote:
F. George McDuffee wrote:

One way or another the governmental debt binge will stop.
You are indeed correct to observe that refusal to raise the
debt ceiling is likely to put the economy in the dumpster.

Uh, have you been asleep for the last two, two and a half years?
The economy went into the dumpster the day Obama started bailing
out all his union cronies with your money.

Sheesh!
Rich



It appears that you are the one who's been asleep. The economy went into
the dumpster in 2008. Didn't you notice that? Since Obama took over the
economy has been growing. Did you not notice that? Or are you just going
to pretend things were not horrible under Bush and they are worse now?
Because every statistic says otherwise.

Hawke