They have six reactors. As far as I know, each reactor has 180 tons of
spent fuel rods in water pools. The pools are giant steel bathtubs
suspended in the air. Each pool starts boiling if water in it is not
cooled. The steam is moderately radioactive.

The water will not be cooled if the plan is abandoned. The plant IS
abandoned. The water is not cooled.

Some pools are already boiling, as far as I can tell, from the copious
white steam clouds emitted.

Assume the slowest development of events, that no pools are
breached. (if they are breached and dry, everything will develop a few
days faster).

If the water is not cooled, it will boil off in a week (also as far as
I know).

Then every pool will turn into a white hot pile of burning nuclear
fuel waste rods.

The pile will melt/fall through the steel bottom of the pool, to the
floor of reinforced concrete buildings, where the resulting pile/lake
of white hot material will be evaporating due to extreme temperature,
an analog of burning, but without any need for oxygen.

In any case, if those white hot waste fuel lakes stay on the surface
and do not eat through and submerge through the soil and concrete,
they will be emitting radiation for years, at a high level, and this
will end, likely, when they evaporate almost fully.

That's the bad news -- 1,080 tons of nuclear waste has, more or less,
nowhere else to go other than to the sky.

The good news, is that most of the material will fall in the Pacific
ocean, where it will dissipate. However, if winds do not cooperate,
there is enough of material to render big parts of Japan unlivable for
a long time, due to long half life of most isotopes in said waste.

The other bad news is that the prevailing winds are towards the United
States, going straight to Larry Jacques' backyard. Hopefully, most
stuff will settle down in the ocean.

If this bad scenario materializes, against my hope, then the solutions
will be dirty. One would be to drop large bombs on those buildings, in
order to spread the nuclear waste from the boiling white hot lakes,
over a large area. That would help with its cooling. Pellets spread
over several acres would cool down somewhat. Then, concrete could be
air dropped over the wide area just to encase everything. Concreting
the reactor buildings, pretty much, is impossible due to lack of
access to the inside, and due to the active lakes of spent fuel.

"Ignoramus19837" wrote in message
...
They have six reactors. As far as I know, each reactor has 180 tons of
spent fuel rods in water pools. The pools are giant steel bathtubs
suspended in the air. Each pool starts boiling if water in it is not
cooled. The steam is moderately radioactive.

The water will not be cooled if the plan is abandoned. The plant IS
abandoned. The water is not cooled.

Some pools are already boiling, as far as I can tell, from the copious
white steam clouds emitted.

Assume the slowest development of events, that no pools are
breached. (if they are breached and dry, everything will develop a few
days faster).

If the water is not cooled, it will boil off in a week (also as far as
I know).

Then every pool will turn into a white hot pile of burning nuclear
fuel waste rods.

The pile will melt/fall through the steel bottom of the pool, to the
floor of reinforced concrete buildings, where the resulting pile/lake
of white hot material will be evaporating due to extreme temperature,
an analog of burning, but without any need for oxygen.

In any case, if those white hot waste fuel lakes stay on the surface
and do not eat through and submerge through the soil and concrete,
they will be emitting radiation for years, at a high level, and this
will end, likely, when they evaporate almost fully.

That's the bad news -- 1,080 tons of nuclear waste has, more or less,
nowhere else to go other than to the sky.

The good news, is that most of the material will fall in the Pacific
ocean, where it will dissipate. However, if winds do not cooperate,
there is enough of material to render big parts of Japan unlivable for
a long time, due to long half life of most isotopes in said waste.

The other bad news is that the prevailing winds are towards the United
States, going straight to Larry Jacques' backyard. Hopefully, most
stuff will settle down in the ocean.

Which is not such good news either.


If this bad scenario materializes, against my hope, then the solutions
will be dirty. One would be to drop large bombs on those buildings, in
order to spread the nuclear waste from the boiling white hot lakes,
over a large area. That would help with its cooling. Pellets spread
over several acres would cool down somewhat. Then, concrete could be
air dropped over the wide area just to encase everything. Concreting
the reactor buildings, pretty much, is impossible due to lack of
access to the inside, and due to the active lakes of spent fuel.

Heh, fuknJapan does it again....
Killed/vivisectioned 39,000,000 chinese pre/during WW II, now she's gonna
**** a good part of the world in the ass once again.....
Too bad we can't selectively direct all that radioactivity to Wash. DC, Wall
Street, and to Microsoft -- do sumpn useful with it....

But dat ****ty li'l self-obsessed country just never quits....
--
EA

On 2011-03-16, Existential Angst wrote:
"Ignoramus19837" wrote in message
If this bad scenario materializes, against my hope, then the solutions
will be dirty. One would be to drop large bombs on those buildings, in
order to spread the nuclear waste from the boiling white hot lakes,
over a large area. That would help with its cooling. Pellets spread
over several acres would cool down somewhat. Then, concrete could be
air dropped over the wide area just to encase everything. Concreting
the reactor buildings, pretty much, is impossible due to lack of
access to the inside, and due to the active lakes of spent fuel.

Heh, fuknJapan does it again....
Killed/vivisectioned 39,000,000 chinese pre/during WW II, now she's gonna
**** a good part of the world in the ass once again.....
Too bad we can't selectively direct all that radioactivity to Wash. DC, Wall
Street, and to Microsoft -- do sumpn useful with it....

Um, it is going to Microsoft.

i

Ignoramus19837 wrote:

They have six reactors. As far as I know, each reactor has 180 tons of
spent fuel rods in water pools. The pools are giant steel bathtubs
suspended in the air. Each pool starts boiling if water in it is not
cooled. The steam is moderately radioactive.

The water will not be cooled if the plan is abandoned. The plant IS
abandoned. The water is not cooled.

Some pools are already boiling, as far as I can tell, from the copious
white steam clouds emitted.

Assume the slowest development of events, that no pools are
breached. (if they are breached and dry, everything will develop a few
days faster).

If the water is not cooled, it will boil off in a week (also as far as
I know).

Then every pool will turn into a white hot pile of burning nuclear
fuel waste rods.

The pile will melt/fall through the steel bottom of the pool, to the
floor of reinforced concrete buildings, where the resulting pile/lake
of white hot material will be evaporating due to extreme temperature,
an analog of burning, but without any need for oxygen.

In any case, if those white hot waste fuel lakes stay on the surface
and do not eat through and submerge through the soil and concrete,
they will be emitting radiation for years, at a high level, and this
will end, likely, when they evaporate almost fully.

That's the bad news -- 1,080 tons of nuclear waste has, more or less,
nowhere else to go other than to the sky.

The good news, is that most of the material will fall in the Pacific
ocean, where it will dissipate. However, if winds do not cooperate,
there is enough of material to render big parts of Japan unlivable for
a long time, due to long half life of most isotopes in said waste.

The other bad news is that the prevailing winds are towards the United
States, going straight to Larry Jacques' backyard. Hopefully, most
stuff will settle down in the ocean.

If this bad scenario materializes, against my hope, then the solutions
will be dirty. One would be to drop large bombs on those buildings, in
order to spread the nuclear waste from the boiling white hot lakes,
over a large area. That would help with its cooling. Pellets spread
over several acres would cool down somewhat. Then, concrete could be
air dropped over the wide area just to encase everything. Concreting
the reactor buildings, pretty much, is impossible due to lack of
access to the inside, and due to the active lakes of spent fuel.

Sounds like the anti-nuke crowd is to blame since they have been
fighting against both a proper safe long term storage facility, as well
as reprocessing of the "spent" fuel.

On 2011-03-16, Pete C. wrote:

Ignoramus19837 wrote:

They have six reactors. As far as I know, each reactor has 180 tons of
spent fuel rods in water pools. The pools are giant steel bathtubs
suspended in the air. Each pool starts boiling if water in it is not
cooled. The steam is moderately radioactive.

The water will not be cooled if the plan is abandoned. The plant IS
abandoned. The water is not cooled.

Some pools are already boiling, as far as I can tell, from the copious
white steam clouds emitted.

Assume the slowest development of events, that no pools are
breached. (if they are breached and dry, everything will develop a few
days faster).

If the water is not cooled, it will boil off in a week (also as far as
I know).

Then every pool will turn into a white hot pile of burning nuclear
fuel waste rods.

The pile will melt/fall through the steel bottom of the pool, to the
floor of reinforced concrete buildings, where the resulting pile/lake
of white hot material will be evaporating due to extreme temperature,
an analog of burning, but without any need for oxygen.

In any case, if those white hot waste fuel lakes stay on the surface
and do not eat through and submerge through the soil and concrete,
they will be emitting radiation for years, at a high level, and this
will end, likely, when they evaporate almost fully.

That's the bad news -- 1,080 tons of nuclear waste has, more or less,
nowhere else to go other than to the sky.

The good news, is that most of the material will fall in the Pacific
ocean, where it will dissipate. However, if winds do not cooperate,
there is enough of material to render big parts of Japan unlivable for
a long time, due to long half life of most isotopes in said waste.

The other bad news is that the prevailing winds are towards the United
States, going straight to Larry Jacques' backyard. Hopefully, most
stuff will settle down in the ocean.

If this bad scenario materializes, against my hope, then the solutions
will be dirty. One would be to drop large bombs on those buildings, in
order to spread the nuclear waste from the boiling white hot lakes,
over a large area. That would help with its cooling. Pellets spread
over several acres would cool down somewhat. Then, concrete could be
air dropped over the wide area just to encase everything. Concreting
the reactor buildings, pretty much, is impossible due to lack of
access to the inside, and due to the active lakes of spent fuel.

Sounds like the anti-nuke crowd is to blame since they have been
fighting against both a proper safe long term storage facility, as well
as reprocessing of the "spent" fuel.

I happen to agree with this, at least if this was in the US. I have no
idea what exactly is/was the nuclear politics in Japan.

I know that the French reprocess their fuel, and the Russians make
giant glass rods, where the nuclear waste is dissolved in molten glass
and then solidifies into large glass cylinders. Those cylinders are
sufficiently inert and stay cool without any need for forced cooling.

If these glass cylinders break due to any accident, it is just a bunch
of glass pieces, staying in one place. It would be radioactive and
would need careful treatment, but not at all a disaster.

If the Japanese waste fuel was in form of those rods, the future would
look a lot brighter.

i

"Pete C." wrote:

Sounds like the anti-nuke crowd is to blame since they have been
fighting against both a proper safe long term storage facility, as well
as reprocessing of the "spent" fuel.

Does that mean all of that spent fuel
would have been shipped to the US
if the US had been less negative towards nuclear power?

Some pictures.

Originals:
http://www.digitalglobe.com/index.ph...magery+Gallery

If originals go away away:
http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/Fukushima...ite-Pix-Mar16/


On 2011-03-16, Ignoramus19837 wrote:
They have six reactors. As far as I know, each reactor has 180 tons of
spent fuel rods in water pools. The pools are giant steel bathtubs
suspended in the air. Each pool starts boiling if water in it is not
cooled. The steam is moderately radioactive.

The water will not be cooled if the plan is abandoned. The plant IS
abandoned. The water is not cooled.

Some pools are already boiling, as far as I can tell, from the copious
white steam clouds emitted.

Assume the slowest development of events, that no pools are
breached. (if they are breached and dry, everything will develop a few
days faster).

If the water is not cooled, it will boil off in a week (also as far as
I know).

Then every pool will turn into a white hot pile of burning nuclear
fuel waste rods.

The pile will melt/fall through the steel bottom of the pool, to the
floor of reinforced concrete buildings, where the resulting pile/lake
of white hot material will be evaporating due to extreme temperature,
an analog of burning, but without any need for oxygen.

In any case, if those white hot waste fuel lakes stay on the surface
and do not eat through and submerge through the soil and concrete,
they will be emitting radiation for years, at a high level, and this
will end, likely, when they evaporate almost fully.

That's the bad news -- 1,080 tons of nuclear waste has, more or less,
nowhere else to go other than to the sky.

The good news, is that most of the material will fall in the Pacific
ocean, where it will dissipate. However, if winds do not cooperate,
there is enough of material to render big parts of Japan unlivable for
a long time, due to long half life of most isotopes in said waste.

The other bad news is that the prevailing winds are towards the United
States, going straight to Larry Jacques' backyard. Hopefully, most
stuff will settle down in the ocean.

If this bad scenario materializes, against my hope, then the solutions
will be dirty. One would be to drop large bombs on those buildings, in
order to spread the nuclear waste from the boiling white hot lakes,
over a large area. That would help with its cooling. Pellets spread
over several acres would cool down somewhat. Then, concrete could be
air dropped over the wide area just to encase everything. Concreting
the reactor buildings, pretty much, is impossible due to lack of
access to the inside, and due to the active lakes of spent fuel.

Also look at the pdf, it is extremely helpful.

http://www.digitalglobe.com/download..._March2011.pdf

same is on my webpage, just in case.

i

On 2011-03-16, Ignoramus19837 wrote:
Some pictures.

Originals:
http://www.digitalglobe.com/index.ph...magery+Gallery

If originals go away away:
http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/Fukushima...ite-Pix-Mar16/


On 2011-03-16, Ignoramus19837 wrote:
They have six reactors. As far as I know, each reactor has 180 tons of
spent fuel rods in water pools. The pools are giant steel bathtubs
suspended in the air. Each pool starts boiling if water in it is not
cooled. The steam is moderately radioactive.

The water will not be cooled if the plan is abandoned. The plant IS
abandoned. The water is not cooled.

Some pools are already boiling, as far as I can tell, from the copious
white steam clouds emitted.

Assume the slowest development of events, that no pools are
breached. (if they are breached and dry, everything will develop a few
days faster).

If the water is not cooled, it will boil off in a week (also as far as
I know).

Then every pool will turn into a white hot pile of burning nuclear
fuel waste rods.

The pile will melt/fall through the steel bottom of the pool, to the
floor of reinforced concrete buildings, where the resulting pile/lake
of white hot material will be evaporating due to extreme temperature,
an analog of burning, but without any need for oxygen.

In any case, if those white hot waste fuel lakes stay on the surface
and do not eat through and submerge through the soil and concrete,
they will be emitting radiation for years, at a high level, and this
will end, likely, when they evaporate almost fully.

That's the bad news -- 1,080 tons of nuclear waste has, more or less,
nowhere else to go other than to the sky.

The good news, is that most of the material will fall in the Pacific
ocean, where it will dissipate. However, if winds do not cooperate,
there is enough of material to render big parts of Japan unlivable for
a long time, due to long half life of most isotopes in said waste.

The other bad news is that the prevailing winds are towards the United
States, going straight to Larry Jacques' backyard. Hopefully, most
stuff will settle down in the ocean.

If this bad scenario materializes, against my hope, then the solutions
will be dirty. One would be to drop large bombs on those buildings, in
order to spread the nuclear waste from the boiling white hot lakes,
over a large area. That would help with its cooling. Pellets spread
over several acres would cool down somewhat. Then, concrete could be
air dropped over the wide area just to encase everything. Concreting
the reactor buildings, pretty much, is impossible due to lack of
access to the inside, and due to the active lakes of spent fuel.

jim wrote:

"Pete C." wrote:

Sounds like the anti-nuke crowd is to blame since they have been
fighting against both a proper safe long term storage facility, as well
as reprocessing of the "spent" fuel.

Does that mean all of that spent fuel
would have been shipped to the US
if the US had been less negative towards nuclear power?

Who knows, it certainly could have been. There has been plenty of talk
of the US and Russia acting as nuclear fuel suppliers and reprocessors
to the world as a means to keep better control on the parts of the
process that could be used to produce weapons grade material.

On 2011-03-16, Pete C. wrote:
Does that mean all of that spent fuel
would have been shipped to the US
if the US had been less negative towards nuclear power?

Who knows, it certainly could have been. There has been plenty of talk
of the US and Russia acting as nuclear fuel suppliers and reprocessors
to the world as a means to keep better control on the parts of the
process that could be used to produce weapons grade material.

The saddest part is that ways to store nuclear waste safely, are well
known.

I went to a drug store today and picked the last two bottles of
potassium iodide, also known as colorless iodide from the scrapes and
cuts section.

I do not expect to need it, even if the plant does becomer a multiyear
disaster. However, I do not want to be a sucker and be without it,
should I be wrong and need it.

I already have only 1/3 of my thyroid left.

i

On Wed, 16 Mar 2011 08:18:20 -0500, Ignoramus19837
wrote:
--snip--
The good news, is that most of the material will fall in the Pacific
ocean, where it will dissipate. However, if winds do not cooperate,
there is enough of material to render big parts of Japan unlivable for
a long time, due to long half life of most isotopes in said waste.

The other bad news is that the prevailing winds are towards the United
States, going straight to Larry Jacques' backyard. Hopefully, most
stuff will settle down in the ocean.

Yeah, I know. sigh Well, I didn't want to live forever anyway.
I just hope it's either clean enough to not cause any side effects at
all or dirty enough to be a quick, clean death.

And what doesn't drop on me will hit the rest of the USA.

Arrrrrrrrrrrgh!


If this bad scenario materializes, against my hope, then the solutions
will be dirty. One would be to drop large bombs on those buildings, in
order to spread the nuclear waste from the boiling white hot lakes,
over a large area. That would help with its cooling. Pellets spread
over several acres would cool down somewhat. Then, concrete could be
air dropped over the wide area just to encase everything. Concreting
the reactor buildings, pretty much, is impossible due to lack of
access to the inside, and due to the active lakes of spent fuel.

Nasty thought.

--
Small opportunities are often the beginning of great enterprises.
-- Demosthenes

On Wed, 16 Mar 2011 08:49:37 -0500, Ignoramus19837
wrote:

On 2011-03-16, Existential Angst wrote:
"Ignoramus19837" wrote in message
If this bad scenario materializes, against my hope, then the solutions
will be dirty. One would be to drop large bombs on those buildings, in
order to spread the nuclear waste from the boiling white hot lakes,
over a large area. That would help with its cooling. Pellets spread
over several acres would cool down somewhat. Then, concrete could be
air dropped over the wide area just to encase everything. Concreting
the reactor buildings, pretty much, is impossible due to lack of
access to the inside, and due to the active lakes of spent fuel.

Heh, fuknJapan does it again....
Killed/vivisectioned 39,000,000 chinese pre/during WW II, now she's gonna
**** a good part of the world in the ass once again.....
Too bad we can't selectively direct all that radioactivity to Wash. DC, Wall
Street, and to Microsoft -- do sumpn useful with it....

Um, it is going to Microsoft.

Wow, maybe it'll result in a genetic mutation of Windows which doesn't
crash and is immune to virii!

--
Small opportunities are often the beginning of great enterprises.
-- Demosthenes

On Wed, 16 Mar 2011 07:51:46 -0600, "Pete C."
wrote:


Ignoramus19837 wrote:

The other bad news is that the prevailing winds are towards the United
States, going straight to Larry Jacques' backyard. Hopefully, most
stuff will settle down in the ocean.

(Note to Ig: There is no "c" in Jaques.)


If this bad scenario materializes, against my hope, then the solutions
will be dirty. One would be to drop large bombs on those buildings, in
order to spread the nuclear waste from the boiling white hot lakes,
over a large area. That would help with its cooling. Pellets spread
over several acres would cool down somewhat. Then, concrete could be
air dropped over the wide area just to encase everything. Concreting
the reactor buildings, pretty much, is impossible due to lack of
access to the inside, and due to the active lakes of spent fuel.

Sounds like the anti-nuke crowd is to blame since they have been
fighting against both a proper safe long term storage facility, as well
as reprocessing of the "spent" fuel.

That's it. We're 3 generations behind in safety because of the
greenies. It's their fault. Reprocessing would have eliminated about
95% of the waste stream.

--
Small opportunities are often the beginning of great enterprises.
-- Demosthenes

Ignoramus19837 wrote:
On 2011-03-16, Existential wrote:
id wrote in message
If this bad scenario materializes, against my hope, then the solutions
will be dirty. One would be to drop large bombs on those buildings, in
order to spread the nuclear waste from the boiling white hot lakes,
over a large area. That would help with its cooling. Pellets spread
over several acres would cool down somewhat. Then, concrete could be
air dropped over the wide area just to encase everything. Concreting
the reactor buildings, pretty much, is impossible due to lack of
access to the inside, and due to the active lakes of spent fuel.

Heh, fuknJapan does it again....
Killed/vivisectioned 39,000,000 chinese pre/during WW II, now she's gonna
**** a good part of the world in the ass once again.....
Too bad we can't selectively direct all that radioactivity to Wash. DC, Wall
Street, and to Microsoft -- do sumpn useful with it....

Um, it is going to Microsoft.

Not that I can see.

http://www.radiationnetwork.com/

--Winston

On Wed, 16 Mar 2011 12:56:31 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote:

On Wed, 16 Mar 2011 08:49:37 -0500, Ignoramus19837
wrote:
Um, it is going to Microsoft.

Wow, maybe it'll result in a genetic mutation of Windows which doesn't
crash and is immune to virii!

That is unlikely. What is likely is that Bill Gates will flee to the
safety of low Earth orbit in the secret space shuttle he keeps parked
in a launch tube built under his house.
Dave

"Larry Jaques" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 16 Mar 2011 08:49:37 -0500, Ignoramus19837
wrote:

On 2011-03-16, Existential Angst wrote:
"Ignoramus19837" wrote in message
If this bad scenario materializes, against my hope, then the solutions
will be dirty. One would be to drop large bombs on those buildings, in
order to spread the nuclear waste from the boiling white hot lakes,
over a large area. That would help with its cooling. Pellets spread
over several acres would cool down somewhat. Then, concrete could be
air dropped over the wide area just to encase everything. Concreting
the reactor buildings, pretty much, is impossible due to lack of
access to the inside, and due to the active lakes of spent fuel.

Heh, fuknJapan does it again....
Killed/vivisectioned 39,000,000 chinese pre/during WW II, now she's gonna
**** a good part of the world in the ass once again.....
Too bad we can't selectively direct all that radioactivity to Wash. DC, Wall
Street, and to Microsoft -- do sumpn useful with it....

Um, it is going to Microsoft.

Wow, maybe it'll result in a genetic mutation of Windows which doesn't
crash and is immune to virii!

--
Small opportunities are often the beginning of great enterprises.
-- Demosthenes


Windows will morph into Linux? OK!

"Larry Jaques" wrote in message
...


(Note to Ig: There is no "c" in Jaques.)


There's no "P" in Larry...the diuretics are WORKING!

Ignoramus19837 wrote:

Just a nitpick, but the transliteration from the Japanese
is "Fu-ku-shi-ma."

"Fuk-u-shima" tempts me to say, "Same to you, shima!"

Hope This Helps!
Rich

There is no L in "Mormon". The L, I say?

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"Tom Gardner" w@w wrote in message
...

"Larry Jaques" wrote in
message
...


(Note to Ig: There is no "c" in Jaques.)


There's no "P" in Larry...the diuretics are WORKING!

John R. Carroll wrote:
Ignoramus19837 wrote:
On 2011-03-16, Pete wrote:
Does that mean all of that spent fuel
would have been shipped to the US
if the US had been less negative towards nuclear power?

Who knows, it certainly could have been. There has been plenty of
talk of the US and Russia acting as nuclear fuel suppliers and
reprocessors to the world as a means to keep better control on the
parts of the process that could be used to produce weapons grade
material.

The saddest part is that ways to store nuclear waste safely, are well
known.

This accident might just be the tragedy needed to go the last mile here in
the US.




The wackos wonder about storing the stuff for 10,000 years, like there
will never be any better technology to handle the stuff in 100 years or
even 20 years/.

John

On Wed, 16 Mar 2011 13:01:33 -0700, Winston
wrote:

Ignoramus19837 wrote:
On 2011-03-16, Existential wrote:
id wrote in message
If this bad scenario materializes, against my hope, then the solutions
will be dirty. One would be to drop large bombs on those buildings, in
order to spread the nuclear waste from the boiling white hot lakes,
over a large area. That would help with its cooling. Pellets spread
over several acres would cool down somewhat. Then, concrete could be
air dropped over the wide area just to encase everything. Concreting
the reactor buildings, pretty much, is impossible due to lack of
access to the inside, and due to the active lakes of spent fuel.

Heh, fuknJapan does it again....
Killed/vivisectioned 39,000,000 chinese pre/during WW II, now she's gonna
**** a good part of the world in the ass once again.....
Too bad we can't selectively direct all that radioactivity to Wash. DC, Wall
Street, and to Microsoft -- do sumpn useful with it....

Um, it is going to Microsoft.

Not that I can see.

http://www.radiationnetwork.com/

I'll have to keep checking that over the next weeks...

--
Small opportunities are often the beginning of great enterprises.
-- Demosthenes

On Wed, 16 Mar 2011 21:29:55 -0400, "Tom Gardner" w@w wrote:


"Larry Jaques" wrote in message
.. .


(Note to Ig: There is no "c" in Jaques.)


There's no "P" in Larry...the diuretics are WORKING!

It's that 20 minute trigger which ****es me off.

--
Small opportunities are often the beginning of great enterprises.
-- Demosthenes

On Wed, 16 Mar 2011 19:14:02 -0700, Rich Grise
wrote:

Ignoramus19837 wrote:

Just a nitpick, but the transliteration from the Japanese
is "Fu-ku-shi-ma."

"Fuk-u-shima" tempts me to say, "Same to you, shima!"

Hope This Helps!
Rich

I worked for a Japanese company. My direct supervisor's last name was
"Shima". I prefer Fuk-U-Shima.
Dave

On Wed, 16 Mar 2011 22:46:28 -0400, John
wrote:

John R. Carroll wrote:
Ignoramus19837 wrote:
On 2011-03-16, Pete wrote:
Does that mean all of that spent fuel
would have been shipped to the US
if the US had been less negative towards nuclear power?

Who knows, it certainly could have been. There has been plenty of
talk of the US and Russia acting as nuclear fuel suppliers and
reprocessors to the world as a means to keep better control on the
parts of the process that could be used to produce weapons grade
material.

The saddest part is that ways to store nuclear waste safely, are well
known.

This accident might just be the tragedy needed to go the last mile here in
the US.




The wackos wonder about storing the stuff for 10,000 years, like there
will never be any better technology to handle the stuff in 100 years or
even 20 years/.

John
======
As indicated in another posting, when a typical "spent"
uranium fuel rod is stored or scraped, c. 98% of the energy,
and cost to mine/refine the uranium it contains is lost.


-- Unka George (George McDuffee)
...............................
The past is a foreign country;
they do things differently there.
L. P. Hartley (1895-1972), British author.
The Go-Between, Prologue (1953).

wrote in message
...
On Wed, 16 Mar 2011 19:14:02 -0700, Rich Grise
wrote:

Ignoramus19837 wrote:

Just a nitpick, but the transliteration from the Japanese
is "Fu-ku-shi-ma."

"Fuk-u-shima" tempts me to say, "Same to you, shima!"

Hope This Helps!
Rich

I worked for a Japanese company. My direct supervisor's last name was
"Shima". I prefer Fuk-U-Shima.
Dave

I used to visit one of our company's factories in Fukui. I really had to
watch my mouth with that one...

--
Ed Huntress

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...

wrote in message
...
On Wed, 16 Mar 2011 19:14:02 -0700, Rich Grise
wrote:

Ignoramus19837 wrote:

Just a nitpick, but the transliteration from the Japanese
is "Fu-ku-shi-ma."

"Fuk-u-shima" tempts me to say, "Same to you, shima!"

Hope This Helps!
Rich

I worked for a Japanese company. My direct supervisor's last name was
"Shima". I prefer Fuk-U-Shima.
Dave

I used to visit one of our company's factories in Fukui. I really had to
watch my mouth with that one...

--
Ed Huntress

Fuku burgers are the best.

http://www.fukuburger.com/menu/

Best Regards
Tom.G

"azotic" wrote in message
...

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...

wrote in message
...
On Wed, 16 Mar 2011 19:14:02 -0700, Rich Grise
wrote:

Ignoramus19837 wrote:

Just a nitpick, but the transliteration from the Japanese
is "Fu-ku-shi-ma."

"Fuk-u-shima" tempts me to say, "Same to you, shima!"

Hope This Helps!
Rich

I worked for a Japanese company. My direct supervisor's last name was
"Shima". I prefer Fuk-U-Shima.
Dave

I used to visit one of our company's factories in Fukui. I really had to
watch my mouth with that one...

--
Ed Huntress

Fuku burgers are the best.

http://www.fukuburger.com/menu/

Mmmmmm...'dem Fuku Pig Burgers look yummy. Is that ketchup or blood drooling
down the side?

I think that's the company that supplied the burgers for our cafeteria at
Michigan State. "You want to know what's in that burger? Fuku!"

--
Ed Huntress



Best Regards
Tom.G

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...

"azotic" wrote in message
...

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...

wrote in message
...
On Wed, 16 Mar 2011 19:14:02 -0700, Rich Grise
wrote:

Ignoramus19837 wrote:

Just a nitpick, but the transliteration from the Japanese
is "Fu-ku-shi-ma."

"Fuk-u-shima" tempts me to say, "Same to you, shima!"

Hope This Helps!
Rich

I worked for a Japanese company. My direct supervisor's last name was
"Shima". I prefer Fuk-U-Shima.
Dave

I used to visit one of our company's factories in Fukui. I really had to
watch my mouth with that one...

--
Ed Huntress

Fuku burgers are the best.

http://www.fukuburger.com/menu/

Mmmmmm...'dem Fuku Pig Burgers look yummy. Is that ketchup or blood
drooling down the side?

I think that's the company that supplied the burgers for our cafeteria at
Michigan State. "You want to know what's in that burger? Fuku!"

--
Ed Huntress



Best Regards
Tom.G



All thier meat comes from the soylent corp.
All natural, no preservatives.

Best Regards
Tom.

"azotic" wrote in message
...

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...

"azotic" wrote in message
...

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...

wrote in message
...
On Wed, 16 Mar 2011 19:14:02 -0700, Rich Grise
wrote:

Ignoramus19837 wrote:

Just a nitpick, but the transliteration from the Japanese
is "Fu-ku-shi-ma."

"Fuk-u-shima" tempts me to say, "Same to you, shima!"

Hope This Helps!
Rich

I worked for a Japanese company. My direct supervisor's last name was
"Shima". I prefer Fuk-U-Shima.
Dave

I used to visit one of our company's factories in Fukui. I really had
to watch my mouth with that one...

--
Ed Huntress

Fuku burgers are the best.

http://www.fukuburger.com/menu/

Mmmmmm...'dem Fuku Pig Burgers look yummy. Is that ketchup or blood
drooling down the side?

I think that's the company that supplied the burgers for our cafeteria at
Michigan State. "You want to know what's in that burger? Fuku!"

--
Ed Huntress



Best Regards
Tom.G



All thier meat comes from the soylent corp.
All natural, no preservatives.

Best Regards
Tom.

Gawd....

This is serious: At Michigan State, our cafeteria burgers (back in the '60s)
came from cows from our Research Farm. No kidding. They had a two-headed
calf out there, and a cow with a glass window in its stomach, so you could
watch it digest its food. They also raised herds of more-or-less normal cows
that, we hoped, were the ones they slaughtered for our burgers, although
they never told us what kind of "research" they had been subjected to.

The two-headed calf was good for the tongue market, I suppose. As for
watching the glass-windowed stomach...well, there wasn't a lot to do in the
middle of Michigan, and we needed something to do on a date that would get
the milkmaids excited. It was amazing how many couples would show up at the
barn on a Friday night.

We also had a research project going on that attempted to learn how much soy
meal we could tolerate in a burger. If we volunteered, we got all of the
free burgers we could eat. We couldn't drop out...if we couldn't eat the
burgers, we still had to show up, take at least one bite, and report how
much we liked them -- or not.

They started at 10% soy meal, and then ramped it up every two or three days,
IIRC. Up to around 30%, they were good. At 40%, they started to taste like
wet newspaper. By the time they reached 70%, the trick was to keep from
barfing. They went all the way to 90%.

For months after that, I couldn't eat a burger. I'd turn green just looking
at them. I still won't eat tofu.

--
Ed Huntress

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...

Gawd....

This is serious: At Michigan State, our cafeteria burgers (back in the
'60s) came from cows from our Research Farm. No kidding. They had a
two-headed calf out there, and a cow with a glass window in its stomach,
so you could watch it digest its food. They also raised herds of
more-or-less normal cows that, we hoped, were the ones they slaughtered
for our burgers, although they never told us what kind of "research" they
had been subjected to.

The two-headed calf was good for the tongue market, I suppose. As for
watching the glass-windowed stomach...well, there wasn't a lot to do in
the middle of Michigan, and we needed something to do on a date that would
get the milkmaids excited. It was amazing how many couples would show up
at the barn on a Friday night.

We also had a research project going on that attempted to learn how much
soy meal we could tolerate in a burger. If we volunteered, we got all of
the free burgers we could eat. We couldn't drop out...if we couldn't eat
the burgers, we still had to show up, take at least one bite, and report
how much we liked them -- or not.

They started at 10% soy meal, and then ramped it up every two or three
days, IIRC. Up to around 30%, they were good. At 40%, they started to
taste like wet newspaper. By the time they reached 70%, the trick was to
keep from barfing. They went all the way to 90%.

For months after that, I couldn't eat a burger. I'd turn green just
looking at them. I still won't eat tofu.

--
Ed Huntress


Wow what were they thinking 90% soy ? The participents should
have gotten hazzard pay and free counseling for PTSD after eating
that concoction.

Best Regards
Tom.

"azotic" wrote in message
...

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...

Gawd....

This is serious: At Michigan State, our cafeteria burgers (back in the
'60s) came from cows from our Research Farm. No kidding. They had a
two-headed calf out there, and a cow with a glass window in its stomach,
so you could watch it digest its food. They also raised herds of
more-or-less normal cows that, we hoped, were the ones they slaughtered
for our burgers, although they never told us what kind of "research" they
had been subjected to.

The two-headed calf was good for the tongue market, I suppose. As for
watching the glass-windowed stomach...well, there wasn't a lot to do in
the middle of Michigan, and we needed something to do on a date that
would
get the milkmaids excited. It was amazing how many couples would show up
at the barn on a Friday night.

We also had a research project going on that attempted to learn how much
soy meal we could tolerate in a burger. If we volunteered, we got all of
the free burgers we could eat. We couldn't drop out...if we couldn't eat
the burgers, we still had to show up, take at least one bite, and report
how much we liked them -- or not.

They started at 10% soy meal, and then ramped it up every two or three
days, IIRC. Up to around 30%, they were good. At 40%, they started to
taste like wet newspaper. By the time they reached 70%, the trick was to
keep from barfing. They went all the way to 90%.

For months after that, I couldn't eat a burger. I'd turn green just
looking at them. I still won't eat tofu.

--
Ed Huntress


Wow what were they thinking 90% soy ?

I think it was some grad student's idea of a symmetrical endpoint. d8-)

The participents should
have gotten hazzard pay and free counseling for PTSD after eating
that concoction.

It was the stuff of nightmares. At around 70% soy, it became uniformly
smooth and gray, like cellulose insulation mixed with coagulated library
paste.

Needless to say, the final menu item was around 25 - 30% soy meal.

--
Ed Huntress



Best Regards
Tom.

On Thu, 17 Mar 2011 07:26:22 -0400, "Ed Huntress"
wrote:


"azotic" wrote in message
...

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...

Gawd....

This is serious: At Michigan State, our cafeteria burgers (back in the
'60s) came from cows from our Research Farm. No kidding. They had a
two-headed calf out there, and a cow with a glass window in its stomach,
so you could watch it digest its food. They also raised herds of
more-or-less normal cows that, we hoped, were the ones they slaughtered
for our burgers, although they never told us what kind of "research" they
had been subjected to.

The two-headed calf was good for the tongue market, I suppose. As for
watching the glass-windowed stomach...well, there wasn't a lot to do in
the middle of Michigan, and we needed something to do on a date that
would
get the milkmaids excited. It was amazing how many couples would show up
at the barn on a Friday night.

We also had a research project going on that attempted to learn how much
soy meal we could tolerate in a burger. If we volunteered, we got all of
the free burgers we could eat. We couldn't drop out...if we couldn't eat
the burgers, we still had to show up, take at least one bite, and report
how much we liked them -- or not.

They started at 10% soy meal, and then ramped it up every two or three
days, IIRC. Up to around 30%, they were good. At 40%, they started to
taste like wet newspaper. By the time they reached 70%, the trick was to
keep from barfing. They went all the way to 90%.

For months after that, I couldn't eat a burger. I'd turn green just
looking at them. I still won't eat tofu.

--
Ed Huntress


Laugh cough yuck LOL I use to yak with a girl online that worked at a
place with windows in cattle was in Kentucky IIRC. She dumped me cause
I moved up north, guess I copped out. Couldn't take the big city
anymore.

Wonder how many acres of land got wet in Japan?

SW


Wow what were they thinking 90% soy ?

I think it was some grad student's idea of a symmetrical endpoint. d8-)

The participents should
have gotten hazzard pay and free counseling for PTSD after eating
that concoction.

It was the stuff of nightmares. At around 70% soy, it became uniformly
smooth and gray, like cellulose insulation mixed with coagulated library
paste.

Needless to say, the final menu item was around 25 - 30% soy meal.

On Wed, 16 Mar 2011 22:19:04 -0700, "azotic"
wrote:

Fuku burgers are the best.

http://www.fukuburger.com/menu/

Then there's the bird: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5D2VdaM8OcM

--
A paranoid is someone who knows a little of what's going on.
-- William S. Burroughs

On Mar 17, 12:52*am, wrote:
On Wed, 16 Mar 2011 19:14:02 -0700, Rich Grise

wrote:
Ignoramus19837 wrote:

Just a nitpick, but the transliteration from the Japanese
is "Fu-ku-shi-ma."

"Fuk-u-shima" tempts me to say, "Same to you, shima!"

Hope This Helps!
Rich

I worked for a Japanese company. My direct supervisor's last name was
"Shima". I prefer Fuk-U-Shima.
Dave

Shima means Island.

On 2011-03-16, Larry Jaques wrote:
On Wed, 16 Mar 2011 07:51:46 -0600, "Pete C."
wrote:


Ignoramus19837 wrote:

The other bad news is that the prevailing winds are towards the United
States, going straight to Larry Jacques' backyard. Hopefully, most
stuff will settle down in the ocean.

(Note to Ig: There is no "c" in Jaques.)

I am sorry, Mr Jaques.


If this bad scenario materializes, against my hope, then the solutions
will be dirty. One would be to drop large bombs on those buildings, in
order to spread the nuclear waste from the boiling white hot lakes,
over a large area. That would help with its cooling. Pellets spread
over several acres would cool down somewhat. Then, concrete could be
air dropped over the wide area just to encase everything. Concreting
the reactor buildings, pretty much, is impossible due to lack of
access to the inside, and due to the active lakes of spent fuel.

Sounds like the anti-nuke crowd is to blame since they have been
fighting against both a proper safe long term storage facility, as well
as reprocessing of the "spent" fuel.

That's it. We're 3 generations behind in safety because of the
greenies. It's their fault. Reprocessing would have eliminated about
95% of the waste stream.


I wish that all that could be rationally addressed.

i

On Mar 16, 8:51*am, "Pete C." wrote:
Ignoramus19837 wrote:

They have six reactors. As far as I know, each reactor has 180 tons of
spent fuel rods in water pools. The pools are giant steel bathtubs
suspended in the air. Each pool starts boiling if water in it is not
cooled. The steam is moderately radioactive.

The water will not be cooled if the plan is abandoned. The plant IS
abandoned. The water is not cooled.

Some pools are already boiling, as far as I can tell, from the copious
white steam clouds emitted.

Assume the slowest development of events, that no pools are
breached. (if they are breached and dry, everything will develop a few
days faster).

If the water is not cooled, it will boil off in a week (also as far as
I know).

Then every pool will turn into a white hot pile of burning nuclear
fuel waste rods.

The pile will melt/fall through the steel bottom of the pool, to the
floor of reinforced concrete buildings, where the resulting pile/lake
of white hot material will be evaporating due to extreme temperature,
an analog of burning, but without any need for oxygen.

In any case, if those white hot waste fuel lakes stay on the surface
and do not eat through and submerge through the soil and concrete,
they will be emitting radiation for years, at a high level, and this
will end, likely, when they evaporate almost fully.

That's the bad news -- 1,080 tons of nuclear waste has, more or less,
nowhere else to go other than to the sky.

The good news, is that most of the material will fall in the Pacific
ocean, where it will dissipate. However, if winds do not cooperate,
there is enough of material to render big parts of Japan unlivable for
a long time, due to long half life of most isotopes in said waste.

The other bad news is that the prevailing winds are towards the United
States, going straight to Larry Jacques' backyard. Hopefully, most
stuff will settle down in the ocean.

If this bad scenario materializes, against my hope, then the solutions
will be dirty. One would be to drop large bombs on those buildings, in
order to spread the nuclear waste from the boiling white hot lakes,
over a large area. That would help with its cooling. Pellets spread
over several acres would cool down somewhat. Then, concrete could be
air dropped over the wide area just to encase everything. Concreting
the reactor buildings, pretty much, is impossible due to lack of
access to the inside, and due to the active lakes of spent fuel.

Sounds like the anti-nuke crowd is to blame since they have been
fighting against both a proper safe long term storage facility, as well
as reprocessing of the "spent" fuel.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

These comments are likely the dumbest ones I will read today.

Would you like to store the spent fuel in your backyard?

TMT

John R. Carroll wrote:
Ignoramus32087 wrote:
On 2011-03-16, Larry Jaques wrote:

That's it. We're 3 generations behind in safety because of the
greenies. It's their fault. Reprocessing would have eliminated
about 95% of the waste stream.

I wish that all that could be rationally addressed.

Or even true.
Yucca mountain isn't open for business because the voters went to the
polls and passed a law.
It's unlikely that the entire State is a bunch of wild eyed "Greenies".
They just didn't want to entertain the possibility that their home would
look like Fukushima.
Can they be blamed for that?

Yeah, boy! There are so many earthquakes and tsunamis there!
/sarcasm

Thanks,
Rich

Ignoramus19837 ignoramus19837 NOSPAM.19837.invalid wrote:

They have six reactors. As far as I know, each reactor has 180
tons of spent fuel rods in water pools. The pools are giant
steel bathtubs suspended in the air. Each pool starts boiling if
water in it is not cooled. The steam is moderately radioactive.

The water will not be cooled if the plan is abandoned. The plant
IS abandoned. The water is not cooled.

Sounds like you're reacting to the constant gushing of
misinformation from the one-way media.

The one-way media cries "They are holding back information about
the nuclear meltdown that is destroying all of Japan!"

And their entertainment crazed audience eats that garbage, hook,
line, and sinker.

Yesterday, one of the major news outlets was talking to some
"expert" who said the wind direction out to sea will help prevent
problems. The one-way media jackass replied "That's very bad, if
EVERYTHING depends on the wind direction". Nobody said EVERYTHING
depended on the wind direction, that was just the asshole's way of
blowing what he was told out of proportion.

It is really very silly and sad IMO. Many thousands of people have
died from the quakes and tsunamis, and the one-way media has its
brainwashed masses fixated on the nuclear power issue.

And when it's all over, when things settle down, your brainwashed
little minds will be subtly shifted to the next entertaining story
with no memory of the Japan "nuclear meltdown".
--
















Some pools are already boiling, as far as I can tell, from the copious
white steam clouds emitted.

Assume the slowest development of events, that no pools are
breached. (if they are breached and dry, everything will develop a few
days faster).

If the water is not cooled, it will boil off in a week (also as far as
I know).

Then every pool will turn into a white hot pile of burning nuclear
fuel waste rods.

The pile will melt/fall through the steel bottom of the pool, to the
floor of reinforced concrete buildings, where the resulting pile/lake
of white hot material will be evaporating due to extreme temperature,
an analog of burning, but without any need for oxygen.

In any case, if those white hot waste fuel lakes stay on the surface
and do not eat through and submerge through the soil and concrete,
they will be emitting radiation for years, at a high level, and this
will end, likely, when they evaporate almost fully.

That's the bad news -- 1,080 tons of nuclear waste has, more or less,
nowhere else to go other than to the sky.

The good news, is that most of the material will fall in the Pacific
ocean, where it will dissipate. However, if winds do not cooperate,
there is enough of material to render big parts of Japan unlivable for
a long time, due to long half life of most isotopes in said waste.

The other bad news is that the prevailing winds are towards the United
States, going straight to Larry Jacques' backyard. Hopefully, most
stuff will settle down in the ocean.

If this bad scenario materializes, against my hope, then the solutions
will be dirty. One would be to drop large bombs on those buildings, in
order to spread the nuclear waste from the boiling white hot lakes,
over a large area. That would help with its cooling. Pellets spread
over several acres would cool down somewhat. Then, concrete could be
air dropped over the wide area just to encase everything. Concreting
the reactor buildings, pretty much, is impossible due to lack of
access to the inside, and due to the active lakes of spent fuel.

John R. Carroll wrote:
Tom Gardner wrote:


What do you think of Yucca Mountain?

Unecessary, Tom, at least as designed.
I don't think glassification is part of intended operations.
Yucca Mountain never looked doable to me but not for technical reasons.



FWIW, ditto...

--

Richard Lamb
email me:
web site: http://www.home.earthlink.net/~cavelamb

"Rich Grise" wrote in message
...
John R. Carroll wrote:
Ignoramus32087 wrote:
On 2011-03-16, Larry Jaques wrote:

That's it. We're 3 generations behind in safety because of the
greenies. It's their fault. Reprocessing would have eliminated
about 95% of the waste stream.

I wish that all that could be rationally addressed.

Or even true.
Yucca mountain isn't open for business because the voters went to the
polls and passed a law.
It's unlikely that the entire State is a bunch of wild eyed "Greenies".
They just didn't want to entertain the possibility that their home would
look like Fukushima.
Can they be blamed for that?

Yeah, boy! There are so many earthquakes and tsunamis there!
/sarcasm

Thanks,
Rich


It's also "Sacred Indian Ground"! ...as is all of North America.