On Feb 14, 4:16*pm, "DoN. Nichols" wrote:
Jim Wilkins wrote:
This is the tool post I like best, the Multifix, ...
I found it for $50 while on a treasure hunt for a used Aloris or new
Phase II.

That is a steal! How many tool holders came with it for that
price?
DoN.

Not really enough. It had one boring, one cutoff and two turning
holders with beat-up clamp screws. The tool blocks are bulletproof
chrome-moly so the screws took all the incoming. They are 7mm, not too
easy to find in the US. I put a carefully adjusted threading bit in
the better holder and used the other for everything else.

Oddly the slot is 13/16" high (0.812) instead of an even metric
number. I had to mill down most of my bit holders.

Later I bought one more turning holder from Enco for $100 (ouch!) and
recently a few Chinese ones Tools4cheap special-ordered for me for $50
each, back when I had a paycheck. I haven't seen another second-hand A
size Multifix holder in ~15 years of poking through machinery junk
piles. The few times I looked on Ebay they were only offered in
Europe.

Their only advantage over an Aloris is that they can be rotated to
allow a hand ground HSS bit to both turn and face, without losing
squareness for parting. A bent Armstrong holder does the same thing if
you grind the bit properly.

Jim Wilkins
Multiple posts of this msg possible. Googrou choked on it.

On Sat, 14 Feb 2009 14:40:25 -0800, the infamous "Michael Koblic"
scrawled the following:

Jim Wilkins wrote:
Carriage bolts are easier than hex heads to modify into tee slot
studs . File a washer to almost fit the square and pound it on, trim
it to the slot width and grind the head thinner if necessary.

I got good at that when I discovered that my new drill press t-slots did not
take the common t-nuts. Why do the Chinese like 7/16" so much?

They don't.
I'll give you 10:1 odds they're actually 10mm slots, Mikey.


--
If we all did the things we are capable of doing,
we would literally astound ourselves.
-- Thomas A. Edison

On 2009-02-15, Jim Wilkins wrote:
On Feb 14, 4:16*pm, "DoN. Nichols" wrote:
Jim Wilkins wrote:
This is the tool post I like best, the Multifix, ...
I found it for $50 while on a treasure hunt for a used Aloris or new
Phase II.

That is a steal! How many tool holders came with it for that
price?
DoN.

Not really enough. It had one boring, one cutoff and two turning
holders with beat-up clamp screws. The tool blocks are bulletproof
chrome-moly so the screws took all the incoming. They are 7mm, not too
easy to find in the US. I put a carefully adjusted threading bit in
the better holder and used the other for everything else.

O.K. I presume that you went to MSC or someone else for the
screws and bought a hundred or a gross (whatever they come in) to have
plenty of spares.

Oddly the slot is 13/16" high (0.812) instead of an even metric
number. I had to mill down most of my bit holders.

Hmm ... probably 20 mm plus a little clearance for the burrs
raised by the clamp screws in shanks which are a bit too soft. If they
were made to a precise fit, it could be difficult to get a burred shank
out of the holder. (And the mushrooming of the screw tips comes into
play as well. :-)

Later I bought one more turning holder from Enco for $100 (ouch!) and
recently a few Chinese ones Tools4cheap special-ordered for me for $50
each, back when I had a paycheck.

Yep -- "gainfully unemployed" (retired) doesn't bring in the
same money.

I haven't seen another second-hand A
size Multifix holder in ~15 years of poking through machinery junk
piles. The few times I looked on Ebay they were only offered in
Europe.

A size is for what range of lathe sizes?

Their only advantage over an Aloris is that they can be rotated to
allow a hand ground HSS bit to both turn and face, without losing
squareness for parting.

Also the squareness for threading.

Actually -- they have another advantage to the manufacturer,
they bring in more money than even the genuine Aloris ones. :-)

A bent Armstrong holder does the same thing if
you grind the bit properly.

But you aren't going to fit a bent Armstrong into one of those
holders. :-)

Enjoy,
DoN.

--
Email: | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
(too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
--- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...

"Harold and Susan Vordos" wrote in message
...

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...
snip---

Anyway, I'm not trying to sell the rocker toolpost, because the Aloris
and similar types have more advantages, and they're handier. But I
disagree with those who say the rocker toolpost is hopeless. A lot of
people have just never used one enough to be comfortable with them.

Fact is, it has little to do with comfort. A rocker tool post does not
allow for production machining. They are totally worthless for that
purpose, which is why they are not found in industry.

Well, if you're doing production turning in industry, a recreational
crafts newsgroup may not be the best place to ask about toolposts. d8-)

They are flexible in that you can achieve pretty much any angle of
approach
to the job, but you can't mark dials and make time with them. I would
avoid a rock toolpost at almost any cost, assuming I had intentions of
making more than one of anything.

Harold

I'll remember that the next time I do a production run in my basement.

--
Ed Huntress

My mind goes to a guy building a model live steam loco, or any model, for
that matter, where he may have to produce a fairly substantial number of
identical parts. He can screw around with each part, setting up tools and
measuring every move, or he can use an indexing or quick change post and
make a setup, using a long travel indicator (not having a DRO), marking
dials. The difference in time spent is monumental. It helps preserve
one's sanity when there are a number of parts to be made.

One need not be in business to benefit from not using a rocker tool post
(yeah, rocker. Don't know how I managed to call it a rock tool post. Must
have been my exuberance!)

Harold

On Feb 14, 11:02*pm, "DoN. Nichols" wrote:
On 2009-02-15, Jim Wilkins wrote:
On Feb 14, 4:16 pm, "DoN. Nichols" wrote:
Jim Wilkins wrote:
This is the tool post I like best, the Multifix, ...
I found it for $50 while on a treasure hunt for a used Aloris or new
Phase II.

That is a steal! How many tool holders came with it for that
price?
DoN.

...the screws ... are 7mm, not too easy to find in the US. .

O.K. I presume that you went to MSC or someone else for the
screws and bought a hundred or a gross (whatever they come in) to have
plenty of spares.

I found a small package of them in an auto parts store.

Oddly the slot is 13/16" high (0.812) instead of an even metric
number. I had to mill down most of my bit holders.

Hmm ... probably 20 mm plus a little clearance for the burrs
raised by the clamp screws in shanks which are a bit too soft. ...

On closer examination the size may be an accident of regrinding the
slot cutters. The half-round clearance grooves at the top and bottom
of the slot stop short of tangential on their outer edges. The Chinese
holders have square-cornered slots 20.8mm high.

Later I bought one more Swiss turning holder from Enco for $100 (ouch!) and
recently a few Chinese ones Tools4cheap special-ordered for me for $50
each, back when I had a paycheck.

Yep -- "gainfully unemployed" (retired) doesn't bring in the
same money.

Or require anywhere near the same expenditures. I have time to cook
meals on the wood stove instead of buying and microwaving prepared
ones. As an R&D lab tech or test engineer I was unemployed during
every recession so I've known how to live cheaply but adequately for a
long time and didn't make expensive commitments like car loans or
cable TV during the good times. My father grew up a dirt poor farm boy
in the southern mountains and although he became very successful he
never forgot the Depression or how to live simply off the land. He
could grow okra and peaches in the poor climate and soil of central
NH.

I haven't seen another second-hand A
size Multifix holder in ~15 years of poking through machinery junk
piles. The few times I looked on Ebay they were only offered in
Europe.

A size is for what range of lathe sizes?

Their size designations are roughly similar to Aloris, with a smaller
Aa for mini lathes.
http://www.top-maschinen.de/spannwer...lter/index.htm
The size follows the word that looks like GroBe.

That photo shows two turning holders, one boring and one cutoff, so I
did buy a complete set. They claim change-precise-ish-ness under 0.01
mm which it really does hold if I brush ALL the chips off the locating
splines.

Note "Home", "OK" and "Made in Germany", their language is turning
into Denglisch.
http://www.dw-world.de/dw/article/0,2144,411555,00.html

Actually -- they have another advantage to the manufacturer,
they bring in more money than even the genuine Aloris ones. :-)

Yes, and I don't think they are worth it. The Chinese copy seems OK
but it's still quite expensive. I'm not pushing them, just passing on
what I know. I have used a Dorian toolpost on a CNC lathe and would be
very happy to own one of those instead.


A bent Armstrong holder does the same thing if
you grind the bit properly.

But you aren't going to fit a bent Armstrong into one of those
holders. :-)
DoN.

There is an Armstrong series that is 3/4" high and fits fine. I have
several bent holders that fit, most by J. H. Williams. The cheap Enco
imports aren't too bad. The ones I bought had to be milled on the
bottom to adjust the bit height and then on the top to fit the slot.
Their dog-point screws haven't mushroomed yet.

Jim Wilkins

"Harold and Susan Vordos" wrote in message
...

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...

"Harold and Susan Vordos" wrote in message
...

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...
snip---

Anyway, I'm not trying to sell the rocker toolpost, because the Aloris
and similar types have more advantages, and they're handier. But I
disagree with those who say the rocker toolpost is hopeless. A lot of
people have just never used one enough to be comfortable with them.

Fact is, it has little to do with comfort. A rocker tool post does not
allow for production machining. They are totally worthless for that
purpose, which is why they are not found in industry.

Well, if you're doing production turning in industry, a recreational
crafts newsgroup may not be the best place to ask about toolposts. d8-)

They are flexible in that you can achieve pretty much any angle of
approach
to the job, but you can't mark dials and make time with them. I would
avoid a rock toolpost at almost any cost, assuming I had intentions of
making more than one of anything.

Harold

I'll remember that the next time I do a production run in my basement.

--
Ed Huntress

My mind goes to a guy building a model live steam loco, or any model, for
that matter, where he may have to produce a fairly substantial number of
identical parts. He can screw around with each part, setting up tools
and measuring every move, or he can use an indexing or quick change post
and make a setup, using a long travel indicator (not having a DRO),
marking dials. The difference in time spent is monumental. It helps
preserve one's sanity when there are a number of parts to be made.

One need not be in business to benefit from not using a rocker tool post
(yeah, rocker. Don't know how I managed to call it a rock tool post.
Must have been my exuberance!)

Harold

If you have the old MAP books or other old hobby books on lathe work, you
know that square, four-tool toolholders were a common homemade tooling item
that was fairly popular for just such jobs. I always figured I'd make one if
I ever needed it. But I never did. The largest number of repeat parts I
think I ever made was six special screws for a flange, and I didn't feel any
hardship in setting them up.

Again, as we've discussed many times, the issue is why you're involved in
machining, and what you like about it. Having spent decades visiting shops
and covering the most advanced machining and other metalworking
technologies, I developed a real sense of separation between what was
possible and what I liked doing in my basement. I have no interest at all in
running my basement shop like a half-assed version of a modern commercial
shop. No matter how many machines I stuffed into it, I'd always fall short
of the 25,000-rpm Roku-Roku that I used to market, which would mill H13
heat-treated to maximum hardness, or the 25 hp that powered the
demonstration lathes Sandvik used to show off their wiper inserts. My lathe
would stall dead if I put a wiper insert in it.

So long ago I decided that chasing new technology would be very expensive
madness, a madness that would never be satisfied, and that if I was going to
enjoy metalworking as a hobby it would be in developing the skills that were
used, say, 70 years ago to make amazing things with simple machines and
basic tools. I love my toolmaker's buttons. I enjoy making expanding laps.
Learning to file well, and making a filing guide for filing the heads of
capscews on my lathe, was a pleasure. I acquired a small bunch of digital
measuring instruments when Mitutoyo was my client, but I hardly use them. I
prefer keeping up my skills with spring calipers and manual mikes. Never
shall CNC cross my threshold.

And I'll keep my rocker toolpost. d8-) I have about a dozen Armstrong
toolholders and five lifetimes' supply of tool bits, and I enjoy using them.
An Aloris would be nice, but it would remind me of dreary hours spent making
batches of parts in the job shop of which I was once part owner. This is a
hobby to me, and the fun is in the doing. And for years, if I needed, say, a
perfectly square block of hardened steel, I could take it to work and run it
on our $500,000 Wasino Wing Ace. Two-millionths accuracy in minutes is a
different world from what I do for relaxation and fun.

--
Ed Huntress

On Feb 15, 4:25*am, "Harold and Susan Vordos" wrote:
"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
"Harold and Susan Vordos" wrote in message
Fact is, it has little to do with comfort. *A rocker tool post does not
allow for production machining....
Harold

Something like this wouldn't be too hard to make on a milling machine:
http://www.rdgtools.co.uk/acatalog/42906.jpg

It doesn't need the rocker if you make it for a specific lathe and
tool bit. You could use an X-Y table for the slides and fit the block
to the tee slot, aligning it with a stop or the end of the slot to
swap tools with some reasonable repeatability.

Jim Wilkins

On 2009-02-15, Jim Wilkins wrote:
On Feb 14, 11:02*pm, "DoN. Nichols" wrote:
On 2009-02-15, Jim Wilkins wrote:

[ ... ]

O.K. I presume that you went to MSC or someone else for the
screws and bought a hundred or a gross (whatever they come in) to have
plenty of spares.

I found a small package of them in an auto parts store.

O.K. Generally, if I need more than about two or three, I find
it worthwhile to order the standard box size from MSC -- for perhaps
double what Home Despot would ask for the three. :-)

Oddly the slot is 13/16" high (0.812) instead of an even metric
number. I had to mill down most of my bit holders.

Hmm ... probably 20 mm plus a little clearance for the burrs
raised by the clamp screws in shanks which are a bit too soft. ...

On closer examination the size may be an accident of regrinding the
slot cutters. The half-round clearance grooves at the top and bottom
of the slot stop short of tangential on their outer edges. The Chinese
holders have square-cornered slots 20.8mm high.

O.K. Hmm ... a half-round at the *top*? What for? Normally
round tools are held against the bottom groove by the screws, and the
top does not matter -- unless this is allowing a slightly larger round
shank to fit.

Hmm ... looking at the web site photos, I see that the current
ones for round shanks are full V bottom, with the top at an angle
matching the corresponding slope of the bottom V.

Later I bought one more Swiss turning holder from Enco for $100 (ouch!) and
recently a few Chinese ones Tools4cheap special-ordered for me for $50
each, back when I had a paycheck.

Yep -- "gainfully unemployed" (retired) doesn't bring in the
same money.

Or require anywhere near the same expenditures. I have time to cook
meals on the wood stove instead of buying and microwaving prepared
ones. As an R&D lab tech or test engineer I was unemployed during
every recession so I've known how to live cheaply but adequately for a
long time and didn't make expensive commitments like car loans or
cable TV during the good times. My father grew up a dirt poor farm boy
in the southern mountains and although he became very successful he
never forgot the Depression or how to live simply off the land. He
could grow okra and peaches in the poor climate and soil of central
NH.

Okra? In N.H.? The Velcro of the vegetable world? I remember
my grandparents growing it in South Texas, but nothing even up here.
And I usually associate it with Cajun cooking.

I haven't seen another second-hand A
size Multifix holder in ~15 years of poking through machinery junk
piles. The few times I looked on Ebay they were only offered in
Europe.

A size is for what range of lathe sizes?

Their size designations are roughly similar to Aloris, with a smaller
Aa for mini lathes.
http://www.top-maschinen.de/spannwer...lter/index.htm
The size follows the word that looks like GroBe.

O.K. Große (Grosse is I believe a valid alternate spelling), so
that would certainly map to "size".

That photo shows two turning holders, one boring and one cutoff, so I
did buy a complete set. They claim change-precise-ish-ness under 0.01
mm which it really does hold if I brush ALL the chips off the locating
splines.

Always the problem. The Aloris style can be pretty self-wiping
as long as you have the wedge style, and hold the front edge in contact
as you slide it on. Chips on the wedge side don't affect the indexing,
though it certainly would with the piston style. :-)

Note "Home", "OK" and "Made in Germany", their language is turning
into Denglisch.

http://www.dw-world.de/dw/article/0,2144,411555,00.html

Also note "System MultiFix" and "MultiFix-Systems"

I also wonder about the "Preis:" and "Netto:" entries on the
individual size's pages. Hmm ... and "Secure Protocol", and an "OK"
button when you have filled out a search term.

For that matter -- the name of the vendor "top-maschinen.de"

Actually -- they have another advantage to the manufacturer,
they bring in more money than even the genuine Aloris ones. :-)

Yes, and I don't think they are worth it. The Chinese copy seems OK
but it's still quite expensive. I'm not pushing them, just passing on
what I know. I have used a Dorian toolpost on a CNC lathe and would be
very happy to own one of those instead.

O.K. That means that the Aloris should be as good. And I know
that I simply have extra tool holders with inserts at different angles,
instead of rotating the toolpost to get a specific angle. (That makes
parting and threading easier, because I *know* that the toolpost is
square.


A bent Armstrong holder does the same thing if
you grind the bit properly.

But you aren't going to fit a bent Armstrong into one of those
holders. :-)
DoN.

There is an Armstrong series that is 3/4" high and fits fine.

What size bits does it use? 3/16"? 1/8"?

I have
several bent holders that fit, most by J. H. Williams. The cheap Enco
imports aren't too bad. The ones I bought had to be milled on the
bottom to adjust the bit height and then on the top to fit the slot.
Their dog-point screws haven't mushroomed yet.

O.K.

Enjoy,
DoN.

--
Email: | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
(too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
--- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

Jim Wilkins wrote:
On Feb 14, 3:54 pm, "DoN. Nichols" wrote:
On 2009-02-14, Michael Koblic wrote:
"DoN. Nichols" wrote in message

Of course -- there are also pie wedge soft jaws, which form
an nearly complete circle when the chuck jaws are at the tightest
setting, and those can be turned for your workpieces. You can even
turn several diameters working as steps from shallow at the OD to
deep at the ID, so progressively smaller discs can be gripped.

Pie jaws:
http://picasaweb.google.com/KB1DAL/T...90941151914594
That chuck opens and closes only about 0.050" total, so the jaw steps
have to be quite close to the size of the work. It's nice for lens
rings etc but not for general work. The internal mechanism is slanted
bar cams as shown in an early Holtzapffel drawing.

Worth a 1000 words. Very nice. Maybe down the road. Right now it is outside
the realm of the superglue-and-doublesided-sticky-tape technology in
operation here.

Your 3-jaw shims can be rings cut from plywood or discarded plates
with a scroll saw.

I was thinking bits of washers cut into three pie wedges.

I make pulley and other wheels on a plywood-covered faceplate. First I
drill a small center hole for a locating & centering pin. Then I
attach the blank to the plywood with screws in the waste areas and
turn the friction-reducing recess between the rim and the hub on both
sides, using the pin to recenter the blank. This is equivalent to you
facing both sides, BEFORE turning the OD and ID.

This is the plan for the face-plate and the holding plug. I found that
unless you actually finish them on some sort of lathe they never turn
concentrically, however nice the work appears to be when you cut them with a
router.

If you want a bevel around the inner hole you could cut a shallow
recess where the hole will be and bevel its edge, leaving the center
to support the disk.

Next space the disk out from the plywood with collars on the screws,
in your case probably the inner ones, and turn the OD.

In my case I let the piece overlap the face-plate by a little. That way (at
least in the improvised conditions) I was able to do the face and OD without
changing clamping arrangement.

Add a ring of screws and collars around the OD, with washers under the
heads to spread the grip and protect the finish. Cut the center loose
by wiggling the bit sideways slightly for clearance as you run it
toward the headstock. This should work on the OD as well, with the
benefit that the outer screws support the blank better. The bit I use
for this plunge cut is rounded on the end with parallel sides, both
relieved to cut. I use it for the cable groove too.

Or reverse it, bore the center first and clamp the disk to the plywood
with a plate larger than the hole and again the spacers on the screws
to support the disk. This way will be harder to assemble but safer.

The best way might be to attach a temporary wooden block to the center
and turn it to fit the bored ID snugly, then screw another clamping
plate over it to sandwich the disk. Then the disk could slip without
causing a problem when you turn the OD. The lathe's tailstock does a
fair job of clamping the outer plate.

That is the current arrangement with a slight modification: The centre
wooden block is slightly tapered and is screwed down onto the shaft by a
screw and a big washer. with everything tight there has been no slippage so
far. I hope for even better result when
a) the face plate is running true
b) the centre block is turned more accurately
c) The whole assembly will be held on the 1"-8 tpi spindle with a single nut

I hope I can get the taper right so I can sneak right up to the central
block when facing (it seems possible even with rather awkward "tools". The
finish the ID on my mill using the boring bar sideways. That is the theory,
anyway.

Use brass or soft steel screws, NOT sheetrock screws which are
hardened.

You could make clamps out of small short bars drilled through the
center for the clamp screw and tapped through the outer end for a
stand-off screw to make them sit flat on the disk. Be careful, they
grab clothing.

The spacer collars are easier to mill than turn to identical length.
They don't have to be cylindrical, cross-drilled bar stock is fine.

My lathe will take collets and a faceplate simultaneously, so I center
the blank with the locating pin in a collet and then attach it to the
faceplate. Unscrewing the faceplate pops out the collet adapter.

Either way, this is going all in my library for future reference. Thanks.

Hals und beinbruch,

I nearly did. But Gott sei dank, so far so good.
Dreimal Hoch!

--
Michael Koblic,
Campbell River, BC

DoN. Nichols wrote:
big snip

I also wonder about the "Preis:" and "Netto:" entries on the
individual size's pages. Hmm ... and "Secure Protocol", and an "OK"
button when you have filled out a search term.

Preis is price including Mehrwetsteuer (Value-added tax). Netto is the price
without. Pretty sure I interpret it right.

But is it not better calling it "Schnellwechsel-Stahlhalter "? Quick-change
toolpost is so...umstandlich! :-)

--
Michael Koblic,
Campbell River, BC

Larry Jaques wrote:

I got good at that when I discovered that my new drill press t-slots
did not take the common t-nuts. Why do the Chinese like 7/16" so
much?

They don't.
I'll give you 10:1 odds they're actually 10mm slots, Mikey.

I would not take your bet because you are right, of course. However, should
one choose to be ornery and demand an independent judgement it would be
difficult to prove by simple measurmement: The T-slots on my drill press
table were milled by a small child using a specially trained gerbil. It is a
matter of not-so-joyful anticipation to see where the t-nut will stick in
the slot. A 10-mm nut!

--
Michael Koblic,
Campbell River, BC

On Feb 15, 5:34*pm, "DoN. Nichols" wrote:
On 2009-02-15, Jim Wilkins wrote:
On Feb 14, 11:02 pm, "DoN. Nichols" wrote:
On 2009-02-15, Jim Wilkins wrote:

[ ... ]
O.K. Generally, if I need more than about two or three, I find
it worthwhile to order the standard box size from MSC -- for perhaps
double what Home Despot would ask for the three. :-)

I've cleaned up so many labs and tossed the used hardware in a box
rather than the trash that I rarely need to buy any.
http://picasaweb.google.com/KB1DAL/H...65927027495682
The first place I worked had a rule that hardware NEVER went back into
the bins so that no damaged screws would ship in the product.
I have far too much to sort completely and I've found that binning by
thread size and material is enough. There's one drawer for 1/4-20,
another for 1/4-28 and a third for stainless + brass + aluminum. When
I need some I dump the drawer in a tray to spread them out, pick out
one with a ruler and the rest by matching the first.

O.K. Hmm ... a half-round at the *top*? What for? Normally
round tools are held against the bottom groove by the screws, and the
top does not matter -- unless this is allowing a slightly larger round
shank to fit.
Hmm ... looking at the web site photos, I see that the current
ones for round shanks are full V bottom, with the top at an angle
matching the corresponding slope of the bottom V.

Those small half-round grooves are in the vertical wall of the Swiss
turning holder slot for inside corner clearance, like the groove at
the bottom of a vee block. The flat sides of the cutters formed the
top and bottom of the slot. The truncated shape of the half-round
suggests that the sides of the cutters were resharpened, making the
slot smaller.

Okra? In N.H.? The Velcro of the vegetable world? I remember
my grandparents growing it in South Texas, but nothing even up here.
And I usually associate it with Cajun cooking.

He coated sliced okra with corn meal and fried it, and it was
delicious. I can't make the corn meal stay on, and know enough about
benzpyrenes that I don't fry as hot as he did. Mine's edible, maybe.

O.K. Große (Grosse is I believe a valid alternate spelling), so
that would certainly map to "size".
Note "Home", "OK" and "Made in Germany", their language is turning
into Denglisch.
http://www.dw-world.de/dw/article/0,2144,411555,00.html
Also note "System MultiFix" and "MultiFix-Systems"
I also wonder about the "Preis:" and "Netto:" entries on the
individual size's pages. Hmm ... and "Secure Protocol", and an "OK"
button when you have filled out a search term.
For that matter -- the name of the vendor "top-maschinen.de"

MultiFix is Swiss, another confederation of several languages. They
speak their own versions of French, German and something resembling
Italian.

The Daimler HighTechReport I subscribe to in German is a great example
of English creeping in.
http://www.daimler.com/dccom/0-5-114...0-0-0-0-0.html
For the third block down, the magazine explains "jam" with a piece on
Minton's Playhouse in 1940s Harlem.

The Saxons in "Anglo-Saxon" were north Germans whom the Britons
stupidly hired as mercenaries to fight off the Picts (Scots) after
Rome pulled out to concentrate on the Goths and Huns. The Saxons
viewed the Brits as sheeple and soon they and their allies were a
bigger problem than the Picts. King Arthur apparently made his name by
defeating them at Badon Hill, but eventually the Saxons forced the
Britons/Celts to retreat into Wales and Ireland and became the English
(Anglisch). Farmer and peasant Olde English developed partly from
Saxon German and the educated words came from French with the Norman
Conquest. Legal phrases may still use both, as in Last Will and
Testament. So similar words could have passed either way, or entered
both languages from French, Latin or Greek. Many of the words for farm
animals etc are still very close in sound if not spelling, like kuh =
cow, hund = hound, katz = cat, maus = mouse, fuchs = fox.

A bent Armstrong holder does the same thing if
you grind the bit properly.
But you aren't going to fit a bent Armstrong into one of those
holders. :-)
DoN.
There is an Armstrong series that is 3/4" high and fits fine.
What size bits does it use? 3/16"? 1/8"?

I have one 3/16" Armstrong and three 1/4" J. H. Williams No.0, right,
straight and left. The 1/4" bits will survive a cut deep enough to
stall the lathe as long as they don't extend any more than necessary
from the holder.

Jim Wilkins

On Sun, 15 Feb 2009 17:13:03 -0800, the infamous "Michael Koblic"
scrawled the following:

Larry Jaques wrote:

I got good at that when I discovered that my new drill press t-slots
did not take the common t-nuts. Why do the Chinese like 7/16" so
much?

They don't.
I'll give you 10:1 odds they're actually 10mm slots, Mikey.

I would not take your bet because you are right, of course.

....even though I don't own a mill, let alone a metrical one.


However, should
one choose to be ornery and demand an independent judgement it would be
difficult to prove by simple measurmement: The T-slots on my drill press
table were milled by a small child using a specially trained gerbil.

What? Technology has improved. I thought the Indians had kids using
twigs and sand to precision grind those nice t-slots.


It is a
matter of not-so-joyful anticipation to see where the t-nut will stick in
the slot. A 10-mm nut!

Braze a pair of nuts together (flat to flat) to keep 'em from canting
in the slot, whydoncha? You'll have happy-happy joy-joy after that!

--
I'm still waiting for another sublime, transcendent flash of adequacy.
--Winnie of RCM

On 2009-02-16, Jim Wilkins wrote:
On Feb 15, 5:34*pm, "DoN. Nichols" wrote:

[ ... ]

O.K. Generally, if I need more than about two or three, I find
it worthwhile to order the standard box size from MSC -- for perhaps
double what Home Despot would ask for the three. :-)

I've cleaned up so many labs and tossed the used hardware in a box
rather than the trash that I rarely need to buy any.
http://picasaweb.google.com/KB1DAL/H...65927027495682
The first place I worked had a rule that hardware NEVER went back into
the bins so that no damaged screws would ship in the product.

Very good practice. Unfortunately, when I was at Melpar, we had
to toss them in the trash. We weren't allowed to "rescue" them for
home use.

I have far too much to sort completely and I've found that binning by
thread size and material is enough. There's one drawer for 1/4-20,
another for 1/4-28 and a third for stainless + brass + aluminum. When
I need some I dump the drawer in a tray to spread them out, pick out
one with a ruler and the rest by matching the first.

Sure -- that makes sense. The ones which I have bought full
boxes of each get their own plastic drawer, of course, because there are
enough to make it worthwhile.

O.K. Hmm ... a half-round at the *top*? What for? Normally
round tools are held against the bottom groove by the screws, and the
top does not matter -- unless this is allowing a slightly larger round
shank to fit.
Hmm ... looking at the web site photos, I see that the current
ones for round shanks are full V bottom, with the top at an angle
matching the corresponding slope of the bottom V.

Those small half-round grooves are in the vertical wall of the Swiss
turning holder slot for inside corner clearance, like the groove at
the bottom of a vee block. The flat sides of the cutters formed the
top and bottom of the slot.

O.K. That is not obvious from the photos on the web site.

The truncated shape of the half-round
suggests that the sides of the cutters were resharpened, making the
slot smaller.

Okra? In N.H.? The Velcro of the vegetable world? I remember
my grandparents growing it in South Texas, but nothing even up here.
And I usually associate it with Cajun cooking.

He coated sliced okra with corn meal and fried it, and it was
delicious. I can't make the corn meal stay on, and know enough about
benzpyrenes that I don't fry as hot as he did. Mine's edible, maybe.

O.K. My own experience with cooked okra was slimy, and it never
got past that rejection as a kid. :-)

[ ... ]

Also note "System MultiFix" and "MultiFix-Systems"
I also wonder about the "Preis:" and "Netto:" entries on the
individual size's pages. Hmm ... and "Secure Protocol", and an "OK"
button when you have filled out a search term.
For that matter -- the name of the vendor "top-maschinen.de"

MultiFix is Swiss,

What about the "System" part? That sounds like plain English.

another confederation of several languages. They
speak their own versions of French, German and something resembling
Italian.

Hmm ... not *closely* resembling Italian -- like perhaps me
trying to speak to an Italian from my base of Spanish? :-)

The Daimler HighTechReport I subscribe to in German is a great example
of English creeping in.
http://www.daimler.com/dccom/0-5-114...0-0-0-0-0.html
For the third block down, the magazine explains "jam" with a piece on
Minton's Playhouse in 1940s Harlem.

:-)

Lots of examples there all right.

The Saxons in "Anglo-Saxon" were north Germans whom the Britons
stupidly hired as mercenaries to fight off the Picts (Scots) after
Rome pulled out to concentrate on the Goths and Huns. The Saxons
viewed the Brits as sheeple and soon they and their allies were a
bigger problem than the Picts.

Isn't that always the problem with hiring mercenaries? :-)

King Arthur apparently made his name by
defeating them at Badon Hill, but eventually the Saxons forced the
Britons/Celts to retreat into Wales and Ireland and became the English
(Anglisch). Farmer and peasant Olde English developed partly from
Saxon German and the educated words came from French with the Norman
Conquest. Legal phrases may still use both, as in Last Will and
Testament. So similar words could have passed either way, or entered
both languages from French, Latin or Greek. Many of the words for farm
animals etc are still very close in sound if not spelling, like kuh =
cow, hund = hound, katz = cat, maus = mouse, fuchs = fox.

Agreed.

A bent Armstrong holder does the same thing if
you grind the bit properly.
But you aren't going to fit a bent Armstrong into one of those
holders. :-)
DoN.
There is an Armstrong series that is 3/4" high and fits fine.
What size bits does it use? 3/16"? 1/8"?

I have one 3/16" Armstrong and three 1/4" J. H. Williams No.0, right,
straight and left. The 1/4" bits will survive a cut deep enough to
stall the lathe as long as they don't extend any more than necessary
from the holder.

O.K. A friend has a set of 3/16" holders and the rocker
toolpost, and refuses to learn how to grind toolbits, refuses to
consider a quick-change toolpost, or even a block or a simple turret
toolpost, and wants to get brazed carbide tooling (which he can find in
1/4" shanks, but not 3/16"), and grind them down to 3/16" on my surface
grinder. I'm going to leave *him* cranking it, not me. :-)

The lathe is an old Atlas 6x18" one. I've got one of those too,
but well retired. If I were still using it, I would be after some
quick-change system for it. Perhaps even one of the little aluminum
based styles would be sufficient given its rigidity. :-)

Enjoy,
DoN.

--
Email: | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
(too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
--- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

"DoN. Nichols" wrote in message
...
On 2009-02-16, Jim Wilkins wrote:

snip


He coated sliced okra with corn meal and fried it, and it was
delicious. I can't make the corn meal stay on, and know enough about
benzpyrenes that I don't fry as hot as he did. Mine's edible, maybe.

O.K. My own experience with cooked okra was slimy, and it never
got past that rejection as a kid. :-)

They were very popular where I grew up. We kids called them "snot pods."
d8-)

--
Ed Huntress