At this point I am moving 4 little pieces of paper around on top of another
sheet of paper with squares drawn on it.

The floor is about 12'x22'. Footprints for the four things a

Car 13'x6'
Lathe 3 1/2' x 5 1/2'
Mill 3' x 4'
Drill 2'x2'

What sort of space should there be between the various tools so I can do
work without having to remember exactly where I am all the time?

Are there any real advantages to having access to all sides of the lathe -
this asked because right now the bench is by itself in the middle of a floor
and it's kind of nice to be able to walk around it.

"jtaylor" wrote in message
...
At this point I am moving 4 little pieces of paper around on top of
another
sheet of paper with squares drawn on it.

The floor is about 12'x22'. Footprints for the four things a

Car 13'x6'
Lathe 3 1/2' x 5 1/2'
Mill 3' x 4'
Drill 2'x2'

What sort of space should there be between the various tools so I can do
work without having to remember exactly where I am all the time?

Are there any real advantages to having access to all sides of the lathe -
this asked because right now the bench is by itself in the middle of a
floor
and it's kind of nice to be able to walk around it.

Ahh... A problem unfortunately near to my heart. I have a one car garage
with a floor 11' wide and 17' long into which I need to fit a lathe, mill,
welder, tools, etc.. and a small project car. The foundation leans back a
bit so I have a bit more width and length about 2' up from the floor. I
went through the same exercise with the paper cut outs. Your larger lathe
and mill operating envelope may offer constraints that I didn't face, but
this is what I did.

I have the lathe (a SB 11" which isn't as deep as yours) running along the
left side of the garage with the tailstock in the left rear corner. I
haven't missed not being able to get to all sides of the lathe. I have the
mill (small Gorton 8D) on a 18" pedestal backed in to the right rear corner.
I can't get to the back of the mill but this hasn't been a problem.

I have a bench in between the mill and the lathe. I used to have this bench
set up to fold up against the wall so that I could fit a full size car in
the garage, but no longer. I'm going to install a folding bench on one side
of the garage. I have a small benchtop DP which is stored on a shelf, but
if I get a bigger one, it'll go in the right front corner. Welding stuff on
the right wall, grinding and sanding stuff in the left front. I've built
shelves to hold as much as a I can. Getting stuff off the floor is a big
help when one doesn't have much floor to work with - my compressor is up
high, as are the small welders.

I apologize if this is more info than you wanted. I'm fairly amazed at the
amount of stuff I've been able to cram into the garage and I guess this was
an opportunity to talk about it. We're remodeling our kitchen in a month
and then I'm taking out the garage shelves and replacing them with the
kitchen cabinets. Oh boy!

Peter

Doing a layout is helpful, but not as helpful as trying a layout for a year
and thinking about what worked and what didn't. Here are some tips:

1. Don't put the headstock of your lathe against a wall. If an end has to go
into a wall, let it be the tailstock end, set just far enough out from the
wall so you can get the tailstock off. That way you can get at the headstock,
put long things through the spindle, etc.

2. You may have to handle longish pieces of stock. Think about if you get
a piece of stock eight feet long, how you would bring it in and manipulate
it so you can cut it down.

3. The mill throws chips when you're flycutting. These don't work well on
car finishes. Think about hanging a curtain or something around your mill.

4. Things can be pretty close to a drill press, but a mill has to be able
to move the table all the way around. Bridgeport recommends a 7x7' footprint
for their mills.

You didn't mention a bench! Where are you going to mount your grinder? How
about your toolboxes? Air compressor? Extension cords? Lighting? Storage?

Think specific questions, like "Where will I keep my pipe wrench?" or "Where
will I keep my thread file?" or "How hard will it be to fill a tire?" Only
you know what you'll be doing.

Good luck, and be patient!

Grant Erwin


jtaylor wrote:
At this point I am moving 4 little pieces of paper around on top of another
sheet of paper with squares drawn on it.

The floor is about 12'x22'. Footprints for the four things a

Car 13'x6'
Lathe 3 1/2' x 5 1/2'
Mill 3' x 4'
Drill 2'x2'

What sort of space should there be between the various tools so I can do
work without having to remember exactly where I am all the time?

Are there any real advantages to having access to all sides of the lathe -
this asked because right now the bench is by itself in the middle of a floor
and it's kind of nice to be able to walk around it.

"Peter Grey" wrote in message
link.net...

"jtaylor" wrote in message
...
At this point I am moving 4 little pieces of paper around on top of
another
sheet of paper with squares drawn on it.


I forgot to add that my piece of paper for the mill included space for X and
Y axis table travel.

Peter

I predict that the car will have to go. You may THINK you have enough
room now but wait 'till you add the roll around tool cabinet, surface
plate/layout bench and assembly bench. Oh, and don't forget that ton or
two of real interesting drop and scraps you will soon pick up. :-)

OTOH, I have an artist friend in NYC, lower East side who built a pretty
nice shop in a 6'X14' closet. But he is a 6'4" anal retentive, who
weighs maybe 140 soaking wet and enjoys getting very intimate with hot
chips. :-)

jtaylor wrote:

At this point I am moving 4 little pieces of paper around on top of another
sheet of paper with squares drawn on it.

The floor is about 12'x22'. Footprints for the four things a

Car 13'x6'
Lathe 3 1/2' x 5 1/2'
Mill 3' x 4'
Drill 2'x2'

What sort of space should there be between the various tools so I can do
work without having to remember exactly where I am all the time?

Are there any real advantages to having access to all sides of the lathe -
this asked because right now the bench is by itself in the middle of a floor
and it's kind of nice to be able to walk around it.



--
Glenn Ashmore

I'm building a 45' cutter in strip/composite. Watch my progress (or lack
there of) at: http://www.rutuonline.com
Shameless Commercial Division: http://www.spade-anchor-us.com

In article ,
jtaylor wrote:
At this point I am moving 4 little pieces of paper around on top of another
sheet of paper with squares drawn on it.

The floor is about 12'x22'. Footprints for the four things a

Car 13'x6'
Lathe 3 1/2' x 5 1/2'
Mill 3' x 4'
Drill 2'x2'

What sort of space should there be between the various tools so I can do
work without having to remember exactly where I am all the time?

Remember to allow for the full travel of the mill table, plus
access to the cranks at each end.

Lots of extra open space to the left and right of the drill
press, to allow drilling in long stock.

The car can be moved out at need -- and will probably eventually
stay outdoors (as ours does), to make more room for machine tools. :-)
Perhaps build a stand-alone carport to shelter it. Besides -- you don't
want to bring a soaking wet car in out of the rain to generate humidity
to condense on the machine tools' ways.

Are there any real advantages to having access to all sides of the lathe -
this asked because right now the bench is by itself in the middle of a floor
and it's kind of nice to be able to walk around it.

Almost all sides.

1) The operator side -- obviously.

2) The headstock end, for changing to the Metric change gear set
at need.

Also -- lots of extra room at this end for feeding long bar
stock through the spindle, and providing an anti-whip support
for the bar stock to keep things from getting really dangerous.

I have to duck under the anti-whip tube when I need to leave
the shop while doing through-the-spindle work.

3) The back side -- to install and remove the taper turning
attachment at need, and for installing the senders for a DRO.

4) As for the tailstock end, I have a heavy-duty purpose-built
table there to hold the bed turret when I'm using a tailstock
instead. It is just high enough so I can slide the bed turret
(loaded with tools) onto the end of the bed, without having to
strip it and lift it in stages. The tailstock is easy to lift,
by comparison.

Enjoy,
DoN.

--
Email: | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
(too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
--- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

Yep - in our starter house many years ago, the car was in the shop one day. After that,
it was a shop and laundry room.

Since then, and three more houses - the car/truck has always been outside.

We unload the truck and walk through the shop to the kitchen door but that is about it. :-)

Martin

Glenn Ashmore wrote:

I predict that the car will have to go. You may THINK you have enough
room now but wait 'till you add the roll around tool cabinet, surface
plate/layout bench and assembly bench. Oh, and don't forget that ton or
two of real interesting drop and scraps you will soon pick up. :-)

OTOH, I have an artist friend in NYC, lower East side who built a pretty
nice shop in a 6'X14' closet. But he is a 6'4" anal retentive, who
weighs maybe 140 soaking wet and enjoys getting very intimate with hot
chips. :-)

jtaylor wrote:

At this point I am moving 4 little pieces of paper around on top of
another
sheet of paper with squares drawn on it.

The floor is about 12'x22'. Footprints for the four things a

Car 13'x6'
Lathe 3 1/2' x 5 1/2'
Mill 3' x 4'
Drill 2'x2'

What sort of space should there be between the various tools so I can do
work without having to remember exactly where I am all the time?

Are there any real advantages to having access to all sides of the
lathe -
this asked because right now the bench is by itself in the middle of a
floor
and it's kind of nice to be able to walk around it.





--
Martin Eastburn, Barbara Eastburn
@ home at Lion's Lair with our computer
NRA LOH, NRA Life
NRA Second Amendment Task Force Charter Founder

"Glenn Ashmore" wrote in message
news:xYKyc.507$3W3.396@lakeread04...
I predict that the car will have to go. You may THINK you have enough
room now but wait 'till you add the roll around tool cabinet, surface
plate/layout bench and assembly bench. Oh, and don't forget that ton or
two of real interesting drop and scraps you will soon pick up. :-)

OTOH, I have an artist friend in NYC, lower East side who built a pretty
nice shop in a 6'X14' closet. But he is a 6'4" anal retentive, who
weighs maybe 140 soaking wet and enjoys getting very intimate with hot
chips. :-)


My "shop" is 42 by 64 INCHES! I've got 3 benchtop drill presses, a micromark
7x14 lathe, bench grinder, buffer, belt/disk sander, and a surprising amount
of storage. The trick for me was to attach the benches to the walls so I
can sit down while working, and put lots of shelves and storage bins on the
walls. I also made a table that folds down from the wall, when i need to
grind, buff, or sand I just grab the appropriate machine from under the D.P.
table and bolt it down (wingnuts are awesome)

This only works for me because the maximum size of the work I do is about 1"
dia X 1 1/2" long (jewelry)
I do have to borrow a friend's bandsaw (and shop) to cut down stock before I
bring it home.

BTW, I'm 6'1, 210 lbs, and I fit in the shop too!

-Gene

In article xYKyc.507$3W3.396@lakeread04, Glenn Ashmore says...

OTOH, I have an artist friend in NYC, lower East side who built a pretty
nice shop in a 6'X14' closet.

On the lower east side, a six by fourteen foot space is called
a 'huge room,' not a closet. I myself at one time installed
a pratt and whitney speed lathe, and a vise on a special
built workbench, inside a closet that was three feet by eight
feet.

When you only have a tiny bit of space, you make the most
of it.

Jim

==================================================
please reply to:
JRR(zero) at yktvmv (dot) vnet (dot) ibm (dot) com
==================================================

One of the things have found when you use certain swarf-making
behemoths is that you should have far more room beside/behind them
than you THINK you need. When you try to clean up after yourself it
can be a problem.

The only other solution to having 2 machines next to each other and
not throwing swarf ALL over the place is to hang visquene from the
ceiling down to the floor so it acts as a wall/deflector and keeps the
stuff within a confined space. Plus it's flxible and you can move
around it easily.

The other problem is if you have a cat who picks up the longer swarf
pieces and carries them all over the house (my shop is in the basement
and kitty has free run of the place) (at least I don't have a wife
nagging me about it) But then, there's this machinist-gunsmith woman
on another list I wish I could meet up with....

On Sat, 12 Jun 2004 13:10:55 -0300, "jtaylor"
wrote:

At this point I am moving 4 little pieces of paper around on top of another
sheet of paper with squares drawn on it.

The floor is about 12'x22'. Footprints for the four things a

Car 13'x6'
Lathe 3 1/2' x 5 1/2'
Mill 3' x 4'
Drill 2'x2'

What sort of space should there be between the various tools so I can do
work without having to remember exactly where I am all the time?

Are there any real advantages to having access to all sides of the lathe -
this asked because right now the bench is by itself in the middle of a floor
and it's kind of nice to be able to walk around it.

Oh, forgot to mention If you have room to do a layout in the atual
place that is going tobe your shop, get some cardboard or paper and
cut out general shapes and sizes and lay them on the floor to give you
a life-size layout that you can relate to. I did this in the proposed
kitchen and laundry when I was building my new house. it worked out
great.


On Sat, 12 Jun 2004 13:10:55 -0300, "jtaylor"
wrote:

At this point I am moving 4 little pieces of paper around on top of another
sheet of paper with squares drawn on it.

The floor is about 12'x22'. Footprints for the four things a

Car 13'x6'
Lathe 3 1/2' x 5 1/2'
Mill 3' x 4'
Drill 2'x2'

What sort of space should there be between the various tools so I can do
work without having to remember exactly where I am all the time?

Are there any real advantages to having access to all sides of the lathe -
this asked because right now the bench is by itself in the middle of a floor
and it's kind of nice to be able to walk around it.

I allow 24" behind my 11X40 Sheldon. I am glad I did because I have to go back
there often, to clean up, adjust the gibs, and dismantle my taper attatchment.
Even with 24" it's tight for a 6' 230# no longer young adult to get some jobs
done. I suspect the car needs to be outside from the get-go, if for no other
reason than it's own protection from oil and swarf. I have a 4X8 wood table in
the middle of my shop and have acess to all four sides. Grinders are against
one wall, 1x42 belt sander, a 6" vice and my doubled ended tool grinder reside
on the table. I also keep several carpet samples for working off of when the
hard surface is a problem. My mill throws chips everywhere so anything close by
has to be movable for cleanup

I just finished the same exercise for a 13X19 garage with an old 911, a
mill, lathe, mini-mill, shop press, drill press, bandsaw, mig welding,
oxy/act welder, floor jacks, workbench, tools chest, etc..

Everyone so far has great suggestions so I'll just add one more. Casters.

EVERYTHING in the shop is either already easily moveable or now has casters
(heavy stuff like the mill has a custom base with leveling bolts that have
to be lowered quite a bit before the casters touch the ground) Being able
to move things around, even if it's just once in a while will make all the
difference....

FWIW.


"jtaylor" wrote in message
...
At this point I am moving 4 little pieces of paper around on top of
another
sheet of paper with squares drawn on it.

The floor is about 12'x22'. Footprints for the four things a

Car 13'x6'
Lathe 3 1/2' x 5 1/2'
Mill 3' x 4'
Drill 2'x2'

What sort of space should there be between the various tools so I can do
work without having to remember exactly where I am all the time?

Are there any real advantages to having access to all sides of the lathe -
this asked because right now the bench is by itself in the middle of a
floor
and it's kind of nice to be able to walk around it.

(DoN. Nichols) writes:

The car can be moved out at need -- and will probably eventually
stay outdoors (as ours does), to make more room for machine tools. :-)
Perhaps build a stand-alone carport to shelter it. Besides -- you don't
want to bring a soaking wet car in out of the rain to generate humidity
to condense on the machine tools' ways.

On the other hand, maybe the trunk of the car can become part of the
shop while it is in the garage?
--
Ignorantly,
Allan Adler
* Disclaimer: I am a guest and *not* a member of the MIT CSAIL. My actions and
* comments do not reflect in any way on MIT. Also, I am nowhere near Boston.

On 15 Aug 2004 20:48:19 -0400, Allan Adler
wrote:

(DoN. Nichols) writes:

The car can be moved out at need -- and will probably eventually
stay outdoors (as ours does), to make more room for machine tools. :-)
Perhaps build a stand-alone carport to shelter it. Besides -- you don't
want to bring a soaking wet car in out of the rain to generate humidity
to condense on the machine tools' ways.

On the other hand, maybe the trunk of the car can become part of the
shop while it is in the garage?

Ayup..there is your bead blasting cabinet or paint spray booth.

gunner

"There is no difference between communism and socialism, except
in the means of achieving the same ultimate end: communism
proposes to enslave men by force, socialism - by vote. It is
merely the difference between murder and suicide."
- Ayn Rand, from "Foreign Policy Drains U.S. of Main
Weapons"