I feel like a fool for posting this since I should be able to fix it in
my sleep, but I can't. 1983 Kaweasaki Prairie 3-wheel ATV wouldn't
start. After digging into it I found the 3 screws sheared that transmit
starter torque to the flywheel. Fixed that; engine turns, has
compression (50#, admittedly low, likely dirt on valve seats that would
blow out on start since I measures 100# 2 weeks ago). Starter is
turning motor in the correct direction, the intake & exhaust valve
operate in the correct sequence when I turn the crankshaft by hand, The
spark is hot & blue and will jump a .250" gap in air. Timing is not
adjustable but a timing light seems to show a flash at the correct 10
deg BTDC.

I put gas or starting fluid in the spark plug hole and NO firing.

If I try it with the plug just out of the hole I get fire about 3 times
before it runs out of fuel.

If I crank the engine with the hot wire just off the plug I get fire
between the plug & hot wire, so that proves current is flowing thru the
plug gap BUT the engine fires on every stroke so I could just be seeing
the spark at the top of the exhaust cycle.

I have the feeling I am missing something simple & stupid. Tell me what
stupid thing I forgot. Please.

--
Free men own guns, slaves don't
www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/5357/

If you have spart, and you have compression, it's got to be in your
carb. If it sat for any amount of time. Pull the carb and clean it
spotless, I bet it starts right up.

In article ,
Nick Hull wrote:

I feel like a fool for posting this since I should be able to fix it in
my sleep, but I can't. 1983 Kaweasaki Prairie 3-wheel ATV wouldn't
start. After digging into it I found the 3 screws sheared that transmit
starter torque to the flywheel. Fixed that; engine turns, has
compression (50#, admittedly low, likely dirt on valve seats that would
blow out on start since I measures 100# 2 weeks ago). Starter is
turning motor in the correct direction, the intake & exhaust valve
operate in the correct sequence when I turn the crankshaft by hand, The
spark is hot & blue and will jump a .250" gap in air. Timing is not
adjustable but a timing light seems to show a flash at the correct 10
deg BTDC.

I put gas or starting fluid in the spark plug hole and NO firing.

If I try it with the plug just out of the hole I get fire about 3 times
before it runs out of fuel.

If I crank the engine with the hot wire just off the plug I get fire
between the plug & hot wire, so that proves current is flowing thru the
plug gap BUT the engine fires on every stroke so I could just be seeing
the spark at the top of the exhaust cycle.

I have the feeling I am missing something simple & stupid. Tell me what
stupid thing I forgot. Please.

No idea if it'll be any help, but the first thing I would try is replace
the plug. Mine deteriorated to where it would not spark under
compression. It looked fine and sparked nicely in open air, but not in
the cylinder. Cheap fix if your luck's running good lately.

Funniest one was one _cold_ day it wouldn't run more than 3-4 seconds.
After practically disassembling and reassembling the engine, I found
water had frozen in a low part of the exhaust system. First time I had
an engine failure from a frozen up exhaust. Solved the problem with a
hair dryer and thereafter, making sure to rev the engine to expell the
water before shutting down.

"Nick Hull" wrote in message
...
SNIP
| I put gas or starting fluid in the spark plug hole and NO firing.
|
| If I try it with the plug just out of the hole I get fire about 3 times
| before it runs out of fuel.
|
| If I crank the engine with the hot wire just off the plug I get fire
| between the plug & hot wire, so that proves current is flowing thru the
| plug gap BUT the engine fires on every stroke so I could just be seeing
| the spark at the top of the exhaust cycle.
|
| I have the feeling I am missing something simple & stupid. Tell me what
| stupid thing I forgot. Please.

Been there, done that, but not with two strokers. The frustration cycle
is that usually your problem is right in front of you, normally obvious, but
your existing frustration level won't let you see it, which makes it even
more frustrating. Go for a walk, have a beer, beat the kids (okay, let's
not and say we did!) or something completely different for a few minutes and
come back with an unstuck brain.
Every time I've had a similar problem, it usually amounted to a float
valve seat or float. Most recently, the car would start and run for a few
seconds, then die. Then it would start right up again. The float was
sticking. I could rap on the carb to keep it going. Cleaned the crud out
of the bowl and valve seat (varnish, actually: 1956 Olds 88) and it ran
sweetly after minor tuning. It had the original Holley carb, and I could
remove the fuel level plug and watch the fuel level go down, otherwise I
would have missed it. The bowl filling up again after shutdown had me
flummoxed, and I suspect that when the float was almost to the bottom it
pulled the valve open, but by then the bowl was too empty to let the car
run.

I feel like a fool for posting this since I should be able to fix it in
my sleep, but I can't. 1983 Kaweasaki Prairie 3-wheel ATV wouldn't
start. After digging into it I found the 3 screws sheared that transmit
starter torque to the flywheel. Fixed that; engine turns, has
compression (50#, admittedly low, likely dirt on valve seats that would
blow out on start since I measures 100# 2 weeks ago). Starter is
turning motor in the correct direction, the intake & exhaust valve
operate in the correct sequence when I turn the crankshaft by hand, The
spark is hot & blue and will jump a .250" gap in air. Timing is not
adjustable but a timing light seems to show a flash at the correct 10
deg BTDC.

I put gas or starting fluid in the spark plug hole and NO firing.

If I try it with the plug just out of the hole I get fire about 3 times
before it runs out of fuel.

If I crank the engine with the hot wire just off the plug I get fire
between the plug & hot wire, so that proves current is flowing thru the
plug gap BUT the engine fires on every stroke so I could just be seeing
the spark at the top of the exhaust cycle.

I have the feeling I am missing something simple & stupid. Tell me what
stupid thing I forgot. Please.

--
Free men own guns, slaves don't
www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/5357/
50# ain't gonna get it..... try some oil in the cylinder to maybe
increase the compression, then if it starts, you're going to need
rings and stuff... I've had a couple that wouldn't fire up even with
spinning the engine with a drill motor... low compression. New
oversized piston and rings fixed the problem.
Ken.

Sounds like there are several things going on. As John said, it is not
unknown for a cracked plug to fire fine in open air, but short out and
not fire under compression. As Carl said, you prolly have carburation
issues also. As Ken said, #50 ain't gonna cut it; but as you said.....if
you get it lit and blow it out, this may improve. Replace the plug and
start it on starting fluid. If it lights and runs briefly, fix the carb.
If it won't light, tear it down.
JR
Dweller in the cellar

Nick Hull wrote:
I feel like a fool for posting this since I should be able to fix it in
my sleep, but I can't. 1983 Kaweasaki Prairie 3-wheel ATV wouldn't
start. After digging into it I found the 3 screws sheared that transmit
starter torque to the flywheel. Fixed that; engine turns, has
compression (50#, admittedly low, likely dirt on valve seats that would
blow out on start since I measures 100# 2 weeks ago). Starter is
turning motor in the correct direction, the intake & exhaust valve
operate in the correct sequence when I turn the crankshaft by hand, The
spark is hot & blue and will jump a .250" gap in air. Timing is not
adjustable but a timing light seems to show a flash at the correct 10
deg BTDC.

I put gas or starting fluid in the spark plug hole and NO firing.

If I try it with the plug just out of the hole I get fire about 3 times
before it runs out of fuel.

If I crank the engine with the hot wire just off the plug I get fire
between the plug & hot wire, so that proves current is flowing thru the
plug gap BUT the engine fires on every stroke so I could just be seeing
the spark at the top of the exhaust cycle.

I have the feeling I am missing something simple & stupid. Tell me what
stupid thing I forgot. Please.



--
--------------------------------------------------------------
Home Page: http://www.seanet.com/~jasonrnorth
If you're not the lead dog, the view never changes
Doubt yourself, and the real world will eat you alive
The world doesn't revolve around you, it revolves around me
No skeletons in the closet; just decomposing corpses
--------------------------------------------------------------
Dependence is Vulnerability:
--------------------------------------------------------------
"Open the Pod Bay Doors please, Hal"
"I'm sorry, Dave, I'm afraid I can't do that.."

Agree with all of the preceding. The other thing I have found helpful at
times like this is to warm up the head and/or carb with a hot air blower.
You're not using old petrol, are you? Over time this loses some of the more
volatile components and gives starting problems if the system is marginal.

Or a gas torch (not oxy acetylene!) if you are away from power.

In article .com,
wrote:

If you have spart, and you have compression, it's got to be in your
carb. If it sat for any amount of time. Pull the carb and clean it
spotless, I bet it starts right up.


If it were a carb problem wouldn't it run a few licks with starting
fluid? It doesn't.

--
Free men own guns, slaves don't
www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/5357/

In article ,
JR North wrote:

Sounds like there are several things going on. As John said, it is not
unknown for a cracked plug to fire fine in open air, but short out and
not fire under compression. As Carl said, you prolly have carburation
issues also. As Ken said, #50 ain't gonna cut it; but as you said.....if
you get it lit and blow it out, this may improve. Replace the plug and
start it on starting fluid. If it lights and runs briefly, fix the carb.
If it won't light, tear it down.
JR
Dweller in the cellar

The plug is NEW, properly gapped at .030". Also tried plug gapped at
..020" and .010". Doesn't light.

Tear it down and look for what? It ran fine until one day it wouldn't
start - I thought I fixed THAT problem.


Nick Hull wrote:
I feel like a fool for posting this since I should be able to fix it in
my sleep, but I can't. 1983 Kaweasaki Prairie 3-wheel ATV wouldn't
start. After digging into it I found the 3 screws sheared that transmit
starter torque to the flywheel. Fixed that; engine turns, has
compression (50#, admittedly low, likely dirt on valve seats that would
blow out on start since I measures 100# 2 weeks ago). Starter is
turning motor in the correct direction, the intake & exhaust valve
operate in the correct sequence when I turn the crankshaft by hand, The
spark is hot & blue and will jump a .250" gap in air. Timing is not
adjustable but a timing light seems to show a flash at the correct 10
deg BTDC.

I put gas or starting fluid in the spark plug hole and NO firing.

If I try it with the plug just out of the hole I get fire about 3 times
before it runs out of fuel.

If I crank the engine with the hot wire just off the plug I get fire
between the plug & hot wire, so that proves current is flowing thru the
plug gap BUT the engine fires on every stroke so I could just be seeing
the spark at the top of the exhaust cycle.

I have the feeling I am missing something simple & stupid. Tell me what
stupid thing I forgot. Please.


--
Free men own guns, slaves don't
www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/5357/

In article ,
"Newshound" wrote:

Or a gas torch (not oxy acetylene!) if you are away from power.



Have tried starting fluid, fresh gasoline, propane, and carb cleaner
(usually works best!). No firing on any.

--
Free men own guns, slaves don't
www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/5357/

On Sat, 08 Apr 2006 21:10:12 GMT, Nick Hull
wrote:

In article ,
"Newshound" wrote:

Or a gas torch (not oxy acetylene!) if you are away from power.



Have tried starting fluid, fresh gasoline, propane, and carb cleaner
(usually works best!). No firing on any.
Greetings Nick,
I had a similar problem with a Mazda GLC years ago. Even though there
was plenty of spark in air the thing wouldn't run. When the timing was
severly retarded the car would run. Since the resistance between the
sparkplug electrodes rises as the density of the ar/fuel mixture rises
it finally occurred to me to look for a short to ground that happened
only when the timing was correct. It turned out to be a bad rotor. It
was shorting to ground through the distributer shaft. Replacing the
rotor fixed the problem. When a timing light was used while the timing
was retarded it would flash. As the distributer was turned the timing
light would cease firing and the car would die. So look at the system
from the coil to the plug.
Cheers,
Eric r Snow

On Sat, 08 Apr 2006 21:08:26 GMT, Nick Hull
wrote:

In article ,
JR North wrote:

Sounds like there are several things going on. As John said, it is not
unknown for a cracked plug to fire fine in open air, but short out and
not fire under compression. As Carl said, you prolly have carburation
issues also. As Ken said, #50 ain't gonna cut it; but as you said.....if
you get it lit and blow it out, this may improve. Replace the plug and
start it on starting fluid. If it lights and runs briefly, fix the carb.
If it won't light, tear it down.
JR
Dweller in the cellar

The plug is NEW, properly gapped at .030". Also tried plug gapped at
.020" and .010". Doesn't light.

Doesn't mean anything now days unfortunately. It's not unheard of to
find 3-4 bad plugs in a box.

Tear it down and look for what? It ran fine until one day it wouldn't
start - I thought I fixed THAT problem.

I'm betting ignition problem from what you describe. If it fires
with the extra gap in the plug that usually indicates a shorted plug
but it could be something else nearly shorted. I had a Honda engine
one time that drove me nuts. It fired fine with the plug, and it fired
fine on my spark checker. The only clue was that it didn't fire fine
with my spark checker inline with the plug. Usually I don't have any
problems with that. It turned out to be a bad coil.

Nick Hull wrote:
I feel like a fool for posting this since I should be able to fix it in
my sleep, but I can't. 1983 Kaweasaki Prairie 3-wheel ATV wouldn't
start. After digging into it I found the 3 screws sheared that transmit
starter torque to the flywheel. Fixed that; engine turns, has
compression (50#, admittedly low, likely dirt on valve seats that would
blow out on start since I measures 100# 2 weeks ago). Starter is
turning motor in the correct direction, the intake & exhaust valve
operate in the correct sequence when I turn the crankshaft by hand, The
spark is hot & blue and will jump a .250" gap in air. Timing is not
adjustable but a timing light seems to show a flash at the correct 10
deg BTDC.

I put gas or starting fluid in the spark plug hole and NO firing.

If I try it with the plug just out of the hole I get fire about 3 times
before it runs out of fuel.

If I crank the engine with the hot wire just off the plug I get fire
between the plug & hot wire, so that proves current is flowing thru the
plug gap BUT the engine fires on every stroke so I could just be seeing
the spark at the top of the exhaust cycle.

I have the feeling I am missing something simple & stupid. Tell me what
stupid thing I forgot. Please.

Sounds like a bad plug preventing the starting. Low compression is
another story.

Nick Hull wrote:

In article ,
JR North wrote:



The plug is NEW, properly gapped at .030". Also tried plug gapped at
.020" and .010". Doesn't light.


Open the gap up on the plug to at least .075 and see if it sparks across
the gap.
From all the information you gave, it seems that there is no spark
inside the cylinder with compression which increases the effective gap.
By opening up the gap and looking at the plug firing you can see if
there is a breakdown inside the plug.

The old spark plug testers had a ignition coil and a way to presurize
the plug and watch the spark under high pressure to see if the plug
would break down.

A new sparkplug dropped on a hard surface is likely to be junk, it will
still look new though.


John

Nick Hull wrote:
In article ,
JR North wrote:


Sounds like there are several things going on. As John said, it is not
unknown for a cracked plug to fire fine in open air, but short out and
not fire under compression. As Carl said, you prolly have carburation
issues also. As Ken said, #50 ain't gonna cut it; but as you said.....if
you get it lit and blow it out, this may improve. Replace the plug and
start it on starting fluid. If it lights and runs briefly, fix the carb.
If it won't light, tear it down.
JR
Dweller in the cellar


The plug is NEW, properly gapped at .030". Also tried plug gapped at
.020" and .010". Doesn't light.

Tear it down and look for what? It ran fine until one day it wouldn't
start - I thought I fixed THAT problem.


Nick Hull wrote:

I feel like a fool for posting this since I should be able to fix it in
my sleep, but I can't. 1983 Kaweasaki Prairie 3-wheel ATV wouldn't
start. After digging into it I found the 3 screws sheared that transmit
starter torque to the flywheel. Fixed that; engine turns, has
compression (50#, admittedly low, likely dirt on valve seats that would
blow out on start since I measures 100# 2 weeks ago). Starter is
turning motor in the correct direction, the intake & exhaust valve
operate in the correct sequence when I turn the crankshaft by hand, The
spark is hot & blue and will jump a .250" gap in air. Timing is not
adjustable but a timing light seems to show a flash at the correct 10
deg BTDC.

I put gas or starting fluid in the spark plug hole and NO firing.

If I try it with the plug just out of the hole I get fire about 3 times
before it runs out of fuel.

If I crank the engine with the hot wire just off the plug I get fire
between the plug & hot wire, so that proves current is flowing thru the
plug gap BUT the engine fires on every stroke so I could just be seeing
the spark at the top of the exhaust cycle.

I have the feeling I am missing something simple & stupid. Tell me what
stupid thing I forgot. Please.



Check valve timing; maybe cam belt or chain has lost tension and
slipped.

"Nick Hull" wrote in message
...
I feel like a fool for posting this since I should be able to fix it in
my sleep, but I can't. 1983 Kaweasaki Prairie 3-wheel ATV wouldn't
start. After digging into it I found the 3 screws sheared that transmit
starter torque to the flywheel. Fixed that; engine turns, has
compression (50#, admittedly low, likely dirt on valve seats that would
blow out on start since I measures 100# 2 weeks ago). Starter is
turning motor in the correct direction, the intake & exhaust valve
operate in the correct sequence when I turn the crankshaft by hand, The
spark is hot & blue and will jump a .250" gap in air. Timing is not
adjustable but a timing light seems to show a flash at the correct 10
deg BTDC.

I put gas or starting fluid in the spark plug hole and NO firing.

If I try it with the plug just out of the hole I get fire about 3 times
before it runs out of fuel.

If I crank the engine with the hot wire just off the plug I get fire
between the plug & hot wire, so that proves current is flowing thru the
plug gap BUT the engine fires on every stroke so I could just be seeing
the spark at the top of the exhaust cycle.

I have the feeling I am missing something simple & stupid. Tell me what
stupid thing I forgot. Please.

Sounds like Valve timing to me. Or something caused the screws to shear and
that could have been a backfire which may have caused other damage. A
sheared key on the flywheel/magneto or just displacement of the key.
Are there timing marks you can look at on the crank and cam?

In article ,
John wrote:

Nick Hull wrote:

In article ,
JR North wrote:



The plug is NEW, properly gapped at .030". Also tried plug gapped at
.020" and .010". Doesn't light.


Open the gap up on the plug to at least .075 and see if it sparks across
the gap.
From all the information you gave, it seems that there is no spark
inside the cylinder with compression which increases the effective gap.
By opening up the gap and looking at the plug firing you can see if
there is a breakdown inside the plug.

I agree it 'looks like' no spark inside the cylinder with compression,
yet with a plug outside I can easily get over .200 spark. I can think
of no reason why I shouldn't get a spark with a mere .030 gap inside,
but I can't actually see it.



The old spark plug testers had a ignition coil and a way to presurize
the plug and watch the spark under high pressure to see if the plug
would break down.

A new sparkplug dropped on a hard surface is likely to be junk, it will
still look new though.


John

--
Free men own guns, slaves don't
www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/5357/

In article ,
Wayne Cook wrote:

On Sat, 08 Apr 2006 21:08:26 GMT, Nick Hull
wrote:

In article ,
JR North wrote:

Sounds like there are several things going on. As John said, it is not
unknown for a cracked plug to fire fine in open air, but short out and
not fire under compression. As Carl said, you prolly have carburation
issues also. As Ken said, #50 ain't gonna cut it; but as you said.....if
you get it lit and blow it out, this may improve. Replace the plug and
start it on starting fluid. If it lights and runs briefly, fix the carb.
If it won't light, tear it down.
JR
Dweller in the cellar

The plug is NEW, properly gapped at .030". Also tried plug gapped at
.020" and .010". Doesn't light.

Doesn't mean anything now days unfortunately. It's not unheard of to
find 3-4 bad plugs in a box.

I did try it with 2 new plugs, plus some older one I'd cleaned up.

Tear it down and look for what? It ran fine until one day it wouldn't
start - I thought I fixed THAT problem.

I'm betting ignition problem from what you describe. If it fires
with the extra gap in the plug that usually indicates a shorted plug
but it could be something else nearly shorted. I had a Honda engine
one time that drove me nuts. It fired fine with the plug, and it fired
fine on my spark checker. The only clue was that it didn't fire fine
with my spark checker inline with the plug. Usually I don't have any
problems with that. It turned out to be a bad coil.

I agree it 'looks' like ignition problems. But I have a NEW coil and it
puts out big blue sparks. Tell me about the spark checker you put
inline with the plug; is it just another spark gap? I have tried a
spark gap in series with the plug, but the engine is designed to fire
everytime the piston goes up, wether compression or exhaust, and I
cvan't distinguish between the 2.

--
Free men own guns, slaves don't
www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/5357/

In article , "Glenn"
wrote:

"Nick Hull" wrote in message
...
I feel like a fool for posting this since I should be able to fix it in
my sleep, but I can't. 1983 Kaweasaki Prairie 3-wheel ATV wouldn't
start. After digging into it I found the 3 screws sheared that transmit
starter torque to the flywheel. Fixed that; engine turns, has
compression (50#, admittedly low, likely dirt on valve seats that would
blow out on start since I measures 100# 2 weeks ago). Starter is
turning motor in the correct direction, the intake & exhaust valve
operate in the correct sequence when I turn the crankshaft by hand, The
spark is hot & blue and will jump a .250" gap in air. Timing is not
adjustable but a timing light seems to show a flash at the correct 10
deg BTDC.

I put gas or starting fluid in the spark plug hole and NO firing.

If I try it with the plug just out of the hole I get fire about 3 times
before it runs out of fuel.

If I crank the engine with the hot wire just off the plug I get fire
between the plug & hot wire, so that proves current is flowing thru the
plug gap BUT the engine fires on every stroke so I could just be seeing
the spark at the top of the exhaust cycle.

I have the feeling I am missing something simple & stupid. Tell me what
stupid thing I forgot. Please.

Sounds like Valve timing to me. Or something caused the screws to shear and
that could have been a backfire which may have caused other damage. A
sheared key on the flywheel/magneto or just displacement of the key.
Are there timing marks you can look at on the crank and cam?

I was so convinced the flywheel key had sheared that I removed the
flywheel; the key was perfect, no displacement. At least when I removed
the flywheel I could see the problem with the sheared bolts on the
starter overrunning clutch.

--
Free men own guns, slaves don't
www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/5357/

In article ,
tomcas wrote:

Nick Hull wrote:
I feel like a fool for posting this since I should be able to fix it in
my sleep, but I can't. 1983 Kaweasaki Prairie 3-wheel ATV wouldn't
start. After digging into it I found the 3 screws sheared that transmit
starter torque to the flywheel. Fixed that; engine turns, has
compression (50#, admittedly low, likely dirt on valve seats that would
blow out on start since I measures 100# 2 weeks ago). Starter is
turning motor in the correct direction, the intake & exhaust valve
operate in the correct sequence when I turn the crankshaft by hand, The
spark is hot & blue and will jump a .250" gap in air. Timing is not
adjustable but a timing light seems to show a flash at the correct 10
deg BTDC.

I put gas or starting fluid in the spark plug hole and NO firing.

If I try it with the plug just out of the hole I get fire about 3 times
before it runs out of fuel.

If I crank the engine with the hot wire just off the plug I get fire
between the plug & hot wire, so that proves current is flowing thru the
plug gap BUT the engine fires on every stroke so I could just be seeing
the spark at the top of the exhaust cycle.

I have the feeling I am missing something simple & stupid. Tell me what
stupid thing I forgot. Please.

Sounds like a bad plug preventing the starting. Low compression is
another story.

Plug is new and I tried more than one. Low compression should lower
power but should not prevent starting. I have driven cars with lower
compression, all I need is for the engine to fire and idle at no load.

--
Free men own guns, slaves don't
www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/5357/

"Nick Hull" wrote in message
I feel like a fool for posting this since I should be able to fix it in
my sleep, but I can't. 1983 Kaweasaki Prairie 3-wheel ATV wouldn't
start. After digging into it I found the 3 screws sheared that transmit
starter torque to the flywheel. Fixed that; engine turns, has
compression (50#, admittedly low, likely dirt on valve seats that would
blow out on start since I measures 100# 2 weeks ago). Starter is
turning motor in the correct direction, the intake & exhaust valve
operate in the correct sequence when I turn the crankshaft by hand, The
spark is hot & blue and will jump a .250" gap in air. Timing is not
adjustable but a timing light seems to show a flash at the correct 10
deg BTDC.

My son had a 1974 Honda 100 that we did some work on and afterward it
wouldn't start. We had a similar situation to yours except that it was a
4-stroke and I'm getting the impression yours is a 2-stroke.

We had good fire. We obviously had fuel because the plug was getting wet.
We also had great compression though. No matter what we did it just
wouldn't crank.

We finally found out that the cam that lifted the points could be either 180
degrees out or 120 or 240, I can't remember whether it had 3 positions or 2.
At any rate, we moved it to another position and it fired right up.

But with the compression so low it seems like maybe you have a valve hanging
open.

Best Regards,
Keith Marshall


"I'm not grown up enough to be so old!"

On Sun, 09 Apr 2006 01:51:32 GMT, Nick Hull
wrote:

In article ,
Wayne Cook wrote:

On Sat, 08 Apr 2006 21:08:26 GMT, Nick Hull
wrote:

In article ,
JR North wrote:

Sounds like there are several things going on. As John said, it is not
unknown for a cracked plug to fire fine in open air, but short out and
not fire under compression. As Carl said, you prolly have carburation
issues also. As Ken said, #50 ain't gonna cut it; but as you said.....if
you get it lit and blow it out, this may improve. Replace the plug and
start it on starting fluid. If it lights and runs briefly, fix the carb.
If it won't light, tear it down.
JR
Dweller in the cellar

The plug is NEW, properly gapped at .030". Also tried plug gapped at
.020" and .010". Doesn't light.

Doesn't mean anything now days unfortunately. It's not unheard of to
find 3-4 bad plugs in a box.

I did try it with 2 new plugs, plus some older one I'd cleaned up.

Tear it down and look for what? It ran fine until one day it wouldn't
start - I thought I fixed THAT problem.

I'm betting ignition problem from what you describe. If it fires
with the extra gap in the plug that usually indicates a shorted plug
but it could be something else nearly shorted. I had a Honda engine
one time that drove me nuts. It fired fine with the plug, and it fired
fine on my spark checker. The only clue was that it didn't fire fine
with my spark checker inline with the plug. Usually I don't have any
problems with that. It turned out to be a bad coil.

I agree it 'looks' like ignition problems. But I have a NEW coil and it
puts out big blue sparks. Tell me about the spark checker you put
inline with the plug; is it just another spark gap? I have tried a
spark gap in series with the plug, but the engine is designed to fire
everytime the piston goes up, wether compression or exhaust, and I
cvan't distinguish between the 2.

My spark checker is home made. I took a spark plug, removed the
tang, and soldered a washer with the hole sized so that the spark had
to jump 1/8" (spec for checking Briggs engines). There is a wire
soldered to the side of the plug with a clip for grounding. I have a
pvc pipe with adapter screwed to the spark end to shield the sunlight
(I used to do all my engine work outside). I've used this for many
years of small engine work with my only problems being the wire
soldered to the side breaks eventually (even with a zip tie as a
strain relief).

Darn, I would have bet the farm on a bad coil...been there, somebody here
figured it out for me. It seems a bad coil can put out a great spark until
under pressure. Bury chicken guts in the back yard under a full moon and
chant something ominous.


"Nick Hull" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Wayne Cook wrote:

On Sat, 08 Apr 2006 21:08:26 GMT, Nick Hull
wrote:

In article ,
JR North wrote:

Sounds like there are several things going on. As John said, it is not
unknown for a cracked plug to fire fine in open air, but short out and
not fire under compression. As Carl said, you prolly have carburation
issues also. As Ken said, #50 ain't gonna cut it; but as you
said.....if
you get it lit and blow it out, this may improve. Replace the plug and
start it on starting fluid. If it lights and runs briefly, fix the
carb.
If it won't light, tear it down.
JR
Dweller in the cellar

The plug is NEW, properly gapped at .030". Also tried plug gapped at
.020" and .010". Doesn't light.

Doesn't mean anything now days unfortunately. It's not unheard of to
find 3-4 bad plugs in a box.

I did try it with 2 new plugs, plus some older one I'd cleaned up.

Tear it down and look for what? It ran fine until one day it wouldn't
start - I thought I fixed THAT problem.

I'm betting ignition problem from what you describe. If it fires
with the extra gap in the plug that usually indicates a shorted plug
but it could be something else nearly shorted. I had a Honda engine
one time that drove me nuts. It fired fine with the plug, and it fired
fine on my spark checker. The only clue was that it didn't fire fine
with my spark checker inline with the plug. Usually I don't have any
problems with that. It turned out to be a bad coil.

I agree it 'looks' like ignition problems. But I have a NEW coil and it
puts out big blue sparks. Tell me about the spark checker you put
inline with the plug; is it just another spark gap? I have tried a
spark gap in series with the plug, but the engine is designed to fire
everytime the piston goes up, wether compression or exhaust, and I
cvan't distinguish between the 2.

--
Free men own guns, slaves don't
www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/5357/

On Sat, 08 Apr 2006 09:21:38 -0700, JR North
wrote:

Sounds like there are several things going on. As John said, it is not
unknown for a cracked plug to fire fine in open air, but short out and
not fire under compression. As Carl said, you prolly have carburation
issues also. As Ken said, #50 ain't gonna cut it; but as you said.....if
you get it lit and blow it out, this may improve. Replace the plug and
start it on starting fluid. If it lights and runs briefly, fix the carb.
If it won't light, tear it down.
JR
Dweller in the cellar

Replace the plug..and stick your unlit propane torch in the open
carby. Starting fluid could both wash the rings and blow a hole in
the top of the piston

Gunner


Nick Hull wrote:
I feel like a fool for posting this since I should be able to fix it in
my sleep, but I can't. 1983 Kaweasaki Prairie 3-wheel ATV wouldn't
start. After digging into it I found the 3 screws sheared that transmit
starter torque to the flywheel. Fixed that; engine turns, has
compression (50#, admittedly low, likely dirt on valve seats that would
blow out on start since I measures 100# 2 weeks ago). Starter is
turning motor in the correct direction, the intake & exhaust valve
operate in the correct sequence when I turn the crankshaft by hand, The
spark is hot & blue and will jump a .250" gap in air. Timing is not
adjustable but a timing light seems to show a flash at the correct 10
deg BTDC.

I put gas or starting fluid in the spark plug hole and NO firing.

If I try it with the plug just out of the hole I get fire about 3 times
before it runs out of fuel.

If I crank the engine with the hot wire just off the plug I get fire
between the plug & hot wire, so that proves current is flowing thru the
plug gap BUT the engine fires on every stroke so I could just be seeing
the spark at the top of the exhaust cycle.

I have the feeling I am missing something simple & stupid. Tell me what
stupid thing I forgot. Please.


"I think this is because of your belief in biological Marxism.
As a genetic communist you feel that noticing behavioural
patterns relating to race would cause a conflict with your belief
in biological Marxism." Big Pete, famous Usenet Racist

Nick Hull wrote:

In article , "Glenn"
wrote:



"Nick Hull" wrote in message
...


I feel like a fool for posting this since I should be able to fix it in
my sleep, but I can't. 1983 Kaweasaki Prairie 3-wheel ATV wouldn't
start. After digging into it I found the 3 screws sheared that transmit
starter torque to the flywheel. Fixed that; engine turns, has
compression (50#, admittedly low, likely dirt on valve seats that would
blow out on start since I measures 100# 2 weeks ago). Starter is
turning motor in the correct direction, the intake & exhaust valve
operate in the correct sequence when I turn the crankshaft by hand, The
spark is hot & blue and will jump a .250" gap in air. Timing is not
adjustable but a timing light seems to show a flash at the correct 10
deg BTDC.

I put gas or starting fluid in the spark plug hole and NO firing.

If I try it with the plug just out of the hole I get fire about 3 times
before it runs out of fuel.

If I crank the engine with the hot wire just off the plug I get fire
between the plug & hot wire, so that proves current is flowing thru the
plug gap BUT the engine fires on every stroke so I could just be seeing
the spark at the top of the exhaust cycle.

I have the feeling I am missing something simple & stupid. Tell me what
stupid thing I forgot. Please.


Sounds like Valve timing to me. Or something caused the screws to shear and
that could have been a backfire which may have caused other damage. A
sheared key on the flywheel/magneto or just displacement of the key.
Are there timing marks you can look at on the crank and cam?



I was so convinced the flywheel key had sheared that I removed the
flywheel; the key was perfect, no displacement. At least when I removed
the flywheel I could see the problem with the sheared bolts on the
starter overrunning clutch.



Check the valve timing and the cam chain tension. If the cam chain had
skipped it would explain the low compression.
A badly clogged muffler can prevent starting too.

Fred

In article ,
ff wrote:

Nick Hull wrote:

In article , "Glenn"
wrote:



"Nick Hull" wrote in message
...


I feel like a fool for posting this since I should be able to fix it in
my sleep, but I can't. 1983 Kaweasaki Prairie 3-wheel ATV wouldn't
start. After digging into it I found the 3 screws sheared that transmit
starter torque to the flywheel. Fixed that; engine turns, has
compression (50#, admittedly low, likely dirt on valve seats that would
blow out on start since I measures 100# 2 weeks ago). Starter is
turning motor in the correct direction, the intake & exhaust valve
operate in the correct sequence when I turn the crankshaft by hand, The
spark is hot & blue and will jump a .250" gap in air. Timing is not
adjustable but a timing light seems to show a flash at the correct 10
deg BTDC.

I put gas or starting fluid in the spark plug hole and NO firing.

If I try it with the plug just out of the hole I get fire about 3 times
before it runs out of fuel.

If I crank the engine with the hot wire just off the plug I get fire
between the plug & hot wire, so that proves current is flowing thru the
plug gap BUT the engine fires on every stroke so I could just be seeing
the spark at the top of the exhaust cycle.

I have the feeling I am missing something simple & stupid. Tell me what
stupid thing I forgot. Please.


Sounds like Valve timing to me. Or something caused the screws to shear
and
that could have been a backfire which may have caused other damage. A
sheared key on the flywheel/magneto or just displacement of the key.
Are there timing marks you can look at on the crank and cam?



I was so convinced the flywheel key had sheared that I removed the
flywheel; the key was perfect, no displacement. At least when I removed
the flywheel I could see the problem with the sheared bolts on the
starter overrunning clutch.



Check the valve timing and the cam chain tension. If the cam chain had
skipped it would explain the low compression.
A badly clogged muffler can prevent starting too.

Fred

I did check the valve timing, the sprocket marks are all correct and the
chain looks good. I suspected that myself for a while until I looked
inside.

I can feel flow coming out the muffler when I crank.

--
Free men own guns, slaves don't
www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/5357/

In article ,
"Keith Marshall" wrote:

"Nick Hull" wrote in message
I feel like a fool for posting this since I should be able to fix it in
my sleep, but I can't. 1983 Kaweasaki Prairie 3-wheel ATV wouldn't
start. After digging into it I found the 3 screws sheared that transmit
starter torque to the flywheel. Fixed that; engine turns, has
compression (50#, admittedly low, likely dirt on valve seats that would
blow out on start since I measures 100# 2 weeks ago). Starter is
turning motor in the correct direction, the intake & exhaust valve
operate in the correct sequence when I turn the crankshaft by hand, The
spark is hot & blue and will jump a .250" gap in air. Timing is not
adjustable but a timing light seems to show a flash at the correct 10
deg BTDC.

My son had a 1974 Honda 100 that we did some work on and afterward it
wouldn't start. We had a similar situation to yours except that it was a
4-stroke and I'm getting the impression yours is a 2-stroke.

My Kawasaki is a 4-stroke

We had good fire. We obviously had fuel because the plug was getting wet.
We also had great compression though. No matter what we did it just
wouldn't crank.

We finally found out that the cam that lifted the points could be either 180
degrees out or 120 or 240, I can't remember whether it had 3 positions or 2.
At any rate, we moved it to another position and it fired right up.

No cam, no points, just a pickup coil like a magneto but the coil is
battery powered thru an electronic coil driver and it all 'seems' to be
working great.

But with the compression so low it seems like maybe you have a valve hanging
open.

I'm guessing I've got some crud/dirt/fibres under the valve seat from
stuffing rope in the cylinder, hoping it will blow out when it starts.

Best Regards,
Keith Marshall


"I'm not grown up enough to be so old!"




--
Free men own guns, slaves don't
www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/5357/

In article ,
Gunner wrote:

On Sat, 08 Apr 2006 09:21:38 -0700, JR North
wrote:

Sounds like there are several things going on. As John said, it is not
unknown for a cracked plug to fire fine in open air, but short out and
not fire under compression. As Carl said, you prolly have carburation
issues also. As Ken said, #50 ain't gonna cut it; but as you said.....if
you get it lit and blow it out, this may improve. Replace the plug and
start it on starting fluid. If it lights and runs briefly, fix the carb.
If it won't light, tear it down.
JR
Dweller in the cellar

Replace the plug..and stick your unlit propane torch in the open
carby. Starting fluid could both wash the rings and blow a hole in
the top of the piston

Gunner

I already tried the unlit propane trick, it's always one of the first
things I try.

--
Free men own guns, slaves don't
www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/5357/

In article ,
"Keith Marshall" wrote:

"Nick Hull" wrote in message
I feel like a fool for posting this since I should be able to fix it in
my sleep, but I can't. 1983 Kaweasaki Prairie 3-wheel ATV wouldn't
start. After digging into it I found the 3 screws sheared that transmit
starter torque to the flywheel. Fixed that; engine turns, has
compression (50#, admittedly low, likely dirt on valve seats that would
blow out on start since I measures 100# 2 weeks ago). Starter is
turning motor in the correct direction, the intake & exhaust valve
operate in the correct sequence when I turn the crankshaft by hand, The
spark is hot & blue and will jump a .250" gap in air. Timing is not
adjustable but a timing light seems to show a flash at the correct 10
deg BTDC.

My son had a 1974 Honda 100 that we did some work on and afterward it
wouldn't start. We had a similar situation to yours except that it was a
4-stroke and I'm getting the impression yours is a 2-stroke.

We had good fire. We obviously had fuel because the plug was getting wet.
We also had great compression though. No matter what we did it just
wouldn't crank.

We finally found out that the cam that lifted the points could be either 180
degrees out or 120 or 240, I can't remember whether it had 3 positions or 2.
At any rate, we moved it to another position and it fired right up.

But with the compression so low it seems like maybe you have a valve hanging
open.

OK, I tried the 'oil trick', it boosted the compression from 50 to 70
psi with a lot less than a teaspoon. I dribbled a very small amount of
way oil with a zoom spout oiler so it would get on the walls. Very
ecouraging result in that I could get it to fire a few times,
pop-pop-pop, whils the starter was cranking. Almost Zero power but
better than anything I had seen before. Then I stuck a soda straw in
thru the plug hole and was able to scrape up some black goo from the top
of the piston. Since the air filter was in bad shape, and it was just a
cheap ($30!) black foam filter maybe some of the black filter foam
disintegrated and got sucked into the cylinder?

The way the 3-wheeler failed was it was running great, then stalled as I
was parking it and would not restart. Did sound a bit wierd as it was
stalling but not like any heavy metal crashing.

Later today I'll hook up an air supply to the plug hole and pressurize
the cxylinder at TDC and see what I observe.

--
Free men own guns, slaves don't
www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/5357/

Check the key in the flywheel . Sounds like it might have sheared , and the
fattest , bluest spark in the world ain't gonna do squat if it don't happen
at the right time . It only has to be off a few degrees ... and yes , I saw
where you said you checked it .

--
Snag aka OSG #1
'76 FLH "Bag Lady"
BS132 SENS NEWT
"A hand shift is a manly shift ."
shamelessly stolen
none to one to reply
"Nick Hull" wrote in message
...
In article ,
tomcas wrote:

Nick Hull wrote:
I feel like a fool for posting this since I should be able to fix it in
my sleep, but I can't. 1983 Kaweasaki Prairie 3-wheel ATV wouldn't
start. After digging into it I found the 3 screws sheared that
transmit
starter torque to the flywheel. Fixed that; engine turns, has
compression (50#, admittedly low, likely dirt on valve seats that would
blow out on start since I measures 100# 2 weeks ago). Starter is
turning motor in the correct direction, the intake & exhaust valve
operate in the correct sequence when I turn the crankshaft by hand, The
spark is hot & blue and will jump a .250" gap in air. Timing is not
adjustable but a timing light seems to show a flash at the correct 10
deg BTDC.

I put gas or starting fluid in the spark plug hole and NO firing.

If I try it with the plug just out of the hole I get fire about 3 times
before it runs out of fuel.

If I crank the engine with the hot wire just off the plug I get fire
between the plug & hot wire, so that proves current is flowing thru the
plug gap BUT the engine fires on every stroke so I could just be seeing
the spark at the top of the exhaust cycle.

I have the feeling I am missing something simple & stupid. Tell me
what
stupid thing I forgot. Please.

Sounds like a bad plug preventing the starting. Low compression is
another story.

Plug is new and I tried more than one. Low compression should lower
power but should not prevent starting. I have driven cars with lower
compression, all I need is for the engine to fire and idle at no load.

--
Free men own guns, slaves don't
www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/5357/

Nick Hull wrote in
:


I have the feeling I am missing something simple & stupid. Tell me
what stupid thing I forgot. Please.


Nick,
Does this thing have a compression release mechanism for ease of
starting? If so...it might be stuck.

--
Anthony

You can't 'idiot proof' anything....every time you try, they just make
better idiots.

Remove sp to reply via email

In article ,
Anthony wrote:

Nick Hull wrote in
:


I have the feeling I am missing something simple & stupid. Tell me
what stupid thing I forgot. Please.


Nick,
Does this thing have a compression release mechanism for ease of
starting? If so...it might be stuck.

No compression release ;(

--
Free men own guns, slaves don't
www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/5357/

On Sun, 09 Apr 2006 01:55:52 GMT, Nick Hull
wrote:

In article ,
Eric R Snow wrote:

On Sat, 08 Apr 2006 21:10:12 GMT, Nick Hull
wrote:

In article ,
"Newshound" wrote:

Or a gas torch (not oxy acetylene!) if you are away from power.



Have tried starting fluid, fresh gasoline, propane, and carb cleaner
(usually works best!). No firing on any.
Greetings Nick,
I had a similar problem with a Mazda GLC years ago. Even though there
was plenty of spark in air the thing wouldn't run. When the timing was
severly retarded the car would run. Since the resistance between the
sparkplug electrodes rises as the density of the ar/fuel mixture rises
it finally occurred to me to look for a short to ground that happened
only when the timing was correct. It turned out to be a bad rotor. It
was shorting to ground through the distributer shaft. Replacing the
rotor fixed the problem. When a timing light was used while the timing
was retarded it would flash. As the distributer was turned the timing
light would cease firing and the car would die. So look at the system
from the coil to the plug.
Cheers,
Eric r Snow

There is nothing between the coil and plug but 6" of new high voltage
cable and the rubber plug cover. It's one cylinder so there is no
distributor and the timing is fixed (like a magneto) so I can't change
it. A timing light makes it look like the correct timing but at
cranking speed it's tough to see well because I lose persistence of
vision.
Greetings Nick,
Didn't I see a post of your's that said it would fire when the plug
was loose, but still threaded in? If this is true, then it's a pretty
good bet that insulation is breaking down somewhere before the plug
can fire. My point in my post, which I failed to make clear, is that
this breakdown can happen anywhere in the high tension circuit. In my
case it was a bad, though brand new, rotor. In your case it could be
the plug, wire, or coil. Even though all these components are new. A
friend of mine had a coil go bad on his boat motor. This motor is an
in-line 6 built in the 40s. He managed to limp it to a marina and
bought the only coil they had. Since he had upgraded the old six volt
system to twelve volts, and the coil he bought was a six volt, there
was a problem. The arc would jump from the coil to the block. So this
path was easier than through the plug wires at the much higher
voltage. He put a light bulb in series with the coil and fixed the
problem. Can you use a different coil? Just for a test?
ERS

Did someone put some carbon tet in your fuel? April fools joke.


John


Nick Hull wrote:

In article ,
John wrote:


Nick Hull wrote:

In article ,
JR North wrote:




The plug is NEW, properly gapped at .030". Also tried plug gapped at
.020" and .010". Doesn't light.



Open the gap up on the plug to at least .075 and see if it sparks across
the gap.
From all the information you gave, it seems that there is no spark
inside the cylinder with compression which increases the effective gap.
By opening up the gap and looking at the plug firing you can see if
there is a breakdown inside the plug.


I agree it 'looks like' no spark inside the cylinder with compression,
yet with a plug outside I can easily get over .200 spark. I can think
of no reason why I shouldn't get a spark with a mere .030 gap inside,
but I can't actually see it.



The old spark plug testers had a ignition coil and a way to presurize
the plug and watch the spark under high pressure to see if the plug
would break down.

A new sparkplug dropped on a hard surface is likely to be junk, it will
still look new though.


John

On Sat, 08 Apr 2006 14:36:46 GMT, Nick Hull
wrote:

I feel like a fool for posting this since I should be able to fix it in
my sleep, but I can't. 1983 Kaweasaki Prairie 3-wheel ATV wouldn't
start. After digging into it I found the 3 screws sheared that transmit
starter torque to the flywheel. Fixed that; engine turns, has
compression (50#, admittedly low, likely dirt on valve seats that would
blow out on start since I measures 100# 2 weeks ago). Starter is
turning motor in the correct direction, the intake & exhaust valve
operate in the correct sequence when I turn the crankshaft by hand, The
spark is hot & blue and will jump a .250" gap in air. Timing is not
adjustable but a timing light seems to show a flash at the correct 10
deg BTDC.

I put gas or starting fluid in the spark plug hole and NO firing.

If I try it with the plug just out of the hole I get fire about 3 times
before it runs out of fuel.

If I crank the engine with the hot wire just off the plug I get fire
between the plug & hot wire, so that proves current is flowing thru the
plug gap BUT the engine fires on every stroke so I could just be seeing
the spark at the top of the exhaust cycle.

I have the feeling I am missing something simple & stupid. Tell me what
stupid thing I forgot. Please.

Try a new plug.
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let me second the "replace the plug" suggestion - I've seen this
happen several times, and plugs are cheap. if you have compression
and spark, some ether (starting fluid) sprayed into the intake as you
crank should make it fire pretty much no matter what else is wrong.








No idea if it'll be any help, but the first thing I would try is replace
the plug. Mine deteriorated to where it would not spark under
compression. It looked fine and sparked nicely in open air, but not in
the cylinder. Cheap fix if your luck's running good lately.

Funniest one was one _cold_ day it wouldn't run more than 3-4 seconds.
After practically disassembling and reassembling the engine, I found
water had frozen in a low part of the exhaust system. First time I had
an engine failure from a frozen up exhaust. Solved the problem with a
hair dryer and thereafter, making sure to rev the engine to expell the
water before shutting down.
Bill

www.wbnoble.com

to contact me, do not reply to this message,
instead correct this address and use it

will iam_ b_ No ble at msn daught com
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On Sat, 08 Apr 2006 21:08:26 GMT, Nick Hull
wrote:

In article ,
JR North wrote:

Sounds like there are several things going on. As John said, it is not
unknown for a cracked plug to fire fine in open air, but short out and
not fire under compression. As Carl said, you prolly have carburation
issues also. As Ken said, #50 ain't gonna cut it; but as you said.....if
you get it lit and blow it out, this may improve. Replace the plug and
start it on starting fluid. If it lights and runs briefly, fix the carb.
If it won't light, tear it down.
JR
Dweller in the cellar

The plug is NEW, properly gapped at .030". Also tried plug gapped at
.020" and .010". Doesn't light.

Tear it down and look for what? It ran fine until one day it wouldn't
start - I thought I fixed THAT problem.


Nick Hull wrote:
I feel like a fool for posting this since I should be able to fix it in
my sleep, but I can't. 1983 Kaweasaki Prairie 3-wheel ATV wouldn't
start. After digging into it I found the 3 screws sheared that transmit
starter torque to the flywheel. Fixed that; engine turns, has
compression (50#, admittedly low, likely dirt on valve seats that would
blow out on start since I measures 100# 2 weeks ago). Starter is
turning motor in the correct direction, the intake & exhaust valve
operate in the correct sequence when I turn the crankshaft by hand, The
spark is hot & blue and will jump a .250" gap in air. Timing is not
adjustable but a timing light seems to show a flash at the correct 10
deg BTDC.

I put gas or starting fluid in the spark plug hole and NO firing.

If I try it with the plug just out of the hole I get fire about 3 times
before it runs out of fuel.

If I crank the engine with the hot wire just off the plug I get fire
between the plug & hot wire, so that proves current is flowing thru the
plug gap BUT the engine fires on every stroke so I could just be seeing
the spark at the top of the exhaust cycle.

I have the feeling I am missing something simple & stupid. Tell me what
stupid thing I forgot. Please.

You are POSITIVE the flywheel key hasn't sheared?
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On Sun, 09 Apr 2006 11:30:47 GMT, Nick Hull
wrote:

In article ,
"Keith Marshall" wrote:

"Nick Hull" wrote in message
I feel like a fool for posting this since I should be able to fix it in
my sleep, but I can't. 1983 Kaweasaki Prairie 3-wheel ATV wouldn't
start. After digging into it I found the 3 screws sheared that transmit
starter torque to the flywheel. Fixed that; engine turns, has
compression (50#, admittedly low, likely dirt on valve seats that would
blow out on start since I measures 100# 2 weeks ago). Starter is
turning motor in the correct direction, the intake & exhaust valve
operate in the correct sequence when I turn the crankshaft by hand, The
spark is hot & blue and will jump a .250" gap in air. Timing is not
adjustable but a timing light seems to show a flash at the correct 10
deg BTDC.

My son had a 1974 Honda 100 that we did some work on and afterward it
wouldn't start. We had a similar situation to yours except that it was a
4-stroke and I'm getting the impression yours is a 2-stroke.

My Kawasaki is a 4-stroke

We had good fire. We obviously had fuel because the plug was getting wet.
We also had great compression though. No matter what we did it just
wouldn't crank.

We finally found out that the cam that lifted the points could be either 180
degrees out or 120 or 240, I can't remember whether it had 3 positions or 2.
At any rate, we moved it to another position and it fired right up.

No cam, no points, just a pickup coil like a magneto but the coil is
battery powered thru an electronic coil driver and it all 'seems' to be
working great.

But with the compression so low it seems like maybe you have a valve hanging
open.

I'm guessing I've got some crud/dirt/fibres under the valve seat from
stuffing rope in the cylinder, hoping it will blow out when it starts.

Best Regards,
Keith Marshall


"I'm not grown up enough to be so old!"



You can expect low compression when cranking many of these engines
because they have a compression release - like Briggs and Stratton
with their "EZEE SPIN"
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