In article 8f_Kf.3814$6H4.366
@fe28.usenetserver.com, ignoramus3408
@NOSPAM.3408.invalid says...
I have this Black and Decker 450 RPM drill:

When plugged into a GFCI outlet, it leaks electricity to ground and
pops the GFCI breaker.

My question is, what is the most likely culprit and how to approach
repair of it.

It trips GFCI outlets; repair it or cut the cord off
and throw it away.

If you need to ask how to repair it ... cut the cord
off and throw it away.

"Ignoramus15109"wrote: (clip) I would like to know the reasoning behind
your opinion (that if I have to ask how to fix it, I should throw it away
(clip)
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
I will answer for Mike. There was something about the tone of your original
post that could be mistaken for naivity. In following the rest of the
thread, including your various responses, I have concluded that expressions
like, "leaks electricity to the case" and "what would be a typical
application for this drill" were not indicative of your non-newbie status.
Clearly, to anyone who read the whole thread, it should be clear that you
not only know what a *megger* is, but you have one, and you know a little
something about the whole subject.

Maybe Mike jumped in and posted without reading the whole thread.

PLEASE don't throw that rugged old drill away. If necessary, use it on a
non-GFI circuit and wear a pair of rubber gloves. It just occurred to
me--maybe this whole thing was just an excuse for you to gloat over the
possession of such a fine old drill. ;-)

If it works, keep it. Especially if it has the bolt hole on the top of
the unit to screw in an auxilary handle. Getting a double handle grip on
it gives you LOTS of control.

Ignoramus15109 wrote:
On Wed, 22 Feb 2006 21:43:38 GMT, Leo Lichtman wrote:

"Ignoramus15109"wrote: (clip) I would like to know the reasoning behind
your opinion (that if I have to ask how to fix it, I should throw it away
(clip)
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
I will answer for Mike. There was something about the tone of your original
post that could be mistaken for naivity. In following the rest of the
thread, including your various responses, I have concluded that expressions
like, "leaks electricity to the case" and "what would be a typical
application for this drill" were not indicative of your non-newbie status.


I believe that you have an extra "not" (or "non") somewhere above.

Otherwise, yes, I think that Mike made some assumptions that were not,
in fact, true.


Clearly, to anyone who read the whole thread, it should be clear that you
not only know what a *megger* is, but you have one, and you know a little
something about the whole subject.


I know a little bit and have done a few electrical projects. Nothing
really advanced, but somewhere at or a little above the level of
repairing an old metal cased drill.


Maybe Mike jumped in and posted without reading the whole thread.

PLEASE don't throw that rugged old drill away. If necessary, use it on a
non-GFI circuit and wear a pair of rubber gloves. It just occurred to
me--maybe this whole thing was just an excuse for you to gloat over the
possession of such a fine old drill. ;-)


Not really. The more I think about it, the more I realize that I
should sell it, as even my 1/2" Dewalt drill is too powerful for my
hands. I would get no benefit from this drill, it is designed for men
stronger than I am. I will likely sell it after I repair it. I first
though to keep it, and then realized that it is too strong for me,
torque wise. As it often happens, I may change my mind.

i

Leo wrote: (clip) not indicative of your non-newbie status. (clip)
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Igor-amp-us wrote: I believe that you have an extra "not" (or "non")
somewhere above.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
to which Leo responds: No. I think I have the right amount of double
negativity. The meaning I was after was, "Your writing style fooled us by
sounding like it came from an uninformed person."

In article %u2Lf.1040$Gz4.781
@fe13.usenetserver.com, ignoramus15109
@NOSPAM.15109.invalid says...
On Wed, 22 Feb 2006 18:54:25 GMT, MikeP wrote:
In article 8f_Kf.3814$6H4.366
@fe28.usenetserver.com, ignoramus3408
@NOSPAM.3408.invalid says...
I have this Black and Decker 450 RPM drill:

When plugged into a GFCI outlet, it leaks electricity to ground and
pops the GFCI breaker.

My question is, what is the most likely culprit and how to approach
repair of it.

It trips GFCI outlets; repair it or cut the cord off
and throw it away.

If you need to ask how to repair it ... cut the cord
off and throw it away.

I would like to know the reasoning behind your opinion (that if I have
to ask how to fix it, I should throw it away). My experience with
repairing various things (spa, compressor, a diesel generator are some
examples) suggests that asking intelligent people nicely results in
good suggestions and finally in good results.

I under estimated your abilities and I tend to error
on the side of safety. I did not intend to be
insulting or inconsiderate. Sorry ...

That said, I would not use (or sell) that drill with
or without rubber gloves until it is properly
repaired.

In defense of Iggy: he asks some pretty basic questions when he starts a
project but seems to power his way through to some exotic questions
fairly quikly. Most of us are not up to designing inverter welder circuits.

Leo Lichtman wrote:

"Ignoramus15109"wrote: (clip) I would like to know the reasoning behind
your opinion (that if I have to ask how to fix it, I should throw it away
(clip)
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
I will answer for Mike. There was something about the tone of your original
post that could be mistaken for naivity. In following the rest of the
thread, including your various responses, I have concluded that expressions
like, "leaks electricity to the case" and "what would be a typical
application for this drill" were not indicative of your non-newbie status.
Clearly, to anyone who read the whole thread, it should be clear that you
not only know what a *megger* is, but you have one, and you know a little
something about the whole subject.

Maybe Mike jumped in and posted without reading the whole thread.

PLEASE don't throw that rugged old drill away. If necessary, use it on a
non-GFI circuit and wear a pair of rubber gloves. It just occurred to
me--maybe this whole thing was just an excuse for you to gloat over the
possession of such a fine old drill. ;-)

On Wed, 22 Feb 2006 22:02:44 GMT, Ignoramus15109
wrote:

snippity snip
Not really. The more I think about it, the more I realize that I
should sell it, as even my 1/2" Dewalt drill is too powerful for my
hands. I would get no benefit from this drill, it is designed for men
stronger than I am. I will likely sell it after I repair it. I first
though to keep it, and then realized that it is too strong for me,
torque wise. As it often happens, I may change my mind.

Hi Iggy,

Harbor Freight puts their Router speed control on sale for
~$12.99 pretty regular. I've used this with my 90 deg angle
drill successfully (single speed). It also works with my
Sears Die Grinder and Milwaukee 4.5 inch Angle Grinder. See:

http://www.harborfreightusa.com/usa/...ateg oryName=

It is in the Feb 27 ending date flier right now for the
aforementioned price. I don't know how well it will hold up,
it isn't very heavy. I can't believe the heatsink inside (I
haven't taken it apart yet) is too substantial. This would
give you a lot more control on a single speed drill though.
--
Leon Fisk
Grand Rapids MI/Zone 5b
Remove no.spam for email

On Thu, 23 Feb 2006 19:46:26 GMT, Ignoramus22178
wrote:

On Thu, 23 Feb 2006 14:29:51 -0500, Leon Fisk wrote:
On Wed, 22 Feb 2006 22:02:44 GMT, Ignoramus15109
wrote:

snippity snip
Not really. The more I think about it, the more I realize that I
should sell it, as even my 1/2" Dewalt drill is too powerful for my
hands. I would get no benefit from this drill, it is designed for men
stronger than I am. I will likely sell it after I repair it. I first
though to keep it, and then realized that it is too strong for me,
torque wise. As it often happens, I may change my mind.

Hi Iggy,

Harbor Freight puts their Router speed control on sale for
~$12.99 pretty regular. I've used this with my 90 deg angle
drill successfully (single speed). It also works with my
Sears Die Grinder and Milwaukee 4.5 inch Angle Grinder. See:

http://www.harborfreightusa.com/usa/...ateg oryName=

It is in the Feb 27 ending date flier right now for the
aforementioned price. I don't know how well it will hold up,
it isn't very heavy. I can't believe the heatsink inside (I
haven't taken it apart yet) is too substantial. This would
give you a lot more control on a single speed drill though.

Leon, that's an interesting item... But my issue is torque, not
speed. What I was saying was, my regular drill has too much torque
fgor me anyway, why would I want a drill with even more torque. A good
answer to it was that this 450 rpm drill can have an extra long handle
screwed in, so that I could handle extra torque. I think that I will
keep this drill for now.

As far as this speed control goes, I am not sure how I would benefit
from it, personally. It is a very interesting item though.

Hi Iggy,

If you decrease the speed with the above said item, you will
also be decreasing the torque. IOW you would be able hold
the drill and stall it out at some point and not end up
looking like a pretzel. Whether or not the speed control
would be up to the stalled condition (I think it would) and
for how long is an unknown question.

Do you still have those Sears Die Grinders you wrote about
awhile back? If so did you ever get around to replacing the
bearings or figuring out why they were so noisy? I suspect I
have one just like them (bought it new) and it sounds loud
too (soon after using it, it is virtually new yet). I always
suspected a vibration/harmonic was setting up in mine. I've
been meaning to try the speed control on it for longer than
just a test and find out if backing off on the RPM a bit
gets rid of it. I should have the manual around for it
somewhere too...

--
Leon Fisk
Grand Rapids MI/Zone 5b
Remove no.spam for email

On Thu, 23 Feb 2006 20:24:53 GMT, Ignoramus22178
wrote:

snip
Do you still have those Sears Die Grinders you wrote about
awhile back?

I sold one a while ago (for $52) and kept another.

If so did you ever get around to replacing the
bearings or figuring out why they were so noisy?

No, but it is straightforward -- go to sears.com and get the
bearings. I just did not get around to it.

I suspect I have one just like them (bought it new) and it sounds
loud too (soon after using it, it is virtually new yet). I always
suspected a vibration/harmonic was setting up in mine. I've been
meaning to try the speed control on it for longer than just a test
and find out if backing off on the RPM a bit gets rid of it. I
should have the manual around for it somewhere too...

I would be greatly interested in your findings actually. I decided
that for whatever little use this grinder gets, I can tolerate a bit
of noise and vibration.

I've got to dig it out and pretend it is really a router for
a short time and finish a Deadbolt strike plate recess
pretty soon. I'll let you know how the speed control works
and whether I can quiet it down or not.
--
Leon Fisk
Grand Rapids MI/Zone 5b
Remove no.spam for email