Is there a source for information covering the restoration of
Starrett's MACHINIST TOOL BOX?

The reason for asking is that I have recently purchased one and have
discovered one of its felts is loose and appears to have shrunk.

It needs a key; are there any sources for one?

Can the felt be cleaned and if so what technique should be used?

Thanks.

Is there a source for information covering the restoration of
Starrett's MACHINIST TOOL BOX?


If there is one I'm not aware of it. The box was made by Gerstner. They did not
have keys for mine. There is a number on the lock if you want to ask them. They
have a website so you can email them.

If your felt is oily I would suggest replacement. Mine needs this but I haven't
gotten around to it. I think its glued in with a light coat of elmers type
glue. You might ask Gerstner. Its been awhile since I asked. Felt is fairly
inexpensive. I tried a spot carpet cleaner but was not satisfied with the
results. I think replacement is the best idea.

Gary Repesh

GJRepesh wrote:

Is there a source for information covering the restoration of
Starrett's MACHINIST TOOL BOX?



If there is one I'm not aware of it. The box was made by Gerstner. They did not
have keys for mine. There is a number on the lock if you want to ask them. They
have a website so you can email them.

If your felt is oily I would suggest replacement. Mine needs this but I haven't
gotten around to it. I think its glued in with a light coat of elmers type
glue. You might ask Gerstner. Its been awhile since I asked. Felt is fairly
inexpensive. I tried a spot carpet cleaner but was not satisfied with the
results. I think replacement is the best idea.

Gary Repesh
Gary -

Why do you say one must get rid of the oily felt ?

I would assume some oil would be good in the tray to generally form a film
across the tools and prevent rust.

Maybe you are meaning real soggy types.

Can you let us know ?

Martin

--
Martin Eastburn, Barbara Eastburn
@ home at Lion's Lair with our computer
NRA LOH, NRA Life
NRA Second Amendment Task Force Charter Founder

To me a restoration is bringing an item back to like new condition. Oily felt
does not fit in my definition. I have not had a rust problem with my tools in a
chest. And it is humid here in Texas. I will replace oily felt.

Gary Repesh

Regarding the key, I have an old (1961 vintage) South Bend lathe with an
underdrive cabinet. The cabinet has three drawers on the left side that
were in great condition with a keyed latch. Of course the keys were
long lost. South Bend, nor Leblonde had replacement keys. I took off
the locks and brought them to a locksmith to have keys fitted. It cost
me about $40. The key was an old "flag" style. Of course the keys
aren't original South Bend, but the locks work now. Interestingly, the
locksmith showed me a round washer like part that he took out of the
inside of the locks. With the washer installed, it acted as a block to
keep the lock from working even if you had the right key. With it out,
the lock worked very smoothly. I've no idea why South Bend would have
installed this washer....

Dave Young

fichensie wrote:

Is there a source for information covering the restoration of
Starrett's MACHINIST TOOL BOX?

The reason for asking is that I have recently purchased one and have
discovered one of its felts is loose and appears to have shrunk.

It needs a key; are there any sources for one?

Can the felt be cleaned and if so what technique should be used?

Thanks.

In article , Dave Young says...

Regarding the key, I have an old (1961 vintage) South Bend lathe with an
underdrive cabinet. The cabinet has three drawers on the left side that
were in great condition with a keyed latch. Of course the keys were
long lost. South Bend, nor Leblonde had replacement keys. I took off
the locks and brought them to a locksmith to have keys fitted. It cost
me about $40. The key was an old "flag" style. Of course the keys
aren't original South Bend, but the locks work now. Interestingly, the
locksmith showed me a round washer like part that he took out of the
inside of the locks. With the washer installed, it acted as a block to
keep the lock from working even if you had the right key. With it out,
the lock worked very smoothly. I've no idea why South Bend would have
installed this washer....

It's possible this might have been an option, so that schools
or industrial plants could prevent folks from locking the drawers
so that the tooling inside could be available for everyone to
use.

Jim

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In article , fichensie says...

Is there a source for information covering the restoration of
Starrett's MACHINIST TOOL BOX?

As others have commented, this was probably not manufactured
by starrett, but by anothe company, for them.

The reason for asking is that I have recently purchased one and have
discovered one of its felts is loose and appears to have shrunk.

I re-did an old oak Scherr toolbox by replacing all the felts
at once. Others have strongly suggested to avoid white glue
as some of the ingredients might promote rust in the tools.
They suggest contact cement IIRC. I re-did mine before the
thread happened, and used elmer's white glue.
The box has been in use for years now, and does not seem
to rust tools noticeably, though.

It needs a key; are there any sources for one?

Your best bet is taking the lock mechanism to a good locksmith,
he may be able to make one for you.

Jim

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JRR(zero) at yktvmv (dot) vnet (dot) ibm (dot) com
==================================================

Jim,

I had never thought of that. I was thinking negatively; that maybe
South Bend (for a price) would give you an operational lock....

:-)

Dave

jim rozen wrote:

In article , Dave Young says...


Regarding the key, I have an old (1961 vintage) South Bend lathe with an
underdrive cabinet. The cabinet has three drawers on the left side that
were in great condition with a keyed latch. Of course the keys were
long lost. South Bend, nor Leblonde had replacement keys. I took off
the locks and brought them to a locksmith to have keys fitted. It cost
me about $40. The key was an old "flag" style. Of course the keys
aren't original South Bend, but the locks work now. Interestingly, the
locksmith showed me a round washer like part that he took out of the
inside of the locks. With the washer installed, it acted as a block to
keep the lock from working even if you had the right key. With it out,
the lock worked very smoothly. I've no idea why South Bend would have
installed this washer....



It's possible this might have been an option, so that schools
or industrial plants could prevent folks from locking the drawers
so that the tooling inside could be available for everyone to
use.

Jim

================================================= =
please reply to:
JRR(zero) at yktvmv (dot) vnet (dot) ibm (dot) com
================================================= =

On Sun, 11 Jan 2004 16:47:41 GMT, Dave Young
wrote:

Regarding the key, I have an old (1961 vintage) South Bend lathe with an
underdrive cabinet. The cabinet has three drawers on the left side that
were in great condition with a keyed latch. Of course the keys were
long lost. South Bend, nor Leblonde had replacement keys. I took off
the locks and brought them to a locksmith to have keys fitted. It cost
me about $40. The key was an old "flag" style. Of course the keys
aren't original South Bend, but the locks work now. Interestingly, the
locksmith showed me a round washer like part that he took out of the
inside of the locks. With the washer installed, it acted as a block to
keep the lock from working even if you had the right key. With it out,
the lock worked very smoothly. I've no idea why South Bend would have
installed this washer....

Is that on a cabinet stand that has a frame that comes up to the top
in a wide, continuous "U" shape? Or two U's sort of like this U_U?

That particular model was often found on ships and in military shops.
It was built to a milspec standard and there were both South Bend and
Standard-Modern lathes built to meet the same spec on a very similar
style stand. They came *fully* equipped with tooling and the drawers
had exquisite fittings for storing and supporting all the bits and
pieces.

Those cabinet stands with the rounded corners on the frames could be
skidded up and down ladders and passageways on ships and in and out of
trucks on mobile or field machine shops.

It may be that the milspec on those called for drawers that latched
shut but did not lock. If that is the case, it might it be that locks
were an inherent part of the drawers but were not part of the milspec
and were disabled by the piece you mention to meet the spec.



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Actually, I used to use a lathe exactly like this one on an old Coast
Guard 180' buoy tender (built around 1943 and still in service in 1995).
This lathe doesn't have legs in the normal since of the word, but the
left side is where the motor, belt and adjustment mechanism is (behind a
door). The right side has three drawers. In the middle is nothing but
a space with a piece of sheet metal bent at the bottom to give a lip for
rigidity. But this lathe was sold to Packard Machinery in January 1961
(according to Rose, who used to work for Leblonde). But the locks very
well might have been made not to be operational for reasons other than
profit. Who knows....

Thanks for the input Jack (sounds like you've got a bit of shipboard
experience)...

Jack Erbes wrote:

On Sun, 11 Jan 2004 16:47:41 GMT, Dave Young
wrote:



Regarding the key, I have an old (1961 vintage) South Bend lathe with an
underdrive cabinet. The cabinet has three drawers on the left side that
were in great condition with a keyed latch. Of course the keys were
long lost. South Bend, nor Leblonde had replacement keys. I took off
the locks and brought them to a locksmith to have keys fitted. It cost
me about $40. The key was an old "flag" style. Of course the keys
aren't original South Bend, but the locks work now. Interestingly, the
locksmith showed me a round washer like part that he took out of the
inside of the locks. With the washer installed, it acted as a block to
keep the lock from working even if you had the right key. With it out,
the lock worked very smoothly. I've no idea why South Bend would have
installed this washer....



Is that on a cabinet stand that has a frame that comes up to the top
in a wide, continuous "U" shape? Or two U's sort of like this U_U?

That particular model was often found on ships and in military shops.
It was built to a milspec standard and there were both South Bend and
Standard-Modern lathes built to meet the same spec on a very similar
style stand. They came *fully* equipped with tooling and the drawers
had exquisite fittings for storing and supporting all the bits and
pieces.

Those cabinet stands with the rounded corners on the frames could be
skidded up and down ladders and passageways on ships and in and out of
trucks on mobile or field machine shops.

It may be that the milspec on those called for drawers that latched
shut but did not lock. If that is the case, it might it be that locks
were an inherent part of the drawers but were not part of the milspec
and were disabled by the piece you mention to meet the spec.



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On Fri, 16 Jan 2004 20:12:13 GMT, Dave Young
wrote:

snip
Thanks for the input Jack (sounds like you've got a bit of shipboard
experience)...


26 years in the Navy and only about two years or so actually on ships
at sea. And that was never more than 60 days at one stretch.

I had a pretty good deal in the Navy, I was in a shore duty rating
(Cryptologic Technician) that put small detachments on board
combatants after the ships were deployed. And we usually left as the
ship was going home. So we did not have to live through the yard
periods and pre-deployment workups. The down side was that, as
spooks, we were misunderstood and resented as outsiders. But we
occasionally did something good for somebody even if we couldn't talk
about it.

But once I became aware of lathes, it seemed like I would run into one
or two somewhere on board every ship. It made me crazy to look at
some of them. That 10" South Bend with the fitted drawers with two
chucks, a Jacobs collet chuck set, taper attachment, cutting tool
holders, and all the other basic attachments in the fitted drawers
used to really make me nuts.

Any ship that had a electric motor rebuilding shop had a lathe. I
made friends with an Chief Electrician's Mate on one of them that
spent a some of his off duty time making models of cannons on the
lathe in his shop. Spent a couple of evenings down there watching him
work and it was a pleasure. That was the cleanest lathe I ever saw in
the Navy. His guys used it too, but they did about 30 minutes of
cleaning for every 15 minutes of turning.

If I was going to look for machinery in a smaller ship, I would start
in the electric shop, then move to the engine room. But on some ships
they were in some real strange places, I know I missed seeing a bunch
of them because I was not a snipe.



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Jack,

29 years in the Coast Guard for me (as of 20 January) and still going.
I'm doing the full 30 (actually I have authorization to do two years
after that, but they're not offering me any good jobs, so probably will
be retiring this year with terminal leave). I am/was a snipe (now CWO).
About 33 years ago the CG combined a lot of the engineering ratings
(Engineman, Machinist Mate, Boilerman, etc) into one rating Machinery
Technician (MK). Unfortunately when they did that we lost a lot of our
expertise. Very few folks active duty in the CG know how to use machine
tools (lathes, milling machines, etc) other than simple drill presses
and bench grinders. Even with simple machine tools we don't know how to
properly use them (I've got a bench grinder at work right now that I've
got tagged out because someone used it for aluminum. I've got a new
wheel, but I won't put it on until I give the guys some training.).
Most of our machining needs are either contracted out, or we have
civilians at some of our bigger units that are machinists.

I was on isolated duty on Kure Island, Hawaii and had a relatively new
Craftsman (I assume Atlas) lathe. No one, including me, knew how to use
it. So it sat there unused. Probably for years. After that tour, I
took a shop class in Alaska and learned the basics of using a lathe
(even used a mill). At the time I was running the vehicle maintenance
shop in Ketchikan. I ended up making some parts for some government
vehicles (door hinge pins and bushings for example) and forklifts, and
for my Harley. From there I went to the CGC Sweetgum, an old 180' buoy
tender built sometime around 1943. Had a pair of old straight eight
Cooper Bessember engines (quietest diesel engines I'd ever heard. You
could have a conversation between them with them running until you
started the ships service generators - 6-71 Detroit Diesels. They
drove generators that ran the single propulsion motor. To start the
engines you would motorize the generators). In the auxiliary shop in
the main motor room we had a 9" South Bend lathe that was very similar
to the lathe I have now (honest I paid for mine, I have a receipt!!!!).
We had to rebuild a couple of heads underway on the Coopers but we
didn't have the tools to pull out the valve guides, nor push them back
in. The engineers were amazed when I went back to the lathe and turned
the stuff we needed and we were able to rebuild the heads. My next unit
was a 210' WMEC (medium endurance cutter) as the Auxiliary Chief. With
the lathe I bought for the cutter (The EO didn't think we'd use a lathe,
but I pestered him until he gave in), I built replacement clutch dogs
for our port anchor windlass and a new pump shaft for the condensate
cooler pump for the boilers. We had tested the anchor windlasses just
before going to REFTRA. When we tried to raise the anchor the windlass
"slipped". The command was upset as the windlasses had to work as it
would have been a restrictive and not allowed to go through the
mandatory training. I took off an inspection cover and found that the
part the clutch dog went into would raise about 1/2" under load which
caused the mechanism to slip preventing the anchor from raising. The
week before I had been over at the scrap bin at the Navy base we tied up
at (Panama City, Florida) and picked up a piece of 2" or so round stock.
With this round stock I built longer clutch dogs that allowed the
windlass to work properly. When we got back we rebuilt the windlass and
replaced the stock dogs, but it did allow us to finish REFTRA. My EO
later told me that listening to me about buying that lathe was one of
the smartest things he'd ever done.

I'm not trying to brag here, but just show how important it is for us to
keep our skills. Last year I jumped at the chance to buy a South Bend
lathe that I mentioned earlier. I don't even try to call myself a
machinist, but I do have fun with it.

Dave

In article , Dave Young says...

From there I went to the CGC Sweetgum, an old 180' buoy
tender built sometime around 1943. Had a pair of old straight eight
Cooper Bessember engines (quietest diesel engines I'd ever heard. You
could have a conversation between them with them running until you
started the ships service generators - 6-71 Detroit Diesels. They
drove generators that ran the single propulsion motor. To start the
engines you would motorize the generators).

That sounds like quite a ship.

caused the mechanism to slip preventing the anchor from raising. The
week before I had been over at the scrap bin at the Navy base we tied up
at (Panama City, Florida) and picked up a piece of 2" or so round stock.

Hey - I've been at that navy base!

Jim

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It was our homeport. The cutter's name was the Courageous (now
decommissioned). I was stationed on her from 1989 - 1991.

jim rozen wrote:

In article , Dave Young says...



From there I went to the CGC Sweetgum, an old 180' buoy
tender built sometime around 1943. Had a pair of old straight eight
Cooper Bessember engines (quietest diesel engines I'd ever heard. You
could have a conversation between them with them running until you
started the ships service generators - 6-71 Detroit Diesels. They
drove generators that ran the single propulsion motor. To start the
engines you would motorize the generators).



That sounds like quite a ship.



caused the mechanism to slip preventing the anchor from raising. The
week before I had been over at the scrap bin at the Navy base we tied up
at (Panama City, Florida) and picked up a piece of 2" or so round stock.



Hey - I've been at that navy base!

Jim

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In article , Dave Young says...

It was our homeport. The cutter's name was the Courageous (now
decommissioned). I was stationed on her from 1989 - 1991.

Ah, I might have seen that ship then. We had to drive past
the CG dock to get to where we were working down there, in
the non-mag area. I remember there was a coke machine
on the other side of the road, that had the least expensive
sodas anywhere.

Jim

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