Toilet is at least 25 years old. One of the good ones, with big tank
and lots of flushing power. Sits on a concrete slab floor, vinyl tile.
Never had a problem with it beyond a few minor leaks, replacing the
float & fill mechanism, etc. Rarely clogged.

So, the other day, I accidentally bumped against it and it MOVED a good
half inch on the floor.

I checked the flange bolts and they are loose as can be. I can actually
pick the bowl up about 1/4 inch off the floor and set it back down. I
haven't taken the bolt covers off yet, so I don't know exactly what the
problem might be.

Going to HD on my lunch hour to get a new wax ring and flange kit. Will
fix this weekend. But I'm curious about how something that has been so
secure for so long can suddenly start to move around like this.

-Frank

--
fwarner1-at-franksknives-dot-com
Here's some of my work:
http://www.franksknives.com/

Frank J Warner wrote:
Toilet is at least 25 years old. One of the good ones, with big tank
and lots of flushing power. Sits on a concrete slab floor, vinyl
tile.
Never had a problem with it beyond a few minor leaks, replacing the
float & fill mechanism, etc. Rarely clogged.

So, the other day, I accidentally bumped against it and it MOVED a
good
half inch on the floor.

I checked the flange bolts and they are loose as can be. I can
actually
pick the bowl up about 1/4 inch off the floor and set it back down. I
haven't taken the bolt covers off yet, so I don't know exactly what
the
problem might be.

Going to HD on my lunch hour to get a new wax ring and flange kit.
Will
fix this weekend. But I'm curious about how something that has been
so
secure for so long can suddenly start to move around like this.

-Frank

--
fwarner1-at-franksknives-dot-com
Here's some of my work:
http://www.franksknives.com/


Since you haven't looked under the covers, I'm going to make a guess
that one or both bolts are rusted through.


Joe

Frank J Warner wrote:
....
...But I'm curious about how something that has been so
secure for so long can suddenly start to move around like this.

I suspect it isn't sudden at all, but you just applied the last bit to
break it loose....

I suspect either the bolts have corroded through or the concrete has
spalled to let the bolt loose...

On Thu, 03 Mar 2005 13:17:15 -0600, Duane Bozarth
wrote:

Frank J Warner wrote:
...
...But I'm curious about how something that has been so
secure for so long can suddenly start to move around like this.

I suspect it isn't sudden at all, but you just applied the last bit to
break it loose....

I suspect either the bolts have corroded through or the concrete has
spalled to let the bolt loose...

Unless that toilet is REALLY old (pre-1940 or so), the mounting bolts
are never set into the concrete. They are set thru the ears or flanges
of the closet flange - the top fo the drain pipe.

In many cases of looseness, either the bolts have rusted or the ears
have broken or cracked on the flange.

There are reinforcing kits sold that mount behind the flange . New
bolts would be inserted thru these reinforcing paltes.

Doug

"Frank J Warner" wrote in message
news:030320051107094224%warnerf@veriSPAMMERSDIEzon .net...
Toilet is at least 25 years old. One of the good ones, with big tank
and lots of flushing power. Sits on a concrete slab floor, vinyl tile.
Never had a problem with it beyond a few minor leaks, replacing the
float & fill mechanism, etc. Rarely clogged.

So, the other day, I accidentally bumped against it and it MOVED a good
half inch on the floor.

I checked the flange bolts and they are loose as can be. I can actually
pick the bowl up about 1/4 inch off the floor and set it back down. I
haven't taken the bolt covers off yet, so I don't know exactly what the
problem might be.

Going to HD on my lunch hour to get a new wax ring and flange kit. Will
fix this weekend. But I'm curious about how something that has been so
secure for so long can suddenly start to move around like this.

-Frank


I'm also going to jump on the band wagon and suggest the bolts on the flange
have rusted. Easy to fix.

Rusted bolts, very likely. But before you start your job I would like
to suggest a new modern alternative to the wax ring which will leak if
the toilet ever moves. The new method is made of PVC with a rubber lip
at the top and two O-rings on the bottom. I know that Lowes sells them
but they are not on the top shelf like wax rings. They are a few more
dollars expensive but it's worth it. They can even be reused.



Frank J Warner wrote:
Toilet is at least 25 years old. One of the good ones, with big tank
and lots of flushing power. Sits on a concrete slab floor, vinyl tile.
Never had a problem with it beyond a few minor leaks, replacing the
float & fill mechanism, etc. Rarely clogged.

So, the other day, I accidentally bumped against it and it MOVED a good
half inch on the floor.

I checked the flange bolts and they are loose as can be. I can actually
pick the bowl up about 1/4 inch off the floor and set it back down. I
haven't taken the bolt covers off yet, so I don't know exactly what the
problem might be.

Going to HD on my lunch hour to get a new wax ring and flange kit. Will
fix this weekend. But I'm curious about how something that has been so
secure for so long can suddenly start to move around like this.

-Frank

Isn't the flange just a slip fit on the sewer pipe?


"Doug" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 03 Mar 2005 13:17:15 -0600, Duane Bozarth
wrote:

Frank J Warner wrote:
...
...But I'm curious about how something that has been so
secure for so long can suddenly start to move around like this.

I suspect it isn't sudden at all, but you just applied the last bit to
break it loose....

I suspect either the bolts have corroded through or the concrete has
spalled to let the bolt loose...

Unless that toilet is REALLY old (pre-1940 or so), the mounting bolts
are never set into the concrete. They are set thru the ears or flanges
of the closet flange - the top fo the drain pipe.

In many cases of looseness, either the bolts have rusted or the ears
have broken or cracked on the flange.

There are reinforcing kits sold that mount behind the flange . New
bolts would be inserted thru these reinforcing paltes.

Doug

Blue wrote:
Isn't the flange just a slip fit on the sewer pipe?


Some are, but you have you use one of the two-piece ones (Two "U" shaped
pieces) to replace it unless you want to start ripping the pipes apart.

I had exactly the same problem with a dowstairs toilet sitting on
ceramic tiles over concrete. The steel flange had rotted away so there
was nothing left to hold the heads of the bolts down.

I solved the problem by drilling two 1/2" diameter holes about two
inches deep at the proper bolt locations and securing two stainless
steel hex head bolts upside down in the holes with "Rockite" expanding
cement.

http://www.rockite.com/

(There are lots of other brands of similar stuff.)

I used a strip of wood with two holes in it to keep the bolts vertical
while the cement set.

As they say down Maine, "It worked slicker than snot on a brass doorknob."

Jeff
--
Jeffry Wisnia

(W1BSV + Brass Rat '57 EE)

"As long as there are final exams, there will be prayer in public
schools"