I have a 3 zone boiler system that is managed from one thermostat. To
tell why is a long story of an old house where I found that all three
zones were wired to this mid-level zone. We were to be out of the
house for awhile, so the t-stat program was overridden to allow the
temperature to temporarily drop. Upon resuming the schedule, the
middle zone is not distributing heat. The other two do distribute
heat.

The two valves that are not using their mercury thermostats appear to
be in the "open" position based on the "open" text that I see on the
dial. The middle one does not appear to read "open" or "closed" and is
not easily rotated. All three devices are labeled white-rogers
1311-102 3/4" .4A 25 VAC.

Does the system need bled? If so, is that something easily done? The
pipes from the three valves are all warm/hot to the touch, but for some
reason the water does not seem to be circulating through the middle
zone.

Of course, being Saturday in a NE snow storm is limiting my options to
call someone over.

Any advice on what it may be and/or whether it is something that is
easily fixable?

Thank you,
Dave

Dave, it's hard to tell from the info you're giving, however, with the
thermostat raised, check one of the working zone valves wires or terminals
to see that you have 24 volts (which you should) now check the not working
valve to see if you have 24 volts: If you don't - you have a wiring problem
and if you do, you have a bad zone valve. In either case you should be able
to open the valve manually and lock it open, which will give you heat to
that zone whenever the thermostat calls and probably a small amount through
convection when the thermostat is off
wrote in message
oups.com...
I have a 3 zone boiler system that is managed from one thermostat. To
tell why is a long story of an old house where I found that all three
zones were wired to this mid-level zone. We were to be out of the
house for awhile, so the t-stat program was overridden to allow the
temperature to temporarily drop. Upon resuming the schedule, the
middle zone is not distributing heat. The other two do distribute
heat.

The two valves that are not using their mercury thermostats appear to
be in the "open" position based on the "open" text that I see on the
dial. The middle one does not appear to read "open" or "closed" and is
not easily rotated. All three devices are labeled white-rogers
1311-102 3/4" .4A 25 VAC.

Does the system need bled? If so, is that something easily done? The
pipes from the three valves are all warm/hot to the touch, but for some
reason the water does not seem to be circulating through the middle
zone.

Of course, being Saturday in a NE snow storm is limiting my options to
call someone over.

Any advice on what it may be and/or whether it is something that is
easily fixable?

Thank you,
Dave

wrote in message
oups.com...
I have a 3 zone boiler system that is managed from one thermostat. To
tell why is a long story of an old house where I found that all three
zones were wired to this mid-level zone. We were to be out of the
house for awhile, so the t-stat program was overridden to allow the
temperature to temporarily drop. Upon resuming the schedule, the
middle zone is not distributing heat. The other two do distribute
heat.

The two valves that are not using their mercury thermostats appear to
be in the "open" position based on the "open" text that I see on the
dial. The middle one does not appear to read "open" or "closed" and is
not easily rotated. All three devices are labeled white-rogers
1311-102 3/4" .4A 25 VAC.

Does the system need bled? If so, is that something easily done? The
pipes from the three valves are all warm/hot to the touch, but for some
reason the water does not seem to be circulating through the middle
zone.

Of course, being Saturday in a NE snow storm is limiting my options to
call someone over.

Any advice on what it may be and/or whether it is something that is
easily fixable?

Thank you,
Dave

You really need to make a call to a competent HVAC company. Let them worry
about the snow and whether they can make it there or not.

~kjpro~

Dave, let me revise my previous post. This is a pretty complex valve for an
amateur and you probably should call a pro, however if you are up to the
task: This particular valve has an "open" and a "close" circuit. With the
thermostat raised, you should get 24 volts between terminals 5 and 4: If you
do, you have a stuck or bad valve if its not opening
"RBM" rmottola1(remove wrote in message
...
Dave, it's hard to tell from the info you're giving, however, with the
thermostat raised, check one of the working zone valves wires or terminals
to see that you have 24 volts (which you should) now check the not working
valve to see if you have 24 volts: If you don't - you have a wiring
problem and if you do, you have a bad zone valve. In either case you
should be able to open the valve manually and lock it open, which will
give you heat to that zone whenever the thermostat calls and probably a
small amount through convection when the thermostat is off
wrote in message
oups.com...
I have a 3 zone boiler system that is managed from one thermostat. To
tell why is a long story of an old house where I found that all three
zones were wired to this mid-level zone. We were to be out of the
house for awhile, so the t-stat program was overridden to allow the
temperature to temporarily drop. Upon resuming the schedule, the
middle zone is not distributing heat. The other two do distribute
heat.

The two valves that are not using their mercury thermostats appear to
be in the "open" position based on the "open" text that I see on the
dial. The middle one does not appear to read "open" or "closed" and is
not easily rotated. All three devices are labeled white-rogers
1311-102 3/4" .4A 25 VAC.

Does the system need bled? If so, is that something easily done? The
pipes from the three valves are all warm/hot to the touch, but for some
reason the water does not seem to be circulating through the middle
zone.

Of course, being Saturday in a NE snow storm is limiting my options to
call someone over.

Any advice on what it may be and/or whether it is something that is
easily fixable?

Thank you,
Dave

Ok, I will check the voltage.

Now, as for setting it open (heat when called for, small amount when
off), I would surmise that that is better than what I think is
happening...which is the boiler is running continuously trying to heat
that part of the house where the thermostat is located.
Thank you for the quick replies.
Dave

If you can get the valve opened manually, hot water will flow through it
whenever the thermostat calls for heat
wrote in message
ups.com...
Ok, I will check the voltage.

Now, as for setting it open (heat when called for, small amount when
off), I would surmise that that is better than what I think is
happening...which is the boiler is running continuously trying to heat
that part of the house where the thermostat is located.
Thank you for the quick replies.
Dave

wrote in message
oups.com...
I have a 3 zone boiler system that is managed from one thermostat. To
tell why is a long story of an old house where I found that all three
zones were wired to this mid-level zone. We were to be out of the
house for awhile, so the t-stat program was overridden to allow the
temperature to temporarily drop. Upon resuming the schedule, the
middle zone is not distributing heat. The other two do distribute
heat.

I don't know the answer to your present problem, but . . . . .

If you have three zones of heating, wouldn't it be better to have each zone
controlled on its own? Why not call in a pro and see what can be done.
Overall it will save you money if you can keep the unused areas of the house
a bit cooler.

Moving the middle-level dial is difficult and immovable so far). It
appears to be in between settings, as I do not see the text of being
"open" or "closed" as I do on the others. Does this control all three
valves since they are wired to it, or is it more likely that two are in
constant "open" and the middle valve is simply regulating that
particular zone and not allowing the distribution of hot water?

On the side of the boiler, there are three pipes labeled "family,"
"living" and "upstairs" corresponding to the three zones. Each of
these has a ball valve with a spigot within a few inches. I'm assuming
that these are to drain the system. On the pipes for the two working
areas, i can feel heat on either side of the valve. On the one that is
not working, I do not feel heat on the lower portion (which appears to
be the feed for the living area). What are the ball and spigot valves
for (bleeding)? If air somehow got into the pipe, or is there a chance
a cold spot froze in the pipe when the temp was down, would it make
sense to bleed this portion?

TIA,
Dave

yes, they are for draining and bleeding. You should have one zone valve for
each zone and if all three are controlled by one thermostat, they should all
open and all close by the one thermostat, which should also turn on the
circulator that pumps the hot water through the valves and pipes. It sounds
like the one valve is stuck. You should be able to turn the dial manually
until it says "Open", at which point you should fee the water temp change in
the pipe. Of course if its frozen, you're out of luck
wrote in message
oups.com...
Moving the middle-level dial is difficult and immovable so far). It
appears to be in between settings, as I do not see the text of being
"open" or "closed" as I do on the others. Does this control all three
valves since they are wired to it, or is it more likely that two are in
constant "open" and the middle valve is simply regulating that
particular zone and not allowing the distribution of hot water?

On the side of the boiler, there are three pipes labeled "family,"
"living" and "upstairs" corresponding to the three zones. Each of
these has a ball valve with a spigot within a few inches. I'm assuming
that these are to drain the system. On the pipes for the two working
areas, i can feel heat on either side of the valve. On the one that is
not working, I do not feel heat on the lower portion (which appears to
be the feed for the living area). What are the ball and spigot valves
for (bleeding)? If air somehow got into the pipe, or is there a chance
a cold spot froze in the pipe when the temp was down, would it make
sense to bleed this portion?

TIA,
Dave

Edwin Pawlowski wrote:
I don't know the answer to your present problem, but . . . . .

If you have three zones of heating, wouldn't it be better to have
each zone
controlled on its own? Why not call in a pro and see what can be
done.
Overall it will save you money if you can keep the unused areas of
the house
a bit cooler.

Yes it would. However, when we originally called someone in last year,
the cost to fix the other two components to get them firing correctly
was quoted at roughly 20% of a new system. We're not sure whether we
want to keep this current system and our timeline is 4-5 years for that
decision (and more importantly, budget availability). So, we decided
to bide our time until the budget was available and in the interim, add
insulation, and do other fundamental things before deciding on fixing
the current system, upgrading or resizing it to meet the enhanced
characteristics the insulation and other things provide, or overhaul
the current system and replace with heating and cooling.

In the interim, given our house configuration, managing temperature
from the middle zone seems to naturally regulate the other levels. We
use our lowest level less frequently than the middle level and we sleep
in the upper level, which benefits from the natural rise of the heat
and we use the prog t-stat to allow the temp to drop at night.

Would it be even more efficient to revamp the system for 3 zone
control? I don't know. However, I'm hesitant to put that type of
investment in an old system that may only be in place a couple of
years. Given this situation, we may be forced to acquire more quotes
and bite the bullet.

Dave

"You should be able to turn the dial manually
until it says "Open", at which point you should fee the water temp
change in
the pipe. Of course if its frozen, you're out of luck"

The odd thing is, the water is "hot" on top of the ball valve and cold
at the bottom...no one has changed the position of the ball valve and
it is in the same position as the others?! I doubt this could happen,
but could something get frozen in one of the lines?

Just a follow up to the issue...

There was a frozen pipe in the basement crawlspace. The insulation
installers did not extend the joist insulation 3 ft into a space where
the water comes down from near the side of the house and back into the
crawlspace. There was a draft in the space and evidently they thought
that the towels/rags that someone had stuffed in there years ago
(before we moved in) was sufficient?! Not only was it frozen there,
but by the time I found it, it had frozen along a 8 foot section right
to left to where the pipe extends back out (if you can vision an 8 foot
living space area where the floor extends to a large window, the
fin-tube runs along either side).

This also explains why the floor in that area is very cold all the
time...I figured it was from the result of the large pane of glass, but
in looking underneath it is because there is no insulation and is
basically a large, exposed box.
Insulation company is coming to fix this.