Diesel brought next idea :
FromTheRafters
Mon, 30 May 2016 18:18:28 GMT in
alt.home.repair, wrote:

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34967 5A576C30614756794943413D


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My apologies for posting this, but he started it.

trader_4 presented the following explanation :
On Tuesday, May 31, 2016 at 6:36:49 PM UTC-4, FromTheRafters wrote:
Doug Miller wrote :
FromTheRafters wrote in news:nikq90$udm$1
@news.albasani.net:

The natural number one with an exponent of two can equal two under the
right circumstances, but I wouldn't expect a seventh grader to know
this or that adding *all* natural numbers together gives -1/12.

The set of natural numbers is the infinite set {1, 2, 3, 4, ...} and its
sum is likewise infinite.

Sure, doing it *that* way. Of course you would never get there to *all*
natural numbers since it is an infinite process. It doesn't make sense
in arithmetic to us seventh gradeers now just like the previous
division by zero being undefined wouldn't make sense to a seventh
grader. That was my point. however with some redefining of things into
a different system of which seventh graders are not aware you can get
different results. Results that work in that system.

And under no circumstances at all is one to the second power equal to two.

Perhaps you should wait to post again until after you've sobered up. ;-)

In an additive group in the integers (which the naturals are a subset
of) exponentiation is the repeated application of the group operator
just as it is in multiplicative groups. It just so happens that
repeated addition is equivalent to multiplication and we aren't used to
thinking of it as exponentiation. I said exponent and right
circumstances. I didn't say second power, because that would have been
misleading.

OMG, more stupidity.

You posted:

"The natural number one with an exponent of two can equal two under the
right circumstances."

An exponent of two is a number raised to the second power. It's the
number times itself. Now explain to us how 1 x 1 = 2.

I didn't say 1x1=2, and you would not understand what I meant if I told
you, so I won't even attempt to do it.

On Wednesday, June 1, 2016 at 6:57:42 AM UTC-4, FromTheRafters wrote:

It's not a circuit unless there is continuity "open circuit" is a
misnomer. When you put the multimeter across the open (gap) the
internal resistance of the meter completes the circuit and you read the
'voltage drop' across that internal resistance which tells you what the
supply voltage is, because as you said, they must be equal.

No completion of that circuit is necessary to measure the voltage
potential.

I didn't say that there was. What I said was that the meter completed
the circuit and the measurement was taken from the 'voltage drop'
across the internal resistance of the meter.

Which implies that completion of the circuit is necessary to be able
to measure the voltage source, hence my reply. If you're not implying
that, what's the point of bringing it up at all? More FUD like bringing
up calculus when you can't do simple math?




The meter has an impedance in the meg ohms and for all
practical purposes can be ignored for the purposes of this discussion.

Maybe for your discussion, but not for mine.

See, I was right, you do want to go off into more nits, when the real
problem here is that you think V = IR, with I=0 somehow involves
division. And that you can't recognize that when an equation like
that gives a value of zero, the zero has meaning. Often in science
and engineering the zero results are among the most interesting,
that solve the problem, etc.


Voltage can exist without
current and current can exist without voltage, but 'voltage drop'
requires current and resistance and Ohm's Law works under those
conditions no matter how close to zero they get without actually being
zero.


And Ohm's Law works at zero too. I've asked 6 times now, have you
drawn a graph of Ohm's Law, plotted, I vs V? You get a straight line,
it goes right through the origin.


And there are non-contact measuring techniques and instruments as well.
You can measure electric potential without a circuit.

I agree with that statement. But you can't measure 'voltage drop'
without current going through the device which is responsible for it.


That's like saying you can't measure the speed of your car, without
the car moving. The rest of us recognize that as a speed of ZERO.

Assignment for a grade school student. Keep a tabulation of the
speed of a car while dad is driving,
record the observations every minute. What speed entry do you
make when the time for an observation occurs when the car is stopped
at a light? The rest of us would put in zero. You? Apparently you'd
argue that the speed is "undefined" because to make that entry would
require division by zero.

Next assignment, calculate the average speed using those recorded
measurements. We'd take all the tabulated entries, add them up and
divide by the number of entries. Let's say there were ten. We have

35, 42, 47, 0, 40, 50, 30, 0

We get (35+42+47+0+40+50+30+0)/8 as the answer

WTF do you get? Speed is undefined because the car is not moving, right?

(35+ 42+47+undefined+40+50+30+undefined)/8 So, answer is undefined?

(35+42+47+40+50+30)/6 ?

That's the screwy world you're living in.



You really
are in way over your head here.

Sure, if you say so. But I don't stick to the shallow end of the pool
like you do. You should stop trying to put words in my mouth so I won't
feel as if I should respond, it makes you look like a troll.

If anyone is a troll, it's you. It's been a long time since we've
seen a total moron here like you. BTW, we're all still waiting
for you to explain how 1 squared can be 2 sometimes, another one
of your claims.

On 05/31/2016 11:55 PM, trader_4 wrote:

[snip]

Rafters doing calculus that would be something. He also said that
1 squared is sometimes equal to 2. I'm sure you'd like to see that
explained too.


I found an alternate universe (SC.777777777776) where 1 squared is equal
to 2, but only on Tuesdays when the 2 is light pink. No one can live
there, and it's dangerous to visit. There's a significant probability of
your brain unexpectedly becoming 0 brains.

On Wednesday, June 1, 2016 at 9:44:18 AM UTC-4, trader_4 wrote:


Correction. In my last post I gave an example of samples taken
from a moving car where I said:

" Let's say there were ten. "

That should be eight.

On 06/01/2016 08:44 AM, trader_4 wrote:

BTW, we're all still waiting
for you to explain how 1 squared can be 2 sometimes, another one
of your claims.


1. make a square 1 unit on each side

2. measure the diagonal. If this is 2, stop taking drugs and go to step 5

3. hold by the other 2 corners (other than the ones you're measuring
between)

4. squeeze until measurement becomes 2

5. say you're doing advanced math, and only you understand it

On 05/31/2016 11:55 PM, trader_4 wrote:

[snip]

Rafters doing calculus that would be something. He also said that
1 squared is sometimes equal to 2. I'm sure you'd like to see that
explained too.


I found https://www.math.toronto.edu/mathnet...first1eq2.html,
which MAY be of some help.

--
Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.us/

"The truth cannot be asserted without denouncing the falsehood." [Leslie
Stephen]

On Wednesday, June 1, 2016 at 12:07:10 PM UTC-4, Mark Lloyd wrote:
On 05/31/2016 11:55 PM, trader_4 wrote:

[snip]

Rafters doing calculus that would be something. He also said that
1 squared is sometimes equal to 2. I'm sure you'd like to see that
explained too.


I found https://www.math.toronto.edu/mathnet...first1eq2.html,
which MAY be of some help.

--
Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.us/

"The truth cannot be asserted without denouncing the falsehood." [Leslie
Stephen]

It's right up Rafter's ally. This is a legitimate case where dividing
by zero is done and it produces an error. Unfortunately it doesn't prove
that 1 squared can be 2. Or that V =IR is invalid when I=0.