The task was to replace a 33x22" cast iron, double-bowl, kitchen sink
with a same-sized one made of stainless steel. I naively thought I just
drop the replacement into the same hole. Turns out the hole was grossly
undersized for the new sink. The new hole had to be enlarged to 32.5 x
21.5" - yes, only 1/4" margin on all four sizes - to accommodate
u-channels for the retaining clips and the larger bowls. Doing the sides
wasn't so bad (used jig saw, belt sander, and rotary file at the
corners), but the back and front were impossible because of extra
supports in those spots.

The countertop is 24" deep, Formica on 3/4" particle board. The supplied
retaining clips are long enough to grasp the bottom of a 3/4" counter,
so they are okay for the sides. At the back, there is one extra support
making the thickness there 1.5". At the front, from top to bottom the
thickness is 2.25". Here's how it looks:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/90278919@N00/16216641888/

Top photo is looking toward front; bottom, looking toward backsplash.

Had to call Kohler to order extra long screws. They had the 2.5" size
that I needed. (Even longer ones are available.) I think there are 12 to
a package for $10.00, plus $14.95 for expedited shipping (2 - 3 days).
The gal gave me a break, charging $5.00 for the clips, making the total
$19.95. Still, I'm without a sink probably to Monday.

What really ****es me off is that Kohler supplied with the sink clips
that only work on 3/4" counter. Certainly my house isn't the only one on
the planet with extra support at the front over the double-doors, and at
the back. I would cost them virtually nothing extra to supply 2.5" with
every SS dropin sink. The extra lengths on the sides wouldn't cause any
problems. Shame on greedy Kohler.

Here's what they look like at the 1.5" length. Note the outrageous price.

http://www.lowes.com/pd_639063-28557...ips&facetInfo=

Just venting here.

R1

On 1/30/2015 1:58 PM, Rebel1 wrote:
The task was to replace a 33x22" cast iron, double-bowl, kitchen sink
with a same-sized one made of stainless steel. I naively thought I just
drop the replacement into the same hole. Turns out the hole was grossly
undersized for the new sink. The new hole had to be enlarged to 32.5 x
21.5" - yes, only 1/4" margin on all four sizes - to accommodate
u-channels for the retaining clips and the larger bowls. Doing the sides
wasn't so bad (used jig saw, belt sander, and rotary file at the
corners), but the back and front were impossible because of extra
supports in those spots.

The countertop is 24" deep, Formica on 3/4" particle board. The supplied
retaining clips are long enough to grasp the bottom of a 3/4" counter,
so they are okay for the sides. At the back, there is one extra support
making the thickness there 1.5". At the front, from top to bottom the
thickness is 2.25". Here's how it looks:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/90278919@N00/16216641888/

Top photo is looking toward front; bottom, looking toward backsplash.

Had to call Kohler to order extra long screws. They had the 2.5" size
that I needed. (Even longer ones are available.) I think there are 12 to
a package for $10.00, plus $14.95 for expedited shipping (2 - 3 days).
The gal gave me a break, charging $5.00 for the clips, making the total
$19.95. Still, I'm without a sink probably to Monday.

What really ****es me off is that Kohler supplied with the sink clips
that only work on 3/4" counter. Certainly my house isn't the only one on
the planet with extra support at the front over the double-doors, and at
the back. I would cost them virtually nothing extra to supply 2.5" with
every SS dropin sink. The extra lengths on the sides wouldn't cause any
problems. Shame on greedy Kohler.

Here's what they look like at the 1.5" length. Note the outrageous price.

http://www.lowes.com/pd_639063-28557...ips&facetInfo=

Be thankful you don't have a stone or solid surface counter top, the 3/4
would probably be fine, but widening the hole would be much more work.

--
Froz...


The system will be down for 10 days for preventive maintenance.

On 1/30/2015 1:58 PM, Rebel1 wrote:
The task was to replace a 33x22" cast iron, double-bowl, kitchen sink
with a same-sized one made of stainless steel. I naively thought I just
drop the replacement into the same hole. Turns out the hole was grossly
undersized for the new sink. The new hole had to be enlarged to 32.5 x
21.5" - yes, only 1/4" margin on all four sizes - to accommodate
u-channels for the retaining clips and the larger bowls. Doing the sides
wasn't so bad (used jig saw, belt sander, and rotary file at the
corners), but the back and front were impossible because of extra
supports in those spots.

The countertop is 24" deep, Formica on 3/4" particle board. The supplied
retaining clips are long enough to grasp the bottom of a 3/4" counter,
so they are okay for the sides. At the back, there is one extra support
making the thickness there 1.5". At the front, from top to bottom the
thickness is 2.25". Here's how it looks:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/90278919@N00/16216641888/

Top photo is looking toward front; bottom, looking toward backsplash.

Had to call Kohler to order extra long screws. They had the 2.5" size
that I needed. (Even longer ones are available.) I think there are 12 to
a package for $10.00, plus $14.95 for expedited shipping (2 - 3 days).
The gal gave me a break, charging $5.00 for the clips, making the total
$19.95. Still, I'm without a sink probably to Monday.

What really ****es me off is that Kohler supplied with the sink clips
that only work on 3/4" counter. Certainly my house isn't the only one on
the planet with extra support at the front over the double-doors, and at
the back. I would cost them virtually nothing extra to supply 2.5" with
every SS dropin sink. The extra lengths on the sides wouldn't cause any
problems. Shame on greedy Kohler.

Here's what they look like at the 1.5" length. Note the outrageous price.

http://www.lowes.com/pd_639063-28557...ips&facetInfo=


Just venting here.

R1


Amazon has one vendor for $5. Even with shipping you could save.
I buy things on line like Moen cartridges or Aquapure water filters at
1/4 the price at local stores.

On Fri, 30 Jan 2015 13:58:32 -0500, Rebel1
wrote:




What really ****es me off is that Kohler supplied with the sink clips
that only work on 3/4" counter. Certainly my house isn't the only one on
the planet with extra support at the front over the double-doors, and at
the back. I would cost them virtually nothing extra to supply 2.5" with
every SS dropin sink. The extra lengths on the sides wouldn't cause any
problems. Shame on greedy Kohler.


Many years ago I worked with my step-father remodeling kitchens. From
my experience, you are the rarity that needs the extra long clips. Why
should they make the rest of us pay for them if we don't need them?
Why make more stuff for the landfill?

Did you check with the local plumbing supply to see if they had them?
I understand your frustration, but I don't think it makes the
manufacturer greedy because you are the exception.

On Saturday, January 31, 2015 at 7:21:36 AM UTC-5, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
On Fri, 30 Jan 2015 13:58:32 -0500, Rebel1
wrote:




What really ****es me off is that Kohler supplied with the sink clips
that only work on 3/4" counter. Certainly my house isn't the only one on
the planet with extra support at the front over the double-doors, and at
the back. I would cost them virtually nothing extra to supply 2.5" with
every SS dropin sink. The extra lengths on the sides wouldn't cause any
problems. Shame on greedy Kohler.


Many years ago I worked with my step-father remodeling kitchens. From
my experience, you are the rarity that needs the extra long clips. Why
should they make the rest of us pay for them if we don't need them?
Why make more stuff for the landfill?

Did you check with the local plumbing supply to see if they had them?
I understand your frustration, but I don't think it makes the
manufacturer greedy because you are the exception.

Especially since they only charged $5 for the 12 screws. The other
$15 was for expedited shipping, a good portion of which presumably
went to the shippper. Even at the originally quoted price of $10 for
12 screws, it seems consistent with similar prices. I just bought
10 gutter screws at HD, they were $11. The alternatives would be to
ship every possible length of screw with every sink or to sell the
sink without screws and you have to buy the ones you need. Neither
sounds too practical. And IDT you can just ship the longest ones,
because they probably are too long, hit the counter, etc.

Like you say, the local plumbing supply probably had them and
probably for less total cost.

On Friday, January 30, 2015 at 1:58:37 PM UTC-5, Rebel1 wrote:
The task was to replace a 33x22" cast iron, double-bowl, kitchen sink
with a same-sized one made of stainless steel. I naively thought I just
drop the replacement into the same hole. Turns out the hole was grossly
undersized for the new sink. The new hole had to be enlarged to 32.5 x
21.5" - yes, only 1/4" margin on all four sizes - to accommodate
u-channels for the retaining clips and the larger bowls. Doing the sides
wasn't so bad (used jig saw, belt sander, and rotary file at the
corners), but the back and front were impossible because of extra
supports in those spots.

The countertop is 24" deep, Formica on 3/4" particle board. The supplied
retaining clips are long enough to grasp the bottom of a 3/4" counter,
so they are okay for the sides. At the back, there is one extra support
making the thickness there 1.5". At the front, from top to bottom the
thickness is 2.25". Here's how it looks:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/90278919@N00/16216641888/

Top photo is looking toward front; bottom, looking toward backsplash.

Had to call Kohler to order extra long screws. They had the 2.5" size
that I needed. (Even longer ones are available.) I think there are 12 to
a package for $10.00, plus $14.95 for expedited shipping (2 - 3 days).
The gal gave me a break, charging $5.00 for the clips, making the total
$19.95. Still, I'm without a sink probably to Monday.

What really ****es me off is that Kohler supplied with the sink clips
that only work on 3/4" counter. Certainly my house isn't the only one on
the planet with extra support at the front over the double-doors, and at
the back. I would cost them virtually nothing extra to supply 2.5" with
every SS dropin sink. The extra lengths on the sides wouldn't cause any
problems. Shame on greedy Kohler.

Here's what they look like at the 1.5" length. Note the outrageous price.

http://www.lowes.com/pd_639063-28557...ips&facetInfo=

Just venting here.

R1

most people who replace a sink buy a new counter top too

On Sat, 31 Jan 2015 12:52:14 -0800 (PST), bob haller
wrote:

most people who replace a sink buy a new counter top too

Why do "most" people do that? It seems silly to me when a sink
replacement will work just fine.

On 1/31/2015 5:42 PM, Oren wrote:
On Sat, 31 Jan 2015 12:52:14 -0800 (PST), bob haller
wrote:

most people who replace a sink buy a new counter top too

Why do "most" people do that? It seems silly to me when a sink
replacement will work just fine.


Would be interesting to see how often the counter top is replaced. The
few times I've done it, both were replaced. I'd guess it is a high
percentage, but not 100%

On Saturday, January 31, 2015 at 7:10:39 PM UTC-5, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
On 1/31/2015 5:42 PM, Oren wrote:
On Sat, 31 Jan 2015 12:52:14 -0800 (PST), bob haller
wrote:

most people who replace a sink buy a new counter top too

Why do "most" people do that? It seems silly to me when a sink
replacement will work just fine.


Would be interesting to see how often the counter top is replaced. The
few times I've done it, both were replaced. I'd guess it is a high
percentage, but not 100%

I changed my sink a few years back without changing the counters.
The garbage disposal went and you know how that goes. I started
thinking about the sink, which I never liked. It was stainless,
the type with that useless little side sink. That left a smaller
main bowl, useless side bowl. So, I got a two bowl, extra deep,
chef style cast iron one. One bowl is about 2/3, the other 1/3.
And it has a center mount faucet, so that there is no ledge space
taken up at the back by the bowels, giving more room.
I'm very happy with it. But I would agree that most sinks
are changed with the counters.