Garage door spring broke in half. Torsion type.
On a bar across the door.
Do people usually replace them as a DIY.
Or is it something nobody does themselves?

"Shlomo Baumgard" wrote in message
...
Garage door spring broke in half. Torsion type.
On a bar across the door.
Do people usually replace them as a DIY.
Or is it something nobody does themselves?

They can be very dangerous to replace. I'm sure that some people do it. I
wouldn't.

On Fri, 19 Sep 2014 03:39:14 -0700, "Julie Bove"
wrote:


"Shlomo Baumgard" wrote in message
...
Garage door spring broke in half. Torsion type.
On a bar across the door.
Do people usually replace them as a DIY.
Or is it something nobody does themselves?

They can be very dangerous to replace. I'm sure that some people do it. I
wouldn't.
Agreed. It is easy with the correct tools and some experience. It is
very dangerous without both. Years ago, my father in law seriously
injured his hand while trying to improvise a tool to replace a spring.
The tool broke and spun around very quickly with the broken end
slicing into his hand. I am 99.9% DIY, but I always hire someone to
replace my torsion springs when they fail.

On 09/19/2014 06:14 AM, Shlomo Baumgard wrote:
Garage door spring broke in half. Torsion type.
On a bar across the door.
Do people usually replace them as a DIY.
Or is it something nobody does themselves?


Most people on this planet are NOT smart enough to navigate a traffic circle properly. How smart are you?

Shlomo Baumgard wrote:

Garage door spring broke in half. Torsion type.
On a bar across the door.
Do people usually replace them as a DIY.
Or is it something nobody does themselves?

If you have to ask, the answer is generally no. It can be done, but it's
not easy or fun and it can be quite dangerous.

0ren wrote, on Fri, 19 Sep 2014 08:18:48 -0400:

Most people on this planet are NOT smart enough to navigate a traffic
circle properly. How smart are you?

I know how to stay to the inside for a few loops until I get my bearing,
so I will research how to replace the torsion spring and let you know how
it works out.

Shlomo Baumgard:

Ignorance is fertile ground for the imagination to run wild. That is, if you don't know where the danger lies, nor how to avoid it, then your imagination will have you in the funeral home as a result of attempting this project.

While it's true that replacing a garage door torsion spring CAN be dangerous, you should be aware that most of the danger lies in the fact that you use steel bars to hold the tension on the torsion spring while you loosen the set screws that hold it to the torsion rod.

The torsion rod goes through the center(s) of the torsion spring(s), and it's the turning of the torsion rod that raises and lowers the garage door. There are things called "knuckles" at one end of each torsion spring, and there are set screws in the knuckles that clamp the knuckle onto the torsion rod. When you loosen the set screw(s) in those knuckles, the twisting force of the torsion spring wants to unwind the spring. So, when you stick a steel rod into those knuckles to prevent them from turning uncontrolably, the instant the set screw lets go of the torsion rod the force that was in that spring now goes into turning the steel bar you're holding. It's not a great amount of force, but you can eliminate most of the danger by making sure that your head and face are out of the path that the steel bar would swing in if that bar you're holding would slip out of your grip and swing under the force of the torsion spring.

That is, if you make a consious effort to keep your face and head out of the path of that "unwinding" bar if it swings, you avoid most of the danger in doing this job. After you replace the torsion springs, you will use those same steel bars to wind the new springs up a predetermined number of turns. The heavier the garage door, the more turns you have to preload into the new torsion springs.

I've replaced one of the torsion springs on my sister's double wide garage door, and I didn't find it either difficult or all that dangerous. I was a bit apprehensive about undoing the set screws holding the torsion spring to the torsion bar, but when I felt that the force was within my strength to support, I immediately felt a sense of relief.

Also, it's important to use steel bars of the correct length. You want them to be as long as possible for maximum leverage, but no so long that they're unweildy and interfere with the hardware around the knuckles you turn with them.

If you have the owner's manual for your garage door, or can find the manufacturer's name somewhere on the door and download the owner's manual or installation manual, you can just follow the instructions printed there.

I made notes of the procedure I followed in replacing the torsion spring on my sister's two car garage door. If you want to, I can copy and paste it into this thread for you to copy and paste into Windows Notepad and print off.

Shlomo Baumgard wrote:
Garage door spring broke in half. Torsion type.
On a bar across the door.
Do people usually replace them as a DIY.
Or is it something nobody does themselves?

Hi,
If you are handy with proper tools, watch Youtube tutorial to
familiarize yourself with the procedure, it is doable. If two
springs, replace both. And rub the springs with oil soaked
rug to minimize dry friction when done(make the springs last longer)
It can seriously injure or even kill you if not careful. Or pros
will do it for you in about less than 2 hours. It costs flat 250.00
where I live. I did it couple times, not as fast as pros but not a
difficult job doing it alone while some one watches on the side for
safety.

On 9/19/2014 6:14 AM, Shlomo Baumgard wrote:
Garage door spring broke in half. Torsion type.
On a bar across the door.
Do people usually replace them as a DIY.
Or is it something nobody does themselves?

I've heard they are quite dangerous. Lot of
stored energy. I'd not want to try it.

--
..
Christopher A. Young
Learn about Jesus
www.lds.org
..

0ren wrote:
On 09/19/2014 06:14 AM, Shlomo Baumgard wrote:
Garage door spring broke in half. Torsion type.
On a bar across the door.
Do people usually replace them as a DIY.
Or is it something nobody does themselves?


Most people on this planet are NOT smart enough to navigate a traffic
circle properly. How smart are you?
Hmmm,
I drive around circle taking my dog to a free run park twice a day.
People living in the neighborhood even don't get it driving me nuts, LOL!

On Fri, 19 Sep 2014 13:29:49 +0000 (UTC), Shlomo Baumgard
wrote:

I know how to stay to the inside for a few loops until I get my bearing,
so I will research how to replace the torsion spring and let you know how
it works out.

Couple of links or read:

http://truetex.com/garage.htm

Best site on the web (IMHO).

http://ddmgaragedoors.com/index.php

On Fri, 19 Sep 2014 16:00:56 +0200, nestork
wrote:


Shlomo Baumgard:

While it's true that replacing a garage door torsion spring CAN be
dangerous, you should be aware that most of the danger lies in the fact
that you use steel bars to hold tension on the torsion spring while you
loosen the set screws that hold it to the torsion rod. It's the turning
of the torsion rod that raises and lowers the door. So, when you stick
a steel rod into the end of the torsion spring and loosen those set
screws, the instant the set screw lets go of the torsion rod, the force
that was in that spring now goes into turning the steel bar you're
holding. It's not a great amount of force, but you can eliminate most
of the danger by making sure that your head and face are out of the path
that the steel bar would swing in if that bar your holding would slip
and swing under the force of the torsion spring.

That is, if you make a consious effort to keep your face and head out of
the path of the bar if it swings, you avoid most of the danger in doing
this job.

I've replaced one of the torsion springs on my sister's double wide
garage door, and I didn't find it either difficult or all that
dangerous. I was a bit apprehensive about undoing the set screws
holding the torsion spring to the torsion bar, but when I felt that the
force was within my strength to support, I immediately felt a sense of
relief.

If you have the owner's manual for your garage door, or can find the
manufacturer's name somewhere on the door and download the owner's
manual or installation manual, you can just follow the instructions
printed there.

I made notes of the procedure I followed in replacing the torsion spring
on my sister's two car garage door. If you want to, I can copy and
paste it into this thread for you to copy and paste into Windows Notepad
and print off.

Sounds like the OP has one spring, does not mention if it two springs
and one broke. If it is a single spring and it broke all the energy is
out of the spring - to my knowledge. The danger would be when
tightening the new spring and the winding bars slip, before the set
screw is tight.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zxUoJrLhaSI

Oren wrote, on Fri, 19 Sep 2014 07:39:58 -0700:

Couple of links or read:

http://truetex.com/garage.htm

Best site on the web (IMHO).

http://ddmgaragedoors.com/index.php

Thanks for that tip!
I'm on the phone with a guy named "Dan" right now!
He sounds like he knows what he's talking about because he had me measure
the broken spring while I was on the phone with him.

I'm ordering two new larger springs and the tools as soon as we figure
out the best upgrade from 10,000 cycles to 70,000 cycles which only costs
a few bucks more.

nestork wrote, on Fri, 19 Sep 2014 16:00:56 +0200:

I made notes of the procedure I followed in replacing the torsion spring
on my sister's two car garage door. If you want to, I can copy and
paste it into this thread for you to copy and paste into Windows Notepad
and print off.

Thanks but the link Oren gave to ddm doors has videos of everything.
I ordered two springs, two steel bars, and three bearings.

It should arrive next week by UPS and I will just follow the video.
Looks pretty easy.

The dangerous part is not making an unscripted mistake.

Stormin Mormon wrote, on Fri, 19 Sep 2014 10:09:52 -0400:

I've heard they are quite dangerous. Lot of stored energy. I'd not want
to try it

It doesn't look more dangerous than driving a car but the true text link
that Oren provided says it can send the steel bar at the speed of a
bullet so the real danger is doing something stupid.

On Fri, 19 Sep 2014 09:28:18 -0700 (PDT), BenDarrenBach
wrote:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zxUoJrLhaSI

The reason I pointed the poster to:

http://ddmgaragedoors.com/index.php

Our friend Danny D. went through this some time ago, as a DIYer. He
gave this link here and I say it is the best site on the web.

The poster did not clarify if he has one or two springs, but the
information is there under the "DIY Instructions" tab.

BenDarrenBach wrote, on Fri, 19 Sep 2014 09:28:18 -0700:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zxUoJrLhaSI

That's the guy Oren gave me the link to.
I spoke to him. His name is Dan.
He patently had me measure the spring while he was on the phone.
They are sending me two new larger longer springs, three bearings, and
two steel rods. Dan told me I can buy the rods at a hardware store but I
got them from him because he was so helpful.

On Fri, 19 Sep 2014 17:34:37 +0000 (UTC), Shlomo Baumgard
wrote:

Best site on the web (IMHO).

http://ddmgaragedoors.com/index.php

Thanks for that tip!

My pleasure.

I'm on the phone with a guy named "Dan" right now!

Dan Musick, the owner since 1982.

He sounds like he knows what he's talking about because he had me measure
the broken spring while I was on the phone with him.

Our friend Danny D. went through changing springs. Dan Musick was
always helpful to him as Danny D. reported here. Danny D. is a bean
counter and pencil pusher (grin) (accountant). He survived doing the
repair DIY. I even learned some things in all the threads.

I'm ordering two new larger springs and the tools as soon as we figure
out the best upgrade from 10,000 cycles to 70,000 cycles which only costs
a few bucks more.

+1

Oren wrote, on Fri, 19 Sep 2014 11:00:46 -0700:

Dan Musick, the owner since 1982.

That's the guy. Thanks!

I will watch his videos until the parts arrive.

Other than safety goggles, it looks like I only need a vise grip, step
ladder, a couple of wrenches, and the two steel winding bars.

The guy was patient with me. He even talked me out of the fancy springs,
saying the plain black ones were just fine if I oil them once a year.

So, the only upgrade was thicker steel, which means it will last longer.

On Fri, 19 Sep 2014 18:21:34 +0000 (UTC), Shlomo Baumgard
wrote:

Oren wrote, on Fri, 19 Sep 2014 11:00:46 -0700:

Dan Musick, the owner since 1982.

That's the guy. Thanks!

I will watch his videos until the parts arrive.

Other than safety goggles, it looks like I only need a vise grip, step
ladder, a couple of wrenches, and the two steel winding bars.


Like he says in the videos, never, never, ever use a screwdriver to
wind the springs. You said you ordered the winding bars, so good for
you. You can make them, but are they secure........ They must fit
correctly for your safety. He mentions this in his videos.

The guy was patient with me. He even talked me out of the fancy springs,
saying the plain black ones were just fine if I oil them once a year.

So, the only upgrade was thicker steel, which means it will last longer.

Which gives you more life cycles. Frankly, I've never had a torsion
spring break but it happens. Listen to Dan Musick, and take his
advice... The man is a professional. Did I mention the advice is free
G?

On Fri, 19 Sep 2014 08:12:30 -0600, Tony Hwang wrote:

0ren wrote:
On 09/19/2014 06:14 AM, Shlomo Baumgard wrote:
Garage door spring broke in half. Torsion type.
On a bar across the door.
Do people usually replace them as a DIY.
Or is it something nobody does themselves?


Most people on this planet are NOT smart enough to navigate a traffic
circle properly. How smart are you?
Hmmm,
I drive around circle taking my dog to a free run park twice a day.

So is the dog in the car or running beside it? ;-)

People living in the neighborhood even don't get it driving me nuts, LOL!

My problem here is 4-way stops. If the entrances are 1, 2, 3, and
4, when 1 is entitled to go, 3 is also, even if he got to the stop later
than 2 and 4, but here 1 goes and 3 stays still, then 2 goes, but 4
doesn't) , then 3 goes (and if anyone has arrived at 1, he doesn't),
then 4 goes, but 2 doesn't. And so on. It must take 60% longer
to get through the intersection than it should.

Also, at the last stop sign before my house, I often come from the east
and turn left. If I put my turn signal on, a reflex, the car
approaching me waits until I've turned. Wastes time. I've almost
learned to leave the signal off until we pass each other in the
intersection and then turn it on and turn left right behind him.

And there's room enough for two cars side-by-side at most stop signs, if
only the cars in front of me would pull to one side or the other, but
some sit in the middle.

On Fri, 19 Sep 2014 18:21:34 +0000 (UTC), Shlomo Baumgard
wrote:

Oren wrote, on Fri, 19 Sep 2014 11:00:46 -0700:

Dan Musick, the owner since 1982.

That's the guy. Thanks!

I will watch his videos until the parts arrive.

Other than safety goggles, it looks like I only need a vise grip, step

Buy Vise-grip brand vise grips. They aren't that expensive ($8 a few
years ago) and they wear like iron, or steel. And have lots of uses.
I usually use the ones with the curved jaws, fwiw.

There are other brands, and no-name brands, and I've ended up with some,
but for anything strenuous, I only trust Vise-Grip (R)

ladder, a couple of wrenches, and the two steel winding bars.

The guy was patient with me. He even talked me out of the fancy springs,
saying the plain black ones were just fine if I oil them once a year.

So, the only upgrade was thicker steel, which means it will last longer.

Oren wrote, on Fri, 19 Sep 2014 11:42:12 -0700:

Which gives you more life cycles. Frankly, I've never had a torsion
spring break but it happens. Listen to Dan Musick, and take his
advice... The man is a professional. Did I mention the advice is free

I hope the OP ordered the springs with the cones attached.

I tried to remove the cones off the old springs, and concluded it wasn't
even close to worth the effort to buy a spring without the end cones.

If your springs have cones, and you have winding bars and a six-inch vise
grip, the job is easy to do (if your flag ends and center supports are
already secure).

Just follow *all* the advice in the DDM videos and you'll do just fine.

Shlomo Baumgard wrote:
BenDarrenBach wrote, on Fri, 19 Sep 2014 09:28:18 -0700:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zxUoJrLhaSI

That's the guy Oren gave me the link to.
I spoke to him. His name is Dan.
He patently had me measure the spring while he was on the phone.
They are sending me two new larger longer springs, three bearings, and
two steel rods. Dan told me I can buy the rods at a hardware store but I
got them from him because he was so helpful.

Hi,
Good luck with it. As long as springs are matching your door(size and
weight). The heavier ther better does not apply in this case. We'd like
to hear feedback after you finish the job. There are many Youtube
tutorials out there.

Shlomo Baumgard:

OK, Shlomo, sounds like you're going to do it.

But, if you end up killing yourself, can I have your guns, your horse and your boots?

Your good friend,
Nestor

Definitely go with the 70,000 cycle springs for the few dollars more.

Also, keep the winding bars in a conspicuous place in your attic rafters so that you have them if and when you need them again.

On Fri, 19 Sep 2014 17:38:23 +0000 (UTC), Shlomo Baumgard
wrote:

Stormin Mormon wrote, on Fri, 19 Sep 2014 10:09:52 -0400:

I've heard they are quite dangerous. Lot of stored energy. I'd not want
to try it

It doesn't look more dangerous than driving a car but the true text link
that Oren provided says it can send the steel bar at the speed of a
bullet so the real danger is doing something stupid.

I've found the first time I do something, I do an excellent job and it
goes perfectly. The second time I do a fine job, everything is fixed
and nothing more is broken.

The third time deep down inside I think I know what I'm doing and even
if I try hard not to think that, that's the time I'm likely to foul up.
But I don't have garage door springs or even a garage.

(Used to in junior high and high school. It never occurred to me, or my
mother I think, that it could be adjusted so it was easier to open.
Coil springs, not tension springs.) For that matter, it never occurred
to me that when the garbage disposal made terrible noises, it was
broken. Or that when the dish washer filled the room with steam, the
gasket should be replaced. All these things were like this when she
bought the house when I was 10, and though I fixed other things, even
when I was 10, these three things seemed to as fixed and unchangeable as
mountain ranges.)

On Fri, 19 Sep 2014 07:49:35 -0500, "Pete C."
wrote:


Shlomo Baumgard wrote:

Garage door spring broke in half. Torsion type.
On a bar across the door.
Do people usually replace them as a DIY.
Or is it something nobody does themselves?

If you have to ask, the answer is generally no. It can be done, but it's
not easy or fun and it can be quite dangerous.
They are pain. I've done quite a few. Including on big bay doors at
the dealership where I worked.. That was when I was a "young feller".
Not sure I'd do the big ones today, but I'll still tackle an 8 footer.
With care and the proper winding bars.

Not something for the beginning DIY homeowner to tackle.

On Fri, 19 Sep 2014 10:09:52 -0400, Stormin Mormon
wrote:

On 9/19/2014 6:14 AM, Shlomo Baumgard wrote:
Garage door spring broke in half. Torsion type.
On a bar across the door.
Do people usually replace them as a DIY.
Or is it something nobody does themselves?

I've heard they are quite dangerous. Lot of
stored energy. I'd not want to try it.


Perhaps Stormy DOES know his limits???

replying to Shlomo Baumgard , Garagedoorguy wrote:
ShlomoB wrote:

Garage door spring broke in half. Torsion type.
On a bar across the door.
Do people usually replace them as a DIY.
Or is it something nobody does themselves?


Removing and adding tension are not the only dangerous parts to the
process. With larger much stronger high cycle springs it could be too
much and cause the door to shoot up like a rocket the second the second
the set screw is tightened after putting tension on the new spring. Always
clamp the door down befor added tension to be safe. I've replaces 1000's
and 1000's pairs of springs over the past 12 years in the garage door
business. If you run into anything you don't understand I can probably
explain it to you. How did you measure you wire diameter on the existing
spring to give to the guy calibrating the new springs?

--

On Sat, 20 Sep 2014 03:44:01 +0000, Garagedoorguy
wrote:

Removing and adding tension are not the only dangerous parts to the
process. With larger much stronger high cycle springs it could be too
much and cause the door to shoot up like a rocket the second the second
the set screw is tightened after putting tension on the new spring. Always
clamp the door down befor added tension to be safe.

Clamping the door was mentioned in a video posted here. A danger;
besides having the winding bars crack your noggin

Shlomo Baumgard wrote, on Fri, 19 Sep 2014 10:14:29 +0000:

Garage door spring broke in half. Torsion type.

Dunno. How good are you at welding?

On Sat, 20 Sep 2014 23:48:39 +0000 (UTC), Ger Robertson
wrote:

Garage door spring broke in half. Torsion type.

Dunno. How good are you at welding?

Only a fool would try welding the spring to make a repair.

OP has the information he needs to proceed fixing it correctly.

On 9/21/2014 11:15 AM, Oren wrote:
On Sat, 20 Sep 2014 23:48:39 +0000 (UTC), Ger Robertson
wrote:

Garage door spring broke in half. Torsion type.

Dunno. How good are you at welding?

Only a fool would try welding the spring to make a repair.


+1 and then someg

FWIW, I had a coil spring fail and leave me stranded. Called a local
repair outfit and he had a clamp that was made specifically to join the
broken ends together as a temporary fix. Worked like a charm and he
only charged me something like $45 for the service call (I wound up
replacing the whole door through a different company). Have never seen
those clamps advertised at the hardware store, etc.

I'm handy and will tackle most any job before crying "Uncle." I'm also
not stupid and had no problem calling for help with a broken torsion
springg

On Sun, 21 Sep 2014 14:49:27 -0500, Unquestionably Confused
wrote:

Garage door spring broke in half. Torsion type.

Dunno. How good are you at welding?

Only a fool would try welding the spring to make a repair.


+1 and then someg

FWIW, I had a coil spring fail and leave me stranded. Called a local
repair outfit and he had a clamp that was made specifically to join the
broken ends together as a temporary fix. Worked like a charm and he
only charged me something like $45 for the service call (I wound up
replacing the whole door through a different company). Have never seen
those clamps advertised at the hardware store, etc.

I'm handy and will tackle most any job before crying "Uncle." I'm also
not stupid and had no problem calling for help with a broken torsion
springg

Exactly. Fix what broke - know your limits. I do.Trying to weld the
spring may or can get you killed or an eye poked out.
--
"Dodgeball in Burkas" -- Greg Gutfeld

In a garage door, the torsion springs are loaded up with tension in the coils all the time the door is closed. The force the springs exert continuously on the door is just a little less than the amount of force necessary to lift the weight of the door. When you (or an electric motor) adds that little bit of extra force needed, the door lifts easily with the help of the springs. You only know it weighs more than just a few pounds by the inertia it has. If you ever replace torsion springs on a garage door, and you find the door rises after preloading the torsion spring(s) with the necessary number of turns, then you've put too many turns of preload into the spring. It's lifting the door without your help. In that case, you need to reduce the number of turns of preload you put in the spring so that the torsion spring is ALMOST able to lift the door.

Also, people should know that torsion springs should only be used in one way; so that as the spring turns to get loaded up with force (as the garage door descends), the end of the spring turns such that you get more coils in the spring. And, as the door rises (with the aid of the stored energy in the spring), the number of turns in the spring is reduced. That's how coil torsion springs are supposed to work. If yours don't work that way, they're installed wrong.

On Saturday, September 20, 2014 12:50:34 PM UTC-4, Oren wrote:
On Sat, 20 Sep 2014 03:44:01 +0000, Garagedoorguy

wrote:



Removing and adding tension are not the only dangerous parts to the

process. With larger much stronger high cycle springs it could be too

much and cause the door to shoot up like a rocket the second the second

the set screw is tightened after putting tension on the new spring. Always

clamp the door down befor added tension to be safe.



Clamping the door was mentioned in a video posted here. A danger;

besides having the winding bars crack your noggin

Not mention that springs are not only rated by cycles, they are rated
by weight. No reason to assume that because he's getting a better
spring, it's going to be for the wrong weight and cause a catastrophe.
Where do people come up with this stuff?

On Mon, 22 Sep 2014 06:48:09 -0700 (PDT), trader_4
wrote:

No reason to assume that because he's getting a better
spring, it's going to be for the wrong weight and cause a catastrophe.
Where do people come up with this stuff?

"...compatible springs with the same lift but a different cycle
life..."

IIRC, Danny D., just bought a longer spring and got more life cycles.
It was the same lift?

http://ddmgaragedoors.com/springs/standard-torsion-springs.php#longer-life-springs

Garagedoorguy wrote:
replying to Shlomo Baumgard , Garagedoorguy wrote:
ShlomoB wrote:

Garage door spring broke in half. Torsion type. On a bar across the
door. Do people usually replace them as a DIY. Or is it something
nobody does themselves?


Removing and adding tension are not the only dangerous parts to the
process. With larger much stronger high cycle springs it could be too
much and cause the door to shoot up like a rocket the second the second
the set screw is tightened after putting tension on the new spring. Always
clamp the door down befor added tension to be safe. I've replaces 1000's
and 1000's pairs of springs over the past 12 years in the garage door
business. If you run into anything you don't understand I can probably
explain it to you. How did you measure you wire diameter on the existing
spring to give to the guy calibrating the new springs?

Hi,
I follow the rule, 4 turns(a full one turn on shaft) per foot of door
height.
Door being 16'x7', I start with ~30 windings and fine tune it. Worked
well for me.