Ashton Crusher wrote:
On Tue, 1 Jul 2014 19:59:02 -0700 (PDT), bob haller
wrote:

Heres MY opinion of global warming

If its truly being made worse by humans we better do what we can to
minize it.

That's true. It makes sense to not pollute anyway.

Since the costs to relocate all the people along the coasts that
might get flooded will kill our economy.

I'm not so sure of that. The encroachment of the sea will be slow so
the loss of people habitat will also be slow. I don't see how that's
really much of a problem for the economy. So every year another
couple thousand people have to move, big deal. In fact, it could be
a boon. It will create jobs building new, and MORE efficient, housing
elsewhere. And if they aren't stupid about it they will relocate to
someplace with better weather and/or a more reliable water supply then
many parts of the CA coast have.

Remember the recent floods not so long that flooded the subways in NYC, and
trashed much of the east coast. Think about that happening yearly.

"Bob F" wrote in message
...
Ashton Crusher wrote:
On Tue, 1 Jul 2014 19:59:02 -0700 (PDT), bob haller
wrote:

Heres MY opinion of global warming

If its truly being made worse by humans we better do what we can to
minize it.

That's true. It makes sense to not pollute anyway.

Since the costs to relocate all the people along the coasts that
might get flooded will kill our economy.

I'm not so sure of that. The encroachment of the sea will be slow so
the loss of people habitat will also be slow. I don't see how that's
really much of a problem for the economy. So every year another
couple thousand people have to move, big deal. In fact, it could be
a boon. It will create jobs building new, and MORE efficient, housing
elsewhere. And if they aren't stupid about it they will relocate to
someplace with better weather and/or a more reliable water supply then
many parts of the CA coast have.

Remember the recent floods not so long that flooded the subways in NYC,
and trashed much of the east coast. Think about that happening yearly.


as was the norm just a few hundreds of years ago.

On Wed, 2 Jul 2014 16:44:21 -0700, "Pico Rico"
wrote:


"Bob F" wrote in message
...
Ashton Crusher wrote:
On Tue, 1 Jul 2014 19:59:02 -0700 (PDT), bob haller
wrote:

Heres MY opinion of global warming

If its truly being made worse by humans we better do what we can to
minize it.

That's true. It makes sense to not pollute anyway.

Since the costs to relocate all the people along the coasts that
might get flooded will kill our economy.

I'm not so sure of that. The encroachment of the sea will be slow so
the loss of people habitat will also be slow. I don't see how that's
really much of a problem for the economy. So every year another
couple thousand people have to move, big deal. In fact, it could be
a boon. It will create jobs building new, and MORE efficient, housing
elsewhere. And if they aren't stupid about it they will relocate to
someplace with better weather and/or a more reliable water supply then
many parts of the CA coast have.

Remember the recent floods not so long that flooded the subways in NYC,
and trashed much of the east coast. Think about that happening yearly.


as was the norm just a few hundreds of years ago.


Yeah, I don't get it how people are all worked up of a couple yeas of
bad weather in a few places. Within every decade there are floods and
hurricanes and tornados and crap somewhere in the US. And changing
weather is normal, did people think nothing was ever going to change
after they were born?

Oren wrote:

On Wed, 02 Jul 2014 08:09:21 -0600, rbowman
wrote:

I'm LV's worst nightmare; I see the sights, catch some of the free
entertainment, get some good food, and leave.

Thanks for leaving your money here

The most I've left is the $8 or whatever the buffet goes for. One chilly
night in Reno I did buy a roll of nickles for the poker machines rather than
sit in the truck and read. I was bored ****less halfway through the roll.

Frank wrote:

I don't gamble either but enjoyed low room cost, good food,
entertainment and a visit to the Hoover dam and Grand Canyon. Atlantic
City is only a 2 hour drive for me but I prefer to fly to Vegas.

Unless AC has changed a lot, I'd prefer to fly to almost any place else.

I used to hang around an Irish Mafia joint in Springfield MA. They'd set up
junkets out of Logan and get comped for the rooms and meals. The bartender's
brother went on one, slept in the room, ate the food, and played golf. The
word came down "We don't care if he wins or loses, but if he ain't going to
play don't ever bring him back here."

Oren wrote:

Lake Mead supports AZ, CA & NV. Some runs off in Mexico somewhere in
salt water.

They're talking about re-opening the very expensive desalinization plant at
Yuma. By treaty, Mexico gets so many acre feet of the Colorado and they
would really like water that they can use for irrigation without killing the
crops.

rbowman wrote:
trader_4 wrote:

LOL. Sure Vegas has more competition, but comparing LV to an Indian
Casino or lottery machine is like saying Cleveland is just as good as
Paris.

Yeah, the buffets in LV are a lot better. I understand they've redecorated
but the Nile River Tour at the Luxor with all the girls dressed like
Cleopatra was fun too. The shows have always seemed to be directed at my
parent's generation and my parents have been dead for decades.

I'm LV's worst nightmare; I see the sights, catch some of the free
entertainment, get some good food, and leave.

I was there the night Luxor opened. It had the river, but they soon
eliminated that river and added more slot machines.

Right, I've gone to Vegas perhaps, 40 times. Never went to gamble. I went
there for the sun, swimming, relaxation, and some craziness.

Greg

"Pete C." wrote:
Rick wrote:

On 07/02/2014 12:41 PM, Pete C. wrote:
The casino tycoons have plenty of money, ultimately they'll end up
funding something like this.

I doubt it.

Taxpayers will pay for the pipeline. And the one percenters that own
the casinos also own the construction companies that will get the
lucrative pipeline contract.

The taxpayers in vegas mostly only exist because of the casinos. Before
the casinos there was nothing there, thus no employment and nobody to
pay taxes.

Didn't need much tax with nobody there.

Many places like Pittsburgh, began as manufacturing and mining centers.
Most of that is gone. The city is still here, but a bit smaller.

You should see Vegas flood when it rains heavy, usually mid august.

Greg

On Wednesday, July 2, 2014 4:11:34 PM UTC-4, Frank wrote:
On 7/2/2014 10:13 AM, Oren wrote:

On Wed, 02 Jul 2014 08:09:21 -0600, rbowman

wrote:



I'm LV's worst nightmare; I see the sights, catch some of the free

entertainment, get some good food, and leave.



Thanks for leaving your money here





I don't gamble either but enjoyed low room cost, good food,

entertainment and a visit to the Hoover dam and Grand Canyon. Atlantic

City is only a 2 hour drive for me but I prefer to fly to Vegas.

Apparently so do a lot of other people. The Atlantic closed a few
months ago. Caesars just announced they are closing the Show Boat.
And the Revel, which just opened a couple years ago, cost $2bil+, has
said if they can't find a buyer soon, they are going to close. I checked
the Revel out when it opened. It's a beautiful glass building, great
views. But the casino floor was something else. With all the science
and behavior analysis that experts are supposed to have down perfect,
I think the Revel is a disaster. The main casino floor has high ceilings,
more like a warehouse or industrial night club look, ie black, can't see
where it ends, etc. It was 180 deg opposite the warm, inviting look of
every other casino I've been in.

I think AC is suffering a lot more from the competition that Guv Bob
is talking about. LV is a whole different experience, at the top end.
AC is stuck in the middle. It has more than the typical nearby local
type casinos, but nowhere near what LV has. So, if you live in NYC or PA
they now have casinos and a lot of people will conclude AC isn't worth
the trip for what it has to offer. But I could see some of those same
people getting on an airplane to LV, because it's so different and has
a lot more to offer, including climate in Fall or Winter.

Odds are pretty good that you're going to lose to the house. Only mathematically challenged idiots go to casinos.

In article ,
Ashton Crusher wrote:

Yeah, I don't get it how people are all worked up of a couple yeas of
bad weather in a few places. Within every decade there are floods and
hurricanes and tornados and crap somewhere in the US. And changing
weather is normal, did people think nothing was ever going to change
after they were born?

I especially liked the arguments after Sandy about how two "100 year"
storms happening so close together had to mean something. Silly me, I
never knew that 100 year storms were scheduled and not random occurances.
--
"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive,
but what they conceal is vital."
-- Aaron Levenstein

In article
,
gregz wrote:


You should see Vegas flood when it rains heavy, usually mid august.

Greg

You could you could almost surf behind the old Imperial Palace when a
deluge came about.
--
€œStatistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive,
but what they conceal is vital.€�
€” Aaron Levenstein

On Thursday, July 3, 2014 7:34:52 AM UTC-4, Chuck Finley wrote:
Odds are pretty good that you're going to lose to the house. Only mathematically challenged idiots go to casinos.

Or card counters able to find places they can still do that
without getting tossed, of which there are few.

On 7/3/2014 7:34 AM, Chuck Finley wrote:
Odds are pretty good that you're going to lose to the house. Only
mathematically challenged idiots go to casinos.

Delaware Park casino is only about a 15 minute drive for me.
I've never been there to gamble except as a kid my father used to drag
me there when it was just a race track.

My wife was getting $10 gambling cards from them and once a $50.
You could not just cash them in but had to gamble so she'd hit a slot
machine, win a few cents and cash in. She always came home with about
80% of the cards worth.

They wised up and she no longer gets the cards

On Thursday, July 3, 2014 5:48:55 AM UTC-7, Kurt Ullman wrote:
In article ,

Ashton Crusher wrote:



Yeah, I don't get it how people are all worked up of a couple yeas of

bad weather in a few places. Within every decade there are floods and

hurricanes and tornados and crap somewhere in the US. And changing

weather is normal, did people think nothing was ever going to change

after they were born?



I especially liked the arguments after Sandy about how two "100 year"

storms happening so close together had to mean something. Silly me, I

never knew that 100 year storms were scheduled and not random occurances.


It is far more than "a few years". The entire middle of the states where irrigation is relied upon for agriculture is running out of water. The water table is dropping and that water is not being replenished, it is "fossil" water from centuries on centuries of storage.

They are deepening wells every year but don't seem to see the elephant in the room, the water isn't going to last forever.

Harry K

On Wed, 02 Jul 2014 18:32:53 -0400, Kurt Ullman
wrote:

In article ,
Oren wrote:

Much of that water was made on Naval ships.
100% of the water used on cruise ships is made on board. Cities of 7500
in some cases with crew and pax.

Yep. One of the last cruise ships I was on made the water. Had
Olympic size pool, other smaller spas and an ice skating rink.
(drained in heavy storms & refilled as needed). Tons of water

On Wed, 02 Jul 2014 16:11:34 -0400, Frank
wrote:

I'm LV's worst nightmare; I see the sights, catch some of the free
entertainment, get some good food, and leave.

Thanks for leaving your money here


I don't gamble either but enjoyed low room cost, good food,
entertainment and a visit to the Hoover dam and Grand Canyon. Atlantic
City is only a 2 hour drive for me but I prefer to fly to Vegas.

Las Vegas keeps reinventing itself. You will not find "historical"
buildings on the Strip. Now we have the High Roller (Ferris wheel).

"The wheel rotates on a pair of custom-designed spherical roller
bearings, each weighing approximately 19,400 lb (8,800 kg). Each
bearing has an outer diameter of 7.55 feet (2.30 m), an inner bore of
5.25 feet (1.60 m), and a width of 2.07 feet (0.63 m)."

"...with the final design accommodating 28 40-person cabins and a
total capacity of 1,120 passengers." World's tallest.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High_Roller_%28Ferris_wheel%29

The casinos pay - state collects a room tax for every room. Visitors
pay that tax indirectly.

Oh, they just opened a new water park to replace an old one

On Wed, 02 Jul 2014 22:04:16 -0600, rbowman
wrote:

Oren wrote:

Lake Mead supports AZ, CA & NV. Some runs off in Mexico somewhere in
salt water.

They're talking about re-opening the very expensive desalinization plant at
Yuma. By treaty, Mexico gets so many acre feet of the Colorado and they
would really like water that they can use for irrigation without killing the
crops.


There was a recent media report that CA is / may be brining a
desalinization plant back on line. About damn time.

On 7/1/14 5:06 PM, philo wrote:
The first time I went to Las Vegas...probably 1964 or so,
it was 117F.
gee, that's odd, I don't recall ever going back to that hell
hole again.

I can't comprehend why anyone would want to go to Las Vegas
in the first place.

Never been there -- never will be...

On Wed, 02 Jul 2014 21:57:58 -0600, rbowman
wrote:

Oren wrote:

On Wed, 02 Jul 2014 08:09:21 -0600, rbowman
wrote:

I'm LV's worst nightmare; I see the sights, catch some of the free
entertainment, get some good food, and leave.

Thanks for leaving your money here

The most I've left is the $8 or whatever the buffet goes for. One chilly
night in Reno I did buy a roll of nickles for the poker machines rather than
sit in the truck and read. I was bored ****less halfway through the roll.


If you flew here, stayed in a room, bought stuff - you left money
here.

On Wed, 02 Jul 2014 19:08:12 -0700, Ashton Crusher
wrote:

Yeah, I don't get it how people are all worked up of a couple yeas of
bad weather in a few places. Within every decade there are floods and
hurricanes and tornados and crap somewhere in the US. And changing
weather is normal, did people think nothing was ever going to change
after they were born?

I wasn't born knowing.

John Albert wrote:

On 7/1/14 5:06 PM, philo wrote:
The first time I went to Las Vegas...probably 1964 or so,
it was 117F.
gee, that's odd, I don't recall ever going back to that hell
hole again.

I can't comprehend why anyone would want to go to Las Vegas
in the first place.

Never been there -- never will be...

Then your ignorance will continue. Go there and you'll learn why people
go there. Hint - it's not all about gambling.

On Thu, 03 Jul 2014 08:48:55 -0400, Kurt Ullman
wrote:

Yeah, I don't get it how people are all worked up of a couple yeas of
bad weather in a few places. Within every decade there are floods and
hurricanes and tornados and crap somewhere in the US. And changing
weather is normal, did people think nothing was ever going to change
after they were born?

I especially liked the arguments after Sandy about how two "100 year"
storms happening so close together had to mean something. Silly me, I
never knew that 100 year storms were scheduled and not random occurances.

Try to build a house here in the desert. Because of the "100 year
flood", you have to excavate soil thousands of years old, put in new
soil and compact it. Just brilliant

On Thu, 3 Jul 2014 05:12:02 +0000 (UTC), gregz
wrote:

You should see Vegas flood when it rains heavy, usually mid august.


You should see the drainage system built in the past 20 years.
Charleston Blvd underpass no longer floods .

Finally a decent system - draining flash floods.

On Thu, 03 Jul 2014 08:50:37 -0400, Kurt Ullman
wrote:

You should see Vegas flood when it rains heavy, usually mid august.

Greg

You could you could almost surf behind the old Imperial Palace when a
deluge came about.

Last I read was that drainage problem was fixed

On Thu, 03 Jul 2014 11:49:08 -0400, John Albert
wrote:

I can't comprehend why anyone would want to go to Las Vegas
in the first place.

Never been there -- never will be...

So go sit in the corner. I moved here. Never intended to stay.

Posted from Las Vegas.

On Thu, 03 Jul 2014 11:18:37 -0500, "Pete C."
wrote:

I can't comprehend why anyone would want to go to Las Vegas
in the first place.

Never been there -- never will be...

Then your ignorance will continue. Go there and you'll learn why people
go there. Hint - it's not all about gambling.

Touche!
--
"Dumb is local...As soon as you go 15 miles away from your dumbness, you see how dumb you are." -- Sherrod Small

On 07/02/2014 05:29 PM, Ashton Crusher wrote:

Pretty much the same for Phoenix


It was 114 at my house yesterday. Only up to 109 so far today. The
red brick pavers are 150+

\


I live in Milwaukee and this is the coldest summer I can remember.

At Noon it's a whopping 66 degrees.

In article ,
Oren wrote:

On Thu, 03 Jul 2014 08:50:37 -0400, Kurt Ullman
wrote:

You should see Vegas flood when it rains heavy, usually mid august.

Greg

You could you could almost surf behind the old Imperial Palace when a
deluge came about.

Last I read was that drainage problem was fixed

I would hope so, It's been about 12 years since the last time I made it
back (two days after they topped out the steel on the Wynn.. man it has
been a long time..._)
--
"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive,
but what they conceal is vital."
-- Aaron Levenstein

Oren wrote:

On Thu, 03 Jul 2014 11:49:08 -0400, John Albert
wrote:

I can't comprehend why anyone would want to go to Las Vegas
in the first place.

Never been there -- never will be...

So go sit in the corner. I moved here. Never intended to stay.

Posted from Las Vegas.

If Cirque du Soleil offered me a job on the tech crew for one of the
shows there I would strongly consider moving there at least part time.

On Thursday, July 3, 2014 11:41:10 AM UTC-4, Oren wrote:
On Wed, 02 Jul 2014 22:04:16 -0600, rbowman

wrote:



Oren wrote:



Lake Mead supports AZ, CA & NV. Some runs off in Mexico somewhere in

salt water.



They're talking about re-opening the very expensive desalinization plant at

Yuma. By treaty, Mexico gets so many acre feet of the Colorado and they

would really like water that they can use for irrigation without killing the

crops.





There was a recent media report that CA is / may be brining a

desalinization plant back on line. About damn time.

I like to brine a pork chop or turkey. But how do you brine a
desalinzation plant? And isn't that an oxymoron?

People have to understand that there are places on this Earth that simply can't sustain a large population. I find it hard to watch as people in some of the dirt poorest places on this Earth are raising large families.

I guess I find it equally hard to watch as unnaturally large populations in what are effectively deserts are sustained by food donations from western countries like Canada, USA, Britain and Australia. I know it's hard to watch as a famine decimates a population, but keeping a large population alive by sending food to those areas is only delaying the inevitable. Eventually the natural order has to prevail, and if the land those people live on can't sustain a large population, then eventually the population has to come down in those areas.

And, truth be told, Las Vegas and Phoenix, Arizona are just such examples of how importing food to areas that couldn't naturally sustain a large population can only work for so long. Eventually, that large population uses up the resources and reserves of the area, and then there's problems... water being the obvious one. As it stands now, Phoenix, Arizona gets it's water from an underground aquifer. Essentially, it's a huge underground oil reservoir filled with water instead of oil. But, Phoenix is already having to curb water useage because the aquifer is running out of water.

In all of these cases, eventually nature will prevail, and those areas of the Earth that cannot support a large population simply won't have a large population.

Oren wrote:

If you flew here, stayed in a room, bought stuff - you left money
here.

I suppose I did buy some food occasionally. At the time, I was a OTR driver
and the company had a terminal in Vegas, so I brought my accomodations with
me, a Volvo White with a sleeper. Mostly what I left in Vegas was carpet,
sometimes furniture.

If I was coming in from Georgia it was a pain in the butt since you got off
the big road a Kingman and crossed the dam. The road down into the canyon
was very interesting with a 53' trailer. I haven't been over the new bridge
but it has to be an improvement.

Oren wrote:

Try to build a house here in the desert. Because of the "100 year
flood", you have to excavate soil thousands of years old, put in new
soil and compact it. Just brilliant

I spent the winter in AZ when they had an exceptionally wet spell and people
found out what a hundred year flood plain is. Hint: 'rio' isn't Spanish for
'dry, sandy place to drive your ATV'.

gregz wrote:

I was there the night Luxor opened. It had the river, but they soon
eliminated that river and added more slot machines.

Figures. What I was really interested in was the virtual reality rides, I
guess you'd call them. They were very sophisticated for the early '90s.

http://archive.wired.com/wired/archive/1.05/luxor.html

Then there was that landing beacon for Martians...


Right, I've gone to Vegas perhaps, 40 times. Never went to gamble. I went
there for the sun, swimming, relaxation, and some craziness.

Except for a family vacation in the '60s, my 'going to Vegas' was hauling
stuff in, usually carpet or furniture. For a while I'd migrate from Montana
to Arizona for the winters on Hwy 93, but I always jumped off I15 on the
east side of town to avoid the whole mess.

Pete C. wrote:

Then your ignorance will continue. Go there and you'll learn why people
go there. Hint - it's not all about gambling.

We made the mistake of holding a users conference there one year. Let's just
say many of our clients are not particularly well funded local government
agencies and a lot of travel requests got bounced back from the bean
counters with a note saying "Conference? Vegas? Like hell!"

We sort of tried to hedge by saying "Clark County" but too many people can
use google maps for that smokescreen to last long.

gregz wrote:

You should see Vegas flood when it rains heavy, usually mid august.

The trucking company had a terminal that was a real gem. After you backed
into the dock, they'd send somebody out with the company pickup to ferry you
to shore. I don't know if the drains in the parking lot were real or dummies
that didn't go anyplace.

LA can be like that too. "It doesn't rain in southern California."

Kurt Ullman wrote:
In article
,
gregz wrote:


You should see Vegas flood when it rains heavy, usually mid august.

Greg

You could you could almost surf behind the old Imperial Palace when a
deluge came about.

My favorite parking area !!!!

Greg

gregz wrote:
"Pete C." wrote:
Rick wrote:

On 07/02/2014 12:41 PM, Pete C. wrote:
The casino tycoons have plenty of money, ultimately they'll end up
funding something like this.

I doubt it.

Taxpayers will pay for the pipeline. And the one percenters that own
the casinos also own the construction companies that will get the
lucrative pipeline contract.

The taxpayers in vegas mostly only exist because of the casinos. Before
the casinos there was nothing there, thus no employment and nobody to
pay taxes.

Didn't need much tax with nobody there.

Many places like Pittsburgh, began as manufacturing and mining centers.
Most of that is gone. The city is still here, but a bit smaller.

You should see Vegas flood when it rains heavy, usually mid august.

Greg

Today's forecast...

....The Flash Flood Warning will expire at 600 PM MST/600 PM PDT/ for
extreme south central Clark and extreme west central Mohave counties...

Heavy rain in the Laughlin-Bullhead City area has ended. Area washes and
streams will continue to run high before gradually receding this evening.

Lat...Lon 3530 11473 3529 11447 3498 11449 3497 11458 3511 11475

338 PM PDT sun Jul 6 2014

....A Flash Flood Warning remains in effect until 615 PM PDT for west
central Clark County...

At 332 PM PDT...National Weather Service Doppler radar continued to
indicate a thunderstorm producing flash flooding over portions of Red Rock
Canyon and mountain Spring Ranch area.

Locations impacted include...western Red Rock Canyon...Spring Mountain
ranch...Blue Diamond

Precautionary/preparedness actions...

Flash flooding is expected in washes...low water crossings and on roads. To
escape rising water...move to higher ground if hiking. Never try to cross a
flooded Road or enter a flood channel while driving. Turn around...don't
drown!

Report flooding to the Las Vegas National Weather Service via facebook or
twitter.

Lat...Lon 3623 11557 3615 11542 3608 11539 3604 11540 3605 11550 3605 11557
3609 11559

On 7/3/14, 10:01 AM, Harry K wrote:


It is far more than "a few years". The entire middle of the states
where irrigation is relied upon for agriculture is running out of
water. The water table is dropping and that water is not being
replenished, it is "fossil" water from centuries on centuries of
storage.

They are deepening wells every year but don't seem to see the
elephant in the room, the water isn't going to last forever.

Harry K

Not necessarily so. There are trigger mechanisms in place to
allocate water if the water tables drop too far. There are moratoriums
in place against increased irrigation acreage for some areas.
This in in Nebraska. We have more irrigation than any other state.
We just happen to be sitting on a prime spot over the Ogallala
Aquifer. We also learned from other states' misfortunes.
The primary regulators are the Natural Resources Districts with the
state as a backup.
Information from the USGS if you're interested.
http://alturl.com/batgu