The local government insists that no cars or vehicles be parked on unpaved
ground. I'm planning to put pea stone down and wonder what sort of
preparation is required.

When my neighbor did this, they just dumped a LOT of the stone on the ground
and spread it out. As you can imagine, stones went everywhere and the area
was impossible to walk through because you would sink into the stones. The
stones got onto the lawn from snow shoveling and banged up the lawnmower
blades and occasionally sent missiles flying through the air. I'd like to
avoid that, if possible, although it may just come with the territory.

Am I correct in assuming that pea stones are roundish, cream and white
roundish colored stones about 3/8" in diameter while pea gravel has more
ragged edges? Does anyone have pricing information for their area so I can
compare the quotes I get from the several places I will be calling in the
next few hours? I realize location makes a big cost difference but I am
just looking for gross data points.

How much would it/should it take to create a "pad" for a minivan?

The precise wording of the ordinance says that as long as the wheels are on
stone, brick or gravel, they can be just runners that the tires sit on and
the whole area need not be covered in building material. I think that would
look tacky, but it might be easier to control the pea stone by digging two
parallel trenches, lining them with a layer of sand and then filling the
trench with the stone.

Thanks in advance for your input,

--
Bobby G.

Robert Green wrote:
The local government insists that no cars or vehicles be parked on
unpaved ground. I'm planning to put pea stone down and wonder what
sort of preparation is required.

wouldn't chipped gravel work a lot better for this usage? Pea gravel is just
going to push aside when you drive on it.

"Robert Green" wrote in message
...
The local government insists that no cars or vehicles be parked on unpaved
ground. I'm planning to put pea stone down and wonder what sort of
preparation is required.

When my neighbor did this, they just dumped a LOT of the stone on the
ground
and spread it out. As you can imagine, stones went everywhere and the
area
was impossible to walk through because you would sink into the stones.
The
stones got onto the lawn from snow shoveling and banged up the lawnmower
blades and occasionally sent missiles flying through the air. I'd like to
avoid that, if possible, although it may just come with the territory.

Am I correct in assuming that pea stones are roundish, cream and white
roundish colored stones about 3/8" in diameter while pea gravel has more
ragged edges? Does anyone have pricing information for their area so I
can
compare the quotes I get from the several places I will be calling in the
next few hours? I realize location makes a big cost difference but I am
just looking for gross data points.

How much would it/should it take to create a "pad" for a minivan?

The precise wording of the ordinance says that as long as the wheels are
on
stone, brick or gravel, they can be just runners that the tires sit on and
the whole area need not be covered in building material. I think that
would
look tacky, but it might be easier to control the pea stone by digging two
parallel trenches, lining them with a layer of sand and then filling the
trench with the stone.


You may want to check out what is called Crusher Run. It is rock that
starts off about 3/4 of an inch rock and finer . Sort of like you just take
a big rock and start crushing it up and get anywhere from almost dust up to
the 3/4 inch stones.

The stone is not very much , maybe 10 to 15 dollars per ton. I would think
maybe 5 tons would be plenty for just one car to park on. The other cost
is for the truck to deliver it. Total may run from $ 150 to $ 200 depending
on the area and how far the trucks have to go. If you are very far from
where the rock is, there may be an added cost.

On 7/24/2013 8:43 AM, Robert Green wrote:
The local government insists that no cars or vehicles be parked on unpaved
ground. I'm planning to put pea stone down and wonder what sort of
preparation is required.

It's not what you've planned to do, but have you thought about using
permeable pavers? You could either pave the entire parking area or
just do a couple of runner tracks for the tires to rest on. The pavers
can be filled with gravel or planted with grass.
Here's a look at a driveway made with TurfStone permeable pavers:

http://www.mutualmaterials.com/homeo...ntal/turfstone

or http://tinyurl.com/l7y74jl

"Robert Green" wrote in
message
The local government insists that no cars or vehicles be
parked on unpaved ground. I'm planning to put pea stone
down and wonder what sort of preparation is required.

Excavate, put in, confine edges, compact. See below.
_________________

When my neighbor did this, they just dumped a LOT of the
stone on the ground and spread it out. As you can
imagine, stones went everywhere and the area was
impossible to walk through because you would sink into
the stones. The stones got onto the lawn from snow
shoveling and banged up the lawnmower blades and
occasionally sent missiles flying through the air. I'd
like to avoid that, if possible, although it may just
come with the territory.

Am I correct in assuming that pea stones are roundish,
cream and white roundish colored stones about 3/8" in
diameter while pea gravel has more ragged edges? Does
anyone have pricing information for their area so I can
compare the quotes I get from the several places I will
be calling in the next few hours? I realize location
makes a big cost difference but I am just looking for
gross data points.

How much would it/should it take to create a "pad" for a
minivan?

The precise wording of the ordinance says that as long as
the wheels are on stone, brick or gravel, they can be
just runners that the tires sit on and the whole area
need not be covered in building material. I think that
would look tacky, but it might be easier to control the
pea stone by digging two parallel trenches, lining them
with a layer of sand and then filling the trench with the
stone.

Thanks in advance for your input,

Gravel is generally considered to be water rounded stones of whatever size.

If I were going to put down an aggregate I would prefer crushed stone or
crushed concrete to gravel; the rounded edges on gravel make it more
"slippy". I would also want a mix of sizes up to around 3/4";again, the mix
of sizes makes it less slippy.

BTW, crushed concrete makes a good base for pavers or bricks, concrete or
clay (better). Where I live, you could get a 10' x 15' brick pad for about
$750. All materials and labor.

Whatever you put down, you'll need to contain the edges to keep it from
spreading out from weight. Concrete makes a good edging. Just digging a
ditch maybe 6" wide and several inches deeper than the excavated area for
your pad and filling it with your rock would help. Whatever you put down
needs to be compacted mechanically; ground too, if it was disturbed.

How thick do you need it? No idea. I would guess 3-4" depending on what
the soil is.
________________________

A couple of alternatives come to mind...

1. two parellel ditches 8" deep and 16" wide. Put concrete blocks in them,
fill with dirt, plant grass.

2. washout. Washout is what is rinsed out of cement trucks after delivery.
Around here it is free but you need a truck to pick it up and a way to
spread it around. It doesn't set up hard like concrete but does firm up
considerably.

--

dadiOH
____________________________

Winters getting colder? Tired of the rat race?
Taxes out of hand? Maybe just ready for a change?
Check it out... http://www.floridaloghouse.net

"Robert Green" writes:

The local government insists that no cars or vehicles be parked on unpaved
ground. I'm planning to put pea stone down and wonder what sort of
preparation is required.

Hi Robert,

One of the prerequisites to reading AHR is that you must know every
This Old House episode by heart.

(Kidding.)

Anyway, I'm 99% certain they did the pea stone deal by pouring some kind
of tar, then the pea stone then a roller. Search around for the episode.

--
Dan Espen

Dan Espen wrote:
"Robert Green" writes:

The local government insists that no cars or vehicles be parked on
unpaved ground. I'm planning to put pea stone down and wonder what
sort of preparation is required.

Hi Robert,

One of the prerequisites to reading AHR is that you must know every
This Old House episode by heart.

(Kidding.)

Anyway, I'm 99% certain they did the pea stone deal by pouring some
kind of tar, then the pea stone then a roller. Search around for the
episode.

That sounds like the "chip-sealing" they're going to do on my street in the next
few weeks.

"Bob F" wrote in message
...
Robert Green wrote:
The local government insists that no cars or vehicles be parked on
unpaved ground. I'm planning to put pea stone down and wonder what
sort of preparation is required.

wouldn't chipped gravel work a lot better for this usage? Pea gravel is
just
going to push aside when you drive on it.

Well, that's what happened to the neighbor's pea stone - it was just dumped
on the ground and raked out and from there it spread like The Blob.

I'm *completely* unfamiliar with this sort of project, which is why I asked
here before searching around the web. So far, I have the general idea of
digging a few inches down, lining the trench with landscaping cloth, putting
down a layer of sand and then filling to the top of the trench with pea
stone, pea gravel, regular gravel or one of the dozen or so stone products I
see advertised locally.

Thanks for your input, Bob!

--
Bobby G.

"Ralph Mowery" wrote in message

stuff snipped

You may want to check out what is called Crusher Run. It is rock that
starts off about 3/4 of an inch rock and finer . Sort of like you just
take
a big rock and start crushing it up and get anywhere from almost dust up
to
the 3/4 inch stones.

Yes, I've seen that listed on the product page of one of the local stone
suppliers. I just selected pea stone because a) it's mentioned by name as
an acceptable material in the ordinance and b) it's what my neighbor used
before she had concrete poured. Ironically about a month after it was
poured the city came and cut it up to repair the pipes leading to the water
meter and made what was then a very obvious repair. It seems to have aged
and become less noticeable.

The stone is not very much , maybe 10 to 15 dollars per ton. I would
think
maybe 5 tons would be plenty for just one car to park on. The other cost
is for the truck to deliver it. Total may run from $ 150 to $ 200
depending
on the area and how far the trucks have to go. If you are very far from
where the rock is, there may be an added cost.

I am seeing numbers running exactly as you quote, varying a little based on
the quality of the stone. All white pebbles cost more than gravel, etc.
$157 per 1 (what that represents they don't seem to say but I am thinking
maybe that's a cubic yard. I am still waiting for a callback from the city
about what exactly will get them off my back. This is all because one
neighbor called the parking police on another neighbor so they came out an
ticketed as far as the eye could see. A reminder that neighbor wars spread
just like international ones. )-;

Thanks for your input, Ralph

--
Bobby G.
!

"dadiOH" wrote in message
...
"Robert Green" wrote in

stuff snipped

A couple of alternatives come to mind...

1. two parellel ditches 8" deep and 16" wide. Put concrete blocks in
them,
fill with dirt, plant grass.

It seems the sight of grass inflames their ticket writing glands. (-:

2. washout. Washout is what is rinsed out of cement trucks after
delivery.
Around here it is free but you need a truck to pick it up and a way to
spread it around. It doesn't set up hard like concrete but does firm up
considerably.

Sounds like a good way to keep "the Blob" contained. I guess that means
calling some local cement companies to see if they have it, but it sounds
fairly tricky to deal with and I am not sure I want it in my minivan!

Thanks for your input, dadiOH.

--
Bobby G.

"dadiOH" wrote in message
...
"Robert Green" wrote in

stuff snipped

Gravel is generally considered to be water rounded stones of whatever
size.

Thanks. There sure are a lot of different stone/rock/pebble/gravel types
out there.

If I were going to put down an aggregate I would prefer crushed stone or
crushed concrete to gravel; the rounded edges on gravel make it more
"slippy". I would also want a mix of sizes up to around 3/4";again, the
mix
of sizes makes it less slippy.

That makes sense. I remember walking (or trying to!) on my neighbor's
freshly laid three inch deep pea stone driveway and it was a little like
quicksand. When she tried to roll the lawnmower over it the wheels just
pushed up a huge ridge of stone making it almost impossible to move it.

BTW, crushed concrete makes a good base for pavers or bricks, concrete or
clay (better). Where I live, you could get a 10' x 15' brick pad for
about
$750. All materials and labor.

I was quote $1200 by one guy I know. I thought that was a little high, but
since I have no idea of how much elbow grease is involved, it may even be
low for my area (Wash, DC).

Whatever you put down, you'll need to contain the edges to keep it from
spreading out from weight. Concrete makes a good edging. Just digging a
ditch maybe 6" wide and several inches deeper than the excavated area for
your pad and filling it with your rock would help. Whatever you put down
needs to be compacted mechanically; ground too, if it was disturbed.

See my comment earlied about "The Blob." I'll bet if I went to the CCTV
archive I could edit together a time-lapse of her driving slowly spreading
out and disappearing.

How thick do you need it? No idea. I would guess 3-4" depending on what
the soil is.

I think that's what they said in the ordinance. I guess this is the time to
find it and post it here. I'll respond to the rest of your post in another
reply:

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
----------------
It shall be unlawful to park any motor vehicle on the unpaved area of any
residential lot, except during a snow emergency. "Unpaved area" shall mean
any surface not completely covered by asphalt, brick, block, concrete,
gravel, crushed stone or structurally sound porous material. It shall not be
necessary to provide a full platform in the surface material under the
parked motor vehicle so long as the wheels of the vehicle rest on runners or
other surface made of said material. Both city code enforcement officers and
parking enforcement officers shall be authorized to enforce this section of
the City Code. In the performance of their duties under this section, city
enforcement officers are hereby authorized to enter upon private premises in
order to place a parking citation on a vehicle parked in violation hereof if
the vehicle is clearly visible from the street. Any restraint or hindrance
offered to the entry of a city enforcement officer or the placing of a
parking citation on a vehicle by any owner or tenant, or agent of an owner
or tenant, is a misdemeanor.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------

Sounds like if I park the van in the backyard, I am off the hook. My wife
may not like that idea although if it's parked outside the bedroom, I could
hear anyone trying to steal it at night - again!

--
Bobby G.


--
Bobby G.

Robert Green wrote:
The local government insists that no cars or vehicles be parked on unpaved
ground. I'm planning to put pea stone down and wonder what sort of
preparation is required.

When my neighbor did this, they just dumped a LOT of the stone on the ground
and spread it out. As you can imagine, stones went everywhere and the area
was impossible to walk through because you would sink into the stones. The
stones got onto the lawn from snow shoveling and banged up the lawnmower
blades and occasionally sent missiles flying through the air. I'd like to
avoid that, if possible, although it may just come with the territory.

Am I correct in assuming that pea stones are roundish, cream and white
roundish colored stones about 3/8" in diameter while pea gravel has more
ragged edges? Does anyone have pricing information for their area so I can
compare the quotes I get from the several places I will be calling in the
next few hours? I realize location makes a big cost difference but I am
just looking for gross data points.

You have already checked with asphalt paving companies on a cost for
paving?
Any kind of loose stone will sink into the ground from traffic after a
while, which may just months away, as was mine which started out as
shale. I had to temporarily have 2x10 lumber lain down over the shale in
order to walk from the car to the front door after a rain.
Figure out the cost of stone that has to be overlain over the years
versus asphalt paving.



How much would it/should it take to create a "pad" for a minivan?

The precise wording of the ordinance says that as long as the wheels are on
stone, brick or gravel, they can be just runners that the tires sit on and
the whole area need not be covered in building material. I think that would
look tacky, but it might be easier to control the pea stone by digging two
parallel trenches, lining them with a layer of sand and then filling the
trench with the stone.

Thanks in advance for your input,

--
Bobby G.




--
Bill
In Hamptonburgh, NY
In the original Orange County. Est. 1683
To email, remove the double zeros after @

"Moe DeLoughan" wrote in message
...
On 7/24/2013 8:43 AM, Robert Green wrote:
The local government insists that no cars or vehicles be parked on
unpaved
ground. I'm planning to put pea stone down and wonder what sort of
preparation is required.

It's not what you've planned to do, but have you thought about using
permeable pavers? You could either pave the entire parking area or
just do a couple of runner tracks for the tires to rest on. The pavers
can be filled with gravel or planted with grass.

I am not sure that they will make the authorities happy. Also, I am not
sure exactly what you mean by permeable pavers. I am not much of a
landscaper

Here's a look at a driveway made with TurfStone permeable pavers:


http://www.mutualmaterials.com/homeo...ntal/turfstone

or http://tinyurl.com/l7y74jl

Great. Thanks for the URL's

I am guessing from the wording of the ordinance and what I know from other
neighbors getting hassled that grass growing through the pavers like it is
in the pictures will set them off in a ticket-writing frenzy.

I have considered asphalt or concrete to make a real driveway, but I'd
really rather not, if only because I feel that the city is forcing me to and
I hate being forced to do anything. In the long run it's probably the right
thing to do, though.

--
Bobby G.

"Dan Espen" wrote in message
...
"Robert Green" writes:

The local government insists that no cars or vehicles be parked on
unpaved
ground. I'm planning to put pea stone down and wonder what sort of
preparation is required.

Hi Robert,

One of the prerequisites to reading AHR is that you must know every
This Old House episode by heart.

(Kidding.)

Actually, I used to record them on my DVR faithfully every Saturday.
Finding any one episode would be painful because they're not very well
categorized. I'll look on-line. Good suggestion.

Anyway, I'm 99% certain they did the pea stone deal by pouring some kind
of tar, then the pea stone then a roller. Search around for the episode.

That would prevent "the Blob" from occurring. Worth a shot. I saw a
product that's pea stone embedded in wire mesh but it's hideously expensive.

Thanks for your input, Dan!

--
Bobby G.


--
Dan Espen

"Robert Green" wrote in news:ksolqi$3gv$1@dont-
email.me:

The local government insists that no cars or vehicles be parked on unpaved
ground. I'm planning to put pea stone down and wonder what sort of
preparation is required.

I have no advice to offer on the preparation, but I sure do on the material: Pea gravel is too fine
for parking vehicles. You want "crushed stone" instead. Best thing to do is to call a local stone
and gravel dealer, tell them what you want the stone for and how large an area you need to
cover, and let them tell you what to get and how much to get.

On 7/24/2013 10:52 AM, Robert Green wrote:
"dadiOH" wrote in message
...
"Robert Green" wrote in

stuff snipped

Gravel is generally considered to be water rounded stones of whatever
size.

Thanks. There sure are a lot of different stone/rock/pebble/gravel types
out there.

If I were going to put down an aggregate I would prefer crushed stone or
crushed concrete to gravel; the rounded edges on gravel make it more
"slippy". I would also want a mix of sizes up to around 3/4";again, the
mix
of sizes makes it less slippy.

That makes sense. I remember walking (or trying to!) on my neighbor's
freshly laid three inch deep pea stone driveway and it was a little like
quicksand. When she tried to roll the lawnmower over it the wheels just
pushed up a huge ridge of stone making it almost impossible to move it.

BTW, crushed concrete makes a good base for pavers or bricks, concrete or
clay (better). Where I live, you could get a 10' x 15' brick pad for
about
$750. All materials and labor.

I was quote $1200 by one guy I know. I thought that was a little high, but
since I have no idea of how much elbow grease is involved, it may even be
low for my area (Wash, DC).

Whatever you put down, you'll need to contain the edges to keep it from
spreading out from weight. Concrete makes a good edging. Just digging a
ditch maybe 6" wide and several inches deeper than the excavated area for
your pad and filling it with your rock would help. Whatever you put down
needs to be compacted mechanically; ground too, if it was disturbed.

See my comment earlied about "The Blob." I'll bet if I went to the CCTV
archive I could edit together a time-lapse of her driving slowly spreading
out and disappearing.

How thick do you need it? No idea. I would guess 3-4" depending on what
the soil is.

I think that's what they said in the ordinance. I guess this is the time to
find it and post it here. I'll respond to the rest of your post in another
reply:

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
----------------
It shall be unlawful to park any motor vehicle on the unpaved area of any
residential lot, except during a snow emergency. "Unpaved area" shall mean
any surface not completely covered by asphalt, brick, block, concrete,
gravel, crushed stone or structurally sound porous material. It shall not be
necessary to provide a full platform in the surface material under the
parked motor vehicle so long as the wheels of the vehicle rest on runners or
other surface made of said material. Both city code enforcement officers and
parking enforcement officers shall be authorized to enforce this section of
the City Code. In the performance of their duties under this section, city
enforcement officers are hereby authorized to enter upon private premises in
order to place a parking citation on a vehicle parked in violation hereof if
the vehicle is clearly visible from the street. Any restraint or hindrance
offered to the entry of a city enforcement officer or the placing of a
parking citation on a vehicle by any owner or tenant, or agent of an owner
or tenant, is a misdemeanor.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------

Sounds like if I park the van in the backyard, I am off the hook. My wife
may not like that idea although if it's parked outside the bedroom, I could
hear anyone trying to steal it at night - again!

--
Bobby G.


--
Bobby G.



probably because of pm10 ordinances that were passed in the last 10
years. i had a gravel front yard, and still got a ticket for parking my
car on it. i just moved it to the graveled side yard, put in a gate, and
presto, it was legal.

"Robert Green" writes:

"Dan Espen" wrote in message
...
"Robert Green" writes:

The local government insists that no cars or vehicles be parked on
unpaved
ground. I'm planning to put pea stone down and wonder what sort of
preparation is required.

Hi Robert,

One of the prerequisites to reading AHR is that you must know every
This Old House episode by heart.

(Kidding.)

Actually, I used to record them on my DVR faithfully every Saturday.
Finding any one episode would be painful because they're not very well
categorized. I'll look on-line. Good suggestion.

Anyway, I'm 99% certain they did the pea stone deal by pouring some kind
of tar, then the pea stone then a roller. Search around for the episode.

That would prevent "the Blob" from occurring. Worth a shot. I saw a
product that's pea stone embedded in wire mesh but it's hideously expensive.

Thanks for your input, Dan!

Hope you find the episode. I can't remember what they did for the base
but they were doing some old house and wanted a rustic look. They may
have done asphalt first. It did look pretty good when they were done.


--
Dan Espen

Robert Green wrote:
The local government insists that no cars or vehicles be parked on
unpaved ground. I'm planning to put pea stone down and wonder what
sort of preparation is required.

When my neighbor did this, they just dumped a LOT of the stone on the
ground and spread it out. As you can imagine, stones went everywhere
and the area was impossible to walk through because you would sink . . . ,

How much would it/should it take to create a "pad" for a minivan? . . . ,

If you go to one or two places that sell stone, gravel, etc., and ask them,
they will have the answer. You just tell them what you want it for and how
big of an area you want to cover (how many square feet), they will tell you
what you need (or what your choices are), how much it will cost, what they
charge to deliver it, etc. They'll know that you want something that
compacts together (like "crushed stone", or whatever it is called) and not
something that stays loose like you neighbor chose to get.

How thick? -- I don't know. If it were me, I'd probably just ask them how
much I would need for a certain size space (such as 10 feet by 20 feet) and
2 inches thick. That will give you an idea of the cost. You may need more
than 2 inches thick, but if it were me, I would start with that knowing that
I could add more later.

Let us know what you find out and what the cost is.

On Wed, 24 Jul 2013 13:23:24 -0400, "Robert Green"
wrote:

I'm *completely* unfamiliar with this sort of project, which is why I asked
here before searching around the web.

Check into Decomposed granite (well compacted). It is used around
here under the faux grass products.

"...Decomposed granite can be used in different ways, even mixed with
other substances. It is commonly used for sidewalks, gardens,
pathways, patios, trails, playing fields, golf courses and any area
where stone or aggregates can be used. You can also make decomposed
granite driveways."

Google some images of decomposed granite driveways.

http://ideas.reliableremodeler.com/Article.aspx?Title=The-Truth-about-Decomposed-Granite-Driveways&ID=632

On Wednesday, July 24, 2013 10:55:58 AM UTC-7, Robert Green wrote:
"Moe DeLoughan" wrote in message

...

On 7/24/2013 8:43 AM, Robert Green wrote:

The local government insists that no cars or vehicles be parked on

unpaved

ground. I'm planning to put pea stone down and wonder what sort of

preparation is required.



It's not what you've planned to do, but have you thought about using

permeable pavers? You could either pave the entire parking area or

just do a couple of runner tracks for the tires to rest on. The pavers

can be filled with gravel or planted with grass.



I am not sure that they will make the authorities happy. Also, I am not

sure exactly what you mean by permeable pavers. I am not much of a

landscaper



Here's a look at a driveway made with TurfStone permeable pavers:





http://www.mutualmaterials.com/homeo...ntal/turfstone



or http://tinyurl.com/l7y74jl



Great. Thanks for the URL's



I am guessing from the wording of the ordinance and what I know from other

neighbors getting hassled that grass growing through the pavers like it is

in the pictures will set them off in a ticket-writing frenzy.



I have considered asphalt or concrete to make a real driveway, but I'd

really rather not, if only because I feel that the city is forcing me to and

I hate being forced to do anything. In the long run it's probably the right

thing to do, though.


Bobby, I can empathize with your objection to being forced to do something!

However, having read through all the comments, I come away with the feeling that the pea gravel cart is pulling the driveway horse (block that metaphor!).

Personally, I wouldn't mess with any kind of gravel. Too much downside.

I'd just either dig out two trenches to the requisite depth and pour concrete for two driveway runners. Even an inept DIY like moi could almost do it..

Check with your Urban Masters to see if you're allowed to plant between the runners. That may not be such a great idea, if your car is parked there a lot. Years ago, I busted my buns to dig out and modify the soil between my runners and seed grass. Well, you just know that it all died because didn't receive any sunshine!!!

BETWEEN the runners might be a place to put gravel, but not the tiny kind; as others have observed, it tends to fly around. If you can afford it, put grow-through pavers between the runners. Your Urban Masters might not even notice, since your car's wheels are on solid concrete runners.

Another (inexpensive) solution might be DG between the runners, but remember it has to be moistened and FIRMLY compacted.

Interesting project; keep us posted.

HB

TomR wrote:
Robert Green wrote:
The local government insists that no cars or vehicles be parked on
unpaved ground. I'm planning to put pea stone down and wonder what
sort of preparation is required.

When my neighbor did this, they just dumped a LOT of the stone on the
ground and spread it out. As you can imagine, stones went everywhere
and the area was impossible to walk through because you would sink .
. . , How much would it/should it take to create a "pad" for a minivan? .
. . ,

If you go to one or two places that sell stone, gravel, etc., and ask
them, they will have the answer. You just tell them what you want it
for and how big of an area you want to cover (how many square feet),
they will tell you what you need (or what your choices are), how much
it will cost, what they charge to deliver it, etc. They'll know that
you want something that compacts together (like "crushed stone", or
whatever it is called) and not something that stays loose like you
neighbor chose to get.
How thick? -- I don't know. If it were me, I'd probably just ask
them how much I would need for a certain size space (such as 10 feet
by 20 feet) and 2 inches thick. That will give you an idea of the
cost. You may need more than 2 inches thick, but if it were me, I
would start with that knowing that I could add more later.

Let us know what you find out and what the cost is.

After I posted the above, I saw your other posts about the town and the
tickets etc. I doubt that my approach will work given what is going on in
your neighborhood with the officials.

My guess is that when you hear back from the officials about what you need
to do, you will end up needing to have a driveway put in -- including a
permit for the new driveway. If that's the case, asphalt will probably end
up being the lowest cost.

If, for some reason, your town wants a driveway or parking area put it, but
doesn't require a permit, you could wait until some of your neighbors have
an asphalt driveway going in and ask the company doing the work what it
would cost for you to have one put in while they are already there doing
work on that street. I had an asphalt driveway replaced and expanded about
4 years ago. While the workers were there doing my driveway, the owner of
the company went up and down the street and 3 other neighbors on the same
street had him do theirs at the same time. Of course, he didn't do them all
in the same day, but they had all of their equipment there and just did all
of the driveways while doing mine and for 2 days after that.

In my case, I didn't get a permit and I don't know if I needed one since it
was a replacement and not a new driveway. And, none of my neighbors got a
permit. But, in your case, the town is there and watching every move, so
you'll have to figure out what the requirements are and then just do what
they say.

"Oren" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 24 Jul 2013 13:23:24 -0400, "Robert Green"
wrote:

I'm *completely* unfamiliar with this sort of project, which is why I
asked
here before searching around the web.

Check into Decomposed granite (well compacted). It is used around
here under the faux grass products.

"...Decomposed granite can be used in different ways, even mixed with
other substances. It is commonly used for sidewalks, gardens,
pathways, patios, trails, playing fields, golf courses and any area
where stone or aggregates can be used. You can also make decomposed
granite driveways."

The above is available where granite is mined, if you are in a limestone
area get some "limestone screenings", or whatever it is called in your area
for the dust and small stones that are screened out of larger gravel, if you
want a stone surface you get, "limestone crusher run" in whatever size you
want, this is the larger stones with the dust and small stones still mixed
in. Both products will compact and set like soft concrete, the limestone
screenings will have a relatively hard surface, the crusher run will have
gravel on the surface. This is what my driveway is made of and I have had 35
ton trucks on it with barely a depression. Another plus if there is a
problem it can be solved by raking out the surface.

Don't use rounded stones as they will never stop moving because they have no
sharp edges to lock together.

On 7/24/2013 12:05 PM, TomR wrote:
TomR wrote:
Robert Green wrote:
The local government insists that no cars or vehicles be parked on
unpaved ground. I'm planning to put pea stone down and wonder what
sort of preparation is required.

When my neighbor did this, they just dumped a LOT of the stone on the
ground and spread it out. As you can imagine, stones went everywhere
and the area was impossible to walk through because you would sink .
. . , How much would it/should it take to create a "pad" for a minivan? .
. . ,

If you go to one or two places that sell stone, gravel, etc., and ask
them, they will have the answer. You just tell them what you want it
for and how big of an area you want to cover (how many square feet),
they will tell you what you need (or what your choices are), how much
it will cost, what they charge to deliver it, etc. They'll know that
you want something that compacts together (like "crushed stone", or
whatever it is called) and not something that stays loose like you
neighbor chose to get.
How thick? -- I don't know. If it were me, I'd probably just ask
them how much I would need for a certain size space (such as 10 feet
by 20 feet) and 2 inches thick. That will give you an idea of the
cost. You may need more than 2 inches thick, but if it were me, I
would start with that knowing that I could add more later.

Let us know what you find out and what the cost is.

After I posted the above, I saw your other posts about the town and the
tickets etc. I doubt that my approach will work given what is going on in
your neighborhood with the officials.

My guess is that when you hear back from the officials about what you need
to do, you will end up needing to have a driveway put in -- including a
permit for the new driveway. If that's the case, asphalt will probably end
up being the lowest cost.

check maximum area coverage for driveways. in my town, there's a %age
maximum front yard coverage with hard surfaces (paving, concrete, etc)
to prevent someone from paving their entire front yard for parking.


If, for some reason, your town wants a driveway or parking area put it, but
doesn't require a permit, you could wait until some of your neighbors have
an asphalt driveway going in and ask the company doing the work what it
would cost for you to have one put in while they are already there doing
work on that street. I had an asphalt driveway replaced and expanded about
4 years ago. While the workers were there doing my driveway, the owner of
the company went up and down the street and 3 other neighbors on the same
street had him do theirs at the same time. Of course, he didn't do them all
in the same day, but they had all of their equipment there and just did all
of the driveways while doing mine and for 2 days after that.

In my case, I didn't get a permit and I don't know if I needed one since it
was a replacement and not a new driveway. And, none of my neighbors got a
permit. But, in your case, the town is there and watching every move, so
you'll have to figure out what the requirements are and then just do what
they say.

"Robert Green" wrote in message
...
The local government insists that no cars or vehicles be parked on
unpaved
ground. I'm planning to put pea stone down and wonder what sort of
preparation is required.

When my neighbor did this, they just dumped a LOT of the stone on the
ground
and spread it out. As you can imagine, stones went everywhere and the
area
was impossible to walk through because you would sink into the stones.
The
stones got onto the lawn from snow shoveling and banged up the lawnmower
blades and occasionally sent missiles flying through the air. I'd like
to
avoid that, if possible, although it may just come with the territory.

Am I correct in assuming that pea stones are roundish, cream and white
roundish colored stones about 3/8" in diameter while pea gravel has more
ragged edges? Does anyone have pricing information for their area so I
can
compare the quotes I get from the several places I will be calling in the
next few hours? I realize location makes a big cost difference but I am
just looking for gross data points.

How much would it/should it take to create a "pad" for a minivan?

The precise wording of the ordinance says that as long as the wheels are
on
stone, brick or gravel, they can be just runners that the tires sit on
and
the whole area need not be covered in building material. I think that
would
look tacky, but it might be easier to control the pea stone by digging
two
parallel trenches, lining them with a layer of sand and then filling the
trench with the stone.

Thanks in advance for your input,

--
Bobby G.

No gravel, it doesn't nest. Look into #57 limestone.

"Oren" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 24 Jul 2013 13:23:24 -0400, "Robert Green"
wrote:

I'm *completely* unfamiliar with this sort of project, which is why I
asked
here before searching around the web.

Check into Decomposed granite (well compacted). It is used around
here under the faux grass products.

"...Decomposed granite can be used in different ways, even mixed with
other substances. It is commonly used for sidewalks, gardens,
pathways, patios, trails, playing fields, golf courses and any area
where stone or aggregates can be used. You can also make decomposed
granite driveways."

Google some images of decomposed granite driveways.


http://ideas.reliableremodeler.com/A...th-about-Decom
posed-Granite-Driveways&ID=632

That site has lots of great and expensive ideas for really doing up a
driveway. Too bad I am looking to do this on the cheap. (-:

--
Bobby G.

"willshak" wrote in message
...
Robert Green wrote:
stuff snipped
You have already checked with asphalt paving companies on a cost for
paving?

This "adventure" just started last Friday with a citation notice. Some
idjit neighbor complained about the kid next door's SafeLite van being
parked too long in front of "his" house - the complainer is a freaking
squatter from what I know, allowed to live in the foreclosed property by the
bank until it is sold - and the code enforcers came out and wrote citations
as far as their eyes could see. I was but one of many.

I believe the intent is roughly the same as when parents say to unruly kids
in the backseat on a long drive: "Don't make me come back there, you'll ALL
regret it!" We're all regretting it.

Any kind of loose stone will sink into the ground from traffic after a
while, which may just months away, as was mine which started out as
shale. I had to temporarily have 2x10 lumber lain down over the shale in
order to walk from the car to the front door after a rain.

I've never had a problem with mud or drainage. The soil here has a very
high clay content and the stones that didn't get snow-shoveled or raked away
are deeply imbedded in the dirt. The problem is that grass grew up between
the gaps and caught the attention of parking

Figure out the cost of stone that has to be overlain over the years
versus asphalt paving.

I'm working out all those calculations and talking to neighbors who have
fallen down the same rabbit hole. There's actually still enough pea stone
embedded in the dirt that it probably satisfies the code. The problem is
that we've had a remarkable growing season and the grass has become lush and
is growing up through the pea stone that's left. I used Roundup today to
kill all the grass, hoping that may be enough to get "the man" off my back.

But I know that paving or concrete are the real solutions. Unfortunately
they are also the "real expensive" solutions. I want to save my pennies so
I can eat when the Chinese economy collapses and drags the whole world into
another bottomless financial pit.

--
Bobby G.

"Higgs Boson" wrote in message
news:09d061e6-431c-4d46-be00-


Bobby, I can empathize with your objection to being forced to do
something!

Thanks.

However, having read through all the comments, I come away with the feeling
that the pea gravel cart is pulling the driveway horse (block that
metaphor!).

Groan! (-;

Personally, I wouldn't mess with any kind of gravel. Too much downside.

I'd just either dig out two trenches to the requisite depth and pour
concrete for two driveway runners. Even an inept DIY like moi could almost
do it.

I'm reluctant to DIY concrete. I've not had exceptionally good experience
with it.

Check with your Urban Masters to see if you're allowed to plant between the
runners. That may not be such a great idea, if your car is parked there a
lot. Years ago, I busted my buns to dig out and modify the soil between my
runners and seed grass. Well, you just know that it all died because didn't
receive any sunshine!!!

BETWEEN the runners might be a place to put gravel, but not the tiny kind;
as others have observed, it tends to fly around. If you can afford it, put
grow-through pavers between the runners. Your Urban Masters might not even
notice, since your car's wheels are on solid concrete runners.

Much depends on what they say. So far they have been tacking notices to my
door, sending in the mail and messenger pigeons will be next.

Another (inexpensive) solution might be DG between the runners, but
remember it has to be moistened and FIRMLY compacted.

Interesting project; keep us posted.

I wish they would just go away. My landscaping guy is coming over in a
little while to discuss the issue. We'll see what he recommends.

--
Bobby G.

"chaniarts" wrote in message
news:ksp4rg$t91$2@dont-
stuff snipped

probably because of pm10 ordinances that were passed in the last 10
years. i had a gravel front yard, and still got a ticket for parking my
car on it. i just moved it to the graveled side yard, put in a gate, and
presto, it was legal.

Unfortunately this jurisdiction has a history of retaliation. The day after
I submitted a property tax appeal I got cited for three niggling offenses as
a way of saying "we don't like people who question our judgement."

--
Bobby G.

"Doug Miller" wrote in message
...
"Robert Green" wrote in
news:ksolqi$3gv$1@dont-
email.me:

The local government insists that no cars or vehicles be parked on
unpaved
ground. I'm planning to put pea stone down and wonder what sort of
preparation is required.

I have no advice to offer on the preparation, but I sure do on the
material: Pea gravel is too fine
for parking vehicles. You want "crushed stone" instead. Best thing to do
is to call a local stone
and gravel dealer, tell them what you want the stone for and how large an
area you need to
cover, and let them tell you what to get and how much to get.

That's two votes for crushed stone!

--
Bobby G.

"TomR" wrote in message
...
Robert Green wrote:
The local government insists that no cars or vehicles be parked on
unpaved ground. I'm planning to put pea stone down and wonder what
sort of preparation is required.

When my neighbor did this, they just dumped a LOT of the stone on the
ground and spread it out. As you can imagine, stones went everywhere
and the area was impossible to walk through because you would sink . . .
,

How much would it/should it take to create a "pad" for a minivan? . . .
,

If you go to one or two places that sell stone, gravel, etc., and ask
them,
they will have the answer. You just tell them what you want it for and
how
big of an area you want to cover (how many square feet), they will tell
you
what you need (or what your choices are), how much it will cost, what they
charge to deliver it, etc. They'll know that you want something that
compacts together (like "crushed stone", or whatever it is called) and not
something that stays loose like you neighbor chose to get.

I'm still in the requirements analysis mode because anything I do has to
pass muster with the local authorities. I really want to spend as little as
possible if only because this is being forced on me from out of the blue.
Call it stubborness.

How thick? -- I don't know. If it were me, I'd probably just ask them how
much I would need for a certain size space (such as 10 feet by 20 feet)
and
2 inches thick. That will give you an idea of the cost. You may need
more
than 2 inches thick, but if it were me, I would start with that knowing
that
I could add more later.

Let us know what you find out and what the cost is.

Will do.

--
Bobby G.

"TomR" wrote in message
...

My guess is that when you hear back from the officials about what you need
to do, you will end up needing to have a driveway put in -- including a
permit for the new driveway. If that's the case, asphalt will probably
end
up being the lowest cost.

If, for some reason, your town wants a driveway or parking area put it,
but
doesn't require a permit, you could wait until some of your neighbors have
an asphalt driveway going in and ask the company doing the work what it
would cost for you to have one put in while they are already there doing
work on that street. I had an asphalt driveway replaced and expanded
about
4 years ago. While the workers were there doing my driveway, the owner of
the company went up and down the street and 3 other neighbors on the same
street had him do theirs at the same time. Of course, he didn't do them
all
in the same day, but they had all of their equipment there and just did
all
of the driveways while doing mine and for 2 days after that.

In my case, I didn't get a permit and I don't know if I needed one since
it
was a replacement and not a new driveway. And, none of my neighbors got a
permit. But, in your case, the town is there and watching every move, so
you'll have to figure out what the requirements are and then just do what
they say.

Yep, I suspect you're correct. I feel I woke up last week in a Soviet
gulag. "Go there, do this, sit down, shut up!"

--
Bobby G.

On Wed, 24 Jul 2013 16:23:04 -0400, "Robert Green"
wrote:

That site has lots of great and expensive ideas for really doing up a
driveway. Too bad I am looking to do this on the cheap. (-:

The point was the material will do what you want, a compacted base to
support the van. I wasn't advocating the fancy, costly stuff.

Crushed fine granite (sand like), moistened, and compacted with a
decent walk behind plate compactor.

Pick your poison.

"Robert Green" wrote in message ...

"chaniarts" wrote in message
news:ksp4rg$t91$2@dont-
stuff snipped

probably because of pm10 ordinances that were passed in the last 10
years. i had a gravel front yard, and still got a ticket for parking my
car on it. i just moved it to the graveled side yard, put in a gate, and
presto, it was legal.

Unfortunately this jurisdiction has a history of retaliation. The day after
I submitted a property tax appeal I got cited for three niggling offenses as
a way of saying "we don't like people who question our judgement."

--
Bobby G.

What town is this. I never want to move there. WW

"Robert Green" wrote in message ...

The local government insists that no cars or vehicles be parked on unpaved
ground. I'm planning to put pea stone down and wonder what sort of
preparation is required.

When my neighbor did this, they just dumped a LOT of the stone on the ground
and spread it out. As you can imagine, stones went everywhere and the area
was impossible to walk through because you would sink into the stones. The
stones got onto the lawn from snow shoveling and banged up the lawnmower
blades and occasionally sent missiles flying through the air. I'd like to
avoid that, if possible, although it may just come with the territory.

Am I correct in assuming that pea stones are roundish, cream and white
roundish colored stones about 3/8" in diameter while pea gravel has more
ragged edges? Does anyone have pricing information for their area so I can
compare the quotes I get from the several places I will be calling in the
next few hours? I realize location makes a big cost difference but I am
just looking for gross data points.

How much would it/should it take to create a "pad" for a minivan?

The precise wording of the ordinance says that as long as the wheels are on
stone, brick or gravel, they can be just runners that the tires sit on and
the whole area need not be covered in building material. I think that would
look tacky, but it might be easier to control the pea stone by digging two
parallel trenches, lining them with a layer of sand and then filling the
trench with the stone.

Thanks in advance for your input,

--
Bobby G.

What I have used is called (road base) This is crushed rock (small) and also
fine sand and dirt. By looking at it. Had large driveway put in with this 18
years ago when house was built. About 10 inches deep. Stuff packs and sets
up almost like concrete. Still in good condition. That is what the road
crews use here locally. Colorado. Check your local town idiots and see if
this OK. WW

On Wed, 24 Jul 2013 15:08:47 -0600, "WW"
wrote:

What town is this. I never want to move there. WW

The land of Marion Barry:

"I promise you a police car on every sidewalk." -- M. Barry, Mayor of
Washington, DC

"If you take out the killings, Washington actually has a very very low
crime rate." -- M. Barry, Mayor of Washington, DC

"chaniarts" wrote in message
news:kspatf$23d$2@dont-

stuff snipped

check maximum area coverage for driveways. in my town, there's a %age
maximum front yard coverage with hard surfaces (paving, concrete, etc)
to prevent someone from paving their entire front yard for parking.

More demons to bedevil me! Fortunately, this is just replacing what has
worn away over the years, so I would hope I am covered. Still, when the
code enforcers are on a roll, they can dream up citations no average
homeowner would ever dream of.

My wife thinks I may have already ****ed them off by filing a "notice of
appeal" but it was just meant to make sure they knew I had been made aware
of the "deficiency" and gave me time to correct it. That and I've been
spooked by a recent Supremes ruling that says if you don't specifically
invoke your rights, you can lose them like the right to remain silent.

That reminds me to print out a wallet card to hand to cops that says: "I am
invoking my right to remain silent, any questions you have for me can be
submitted to my attorney in writing for consideration" with his business
info on the reverse. If I survive the beating, I should be covered. (-:

Sadly, my landscaper of nearly 10 years, Al, one of the best workers I've
ever hired, died suddenly at age 56 of liver failure. So I've got a new guy
who's clearly nowhere near as experienced so I thought I would turn this
task over to him to see how well he does with specs in hand. Part of the
horrible process of getting old is learning to turn over tasks like this to
people you pay to do them. All the small contractors seem to need work and
I want to spend down my savings just in time to die broke. (-: So it's a
perfect match.

I just took a picture of the driveway, printed it out and marked up where
and what I want and asked him to work up a quote. So begins "War and
Peas-tone."

--
Bobby G.

"Russ N." wrote in message
...

"Robert Green" wrote in message
...
The local government insists that no cars or vehicles be parked on
unpaved
ground. I'm planning to put pea stone down and wonder what sort of
preparation is required.

When my neighbor did this, they just dumped a LOT of the stone on the
ground
and spread it out. As you can imagine, stones went everywhere and the
area
was impossible to walk through because you would sink into the stones.
The
stones got onto the lawn from snow shoveling and banged up the lawnmower
blades and occasionally sent missiles flying through the air. I'd like
to
avoid that, if possible, although it may just come with the territory.

Am I correct in assuming that pea stones are roundish, cream and white
roundish colored stones about 3/8" in diameter while pea gravel has more
ragged edges? Does anyone have pricing information for their area so I
can
compare the quotes I get from the several places I will be calling in
the
next few hours? I realize location makes a big cost difference but I am
just looking for gross data points.

How much would it/should it take to create a "pad" for a minivan?

The precise wording of the ordinance says that as long as the wheels are
on
stone, brick or gravel, they can be just runners that the tires sit on
and
the whole area need not be covered in building material. I think that
would
look tacky, but it might be easier to control the pea stone by digging
two
parallel trenches, lining them with a layer of sand and then filling the
trench with the stone.

Thanks in advance for your input,

--
Bobby G.

No gravel, it doesn't nest. Look into #57 limestone.

This is the part of the project where so much information arrives that it
stops dead in the water to explore all the avenues that have opened up.

Am I correct in assuming that "nest" means to interlock somehow to resist
unwanted spreading?

--
Bobby G.

"EXT" wrote in message
news:51f029cc$0$2233$c3e8da3

stuff snipped

Don't use rounded stones as they will never stop moving because they have
no
sharp edges to lock together.

Well, my landscaper is out looking for pea stone. Where were you 20 minutes
ago! (-:

(Don't worry, nothing's set in stone - groan). It sounds like flaky and
sticky materials are what I am really looking for. Thanks!

--
Bobby G.

Robert Green wrote:
"EXT" wrote in message
news:51f029cc$0$2233$c3e8da3

stuff snipped

Don't use rounded stones as they will never stop moving because they have
no
sharp edges to lock together.

Well, my landscaper is out looking for pea stone. Where were you 20 minutes
ago! (-:

Your landscaper 'has to look' for a supply of Pea stone?
One would think that he/she would know where to get any landscaping
material.


(Don't worry, nothing's set in stone - groan). It sounds like flaky and
sticky materials are what I am really looking for. Thanks!

--
Bobby G.






--
Bill
In Hamptonburgh, NY
In the original Orange County. Est. 1683
To email, remove the double zeros after @

crushed concrete, old concrete that is crushed works awesome, it compacts to near concrete like surface and stays where its put......

Just rake it out by hand in case there are any bits of wire in it.. what i had delivered was very clean

I did this a couple years ago so my GFs sons vehilcle would never block anyone in, we execvated by hand a few inches below grade