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#1
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What causes this crazy brown 'crazing' in a varnished steelmeasuring square?
What causes this crazy brown crazing on a varnished steel square?
http://www3.picturepush.com/photo/a/...mg/7485181.jpg What can be done to get rid of it (so that I can read the numbers on the rule)? I pulled out this measuring square out of my toolbox and was dismayed to realize that it was almost impossible to read the markings because of this haphazard crazy brown "crazing" all over the place. Can it be fixed? |
#2
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What causes this crazy brown 'crazing' in a varnished steelmeasuring square?
On Feb 3, 10:22*pm, Chuck Banshee wrote:
What causes this crazy brown crazing on a varnished steel square? snip Can it be fixed? Not likely. You are storing your tools in a high humidity area. Keep them dry. Discard the framing square and get a better one made from aluminum. Even cheap steel squares years ago were heavily copper plated, and yours is not in that category at all. Moisture and some raw ferrous material like steel wool could have made the corrosion marks you see. Joe |
#3
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What causes this crazy brown 'crazing' in a varnished steelmeasuring square?
On Feb 3, 11:22*pm, Chuck Banshee wrote:
What causes this crazy brown crazing on a varnished steel square? *http://www3.picturepush.com/photo/a/...mg/7485181.jpg What can be done to get rid of it (so that I can read the numbers on the rule)? I pulled out this measuring square out of my toolbox and was dismayed to realize that it was almost impossible to read the markings because of this haphazard crazy brown "crazing" all over the place. Can it be fixed? Remove the varnish. Ive never seen one that wasnt bare metal.. Did it come that way new? I used to have one that was blued, not surre if it came that way or if it was something my brother did. He learned how to blue guns and he was bluing everything for a while. Jimmie |
#4
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What causes this crazy brown 'crazing' in a varnished steel measuring square?
Chuck Banshee wrote:
What causes this crazy brown crazing on a varnished steel square? http://www3.picturepush.com/photo/a/...mg/7485181.jpg What can be done to get rid of it (so that I can read the numbers on the rule)? I pulled out this measuring square out of my toolbox and was dismayed to realize that it was almost impossible to read the markings because of this haphazard crazy brown "crazing" all over the place. Can it be fixed? Cracks through the finish, rusting underneath? |
#5
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What causes this crazy brown 'crazing' in a varnished steel measuringsquare?
On 02/03/2012 11:22 PM, Chuck Banshee wrote:
What causes this crazy brown crazing on a varnished steel square? http://www3.picturepush.com/photo/a/...mg/7485181.jpg What can be done to get rid of it (so that I can read the numbers on the rule)? I pulled out this measuring square out of my toolbox and was dismayed to realize that it was almost impossible to read the markings because of this haphazard crazy brown "crazing" all over the place. Can it be fixed? Strip the varnish, put it in an electrolytic derust tank (I know, it sounds like I'm asking you to do something ludicrous, but I'm running one right now, and trust me, once you have one set up you will find stuff to put it it, it's great) paint/varnish. Or buy a new one for $10 or so. The crazing I believe is corrosion caused by moisture/air actually getting underneath the finish at a tiny flaw and spreading from there. nate -- replace "roosters" with "cox" to reply. http://members.cox.net/njnagel |
#6
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What causes this crazy brown 'crazing' in a varnished steel measuring square?
Chuck Banshee wrote:
What causes this crazy brown crazing on a varnished steel square? http://www3.picturepush.com/photo/a/...mg/7485181.jpg What can be done to get rid of it (so that I can read the numbers on the rule)? I pulled out this measuring square out of my toolbox and was dismayed to realize that it was almost impossible to read the markings because of this haphazard crazy brown "crazing" all over the place. Can it be fixed? Technically, it is called "rust". You can get rid of it by removing the clear coat on the rule and then either sanding off the rust or removing it chemically. -- dadiOH ____________________________ dadiOH's dandies v3.06... ....a help file of info about MP3s, recording from LP/cassette and tips & tricks on this and that. Get it at http://mysite.verizon.net/xico |
#7
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What causes this crazy brown 'crazing' in a varnished steel measuring square?
On Sat, 4 Feb 2012 07:31:07 -0500, "dadiOH"
wrote: Chuck Banshee wrote: What causes this crazy brown crazing on a varnished steel square? http://www3.picturepush.com/photo/a/...mg/7485181.jpg What can be done to get rid of it (so that I can read the numbers on the rule)? I pulled out this measuring square out of my toolbox and was dismayed to realize that it was almost impossible to read the markings because of this haphazard crazy brown "crazing" all over the place. Can it be fixed? Technically, it is called "rust". You can get rid of it by removing the clear coat on the rule and then either sanding off the rust or removing it chemically. I had a bit of something called neutra rust a long time ago. It was watery like solution and I used some on a rusting pipe railing and it has not rusted in 15 years or more. I ran out of the stuff and now cannot find where to by more. Anyone have a place to buy it or a replacement for such? |
#8
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What causes this crazy brown 'crazing' in a varnished steelmeasuring square?
On Fri, 03 Feb 2012 21:53:03 -0800, Bob F wrote:
Cracks through the finish, rusting underneath? I never thought it was rust. Sure, it's 'brown' ... and the square is steel so it 'can' rust. But I've never seen rust like that! Rust usually covers a wide area, and it's rough. This is smooth as silk. Still ... maybe it 'is' rust as it must be something! |
#9
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What causes this crazy brown 'crazing' in a varnished steelmeasuring square?
On Sat, 04 Feb 2012 07:22:38 -0500, Nate Nagel wrote:
The crazing I believe is corrosion caused by moisture/air actually getting underneath the finish at a tiny flaw and spreading from there. Hi Nate, I had never thought it was rust, but you're the second person to say that. Since it doesn't look or feel like any rust I've ever seen, it didn't even cross my mind that it's rust. Here's a closeup of the crazing. It's almost as if a tiny burrowing animal tunneled under the varnish looking for food to eat! http://www3.picturepush.com/photo/a/...40/7487896.jpg |
#10
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What causes this crazy brown 'crazing' in a varnished steelmeasuring square?
On Sat, 04 Feb 2012 07:31:07 -0500, dadiOH wrote:
Technically, it is called "rust". OK. You're the third person to say it's rust under the varnish. I have to say, I've seen rust. This doesn't look like rust. But all three of the responses say it's rust - so - rust it must be. http://www4.picturepush.com/photo/a/...mg/7487972.jpg I'll look at the cost of varnish remover versus just buying a new square! |
#11
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What causes this crazy brown 'crazing' in a varnished steel measuring square?
On Sat, 4 Feb 2012 14:20:41 +0000 (UTC), Chuck Banshee
wrote: On Fri, 03 Feb 2012 21:53:03 -0800, Bob F wrote: Cracks through the finish, rusting underneath? I never thought it was rust. Sure, it's 'brown' ... and the square is steel so it 'can' rust. But I've never seen rust like that! Rust usually covers a wide area, and it's rough. This is smooth as silk. Still ... maybe it 'is' rust as it must be something! It may be rust in the pinholes of a clear-coat? |
#12
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What causes this crazy brown 'crazing' in a varnished steel measuring square?
Chuck Banshee wrote:
On Sat, 04 Feb 2012 07:31:07 -0500, dadiOH wrote: Technically, it is called "rust". OK. You're the third person to say it's rust under the varnish. I have to say, I've seen rust. This doesn't look like rust. But all three of the responses say it's rust - so - rust it must be. http://www4.picturepush.com/photo/a/...mg/7487972.jpg I'll look at the cost of varnish remover versus just buying a new square! It wouldn't be varnish, it would be lacquer. A bit of lacquer thinner will remove it. -- dadiOH ____________________________ dadiOH's dandies v3.06... ....a help file of info about MP3s, recording from LP/cassette and tips & tricks on this and that. Get it at http://mysite.verizon.net/xico |
#13
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What causes this crazy brown 'crazing' in a varnished steelmeasuring square?
On Sat, 04 Feb 2012 11:40:26 -0500, dadiOH wrote:
It wouldn't be varnish, it would be lacquer. A bit of lacquer thinner will remove it. Ooops. I don't know the difference between varnish & lacquer. Looking it up by a variety of sources, Wikipedia included, the difference is interesting ... but after looking that up, I'm still not sure how you know it's lacquer. Here's how Wikipedia lists differences: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Varnish http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lacquer Here's a synopsis from multiple web sites: Varnish: oil + resin + solvent always clear usually brushed on slow drying relatively high percentage of solids usually less durable Lacquer: nitrocellulose + solvent can be tinted usually sprayed on fast drying relatively low percentage of solids usually more durable |
#14
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What causes this crazy brown 'crazing' in a varnished steel measuring square?
On Sat, 4 Feb 2012 14:26:19 +0000 (UTC), Chuck Banshee
wrote: On Sat, 04 Feb 2012 07:31:07 -0500, dadiOH wrote: Technically, it is called "rust". OK. You're the third person to say it's rust under the varnish. I have to say, I've seen rust. This doesn't look like rust. But all three of the responses say it's rust - so - rust it must be. http://www4.picturepush.com/photo/a/...mg/7487972.jpg I'll look at the cost of varnish remover versus just buying a new square! I'm wondering if lemon / lime would clean this off. Cut a lime in half, add some salt and rub the metal? |
#15
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What causes this crazy brown 'crazing' in a varnished steel measuring square?
Chuck Banshee wrote:
On Sat, 04 Feb 2012 11:40:26 -0500, dadiOH wrote: It wouldn't be varnish, it would be lacquer. A bit of lacquer thinner will remove it. Ooops. I don't know the difference between varnish & lacquer. Looking it up by a variety of sources, Wikipedia included, the difference is interesting ... but after looking that up, I'm still not sure how you know it's lacquer. Because no manufacturer would use varnish because it dries so slowly. Ditto commercial furniture - lacquer finish. -- dadiOH ____________________________ dadiOH's dandies v3.06... ....a help file of info about MP3s, recording from LP/cassette and tips & tricks on this and that. Get it at http://mysite.verizon.net/xico |
#16
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What causes this crazy brown 'crazing' in a varnished steel measuring square?
Chuck Banshee wrote:
On Sat, 04 Feb 2012 11:40:26 -0500, dadiOH wrote: It wouldn't be varnish, it would be lacquer. A bit of lacquer thinner will remove it. Ooops. I don't know the difference between varnish & lacquer. Looking it up by a variety of sources, Wikipedia included, the difference is interesting ... but after looking that up, I'm still not sure how you know it's lacquer. Here's how Wikipedia lists differences: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Varnish http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lacquer Here's a synopsis from multiple web sites: Varnish: oil + resin + solvent always clear usually brushed on slow drying relatively high percentage of solids usually less durable Lacquer: nitrocellulose + solvent can be tinted usually sprayed on fast drying relatively low percentage of solids usually more durable I don't see it more durable. I also see lacquer as being able to absorb moisture. Ever seen clouding on a piece of furniture top. I had clouding and actual gouging on a car paint finish using one of those bras. Permanent damage. The finish was lacquer. I have one of those squares that get all rust. I have to try dissolving the rust ever so often. Dam hard to read in any condition. Greg |
#17
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What causes this crazy brown 'crazing' in a varnished steel measuring square?
On Sat, 4 Feb 2012 17:08:20 +0000 (UTC), Chuck Banshee wrote:
Ooops. I don't know the difference between varnish & lacquer. Lacquer dries solely by the evaporation of its solvent. No chemical change takes place. When dry, it can be removed with its original solvent When varnish dries and cures, it combines with oxygen from the air and a chemical change takes place. Because of this chemical change, its original solvent will not remove it. When you hear that piles of oil soaked rags will spontaneously combust, they are not talking about motor oil. They are talking about oils used in varnishes and oil based paints (linseed oil, etc.) that combine with oxygen (oxidize) producing an exothermic chemical reaction as they cure. |
#18
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What causes this crazy brown 'crazing' in a varnished steel measuring square?
On Sat, 4 Feb 2012 15:37:32 -0500, "dadiOH" wrote:
Chuck Banshee wrote: On Sat, 04 Feb 2012 11:40:26 -0500, dadiOH wrote: It wouldn't be varnish, it would be lacquer. A bit of lacquer thinner will remove it. Ooops. I don't know the difference between varnish & lacquer. Looking it up by a variety of sources, Wikipedia included, the difference is interesting ... but after looking that up, I'm still not sure how you know it's lacquer. Because no manufacturer would use varnish because it dries so slowly. Ditto commercial furniture - lacquer finish. Why wouldn't they use a UV-cured epoxy, or some such? Much faster than any of the above. |
#19
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What causes this crazy brown 'crazing' in a varnished steel measuringsquare?
On 02/04/2012 09:13 AM, joevan wrote:
On Sat, 4 Feb 2012 07:31:07 -0500, wrote: Chuck Banshee wrote: What causes this crazy brown crazing on a varnished steel square? http://www3.picturepush.com/photo/a/...mg/7485181.jpg What can be done to get rid of it (so that I can read the numbers on the rule)? I pulled out this measuring square out of my toolbox and was dismayed to realize that it was almost impossible to read the markings because of this haphazard crazy brown "crazing" all over the place. Can it be fixed? Technically, it is called "rust". You can get rid of it by removing the clear coat on the rule and then either sanding off the rust or removing it chemically. I had a bit of something called neutra rust a long time ago. It was watery like solution and I used some on a rusting pipe railing and it has not rusted in 15 years or more. I ran out of the stuff and now cannot find where to by more. Anyone have a place to buy it or a replacement for such? probably a phosphoric acid based solution, I'd guess. nate -- replace "roosters" with "cox" to reply. http://members.cox.net/njnagel |
#21
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What causes this crazy brown 'crazing' in a varnished steel measuring square?
On Sun, 5 Feb 2012 10:32:04 -0500, "dadiOH" wrote:
wrote: On Sat, 4 Feb 2012 15:37:32 -0500, "dadiOH" wrote: Chuck Banshee wrote: On Sat, 04 Feb 2012 11:40:26 -0500, dadiOH wrote: It wouldn't be varnish, it would be lacquer. A bit of lacquer thinner will remove it. Ooops. I don't know the difference between varnish & lacquer. Looking it up by a variety of sources, Wikipedia included, the difference is interesting ... but after looking that up, I'm still not sure how you know it's lacquer. Because no manufacturer would use varnish because it dries so slowly. Ditto commercial furniture - lacquer finish. Why wouldn't they use a UV-cured epoxy, or some such? Much faster than any of the above. Maybe they do, no idea. It would depend on cost I would guess. It's used on flooring (many coats, even), why not on even a cheap square? |
#22
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What causes this crazy brown 'crazing' in a varnished steel measuring square?
zzzzzzzzzz wrote:
On Sun, 5 Feb 2012 10:32:04 -0500, "dadiOH" wrote: zzzzzzzzzz wrote: On Sat, 4 Feb 2012 15:37:32 -0500, "dadiOH" wrote: Chuck Banshee wrote: On Sat, 04 Feb 2012 11:40:26 -0500, dadiOH wrote: It wouldn't be varnish, it would be lacquer. A bit of lacquer thinner will remove it. Ooops. I don't know the difference between varnish & lacquer. Looking it up by a variety of sources, Wikipedia included, the difference is interesting ... but after looking that up, I'm still not sure how you know it's lacquer. Because no manufacturer would use varnish because it dries so slowly. Ditto commercial furniture - lacquer finish. Why wouldn't they use a UV-cured epoxy, or some such? Much faster than any of the above. Maybe they do, no idea. It would depend on cost I would guess. It's used on flooring (many coats, even), why not on even a cheap square? Because flooring sells formore? -- dadiOH ____________________________ dadiOH's dandies v3.06... ....a help file of info about MP3s, recording from LP/cassette and tips & tricks on this and that. Get it at http://mysite.verizon.net/xico |
#23
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What causes this crazy brown 'crazing' in a varnished steel measuring square?
On Sun, 5 Feb 2012 13:40:45 -0500, "dadiOH" wrote:
wrote: On Sun, 5 Feb 2012 10:32:04 -0500, "dadiOH" wrote: zzzzzzzzzz wrote: On Sat, 4 Feb 2012 15:37:32 -0500, "dadiOH" wrote: Chuck Banshee wrote: On Sat, 04 Feb 2012 11:40:26 -0500, dadiOH wrote: It wouldn't be varnish, it would be lacquer. A bit of lacquer thinner will remove it. Ooops. I don't know the difference between varnish & lacquer. Looking it up by a variety of sources, Wikipedia included, the difference is interesting ... but after looking that up, I'm still not sure how you know it's lacquer. Because no manufacturer would use varnish because it dries so slowly. Ditto commercial furniture - lacquer finish. Why wouldn't they use a UV-cured epoxy, or some such? Much faster than any of the above. Maybe they do, no idea. It would depend on cost I would guess. It's used on flooring (many coats, even), why not on even a cheap square? Because flooring sells formore? $1/ft^2 flooring uses UV treated coatings. Several coats. Even a cheap square is what, $10? |
#24
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What causes this crazy brown 'crazing' in a varnished steel measuring square?
" wrote:
On Sat, 4 Feb 2012 15:37:32 -0500, "dadiOH" wrote: Chuck Banshee wrote: On Sat, 04 Feb 2012 11:40:26 -0500, dadiOH wrote: It wouldn't be varnish, it would be lacquer. A bit of lacquer thinner will remove it. Ooops. I don't know the difference between varnish & lacquer. Looking it up by a variety of sources, Wikipedia included, the difference is interesting ... but after looking that up, I'm still not sure how you know it's lacquer. Because no manufacturer would use varnish because it dries so slowly. Ditto commercial furniture - lacquer finish. Why wouldn't they use a UV-cured epoxy, or some such? Much faster than any of the above. Lacquer seems to be a thinner coating. They could easily use acrylic enamel with the hardener, used on practically all cars. It sets up fast. Greg |
#25
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What causes this crazy brown 'crazing' in a varnished steel measuring square?
joevan wrote in
: I had a bit of something called neutra rust a long time ago. It was watery like solution and I used some on a rusting pipe railing and it has not rusted in 15 years or more. I ran out of the stuff and now cannot find where to by more. Anyone have a place to buy it or a replacement for such? if you mean the rust-converting solution,then an auto store,like PepBoys or Auto Zone. There also are paints that have the rust-converting ingredients. if you want rust removing stuff,try a woodworker's store,stuff Like Boeshield T-9. -- Jim Yanik jyanik at localnet dot com |
#26
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What causes this crazy brown 'crazing' in a varnished steel measuring square?
On Sun, 05 Feb 2012 17:47:38 -0600, Jim Yanik
wrote: joevan wrote in : I had a bit of something called neutra rust a long time ago. It was watery like solution and I used some on a rusting pipe railing and it has not rusted in 15 years or more. I ran out of the stuff and now cannot find where to by more. Anyone have a place to buy it or a replacement for such? if you mean the rust-converting solution,then an auto store,like PepBoys or Auto Zone. There also are paints that have the rust-converting ingredients. if you want rust removing stuff,try a woodworker's store,stuff Like Boeshield T-9. Thanks, Sounds just like what I was looking for. |
#27
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What causes this crazy brown 'crazing' in a varnished steelmeasuring square?
Update: You guys were right all along!
The crazing didn't look like rust at the crazed parts - but - at the end, where the varnish/lacquer peeled up - it certainly did look like rust underneath. Here's a closeup: http://www1.picturepush.com/photo/a/...mg/7508284.jpg I think I'll just replace it. |
#28
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What causes this crazy brown 'crazing' in a varnished steel measuring square?
Chuck Banshee wrote:
Update: You guys were right all along! The crazing didn't look like rust at the crazed parts - but - at the end, where the varnish/lacquer peeled up - it certainly did look like rust underneath. Here's a closeup: http://www1.picturepush.com/photo/a/...mg/7508284.jpg I think I'll just replace it. Stainless steel would be good. -- dadiOH ____________________________ dadiOH's dandies v3.06... ....a help file of info about MP3s, recording from LP/cassette and tips & tricks on this and that. Get it at http://mysite.verizon.net/xico |
#29
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What causes this crazy brown 'crazing' in a varnished steel measuring square?
On Mon, 6 Feb 2012 15:13:25 -0500, "dadiOH"
wrote: Here's a closeup: http://www1.picturepush.com/photo/a/...mg/7508284.jpg I think I'll just replace it. Stainless steel would be good. Ah, I didn't realize they came in SS. (test it with a magnet).. |
#30
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What causes this crazy brown 'crazing' in a varnished steel measuring square?
Chuck Banshee wrote in
: Update: You guys were right all along! The crazing didn't look like rust at the crazed parts - but - at the end, where the varnish/lacquer peeled up - it certainly did look like rust underneath. Here's a closeup: http://www1.picturepush.com/photo/a/...mg/7508284.jpg I think I'll just replace it. Wasteful....a little elbow grease,and you're restored a good tool. I had to use steel wool to clean my square's steel rule,and then I sprayed it with Krylon crystal clear. wipe the rule with paint first to fill in the markings for an easier read. -- Jim Yanik jyanik at localnet dot com |
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