I want to inspect the crawlspace once in a while but don't really enjoy
crawling in it.

Can you use the trakr (RC video camera tank) to inspect the crawlspace or is
there something more appropriate? The camera would need to see in the dark
or have built-in light.

Things I want to checks are : water on the vapor barrier, rodents, detached
insulation, etc.

On Nov 3, 2:16*am, "james" wrote:
I want to inspect the crawlspace once in a while but don't really enjoy
crawling in it.

Can you use the trakr (RC video camera tank) to inspect the crawlspace or is
there something more appropriate? The camera would need to see in the dark
or have built-in light.

Things I want to checks are : water on the vapor barrier, rodents, detached
insulation, etc.

If it is fairly smooth it could work, that looks very easy to high
center. Were that to happen, you would have to crawl to retrieve it.
Built in light? you could attach a small led flashlight to it.
Here is another thought: http://ardrone.parrot.com/parrot-ar-drone/usa/

IIRC, there was a show on the history channel showing such a strategy
to explore one of the air shafts in one of the pyramids. Worst case,
you would have to crawl in and retrieve it.

"deadgoose" wrote in message
...
IIRC, there was a show on the history channel showing such a strategy
to explore one of the air shafts in one of the pyramids. Worst case,
you would have to crawl in and retrieve it.

Tie a string to it so if it flips, you can haul it out. After watching a TV
show where they were hauling dead and maggot-ridden possums and skunks out
from under the crawl space, I am now thoroughly convinced NEVER to buy a
house without a basement. Repairing *anything* serious in a crawl space
turns a fairly routine job into a near-lunar expedition, complete with
bio-hazards from the parasites and other creatures that inhabit living and
dead possums, skunks, raccoons, etc. You have my sympathy. Gives me a good
idea, though. Start a plumbing and electrical company staffed by midgets
specializing in crawlspace work. (-:

I've never been able to figure out why some areas of the countries don't
have basements. It was probably a good building strategy when there was no
plumbing, CATV or electric in houses, but now? Uh uh.

--
Bobby G.

Robert Green wrote:
....

I've never been able to figure out why some areas of the countries don't
have basements. ...

Clearly you've never had a leaking one or failed walls from clay soil
heave, etc., etc., etc., ...

--

On 11/3/2010 10:47 AM, dpb wrote:
Robert Green wrote:
...

I've never been able to figure out why some areas of the countries don't
have basements. ...

Clearly you've never had a leaking one or failed walls from clay soil
heave, etc., etc., etc., ...

--
A properly built and drained basement makes those occurrences extremely
rare. I know the soil conditions and water tables in some areas make
basements problematical, but unless I absolutely had to live someplace
they were totally impractical, I would find a basement, or go with a
well built slab house. I hate crawls with a passion. Or if cost was no
object, I'd find a lot that was big enough to make a hill that was above
the water table.
(That last tactic is pretty common with McMansions in bayou country.
Looks nicer than the houses on stilts.)

--
aem sends...

On Wed, 03 Nov 2010 09:47:21 -0500, dpb wrote:

Robert Green wrote:
...

I've never been able to figure out why some areas of the countries don't
have basements. ...

Clearly you've never had a leaking one or failed walls from clay soil
heave, etc., etc., etc., ...
There ARE other options
Basement, or on slab, I'd never buy a house with a crawl-space. (or a
flat roof)

"dpb" wrote in message
...
Robert Green wrote:
...

I've never been able to figure out why some areas of the countries don't
have basements. ...

Clearly you've never had a leaking one or failed walls from clay soil
heave, etc., etc., etc., ...

Clearly. Well, I've had leaking ones, but I'd rather deal with that than
crawl under the house on a hot day to fix a cracked pipe lying next to a
dead skunk, a cadre of spiders and loads of other things that seem to call
crawlspaces "home sweet home."

Is soil instability the only reason to omit basements (aside from cost)?

--
Bobby G.

On Nov 3, 10:35*am, "Robert Green" wrote:
"deadgoose" wrote in message

...

IIRC, there was a show on the history channel showing such a strategy
to explore one of the air shafts in one of the pyramids. Worst case,
you would have to crawl in and retrieve it.

Tie a string to it so if it flips, you can haul it out. *After watching a TV
show where they were hauling dead and maggot-ridden possums and skunks out
from under the crawl space, I am now thoroughly convinced NEVER to buy a
house without a basement. *Repairing *anything* serious in a crawl space
turns a fairly routine job into a near-lunar expedition, complete with
bio-hazards from the parasites and other creatures that inhabit living and
dead possums, skunks, raccoons, etc. *You have my sympathy. *Gives me a good
idea, though. *Start a plumbing and electrical company staffed by midgets
specializing in crawlspace work. *(-:

I've never been able to figure out why some areas of the countries don't
have basements. *It was probably a good building strategy when there was no
plumbing, CATV or electric in houses, but now? *Uh uh.

--
Bobby G.

High water table, would be my guess.

nate

On 11/3/2010 9:35 AM, Robert Green wrote:
wrote in message
...
IIRC, there was a show on the history channel showing such a strategy
to explore one of the air shafts in one of the pyramids. Worst case,
you would have to crawl in and retrieve it.

Tie a string to it so if it flips, you can haul it out. After watching a TV
show where they were hauling dead and maggot-ridden possums and skunks out
from under the crawl space, I am now thoroughly convinced NEVER to buy a
house without a basement. Repairing *anything* serious in a crawl space
turns a fairly routine job into a near-lunar expedition, complete with
bio-hazards from the parasites and other creatures that inhabit living and
dead possums, skunks, raccoons, etc. You have my sympathy. Gives me a good
idea, though. Start a plumbing and electrical company staffed by midgets
specializing in crawlspace work. (-:

I've never been able to figure out why some areas of the countries don't
have basements. It was probably a good building strategy when there was no
plumbing, CATV or electric in houses, but now? Uh uh.

--
Bobby G.



It's easy enough to keep the serious critters out of a crawl space. The
bugs and small things won't hurt you.

as for your question about no basements, well in someparts of the
country it is solid rock. Can't dig. Hard enough to put in a frost
footing. In other areas, no tornadoes, so no basement needed. Build on
a slab. It's cheap. Ever watch extreme home makeover on sunday
nights?? Those fancified mcmansions are ALL built on slabs. It's the
only way they can do it in a week. Crawl spaces are not the end of the
world, but i sure do wish the folks in the old days would have made the
house just 8 or 10 inches taller off the ground. LOL! I'm not as skinny
as i used to be. And the house i live in has the joists 8" off the
dirt. and NO access to the space anyway.

--
Steve Barker
remove the "not" from my address to email

"Steve Barker" wrote in message
...
On 11/3/2010 9:35 AM, Robert Green wrote:
wrote in message

...
IIRC, there was a show on the history channel showing such a strategy
to explore one of the air shafts in one of the pyramids. Worst case,
you would have to crawl in and retrieve it.

Tie a string to it so if it flips, you can haul it out. After watching
a TV
show where they were hauling dead and maggot-ridden possums and skunks
out
from under the crawl space, I am now thoroughly convinced NEVER to buy a
house without a basement. Repairing *anything* serious in a crawl space
turns a fairly routine job into a near-lunar expedition, complete with
bio-hazards from the parasites and other creatures that inhabit living
and
dead possums, skunks, raccoons, etc. You have my sympathy. Gives me a
good
idea, though. Start a plumbing and electrical company staffed by
midgets
specializing in crawlspace work. (-:

I've never been able to figure out why some areas of the countries don't
have basements. It was probably a good building strategy when there was
no
plumbing, CATV or electric in houses, but now? Uh uh.

--
Bobby G.


It's easy enough to keep the serious critters out of a crawl space. The
bugs and small things won't hurt you.

Tell that to my Marine buddy and his son who went coon hunting near Quantico
and ending up covered in ticks. Close to 300. Little things can hurt you
just as badly as some of the big ones. (-: Squirrels laughed at my first
attempts to screen them out of the attic. Now the vents are covered with
1/4" thick metal gridwork of the kind seen on metal stair risers on old
front stoops. Apparently if the squirrels were raised in the attic, they
want back in very badly and will chew wherever they can catch a whiff of
their old haunts.

as for your question about no basements, well in someparts of the
country it is solid rock. Can't dig. Hard enough to put in a frost
footing.

That makes sense. It also makes sense, as other have suggested, to have
basement in an area with a high water table or in areas prone to flash
floods. It's sound like areas without basements have some serious "other"
issues to consider. When I see interviews with people in flood areas on the
news saying it's their fourth or fifth total innundation, I ask myself
"What does it take to get people to move to higher ground?"

In other areas, no tornadoes, so no basement needed. Build on
a slab.

Are basements really built outside tornado alley just to provide refuge? I
wonder if it's a throwback to the days of root cellars and once the trend
of basements got going it didn't stop - until it met areas where it was not
a good idea.

It's cheap. Ever watch extreme home makeover on sunday
nights?? Those fancified mcmansions are ALL built on slabs.

Watching them would just encourage them. (-:

It's the
only way they can do it in a week. Crawl spaces are not the end of the
world,

No, they're just the *gateway* to the end of the world . . . (-"

but i sure do wish the folks in the old days would have made the
house just 8 or 10 inches taller off the ground. LOL! I'm not as skinny
as i used to be.

When you get to be as skinny as you were when you're older than say 50, it's
usually not a very good thing. Be thankful for that fat. Well, some of it,
anyway.

And the house i live in has the joists 8" off the
dirt. and NO access to the space anyway.

Mike Rowe was working in a damn tight space - so tight he was getting his
butt snagged when backing up. It couldn't have been much taller than 12 or
14" inches worth of space. And all they were doing was inspecting and
removing dead raccoon and skunk carcasses. Working under there just has to
be grim. What I would worry about is how long it could take to get out of
there if you had an accident, got some chemicals in your eye or whatever?
Tank crews have a loop on their backs for quick extraction and they're not
cramped at all compared to some crawl spaces. Of course, your average house
won't blow a 100' crater if the stored ammo lights up accidentally.

--
Bobby G.

On Wed, 03 Nov 2010 10:08:25 -0500, Steve Barker
wrote:

On 11/3/2010 9:35 AM, Robert Green wrote:
wrote in message
...
IIRC, there was a show on the history channel showing such a strategy
to explore one of the air shafts in one of the pyramids. Worst case,
you would have to crawl in and retrieve it.

Tie a string to it so if it flips, you can haul it out. After watching a TV
show where they were hauling dead and maggot-ridden possums and skunks out
from under the crawl space, I am now thoroughly convinced NEVER to buy a
house without a basement. Repairing *anything* serious in a crawl space
turns a fairly routine job into a near-lunar expedition, complete with
bio-hazards from the parasites and other creatures that inhabit living and
dead possums, skunks, raccoons, etc. You have my sympathy. Gives me a good
idea, though. Start a plumbing and electrical company staffed by midgets
specializing in crawlspace work. (-:

I've never been able to figure out why some areas of the countries don't
have basements. It was probably a good building strategy when there was no
plumbing, CATV or electric in houses, but now? Uh uh.

--
Bobby G.



It's easy enough to keep the serious critters out of a crawl space. The
bugs and small things won't hurt you.

as for your question about no basements, well in someparts of the
country it is solid rock. Can't dig. Hard enough to put in a frost
footing.

In those cases it's not necessary. The ledge *is* the frost footing. Anchor
to it.

In other areas, no tornadoes, so no basement needed.

Nonsense. As others have pointed out, you still need to get the foundation
down below frost, so a basement is essentially free; just dig out a little
more dirt (and often use it for fill on the same lot).

Build on
a slab. It's cheap. Ever watch extreme home makeover on sunday
nights?? Those fancified mcmansions are ALL built on slabs.

Ever notice how many of those are in the Southeast? No need for an 8' frost
footing in GA. HGTV comes out of Atlanta, IIRC.

It's the
only way they can do it in a week. Crawl spaces are not the end of the
world, but i sure do wish the folks in the old days would have made the
house just 8 or 10 inches taller off the ground. LOL! I'm not as skinny
as i used to be. And the house i live in has the joists 8" off the
dirt. and NO access to the space anyway.

My current house (100mi from Atlanta) is on slab. About half around here have
crawl spaces and basements are rare. The only house with a basement that we
looked at when we bought this house was built into a cliff. It looked like it
was going to slide down into the abyss any minute. A 20' high retaining wall
was all that was holding it onto the hillside. OTOH, the real reason we
didn't buy it was that SWMBO didn't like the kitchen. ;-) It had a 2300ft^2
unfinished basement that I would have *loved*.

On Nov 3, 9:35*am, "Robert Green" wrote:
"deadgoose" wrote in message

...

IIRC, there was a show on the history channel showing such a strategy
to explore one of the air shafts in one of the pyramids. Worst case,
you would have to crawl in and retrieve it.

Tie a string to it so if it flips, you can haul it out. *After watching a TV
show where they were hauling dead and maggot-ridden possums and skunks out
from under the crawl space, I am now thoroughly convinced NEVER to buy a
house without a basement. *Repairing *anything* serious in a crawl space
turns a fairly routine job into a near-lunar expedition, complete with
bio-hazards from the parasites and other creatures that inhabit living and
dead possums, skunks, raccoons, etc. *You have my sympathy. *Gives me a good
idea, though. *Start a plumbing and electrical company staffed by midgets
specializing in crawlspace work. *(-:

I've never been able to figure out why some areas of the countries don't
have basements. *It was probably a good building strategy when there was no
plumbing, CATV or electric in houses, but now? *Uh uh.

--
Bobby G.

2 words: flash floods

"Eric in North TX" wrote in message
...
On Nov 3, 9:35 am, "Robert Green" wrote:
"deadgoose" wrote in message

...

IIRC, there was a show on the history channel showing such a strategy
to explore one of the air shafts in one of the pyramids. Worst case,
you would have to crawl in and retrieve it.

Tie a string to it so if it flips, you can haul it out. After watching a
TV
show where they were hauling dead and maggot-ridden possums and skunks out
from under the crawl space, I am now thoroughly convinced NEVER to buy a
house without a basement. Repairing *anything* serious in a crawl space
turns a fairly routine job into a near-lunar expedition, complete with
bio-hazards from the parasites and other creatures that inhabit living and
dead possums, skunks, raccoons, etc. You have my sympathy. Gives me a good
idea, though. Start a plumbing and electrical company staffed by midgets
specializing in crawlspace work. (-:

I've never been able to figure out why some areas of the countries don't
have basements. It was probably a good building strategy when there was no
plumbing, CATV or electric in houses, but now? Uh uh.

--
Bobby G.

2 words: flash floods

That sounds like a good reason. I've never seen rain like I saw in
Orlanda, FL when I visited one spring. Had to pull off the road it was
raining so hard and even that was just guesswork. I figure the windshield
wipers couldn't have kept up even if the wiping speed was increased 100X.
It was like walking under a waterfall.

--
Bobby G.

On Nov 3, 10:35*am, "Robert Green" wrote:

I've never been able to figure out why some areas of the countries don't
have basements.

Here in Florida, those are called swimming pools.

"Larry Fishel" wrote in message
...
On Nov 3, 10:35 am, "Robert Green" wrote:

I've never been able to figure out why some areas of the countries don't
have basements.

Here in Florida, those are called swimming pools.

I'm beginning to get the picture.

--
Bobby G.

Water table too high. Cellars fill with water.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"Robert Green"
wrote in message ...

I've never been able to figure out why some areas of the countries
don't
have basements. It was probably a good building strategy when there
was no
plumbing, CATV or electric in houses, but now? Uh uh.

--
Bobby G.

On Wed, 3 Nov 2010 10:35:49 -0400, "Robert Green"
wrote:
I am now thoroughly convinced NEVER to buy a
house without a basement.

You're not moving to Florida, then. (Might be a good thing for those
of us already here as well as for you. My mom used to have a bumper
sticker "leaving Florida? take a friend".) Basements are rare in
Florida, and pretty much non-existent in residential building.

I've never been able to figure out why some areas of the countries don't
have basements.

High expense when it's not needed to get below the frost line. In
north Florida, the frost line is about 1/4" below the surface. In
south Florida, it's at the top of the grass. Plus the water table is
almost never 8' down, so a basement has to have a floor and the walls
and floor have to be not only watertight but keep out 2 to 4 psi.
Basically you have a houseboat.

If you don't like repairing something in a crawl space, try repairing
it when it's embedded in a slab.

But I agree, an 8" crawl space is beyond stupid. They don't have to be
like that. I can sit up in mine in the most cramped corner. At the
access door, I can sit up and have space between my head and the
joists. Eventually I plan to seal it with 6 mil poly and put down
boards to slide on -- cleaner and keep the humidity out.

So the problem is not a crawl space per se, but a crawl space that's
stupidly small.

Edward

"Edward Reid" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 3 Nov 2010 10:35:49 -0400, "Robert Green"
wrote:
I am now thoroughly convinced NEVER to buy a
house without a basement.

You're not moving to Florida, then. (Might be a good thing for those
of us already here as well as for you. My mom used to have a bumper
sticker "leaving Florida? take a friend".) Basements are rare in
Florida, and pretty much non-existent in residential building.

No worries, I'm not moving to the Hurricane Belt. Got socked in with Opal
in Montgomery, Alabama. Once is enough.

I've never been able to figure out why some areas of the countries don't
have basements.

High expense when it's not needed to get below the frost line. In
north Florida, the frost line is about 1/4" below the surface. In
south Florida, it's at the top of the grass. Plus the water table is
almost never 8' down, so a basement has to have a floor and the walls
and floor have to be not only watertight but keep out 2 to 4 psi.
Basically you have a houseboat.

That makes sense. Another mystery of life revealed.

If you don't like repairing something in a crawl space, try repairing
it when it's embedded in a slab.

On the one hand, the slab would keep critters from chewing on wires, but on
the other hand, when you need to do something, it's a hell of a mess.

But I agree, an 8" crawl space is beyond stupid. They don't have to be
like that. I can sit up in mine in the most cramped corner. At the
access door, I can sit up and have space between my head and the
joists. Eventually I plan to seal it with 6 mil poly and put down
boards to slide on -- cleaner and keep the humidity out.

That makes more sense, but it seems that you have to be vigilant about the
keeping the vents screened and with something a little sturdier than
aluminum screening.

So the problem is not a crawl space per se, but a crawl space that's
stupidly small.

I'll still take a basement every time. (-:

--
Bobby G.

"deadgoose" wrote in message
...

IIRC, there was a show on the history channel showing such a strategy
to explore one of the air shafts in one of the pyramids. Worst case,
you would have to crawl in and retrieve it.

That was interesting, they got to a door made of a huge slab of stone with
some copper fittings to keep it from being raised to open it, and that's as
far as they got. I wonder if they ever figured out what was on the other
side of the door? cue spooky music

"DGDevin" wrote in message
m...

"deadgoose" wrote in message
...

IIRC, there was a show on the history channel showing such a strategy
to explore one of the air shafts in one of the pyramids. Worst case,
you would have to crawl in and retrieve it.

That was interesting, they got to a door made of a huge slab of stone with
some copper fittings to keep it from being raised to open it, and that's
as
far as they got. I wonder if they ever figured out what was on the other
side of the door? cue spooky music

Geraldo Rivera.

--
Bobby G.

Eric in North TX wrote:
On Nov 3, 2:16 am, "james" wrote:
I want to inspect the crawlspace once in a while but don't really
enjoy crawling in it.

Can you use the trakr (RC video camera tank) to inspect the
crawlspace or is there something more appropriate? The camera would
need to see in the dark or have built-in light.

Things I want to checks are : water on the vapor barrier, rodents,
detached insulation, etc.

If it is fairly smooth it could work, that looks very easy to high
center. Were that to happen, you would have to crawl to retrieve it.
Built in light? you could attach a small led flashlight to it.
Here is another thought:
http://ardrone.parrot.com/parrot-ar-drone/usa/

So you can zap any rodents you see?

On Wed, 3 Nov 2010 04:14:40 -0700 (PDT), Eric in North TX
wrote:

On Nov 3, 2:16Â*am, "james" wrote:
I want to inspect the crawlspace once in a while but don't really enjoy
crawling in it.

Can you use the trakr (RC video camera tank) to inspect the crawlspace or is
there something more appropriate? The camera would need to see in the dark
or have built-in light.

Things I want to checks are : water on the vapor barrier, rodents, detached
insulation, etc.

If it is fairly smooth it could work, that looks very easy to high
center. Were that to happen, you would have to crawl to retrieve it.
Built in light? you could attach a small led flashlight to it.
Here is another thought: http://ardrone.parrot.com/parrot-ar-drone/usa/

Tie a string to it to retrieve it if it gets stuck. I use an RC truck
to pull cable over suspended ceilings quite often. If it gets hung up,
I yank on the fish-cord to get it unstuck, then let it go again.

On 11/3/2010 2:16 AM, james wrote:
I want to inspect the crawlspace once in a while but don't really enjoy
crawling in it.

Can you use the trakr (RC video camera tank) to inspect the crawlspace
or is there something more appropriate? The camera would need to see in
the dark or have built-in light.

Things I want to checks are : water on the vapor barrier, rodents,
detached insulation, etc.

you could tie a light line to it incase you have to drag it back or
something. I know in one house we have, there IS no going in the crawl
space. It's about 8" from the joists to the dirt.

--
Steve Barker
remove the "not" from my address to email

Steve Barker wrote in
:

On 11/3/2010 2:16 AM, james wrote:
I want to inspect the crawlspace once in a while but don't really enjoy
crawling in it.

Can you use the trakr (RC video camera tank) to inspect the crawlspace
or is there something more appropriate? The camera would need to see in
the dark or have built-in light.

Things I want to checks are : water on the vapor barrier, rodents,
detached insulation, etc.

you could tie a light line to it incase you have to drag it back or
something. I know in one house we have, there IS no going in the crawl
space. It's about 8" from the joists to the dirt.


Oh yes there is going there. 6 mos ago the last place I rehabbed was just
that. Fortunately dry. Took wireless house phone with me for sure. If I had
a Fred Sanford "Big One" under there it would have been a CSI desert
recovery and ID by the time I was found.

On Nov 3, 2:16*am, "james" wrote:
I want to inspect the crawlspace once in a while but don't really enjoy
crawling in it.

Can you use the trakr (RC video camera tank) to inspect the crawlspace or is
there something more appropriate? The camera would need to see in the dark
or have built-in light.

Things I want to checks are : water on the vapor barrier, rodents, detached
insulation, etc.

Video camera from Harbor Freight? Radio Shack? For light install a
proper lamp assembly fitted with a CFL.

Joe

On Nov 3, 3:16*am, "james" wrote:
I want to inspect the crawlspace once in a while but don't really enjoy
crawling in it.

Can you use the trakr (RC video camera tank) to inspect the crawlspace or is
there something more appropriate? The camera would need to see in the dark
or have built-in light.

Things I want to checks are : water on the vapor barrier, rodents, detached
insulation, etc.

Watch this excerpt from Modern Family, Season 1, Episode 16.

http://www.hulu.com/watch/132151/modern-family-truck

If you can find the entire episode someplace, the "RC spy car as
crawlspace inspection device?" question will be answered for you.