There is a push to cool the earth, save energy and keep your home cooler
at less cost to have white roofs. Especially in the cities to reduce
heat islands.
What about northern states where we heat more than air condition. Should
we go to white roofs or black roofs or middle colors?




--
LSMFT

I haven't spoken to my wife in 18 months.
I don't like to interrupt her.

On Jul 13, 9:51*pm, LSMFT wrote:
There is a push to cool the earth, save energy and keep your home cooler
at less cost to have white roofs. Especially in the cities to reduce
heat islands.
What about northern states where we heat more than air condition. Should
we go to white roofs or black roofs or middle colors?

--
LSMFT

I haven't spoken to my wife in 18 months.
I don't like to interrupt her.

Here in the north central, seldom see a white roof. Large southern
cities, though, evidently find white a benefit. Choosing colors for
two roof replacements last year we found no truly white conventional
shingles on the market. I'm guessing that the colored topping weathers
off the light colored ones in a few years leaving the darker substrate
behind anyway. So metal or other material would be the most practical
long lasting material. Something to consider when the price comes down
a bit. Hard to make a choice when so many factors are involved. Best
left to the architect, probably.

Joe

On Jul 13, 9:51*pm, LSMFT wrote:
There is a push to cool the earth, save energy and keep your home cooler
at less cost to have white roofs. Especially in the cities to reduce
heat islands.
What about northern states where we heat more than air condition. Should
we go to white roofs or black roofs or middle colors?

--



The only thing a white roof will cool is your house in the
winter. This "man made climate change" thing is just a huge money
grabbing scam.

On 7/13/2010 11:15 PM, serebel wrote:
On Jul 13, 9:51 pm, wrote:
There is a push to cool the earth, save energy and keep your home cooler
at less cost to have white roofs. Especially in the cities to reduce
heat islands.
What about northern states where we heat more than air condition. Should
we go to white roofs or black roofs or middle colors?

--



The only thing a white roof will cool is your house in the
winter. This "man made climate change" thing is just a huge money
grabbing scam.

You obviously are a Republican....not a doubt in my mind.

Don

"serebel" wrote in message
...
On Jul 13, 9:51 pm, LSMFT wrote:
There is a push to cool the earth, save energy and keep your home cooler
at less cost to have white roofs. Especially in the cities to reduce
heat islands.
What about northern states where we heat more than air condition. Should
we go to white roofs or black roofs or middle colors?

--



The only thing a white roof will cool is your house in the
winter. This "man made climate change" thing is just a huge money
grabbing scam.

reply: I agree with you. In the thousands of years roofs have been around,
seems like common knowledge would have evolved saying that this color is
better than that one. Instead, we get these new government revelations from
people who are educated beyond their capacities as to what they "think" is
the best.

I remember in the sixties, in Las Vegas, they did a slight pitch roof, put
gravel on it, then put rocks the size of softballs and white tar or paint.
Those gradually wore out and were replaced, and now are seen no more.

If a house is set up where a considerable heat load can be conducted to the
house from the roof, it is plain built wrong. There is a layer of air
there, and yes, attic ventilation fans will keep down the attic temperature,
but the sun load on the roof will be there no matter what, unless we all
wrap them in tinfoil, which may be an alternative, since we know tin foil
(excuse me, aluminum foil) hats are very valuable in fending off the evil
controlling rays of evil beings.

But then, I'm not sure. How about a couple of million for me to do a study?
Send the money in small unmarked bills, and I'll get back to you. Just like
they do it in Washington. The money will be in the freezer wrapped in tin
(aluminum) foil.

Steve, a libertarian

visit my blog at http://cabgbypasssurgery.com

On Jul 14, 3:51*am, LSMFT wrote:
There is a push to cool the earth, save energy and keep your home cooler
at less cost to have white roofs. Especially in the cities to reduce
heat islands.
What about northern states where we heat more than air condition. Should
we go to white roofs or black roofs or middle colors?

--
LSMFT

I haven't spoken to my wife in 18 months.
I don't like to interrupt her.

The purpose of a white roof is to reflect the radiant heat of
sunlight.
For keeping warmth in, the colour of the roof will make very little
difference as the heat loss is by conduction mainly, not radiation.
What you need is insulation.

On Tue, 13 Jul 2010 22:51:39 -0400, LSMFT wrote:

There is a push to cool the earth, save energy and keep your home cooler
at less cost to have white roofs. Especially in the cities to reduce
heat islands.
What about northern states where we heat more than air condition. Should
we go to white roofs or black roofs or middle colors?

In Indianapolis for many years, there were two big department stores
downtown. Blocks and Ayres. The Blocks lived just doown the street
from us, on the nice part of the street, the really nice part, but we
drove by their enormous house to get home. Later, the son built a big
house next door, with dark shingles. Four months later, the shingles
were replaced with white or almost white. This was probably 1961.

My townhouse had dark brown shingles and when my next door neighbor
and I needed a new roof, I talked him into light brown. White
wouldn't have looked good. He uses his AC a lot and I rarely use
mine, and I think maybe I helped him more than me, becaues with the
cooler attic he saves money on his AC and I don't use mine enough to
save more than a bit of money. For me, in the summer, I'm pretty
sure the house is not as hot as it was. (Maybe I need more insulation
on part of the attic floor but most has plenty.)

But in the mid fall and early spring, I turned off the roof fan so the
attic got as hot as possible and I used the heat of the attic to warm
the house. That doesn't seem to work anymore. It was only good for
2 to 4 degrees but it was also the difference between closing the
windows and turning on the heat, versus leaving them open and heating
a little bit the house from attic.

All these effects would be a little greater with white. I was
afraid, warned even, that white would look dirty eventually, although
I don't know why he claimed that. I meant to look at other white roofs
to see if any looked dirty, but I forgot that until just now, and I
never did it.

I think I'd still get light colored shingles rather than dark, no
matter what my habits aare.

On Wed, 14 Jul 2010 03:24:10 -0400, mm
wrote:



But in the mid fall and early spring, I turned off the roof fan so the

Oh yeah, I'm pretty sure that in the summer, the roof fan turns on a
little later and off a little earlier, maybe 30 to 45 minutes at each
end. I did pay attention, because I was curious, but I didn't keep
written records with the old roof, and maybe I'm wrong.

attic got as hot as possible and I used the heat of the attic to warm
the house. That doesn't seem to work anymore. It was only good for
2 to 4 degrees but it was also the difference between closing the
windows and turning on the heat, versus leaving them open and heating
a little bit the house from attic.

LSMFT wrote:
There is a push to cool the earth, save energy and keep your home
cooler at less cost to have white roofs. Especially in the cities to
reduce heat islands.
What about northern states where we heat more than air condition.
Should we go to white roofs or black roofs or middle colors?

Let's think about white roofs and summers:

Whatever the color of the roof, it's going to absorb SOME heat. Eventually
it will absorb as much as it can. The trick is to have a system that can
shed as much heat as is absorbed. A white roof will merely absorb heat at a
slower rate than, say, a black roof. That means that the rest of the system
(fans, soffit vents, etc.) need not be as robust as if the rest of the
ventilation system had to deal with the heat transfer of a black roof.

Meanwhile, a white roof will almost immediately look like hammered goose
droppings due to staining and dirt.

For a black roof - winter combination, the reverse heat transfer process is
in play. A black roof will shed heat from the house at a slower rate than a
white roof because the black roof is absorbing heat from the sun faster than
its white counterpart.

So, then, to answer your question: Roof color will make SOME difference in
energy costs but that differerence depends more on the quality of the rest
of the system (ventilation, insulation, etc.), than the color of the roof.
Specifically, with sufficient ventilation, an attic in summer won't get much
hotter than the outside air, irrespective of the roof color. With pitiful,
or no, ventilation, the attic temperature may be a hundred degrees higher
than the air outside!

"mm" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 13 Jul 2010 22:51:39 -0400, LSMFT
wrote:

There is a push to cool the earth, save energy and keep your
home cooler
at less cost to have white roofs. Especially in the cities to
reduce
heat islands.
What about northern states where we heat more than air
condition. Should
we go to white roofs or black roofs or middle colors?

In Indianapolis for many years, there were two big department
stores
downtown. Blocks and Ayres. The Blocks lived just doown the
street
from us, on the nice part of the street, the really nice part,
but we
drove by their enormous house to get home. Later, the son built
a big
house next door, with dark shingles. Four months later, the
shingles
were replaced with white or almost white. This was probably
1961.

My townhouse had dark brown shingles and when my next door
neighbor
and I needed a new roof, I talked him into light brown. White
wouldn't have looked good. He uses his AC a lot and I rarely
use
mine, and I think maybe I helped him more than me, becaues with
the
cooler attic he saves money on his AC and I don't use mine
enough to
save more than a bit of money. For me, in the summer, I'm
pretty
sure the house is not as hot as it was. (Maybe I need more
insulation
on part of the attic floor but most has plenty.)

But in the mid fall and early spring, I turned off the roof fan
so the
attic got as hot as possible and I used the heat of the attic to
warm
the house. That doesn't seem to work anymore. It was only
good for
2 to 4 degrees but it was also the difference between closing
the
windows and turning on the heat, versus leaving them open and
heating
a little bit the house from attic.

All these effects would be a little greater with white. I was
afraid, warned even, that white would look dirty eventually,
although
I don't know why he claimed that. I meant to look at other white
roofs
to see if any looked dirty, but I forgot that until just now,
and I
never did it.

I think I'd still get light colored shingles rather than dark,
no
matter what my habits aare.

Besides the color of a roof, here are a couple more thoughts. In
the desert SW, we have a lot of homes with barrel tile roofs.
Essentially, the house has a waterproof roofing material over the
roof sheathing, and this is then covered with the barrel tile
(made of concrete nowadays) to protect the membrane from UV. A
side effect of this is that the barrel tile, with its "S"-shaped
design creates shade for the roofing material below, together with
terrific convection air flow up under the tile. This reduces
attic temperatures.

In our own home, besides the barrel tile roof, we also have flat
solar panels to heat our pool. Again, they shade the barrel tile,
which in turn shades the roofing membrane. However, there's a
hidden value in that, say, the pool's water is 85f going into the
panels and 88f departing, you essentially have a cold blanket
(relative to the air temperature and sun load here in the desert,
usually) on your roof. There is air circulation under this "cold"
blanket, due to the upper surface of the barrel tile, as well as
below.

Nonny


--
On most days,
it's just not worth
the effort of chewing
through the restraints..

serebel wrote the following:
On Jul 13, 9:51 pm, LSMFT wrote:

There is a push to cool the earth, save energy and keep your home cooler
at less cost to have white roofs. Especially in the cities to reduce
heat islands.
What about northern states where we heat more than air condition. Should
we go to white roofs or black roofs or middle colors?

--




The only thing a white roof will cool is your house in the
winter. This "man made climate change" thing is just a huge money
grabbing scam.


True, the white roof won't cool anything, but it will reflect more heat
than a dark roof, thereby reducing the heat gain to the roof material
and the spaces below.

--

Bill
In Hamptonburgh, NY
In the original Orange County. Est. 1683
To email, remove the double zeroes after @

We need a federal panel to study the matter, with an eye toward
diversity. What would minorities and women think if they drove into a
part of town that had all white roofs. Think of the children, man!

--
..
"LSMFT" wrote in message
...
There is a push to cool the earth, save energy and keep your home
cooler
at less cost to have white roofs. Especially in the cities to reduce
heat islands.
What about northern states where we heat more than air condition.
Should
we go to white roofs or black roofs or middle colors?




--
LSMFT

I haven't spoken to my wife in 18 months.
I don't like to interrupt her.

The intelligence shows. Republicans, the party of traditional values.
Lower taxes, morality, waterboarding, and the Patriot Act.

Hmm. Did that help or hurt my case?

--
..
"IGot2P" wrote in message
...


The only thing a white roof will cool is your house in the
winter. This "man made climate change" thing is just a huge money
grabbing scam.

You obviously are a Republican....not a doubt in my mind.

Don

Just present your DNC card at the welfare office. They will take care
of you.

--
..
"Steve B" wrote in message
news
But then, I'm not sure. How about a couple of million for me to do a
study?
Send the money in small unmarked bills, and I'll get back to you.
Just like
they do it in Washington. The money will be in the freezer wrapped in
tin
(aluminum) foil.

Steve, a libertarian

visit my blog at http://cabgbypasssurgery.com

"Steve B" wrote in message
news

"serebel" wrote in message
...
On Jul 13, 9:51 pm, LSMFT wrote:
There is a push to cool the earth, save energy and keep your home cooler
at less cost to have white roofs. Especially in the cities to reduce
heat islands.
What about northern states where we heat more than air condition. Should
we go to white roofs or black roofs or middle colors?

--



The only thing a white roof will cool is your house in the
winter. snip

I guess the logic escapes you. g

Jim

"harry" wrote in message
...
On Jul 14, 3:51 am, LSMFT wrote:
There is a push to cool the earth, save energy and keep your home cooler
at less cost to have white roofs. Especially in the cities to reduce
heat islands.
What about northern states where we heat more than air condition. Should
we go to white roofs or black roofs or middle colors?

--
LSMFT

I haven't spoken to my wife in 18 months.
I don't like to interrupt her.

The purpose of a white roof is to reflect the radiant heat of
sunlight.
For keeping warmth in, the colour of the roof will make very little
difference as the heat loss is by conduction mainly, not radiation.
What you need is insulation.

====

That's how the roofer explained it to me. Nothing is going to make up for
the lack of good insullation. The white roof could possibly reduce the temp
in the attic by 10 degree F. though. About as much as a ridge vent. Over all
cooling of the earth, I have no idea. I know NYC is miserable this time of
year, and if it helps, by all means do it.

Stormin Mormon wrote:
We need a federal panel to study the matter, with an eye toward
diversity. What would minorities and women think if they drove into a
part of town that had all white roofs. Think of the children, man!


I've seen the study already. My mom insisted on almost white for the
new roof, my father bitched and complained that is looks ugly and won't
stay any cooler. Sometime later my father was on a porch roof with dark
.... what's it called? Rolled roofing? Like a giant shingle on a roll.
Anyway he was on the dark part and was getting burnt, he moved the the
white shingles and said to me "Don't tell Mom but she sure was right
about the white beeing cooler!

OK, a small study but it sure made Dad change his mind.

"JimT" wrote in message
net...

"Steve B" wrote in message
news

"serebel" wrote in message
...
On Jul 13, 9:51 pm, LSMFT wrote:
There is a push to cool the earth, save energy and keep your home cooler
at less cost to have white roofs. Especially in the cities to reduce
heat islands.
What about northern states where we heat more than air condition. Should
we go to white roofs or black roofs or middle colors?

--



The only thing a white roof will cool is your house in the
winter. snip

I guess the logic escapes you. g

Jim

Hunh? I wrote none of which you snipped and posted.

Steve

visit my blog at http://cabgbypasssurgery.com watch for the book

"Steve B" wrote in message
...

"JimT" wrote in message
net...

"Steve B" wrote in message
news

"serebel" wrote in message
...
On Jul 13, 9:51 pm, LSMFT wrote:
There is a push to cool the earth, save energy and keep your home
cooler
at less cost to have white roofs. Especially in the cities to reduce
heat islands.
What about northern states where we heat more than air condition.
Should
we go to white roofs or black roofs or middle colors?

--



The only thing a white roof will cool is your house in the
winter. snip

I guess the logic escapes you. g

Jim

Hunh? I wrote none of which you snipped and posted.

Steve

visit my blog at http://cabgbypasssurgery.com watch for the book


It looked like you wrote "The only thing a white roof will cool is your
house in the
winter." Which made little since to me. If it cools in the winter why
wouldn't it cool in the summer?

If that wasn't you ignore it. With Google Groups some of the quotes get
messed up.

Jim

"JimT" wrote in message
news

"Steve B" wrote in message
...

"JimT" wrote in message
net...

"Steve B" wrote in message
news
"serebel" wrote in message
...
On Jul 13, 9:51 pm, LSMFT wrote:
There is a push to cool the earth, save energy and keep your home
cooler
at less cost to have white roofs. Especially in the cities to reduce
heat islands.
What about northern states where we heat more than air condition.
Should
we go to white roofs or black roofs or middle colors?

--



The only thing a white roof will cool is your house in the
winter. snip

I guess the logic escapes you. g

Jim

Hunh? I wrote none of which you snipped and posted.

Steve

visit my blog at http://cabgbypasssurgery.com watch for the book


It looked like you wrote "The only thing a white roof will cool is your
house in the
winter." Which made little since to me. If it cools in the winter why
wouldn't it cool in the summer?

If that wasn't you ignore it. With Google Groups some of the quotes get
messed up.

Jim

That one sure did.

Steve

"Steve B" wrote in message
...

"JimT" wrote in message
news

"Steve B" wrote in message
...

"JimT" wrote in message
net...

"Steve B" wrote in message
news
"serebel" wrote in message
...
On Jul 13, 9:51 pm, LSMFT wrote:
There is a push to cool the earth, save energy and keep your home
cooler
at less cost to have white roofs. Especially in the cities to reduce
heat islands.
What about northern states where we heat more than air condition.
Should
we go to white roofs or black roofs or middle colors?

--



The only thing a white roof will cool is your house in the
winter. snip

I guess the logic escapes you. g

Jim

Hunh? I wrote none of which you snipped and posted.

Steve

visit my blog at http://cabgbypasssurgery.com watch for the book


It looked like you wrote "The only thing a white roof will cool is your
house in the
winter." Which made little since to me. If it cools in the winter why
wouldn't it cool in the summer?

If that wasn't you ignore it. With Google Groups some of the quotes get
messed up.

Jim

That one sure did.

Steve


When people post from GG the quotes get fouled up. Another reason to hate GG
for me. The following is exactly how the post appeared to me. Some have been
using ===== to divide the posts. There is a add on program that fixes ths
w/OE but I don't like it either.


"serebel" wrote in message
...
On Jul 13, 9:51 pm, LSMFT wrote:
There is a push to cool the earth, save energy and keep your home cooler
at less cost to have white roofs. Especially in the cities to reduce
heat islands.
What about northern states where we heat more than air condition. Should
we go to white roofs or black roofs or middle colors?

--

The only thing a white roof will cool is your house in the
winter. This "man made climate change" thing is just a huge money
grabbing scam.

reply: I agree with you. In the thousands of years roofs have been around,
seems like common knowledge would have evolved saying that this color is
better than that one. Instead, we get these new government revelations from
people who are educated beyond their capacities as to what they "think" is
the best.

I remember in the sixties, in Las Vegas, they did a slight pitch roof, put
gravel on it, then put rocks the size of softballs and white tar or paint.
Those gradually wore out and were replaced, and now are seen no more.

If a house is set up where a considerable heat load can be conducted to the
house from the roof, it is plain built wrong. There is a layer of air
there, and yes, attic ventilation fans will keep down the attic temperature,
but the sun load on the roof will be there no matter what, unless we all
wrap them in tinfoil, which may be an alternative, since we know tin foil
(excuse me, aluminum foil) hats are very valuable in fending off the evil
controlling rays of evil beings.

But then, I'm not sure. How about a couple of million for me to do a study?
Send the money in small unmarked bills, and I'll get back to you. Just like
they do it in Washington. The money will be in the freezer wrapped in tin
(aluminum) foil.

Steve, a libertarian

visit my blog at http://cabgbypasssurgery.com

On Wed, 14 Jul 2010 14:04:29 -0400, "Stormin Mormon"
wrote:

The intelligence shows. Republicans, the party of traditional values.
Lower taxes, morality, waterboarding, and the Patriot Act.

Works for me.

Hmm. Did that help or hurt my case?

You have some case.

On Jul 14, 12:12*am, IGot2P wrote:
On 7/13/2010 11:15 PM, serebel wrote:


* * *The only thing a white roof will cool is your house in the
winter. *This "man made climate change" thing is just a huge money
grabbing scam.

You obviously are a Republican....not a doubt in my mind.

Don



WRONG !!!!! Not much of a mind.