I saw this on an auto newsgroup and fund it interesting.


And dangerous too!

http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/201...r-bricks-cars/

The dealership used a system called Webtech Plus as an alternative to
repossessing vehicles that haven't been paid for. Operated by
Cleveland-based Pay Technologies, the system lets car dealers install a
small black box under vehicle dashboards that responds to commands issued
through a central website, and relayed over a wireless pager network. The
dealer can disable a car's ignition system, or trigger the horn to begin
honking, as a reminder that a payment is due. The system will not stop a
running vehicle.

Texas Auto Center began fielding complaints from baffled customers the last
week in February, many of whom wound up missing work, calling tow trucks or
disconnecting their batteries to stop the honking. The troubles stopped
five days later, when Texas Auto Center reset the Webtech Plus passwords
for all its employee accounts, says Garcia. Then police obtained access
logs from Pay Technologies, and traced the saboteur's IP address to
Ramos-Lopez's AT&T internet service, according to a police affidavit filed
in the case.

On 2010-03-22, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

Cleveland-based Pay Technologies, the system lets car dealers install a
small black box under vehicle dashboards that responds to commands issued
through a central website.....

The electronification of your car is becoming more and more intrusive.
There are microchips in things like your tranny, brakes, etc, that
record information without your knowledge. Have an accident? Your
insurance company --and law enforecement-- can access those chips to
find out how fast you were going, how far before impact you actually
hit the brakes, etc. Gee, due to information we retrieved from your
car, we are not going to honor your claim!! Welcome to the future.

Several years ago speeding tickets were issued based on readings from
GPS devices in rental cars. I think that one got squashed, but rental
companies where not happy about it, as it was also the basis for
levying additional charges on the customer. Look for and end run on
that one.

nb

Ed Pawlowski wrote:

I saw this on an auto newsgroup and fund it interesting.

And dangerous too!

http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/201...r-bricks-cars/

The dealership used a system called Webtech Plus as an alternative to
repossessing vehicles that haven't been paid for. Operated by
Cleveland-based Pay Technologies, the system lets car dealers install a
small black box under vehicle dashboards that responds to commands issued
through a central website, and relayed over a wireless pager network. The
dealer can disable a car's ignition system, or trigger the horn to begin
honking, as a reminder that a payment is due. The system will not stop a
running vehicle.

Texas Auto Center began fielding complaints from baffled customers the last
week in February, many of whom wound up missing work, calling tow trucks or
disconnecting their batteries to stop the honking. The troubles stopped
five days later, when Texas Auto Center reset the Webtech Plus passwords
for all its employee accounts, says Garcia. Then police obtained access
logs from Pay Technologies, and traced the saboteur's IP address to
Ramos-Lopez's AT&T internet service, according to a police affidavit filed
in the case.

I believe this is not a true "car dealer", but rather one of the "buy
here, pay here" type loan sharks that specialize in selling to high risk
customers with credit scores in the negative numbers. I expect on any
given month, 75%+ of their customers are delinquent in their payments.

On 3/21/2010 10:21 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
I saw this on an auto newsgroup and fund it interesting.


And dangerous too!

http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/201...r-bricks-cars/

The dealership used a system called Webtech Plus as an alternative to
repossessing vehicles that haven't been paid for. Operated by
Cleveland-based Pay Technologies, the system lets car dealers install a
small black box under vehicle dashboards that responds to commands issued
through a central website, and relayed over a wireless pager network. The
dealer can disable a car's ignition system, or trigger the horn to begin
honking, as a reminder that a payment is due. The system will not stop a
running vehicle.

Texas Auto Center began fielding complaints from baffled customers the last
week in February, many of whom wound up missing work, calling tow trucks or
disconnecting their batteries to stop the honking. The troubles stopped
five days later, when Texas Auto Center reset the Webtech Plus passwords
for all its employee accounts, says Garcia. Then police obtained access
logs from Pay Technologies, and traced the saboteur's IP address to
Ramos-Lopez's AT&T internet service, according to a police affidavit filed
in the case.

Understand your concerns about privacy but this isn't a car dealer.

It is one of those places that are set up to serve people in the "new
economy" much like the "rent-a-center" places.

In this case they are giving someone a car and they employ a method to
remotely disable the car if they haven't been paid. My niece worked at
one of those places for a while. She said they are totally upfront about
the use of the device.

But it does point out how utterly and completely clueless most are about
security. The first thing the rental place should have done when they
threw the guy under the bus is reset all of the passwords.

On Mar 21, 10:21*pm, "Ed Pawlowski" wrote:
I saw this on an auto newsgroup and fund it interesting.

And dangerous too!

http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/201...r-bricks-cars/

The dealership used a system called Webtech Plus as an alternative to
repossessing vehicles that haven't been paid for. Operated by
Cleveland-based Pay Technologies, the system lets car dealers install a
small black box under vehicle dashboards that responds to commands issued
through a central website, and relayed over a wireless pager network. The
dealer can disable a car's ignition system, or trigger the horn to begin
honking, as a reminder that a payment is due. The system will not stop a
running vehicle.

Texas Auto Center began fielding complaints from baffled customers the last
week in February, many of whom wound up missing work, calling tow trucks or
disconnecting their batteries to stop the honking. The troubles stopped
five days later, when Texas Auto Center reset the Webtech Plus passwords
for all its employee accounts, says Garcia. Then police obtained access
logs from Pay Technologies, and traced the saboteur's IP address to
Ramos-Lopez's AT&T internet service, according to a police affidavit filed
in the case.

I believe On Star can do this. One of their ads shows them disabling
a stolen vehicle. If they can do it to a stolen vehicle, they can do
it to any vehicle.

the system lets car dealers install a
small black box under vehicle dashboards that responds to commands issued
through a central website, and relayed over a wireless pager network. The
dealer can disable a car's ignition system, or trigger the horn to begin
honking, as a reminder that a payment is due.

How unreasonable of them! To expect people to pay for what they purchased!
Geezzze...

On Mar 22, 8:25*am, George wrote:
Understand your concerns about privacy but this isn't a car dealer.

That's what the news outlets want you to get enraged about, but this
doesn't have a damned thing to do with privacy.

It is one of those places that are set up to serve people in the "new
economy" much like the "rent-a-center" places.

Bull****. Loan shark car dealers have been around for decades. This
operation's core business is nothing new. They "sell" a used car to
someone on a weekly payment schedule and an exhorbitantly high
interest rate. Technically they are only RENTING the car, as ownership
remains with the dealer until the loan is paid.

Miss a payment, and you lose the car. As it should be.

Evidently a major problem with this is the "buyers" moving to a new
address but failing to inform the car dealer. They go to reposses the
car, and nobody's home. The car is nowhere to be found.

Now it CAN be found. I think it's a great idea. The execution could
use a little work, though.

On Mar 21, 10:21*pm, "Ed Pawlowski" wrote:
I saw this on an auto newsgroup and fund it interesting.

And dangerous too!

http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/201...r-bricks-cars/

The dealership used a system called Webtech Plus as an alternative to
repossessing vehicles that haven't been paid for. Operated by
Cleveland-based Pay Technologies, the system lets car dealers install a
small black box under vehicle dashboards that responds to commands issued
through a central website, and relayed over a wireless pager network. The
dealer can disable a car's ignition system, or trigger the horn to begin
honking, as a reminder that a payment is due. The system will not stop a
running vehicle.

Texas Auto Center began fielding complaints from baffled customers the last
week in February, many of whom wound up missing work, calling tow trucks or
disconnecting their batteries to stop the honking. The troubles stopped
five days later, when Texas Auto Center reset the Webtech Plus passwords
for all its employee accounts, says Garcia. Then police obtained access
logs from Pay Technologies, and traced the saboteur's IP address to
Ramos-Lopez's AT&T internet service, according to a police affidavit filed
in the case.

Tho I think the story you are reporting is bogus, I just wanted to
point out that the title you used for the thread is redundant.

hibb wrote:
On Mar 21, 10:21 pm, "Ed Pawlowski" wrote:
I saw this on an auto newsgroup and fund it interesting.

And dangerous too!

http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/201...r-bricks-cars/

The dealership used a system called Webtech Plus as an alternative to
repossessing vehicles that haven't been paid for. Operated by
Cleveland-based Pay Technologies, the system lets car dealers install a
small black box under vehicle dashboards that responds to commands issued
through a central website, and relayed over a wireless pager network. The
dealer can disable a car's ignition system, or trigger the horn to begin
honking, as a reminder that a payment is due. The system will not stop a
running vehicle.

Texas Auto Center began fielding complaints from baffled customers the last
week in February, many of whom wound up missing work, calling tow trucks or
disconnecting their batteries to stop the honking. The troubles stopped
five days later, when Texas Auto Center reset the Webtech Plus passwords
for all its employee accounts, says Garcia. Then police obtained access
logs from Pay Technologies, and traced the saboteur's IP address to
Ramos-Lopez's AT&T internet service, according to a police affidavit filed
in the case.

Tho I think the story you are reporting is bogus, I just wanted to
point out that the title you used for the thread is redundant.

Don't know about this specific case, but the technology is indeed out
there. The papers reported a court case a year or three ago about buyers
being unable to use their cars even if the payments were current. I
would NEVER deal with a dealer that used such garbage- if I couldn't
afford to buy a decent used car (private or dealer), I'd just keep
buying beaters. Buy here, pay here lots are a sucker bet anyway. Like
rent-to-own furniture, their business is lending money at super high
rates. The merchandise is just a hook to get you in the tent.

--
aem sends...

aemeijers wrote:

hibb wrote:
On Mar 21, 10:21 pm, "Ed Pawlowski" wrote:
I saw this on an auto newsgroup and fund it interesting.

And dangerous too!

http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/201...r-bricks-cars/

The dealership used a system called Webtech Plus as an alternative to
repossessing vehicles that haven't been paid for. Operated by
Cleveland-based Pay Technologies, the system lets car dealers install a
small black box under vehicle dashboards that responds to commands issued
through a central website, and relayed over a wireless pager network. The
dealer can disable a car's ignition system, or trigger the horn to begin
honking, as a reminder that a payment is due. The system will not stop a
running vehicle.

Texas Auto Center began fielding complaints from baffled customers the last
week in February, many of whom wound up missing work, calling tow trucks or
disconnecting their batteries to stop the honking. The troubles stopped
five days later, when Texas Auto Center reset the Webtech Plus passwords
for all its employee accounts, says Garcia. Then police obtained access
logs from Pay Technologies, and traced the saboteur's IP address to
Ramos-Lopez's AT&T internet service, according to a police affidavit filed
in the case.

Tho I think the story you are reporting is bogus, I just wanted to
point out that the title you used for the thread is redundant.

Don't know about this specific case, but the technology is indeed out
there. The papers reported a court case a year or three ago about buyers
being unable to use their cars even if the payments were current. I
would NEVER deal with a dealer that used such garbage- if I couldn't
afford to buy a decent used car (private or dealer), I'd just keep
buying beaters. Buy here, pay here lots are a sucker bet anyway. Like
rent-to-own furniture, their business is lending money at super high
rates. The merchandise is just a hook to get you in the tent.

More accurately, the "buy here, pay here" outfits are the only option
left to those who have tried to rip off all the legitimate dealers /
banks and have negative credit scores. People who actually pay their
bills don't deal with these places and those who have to deal with those
places dug their own financial graves.

"aemeijers" wrote in message
...
hibb wrote:
On Mar 21, 10:21 pm, "Ed Pawlowski" wrote:
I saw this on an auto newsgroup and fund it interesting.

And dangerous too!

http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/201...r-bricks-cars/

The dealership used a system called Webtech Plus as an alternative to
repossessing vehicles that haven't been paid for. Operated by
Cleveland-based Pay Technologies, the system lets car dealers install a
small black box under vehicle dashboards that responds to commands
issued
through a central website, and relayed over a wireless pager network.
The
dealer can disable a car's ignition system, or trigger the horn to begin
honking, as a reminder that a payment is due. The system will not stop a
running vehicle.

Texas Auto Center began fielding complaints from baffled customers the
last
week in February, many of whom wound up missing work, calling tow trucks
or
disconnecting their batteries to stop the honking. The troubles stopped
five days later, when Texas Auto Center reset the Webtech Plus passwords
for all its employee accounts, says Garcia. Then police obtained access
logs from Pay Technologies, and traced the saboteur's IP address to
Ramos-Lopez's AT&T internet service, according to a police affidavit
filed
in the case.

Tho I think the story you are reporting is bogus, I just wanted to
point out that the title you used for the thread is redundant.

Don't know about this specific case, but the technology is indeed out
there. The papers reported a court case a year or three ago about buyers
being unable to use their cars even if the payments were current. I would
NEVER deal with a dealer that used such garbage- if I couldn't afford to
buy a decent used car (private or dealer), I'd just keep buying beaters.
Buy here, pay here lots are a sucker bet anyway. Like rent-to-own
furniture, their business is lending money at super high rates. The
merchandise is just a hook to get you in the tent.

--
aem sends...

If you're a credit bandit there isn't much choice and regardless of the rate
they were given a chance to have wheels and still didn't pay. Credit bandits
deserve what they get.

Pete C. wrote:
aemeijers wrote:
hibb wrote:
On Mar 21, 10:21 pm, "Ed Pawlowski" wrote:
I saw this on an auto newsgroup and fund it interesting.

And dangerous too!

http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/201...r-bricks-cars/

The dealership used a system called Webtech Plus as an alternative to
repossessing vehicles that haven't been paid for. Operated by
Cleveland-based Pay Technologies, the system lets car dealers install a
small black box under vehicle dashboards that responds to commands issued
through a central website, and relayed over a wireless pager network. The
dealer can disable a car's ignition system, or trigger the horn to begin
honking, as a reminder that a payment is due. The system will not stop a
running vehicle.

Texas Auto Center began fielding complaints from baffled customers the last
week in February, many of whom wound up missing work, calling tow trucks or
disconnecting their batteries to stop the honking. The troubles stopped
five days later, when Texas Auto Center reset the Webtech Plus passwords
for all its employee accounts, says Garcia. Then police obtained access
logs from Pay Technologies, and traced the saboteur's IP address to
Ramos-Lopez's AT&T internet service, according to a police affidavit filed
in the case.
Tho I think the story you are reporting is bogus, I just wanted to
point out that the title you used for the thread is redundant.

Don't know about this specific case, but the technology is indeed out
there. The papers reported a court case a year or three ago about buyers
being unable to use their cars even if the payments were current. I
would NEVER deal with a dealer that used such garbage- if I couldn't
afford to buy a decent used car (private or dealer), I'd just keep
buying beaters. Buy here, pay here lots are a sucker bet anyway. Like
rent-to-own furniture, their business is lending money at super high
rates. The merchandise is just a hook to get you in the tent.

More accurately, the "buy here, pay here" outfits are the only option
left to those who have tried to rip off all the legitimate dealers /
banks and have negative credit scores. People who actually pay their
bills don't deal with these places and those who have to deal with those
places dug their own financial graves.

Not saying you are wrong, but there are still $750 used cars out there,
that will get you back and forth to work. The fenders will be flapping
in the breeze, and the seats will need a blanket over them, but they
move under their own power. That is a better option than dealing with a
buy-here pay-here lot, IMHO. Personally, I only buy cars I can write a
check for. Never made payments, never plan to.

--
aem sends...

aemeijers wrote:

Pete C. wrote:
aemeijers wrote:
hibb wrote:
On Mar 21, 10:21 pm, "Ed Pawlowski" wrote:
I saw this on an auto newsgroup and fund it interesting.

And dangerous too!

http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/201...r-bricks-cars/

The dealership used a system called Webtech Plus as an alternative to
repossessing vehicles that haven't been paid for. Operated by
Cleveland-based Pay Technologies, the system lets car dealers install a
small black box under vehicle dashboards that responds to commands issued
through a central website, and relayed over a wireless pager network. The
dealer can disable a car's ignition system, or trigger the horn to begin
honking, as a reminder that a payment is due. The system will not stop a
running vehicle.

Texas Auto Center began fielding complaints from baffled customers the last
week in February, many of whom wound up missing work, calling tow trucks or
disconnecting their batteries to stop the honking. The troubles stopped
five days later, when Texas Auto Center reset the Webtech Plus passwords
for all its employee accounts, says Garcia. Then police obtained access
logs from Pay Technologies, and traced the saboteur's IP address to
Ramos-Lopez's AT&T internet service, according to a police affidavit filed
in the case.
Tho I think the story you are reporting is bogus, I just wanted to
point out that the title you used for the thread is redundant.

Don't know about this specific case, but the technology is indeed out
there. The papers reported a court case a year or three ago about buyers
being unable to use their cars even if the payments were current. I
would NEVER deal with a dealer that used such garbage- if I couldn't
afford to buy a decent used car (private or dealer), I'd just keep
buying beaters. Buy here, pay here lots are a sucker bet anyway. Like
rent-to-own furniture, their business is lending money at super high
rates. The merchandise is just a hook to get you in the tent.

More accurately, the "buy here, pay here" outfits are the only option
left to those who have tried to rip off all the legitimate dealers /
banks and have negative credit scores. People who actually pay their
bills don't deal with these places and those who have to deal with those
places dug their own financial graves.

Not saying you are wrong, but there are still $750 used cars out there,
that will get you back and forth to work. The fenders will be flapping
in the breeze, and the seats will need a blanket over them, but they
move under their own power. That is a better option than dealing with a
buy-here pay-here lot, IMHO.

I would agree, however people who dig their own financial graves also
don't have the sense to put their egos aside and trade unaffordable
bling for sensible beater.

Personally, I only buy cars I can write a
check for. Never made payments, never plan to.

I finance my vehicles, but only through real banks (not even auto
dealer's financing), with a sizable amount down and at both low interest
rates and short terms.

"Pete C." wrote

I finance my vehicles, but only through real banks (not even auto
dealer's financing), with a sizable amount down and at both low interest
rates and short terms.

Three years ago I bought a car with 1.9%. I bought a new one a few months
ago for 0%. Not much incentive for a short term, but the rate is good.

Ed Pawlowski wrote:

"Pete C." wrote

I finance my vehicles, but only through real banks (not even auto
dealer's financing), with a sizable amount down and at both low interest
rates and short terms.

Three years ago I bought a car with 1.9%. I bought a new one a few months
ago for 0%. Not much incentive for a short term, but the rate is good.



That works for cars, but such manufacturer promo rates are rarely
available for the trucks I buy since they are always in demand.

aemeijers wrote:

Not saying you are wrong, but there are still $750 used cars out
there, that will get you back and forth to work. The fenders will be
flapping in the breeze, and the seats will need a blanket over them,
but they move under their own power. That is a better option than
dealing with a buy-here pay-here lot, IMHO. Personally, I only buy
cars I can write a check for. Never made payments, never plan to.

What the hell kind of chick can you pick up in a $750 clunker?

You need to keep up with the times. Do you know you can rent TIRES? Not
only that, but you can rent WHEELS! Some as low as $50/week - but that's for
the whole set.

There are, evidently, females who go all wet when they see the latest
chrome-and-stainless-with-just-a-discrete-hint-of-gold-bling going
round-and-round.

Ed Pawlowski wrote:
"Pete C." wrote

I finance my vehicles, but only through real banks (not even auto
dealer's financing), with a sizable amount down and at both low
interest rates and short terms.

Three years ago I bought a car with 1.9%. I bought a new one a few
months ago for 0%. Not much incentive for a short term, but the rate
is good.

the last used vette i bought was about 7 years ago when credit cards were
still offering limited time 0% and no cost transfers of other loans for 1
year. i bounced that loan through 3 different cards before it got paid off,
and never paid interest on the car.

Three years ago I bought a car with 1.9%. I bought a new one a few
months
ago for 0%. Not much incentive for a short term, but the rate is good.

That works for cars, but such manufacturer promo rates are rarely
available for the trucks I buy since they are always in demand.

I have 3 months to go on my FORD, 36 month 0% interest financing.
Thats a truck, a 2007 F-150 Supercrew 4X4 5.4

HeyBub wrote:
aemeijers wrote:
Not saying you are wrong, but there are still $750 used cars out
there, that will get you back and forth to work. The fenders will be
flapping in the breeze, and the seats will need a blanket over them,
but they move under their own power. That is a better option than
dealing with a buy-here pay-here lot, IMHO. Personally, I only buy
cars I can write a check for. Never made payments, never plan to.

What the hell kind of chick can you pick up in a $750 clunker?


A little yellow one that goes cheep, cheep, cheep, cheep......

TDD