1. When it's 105 out and I've just come out of
your attic please do not offer me anything to
drink. Us heating and air techs have a special
gene that lets us recycle our sweat when
licked of off our bodies in a timely manner.
Heat stroke is a Zen experience!
2. By all means tell me that you want to pay my
after hours fee and then wait till I'm five
minutes
from your house and call and cancel. We have
a special deal with the gas companies where we
only pay half price.
3. When I tell you that a part costs x dollars,
please exclaim as loud as you can "For that!"
There are no overhead costs associated with
running our business, that's why it's called
HVAC. You know, heating, ventilating and
charity.
4. When I tell you the price for a new system,
please tell me how Joe down the street just got
one for half that price. I'm just curious, did
Joe get the Ford model or the Mercedes model
or did BillyBobs heating, ventilating and charity
install said system?
5. When I tell you the price of a new system,
please tell me how you can get one off of that
internet thingy for half price. Those internet
models install and warranty themselves I
heard.
6. When I tell you the price of a new system,
please tell me that you want to get a quote from
10 other companies and make a decision five
years from now. Our business is inflation proof.
7. When I show you the problem with your system
and you're standing right there, please tell me
you
want to call 5 more companies for a second
opinion. All these certifications we have mean
absolutely bubkis.
8. When I ask you who put your system in and you
tell me a friend of a friend so your cheap ass
could
save money, please get mad as hell when I tell you
that that's what happens when you hire hacks. Oh
wait, that's right, you hired BillyBobs heating,
ventilating and charity. So sorry I insulted you,
my
bad.
9. When I disable your system because your heat
exchanger is cracked, please go completely off
and tell me what a crook I am. If I don't hear
what
a crook I am at least once a day I start getting
a
complex. Besides, I heard that a little carbon
monoxide, in moderation of course, is a Zen
experience.
10. When I have you scheduled for 10:00 and you
are not there, please expect me to wait an hour
while you do whatever it is you have to do. You
are the only customer I have that day and I have
nothing better to do anyway.
11. When you see my van driving down the road,
please do everything you can to impede my
progress. We all attended the Skip Barber racing
school and you are helping us keep our driving
skills up to par without having to go back and pay
that damn racing school for a refresher course
each year.
12. Please answer your door in the most revealing
clothing you have and then offer to pay for the
service call by "unconventional" means. Hey, all
of us have screwed up marriages anyway, we only
married our wives out of charity.
13. Please argue with me about how much the office
said the service charge would be. I've only worked
for said company four years anyway, what the hell
do I know.
14. When I am looking at your system, please have
your engineer neighbor there so he can make
suggestions every 2.5 seconds. After all, all of
these
certifications we have, well, we had to eat a lot
of
cracker jacks to get them.
15. After I have just fixed your system, please
fiddle with the thermostat and turn it off. It's
ok
because we all have ESP and will know that you
just turned the thermostat off. Besides, I really
didn't want to give you the "complete system
evaluation" that you're paying for anyway.
16. When I tell you that your system is low on
refrigerant and will need 5 lbs, please ask me to
add only two pounds so you can save some
money. You have a special system that will
cool without the required amount of refrigerant,
all I have to do is throw the kaniflin valve
counter
clockwise and this will allow the system to run
correctly and as an added bonus will seal the leak
wherever it is.
16a. If the system isn't cooling. Be sure to tell
me
that you know it's low on freon, and just to add
a couple pounds. Don't let me sell you a fan, or
scam you by cleaning the condensor.
17. When I tell you that your duct work is
improperly sized, please ask me why someone
would do that. I can surely answer that question
because as I said earlier, we all have ESP.
18. When I ask you to explain what your system
is doing or not doing, please start out with "it
was working yesterday" with the tone in your
voice like you expected it to ring you up and let
you know that at exactly 5:04 tomorrow it's
going to croak.
19. Please do everything you can to get me to
warranty something that is not covered under
your warranty. Remember, I am running a
charity, not a business.
20. When I am diagnosing why your new system does
not heat or cool properly, please start out with
"well
the salesman said." That's why they are called
salesmen!
21. Please ask me to estimate the repair over the
phone. With only a sketchy description of the
problem, and no clue what the equipment is. Ask
for a firm, cast in concrete quote. Don't take no
for an answer. And then when I get there, tell me
the rest of the problem.
22. After the phone quote, don't accept any hint
of possibly saying something else was wrong.
HVAC guys are psychic. We can diagnose over
the phone. But we do, so, love scewing with you.
We get there, and find five other things wrong
cause we love to make you squirm.
23. Be sure to call on a weekday about 10 AM, and
ask for the quote on fixing the system. Then call
back, Sunday night about 9 PM and say that you
can't stand it, and want someone out right away.
And that you want the quoted price.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..

On Sun, 28 Feb 2010 22:02:54 -0500, "Stormin Mormon"
wrote:

Snip

Pretty good!

Copied it off alternating havoc. I added the bit
about adding freon, point 16a. That's from my own
experience with a customer from Hell.

The guy had a couple systems which were obvious to
me loaded with air. He wanted "five pounds freon
in this one, and eight in the other one". I showed
him that the receiver would only hold 1.7 pounds,
so eight pounds is way out of line. He didn't
believe me. Told him that the system needed to be
evacuated, and get the air out. He also didn't
believe me. I hope he's found another technician
who will do exactly what he says. I sure won't.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"Gordon Shumway" wrote in
message
...
On Sun, 28 Feb 2010 22:02:54 -0500, "Stormin
Mormon"
wrote:

Snip

Pretty good!

Stormin Mormon wrote:
Copied it off alternating havoc.

Glad to someone in the trade making that comment. Pretty obnoxious bunch over
there.

Stormin Mormon wrote:
Copied it off alternating havoc. I added the bit
about adding freon, point 16a. That's from my own
experience with a customer from Hell.

The guy had a couple systems which were obvious to
me loaded with air. He wanted "five pounds freon
in this one, and eight in the other one". I showed
him that the receiver would only hold 1.7 pounds,
so eight pounds is way out of line. He didn't
believe me. Told him that the system needed to be
evacuated, and get the air out. He also didn't
believe me. I hope he's found another technician
who will do exactly what he says. I sure won't.


Don't you just love coming out to work on anything
after some Neanderthal has gotten hold of it?

TDD

I'm not sure what's worse. The other tech with the
load of air in the system, I can deal with that.
The customer who totally insists all it needs is 8
pounds of freon. I can't do much with that. I
think it's sad, though. The restaurant has several
of the world's nicest people. But the owner was
pretty set in his ways, and not listening to
reason.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"The Daring Dufas"
wrote in message
...


Don't you just love coming out to work on anything
after some Neanderthal has gotten hold of it?

TDD

"The Daring Dufas" wrote in message
...
Stormin Mormon wrote:
Copied it off alternating havoc. I added the bit about adding freon,
point 16a. That's from my own experience with a customer from Hell.

The guy had a couple systems which were obvious to me loaded with air. He
wanted "five pounds freon in this one, and eight in the other one". I
showed him that the receiver would only hold 1.7 pounds, so eight pounds
is way out of line. He didn't believe me. Told him that the system needed
to be evacuated, and get the air out. He also didn't believe me. I hope
he's found another technician who will do exactly what he says. I sure
won't.


Don't you just love coming out to work on anything
after some Neanderthal has gotten hold of it?

TDD

In the welding trade, I made a boatload of money from it. However, there
were jobs where the client did not want to pay my hourly rate, or the thing
was so screwed up it had to be redone. And on those jobs where I bid it,
and they took low bid or had their brother-in-law do it, and now had to get
a pro to fix it, I charged them full rates. A lot of it had to do with the
attitude of the client. I'd help some people out, and then I'd give some
people better pricing, but for some, I enjoyed either walking away, or
telling them to get the original worker over there to fix their own mess.

Steve

I do read alternating havoc, now and again. Can't
say as I am fond of most of the posters there. Ah,
well. They need the voice of sanity now and again.
Keeps them off balance.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"Bob F" wrote in message
...
Stormin Mormon wrote:
Copied it off alternating havoc.

Glad to someone in the trade making that comment.
Pretty obnoxious bunch over
there.

I've got a couple customers, it will be nice when
they retire to Florida, and sell the place to
someone else. Will be nice when I can go back, and
prove to myself that I really did know how to fix
that cooler that "needed 8 pounds of freon".

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"Steve B" wrote in
message ...


In the welding trade, I made a boatload of money
from it. However, there
were jobs where the client did not want to pay my
hourly rate, or the thing
was so screwed up it had to be redone. And on
those jobs where I bid it,
and they took low bid or had their brother-in-law
do it, and now had to get
a pro to fix it, I charged them full rates. A lot
of it had to do with the
attitude of the client. I'd help some people out,
and then I'd give some
people better pricing, but for some, I enjoyed
either walking away, or
telling them to get the original worker over there
to fix their own mess.

Steve

Steve B wrote:
"The Daring Dufas" wrote in message
...
Stormin Mormon wrote:
Copied it off alternating havoc. I added the bit about adding freon,
point 16a. That's from my own experience with a customer from Hell.

The guy had a couple systems which were obvious to me loaded with air. He
wanted "five pounds freon in this one, and eight in the other one". I
showed him that the receiver would only hold 1.7 pounds, so eight pounds
is way out of line. He didn't believe me. Told him that the system needed
to be evacuated, and get the air out. He also didn't believe me. I hope
he's found another technician who will do exactly what he says. I sure
won't.

Don't you just love coming out to work on anything
after some Neanderthal has gotten hold of it?

TDD

In the welding trade, I made a boatload of money from it. However, there
were jobs where the client did not want to pay my hourly rate, or the thing
was so screwed up it had to be redone. And on those jobs where I bid it,
and they took low bid or had their brother-in-law do it, and now had to get
a pro to fix it, I charged them full rates. A lot of it had to do with the
attitude of the client. I'd help some people out, and then I'd give some
people better pricing, but for some, I enjoyed either walking away, or
telling them to get the original worker over there to fix their own mess.

Steve

I often worked on equipment after the owner, or his friend the
electrical engineer tried to fix it. When it came time for the bill I
would go over how many things and how long it took to fix the damage
they did, lets say $300 worth, and then the original problem cost about
$75 to fix, the minimum charge.

I've had a call or two like that. I'm remembering
the furnace that tripped the breaker. The lady
reset the breaker. Repeatedlly, until it stayed
on.

Original problem: shorted out fan blower motor.
New problem: Having power surged the furnace
repeatedly. Finally, a relay on the circuit board
vaporized.

Blower was $50 or so, and the board was $200 or
so. Been several years ago, so I'm sure my memory
of prices is way off.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"Tony" wrote in message
...

I often worked on equipment after the owner, or
his friend the
electrical engineer tried to fix it. When it came
time for the bill I
would go over how many things and how long it took
to fix the damage
they did, lets say $300 worth, and then the
original problem cost about
$75 to fix, the minimum charge.

On Mar 1, 6:06*am, The Daring Dufas
wrote:
Stormin Mormon wrote:
Copied it off alternating *havoc. I added the bit
about adding freon, point 16a. That's from my own
experience with a customer from Hell.

The guy had a couple systems which were obvious to
me loaded with air. He wanted "five pounds freon
in this one, and eight in the other one". I showed
him that the receiver would only hold 1.7 pounds,
so eight pounds is way out of line. He didn't
believe me. Told him that the system needed to be
evacuated, and get the air out. He also didn't
believe me. I hope he's found another technician
who will do exactly what he says. I sure won't.

Don't you just love coming out to work on anything
after some Neanderthal has gotten hold of it?

TDD

In another life I was installing/ repairing TVRO systems. I could have
almost made a pretty decent living just because some of my competitors
didnt know how to put an N connector on a piece of coax.

Jimmie

Steve B wrote:
"The Daring Dufas" wrote in message
...
Stormin Mormon wrote:
Copied it off alternating havoc. I added the bit about adding freon,
point 16a. That's from my own experience with a customer from Hell.

The guy had a couple systems which were obvious to me loaded with air. He
wanted "five pounds freon in this one, and eight in the other one". I
showed him that the receiver would only hold 1.7 pounds, so eight pounds
is way out of line. He didn't believe me. Told him that the system needed
to be evacuated, and get the air out. He also didn't believe me. I hope
he's found another technician who will do exactly what he says. I sure
won't.

Don't you just love coming out to work on anything
after some Neanderthal has gotten hold of it?

TDD

In the welding trade, I made a boatload of money from it. However, there
were jobs where the client did not want to pay my hourly rate, or the thing
was so screwed up it had to be redone. And on those jobs where I bid it,
and they took low bid or had their brother-in-law do it, and now had to get
a pro to fix it, I charged them full rates. A lot of it had to do with the
attitude of the client. I'd help some people out, and then I'd give some
people better pricing, but for some, I enjoyed either walking away, or
telling them to get the original worker over there to fix their own mess.

Steve



That's something a lot of folks don't understand. The reason I work
for myself is because I don'[t have to put up with assholes. I fire
at least 2 customers a year. The amount of the bill or the size of
the discount is directly proportional to the attitude of the customer!
Nasty people can't understand why I'm suddenly not available anymore.
Want to see my vanishing act, say the magic words "I ain't gonna pay"
in any context.

TDD

On Feb 28, 10:02*pm, "Stormin Mormon"
wrote:

I give mine a cold beer and some hot sex. Needless
to say, I'm married to him.

Cindy Hamilton

On Mar 1, 11:26*am, "Stormin Mormon"
wrote:
I've got a couple customers, it will be nice when
they retire to Florida, and sell the place to
someone else. Will be nice when I can go back, and
prove to myself that I really did know how to fix
that cooler that "needed 8 pounds of freon".

The only problem I have with all this is that it makes the assumption
that all HVAC guys are competent, honest professionals.

There are a LOT of outfits out there that are incompetent and/or just
out to screw the customer for every penny they can. How they manage to
stay in business for decades, I don't know.

Cindy Hamilton wrote:
On Feb 28, 10:02 pm, "Stormin Mormon"
wrote:

I give mine a cold beer and some hot sex. Needless
to say, I'm married to him.

Cindy Hamilton

Ah Dang! YOu had me putting on my tool belt!

Cindy Hamilton wrote in news:ba428aa7-ac11-
:

On Feb 28, 10:02*pm, "Stormin Mormon"
wrote:

I give mine a cold beer and some hot sex. Needless
to say, I'm married to him.

Cindy Hamilton

Does he need a helper by any chance?

Red Green wrote:
Cindy Hamilton wrote in
news:ba428aa7-ac11-
:

On Feb 28, 10:02*pm, "Stormin Mormon"
wrote:

I give mine a cold beer and some hot sex. Needless
to say, I'm married to him.

Cindy Hamilton

Does he need a helper by any chance?

You could hold his beer and watch.

"HeyBub" wrote in news:-
:

Red Green wrote:
Cindy Hamilton wrote in
news:ba428aa7-ac11-
:

On Feb 28, 10:02*pm, "Stormin Mormon"
wrote:

I give mine a cold beer and some hot sex. Needless
to say, I'm married to him.

Cindy Hamilton

Does he need a helper by any chance?

You could hold his beer and watch.



He could actually trust me with it since I don't drink. Now as far as
Cindy...

On Feb 28, 10:02*pm, "Stormin Mormon"
wrote:

snip

Now how do I get a guy to come out and quote me a price?

seriously, I have been putting off getting a heat pump for my garage
not because of money but because the contractor that put the A/C in my
house has shown a decided disinterest in quoting any more work for
me. Not sure what I did to **** him off, I did get three quotes for
my A/C but he was NOT low, I picked him because I got the best
impression of his professionalism and thoroughness of the three. If
he gave me a good price for the garage I wouldn't even bother getting
another quote BUT now I have to start all over again...

grr.

nate

(no, I did not offer to pay by unconventional means. That would be
kinda creepy.)

I can believe that.
Ain't it awful?
Gonna take care of yourself.
Pay your bills honestly.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"The Daring Dufas"
wrote in message
...

Want to see my vanishing act, say the magic words
"I ain't gonna pay"
in any context.

TDD

I've had to fire a couple customers. Not often,
but once in a while.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"The Daring Dufas"
wrote in message
...


That's something a lot of folks don't understand.
The reason I work
for myself is because I don'[t have to put up with
assholes. I fire
at least 2 customers a year. The amount of the
bill or the size of
the discount is directly proportional to the
attitude of the customer!
Nasty people can't understand why I'm suddenly not
available anymore.
Want to see my vanishing act, say the magic words
"I ain't gonna pay"
in any context.

TDD

Lets be careful, with the quoted text!

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"Cindy Hamilton"
wrote in message
...

On Feb 28, 10:02 pm, "Stormin Mormon"
wrote:

I give mine a cold beer and some hot sex.
Needless
to say, I'm married to him.

Cindy Hamilton

Whew. That's better quoted text job.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"Cindy Hamilton"
wrote in message
...

I give mine a cold beer and some hot sex.
Needless
to say, I'm married to him.

Cindy Hamilton

Better off with a good Mormon. We neither drink,
nor fornicate.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"Red Green" wrote in
message
...
"HeyBub" wrote in news:-
:

Red Green wrote:
Cindy Hamilton
wrote in
news:ba428aa7-ac11-
:

On Feb 28, 10:02 pm, "Stormin Mormon"
wrote:

I give mine a cold beer and some hot sex.
Needless
to say, I'm married to him.

Cindy Hamilton

Does he need a helper by any chance?

You could hold his beer and watch.



He could actually trust me with it since I don't
drink. Now as far as
Cindy...

I can't comment on what another tech is thinking.
But, that sounds strange. Turning down repeat
business? Really strange.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"N8N" wrote in message
...

Now how do I get a guy to come out and quote me a
price?

seriously, I have been putting off getting a heat
pump for my garage
not because of money but because the contractor
that put the A/C in my
house has shown a decided disinterest in quoting
any more work for
me. Not sure what I did to **** him off, I did
get three quotes for
my A/C but he was NOT low, I picked him because I
got the best
impression of his professionalism and thoroughness
of the three. If
he gave me a good price for the garage I wouldn't
even bother getting
another quote BUT now I have to start all over
again...

grr.

nate

(no, I did not offer to pay by unconventional
means. That would be
kinda creepy.)

"Stormin Mormon" wrote in news:hmk0ul
:

Better off with a good Mormon. We neither drink,
nor fornicate.


Uhhh, yuhhhh, maybe later. I strive for progress, not perfection.

"The Daring Dufas" wrote

That's something a lot of folks don't understand. The reason I work
for myself is because I don'[t have to put up with assholes. I fire
at least 2 customers a year. The amount of the bill or the size of
the discount is directly proportional to the attitude of the customer!
Nasty people can't understand why I'm suddenly not available anymore.
Want to see my vanishing act, say the magic words "I ain't gonna pay"
in any context.

LOL! I'm with ya. I know various contractors quitely have a traded 'black
ball list' and with suprise, find they have a 'golden ball' one as well for
that rare client that is a joy to work with. We are on that second list.

Grin, I have some work due soon. Refencing (wood 6ftx8ft dogear panels).
One of the fellows who's worked here before is now on his own and severely
cash strapped. We got all the materials (20 panels, need only 5 new posts
but got 6, 4 bags of the right cement and so on, delivered yesterday). He
got stiffed by some clients and his ability to get the materials is now in
the basement while Lowes gives me 10% off for being retired military. So,
we got'em. He's pulling permits and such tomorrow and has his own health
insurance etc still. He's put the word out he needs 1 buddy to help
(medical issues prevent us from being able to handle such weights now though
10 years ago we'd have done this ourselves). Apparently he's got 7 guys who
want the job, 5 of which have worked here before and quietly asked him if
I'd be fixing (insert recipe) those days?

Snicker. He's laughing and so am I. It's hilarious but he's narrowed to 3
of them and is debating which one based on who asked for the food he wants
the most. Pay is simple. Total job expected to take a little less than 2
days (estimated 16 hours for work time) and 300$ a day (37.5$ an hour) per
person. His request was 150$ a day per person. *We* upped it to 300$ a day
for up to 2 workers (if they want a 3rd, they take it out of hide). If it
takes longer, it won't be by much and they sorta 'eat it' but we are all
pretty sure it's actually going to take less time (my end of the fees are
set so if they finish faster, the hour rate obviously goes up). True
estimate is it will take 2 guys about 8-10 hours due to the specifics here.
(It's pretty much just manhandle panels over then nail to existing posts for
the majority of it).

Each day I will make fresh bread in the ABM so they get it hot and dripping
with butter right on the spot plus a backup loaf all sliced for samwiches to
take home (also pressd into service if the bread fails which happens rarely
but does). I'll also make rice (a keep warm rice maker is a glory), some
sort of crockpot thing (what depends on if they want beans, chicken stew, or
southern BBQ pulled pork), and 2-3 veggies (blanched whole fresh green beans
with sesame oil, steamed Bok choy with ****take mushrooms and miso dressing,
or whatever they know I make and they like if I can find it in season).
Basically if you work here, expect to take time outs to stuff yourself
whilst I whift little food items under your nose. Yeah, I even take
requests and suit special diets.

Summary: If there's a good rate out there, I'm apt to get it. I'm apt to
be offered the lower rate right away, know it, and don't dicker. If you
think the 300$ a day per person is high for the job we spec'ed out, the job
was spec'ed in 2007 by 3 contractors and they wanted over 3,000$ labor for
it. We were 'unknowns then' and it's the average rate for the area.

Grin, as I typo'd to you all, he emailed. He's now got a fellow with a
truck who for 50$ flat rate will handle all haul away. Cool! He's added a
saucy fun request for a few slices of rye bread to go with some havarti. I
added a saucy reply to ask if he wants a mustard rye (goes well with
Havarti) or a straight one and a yes to the extra fee. He's also selected 2
co-workers (all with insurance, my end the same price) and rotiserrie
chicken, green beans with sesame oil, carrot cream soup, and whatever else I
feel like adding. Hehe part of the deal is a good feedbag. The other part is
he comes over and sets the new posts before hand so ready when the team
arrives.

"N8N" wrote

seriously, I have been putting off getting a heat pump for my garage
not because of money but because the contractor that put the A/C in my
house has shown a decided disinterest in quoting any more work for
me. Not sure what I did to **** him off, I did get three quotes for

Smile, Nate, I can't tell either but there are several possibles. One, the
job is now too small and you live far eough away that it isnt cost effective
foir him.

Lets spec that out. If driving time to your location is 1 hour, he has to
pay the worker 1 hour wages each way.. It's not applicable in my situation
as they are 5-10 mins away, but may be in yours. 'Labor' costs go way up if
the person pretty much has to spend all day to get to and from your
location.

Second, he may be so good that he's flooded with work. 1 hour at your place
for 100$ profit means he can't fit in that 7,000$ profit job he has in the
wings. My fencing guy from before now works with clients who go 'oh it's
that cheap?' at 10,000 for the same job I am having done and he spec'ed for
3,500$ in 2007. He's good dont get me wrong and I'm happy for him but he's
booked solid. He's now got the upperscale folks and I am happy for him.

Third, you *might* have hung over his head a bit too much. I've seen folks
advise 'watch them all the time' but in reality, it's pretty irritating to
have someone peering over your shoulder. Think about when you are at work
and if you want that? If the first impression you give the worker is that
you trust them to do well by you, and they will. They also take reall well
to comments like: 'I know some things but little of this so do you mind if I
learn a little about your trade?'. Hehe I might actually *know* their trade
but it makes people feel good in a great way if you approach it from the
right angle.

My own tactic is to play 'dumb blonde' who knows just enough if they havent
been here before (sadly they catch on pretty quick now) and make them happy
to show off the fine details of their work while I smile and go 'wow'. It
works at the start and is harmless until they figure out the 'petite lady
they were talking to flipped houses from age 5 with her Mom for a living'.
After they figure it out, they just laugh and ask me if I have any tips
which depending on the item, I may have.

PS: Just so it makes sense, I have medical issues so have to contract out
things I know how to do, but sadly no longer can.

"cshenk" wrote in message
...
"N8N" wrote

seriously, I have been putting off getting a heat pump for my garage
not because of money but because the contractor that put the A/C in my
house has shown a decided disinterest in quoting any more work for
me. Not sure what I did to **** him off, I did get three quotes for

Smile, Nate, I can't tell either but there are several possibles. One,
the job is now too small and you live far eough away that it isnt cost
effective foir him.

Lets spec that out. If driving time to your location is 1 hour, he has to
pay the worker 1 hour wages each way.. It's not applicable in my situation
as they are 5-10 mins away, but may be in yours. 'Labor' costs go way up
if the person pretty much has to spend all day to get to and from your
location.

Second, he may be so good that he's flooded with work. 1 hour at your
place for 100$ profit means he can't fit in that 7,000$ profit job he has
in the wings. My fencing guy from before now works with clients who go
'oh it's that cheap?' at 10,000 for the same job I am having done and he
spec'ed for 3,500$ in 2007. He's good dont get me wrong and I'm happy for
him but he's booked solid. He's now got the upperscale folks and I am
happy for him.

Third, you *might* have hung over his head a bit too much. I've seen
folks advise 'watch them all the time' but in reality, it's pretty
irritating to have someone peering over your shoulder. Think about when
you are at work and if you want that? If the first impression you give
the worker is that you trust them to do well by you, and they will. They
also take reall well to comments like: 'I know some things but little of
this so do you mind if I learn a little about your trade?'. Hehe I might
actually *know* their trade but it makes people feel good in a great way
if you approach it from the right angle.

My own tactic is to play 'dumb blonde' who knows just enough if they
havent been here before (sadly they catch on pretty quick now) and make
them happy to show off the fine details of their work while I smile and go
'wow'. It works at the start and is harmless until they figure out the
'petite lady they were talking to flipped houses from age 5 with her Mom
for a living'. After they figure it out, they just laugh and ask me if I
have any tips which depending on the item, I may have.

PS: Just so it makes sense, I have medical issues so have to contract out
things I know how to do, but sadly no longer can.






Homeowners that have to stand over me like I can't be trusted is my biggest
turn off...Even more so if they try to tell me how to do it or question
every move I make...I have been doing drywall for nearly 30 years and never
stolen anything or ripped anyone off and don't need somebody babysitting me
and offering how to tips from some stupid DYI show...I just won't do any
more work for them...I say I'm "busy"...Same for showing up with a crew and
delivery truck with materials and told they aren't ready for me after
calling and telling me it's ready to go and get ****ed when I charge extra
for it...Never again...I'm "busy"...

"The Daring Dufas" wrote in message
...
Steve B wrote:
"The Daring Dufas" wrote in message
...
Stormin Mormon wrote:
Copied it off alternating havoc. I added the bit about adding freon,
point 16a. That's from my own experience with a customer from Hell.

The guy had a couple systems which were obvious to me loaded with air.
He wanted "five pounds freon in this one, and eight in the other one".
I showed him that the receiver would only hold 1.7 pounds, so eight
pounds is way out of line. He didn't believe me. Told him that the
system needed to be evacuated, and get the air out. He also didn't
believe me. I hope he's found another technician who will do exactly
what he says. I sure won't.

Don't you just love coming out to work on anything
after some Neanderthal has gotten hold of it?

TDD

In the welding trade, I made a boatload of money from it. However, there
were jobs where the client did not want to pay my hourly rate, or the
thing was so screwed up it had to be redone. And on those jobs where I
bid it, and they took low bid or had their brother-in-law do it, and now
had to get a pro to fix it, I charged them full rates. A lot of it had
to do with the attitude of the client. I'd help some people out, and
then I'd give some people better pricing, but for some, I enjoyed either
walking away, or telling them to get the original worker over there to
fix their own mess.

Steve

That's something a lot of folks don't understand. The reason I work
for myself is because I don'[t have to put up with assholes. I fire
at least 2 customers a year. The amount of the bill or the size of
the discount is directly proportional to the attitude of the customer!
Nasty people can't understand why I'm suddenly not available anymore.
Want to see my vanishing act, say the magic words "I ain't gonna pay"
in any context.

TDD



DITTO...Same for me....

Stormin Mormon wrote:
Better off with a good Mormon. We neither drink,
nor fornicate.


That's not the way I heard it. Where do all those babies come from?

Oh! I get it. The GOOD Mormans don't fornicate.

"benick" wrote in
:

"cshenk" wrote in message
...
"N8N" wrote

seriously, I have been putting off getting a heat pump for my garage
not because of money but because the contractor that put the A/C in
my house has shown a decided disinterest in quoting any more work
for me. Not sure what I did to **** him off, I did get three quotes
for

Smile, Nate, I can't tell either but there are several possibles.
One, the job is now too small and you live far eough away that it
isnt cost effective foir him.

Lets spec that out. If driving time to your location is 1 hour, he
has to pay the worker 1 hour wages each way.. It's not applicable in
my situation as they are 5-10 mins away, but may be in yours.
'Labor' costs go way up if the person pretty much has to spend all
day to get to and from your location.

Second, he may be so good that he's flooded with work. 1 hour at
your place for 100$ profit means he can't fit in that 7,000$ profit
job he has in the wings. My fencing guy from before now works with
clients who go 'oh it's that cheap?' at 10,000 for the same job I am
having done and he spec'ed for 3,500$ in 2007. He's good dont get me
wrong and I'm happy for him but he's booked solid. He's now got the
upperscale folks and I am happy for him.

Third, you *might* have hung over his head a bit too much. I've seen
folks advise 'watch them all the time' but in reality, it's pretty
irritating to have someone peering over your shoulder. Think about
when you are at work and if you want that? If the first impression
you give the worker is that you trust them to do well by you, and
they will. They also take reall well to comments like: 'I know some
things but little of this so do you mind if I learn a little about
your trade?'. Hehe I might actually *know* their trade but it makes
people feel good in a great way if you approach it from the right
angle.

My own tactic is to play 'dumb blonde' who knows just enough if they
havent been here before (sadly they catch on pretty quick now) and
make them happy to show off the fine details of their work while I
smile and go 'wow'. It works at the start and is harmless until they
figure out the 'petite lady they were talking to flipped houses from
age 5 with her Mom for a living'. After they figure it out, they just
laugh and ask me if I have any tips which depending on the item, I
may have.

PS: Just so it makes sense, I have medical issues so have to
contract out things I know how to do, but sadly no longer can.






Homeowners that have to stand over me like I can't be trusted is my
biggest turn off...Even more so if they try to tell me how to do it or
question every move I make...I have been doing drywall for nearly 30
years and never stolen anything or ripped anyone off and don't need
somebody babysitting me and offering how to tips from some stupid DYI
show...I just won't do any more work for them...I say I'm
"busy"...Same for showing up with a crew and delivery truck with
materials and told they aren't ready for me after calling and telling
me it's ready to go and get ****ed when I charge extra for it...Never
again...I'm "busy"...


Well sometimes they just want to learn what they can. Sometimes the Q's
are a result of an opportunity to learn something from someone who knows
what they are doing. Yea, one considers it being watched and in reality
they are being complimented as a souce of reliable information.

Yea, I know the PITA's too. The DIY show parrots, the "Well we used to do
it yadda yadda", the "I think you should yak yak". the "My uncle would do
it blah blah.

I rebuild severely trashed foreclosed homes but I don't do HVAC. I have a
guy I really trust and visa-versa. When he works on a system I stick with
him like glue and I ask questions. I have a reasonable knowledge of
physics, math, chemistry, electronics and electrical. He knows that by
the things I ask (not question) and is glad to offer up words. In one
house where the air handler was in the attic and it was July on the
North/South Carolina border and 98 at noon, I stuck with him up there in
the attic. When he fired up the mapp gas on top of that he looked at me
and snickered.

Sounds like you place value on your time, and
skills. I can understand that.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"benick" wrote in message
. ..

Homeowners that have to stand over me like I can't
be trusted is my biggest
turn off...Even more so if they try to tell me how
to do it or question
every move I make...I have been doing drywall for
nearly 30 years and never
stolen anything or ripped anyone off and don't
need somebody babysitting me
and offering how to tips from some stupid DYI
show...I just won't do any
more work for them...I say I'm "busy"...Same for
showing up with a crew and
delivery truck with materials and told they aren't
ready for me after
calling and telling me it's ready to go and get
****ed when I charge extra
for it...Never again...I'm "busy"...

I can believe that.
Ain't it awful?
Gonna take care of yourself.
Pay your bills honestly.


--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"benick" wrote in message
...

DITTO...Same for me....

Fornicate: To have sex with someone other than
one's spouse.

(You and your spouse can have as much whoopee as
you want. But, only with your spouse.)

I don't think you "get it" at all.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"Bob F" wrote in message
...
Stormin Mormon wrote:
Better off with a good Mormon. We neither drink,
nor fornicate.


That's not the way I heard it. Where do all those
babies come from?

Oh! I get it. The GOOD Mormans don't fornicate.

"Red Green" wrote in message
...
"benick" wrote in
:

"cshenk" wrote in message
...
"N8N" wrote

seriously, I have been putting off getting a heat pump for my garage
not because of money but because the contractor that put the A/C in
my house has shown a decided disinterest in quoting any more work
for me. Not sure what I did to **** him off, I did get three quotes
for

Smile, Nate, I can't tell either but there are several possibles.
One, the job is now too small and you live far eough away that it
isnt cost effective foir him.

Lets spec that out. If driving time to your location is 1 hour, he
has to pay the worker 1 hour wages each way.. It's not applicable in
my situation as they are 5-10 mins away, but may be in yours.
'Labor' costs go way up if the person pretty much has to spend all
day to get to and from your location.

Second, he may be so good that he's flooded with work. 1 hour at
your place for 100$ profit means he can't fit in that 7,000$ profit
job he has in the wings. My fencing guy from before now works with
clients who go 'oh it's that cheap?' at 10,000 for the same job I am
having done and he spec'ed for 3,500$ in 2007. He's good dont get me
wrong and I'm happy for him but he's booked solid. He's now got the
upperscale folks and I am happy for him.

Third, you *might* have hung over his head a bit too much. I've seen
folks advise 'watch them all the time' but in reality, it's pretty
irritating to have someone peering over your shoulder. Think about
when you are at work and if you want that? If the first impression
you give the worker is that you trust them to do well by you, and
they will. They also take reall well to comments like: 'I know some
things but little of this so do you mind if I learn a little about
your trade?'. Hehe I might actually *know* their trade but it makes
people feel good in a great way if you approach it from the right
angle.

My own tactic is to play 'dumb blonde' who knows just enough if they
havent been here before (sadly they catch on pretty quick now) and
make them happy to show off the fine details of their work while I
smile and go 'wow'. It works at the start and is harmless until they
figure out the 'petite lady they were talking to flipped houses from
age 5 with her Mom for a living'. After they figure it out, they just
laugh and ask me if I have any tips which depending on the item, I
may have.

PS: Just so it makes sense, I have medical issues so have to
contract out things I know how to do, but sadly no longer can.






Homeowners that have to stand over me like I can't be trusted is my
biggest turn off...Even more so if they try to tell me how to do it or
question every move I make...I have been doing drywall for nearly 30
years and never stolen anything or ripped anyone off and don't need
somebody babysitting me and offering how to tips from some stupid DYI
show...I just won't do any more work for them...I say I'm
"busy"...Same for showing up with a crew and delivery truck with
materials and told they aren't ready for me after calling and telling
me it's ready to go and get ****ed when I charge extra for it...Never
again...I'm "busy"...


Well sometimes they just want to learn what they can. Sometimes the Q's
are a result of an opportunity to learn something from someone who knows
what they are doing. Yea, one considers it being watched and in reality
they are being complimented as a souce of reliable information.

Yea, I know the PITA's too. The DIY show parrots, the "Well we used to do
it yadda yadda", the "I think you should yak yak". the "My uncle would do
it blah blah.

I rebuild severely trashed foreclosed homes but I don't do HVAC. I have a
guy I really trust and visa-versa. When he works on a system I stick with
him like glue and I ask questions. I have a reasonable knowledge of
physics, math, chemistry, electronics and electrical. He knows that by
the things I ask (not question) and is glad to offer up words. In one
house where the air handler was in the attic and it was July on the
North/South Carolina border and 98 at noon, I stuck with him up there in
the attic. When he fired up the mapp gas on top of that he looked at me
and snickered.


Maybe they are trying to learn a few tricks but when you're working on
stilts or staging it can become a real distraction and dangerous especially
if it's a one or 2 room job and you're using setting type compound...I have
no time to chat if you know what I mean...Hanging around for a bit is one
thing but all day is quite different....When they bring in a chair and flop
down I know it's gonna be a LONG day and more than likely the LAST time I do
work for them...LOL...

"Stormin Mormon" wrote in news:hmkkg0
:

Fornicate: To have sex with someone other than
one's spouse.

(You and your spouse can have as much whoopee as
you want. But, only with your spouse.)

I don't think you "get it" at all.



All I can say is there weren't many mormons at the '69 Woodstock. Everybody
was f'n and f'd up.

Stormin Mormon wrote:
Better off with a good Mormon. We neither drink,
nor fornicate.


Oh yea, reproduction by cloning. Explains a lot.
ROTFLMAO

TDD

cshenk wrote:
"The Daring Dufas" wrote

That's something a lot of folks don't understand. The reason I work
for myself is because I don'[t have to put up with assholes. I fire
at least 2 customers a year. The amount of the bill or the size of
the discount is directly proportional to the attitude of the customer!
Nasty people can't understand why I'm suddenly not available anymore.
Want to see my vanishing act, say the magic words "I ain't gonna pay"
in any context.

LOL! I'm with ya. I know various contractors quitely have a traded
'black ball list' and with suprise, find they have a 'golden ball' one
as well for that rare client that is a joy to work with. We are on that
second list.

Grin, I have some work due soon. Refencing (wood 6ftx8ft dogear
panels). One of the fellows who's worked here before is now on his own
and severely cash strapped. We got all the materials (20 panels, need
only 5 new posts but got 6, 4 bags of the right cement and so on,
delivered yesterday). He got stiffed by some clients and his ability to
get the materials is now in the basement while Lowes gives me 10% off
for being retired military. So, we got'em. He's pulling permits and
such tomorrow and has his own health insurance etc still. He's put the
word out he needs 1 buddy to help (medical issues prevent us from being
able to handle such weights now though 10 years ago we'd have done this
ourselves). Apparently he's got 7 guys who want the job, 5 of which
have worked here before and quietly asked him if I'd be fixing (insert
recipe) those days?

Snicker. He's laughing and so am I. It's hilarious but he's narrowed
to 3 of them and is debating which one based on who asked for the food
he wants the most. Pay is simple. Total job expected to take a little
less than 2 days (estimated 16 hours for work time) and 300$ a day
(37.5$ an hour) per person. His request was 150$ a day per person.
*We* upped it to 300$ a day for up to 2 workers (if they want a 3rd,
they take it out of hide). If it takes longer, it won't be by much and
they sorta 'eat it' but we are all pretty sure it's actually going to
take less time (my end of the fees are set so if they finish faster, the
hour rate obviously goes up). True estimate is it will take 2 guys
about 8-10 hours due to the specifics here. (It's pretty much just
manhandle panels over then nail to existing posts for the majority of it).

Each day I will make fresh bread in the ABM so they get it hot and
dripping with butter right on the spot plus a backup loaf all sliced for
samwiches to take home (also pressd into service if the bread fails
which happens rarely but does). I'll also make rice (a keep warm rice
maker is a glory), some sort of crockpot thing (what depends on if they
want beans, chicken stew, or southern BBQ pulled pork), and 2-3 veggies
(blanched whole fresh green beans with sesame oil, steamed Bok choy with
****take mushrooms and miso dressing, or whatever they know I make and
they like if I can find it in season). Basically if you work here,
expect to take time outs to stuff yourself whilst I whift little food
items under your nose. Yeah, I even take requests and suit special diets.

Summary: If there's a good rate out there, I'm apt to get it. I'm apt
to be offered the lower rate right away, know it, and don't dicker. If
you think the 300$ a day per person is high for the job we spec'ed out,
the job was spec'ed in 2007 by 3 contractors and they wanted over 3,000$
labor for it. We were 'unknowns then' and it's the average rate for the
area.

Grin, as I typo'd to you all, he emailed. He's now got a fellow with a
truck who for 50$ flat rate will handle all haul away. Cool! He's
added a saucy fun request for a few slices of rye bread to go with some
havarti. I added a saucy reply to ask if he wants a mustard rye (goes
well with Havarti) or a straight one and a yes to the extra fee. He's
also selected 2 co-workers (all with insurance, my end the same price)
and rotiserrie chicken, green beans with sesame oil, carrot cream soup,
and whatever else I feel like adding. Hehe part of the deal is a good
feedbag. The other part is he comes over and sets the new posts before
hand so ready when the team arrives.



There are certain people who are charged nothing for something simple.
Like the old frail mother of a late friend of mine. People may find it
hard to believe just how much pro bono work your average service company
may do. Me and my friends will often help out folks who are on a fixed
or limited income. You can call it Karma or the pass it on theory and
you may have to threaten to smack them if they try to give you money.
No government agency or preacher has to tell us to do it, we just do it.

TDD