just an update... bought a shiny new GE fridge a couple months back.
have had it plugged into a kill-a-watt just to see if it really lived up
to the energy-saving hype. It's been running for about 400 hours since
the last power outage, and average rate of energy consumption works out
to about 636 kWh/year. energyguide says 458, but I've had the "energy
saver" turned off because I was getting condensation on the door seals
(it's pretty darn humid here, even with the AC and a dehumidifier in the
basement.)

Old smaller fridge was over 1000 kWh/year according to the KAW so good
deal. Now at that rate for the fridge to pay for itself it'll take...
lessee...

hmm, this is kinda like cars, isn't it?

But it's quiet, keeps my beer cold, and makes the girlie happy, none of
which the old fridge was doing towards the end...

nate

--
replace "roosters" with "cox" to reply.
http://members.cox.net/njnagel

"Nate Nagel" wrote in message
...
just an update... bought a shiny new GE fridge a couple months back.
have had it plugged into a kill-a-watt just to see if it really lived up
to the energy-saving hype. It's been running for about 400 hours since
the last power outage, and average rate of energy consumption works out
to about 636 kWh/year. energyguide says 458, but I've had the "energy
saver" turned off because I was getting condensation on the door seals
(it's pretty darn humid here, even with the AC and a dehumidifier in the
basement.)

Old smaller fridge was over 1000 kWh/year according to the KAW so good
deal. Now at that rate for the fridge to pay for itself it'll take...
lessee...

If it's anything like my old GE it just might last long enough...


hmm, this is kinda like cars, isn't it?

If a car lasts long enough it will pay for itself? I've been doing it wrong
then. Mine always want me to keep paying.


But it's quiet, keeps my beer cold, and makes the girlie happy, none of
which the old fridge was doing towards the end...

nate

--
replace "roosters" with "cox" to reply.
http://members.cox.net/njnagel

On Aug 7, 5:33 pm, Nate Nagel wrote:
just an update... bought a shiny new GE fridge a couple months back.
have had it plugged into a kill-a-watt just to see if it really lived up
to the energy-saving hype. It's been running for about 400 hours since
the last power outage, and average rate of energy consumption works out
to about 636 kWh/year. energyguide says 458, but I've had the "energy
saver" turned off because I was getting condensation on the door seals
(it's pretty darn humid here, even with the AC and a dehumidifier in the
basement.)

Old smaller fridge was over 1000 kWh/year according to the KAW so good
deal. Now at that rate for the fridge to pay for itself it'll take...
lessee...

hmm, this is kinda like cars, isn't it?

But it's quiet, keeps my beer cold, and makes the girlie happy, none of
which the old fridge was doing towards the end...

nate

--
replace "roosters" with "cox" to reply.http://members.cox.net/njnagel

great news, tnx !

Nate Nagel wrote:
just an update... bought a shiny new GE fridge a couple months back.
have had it plugged into a kill-a-watt just to see if it really lived up
to the energy-saving hype. It's been running for about 400 hours since
the last power outage, and average rate of energy consumption works out
to about 636 kWh/year. energyguide says 458, but I've had the "energy
saver" turned off because I was getting condensation on the door seals
(it's pretty darn humid here, even with the AC and a dehumidifier in the
basement.)

Old smaller fridge was over 1000 kWh/year according to the KAW so good
deal. Now at that rate for the fridge to pay for itself it'll take...
lessee...

hmm, this is kinda like cars, isn't it?

But it's quiet, keeps my beer cold, and makes the girlie happy, none of
which the old fridge was doing towards the end...

nate

Hi,
Good to hear that. Hope it'll last long w/o problems.
My fridge is running since '94 when we moved into this place we had
custom built. Not a single problem(knock on the wood) yet. Mean while
matching GE dishwasher needed a new pump ass'y, self-clean range/oven
needed two new burner and temp control 'stat. MW was dead long ago, it
is 2nd one(not GE this time, Panasonic one)

wrote:
On Fri, 07 Aug 2009 18:33:42 -0400, Nate Nagel
wrote:

just an update... bought a shiny new GE fridge a couple months back.
have had it plugged into a kill-a-watt just to see if it really lived up
to the energy-saving hype. It's been running for about 400 hours since
the last power outage, and average rate of energy consumption works out
to about 636 kWh/year. energyguide says 458, but I've had the "energy
saver" turned off because I was getting condensation on the door seals
(it's pretty darn humid here, even with the AC and a dehumidifier in the
basement.)

Old smaller fridge was over 1000 kWh/year according to the KAW so good
deal. Now at that rate for the fridge to pay for itself it'll take...
lessee...

hmm, this is kinda like cars, isn't it?

But it's quiet, keeps my beer cold, and makes the girlie happy, none of
which the old fridge was doing towards the end...

nate


Sounds right. My Whirlpool side by side clocks in at 762kwh a year
and it is outside in Florida. Not on the front porch, that is Georgia,
it is in the tiki bar by the pool.
An interesting thing is the light bulbs draw as much power as the
compressor, another reason to keep the door closed. Having that door
switch go bad would certainly spike your bill.

I always thought that was silly to put a 40W light bulb in a fridge, but
the shiny new one uses LEDs. Cool, in more ways than one

nate

--
replace "roosters" with "cox" to reply.
http://members.cox.net/njnagel

Nate Nagel wrote in
:

just an update... bought a shiny new GE fridge a couple months back.
have had it plugged into a kill-a-watt just to see if it really lived
up to the energy-saving hype. It's been running for about 400 hours
since the last power outage, and average rate of energy consumption
works out to about 636 kWh/year. energyguide says 458, but I've had
the "energy saver" turned off because I was getting condensation on
the door seals (it's pretty darn humid here, even with the AC and a
dehumidifier in the basement.)

Old smaller fridge was over 1000 kWh/year according to the KAW so good
deal. Now at that rate for the fridge to pay for itself it'll take...
lessee...

hmm, this is kinda like cars, isn't it?

But it's quiet, keeps my beer cold, and makes the girlie happy, none
of which the old fridge was doing towards the end...

nate


Don't know if it's still true or true with yours but a repairman one
told me the energy saver is just a low wattage heater that runs around
the door seal or the like. IIRC he said it was like 7-10 watts.

Making a BIG (and most likely incorrect) assumption that your difference
is totally due to the energy saver being off you have a (636-458) =
178kW difference. 178k/365/24 comes out to about a 20w door heater.
Seems like a lot. That's why I say most likely incorrect.

What the point? I dunno. Still got a much better frig especially if your
in an area where electric rates are high.

On Aug 7, 5:33*pm, Nate Nagel wrote:
just an update... bought a shiny new GE fridge a couple months back.
have had it plugged into a kill-a-watt just to see if it really lived up
to the energy-saving hype. *It's been running for about 400 hours since
the last power outage, and average rate of energy consumption works out
to about 636 kWh/year. *energyguide says 458, but I've had the "energy
saver" turned off because I was getting condensation on the door seals
(it's pretty darn humid here, even with the AC and a dehumidifier in the
basement.)

Old smaller fridge was over 1000 kWh/year according to the KAW so good
deal. *Now at that rate for the fridge to pay for itself it'll take...
lessee...

hmm, this is kinda like cars, isn't it?

But it's quiet, keeps my beer cold, and makes the girlie happy, none of
which the old fridge was doing towards the end...

nate

--
replace "roosters" with "cox" to reply.http://members.cox.net/njnagel

My Kenmore met the label with a kaw when I kept temp not to low and
opened and closed the door quickly, it was about 4.50 a month vs my
old 15$ a month for my old frige

In article ,
Nate Nagel wrote:

just an update... bought a shiny new GE fridge a couple months back.
have had it plugged into a kill-a-watt just to see if it really lived up
to the energy-saving hype. It's been running for about 400 hours since
the last power outage, and average rate of energy consumption works out
to about 636 kWh/year. energyguide says 458, but I've had the "energy
saver" turned off because I was getting condensation on the door seals
(it's pretty darn humid here, even with the AC and a dehumidifier in the
basement.)

Old smaller fridge was over 1000 kWh/year according to the KAW so good
deal. Now at that rate for the fridge to pay for itself it'll take...
lessee...

hmm, this is kinda like cars, isn't it?

But it's quiet, keeps my beer cold, and makes the girlie happy, none of
which the old fridge was doing towards the end...

nate

"Energy saver switch?"

Step 1. Make the walls of a refrigerator too thin.

Advantage: increase capacity without increasing footprint.

Disadvantage: insufficient insulation to keep the warm room air out and
the cold air in.

Step 2. Notice that the disadvantage above has a most unpleasant
corollary: In humid conditions, the outside of the fridge sweats. It's
too cool, due to lack of insulation, so condensation forms.

Step 3. Engineering pow-wow leads to the installation of a heating coil
inside the outer wall of the fridge, to keep the outer wall warm enough
to prevent condensation.

Step 4. Choose to disregard that the heating coil compounds the problem
of insufficient insulation, in that it makes the fridge even less energy
efficient; in two ways. Uses power to run the heating coil, and forces
the fridge to run more to counteract the heat from the coil.

Step 5. Supply a switch to turn the heating coil off, during periods of
low humidity.

Step 6. And this is really a tribute to marketing, here. Claim that the
under-insulated fridge, complete with heating coil, is an energy-saving
model.

Step 7. Label the switch "Energy Saver." In the OFF position, the
heater is on.

On Aug 7, 8:33*pm, Nate Nagel wrote:
just an update... bought a shiny new GE fridge a couple months back.
have had it plugged into a kill-a-watt just to see if it really lived up
to the energy-saving hype. *It's been running for about 400 hours since
the last power outage, and average rate of energy consumption works out
to about 636 kWh/year. *energyguide says 458, but I've had the "energy
saver" turned off because I was getting condensation on the door seals
(it's pretty darn humid here, even with the AC and a dehumidifier in the
basement.)

Old smaller fridge was over 1000 kWh/year according to the KAW so good
deal. *Now at that rate for the fridge to pay for itself it'll take...
lessee...

hmm, this is kinda like cars, isn't it?

But it's quiet, keeps my beer cold, and makes the girlie happy, none of
which the old fridge was doing towards the end...

nate

--
replace "roosters" with "cox" to reply.http://members.cox.net/njnagel

Saving say 1100 - 636 = 464 less k.watts per year.
At say 10 cents per kwhr. = $46.40 per year.
That's something of the order of an eight to ten year simple payback.
Of course as the OP said, the 'old' fridge wasn't doing the job and
had to be replaced anyway.

By contrast in a climate like ours (Easternmost Canada), such
previously wasted electric energy won't be available to heat the house
during the ten months or so of the year heating is needed here! Same
argument we use for not using CFLs! Heating needed in the evenings or
at night when light tend to be on anyway.

In fact yesterday it was so humid here that we turned on the bathroom
heat (actually six 40 watt incandescent light bulbs) above the
bathroom vanity mirror) in order to warm up the room to combat the
dampness. We do have a portable dehumidifier current on loan to a
relative to more quickly dry out a plaster repair job in his bathroom!

On Aug 8, 1:59*pm, Smitty Two wrote:
In article ,
*Nate Nagel wrote:





just an update... bought a shiny new GE fridge a couple months back.
have had it plugged into a kill-a-watt just to see if it really lived up
to the energy-saving hype. *It's been running for about 400 hours since
the last power outage, and average rate of energy consumption works out
to about 636 kWh/year. *energyguide says 458, but I've had the "energy
saver" turned off because I was getting condensation on the door seals
(it's pretty darn humid here, even with the AC and a dehumidifier in the
basement.)

Old smaller fridge was over 1000 kWh/year according to the KAW so good
deal. *Now at that rate for the fridge to pay for itself it'll take....
lessee...

hmm, this is kinda like cars, isn't it?

But it's quiet, keeps my beer cold, and makes the girlie happy, none of
which the old fridge was doing towards the end...

nate

"Energy saver switch?"

Step 1. *Make the walls of a refrigerator too thin.

Advantage: increase capacity without increasing footprint.

Disadvantage: insufficient insulation to keep the warm room air out and
the cold air in.

Step 2. *Notice that the disadvantage above has a most unpleasant
corollary: In humid conditions, the outside of the fridge sweats. It's
too cool, due to lack of insulation, so condensation forms.

Step 3. *Engineering pow-wow leads to the installation of a heating coil
inside the outer wall of the fridge, to keep the outer wall warm enough
to prevent condensation.

Step 4. *Choose to disregard that the heating coil compounds the problem
of insufficient insulation, in that it makes the fridge even less energy
efficient; in two ways. Uses power to run the heating coil, and forces
the fridge to run more to counteract the heat from the coil.

Step 5. *Supply a switch to turn the heating coil off, during periods of
low humidity.

Step 6. *And this is really a tribute to marketing, here. Claim that the
under-insulated fridge, complete with heating coil, is an energy-saving
model.

Step 7. *Label the switch "Energy Saver." In the OFF position, the
heater is on.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Interesting. Thinking back a few years when wondering if the boxy part
of a fridge could be built into the outer wall of the kitchen,
projecting if not outside at least into a cool area, such as the
garage! Advantages would be more space in kitchen area and possibly
more room around the fridge door opening! Disadvantages seemed to be
an inability to easily seal around the front edge of the fridge to
prevent cold outside air coming in! Although it should be possible to
suitability modify one?

Part of the idea came from seeing a TV mounted on top of fridge, on a
swivel base, so that it could be turned to face the other way into a
living room; through a hole that had been cut in the wall!. Only thing
was that the typically then very large and heavy wooden TV case (it
was a 21 inch tube mounted in a cubical box some 24 inches square,
IIRC) was very hard to do TV repair work on at that height standing on
a kitchen chair!

On Aug 8, 1:13*pm, stan wrote:
On Aug 7, 8:33*pm, Nate Nagel wrote:





just an update... bought a shiny new GE fridge a couple months back.
have had it plugged into a kill-a-watt just to see if it really lived up
to the energy-saving hype. *It's been running for about 400 hours since
the last power outage, and average rate of energy consumption works out
to about 636 kWh/year. *energyguide says 458, but I've had the "energy
saver" turned off because I was getting condensation on the door seals
(it's pretty darn humid here, even with the AC and a dehumidifier in the
basement.)

Old smaller fridge was over 1000 kWh/year according to the KAW so good
deal. *Now at that rate for the fridge to pay for itself it'll take....
lessee...

hmm, this is kinda like cars, isn't it?

But it's quiet, keeps my beer cold, and makes the girlie happy, none of
which the old fridge was doing towards the end...

nate

--
replace "roosters" with "cox" to reply.http://members.cox.net/njnagel

Saving say 1100 - 636 = 464 less k.watts per year.
At say 10 cents per kwhr. = $46.40 per year.
That's something of the order of an eight to ten year simple payback.
Of course as the OP said, the 'old' fridge wasn't doing the job and
had to be replaced anyway.

If only! since we were shopping for a new fridge, and we own this
house, SWMBO wanted what she wanted, which was a bottom freezer,
french door model. To add insult to injury, we had to get a "counter
depth" model (why do they make you pay more for a smaller fridge?) and
still had to remove a cabinet anyway, so by the time the fridge has
paid for its purchase price, the paint, plaster, copper tubing etc.
and my labor, it'll be long gone.

But it does look nice. And it's quiet. Love the quiet. plus having
built in water dispenser and ice maker means saving even more space
because the Brita pitcher doesn't have to live in the fridge, and I
don't keep my water bottles (for riding bike) frozen in the freezer
anymore.

Sometimes you just gotta pay more to get what you want; like the
fridge, or the rug in the living room (I'm proud of that one though,
only paid $900 on Craigslist for a rug that I'm sure would appraise
over $5K. sounds silly but I'm a barefoot kinda guy, and walking on a
nice rug, especially one that looks nice too, is something that just
makes you feel glad you paid the $$$.)


By contrast in a climate like ours (Easternmost Canada), such
previously wasted electric energy won't be available to heat the house
during the ten months or so of the year heating is needed here! Same
argument we use for not using CFLs! Heating needed in the evenings or
at night when light tend to be on anyway.

In fact yesterday it was so humid here that we turned on the bathroom
heat (actually six 40 watt incandescent light bulbs) above the
bathroom vanity mirror) in order to warm up the room to combat the
dampness. We do have a portable dehumidifier current on loan to a
relative to more quickly dry out a plaster repair job in his bathroom!

heh. I think we heat maybe 3 mos. out of the year if that.

House didn't have A/C when we moved in, it was OK for the first
summer, but days like today I'm glad we have it. Heard it was
supposed to get close to 100 degrees.

nate

On Aug 8, 12:34*am, Red Green wrote:
Nate Nagel wrote :





just an update... bought a shiny new GE fridge a couple months back.
have had it plugged into a kill-a-watt just to see if it really lived
up to the energy-saving hype. *It's been running for about 400 hours
since the last power outage, and average rate of energy consumption
works out to about 636 kWh/year. *energyguide says 458, but I've had
the "energy saver" turned off because I was getting condensation on
the door seals (it's pretty darn humid here, even with the AC and a
dehumidifier in the basement.)

Old smaller fridge was over 1000 kWh/year according to the KAW so good
deal. *Now at that rate for the fridge to pay for itself it'll take....
lessee...

hmm, this is kinda like cars, isn't it?

But it's quiet, keeps my beer cold, and makes the girlie happy, none
of which the old fridge was doing towards the end...

nate

Don't know if it's still true or true with yours but a repairman one
told me the energy saver is just a low wattage heater that runs around
the door seal or the like. IIRC he said it was like 7-10 watts.

that's what the booklet says, although it didn't specify wattage.


Making a BIG (and most likely incorrect) assumption that your difference
is totally due to the energy saver being off you have a (636-458) =
178kW *difference. 178k/365/24 comes out to about a 20w door heater.
Seems like a lot. That's why I say most likely incorrect.

What the point? I dunno. Still got a much better frig especially if your
in an area where electric rates are high.

ISTR testing it on and off and with the fridge completely off (doors
closed, compressor and fan both shut off) current draw was almost nil
with the energy saver on (as it should be, all it's running at that
point is the electronics for the controls and display) and about 1A
with the energy saver off. So that's more like 120W but I don't
believe that it has a 100% duty cycle.

Maybe if I check it again in the winter I'll find that it is actually
even more efficient than the label says? who knows.

nate

Smitty Two wrote in
news
In article ,
Nate Nagel wrote:

just an update... bought a shiny new GE fridge a couple months back.
have had it plugged into a kill-a-watt just to see if it really lived
up to the energy-saving hype. It's been running for about 400 hours
since the last power outage, and average rate of energy consumption
works out to about 636 kWh/year. energyguide says 458, but I've had
the "energy saver" turned off because I was getting condensation on
the door seals (it's pretty darn humid here, even with the AC and a
dehumidifier in the basement.)

Old smaller fridge was over 1000 kWh/year according to the KAW so
good deal. Now at that rate for the fridge to pay for itself it'll
take... lessee...

hmm, this is kinda like cars, isn't it?

But it's quiet, keeps my beer cold, and makes the girlie happy, none
of which the old fridge was doing towards the end...

nate

"Energy saver switch?"

Step 1. Make the walls of a refrigerator too thin.

Advantage: increase capacity without increasing footprint.

Disadvantage: insufficient insulation to keep the warm room air out
and the cold air in.

Step 2. Notice that the disadvantage above has a most unpleasant
corollary: In humid conditions, the outside of the fridge sweats. It's
too cool, due to lack of insulation, so condensation forms.

Step 3. Engineering pow-wow leads to the installation of a heating
coil inside the outer wall of the fridge, to keep the outer wall warm
enough to prevent condensation.

Step 4. Choose to disregard that the heating coil compounds the
problem of insufficient insulation, in that it makes the fridge even
less energy efficient; in two ways. Uses power to run the heating
coil, and forces the fridge to run more to counteract the heat from
the coil.

Step 5. Supply a switch to turn the heating coil off, during periods
of low humidity.

Step 6. And this is really a tribute to marketing, here. Claim that
the under-insulated fridge, complete with heating coil, is an
energy-saving model.

Step 7. Label the switch "Energy Saver." In the OFF position, the
heater is on.


I don't know why they couldn't use some of the compressor's waste heat to
keep the door seals warm and dry.
Like a heat pipe,something sealed and passive,no maintenance.

--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
kua.net

N8N wrote:
On Aug 8, 1:13 pm, stan wrote:
On Aug 7, 8:33 pm, Nate Nagel wrote:






A snip

If only! since we were shopping for a new fridge, and we own this
house, SWMBO wanted what she wanted, which was a bottom freezer,
french door model. To add insult to injury, we had to get a "counter
depth" model (why do they make you pay more for a smaller fridge?) and
still had to remove a cabinet anyway, so by the time the fridge has
paid for its purchase price, the paint, plaster, copper tubing etc.
and my labor, it'll be long gone.

But it does look nice. And it's quiet. Love the quiet. plus having
built in water dispenser and ice maker means saving even more space
because the Brita pitcher doesn't have to live in the fridge, and I
don't keep my water bottles (for riding bike) frozen in the freezer
anymore.


I like quiet. Our old fridge would drive me mad as I was listening to the TV
in a room a mile away - well no, a few feet away but through two solid
walls, not studding and plaster.

Sometimes you just gotta pay more to get what you want; like the
fridge, or the rug in the living room (I'm proud of that one though,
only paid $900 on Craigslist for a rug that I'm sure would appraise
over $5K. sounds silly but I'm a barefoot kinda guy, and walking on a
nice rug, especially one that looks nice too, is something that just
makes you feel glad you paid the $$$.)

Your views and I welcome our freedom. I hate folk walking barefoot. When in
someone else's house, I feel happy to remove my shoes but no more. It is
strange that many cultures seem to have different makes on this.

Another snip

"Nate Nagel" wrote in message
...
just an update... bought a shiny new GE fridge a couple months back.
have had it plugged into a kill-a-watt just to see if it really lived up
to the energy-saving hype. It's been running for about 400 hours since
the last power outage, and average rate of energy consumption works out
to about 636 kWh/year. energyguide says 458, but I've had the "energy
saver" turned off because I was getting condensation on the door seals
(it's pretty darn humid here, even with the AC and a dehumidifier in the
basement.)

But this is also August. In spring winter and fall you probably will do a
little better as the room will be cooler so the fridge will suck up less
room heat.

Another thing you can do is to place jugs of water in the fridge and the
freezer if you have space. This displaces the cold air that falls out every
time you open the door so the compressor doesn't have to work so hard.

--
Roger Shoaf
If you are not part of the solution, you are not dissolved in the solvent.

Another thing you can do is to place jugs of water in the fridge and the
freezer if you have space. This displaces the cold air that falls out
every
time you open the door so the compressor doesn't have to work so hard.

I doubt that if your "did the math" you would find it hard to justify the
water jugs on the basis of energy conservation.

One "fill" of air doen't actually represent much heat energy (or lack there
of).

But when you do open the door, the cold air is almost immediately replaced
by warm room air. That warm air starts to heat everything in the
compartment: both your stored food AND your water jugs. The most "stuff"
you have in the ice box, the most heat is transferred from the air to the
"stuff."

Moreover, the more 'stuff' (including water jugs) you have, the longer it
will take to store or retrieve the food and, thus, the more time it will
take the compressor to restore the proper temperature.

If you live in a area where the power goes off often, it's often a good idea
to keep some water jugs in the freezer. The drill starts when the fresh
food compartment temp gets above 40F or so. That's when you take your
frozen water jugs from the freezer and put them in the fresh food
compartment. By that time, your freezer compartment is around freezing
and, in fact, your frozen food should either be consumed or disposed of.
Most frozen foods should be kept below 20F. At even 30F, because of
dissolved solids, the food is starting to thaw.