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Old October 8th 08, 03:36 PM posted to alt.home.repair
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Default 4-wire feeder line vs. 3-wire feeder line

I have a question that I can't seem to find an answer to.

The task is adding a new sub-panel in an outbuilding. I understand that
new sub-panels now require a 4-wire feeder line, however this feeder will
be coming from the service disconnect. Specifically, it will be coming
from a small lug box on the side of the service disconnect; because this
is how the existing outbuildings are being fed.

So, my quesiton is: Is the fourth wire required in this situation, coming
off the disconnect. If it is required, what is it connected to??

Thanks in advance for any advice!
scrapwood.

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Old October 8th 08, 06:57 PM posted to alt.home.repair
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Default 4-wire feeder line vs. 3-wire feeder line

On Oct 8, 9:36*am, (scrapwood)
wrote:
I have a question that I can't seem to find an answer to.

The task is adding a new sub-panel in an outbuilding. *I understand that
new sub-panels now require a 4-wire feeder line, ...


Run four. It never hurts to upgrade and it is always far more
bother and expense to change it later when the need, that you thought
would never happen, happens.

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Old October 8th 08, 07:21 PM posted to alt.home.repair
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Default 4-wire feeder line vs. 3-wire feeder line


"scrapwood" wrote in message
...
I have a question that I can't seem to find an answer to.

The task is adding a new sub-panel in an outbuilding. I understand that
new sub-panels now require a 4-wire feeder line, however this feeder will
be coming from the service disconnect. Specifically, it will be coming
from a small lug box on the side of the service disconnect; because this
is how the existing outbuildings are being fed.

So, my quesiton is: Is the fourth wire required in this situation, coming
off the disconnect. If it is required, what is it connected to??

Thanks in advance for any advice!
scrapwood.

-----------------------------------



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##-----------------------------------------------##


I'm not completely sure I understand your situation, however, if this feeder
to the outbuilding is connected to the "load" side of the service
disconnect, it will require four wires for a 120/240 volt feeder. Two hot
legs, one neutral, and one ground. You may have to drive additional ground
rods at the outbuilding as well


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Old October 8th 08, 10:51 PM posted to alt.home.repair
TKM TKM is offline
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Default 4-wire feeder line vs. 3-wire feeder line


"RBM" wrote in message
...

"scrapwood" wrote in message
...
I have a question that I can't seem to find an answer to.

The task is adding a new sub-panel in an outbuilding. I understand that
new sub-panels now require a 4-wire feeder line, however this feeder will
be coming from the service disconnect. Specifically, it will be coming
from a small lug box on the side of the service disconnect; because this
is how the existing outbuildings are being fed.

So, my quesiton is: Is the fourth wire required in this situation, coming
off the disconnect. If it is required, what is it connected to??

Thanks in advance for any advice!
scrapwood.

-----------------------------------



##-----------------------------------------------##
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Building Construction and Maintenance Forum
Web and RSS access to your favorite newsgroup -
alt.home.repair - 317306 messages and counting!
##-----------------------------------------------##


I'm not completely sure I understand your situation, however, if this
feeder to the outbuilding is connected to the "load" side of the service
disconnect, it will require four wires for a 120/240 volt feeder. Two hot
legs, one neutral, and one ground. You may have to drive additional ground
rods at the outbuilding as well


The ground line can be bare and is sometimes wrapped around the others to
make a sturdy cable.

But there's another possibility if you have heavy motor loads. What you
heard could apply to a 3-phase system and, specifically, a 3-phase "Y"
system which has 4 wires.

TKM


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Old October 9th 08, 12:01 AM posted to alt.home.repair
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Default 4-wire feeder line vs. 3-wire feeder line


"TKM" wrote in message
...

"RBM" wrote in message
...

"scrapwood" wrote in message
...
I have a question that I can't seem to find an answer to.

The task is adding a new sub-panel in an outbuilding. I understand that
new sub-panels now require a 4-wire feeder line, however this feeder
will
be coming from the service disconnect. Specifically, it will be coming
from a small lug box on the side of the service disconnect; because this
is how the existing outbuildings are being fed.

So, my quesiton is: Is the fourth wire required in this situation,
coming
off the disconnect. If it is required, what is it connected to??

Thanks in advance for any advice!
scrapwood.

-----------------------------------



##-----------------------------------------------##
Delivered via http://www.thestuccocompany.com/
Building Construction and Maintenance Forum
Web and RSS access to your favorite newsgroup -
alt.home.repair - 317306 messages and counting!
##-----------------------------------------------##


I'm not completely sure I understand your situation, however, if this
feeder to the outbuilding is connected to the "load" side of the service
disconnect, it will require four wires for a 120/240 volt feeder. Two hot
legs, one neutral, and one ground. You may have to drive additional
ground rods at the outbuilding as well


The ground line can be bare and is sometimes wrapped around the others to
make a sturdy cable.


That is not the ground. It is the neutral conductor of an "SEU" type cable


But there's another possibility if you have heavy motor loads. What you
heard could apply to a 3-phase system and, specifically, a 3-phase "Y"
system which has 4 wires.


Even if the OP had a 3 phase wye service, it would still require a fifth
conductor as it would require three hot legs, one neutral, and one ground

TKM





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Old October 9th 08, 01:29 AM posted to alt.home.repair
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Default 4-wire feeder line vs. 3-wire feeder line

On Oct 8, 6:01�pm, "RBM" wrote:
"TKM" wrote in message

...







"RBM" wrote in message
...


"scrapwood" wrote in message
.. .
I have a question that I can't seem to find an answer to.


The task is adding a new sub-panel in an outbuilding. �I understand that
new sub-panels now require a 4-wire feeder line, however this feeder
will
be coming from the service disconnect. �Specifically, it will be coming
from a small lug box on the side of the service disconnect; because this
is how the existing outbuildings are being fed.


So, my quesiton is: Is the fourth wire required in this situation,
coming
off the disconnect. �If it is required, what is it connected to??


Thanks in advance for any advice!
scrapwood.


-----------------------------------


##-----------------------------------------------##
Delivered via �http://www.thestuccocompany.com/
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Web and RSS access to your favorite newsgroup -
alt.home.repair - 317306 messages and counting!
##-----------------------------------------------##


I'm not completely sure I understand your situation, however, if this
feeder to the outbuilding is connected to the "load" side of the service
disconnect, it will require four wires for a 120/240 volt feeder. Two hot
legs, one neutral, and one ground. You may have to drive additional
ground rods at the outbuilding as well


The ground line can be bare and is sometimes wrapped around the others to
make a sturdy cable.


That is not the ground. It is the neutral conductor of an "SEU" type cable



But there's another possibility if you have heavy motor loads. �What you
heard could apply to a 3-phase system and, specifically, a 3-phase "Y"
system which has 4 wires.


Even if the OP had a 3 phase wye service, it would still require a fifth
conductor as it would require three hot legs, one neutral, and one ground





TKM- Hide quoted text -


- Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -


or run a empty conduit for a future use. cheap choice
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Old October 9th 08, 02:10 AM posted to alt.home.repair
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Default 4-wire feeder line vs. 3-wire feeder line


"TKM" wrote in message
...

"RBM" wrote in message
...

"scrapwood" wrote in message
...
I have a question that I can't seem to find an answer to.

The task is adding a new sub-panel in an outbuilding. I understand that
new sub-panels now require a 4-wire feeder line, however this feeder
will
be coming from the service disconnect. Specifically, it will be coming
from a small lug box on the side of the service disconnect; because this
is how the existing outbuildings are being fed.

So, my quesiton is: Is the fourth wire required in this situation,
coming
off the disconnect. If it is required, what is it connected to??

Thanks in advance for any advice!
scrapwood.

-----------------------------------



##-----------------------------------------------##
Delivered via http://www.thestuccocompany.com/
Building Construction and Maintenance Forum
Web and RSS access to your favorite newsgroup -
alt.home.repair - 317306 messages and counting!
##-----------------------------------------------##


I'm not completely sure I understand your situation, however, if this
feeder to the outbuilding is connected to the "load" side of the service
disconnect, it will require four wires for a 120/240 volt feeder. Two hot
legs, one neutral, and one ground. You may have to drive additional
ground rods at the outbuilding as well


The ground line can be bare and is sometimes wrapped around the others to
make a sturdy cable.

But there's another possibility if you have heavy motor loads. What you
heard could apply to a 3-phase system and, specifically, a 3-phase "Y"
system which has 4 wires.

TKM


So, what would a delta have? My house has 240V 3 Phase Delta service, four
wires come from the pole to the house. Three are standard single phase, two
hot, one common. The other is the so called "wild" leg. No ground. Ground is
bonded to the water line and tied to a ground rod just under the meter.

Al


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Old October 9th 08, 02:29 AM posted to alt.home.repair
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Default 4-wire feeder line vs. 3-wire feeder line


Big Al wrote:

"TKM" wrote in message
...

"RBM" wrote in message
...

"scrapwood" wrote in message
...
I have a question that I can't seem to find an answer to.

The task is adding a new sub-panel in an outbuilding. I understand that
new sub-panels now require a 4-wire feeder line, however this feeder
will
be coming from the service disconnect. Specifically, it will be coming
from a small lug box on the side of the service disconnect; because this
is how the existing outbuildings are being fed.

So, my quesiton is: Is the fourth wire required in this situation,
coming
off the disconnect. If it is required, what is it connected to??

Thanks in advance for any advice!
scrapwood.

-----------------------------------



##-----------------------------------------------##
Delivered via http://www.thestuccocompany.com/
Building Construction and Maintenance Forum
Web and RSS access to your favorite newsgroup -
alt.home.repair - 317306 messages and counting!
##-----------------------------------------------##


I'm not completely sure I understand your situation, however, if this
feeder to the outbuilding is connected to the "load" side of the service
disconnect, it will require four wires for a 120/240 volt feeder. Two hot
legs, one neutral, and one ground. You may have to drive additional
ground rods at the outbuilding as well


The ground line can be bare and is sometimes wrapped around the others to
make a sturdy cable.

But there's another possibility if you have heavy motor loads. What you
heard could apply to a 3-phase system and, specifically, a 3-phase "Y"
system which has 4 wires.

TKM


So, what would a delta have? My house has 240V 3 Phase Delta service, four
wires come from the pole to the house. Three are standard single phase, two
hot, one common. The other is the so called "wild" leg. No ground. Ground is
bonded to the water line and tied to a ground rod just under the meter.

Al


You'd still have 5 wires feeding a sub panel, your three hots (including
the "wild" one), your neutral a.k.a. your common, and the ground which
is bonded to your neutral at your service entrance. The key thing here
is we're talking about what is required to be feeding a sub panel, not
what is feeding from the utility to your service disconnecting means.
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Old October 9th 08, 03:21 AM posted to alt.home.repair
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Default 4-wire feeder line vs. 3-wire feeder line

scrapwood had written this in response to
http://www.thestuccocompany.com/main...ne-335437-.htm
:

Thanks for all the suggestion guys. After doing further research today,
and consulting a knowledgable electrician, I think I have my answer.

First, I have to change out the breaker box and put a load center there so
I can have three breakers. The two existing ones plus the new one. Run
3-wire with equipment ground to the new barn. Grounding rod at the
sub-panel in the barn. Apparently, grounding rod at the other end is not
required. . . unless of course the inspector says it is

Thanks for all the suggesitons guys. I sure do appreciate it!

scrapwood.
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