my 25 yr old house has a 220 outlet with a Red, Black,
and White wire at the 220 outet. Pulled out the old
stove and installing my new(er) replacement stove.
This stove has Red, Black, White and GREEN!..
at the new(er) stove end wire..want to marry the
3 wires from my box to the 4 wires of my new stove

what is normally done..??
flaco

On Mon 04 Aug 2008 04:01:24p, flaco told us...

my 25 yr old house has a 220 outlet with a Red, Black,
and White wire at the 220 outet. Pulled out the old
stove and installing my new(er) replacement stove.
This stove has Red, Black, White and GREEN!..
at the new(er) stove end wire..want to marry the
3 wires from my box to the 4 wires of my new stove

what is normally done..??
flaco


The simplest way is to connect the neutral + ground wires together at the
range and buy a new 3-wire cord to connect it to the wall outlet. The
other option is to run a new 4-wire circuit back to the braeker panel and
install a new 4-wire socket.

--
Wayne Boatwright
-------------------------------------------
Monday, 08(VIII)/04(IV)/08(MMVIII)
-------------------------------------------
-------------------------------------------
Where am I going, and why am I in this
handbasket?
-------------------------------------------

"flaco" wrote in message
...
my 25 yr old house has a 220 outlet with a Red, Black,
and White wire at the 220 outet. Pulled out the old
stove and installing my new(er) replacement stove.
This stove has Red, Black, White and GREEN!..
at the new(er) stove end wire..want to marry the
3 wires from my box to the 4 wires of my new stove

what is normally done..??
flaco


Change the cord on the new stove to a three wire cord. Inside the stove
electrical junction box there is usually a means to jumper the white and
green together. Connect the jumper so that the white and green inside of
the stove are together and connect the new cord to the terminal block

"flaco" wrote in message
...
my 25 yr old house has a 220 outlet with a Red, Black,
and White wire at the 220 outet. Pulled out the old
stove and installing my new(er) replacement stove.
This stove has Red, Black, White and GREEN!..
at the new(er) stove end wire..want to marry the
3 wires from my box to the 4 wires of my new stove

what is normally done..??
flaco

Check to see if the existing feeder cable has a ground wire that is not
being used. If it does, get a four wire range (50 amp) outlet. If the feeder
is only three wire, replace the range cord set with a three wire range cord
set, and install the (usually included) bonding strap from the neutral
connection (white wire) to the frame of the range.

On Aug 4, 6:21*pm, "John Grabowski" wrote:
"flaco" wrote in message

...

my 25 yr old house has a 220 outlet with a Red, Black,
and White wire at the 220 outet. Pulled out the old
stove and installing my new(er) replacement stove.
This stove has Red, Black, White and GREEN!..
at the new(er) stove end wire..want to marry the
3 wires from my box to the 4 wires of my new stove

what is normally done..??
flaco

Change the cord on the new stove to a three wire cord. *Inside the stove
electrical junction box there is usually a means to jumper the white and
green together. *Connect the jumper so that the white and green inside of
the stove are together and connect the new cord to the terminal block


The cord coming off the elec. range has the metal sheath with the
wires inside and will reach to my wall outlet.It WAS hard wired
into the junciton box w/o an outlet..(was that way for 25 yrs)
cant just put it back into the box..hard wired again???

flaco wrote:
On Aug 4, 6:21 pm, "John Grabowski" wrote:
"flaco" wrote in message

...

my 25 yr old house has a 220 outlet with a Red, Black,
and White wire at the 220 outet. Pulled out the old
stove and installing my new(er) replacement stove.
This stove has Red, Black, White and GREEN!..
at the new(er) stove end wire..want to marry the
3 wires from my box to the 4 wires of my new stove

what is normally done..??
flaco

Change the cord on the new stove to a three wire cord. Inside the
stove electrical junction box there is usually a means to jumper
the
white and green together. Connect the jumper so that the white and
green inside of the stove are together and connect the new cord to
the terminal block


The cord coming off the elec. range has the metal sheath with the
wires inside and will reach to my wall outlet.It WAS hard wired
into the junciton box w/o an outlet..(was that way for 25 yrs)
cant just put it back into the box..hard wired again???

There are two issues--making it work and making it legal.

Hard wiring it with the green wire connected to the neutral wire will
_work_ but it may or may not meet code depending on the code--you need
to run this one by your local inspector if code is an issue where you
are.


--
--
--John
to email, dial "usenet" and validate
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)

flaco wrote:

my 25 yr old house has a 220 outlet with a Red, Black,
and White wire at the 220 outet. Pulled out the old
stove and installing my new(er) replacement stove.
This stove has Red, Black, White and GREEN!..
at the new(er) stove end wire..want to marry the
3 wires from my box to the 4 wires of my new stove

what is normally done..??

I do my own wiring and I'll be damned before I'd risk
marrying a three wire 220V outlet into a four-wire
stove. That is dangerous and most likely illegal.
My suggestion is to trace the wire to the breaker box
and replace it with the proper wire. I always use
one gauge lower than code.

If you attach the wire to a fish before removing it,
you shouldn't have a problem pulling the new wire up.
It may be a little more work and cost $10 more, but
you'll sleep better at night.

If you do decide to marry the wires, make sure you
have a damn good homeowners policy with a very low
deductible (like $100). Also make sure you all of
your smoke detectors are working - the Fire Marshall
checks them after the fire has been extinguish.

Being afraid of electricity can save your life.

Dick

On Mon, 4 Aug 2008 16:01:24 -0700 (PDT), flaco
wrote:

my 25 yr old house has a 220 outlet with a Red, Black,
and White wire at the 220 outet. Pulled out the old
stove and installing my new(er) replacement stove.
This stove has Red, Black, White and GREEN!..
at the new(er) stove end wire..want to marry the
3 wires from my box to the 4 wires of my new stove

what is normally done..??
flaco

With the circuit OFF, look inside the outlet box and see if there is a
ground wire for the green wire. If so, replace the 220 outlet with a
4-conductor outlet. There should be a diagram that labels the wires.
The green wire is (should be) the ground.

"flaco" wrote in message
...
On Aug 4, 6:21 pm, "John Grabowski" wrote:
"flaco" wrote in message

...

my 25 yr old house has a 220 outlet with a Red, Black,
and White wire at the 220 outet. Pulled out the old
stove and installing my new(er) replacement stove.
This stove has Red, Black, White and GREEN!..
at the new(er) stove end wire..want to marry the
3 wires from my box to the 4 wires of my new stove

what is normally done..??
flaco

Change the cord on the new stove to a three wire cord. Inside the stove
electrical junction box there is usually a means to jumper the white and
green together. Connect the jumper so that the white and green inside of
the stove are together and connect the new cord to the terminal block


The cord coming off the elec. range has the metal sheath with the
wires inside and will reach to my wall outlet.It WAS hard wired
into the junciton box w/o an outlet..(was that way for 25 yrs)
cant just put it back into the box..hard wired again???

First, you said you have a three wire outlet, and now you're saying you have
a junction box. Which is it? If this is a new "range" it's not going to have
metal flex coming off of it, it will either have a range cord, or nothing.
If the unit is not a range, but a "cooktop", it will have a metal flex with
wires attached to it, and that gets directly connected into a junction box,
not a receptacle outlet

"Dick Adams" wrote in message
...
flaco wrote:

my 25 yr old house has a 220 outlet with a Red, Black,
and White wire at the 220 outet. Pulled out the old
stove and installing my new(er) replacement stove.
This stove has Red, Black, White and GREEN!..
at the new(er) stove end wire..want to marry the
3 wires from my box to the 4 wires of my new stove

what is normally done..??

I do my own wiring and I'll be damned before I'd risk
marrying a three wire 220V outlet into a four-wire
stove. That is dangerous and most likely illegal.
My suggestion is to trace the wire to the breaker box
and replace it with the proper wire. I always use
one gauge lower than code.

If you attach the wire to a fish before removing it,
you shouldn't have a problem pulling the new wire up.
It may be a little more work and cost $10 more, but
you'll sleep better at night.

If you do decide to marry the wires, make sure you
have a damn good homeowners policy with a very low
deductible (like $100). Also make sure you all of
your smoke detectors are working - the Fire Marshall
checks them after the fire has been extinguish.

Being afraid of electricity can save your life.

Dick

I suppose it's ignorance rather than fear-mongering, but "marrying" a 4wire
range to a 3 wire range outlet is not dangerous, is how most existing
ranges are connected, and meets National Electric Code standards

Dick Adams wrote:
flaco wrote:

my 25 yr old house has a 220 outlet with a Red, Black,
and White wire at the 220 outet. Pulled out the old
stove and installing my new(er) replacement stove.
This stove has Red, Black, White and GREEN!..
at the new(er) stove end wire..want to marry the
3 wires from my box to the 4 wires of my new stove

what is normally done..??

I do my own wiring and I'll be damned before I'd risk
marrying a three wire 220V outlet into a four-wire
stove. That is dangerous and most likely illegal.

Why is it dangerous and what laws wold it violate?

My suggestion is to trace the wire to the breaker box
and replace it with the proper wire. I always use
one gauge lower than code.

Certainly nothing wrong with doing this, however considering the huge
number of stoves that are wired to three wire outlets and the paucity
of problems resulting from this, it would seem to be overkill.

If you attach the wire to a fish before removing it,
you shouldn't have a problem pulling the new wire up.
It may be a little more work and cost $10 more, but
you'll sleep better at night.

Have you ever pulled 8/3 with ground around a corner.

If you do decide to marry the wires, make sure you
have a damn good homeowners policy with a very low
deductible (like $100). Also make sure you all of
your smoke detectors are working - the Fire Marshall
checks them after the fire has been extinguish.

Why would he want to do this? What is it about connecting ground with
neutral that creates a fire hazard?

Being afraid of electricity can save your life.

Yes, it can, but what is the specific danger here?


--
--
--John
to email, dial "usenet" and validate
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)

I could never understand what is the purpose of 3 vs 4 wire dryer
plugs. The ground and neutral are connected together at the main panel
anyway. If this is an existing outlet, not a problem to change the 4
wire plug to 3 wire and jump the ground and neutral inside the dryer.
For new installations, then you would run a 4 wire circuit.

On Aug 5, 1:25*pm, Mikepier wrote:
I could never understand what is the purpose of 3 vs 4 wire dryer
plugs. The ground and neutral are connected together at the main panel
anyway. If this is an existing outlet, not a problem to change the 4
wire plug to 3 wire and jump the ground and neutral inside the dryer.
For new installations, then you would run a 4 wire circuit.

Yes; this comes up from time to time by some ignorant of safe wiring
practices.

The ground an the neutral ARE connected together BUT ONLY ONCE at the
main panel.

Never at a sub-panel or at an appliance or outlet!!!!!

Everywhere else in the house the ground and the neutral are to be
separate wires.

Reason: If a fault occurs the ground wire (which must be of certain
gauge etc.) will carry the fault current safely to ground hopefully
protecting persons from shock and in many cases will trip the circuit
breaker for safety.
But if the neutral white wire breaks/becomes open the appliance etc.
should safely stop working until properly repaired. It should not
continue to work with the neutral current flowing through the metal
frame of the appliance etc.

terry wrote:
On Aug 5, 1:25 pm, Mikepier wrote:
I could never understand what is the purpose of 3 vs 4 wire dryer
plugs. The ground and neutral are connected together at the main
panel anyway. If this is an existing outlet, not a problem to
change
the 4 wire plug to 3 wire and jump the ground and neutral inside
the
dryer. For new installations, then you would run a 4 wire circuit.

Yes; this comes up from time to time by some ignorant of safe wiring
practices.

The ground an the neutral ARE connected together BUT ONLY ONCE at
the
main panel.

Never at a sub-panel or at an appliance or outlet!!!!!

Everywhere else in the house the ground and the neutral are to be
separate wires.

Reason: If a fault occurs the ground wire (which must be of certain
gauge etc.) will carry the fault current safely to ground hopefully
protecting persons from shock and in many cases will trip the
circuit
breaker for safety.
But if the neutral white wire breaks/becomes open the appliance etc.
should safely stop working until properly repaired. It should not
continue to work with the neutral current flowing through the metal
frame of the appliance etc.

A 220v stove usually works fine with the neutral open. Your rationale
may be appropriate for some types of appliance but it doesn't really
make a lot of sense for a stove.


--
--
--John
to email, dial "usenet" and validate
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)

On Aug 5, 6:31*am, Phisherman wrote:
With the circuit OFF, look inside the outlet box and see if there is a
ground wire for the green wire. *If so, replace the 220 outlet with a
4-conductor outlet. * There should be a diagram that labels the wires.
The green wire is (should be) the ground.

About F-ing time someone with some common sense posted a reply to
this...

The OP recanted and said it's a junction box, not a "plug." It's
probably a cooktop and not a range, too.

The junction box is likely metal, and likely grounded with a fourth
wire. Attach the green wire to the ground screw inside the junction
box, nut and tape the other three, and get to cooking something
already!