Have you noticed that our choices for Pro Line Tools are diminishing fast!
It use to be there was 4 or 5 choices for good quality power tools. Black
and Decker has bought up 3 of those products and now turned them into CRAP!
What are our choices now? None. Most of my power tools are Porter Cable and
I have had great luck with them. I have a 14.4 drill/driver that has lasted
7 years and I use it everyday. I have already seen the quality of this tool
drop from Pro Line to Week End Warrior status. What are we suppose to use
now when we want Quality and Dependability?

Bosch comes to mind and Festool, but I'm not sure who builds these. I'm sure
every tool built now comes with China fasteners and what few metal parts
are left in them. I'm just getting sick of large corps. buying these tool
makers and turning them into cheap ass trash not even worthy of Weekend
Warrior Status.

I needed to VENT and was wondering what you guys think of this trend?

Rich

evodawg wrote:
Have you noticed that our choices for Pro Line Tools are diminishing fast!
It use to be there was 4 or 5 choices for good quality power tools. Black
and Decker has bought up 3 of those products and now turned them into CRAP!
What are our choices now? None. Most of my power tools are Porter Cable and
I have had great luck with them. I have a 14.4 drill/driver that has lasted
7 years and I use it everyday. I have already seen the quality of this tool
drop from Pro Line to Week End Warrior status. What are we suppose to use
now when we want Quality and Dependability?

Bosch comes to mind and Festool, but I'm not sure who builds these. I'm sure
every tool built now comes with China fasteners and what few metal parts
are left in them. I'm just getting sick of large corps. buying these tool
makers and turning them into cheap ass trash not even worthy of Weekend
Warrior Status.

I needed to VENT and was wondering what you guys think of this trend?

Rich


It's not just tools, it's every consumer good. For *most* people the
thought of buying tools/goods for a lifetime never occurs to them, just
getting them through the next job.

I tear up whenever I think about all the old Delta tools that were in my
grandfather's workshop that ended up getting sold because when they
moved out I didn't have the money (although I'm sure if I'd expressed
interest, I would have been given them, I would have felt guilty,) a
truck, or a place to put them. Fortunately I got a lot of his hand
tools and AFAIK what my grandmother still doesn't have were taken by my
cousin's husband; the only great loss was the tubing tools which were sold.

I'm still having good luck with my Milwaukee and Makita stuff, but the
only major tool I've bought within the last decade was a new Sawzall,
the rest of it is fairly old.

nate

--
replace "roosters" with "cox" to reply.
http://members.cox.net/njnagel

evodawg wrote:
....sour grapes...

Milwaukee Red...

--

dpb wrote:

evodawg wrote:
...sour grapes...

Milwaukee Red...

--
Milwaukee 1/2" corded power drill and Sawzall. Think they are built it
France NOW!

Website Addy http://rentmyhusband.co.nr/

On Aug 2, 1:31*pm, evodawg wrote:
Have you noticed that our choices for Pro Line Tools are diminishing fast!
It use to be there was 4 or 5 choices for good quality power tools. Black
and Decker has bought up 3 of those products and now turned them into CRAP!
What are our choices now? None. Most of my power tools are Porter Cable and
I have had great luck with them. I have a 14.4 drill/driver that has lasted
7 years and I use it everyday. I have already seen the quality of this tool
drop from Pro Line to Week End Warrior status. What are we suppose to use
now when we want Quality and Dependability?

Bosch comes to mind and Festool, but I'm not sure who builds these. I'm sure
every tool built now comes with China fasteners and what few metal parts
are left in them. I'm just getting sick of large corps. buying these tool
makers and turning them into cheap ass trash not even worthy of Weekend
Warrior Status.

I needed to VENT and was wondering what you guys think of this trend?

Rich

With everything being made in china for the lowest price and unknown
quality control nobody knows, a bad batch of anyproduct will always
get sold here. I have maybe 10 PC products that are fine, I am trying
HDs ridgid brand only because of a lifetime warranty even on
batteries.

evodawg wrote:
Have you noticed that our choices for Pro Line Tools are diminishing fast!
It use to be there was 4 or 5 choices for good quality power tools. Black
and Decker has bought up 3 of those products and now turned them into CRAP!
What are our choices now? None. Most of my power tools are Porter Cable and
I have had great luck with them. I have a 14.4 drill/driver that has lasted
7 years and I use it everyday. I have already seen the quality of this tool
drop from Pro Line to Week End Warrior status. What are we suppose to use
now when we want Quality and Dependability?

Bosch comes to mind and Festool, but I'm not sure who builds these. I'm sure
every tool built now comes with China fasteners and what few metal parts
are left in them. I'm just getting sick of large corps. buying these tool
makers and turning them into cheap ass trash not even worthy of Weekend
Warrior Status.

I needed to VENT and was wondering what you guys think of this trend?

Rich


Yes, I have noticed that also... oops, I'm not a professional, so please
disregard this.

a

On Sat, 02 Aug 2008 12:16:34 -0700, evodawg
wrote:

dpb wrote:

evodawg wrote:
...sour grapes...

Milwaukee Red...

--
Milwaukee 1/2" corded power drill and Sawzall. Think they are built it
France NOW!

I bought ONE of each at HD in the past a year or two. Discontinued
stocking/model. 1/2 hammer/drill was marked down from $149.00 to about
129.00 or less. Told the clerk to get me one. They were out on the
stock shelves. I bought the display, AFTER sending the clerk with my
$75.00 offer to an on duty manger. With tax if cost me $90.00.

I needed a corded sawzall this year and picked up one on the "isle"
table. Saved maybe $25.00.

Both were Miilwaukee





Website Addy http://rentmyhusband.co.nr/

"evodawg" wrote in message
...
dpb wrote:

evodawg wrote:
...sour grapes...

Milwaukee Red...

--
Milwaukee 1/2" corded power drill and Sawzall. Think they are built it
France NOW!


French-- Oh yeah, that's real good-- socialized and unionized up to their
eyeballs, 6 weeks off per year, short work weeks, no pride in what they
do....I'll take my chances with the stuff from China!

evodawg wrote:
Have you noticed that our choices for Pro Line Tools are diminishing fast!
It use to be there was 4 or 5 choices for good quality power tools. Black
and Decker has bought up 3 of those products and now turned them into CRAP!
What are our choices now? None. Most of my power tools are Porter Cable and
I have had great luck with them. I have a 14.4 drill/driver that has lasted
7 years and I use it everyday. I have already seen the quality of this tool
drop from Pro Line to Week End Warrior status. What are we suppose to use
now when we want Quality and Dependability?

Bosch comes to mind and Festool, but I'm not sure who builds these. I'm sure
every tool built now comes with China fasteners and what few metal parts
are left in them. I'm just getting sick of large corps. buying these tool
makers and turning them into cheap ass trash not even worthy of Weekend
Warrior Status.

I needed to VENT and was wondering what you guys think of this trend?

Rich


Here is one reason:
http://www.harborfreight.com/
Kevin

evodawg wrote:
dpb wrote:

evodawg wrote:
...sour grapes...

Milwaukee Red...

--
Milwaukee 1/2" corded power drill and Sawzall. Think they are built it
France NOW!
....

The point of the other poster's complaint was perceived quality
irregardless of place of manufacture -- imo, Milwaukee is still topnotch
for the job in any of their tools I have.

"Homebuilt" would be nice in many ways but currently isn't a reality so
there's no point in even debating the issue. The suitability of the
tool and reliability, etc., otoh, is...

--

On Sat, 02 Aug 2008 19:26:00 GMT, a wrote:

Yes, I have noticed that also... oops, I'm not a professional, so please
disregard this.

a

Just not enough vowels in your mym...

Nate Nagel wrote:
evodawg wrote:
Have you noticed that our choices for Pro Line Tools are diminishing
fast!
It use to be there was 4 or 5 choices for good quality power tools. Black
and Decker has bought up 3 of those products and now turned them into
CRAP!
What are our choices now? None. Most of my power tools are Porter
Cable and
I have had great luck with them. I have a 14.4 drill/driver that has
lasted
7 years and I use it everyday. I have already seen the quality of this
tool
drop from Pro Line to Week End Warrior status. What are we suppose to use
now when we want Quality and Dependability?

Bosch comes to mind and Festool, but I'm not sure who builds these.
I'm sure
every tool built now comes with China fasteners and what few metal parts
are left in them. I'm just getting sick of large corps. buying these tool
makers and turning them into cheap ass trash not even worthy of Weekend
Warrior Status.

I needed to VENT and was wondering what you guys think of this trend?

Rich


It's not just tools, it's every consumer good. For *most* people the
thought of buying tools/goods for a lifetime never occurs to them, just
getting them through the next job.

I tear up whenever I think about all the old Delta tools that were in my
grandfather's workshop that ended up getting sold because when they
moved out I didn't have the money (although I'm sure if I'd expressed
interest, I would have been given them, I would have felt guilty,) a
truck, or a place to put them. Fortunately I got a lot of his hand
tools and AFAIK what my grandmother still doesn't have were taken by my
cousin's husband; the only great loss was the tubing tools which were sold.

I'm still having good luck with my Milwaukee and Makita stuff, but the
only major tool I've bought within the last decade was a new Sawzall,
the rest of it is fairly old.

nate

Hmmm,
Old red Milwaukee, Bosch(made in Swiss), Porter Calbe(made in TN).
My idea of getting something is buy best I could afford and keep it life
time. Stuff made in China depends on what spec. it is made to. Not
everything Chinese is bad.

evodawg wrote:
Have you noticed that our choices for Pro Line Tools are diminishing
fast! It use to be there was 4 or 5 choices for good quality power
tools. Black and Decker has bought up 3 of those products and now
turned them into CRAP! What are our choices now? None. Most of my
power tools are Porter Cable and I have had great luck with them. I
have a 14.4 drill/driver that has lasted 7 years and I use it
everyday. I have already seen the quality of this tool drop from Pro
Line to Week End Warrior status. What are we suppose to use now when
we want Quality and Dependability?

Bosch comes to mind and Festool, but I'm not sure who builds these.
I'm sure every tool built now comes with China fasteners and what few
metal parts are left in them. I'm just getting sick of large corps.
buying these tool makers and turning them into cheap ass trash not
even worthy of Weekend Warrior Status.

I needed to VENT and was wondering what you guys think of this trend?


I think it's a good idea. There are electrical hand tools (drills, saws,
etc.) that were made 50 years ago that still work swell.

But who would use them? Compared to today's products, these ancient models
are heavy, bulky, and limited in function. Heck, they don't even have built
in lights, bubble-levels, or radios.

I know of what you speak. I'm still working Black & Decker
commercial (my age is showing now), Porter Cable for wood working
tools, and Milwaukee for anything that counts. I have never liked
Bosch. I have two old Makita drywall guns before they changed the
style (for the worse). I got started with DeWalt cordless and
have stayed there due to batteries, etc. Ridgid makes the only
plumbing tools.

--
______________________________
Keep the whole world singing . . . .
DanG (remove the sevens)




"evodawg" wrote in message
...
Have you noticed that our choices for Pro Line Tools are
diminishing fast!
It use to be there was 4 or 5 choices for good quality power
tools. Black
and Decker has bought up 3 of those products and now turned them
into CRAP!
What are our choices now? None. Most of my power tools are
Porter Cable and
I have had great luck with them. I have a 14.4 drill/driver that
has lasted
7 years and I use it everyday. I have already seen the quality
of this tool
drop from Pro Line to Week End Warrior status. What are we
suppose to use
now when we want Quality and Dependability?

Bosch comes to mind and Festool, but I'm not sure who builds
these. I'm sure
every tool built now comes with China fasteners and what few
metal parts
are left in them. I'm just getting sick of large corps. buying
these tool
makers and turning them into cheap ass trash not even worthy of
Weekend
Warrior Status.

I needed to VENT and was wondering what you guys think of this
trend?

Rich

Oops!!!!! I'm not a professional. Not in home repair anyways...

Ralph Mowery wrote:
"The Postman" route23@pod wrote in message
. ..
eyeballs, 6 weeks off per year, short work weeks, no pride in what
they


Not too sure how many countries do it, but some countries have
passed
a law the companies have to give atleast a month off. This is to
create more jobs for the workers. Seems their government is
looking
out for them. Ours seems to make it easier to import things and
cost
jobs. If you look at some of the American stuff you will see there
is no pride in our work either.

And yet oddly the US GDP is still approximately the same as that of
the whole of Europe and about ten times that of Japan.

--
--
--John
to email, dial "usenet" and validate
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)

"The Postman" route23@pod wrote in message
. ..
eyeballs, 6 weeks off per year, short work weeks, no pride in what they


Not too sure how many countries do it, but some countries have passed a law
the companies have to give atleast a month off. This is to create more jobs
for the workers. Seems their government is looking out for them. Ours
seems to make it easier to import things and cost jobs. If you look at
some of the American stuff you will see there is no pride in our work
either.

"evodawg" wrote in message
...
Have you noticed that our choices for Pro Line Tools are diminishing fast!
It use to be there was 4 or 5 choices for good quality power tools. Black
and Decker has bought up 3 of those products and now turned them into
CRAP!
What are our choices now? None. Most of my power tools are Porter Cable
and
I have had great luck with them. I have a 14.4 drill/driver that has
lasted
7 years and I use it everyday. I have already seen the quality of this
tool
drop from Pro Line to Week End Warrior status. What are we suppose to use
now when we want Quality and Dependability?

Bosch comes to mind and Festool, but I'm not sure who builds these. I'm
sure
every tool built now comes with China fasteners and what few metal parts
are left in them. I'm just getting sick of large corps. buying these tool
makers and turning them into cheap ass trash not even worthy of Weekend
Warrior Status.

I needed to VENT and was wondering what you guys think of this trend?

Rich

I think the quality of products like power tools, is, and has always been
cyclic. Every one of the manufacturers mentioned has at one time or another
produced good stuff. I don't care where it's made or who makes it, if there
is a market for a quality tool, one will be produced by somebody. I would
guess at this point in time, with world wide competition, and a lower
quality market catering to do-it-yourselfers, there just isn't a great
market for expensive professional grade tools, but eventually someone will
see the need and produce them again... for a time. Currently I use: Dewalt,
Milwaukee, Bosch, Makita,Skil,and Kango.... They're all crap, but their
relatively cheap

Ralph Mowery wrote:
"The Postman" route23@pod wrote in message
. ..
eyeballs, 6 weeks off per year, short work weeks, no pride in what they


Not too sure how many countries do it, but some countries have passed a law
the companies have to give atleast a month off. This is to create more jobs
for the workers. Seems their government is looking out for them. Ours
seems to make it easier to import things and cost jobs. If you look at
some of the American stuff you will see there is no pride in our work
either.


TANSTAAFL. If you have to have enough extra bodies to give 4 weeks off
instead of 2 (or whatever), but still have to pay all the workers for
all 52 weeks each year, well, who is making up the difference in labor
costs? You HAVE to increase your prices. And if the country next door is
making the same thing, but they only have to pay the employees for 2
free weeks each year, well, they can set their prices a little lower.

Not defending robber barons or the chinese slave factories, mind you.
Every company should treat their workers well, or at least humanely. But
if the 'other guy' isn't paying for that perk for his workers, you
probably can't afford to either.

--
aem sends...

Made in France says it all!!! French tanks have 1 forward speed and 3
reverse speeds. Their rifles are often found on the battlefield in
like new condition-- need I mention Renault!!!!


On Aug 2, 4:54*pm, Abe wrote:
Milwaukee 1/2" corded power drill and Sawzall. Think they are built it
France NOW!

French-- Oh yeah, that's real good-- socialized and unionized up to their
eyeballs, 6 weeks off per year, short work weeks, no pride in what they
do....I'll take my chances with the stuff from China!

How in the world do you make the connection between:

1. socialized
2. unionized
3. 6 weeks vacation

and

no pride in what they do?

I think it's just the opposite. Good working conditions, strong
workers rights, and ample vacation time make for a motivated work
force with pride in their work. I think you've been drinking BillO's,
Hannity's, and Rush's Kool-aid. Your brain seems to be rusting.

HeyBub wrote:


I think it's a good idea. There are electrical hand tools (drills, saws,
etc.) that were made 50 years ago that still work swell.

But who would use them? Compared to today's products, these ancient models
are heavy, bulky, and limited in function. Heck, they don't even have
built in lights, bubble-levels, or radios.

LMFAO, I often wondered how well a bubble level would work on the top of a
drill. What a bunch of weekend warrior gimmicks. Give me a freakin break.

--
"You can lead them to LINUX
but you can't make them THINK"
Running Mandriva release 2008.0 free-i586 using KDE on i586
Website Address http://rentmyhusband.co.nr/

Are you sure that's not by design... LOL and I always thought it's because
the French are always in retreat and that goes for the rifle to. You can't
run as fast when you have a rifle in your hands.

wrote:

Made in France says it all!!! French tanks have 1 forward speed and 3
reverse speeds. Their rifles are often found on the battlefield in
like new condition-- need I mention Renault!!!!

On Sat, 02 Aug 2008 17:42:05 -0500, Ralph Mowery wrote:


"The Postman" route23@pod wrote in message
. ..
eyeballs, 6 weeks off per year, short work weeks, no pride in what they


Not too sure how many countries do it, but some countries have passed a law
the companies have to give atleast a month off. This is to create more jobs
for the workers. Seems their government is looking out for them. Ours
seems to make it easier to import things and cost jobs. If you look at
some of the American stuff you will see there is no pride in our work
either.

Excellent perception.
Made in the USA doesn't always mean the best possible product for the buck.
Pride in workmanship starts at the top.

The mark of a true professional is doing the job right the first time and
making it look easy.

On Sat 02 Aug 2008 04:10:19p, evodawg told us...

HeyBub wrote:


I think it's a good idea. There are electrical hand tools (drills,
saws, etc.) that were made 50 years ago that still work swell.

But who would use them? Compared to today's products, these ancient
models are heavy, bulky, and limited in function. Heck, they don't even
have built in lights, bubble-levels, or radios.

LMFAO, I often wondered how well a bubble level would work on the top of
a drill. What a bunch of weekend warrior gimmicks. Give me a freakin
break.


I gues you could call me a weekend warrior, but I have a decent collection
of both old and new tools. A rechargeable drill I bought a couple of years
ago happened to have a bubble level built into it. I didn't think much of
it until I began using the drill. Surprisingly, it does help in guiding
the drill in a horizontal position.

--
Wayne Boatwright
-------------------------------------------
Saturday, 08(VIII)/02(II)/08(MMVIII)
-------------------------------------------
-------------------------------------------
Don't start an argument with somebody
who has a microphone when you don't;
they'll make you look like chopped
liver. --Harlan Ellison, on hecklers
-------------------------------------------

evodawg wrote:
HeyBub wrote:


I think it's a good idea. There are electrical hand tools (drills,
saws, etc.) that were made 50 years ago that still work swell.

But who would use them? Compared to today's products, these ancient
models are heavy, bulky, and limited in function. Heck, they don't
even have built in lights, bubble-levels, or radios.

LMFAO, I often wondered how well a bubble level would work on the top
of a drill. What a bunch of weekend warrior gimmicks. Give me a
freakin break.

You may be correct. Modern drills are light enough to use with one hand
while the other holds a square. But you have to keep moving the square!
Nowdays, drills have those little target levels so you can get the hole
perfect in all directions! They've got chucks that don't need keys, battery
operated so you can use 'em anywhere, little clips to hold spare/extra screw
bits, all kinds of goodness.

That, and I like to listen to the radio.

Tony Hwang wrote:
Nate Nagel wrote:
evodawg wrote:
Have you noticed that our choices for Pro Line Tools are diminishing
fast!
It use to be there was 4 or 5 choices for good quality power tools.
Black
and Decker has bought up 3 of those products and now turned them into
CRAP!
What are our choices now? None. Most of my power tools are Porter
Cable and
I have had great luck with them. I have a 14.4 drill/driver that has
lasted
7 years and I use it everyday. I have already seen the quality of
this tool
drop from Pro Line to Week End Warrior status. What are we suppose to
use
now when we want Quality and Dependability?

Bosch comes to mind and Festool, but I'm not sure who builds these.
I'm sure
every tool built now comes with China fasteners and what few metal parts
are left in them. I'm just getting sick of large corps. buying these
tool
makers and turning them into cheap ass trash not even worthy of Weekend
Warrior Status.

I needed to VENT and was wondering what you guys think of this trend?

Rich


It's not just tools, it's every consumer good. For *most* people the
thought of buying tools/goods for a lifetime never occurs to them,
just getting them through the next job.

I tear up whenever I think about all the old Delta tools that were in
my grandfather's workshop that ended up getting sold because when they
moved out I didn't have the money (although I'm sure if I'd expressed
interest, I would have been given them, I would have felt guilty,) a
truck, or a place to put them. Fortunately I got a lot of his hand
tools and AFAIK what my grandmother still doesn't have were taken by
my cousin's husband; the only great loss was the tubing tools which
were sold.

I'm still having good luck with my Milwaukee and Makita stuff, but the
only major tool I've bought within the last decade was a new Sawzall,
the rest of it is fairly old.

nate

Hmmm,
Old red Milwaukee, Bosch(made in Swiss), Porter Calbe(made in TN).
My idea of getting something is buy best I could afford and keep it life
time. Stuff made in China depends on what spec. it is made to. Not
everything Chinese is bad.

I love Chinese food.

[8~{} Uncle Monster

Tony Hwang wrote:
Nate Nagel wrote:

evodawg wrote:

Have you noticed that our choices for Pro Line Tools are diminishing
fast!
It use to be there was 4 or 5 choices for good quality power tools.
Black
and Decker has bought up 3 of those products and now turned them into
CRAP!
What are our choices now? None. Most of my power tools are Porter
Cable and
I have had great luck with them. I have a 14.4 drill/driver that has
lasted
7 years and I use it everyday. I have already seen the quality of
this tool
drop from Pro Line to Week End Warrior status. What are we suppose to
use
now when we want Quality and Dependability?

Bosch comes to mind and Festool, but I'm not sure who builds these.
I'm sure
every tool built now comes with China fasteners and what few metal parts
are left in them. I'm just getting sick of large corps. buying these
tool
makers and turning them into cheap ass trash not even worthy of Weekend
Warrior Status.

I needed to VENT and was wondering what you guys think of this trend?

Rich


It's not just tools, it's every consumer good. For *most* people the
thought of buying tools/goods for a lifetime never occurs to them,
just getting them through the next job.

I tear up whenever I think about all the old Delta tools that were in
my grandfather's workshop that ended up getting sold because when they
moved out I didn't have the money (although I'm sure if I'd expressed
interest, I would have been given them, I would have felt guilty,) a
truck, or a place to put them. Fortunately I got a lot of his hand
tools and AFAIK what my grandmother still doesn't have were taken by
my cousin's husband; the only great loss was the tubing tools which
were sold.

I'm still having good luck with my Milwaukee and Makita stuff, but the
only major tool I've bought within the last decade was a new Sawzall,
the rest of it is fairly old.

nate

Hmmm,
Old red Milwaukee, Bosch(made in Swiss), Porter Calbe(made in TN).
My idea of getting something is buy best I could afford and keep it life
time. Stuff made in China depends on what spec. it is made to. Not
everything Chinese is bad.

I didn't mean to imply that, but it seems that really the only way to
evaluate Chinese quality is visual inspection, as a lot of stuff hasn't
been on the market long enough to see whether it's really durable or
not. Also many stores take a dim view of disassembling the samples in
the store And you have to admit that some Chinese products have
indeed received a bad rap for quality.

nate

--
replace "roosters" with "cox" to reply.
http://members.cox.net/njnagel

HeyBub wrote:
evodawg wrote:

Have you noticed that our choices for Pro Line Tools are diminishing
fast! It use to be there was 4 or 5 choices for good quality power
tools. Black and Decker has bought up 3 of those products and now
turned them into CRAP! What are our choices now? None. Most of my
power tools are Porter Cable and I have had great luck with them. I
have a 14.4 drill/driver that has lasted 7 years and I use it
everyday. I have already seen the quality of this tool drop from Pro
Line to Week End Warrior status. What are we suppose to use now when
we want Quality and Dependability?

Bosch comes to mind and Festool, but I'm not sure who builds these.
I'm sure every tool built now comes with China fasteners and what few
metal parts are left in them. I'm just getting sick of large corps.
buying these tool makers and turning them into cheap ass trash not
even worthy of Weekend Warrior Status.

I needed to VENT and was wondering what you guys think of this trend?



I think it's a good idea. There are electrical hand tools (drills, saws,
etc.) that were made 50 years ago that still work swell.

But who would use them? Compared to today's products, these ancient models
are heavy, bulky, and limited in function. Heck, they don't even have built
in lights, bubble-levels, or radios.


I'm assuming that that was tongue in cheek. I don't care if my drill
weighs 10 lbs. if I need to drill a hole in a truck frame, and only have
to do that every couple years or so. I can (and do) keep a cheap
consumer grade model around for around-the-house tasks.

nate


--
replace "roosters" with "cox" to reply.
http://members.cox.net/njnagel

Ralph Mowery wrote:
"The Postman" route23@pod wrote in message
. ..

eyeballs, 6 weeks off per year, short work weeks, no pride in what they



Not too sure how many countries do it, but some countries have passed a law
the companies have to give atleast a month off. This is to create more jobs
for the workers. Seems their government is looking out for them. Ours
seems to make it easier to import things and cost jobs. If you look at
some of the American stuff you will see there is no pride in our work
either.


Depends on what you're doing. I still know some people who take pride
in their work, and I enjoy working with those people. Sadly, they're
electricians (in a specialized field) and a lot of them are here on
green cards, apparently working with your hands is not
lucrative/attractive enough for many native born citizens.

nate


--
replace "roosters" with "cox" to reply.
http://members.cox.net/njnagel

HeyBub wrote:
evodawg wrote:

HeyBub wrote:


I think it's a good idea. There are electrical hand tools (drills,
saws, etc.) that were made 50 years ago that still work swell.

But who would use them? Compared to today's products, these ancient
models are heavy, bulky, and limited in function. Heck, they don't
even have built in lights, bubble-levels, or radios.

LMFAO, I often wondered how well a bubble level would work on the top
of a drill. What a bunch of weekend warrior gimmicks. Give me a
freakin break.


You may be correct. Modern drills are light enough to use with one hand
while the other holds a square. But you have to keep moving the square!
Nowdays, drills have those little target levels so you can get the hole
perfect in all directions! They've got chucks that don't need keys, battery
operated so you can use 'em anywhere, little clips to hold spare/extra screw
bits, all kinds of goodness.

That, and I like to listen to the radio.


I freakin' HATE keyless chucks. Inevitably I will have to drill a hole
in steel sheet and the drill bit I need will be some old thing without
the three flats on it, and inevitably it will catch, a keyless chuck
simply does not grip the bit tight enough to keep it from spinning.
Reverse it out, remove bit, gently file the burrs off the shank, try
again, catch, spin, repeat 3x, finally hole is done, clean up with
reamer and chamfer, now you have to file the drill bit again 'cause the
burr won't let it fit into your drill index...

just give me a good old fashioned Jacobs keyed chuck, thank you.

nate


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Ralph Mowery wrote:


Also how much pride do you think I or others like me can take when the
following hapens to them?
I was promised a good eairly retirement when I started at 23 years old if
I
worked for the comapny for 30 years and was over 55. Around the time I
turned 53 the company was sold and the new owners decided not to honor
that
agreement. That now means instead of retiring at 55 or 60 I will have to
work to atleast 62 or maybe 65 when the medicare insurance starts.
Then I look at Home Depot and see they 'fired' the CEO and gave him
around
120 million to leave. Poor Ford Motor comapny CEO only got about 20
million
to leave. I did manage to loose about $ 10,000
in the Ford stock when it fell from around $ 27 to $ 10. See that it is
around $ 5 now. Guess that I did save a few dollars by getting out at $
10.

Seems the government lets the big boys get payed when they are fired for
poor job performance, while the workers get shafted for working.

You really need to understand how things work. I look at life like a big
Chess Board. We are the Pawns, disposable, expendable, and easily made to
feel somewhat important. Then you have the big boys with the true POWER
that control the strings and every movement is made far in advance, control
every aspect of our life's. And these big boys are not the president or
congress, just the ones that control everything like all the moves on the
Chess Board. Big Money and Corporations and the families that control it.
You just do your best and try not to get in their way and hopefully you can
die with some kind of dignity and be somewhat successful. And this is the
way it's been since the beginning of time and it will be that way until
man's demise.

I know this sounds cynical but can anyone explain to me why this would not
make sense? Explain to me why People in high places can make the dumbest
decisions that not even a moron would make and come out smelling like a
rose? Simple, read the above paragraph.

--
"You can lead them to LINUX
but you can't make them THINK"
Running Mandriva release 2008.0 free-i586 using KDE on i586
Website Address http://rentmyhusband.co.nr/

Nate Nagel wrote:

HeyBub wrote:
evodawg wrote:

HeyBub wrote:


I think it's a good idea. There are electrical hand tools (drills,
saws, etc.) that were made 50 years ago that still work swell.

But who would use them? Compared to today's products, these ancient
models are heavy, bulky, and limited in function. Heck, they don't
even have built in lights, bubble-levels, or radios.

LMFAO, I often wondered how well a bubble level would work on the top
of a drill. What a bunch of weekend warrior gimmicks. Give me a
freakin break.


You may be correct. Modern drills are light enough to use with one hand
while the other holds a square. But you have to keep moving the square!
Nowdays, drills have those little target levels so you can get the hole
perfect in all directions! They've got chucks that don't need keys,
battery operated so you can use 'em anywhere, little clips to hold
spare/extra screw bits, all kinds of goodness.

That, and I like to listen to the radio.


I freakin' HATE keyless chucks. Inevitably I will have to drill a hole
in steel sheet and the drill bit I need will be some old thing without
the three flats on it, and inevitably it will catch, a keyless chuck
simply does not grip the bit tight enough to keep it from spinning.
Reverse it out, remove bit, gently file the burrs off the shank, try
again, catch, spin, repeat 3x, finally hole is done, clean up with
reamer and chamfer, now you have to file the drill bit again 'cause the
burr won't let it fit into your drill index...

just give me a good old fashioned Jacobs keyed chuck, thank you.

nate



I always love it when your drilling into hard dry wood and the drill sticks
then you reverse it and the drill bit is now stuck in the wood and the only
way to get it out is with vise grips and like you say you end up either
breaking it or burring it. And sometimes if it breaks your screwed because
that's the only hole you could drill for appearance purposes.

--
"You can lead them to LINUX
but you can't make them THINK"
Running Mandriva release 2008.0 free-i586 using KDE on i586
Website Address http://rentmyhusband.co.nr/

"RLM" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 02 Aug 2008 17:42:05 -0500, Ralph Mowery wrote:


"The Postman" route23@pod wrote in message
Excellent perception.
Made in the USA doesn't always mean the best possible product for the
buck.
Pride in workmanship starts at the top.


Also how much pride do you think I or others like me can take when the
following hapens to them?
I was promised a good eairly retirement when I started at 23 years old if I
worked for the comapny for 30 years and was over 55. Around the time I
turned 53 the company was sold and the new owners decided not to honor that
agreement. That now means instead of retiring at 55 or 60 I will have to
work to atleast 62 or maybe 65 when the medicare insurance starts.
Then I look at Home Depot and see they 'fired' the CEO and gave him around
120 million to leave. Poor Ford Motor comapny CEO only got about 20 million
to leave. I did manage to loose about $ 10,000
in the Ford stock when it fell from around $ 27 to $ 10. See that it is
around $ 5 now. Guess that I did save a few dollars by getting out at $ 10.

Seems the government lets the big boys get payed when they are fired for
poor job performance, while the workers get shafted for working.

In article ,
"Ralph Mowery" wrote:


Seems the government lets the big boys get payed when they are fired for
poor job performance, while the workers get shafted for working.

Government doesn't really have a dog in this fight. I am assuming
that you aren't suggesting that the government mandated the changes in
your situation.

evodawg wrote:
Have you noticed that our choices for Pro Line Tools are diminishing fast!
It use to be there was 4 or 5 choices for good quality power tools. Black
and Decker has bought up 3 of those products and now turned them into CRAP!
What are our choices now? None. Most of my power tools are Porter Cable and
I have had great luck with them. I have a 14.4 drill/driver that has lasted
7 years and I use it everyday. I have already seen the quality of this tool
drop from Pro Line to Week End Warrior status. What are we suppose to use
now when we want Quality and Dependability?

Bosch comes to mind and Festool, but I'm not sure who builds these. I'm sure
every tool built now comes with China fasteners and what few metal parts
are left in them. I'm just getting sick of large corps. buying these tool
makers and turning them into cheap ass trash not even worthy of Weekend
Warrior Status.

I needed to VENT and was wondering what you guys think of this trend?

Rich

Some of the best and highest quality power tools
I've ever used are manufactured by Hilti (Liechtenstein)
and Metabo (Germany). Their tools are very tough and
powerful. If you ever come across any in a pawn shop,
snatch them up if the price is reasonable.

[8~{} Uncle Monster

What qualifications do I need, in order to have your permission to reply?

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"evodawg" wrote in message
...
Have you noticed that our choices for Pro Line Tools are diminishing fast!
It use to be there was 4 or 5 choices for good quality power tools. Black
and Decker has bought up 3 of those products and now turned them into CRAP!
What are our choices now? None. Most of my power tools are Porter Cable and
I have had great luck with them. I have a 14.4 drill/driver that has lasted
7 years and I use it everyday. I have already seen the quality of this tool
drop from Pro Line to Week End Warrior status. What are we suppose to use
now when we want Quality and Dependability?

Bosch comes to mind and Festool, but I'm not sure who builds these. I'm sure
every tool built now comes with China fasteners and what few metal parts
are left in them. I'm just getting sick of large corps. buying these tool
makers and turning them into cheap ass trash not even worthy of Weekend
Warrior Status.

I needed to VENT and was wondering what you guys think of this trend?

Rich

"evodawg" wrote in message
...
Have you noticed that our choices for Pro Line Tools are diminishing fast!
It use to be there was 4 or 5 choices for good quality power tools.

So, only professionals can reply. Us no-pro, but serious tool uses don't
count? If not for us, the pro would have even less choices. We buy the PC,
Bosch, Festool and the like that makes for enough volume to support the pro
line manufacturing.

Get your head out of your ass and consider the serious tool user, not just
the pro.

"Nate Nagel" wrote in message

I freakin' HATE keyless chucks. Inevitably I will have to drill a hole in
steel sheet and the drill bit I need will be some old thing without the
three flats on it, and inevitably it will catch, a keyless chuck simply
does not grip the bit tight enough to keep it from spinning.

Like everything else, they have there place I don't want one on my drill
press, but I certainly like the one on my Panasonic drill. I don't drill
steel with a hand drill very often though.

evodawg wrote:
Have you noticed that our choices for Pro ...


Professional what? Cross dresser? Is that what you think this
typewriter-with-a-tv-screen thing is for?

Get over yourself. Welcome to the IntarWeeb©®.

a

Nate Nagel wrote:

I freakin' HATE keyless chucks. Inevitably I will have to drill a
hole in steel sheet and the drill bit I need will be some old thing
without the three flats on it, and inevitably it will catch, a
keyless chuck simply does not grip the bit tight enough to keep it
from spinning. Reverse it out, remove bit, gently file the burrs off
the shank, try again, catch, spin, repeat 3x, finally hole is done,
clean up with reamer and chamfer, now you have to file the drill bit
again 'cause the burr won't let it fit into your drill index...

just give me a good old fashioned Jacobs keyed chuck, thank you.


To each his own. From now on, when I hear someone pining for the
good-old-days, I'll think of you.

And dentistry.