I swapped out my incandescent lights for the spiral fluorescent
lights. They are rated for 5 years (some maybe 7years) at 4 hours
usage per day. In both my old house and in my new home, I am not
getting anywhere near that. My longest one, the one least used lasted
2 years.

With the initial higher cost of the bulb, I'm GUESSING I would need
the bulb to last close to at least 4 years to pay for itself. The
bulbs run about $7 for 3ea 100 watt equivalent (they use 26 watts)
Maybe someone could help me on this math or show me how to figure out
how long they'd need to last to be a better buy then incandescents.

Is anyone else using these fluorescent lights? I get them at Wal-Mart
so it is whatever brand they carry. My current bad bulb is made by
Commercial Electric. It had a 7 year guarantee. It was installed
2005-01-06. At the rated 4 hours a day, I should have gotten 10,192
hours of use. I had the bulb for about 19,000 hours. If I ran it non
stop, day and night, I could have burned it out. But why the heck
would I buy an energy saving bulb if I wasn't trying to save energy.


What kind of hours are YOU getting? Have you folks in CA switched yet
before it becomes law?



Also, does anyone know of any light sources that use LEDs for the
home? I saw one at Lowe's ( like a Home Depo/Builders Square ) but it
seemed to be more for ambient light then to light a room or task
lighting. But some kind of device with a few dozen LEDs in it that
screwed into a standard socket would be pretty cool. I hear that LEDs
are as more efficient then fluorescent. Don't know if it is true but
I THINK I saw something that claimed the difference in efficiency
between LEDs and fluorescent's was about the same as the difference
between fluorescent's and incandescents. But that doesn't seem right
to me because fluorescent's are in the 90-95% efficiency range, right?
Again, I don't know, but I have started my search for better
fluorescent and LED lights.

But I would like your feed back - mainly on the life of your
fluorescent lights, but all the other stuff too.

( Got to remember to take the ambien after I write the emails. Wait,
did I take it yet? Well, better to be sure and take one more.)

Thanks

Bonnie
lass

I got some of those GE brand ones at Walmart and all I have is trouble
with them. I just installed one about 5 weeks ago and last week it
began to go on and off all the time.

I have some of the original straight U shaped CF's that have been in
my home for 5 years and they still work fine. One of them is left on
all night every night. These new spiral ones are garbage, at least
the GE brans sold at Walmart. I just complained to the company, and
they said they want me to send the bulb and a receipt. I can send the
bulb (as long as they payt the shipping), but I dont save receipts for
small items. I got more important things to do with my time than
collect paper. I think I am going back to common lightbulbs.



On Tue, 03 Apr 2007 01:51:58 -0400, Bonnie Peebles
wrote:

I swapped out my incandescent lights for the spiral fluorescent
lights. They are rated for 5 years (some maybe 7years) at 4 hours
usage per day. In both my old house and in my new home, I am not
getting anywhere near that. My longest one, the one least used lasted
2 years.

With the initial higher cost of the bulb, I'm GUESSING I would need
the bulb to last close to at least 4 years to pay for itself. The
bulbs run about $7 for 3ea 100 watt equivalent (they use 26 watts)
Maybe someone could help me on this math or show me how to figure out
how long they'd need to last to be a better buy then incandescents.

Is anyone else using these fluorescent lights? I get them at Wal-Mart
so it is whatever brand they carry. My current bad bulb is made by
Commercial Electric. It had a 7 year guarantee. It was installed
2005-01-06. At the rated 4 hours a day, I should have gotten 10,192
hours of use. I had the bulb for about 19,000 hours. If I ran it non
stop, day and night, I could have burned it out. But why the heck
would I buy an energy saving bulb if I wasn't trying to save energy.


What kind of hours are YOU getting? Have you folks in CA switched yet
before it becomes law?



Also, does anyone know of any light sources that use LEDs for the
home? I saw one at Lowe's ( like a Home Depo/Builders Square ) but it
seemed to be more for ambient light then to light a room or task
lighting. But some kind of device with a few dozen LEDs in it that
screwed into a standard socket would be pretty cool. I hear that LEDs
are as more efficient then fluorescent. Don't know if it is true but
I THINK I saw something that claimed the difference in efficiency
between LEDs and fluorescent's was about the same as the difference
between fluorescent's and incandescents. But that doesn't seem right
to me because fluorescent's are in the 90-95% efficiency range, right?
Again, I don't know, but I have started my search for better
fluorescent and LED lights.

But I would like your feed back - mainly on the life of your
fluorescent lights, but all the other stuff too.

( Got to remember to take the ambien after I write the emails. Wait,
did I take it yet? Well, better to be sure and take one more.)

Thanks

Bonnie
lass

wrote:
I got some of those GE brand ones at Walmart and all I have is trouble
with them. I just installed one about 5 weeks ago and last week it
began to go on and off all the time.

I have some of the original straight U shaped CF's that have been in
my home for 5 years and they still work fine. One of them is left on
all night every night. These new spiral ones are garbage, at least
the GE brans sold at Walmart. I just complained to the company, and
they said they want me to send the bulb and a receipt. I can send the
bulb (as long as they payt the shipping), but I dont save receipts for
small items. I got more important things to do with my time than
collect paper. I think I am going back to common lightbulbs.



On Tue, 03 Apr 2007 01:51:58 -0400, Bonnie Peebles
wrote:


I swapped out my incandescent lights for the spiral fluorescent
lights. They are rated for 5 years (some maybe 7years) at 4 hours
usage per day. In both my old house and in my new home, I am not
getting anywhere near that. My longest one, the one least used lasted
2 years.

With the initial higher cost of the bulb, I'm GUESSING I would need
the bulb to last close to at least 4 years to pay for itself. The
bulbs run about $7 for 3ea 100 watt equivalent (they use 26 watts)
Maybe someone could help me on this math or show me how to figure out
how long they'd need to last to be a better buy then incandescents.

Is anyone else using these fluorescent lights? I get them at Wal-Mart
so it is whatever brand they carry. My current bad bulb is made by
Commercial Electric. It had a 7 year guarantee. It was installed
2005-01-06. At the rated 4 hours a day, I should have gotten 10,192
hours of use. I had the bulb for about 19,000 hours. If I ran it non
stop, day and night, I could have burned it out. But why the heck
would I buy an energy saving bulb if I wasn't trying to save energy.


What kind of hours are YOU getting? Have you folks in CA switched yet
before it becomes law?



Also, does anyone know of any light sources that use LEDs for the
home? I saw one at Lowe's ( like a Home Depo/Builders Square ) but it
seemed to be more for ambient light then to light a room or task
lighting. But some kind of device with a few dozen LEDs in it that
screwed into a standard socket would be pretty cool. I hear that LEDs
are as more efficient then fluorescent. Don't know if it is true but
I THINK I saw something that claimed the difference in efficiency
between LEDs and fluorescent's was about the same as the difference
between fluorescent's and incandescents. But that doesn't seem right
to me because fluorescent's are in the 90-95% efficiency range, right?
Again, I don't know, but I have started my search for better
fluorescent and LED lights.

But I would like your feed back - mainly on the life of your
fluorescent lights, but all the other stuff too.

( Got to remember to take the ambien after I write the emails. Wait,
did I take it yet? Well, better to be sure and take one more.)

Thanks

Bonnie
lass




Well, it all depends upon what you are willing to do to enforce the
representations the
manufacturers make. If you are willing to do enough, you will make out
fine; if not, you'll
get screwed ( thats a pun with respect to light bulbs which I did not
intend, but its still funny.)
Me, I really don't like to let a manufacturer or a marketer get away
with misrepresentations. YMMV.

I buy the compact flourescents in bulk at Costco. I staple the Costco
recept to the blister pack.
When I install a CFL I use a black sharpie to mark the installation
date on the bulb base. If the
bulb fails in less than 5 or 7 or whatever years as marked on the
package, I have a canned
letter in my word processor system which I send to Costco in Kirkland,
WA and the bulb
manufacturer. In every instance I have received a replacement buld at
o cost.

I started this with a bunch of Phillips CFL bulbs which failed
miserably in less s than 6 months.
I had fortitously ( naw, honestly its a real junk pile out in the
garage and I was just lucky)
kept the bulb package and the receipt. After that experience I won't
let the mfgrs. or the
vendors screw me on the bulb life representations they choose o make.
If a mfgr makes a
representation / promise on bulb life, they need to live up to it.

Side note, other than a canderlabra / chandelier fixture for which I
have found no replacement
CFL fluted bulbs, and the outdoor security lights where ambient
temperature works against CFLs,
I have replaced every incandescent bulb in the house with CFLs. I have
literally cut my KWH
monthly by 33 %. Sadly, because of the rate increases ( Portland, OR -
Portland General Electric),
I haven't cut my bill by that much, but without the massive CFL
replacement, and consequent
KWH decline, my bill would be a whole lot higher. IU wuldn't co back
to incandescents. .

Again, its a function of what you are willing to do, both for aggressive
CFL replacement of
incandescents and record keeping to keep the CFL manufacturers and
vendors honest.

I am looking forward to reasonably priced LEDs.

Bonnie Peebles wrote:
I swapped out my incandescent lights for the spiral fluorescent
lights. They are rated for 5 years (some maybe 7years) at 4 hours
usage per day. In both my old house and in my new home, I am not
getting anywhere near that. My longest one, the one least used lasted
2 years.

Fluorescent light lifetime is affected by how often it gets switched on
and off. They're most effective when used for lights that stay on for a
long time once they're turned on.

It only takes the equivalent of about 20-30 seconds worth of electrical
power to turn on a fluorescent, but the more frequently you cycle them
the faster they die.

Chris

Chris Friesen wrote:

Fluorescent light lifetime is affected by how often it gets switched on...

Each start uses up about 6 minutes of their 10K-20K hour lifetime.

It only takes the equivalent of about 20-30 seconds worth of electrical
power to turn on a fluorescent...

No. Less than a second's worth of electrical energy.

Nick

Bonnie Peebles wrote:
I swapped out my incandescent lights for the spiral fluorescent
lights. They are rated for 5 years (some maybe 7years) at 4 hours
usage per day. In both my old house and in my new home, I am not
getting anywhere near that. My longest one, the one least used lasted
2 years.
...

The first ones I bought a few years ago did not last that long (at least
some did not), they were not as bright as expected, they did not come up to
full brightness very fast and overall were not all that good.

Those I have bought this year (three different types two brands) have
done everything well. I will be using more in the future.



--
Joseph Meehan

Dia 's Muire duit

On Apr 3, 6:40�am, "Joseph Meehan" wrote:
Bonnie Peebles wrote:
I swapped out my incandescent lights for the spiral fluorescent
lights. *They are rated for 5 years (some maybe 7years) at 4 hours
usage per day. *In both my old house and in my new home, I am not
getting anywhere near that. *My longest one, the one least used lasted
2 years.
*...

* * The first ones I bought a few years ago did not last that long (at least
some did not), they were not as bright as expected, they did not come up to
full brightness very fast and overall were not all that good.

* * Those I have bought this year (three different types two brands) have
done everything well. *I will be using more in the future.

--
Joseph Meehan

*Dia 's Muire duit

well they dont last as promoted, and I have had 2 burn out when waxing
living room tables, the aerosol spray mist appears to fry them.

needless to say I dont do hat again, one went poof with a little flame
and I wasnt spraying in the bulb, overspray did it in

"Bonnie Peebles" wrote in message
...
I swapped out my incandescent lights for the spiral fluorescent
lights. They are rated for 5 years (some maybe 7years) at 4 hours
usage per day. In both my old house and in my new home, I am not
getting anywhere near that. My longest one, the one least used lasted
2 years.

With the initial higher cost of the bulb, I'm GUESSING I would need
the bulb to last close to at least 4 years to pay for itself. The
bulbs run about $7 for 3ea 100 watt equivalent (they use 26 watts)
Maybe someone could help me on this math or show me how to figure out
how long they'd need to last to be a better buy then incandescents.

Is anyone else using these fluorescent lights? I get them at Wal-Mart
so it is whatever brand they carry. My current bad bulb is made by
Commercial Electric. It had a 7 year guarantee. It was installed
2005-01-06. At the rated 4 hours a day, I should have gotten 10,192
hours of use. I had the bulb for about 19,000 hours. If I ran it non
stop, day and night, I could have burned it out. But why the heck
would I buy an energy saving bulb if I wasn't trying to save energy.


What kind of hours are YOU getting? Have you folks in CA switched yet
before it becomes law?



Also, does anyone know of any light sources that use LEDs for the
home? I saw one at Lowe's ( like a Home Depo/Builders Square ) but it
seemed to be more for ambient light then to light a room or task
lighting. But some kind of device with a few dozen LEDs in it that
screwed into a standard socket would be pretty cool. I hear that LEDs
are as more efficient then fluorescent. Don't know if it is true but
I THINK I saw something that claimed the difference in efficiency
between LEDs and fluorescent's was about the same as the difference
between fluorescent's and incandescents. But that doesn't seem right
to me because fluorescent's are in the 90-95% efficiency range, right?
Again, I don't know, but I have started my search for better
fluorescent and LED lights.

But I would like your feed back - mainly on the life of your
fluorescent lights, but all the other stuff too.

( Got to remember to take the ambien after I write the emails. Wait,
did I take it yet? Well, better to be sure and take one more.)

Thanks

Bonnie

CFLs are not yet commodity items. Brands count from my experience and if
you just buy on price, performance is likely to be poor. I put in CFLs
about 4 years ago and haven't had a burnout as yet with several of the lamps
on 4-6 hours/day. Got the lamps at Target, but all were Energy Star listed.
That means the lamps are tested for life, light output, color, etc. and you
can complain to Energy Star if they don't perform. I always return lamps
that fail prematurely to the manufacturer (address is on the carton
typically). Not only do they replace the lamp, they usually include a
coupon or extra lamps -- at least the name brand companies.

LEDs are improving rapidly and make sense for certain applications (see
www.lightingfortomorrow.com ) for some examples. But they are heat
sensitive and packing them into something that looks like a standard light
bulb isn't a good application for them. And, it will be an expensive device
for some time to come. White light LEDs deliver about 30-40 lumens/watt
right now compared to 70-80 lumens/watt for CFLs. If you want to see an
incandescent to LED replacement that might work, go to:
http://www.ledlightingfixtures.com/ and notice the heat sink. We'll see
shortly if the company can get beyond press releases.

TKM

I've also noticed that the life of my 7 yr bulbs is closer to 90 days
for many in the pack.
I now keep the receipts and bulb packs.

Recenltly I bought a pack of 3 and 2 of them were defective (very
dim).

You should recover the cost in less than a year with normal use.





On Tue, 03 Apr 2007 01:51:58 -0400, Bonnie Peebles
wrote:

I swapped out my incandescent lights for the spiral fluorescent
lights. They are rated for 5 years (some maybe 7years) at 4 hours
usage per day. In both my old house and in my new home, I am not
getting anywhere near that. My longest one, the one least used lasted
2 years.

With the initial higher cost of the bulb, I'm GUESSING I would need
the bulb to last close to at least 4 years to pay for itself. The
bulbs run about $7 for 3ea 100 watt equivalent (they use 26 watts)
Maybe someone could help me on this math or show me how to figure out
how long they'd need to last to be a better buy then incandescents.

Is anyone else using these fluorescent lights? I get them at Wal-Mart
so it is whatever brand they carry. My current bad bulb is made by
Commercial Electric. It had a 7 year guarantee. It was installed
2005-01-06. At the rated 4 hours a day, I should have gotten 10,192
hours of use. I had the bulb for about 19,000 hours. If I ran it non
stop, day and night, I could have burned it out. But why the heck
would I buy an energy saving bulb if I wasn't trying to save energy.


What kind of hours are YOU getting? Have you folks in CA switched yet
before it becomes law?



Also, does anyone know of any light sources that use LEDs for the
home? I saw one at Lowe's ( like a Home Depo/Builders Square ) but it
seemed to be more for ambient light then to light a room or task
lighting. But some kind of device with a few dozen LEDs in it that
screwed into a standard socket would be pretty cool. I hear that LEDs
are as more efficient then fluorescent. Don't know if it is true but
I THINK I saw something that claimed the difference in efficiency
between LEDs and fluorescent's was about the same as the difference
between fluorescent's and incandescents. But that doesn't seem right
to me because fluorescent's are in the 90-95% efficiency range, right?
Again, I don't know, but I have started my search for better
fluorescent and LED lights.

But I would like your feed back - mainly on the life of your
fluorescent lights, but all the other stuff too.

( Got to remember to take the ambien after I write the emails. Wait,
did I take it yet? Well, better to be sure and take one more.)

Thanks

Bonnie
lass

wrote:
Chris Friesen wrote:

It only takes the equivalent of about 20-30 seconds worth of electrical
power to turn on a fluorescent...

No. Less than a second's worth of electrical energy.

I'd love to see your sources on that. The lowest I've seen is about 5
seconds worth of running energy to turn it on, with most places giving
the numbers I presented.

Chris

Bonnie Peebles wrote:

With the initial higher cost of the bulb, I'm GUESSING I would need
the bulb to last close to at least 4 years to pay for itself. The
bulbs run about $7 for 3ea 100 watt equivalent (they use 26 watts)

That's $2.33 each. It would pay for itself in H hours at C cents/kWh
compared to a 50 cent incandescent if HC(100-26)/1000 = 233-50, ie
H = 2493/C hours, eg 249 hours at 10 cents/kWh, eg 618 days
(1.7 years) if used for 4 hours per day.

Is anyone else using these fluorescent lights?

Sure.

I get them at Wal-Mart so it is whatever brand they carry. My current
bad bulb is made by Commercial Electric. It had a 7 year guarantee.

When I called Commercial Electric with the 800 number printed on the CFs
I bought at Home Depot and gave them the date code on the dead bulb,
they sent me a new one, free.

Nick

Chris Friesen wrote:

It only takes the equivalent of about 20-30 seconds worth of electrical
power to turn on a fluorescent...

No. Less than a second's worth of electrical energy.

I'd love to see your sources on that. The lowest I've seen is about 5
seconds worth of running energy to turn it on, with most places giving
the numbers I presented.

Where did you find those numbers? :-)

Nick

wrote:
Chris Friesen wrote:

I'd love to see your sources on that. The lowest I've seen is about 5
seconds worth of running energy to turn it on, with most places giving
the numbers I presented.

Where did you find those numbers? :-)

Just did some more digging.

Mythbusters did an episode where they actually measured it.

http://kwc.org/mythbusters/2006/12/e..._fall_lig.html

They found that for a standard fluorescent lamp (they didn't specify
ballast type) it took about 23 seconds to make up for the startup surge.
With a CFL, however, it took 0.015 seconds.

Some other sources specified a 5-second time for fluorescent lamps.
However, these also looked at the deterioriation due to the actual
switching and concluded that once you factor in lamp replacement you're
better off leaving it running if you're going to need it in 15-20 minutes.

http://lightingdesignlab.com/article...luorescent.htm
http://www.eere.energy.gov/consumer/.../mytopic=12280
http://oee.nrcan.gc.ca/energystar/en...=N&printview=N

Chris

"Chris Friesen" wrote in message
...
wrote:
Chris Friesen wrote:

I'd love to see your sources on that. The lowest I've seen is about 5
seconds worth of running energy to turn it on, with most places giving
the numbers I presented.

Where did you find those numbers? :-)

Just did some more digging.

Mythbusters did an episode where they actually measured it.

http://kwc.org/mythbusters/2006/12/e..._fall_lig.html

They found that for a standard fluorescent lamp (they didn't specify
ballast type) it took about 23 seconds to make up for the startup surge.
With a CFL, however, it took 0.015 seconds.

Some other sources specified a 5-second time for fluorescent lamps.
However, these also looked at the deterioriation due to the actual
switching and concluded that once you factor in lamp replacement you're
better off leaving it running if you're going to need it in 15-20 minutes.

http://lightingdesignlab.com/article...luorescent.htm
http://www.eere.energy.gov/consumer/.../mytopic=12280
http://oee.nrcan.gc.ca/energystar/en...=N&printview=N

Chris

Where did this "starting surge" thing come from? I've worked with
fluorescent ballasts for 30+ years and never saw anything in the
specifications or on a 'scope to indicate there was more than a minor
current pulse (a few milliseconds) at turn-on. For most CFLs you can't even
see that.

Incandescent lamps are much, much worse. They can draw 20 times normal
current at start-up from cold for the first cycle or two; but even that
doesn't translate into anyting that shows up on the electric bill.

There's a reference called the Illuminating Engineering Society Handbook
(8th. Ed.) which has all the curves. Unfortunately, it's not on line; but
it is usually in technical libraries.

TKM

Chris Friesen wrote:

Mythbusters did an episode where they actually measured it.

http://kwc.org/mythbusters/2006/12/e..._fall_lig.html

They found that for a standard fluorescent lamp (they didn't specify
ballast type) it took about 23 seconds to make up for the startup surge.

Sounds bogus. For one thing, they wrote about "watts per hour" (meaningless
in this context), until corrected. For another, it looks like they tested
a 10 watt (very small) fluorescent, and they only measured the startup
current, vs the energy, including the power factor.

If a lamp really used a lot more starting than running power, it would
likely blow breakers on startup.

Nick

On 3 Apr 2007 12:29:02 -0400, wrote:

Bonnie Peebles wrote:

With the initial higher cost of the bulb, I'm GUESSING I would need
the bulb to last close to at least 4 years to pay for itself. The
bulbs run about $7 for 3ea 100 watt equivalent (they use 26 watts)

That's $2.33 each. It would pay for itself in H hours at C cents/kWh
compared to a 50 cent incandescent if HC(100-26)/1000 = 233-50, ie
H = 2493/C hours, eg 249 hours at 10 cents/kWh, eg 618 days
(1.7 years) if used for 4 hours per day.

Is anyone else using these fluorescent lights?

Sure.

I get them at Wal-Mart so it is whatever brand they carry. My current
bad bulb is made by Commercial Electric. It had a 7 year guarantee.

When I called Commercial Electric with the 800 number printed on the CFs
I bought at Home Depot and gave them the date code on the dead bulb,
they sent me a new one, free.

Nick

I have in front of me 6 power companies and their kwh cost. Not one
of them approaches10 cents.

On Tue, 03 Apr 2007 14:08:43 -0500, deke wrote:

I have in front of me 6 power companies and their kwh cost. Not one
of them approaches10 cents.

According to the EIA, the average retail price paid by residential
consumers last year was 10.4 cents per kWh.

Source: http://www.eia.doe.gov/cneaf/electri.../table5_3.html

Cheers,
Paul

Bonnie Peebles writes:

Also, does anyone know of any light sources that use LEDs for the
home? I saw one at Lowe's ( like a Home Depo/Builders Square ) but it
seemed to be more for ambient light then to light a room or task
lighting. But some kind of device with a few dozen LEDs in it that
screwed into a standard socket would be pretty cool. I hear that LEDs
are as more efficient then fluorescent.

There are companies selling LED-based light sources. TIR Systems
(http://www.tirsys.com) is one that's located a few miles from me. They
were recently purchased by Philips.

But so far they're more expensive than other light sources. It's worth
it if you need the ability to change light colour, but they are *less*
efficient than CFL. They're more efficient than incandescent, even
halogen incandescent, and still getting better so they may pass CFL one
day.

Dave

On Tue, 3 Apr 2007 20:23:53 +0000 (UTC), (Dave
Martindale) wrote:


But so far they're more expensive than other light sources. It's worth
it if you need the ability to change light colour, but they are *less*
efficient than CFL. They're more efficient than incandescent, even
halogen incandescent, and still getting better so they may pass CFL one
day.

LED flashlights, with say 14 leds, are pretty good in total darkness,
just as one AAA cell in a little penlight can do a lot, in total
darkness. Probably even a lot better than the penlight.

But for real light, when there is light in the rest of the room, we
have to wait.

Dave

The benefit of fluorescent lights is reduced greatly in places where
they are only used for short periods of time, such as in bathrooms.

For several years, California has had a building code requirement that
requires general lighting in bathrooms to be fluorescent. Creative
builders meet this rule by providing a CFL integrated with the exhaust
fan while having an incandescent light bar over the mirror.

On Apr 3, 7:56 am, "TKM" wrote:
"Bonnie Peebles" wrote in message

...





I swapped out my incandescent lights for the spiral fluorescent
lights. They are rated for 5 years (some maybe 7years) at 4 hours
usage per day. In both my old house and in my new home, I am not
getting anywhere near that. My longest one, the one least used lasted
2 years.

With the initial higher cost of the bulb, I'm GUESSING I would need
the bulb to last close to at least 4 years to pay for itself. The
bulbs run about $7 for 3ea 100 watt equivalent (they use 26 watts)
Maybe someone could help me on this math or show me how to figure out
how long they'd need to last to be a better buy then incandescents.

Is anyone else using these fluorescent lights? I get them at Wal-Mart
so it is whatever brand they carry. My current bad bulb is made by
Commercial Electric. It had a 7 year guarantee. It was installed
2005-01-06. At the rated 4 hours a day, I should have gotten 10,192
hours of use. I had the bulb for about 19,000 hours. If I ran it non
stop, day and night, I could have burned it out. But why the heck
would I buy an energy saving bulb if I wasn't trying to save energy.

What kind of hours are YOU getting? Have you folks in CA switched yet
before it becomes law?

Also, does anyone know of any light sources that use LEDs for the
home? I saw one at Lowe's ( like a Home Depo/Builders Square ) but it
seemed to be more for ambient light then to light a room or task
lighting. But some kind of device with a few dozen LEDs in it that
screwed into a standard socket would be pretty cool. I hear that LEDs
are as more efficient then fluorescent. Don't know if it is true but
I THINK I saw something that claimed the difference in efficiency
between LEDs and fluorescent's was about the same as the difference
between fluorescent's and incandescents. But that doesn't seem right
to me because fluorescent's are in the 90-95% efficiency range, right?
Again, I don't know, but I have started my search for better
fluorescent and LED lights.

But I would like your feed back - mainly on the life of your
fluorescent lights, but all the other stuff too.

( Got to remember to take the ambien after I write the emails. Wait,
did I take it yet? Well, better to be sure and take one more.)

Thanks

Bonnie

CFLs are not yet commodity items. Brands count from my experience and if
you just buy on price, performance is likely to be poor. I put in CFLs
about 4 years ago and haven't had a burnout as yet with several of the lamps
on 4-6 hours/day. Got the lamps at Target, but all were Energy Star listed.
That means the lamps are tested for life, light output, color, etc. and you
can complain to Energy Star if they don't perform. I always return lamps
that fail prematurely to the manufacturer (address is on the carton
typically). Not only do they replace the lamp, they usually include a
coupon or extra lamps -- at least the name brand companies.

LEDs are improving rapidly and make sense for certain applications (seewww.lightingfortomorrow.com) for some examples. But they are heat
sensitive and packing them into something that looks like a standard light
bulb isn't a good application for them. And, it will be an expensive device
for some time to come. White light LEDs deliver about 30-40 lumens/watt
right now compared to 70-80 lumens/watt for CFLs. If you want to see an
incandescent to LED replacement that might work, go to:http://www.ledlightingfixtures.com/ and notice the heat sink. We'll see
shortly if the company can get beyond press releases.

I would think that shipping cost would cost as much as the
replacement.

Do they pay shipping too?

I was thinking about trying to take them back to Walmart next time
they fail.
Walmart is pretty good about returning stuff if you have the receipt.

On a side note. I have heard that having the lamps with the base at
the bottom lasts longer than having the base at the top. ie desk lamp
vs ceiling light. Extra heat on the electronics.

On Tue, 03 Apr 2007 01:07:02 -0600, Chris Friesen
wrote:

Bonnie Peebles wrote:
I swapped out my incandescent lights for the spiral fluorescent
lights. They are rated for 5 years (some maybe 7years) at 4 hours
usage per day. In both my old house and in my new home, I am not
getting anywhere near that. My longest one, the one least used lasted
2 years.

Fluorescent light lifetime is affected by how often it gets switched on
and off. They're most effective when used for lights that stay on for a
long time once they're turned on.

It only takes the equivalent of about 20-30 seconds worth of electrical
power to turn on a fluorescent, but the more frequently you cycle them
the faster they die.

Chris


SO, if I go in the bathroom for a total of one half hour per night and
have two 60W indecesant bulbs in the fixtures, then I consume a total
of 60W per day. If these same two fixtures each have 15W CF bulbs
(equivalant to 60W), but have to leave them on 24/7, I am using 720W
per day. That is far from being a savings, particularly when you
consider the CF bulb costs $3 or so, and the indec bulb costs 25
cents. Until they come up with a CF bulb that can last as long as
advertised, and can be turned on and off as needed, I will not buy any
more of them. Besides the one that I mentioned yesterday that lasted
5 or 6 weeks, or less than 100 hours, I have had another one flare up,
causing sparks and a bathroom filled with stinky smoke. Luckily no
fire, but the smoke was terrible and seeing sparks blowing around the
room is not my idea of fun. Additionally, this is not the first bulb
that has died before its rated time. In fact, almost all of these
spiral types are dying in short time, whereas the original straight
CFs seem to last and last and last. I dont even see that type sold
anymore.

wrote:
On Tue, 03 Apr 2007 01:07:02 -0600, Chris Friesen
wrote:

Bonnie Peebles wrote:
I swapped out my incandescent lights for the spiral fluorescent
lights. They are rated for 5 years (some maybe 7years) at 4 hours
usage per day. In both my old house and in my new home, I am not
getting anywhere near that. My longest one, the one least used
lasted 2 years.

Fluorescent light lifetime is affected by how often it gets switched
on and off. They're most effective when used for lights that stay
on for a long time once they're turned on.

It only takes the equivalent of about 20-30 seconds worth of
electrical power to turn on a fluorescent, but the more frequently
you cycle them the faster they die.

Chris


SO, if I go in the bathroom for a total of one half hour per night and
have two 60W indecesant bulbs in the fixtures, then I consume a total
of 60W per day.

Watt hours ???? :-)

If these same two fixtures each have 15W CF bulbs
(equivalant to 60W), but have to leave them on 24/7, I am using 720W
per day. That is far from being a savings, particularly when you
consider the CF bulb costs $3 or so, and the indec bulb costs 25
cents. Until they come up with a CF bulb that can last as long as
advertised, and can be turned on and off as needed, I will not buy any
more of them. Besides the one that I mentioned yesterday that lasted
5 or 6 weeks, or less than 100 hours, I have had another one flare up,
causing sparks and a bathroom filled with stinky smoke. Luckily no
fire, but the smoke was terrible and seeing sparks blowing around the
room is not my idea of fun. Additionally, this is not the first bulb
that has died before its rated time. In fact, almost all of these
spiral types are dying in short time, whereas the original straight
CFs seem to last and last and last. I dont even see that type sold
anymore.


I would imagine that Chris was suggesting that fluorescent lighting was
better used in locations where there would be longer use of the lights.

When I was in college many years ago we computed that the lights they
were using at that time had to be off for more than 48 minutes to break even
cost wise, not counting the cost of labor of replacement.

Today's lamps are far different and the penalty for short time usage is
far less for the better lamps available today. However not all lamps
available today are any better and I suspect some are worse. I suspect the
differences we are seeing in results from CFs and other newer lamps has a
lot to do with the quality of their design and build.

--
Joseph Meehan

Dia 's Muire duit

"Paul M. Eldridge" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 03 Apr 2007 14:08:43 -0500, deke wrote:

I have in front of me 6 power companies and their kwh cost. Not one
of them approaches10 cents.

According to the EIA, the average retail price paid by residential
consumers last year was 10.4 cents per kWh.

Source: http://www.eia.doe.gov/cneaf/electri.../table5_3.html

Cheers,
Paul

Posted rates don't tell the whole story. There are service charges and
taxes added on, for example. Take your total bill and divide by the kWh
used to get your actual rate. Mine was $0.132/kWh in March. A friend in
western New York, however, just paid over $0.30/kWh on vacation home
because the fees and taxes swamped the cost of the low kWh use.

TKM

On Wed, 04 Apr 2007 01:36:28 -0500, wrote:

On Tue, 03 Apr 2007 01:07:02 -0600, Chris Friesen
wrote:

Bonnie Peebles wrote:
I swapped out my incandescent lights for the spiral fluorescent
lights. They are rated for 5 years (some maybe 7years) at 4 hours
usage per day. In both my old house and in my new home, I am not
getting anywhere near that. My longest one, the one least used lasted
2 years.

Fluorescent light lifetime is affected by how often it gets switched on
and off. They're most effective when used for lights that stay on for a
long time once they're turned on.

It only takes the equivalent of about 20-30 seconds worth of electrical
power to turn on a fluorescent, but the more frequently you cycle them
the faster they die.

Chris


SO, if I go in the bathroom for a total of one half hour per night and
have two 60W indecesant bulbs in the fixtures, then I consume a total
of 60W per day. If these same two fixtures each have 15W CF bulbs
(equivalant to 60W), but have to leave them on 24/7, I am using 720W
per day. That is far from being a savings, particularly when you
consider the CF bulb costs $3 or so, and the indec bulb costs 25
cents. Until they come up with a CF bulb that can last as long as
advertised, and can be turned on and off as needed, I will not buy any
more of them. Besides the one that I mentioned yesterday that lasted
5 or 6 weeks, or less than 100 hours, I have had another one flare up,
causing sparks and a bathroom filled with stinky smoke. Luckily no
fire, but the smoke was terrible and seeing sparks blowing around the
room is not my idea of fun. Additionally, this is not the first bulb
that has died before its rated time. In fact, almost all of these
spiral types are dying in short time, whereas the original straight
CFs seem to last and last and last. I dont even see that type sold
anymore.


I put a string of 35 yellow LED holiday lights in my bathroom. These
give off enough light I almost never need the regular light.

Those lights consume about 1.8W. Multiplied by 24 hours, that's 43.2
watt-hours.

BTW, I always thought that "24/7" stuff sounded stupid. It's ALL THE
TIME!
--
Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.laughingsquid.com

"Never underestimate the power of stupid
people in large groups"

TKM wrote:

Posted rates don't tell the whole story. There are service charges and
taxes added on, for example. Take your total bill and divide by the kWh
used to get your actual rate.

That's not the whole story either, because then the "rate" is dependent
on consumption and cannot directly be compared.

It's most accurate to describe the power bill as a linear function of
the form "mx + b", where b is a constant charge, m is the rate per kWh,
and x is the power usage. This is more complicated, but it reflects the
actual billing structure rather than trying to force it into a single
number.

Chris

wrote:

SO, if I go in the bathroom for a total of one half hour per night and
have two 60W indecesant bulbs in the fixtures, then I consume a total
of 60W per day. If these same two fixtures each have 15W CF bulbs
(equivalant to 60W), but have to leave them on 24/7, I am using 720W
per day. That is far from being a savings, particularly when you
consider the CF bulb costs $3 or so, and the indec bulb costs 25
cents.

Why would you leave them on all day? All I said was that the more you
turn them on/off, the faster they wear out.


Around here, Philips CFLs are available easily for $2/bulb at the local
Home Depot.

At 10.4 cents/KWh, it takes 16.82 KWh to make up the price difference,
or around 280 hrs of runtime for the bulbs you specified above. As long
as they don't wear out before that then they make sense.

Turning them on/off once a night shouldn't be a problem--any CFL should
be able to last for years under those conditions, and if it doesn't I'd
contact the manufacturer. For a pantry light that may get cycled a
dozen times while making a meal and is only on for a few seconds at a
time, they're probably not the best thing to use.

For my home office where the lights get turned on in the morning and
stay on basically all day, the bulbs pay for themselves in a couple months.

Chris

Mark Lloyd wrote:
BTW, I always thought that "24/7" stuff sounded stupid.

That's 'cause you left off the /365 part.

--
Music hath charms to soothe the savage breast.
That's why stereo has two channels.

On Wed, 04 Apr 2007 14:59:56 -0500, clifto wrote:

Mark Lloyd wrote:
BTW, I always thought that "24/7" stuff sounded stupid.

That's 'cause you left off the /365 part.

As in "24/7/365"? I get the idea people who use that think they're
describing one year, not the SEVEN that are actually there (365
WEEKS).
--
Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.laughingsquid.com

"Never underestimate the power of stupid
people in large groups"

On Wed, 04 Apr 2007 17:08:44 GMT, "TKM" wrote:

"Paul M. Eldridge" wrote in message

According to the EIA, the average retail price paid by residential
consumers last year was 10.4 cents per kWh.

Source: http://www.eia.doe.gov/cneaf/electri.../table5_3.html

Cheers,
Paul

Posted rates don't tell the whole story. There are service charges and
taxes added on, for example. Take your total bill and divide by the kWh
used to get your actual rate. Mine was $0.132/kWh in March. A friend in
western New York, however, just paid over $0.30/kWh on vacation home
because the fees and taxes swamped the cost of the low kWh use.

TKM

Hi Terry,

I'm not sure what "additional" charges, if any, are included in the
stated price (e.g., stranded debt, transmission & distribution, etc.).
The accompanying footnote tells us that "[p]rices are calculated by
dividing revenue by sales", so that would suggest it does, in fact,
include all of these miscellaneous items and quite possibly the fixed
charges as well.

Cheers,
Paul

In article ,
wrote:
On Tue, 03 Apr 2007 01:07:02 -0600, Chris Friesen
wrote:

Bonnie Peebles wrote:
I swapped out my incandescent lights for the spiral fluorescent
lights. They are rated for 5 years (some maybe 7years) at 4 hours
usage per day. In both my old house and in my new home, I am not
getting anywhere near that. My longest one, the one least used lasted
2 years.

Fluorescent light lifetime is affected by how often it gets switched on
and off. They're most effective when used for lights that stay on for a
long time once they're turned on.

It only takes the equivalent of about 20-30 seconds worth of electrical
power to turn on a fluorescent, but the more frequently you cycle them
the faster they die.

Excess power consumption by a fluorescent during starting is somewhere
between nonexistent and equivalent to 1 second or so of continuous
operation.

Chris

SO, if I go in the bathroom for a total of one half hour per night and
have two 60W indecesant bulbs in the fixtures, then I consume a total
of 60W per day. If these same two fixtures each have 15W CF bulbs
(equivalant to 60W), but have to leave them on 24/7, I am using 720W
per day.

You mean watt-hours, not watts.

Meanwhile, if you have them on once a day for half an hour, they will
last longer if you have them off the other 23.5 hours. A start usually
costs something like 10 minutes of life.

That is far from being a savings, particularly when you
consider the CF bulb costs $3 or so, and the indec bulb costs 25
cents. Until they come up with a CF bulb that can last as long as
advertised, and can be turned on and off as needed, I will not buy any
more of them. Besides the one that I mentioned yesterday that lasted
5 or 6 weeks, or less than 100 hours,

If that one had a limited warranty, you can make good on it. Many have
these limited warranties for home use.

I have had another one flare up causing sparks and a bathroom filled
with stinky smoke.

Was that a dollar store junker? I never had any other than dollar store
junkers do that. In my experience, most dollar store ones lack UL
listing, while most other screw base (ballast included) CFLs have that.
(Ballastless lightbulbs don't appear to me to need that.)

Additionally, this is not the first bulb that has died before its rated
time. In fact, almost all of these spiral types are dying in short time,

In my experience, spirals mostly outlast incandescents by far.

The main exceptions:

1) A Lights of America one and one bad run of GE ones - 25 watts,
purchased around 2001. (I have also experienced more than a fair share of
problems with non-spiral Lights of America CFLs.)

2) Ones overheating in small enclosed fixtures or in recessed ceiling
fixtures.

3) High wattage ones (like 42 watts) operating base-up.

whereas the original straight CFs seem to last and last and last. I dont
even see that type sold anymore.

Home centers usually have a few. Electrical/lighting supply shops of
the kind that contractors go to and the major online lightbulb sellers
have more. Just avoid the dollar store ones - I consistently found
problems, including poor color, poor color rendering, and severe shortfall
of light output from claimed light output, lack of a lumen figure for
light output, lack of signs of certification by any recognized safety
testing organization whether UL or otherwise, usually most of these, often
all of these in my experience.

- Don Klipstein )

On Wed, 04 Apr 2007 12:26:01 -0500, Mark Lloyd
wrote:

On Wed, 04 Apr 2007 01:36:28 -0500, wrote:

On Tue, 03 Apr 2007 01:07:02 -0600, Chris Friesen
wrote:

Bonnie Peebles wrote:
I swapped out my incandescent lights for the spiral fluorescent
lights. They are rated for 5 years (some maybe 7years) at 4 hours
usage per day. In both my old house and in my new home, I am not
getting anywhere near that. My longest one, the one least used lasted
2 years.

Fluorescent light lifetime is affected by how often it gets switched on
and off. They're most effective when used for lights that stay on for a
long time once they're turned on.

It only takes the equivalent of about 20-30 seconds worth of electrical
power to turn on a fluorescent, but the more frequently you cycle them
the faster they die.

Chris


SO, if I go in the bathroom for a total of one half hour per night and
have two 60W indecesant bulbs in the fixtures, then I consume a total
of 60W per day. If these same two fixtures each have 15W CF bulbs
(equivalant to 60W), but have to leave them on 24/7, I am using 720W
per day. That is far from being a savings, particularly when you
consider the CF bulb costs $3 or so, and the indec bulb costs 25
cents. Until they come up with a CF bulb that can last as long as
advertised, and can be turned on and off as needed, I will not buy any
more of them. Besides the one that I mentioned yesterday that lasted
5 or 6 weeks, or less than 100 hours, I have had another one flare up,
causing sparks and a bathroom filled with stinky smoke. Luckily no
fire, but the smoke was terrible and seeing sparks blowing around the
room is not my idea of fun. Additionally, this is not the first bulb
that has died before its rated time. In fact, almost all of these
spiral types are dying in short time, whereas the original straight
CFs seem to last and last and last. I dont even see that type sold
anymore.


I put a string of 35 yellow LED holiday lights in my bathroom. These
give off enough light I almost never need the regular light.

But but but........ Yellow poop is a sign of jaundice, or is it
leprocy !!!!!

Those lights consume about 1.8W. Multiplied by 24 hours, that's 43.2
watt-hours.

BTW, I always thought that "24/7" stuff sounded stupid. It's ALL THE
TIME!

One of my old PHILIPS CFL bulbs finally died
after 12(?) years of service.
I opened it up to do an "autopsy",
and I was amazed at the number of electronic components.

Two circuit boards, tiny transformer, couple of electrlytic caps, SCR,
transistor, dozen mini-resistors and caps, a few diodes,...etc.etc.

Haven't opened up a modern CFL,
but, I'm sure they've cut the component count.

rj

"Paul M. Eldridge" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 04 Apr 2007 17:08:44 GMT, "TKM" wrote:

"Paul M. Eldridge" wrote in message

According to the EIA, the average retail price paid by residential
consumers last year was 10.4 cents per kWh.

Source: http://www.eia.doe.gov/cneaf/electri.../table5_3.html

Cheers,
Paul

Posted rates don't tell the whole story. There are service charges and
taxes added on, for example. Take your total bill and divide by the kWh
used to get your actual rate. Mine was $0.132/kWh in March. A friend in
western New York, however, just paid over $0.30/kWh on vacation home
because the fees and taxes swamped the cost of the low kWh use.

TKM

Hi Terry,

I'm not sure what "additional" charges, if any, are included in the
stated price (e.g., stranded debt, transmission & distribution, etc.).
The accompanying footnote tells us that "[p]rices are calculated by
dividing revenue by sales", so that would suggest it does, in fact,
include all of these miscellaneous items and quite possibly the fixed
charges as well.

Cheers,
Paul

I agree, Paul, that the 10.4 cents/kWh for the average consumer rate for
2006 is right and includes all the extra charges. There used to be a
magazine that published energy rates every month and it was easy to keep
track; but I can't find it any more.

Terry McGowan

On Thu, 05 Apr 2007 19:46:07 GMT, "TKM" wrote:

I'm not sure what "additional" charges, if any, are included in the
stated price (e.g., stranded debt, transmission & distribution, etc.).
The accompanying footnote tells us that "[p]rices are calculated by
dividing revenue by sales", so that would suggest it does, in fact,
include all of these miscellaneous items and quite possibly the fixed
charges as well.

Cheers,
Paul

I agree, Paul, that the 10.4 cents/kWh for the average consumer rate for
2006 is right and includes all the extra charges. There used to be a
magazine that published energy rates every month and it was easy to keep
track; but I can't find it any more.

Terry McGowan

Hi Terry,

For those living in California, New York or New England, the first
reaction must be "that can't be right! I pay a LOT more than that!"
:-0

I'm guessing the national average is skewed by the fact that those who
pay more are likely to use less and, by the same token, those living
in areas where rates are comparatively low consume more (e.g.,
electric heat is popular in the Pacific North West but far less so in
NY, MA, VT or NH where rates are two to three times higher).

Cheers,
Paul

On Wed, 04 Apr 2007 23:21:51 -0500, wrote:

On Wed, 04 Apr 2007 12:26:01 -0500, Mark Lloyd
wrote:

On Wed, 04 Apr 2007 01:36:28 -0500, wrote:

On Tue, 03 Apr 2007 01:07:02 -0600, Chris Friesen
wrote:

Bonnie Peebles wrote:
I swapped out my incandescent lights for the spiral fluorescent
lights. They are rated for 5 years (some maybe 7years) at 4 hours
usage per day. In both my old house and in my new home, I am not
getting anywhere near that. My longest one, the one least used lasted
2 years.

Fluorescent light lifetime is affected by how often it gets switched on
and off. They're most effective when used for lights that stay on for a
long time once they're turned on.

It only takes the equivalent of about 20-30 seconds worth of electrical
power to turn on a fluorescent, but the more frequently you cycle them
the faster they die.

Chris


SO, if I go in the bathroom for a total of one half hour per night and
have two 60W indecesant bulbs in the fixtures, then I consume a total
of 60W per day. If these same two fixtures each have 15W CF bulbs
(equivalant to 60W), but have to leave them on 24/7, I am using 720W
per day. That is far from being a savings, particularly when you
consider the CF bulb costs $3 or so, and the indec bulb costs 25
cents. Until they come up with a CF bulb that can last as long as
advertised, and can be turned on and off as needed, I will not buy any
more of them. Besides the one that I mentioned yesterday that lasted
5 or 6 weeks, or less than 100 hours, I have had another one flare up,
causing sparks and a bathroom filled with stinky smoke. Luckily no
fire, but the smoke was terrible and seeing sparks blowing around the
room is not my idea of fun. Additionally, this is not the first bulb
that has died before its rated time. In fact, almost all of these
spiral types are dying in short time, whereas the original straight
CFs seem to last and last and last. I dont even see that type sold
anymore.


I put a string of 70 yellow LED holiday lights in my bathroom. These
give off enough light I almost never need the regular light.

But but but........ Yellow poop is a sign of jaundice, or is it
leprocy !!!!!


Or eating too much corn? :-)

Those lights consume about 1.8W. Multiplied by 24 hours, that's 43.2
watt-hours.

BTW, I always thought that "24/7" stuff sounded stupid. It's ALL THE
TIME!

BTW, I edited my quote because of a mistake. It was 70 lights, not 35.
I never edit other people's quotes.
--
Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.laughingsquid.com

"Never underestimate the power of stupid
people in large groups"

On Tue, 03 Apr 2007 01:51:58 -0400, Bonnie Peebles
wrote:

I swapped out my incandescent lights for the spiral fluorescent
lights. They are rated for 5 years (some maybe 7years) at 4 hours
usage per day. In both my old house and in my new home, I am not
getting anywhere near that. My longest one, the one least used lasted
2 years.

With the initial higher cost of the bulb, I'm GUESSING I would need
the bulb to last close to at least 4 years to pay for itself. The
bulbs run about $7 for 3ea 100 watt equivalent (they use 26 watts)
Maybe someone could help me on this math or show me how to figure out
how long they'd need to last to be a better buy then incandescents.

Is anyone else using these fluorescent lights? I get them at Wal-Mart
so it is whatever brand they carry. My current bad bulb is made by
Commercial Electric. It had a 7 year guarantee. It was installed
2005-01-06. At the rated 4 hours a day, I should have gotten 10,192
hours of use. I had the bulb for about 19,000 hours. If I ran it non
stop, day and night, I could have burned it out. But why the heck
would I buy an energy saving bulb if I wasn't trying to save energy.


What kind of hours are YOU getting? Have you folks in CA switched yet
before it becomes law?



Also, does anyone know of any light sources that use LEDs for the
home? I saw one at Lowe's ( like a Home Depo/Builders Square ) but it
seemed to be more for ambient light then to light a room or task
lighting. But some kind of device with a few dozen LEDs in it that
screwed into a standard socket would be pretty cool. I hear that LEDs
are as more efficient then fluorescent. Don't know if it is true but
I THINK I saw something that claimed the difference in efficiency
between LEDs and fluorescent's was about the same as the difference
between fluorescent's and incandescents. But that doesn't seem right
to me because fluorescent's are in the 90-95% efficiency range, right?
Again, I don't know, but I have started my search for better
fluorescent and LED lights.

But I would like your feed back - mainly on the life of your
fluorescent lights, but all the other stuff too.

( Got to remember to take the ambien after I write the emails. Wait,
did I take it yet? Well, better to be sure and take one more.)

Thanks

Bonnie
lass

I don't get 5 years, but there is a disclaimer on the box stating
under what conditions they expect the bulb to last x years.

tom @ www.Consolidated-Loans.info

I use them but don't really keep track of the hours I get from them. I work
maint for a hotel and we use them and date them. We probably have them on 7
hours a day and they go for 2-3 years and we use Phillips brand.
I can say in the summer time it quite a bit cooler standing under a ceiling
fan with the compact bulbs then the standard bulb at the house so it has to
save on the cooling bill also. For the home I buy from Lowes and HD
"Just Joshin" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 03 Apr 2007 01:51:58 -0400, Bonnie Peebles
wrote:

I swapped out my incandescent lights for the spiral fluorescent
lights. They are rated for 5 years (some maybe 7years) at 4 hours
usage per day. In both my old house and in my new home, I am not
getting anywhere near that. My longest one, the one least used lasted
2 years.

With the initial higher cost of the bulb, I'm GUESSING I would need
the bulb to last close to at least 4 years to pay for itself. The
bulbs run about $7 for 3ea 100 watt equivalent (they use 26 watts)
Maybe someone could help me on this math or show me how to figure out
how long they'd need to last to be a better buy then incandescents.

Is anyone else using these fluorescent lights? I get them at Wal-Mart
so it is whatever brand they carry. My current bad bulb is made by
Commercial Electric. It had a 7 year guarantee. It was installed
2005-01-06. At the rated 4 hours a day, I should have gotten 10,192
hours of use. I had the bulb for about 19,000 hours. If I ran it non
stop, day and night, I could have burned it out. But why the heck
would I buy an energy saving bulb if I wasn't trying to save energy.


What kind of hours are YOU getting? Have you folks in CA switched yet
before it becomes law?



Also, does anyone know of any light sources that use LEDs for the
home? I saw one at Lowe's ( like a Home Depo/Builders Square ) but it
seemed to be more for ambient light then to light a room or task
lighting. But some kind of device with a few dozen LEDs in it that
screwed into a standard socket would be pretty cool. I hear that LEDs
are as more efficient then fluorescent. Don't know if it is true but
I THINK I saw something that claimed the difference in efficiency
between LEDs and fluorescent's was about the same as the difference
between fluorescent's and incandescents. But that doesn't seem right
to me because fluorescent's are in the 90-95% efficiency range, right?
Again, I don't know, but I have started my search for better
fluorescent and LED lights.

But I would like your feed back - mainly on the life of your
fluorescent lights, but all the other stuff too.

( Got to remember to take the ambien after I write the emails. Wait,
did I take it yet? Well, better to be sure and take one more.)

Thanks

Bonnie
lass

I don't get 5 years, but there is a disclaimer on the box stating
under what conditions they expect the bulb to last x years.

tom @ www.Consolidated-Loans.info

On Fri, 6 Apr 2007 20:58:08 -0400, "bob kater"
wrote:

I use them but don't really keep track of the hours I get from them. I work
maint for a hotel and we use them and date them. We probably have them on 7
hours a day and they go for 2-3 years and we use Phillips brand.
I can say in the summer time it quite a bit cooler standing under a ceiling
fan with the compact bulbs then the standard bulb at the house so it has to
save on the cooling bill also. For the home I buy from Lowes and HD

I was told that name brand ones do have a better life expectancy than
no name ones. Wonder if it was a commercial.

tom @ www.MedJobSite.com


"Just Joshin" wrote in message
.. .
On Tue, 03 Apr 2007 01:51:58 -0400, Bonnie Peebles
wrote:

I swapped out my incandescent lights for the spiral fluorescent
lights. They are rated for 5 years (some maybe 7years) at 4 hours
usage per day. In both my old house and in my new home, I am not
getting anywhere near that. My longest one, the one least used lasted
2 years.

With the initial higher cost of the bulb, I'm GUESSING I would need
the bulb to last close to at least 4 years to pay for itself. The
bulbs run about $7 for 3ea 100 watt equivalent (they use 26 watts)
Maybe someone could help me on this math or show me how to figure out
how long they'd need to last to be a better buy then incandescents.

Is anyone else using these fluorescent lights? I get them at Wal-Mart
so it is whatever brand they carry. My current bad bulb is made by
Commercial Electric. It had a 7 year guarantee. It was installed
2005-01-06. At the rated 4 hours a day, I should have gotten 10,192
hours of use. I had the bulb for about 19,000 hours. If I ran it non
stop, day and night, I could have burned it out. But why the heck
would I buy an energy saving bulb if I wasn't trying to save energy.


What kind of hours are YOU getting? Have you folks in CA switched yet
before it becomes law?



Also, does anyone know of any light sources that use LEDs for the
home? I saw one at Lowe's ( like a Home Depo/Builders Square ) but it
seemed to be more for ambient light then to light a room or task
lighting. But some kind of device with a few dozen LEDs in it that
screwed into a standard socket would be pretty cool. I hear that LEDs
are as more efficient then fluorescent. Don't know if it is true but
I THINK I saw something that claimed the difference in efficiency
between LEDs and fluorescent's was about the same as the difference
between fluorescent's and incandescents. But that doesn't seem right
to me because fluorescent's are in the 90-95% efficiency range, right?
Again, I don't know, but I have started my search for better
fluorescent and LED lights.

But I would like your feed back - mainly on the life of your
fluorescent lights, but all the other stuff too.

( Got to remember to take the ambien after I write the emails. Wait,
did I take it yet? Well, better to be sure and take one more.)

Thanks

Bonnie
lass

I don't get 5 years, but there is a disclaimer on the box stating
under what conditions they expect the bulb to last x years.

tom @ www.Consolidated-Loans.info

On Wed, 04 Apr 2007 01:04:47 GMT, Bob wrote:

The benefit of fluorescent lights is reduced greatly in places where
they are only used for short periods of time, such as in bathrooms.

For several years, California has had a building code requirement that
requires general lighting in bathrooms to be fluorescent.

For heaven's sake, WHY???

Creative
builders meet this rule by providing a CFL integrated with the exhaust
fan while having an incandescent light bar over the mirror.