Home |
Search |
Today's Posts |
|
Home Repair (alt.home.repair) For all homeowners and DIYers with many experienced tradesmen. Solve your toughest home fix-it problems. |
Reply |
|
|
LinkBack | Thread Tools | Display Modes |
|
#1
Posted to alt.home.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Spiral fluorescent lighting - not getting anywhere near the 5 to 7 year life - anyone else?
I swapped out my incandescent lights for the spiral fluorescent
lights. They are rated for 5 years (some maybe 7years) at 4 hours usage per day. In both my old house and in my new home, I am not getting anywhere near that. My longest one, the one least used lasted 2 years. With the initial higher cost of the bulb, I'm GUESSING I would need the bulb to last close to at least 4 years to pay for itself. The bulbs run about $7 for 3ea 100 watt equivalent (they use 26 watts) Maybe someone could help me on this math or show me how to figure out how long they'd need to last to be a better buy then incandescents. Is anyone else using these fluorescent lights? I get them at Wal-Mart so it is whatever brand they carry. My current bad bulb is made by Commercial Electric. It had a 7 year guarantee. It was installed 2005-01-06. At the rated 4 hours a day, I should have gotten 10,192 hours of use. I had the bulb for about 19,000 hours. If I ran it non stop, day and night, I could have burned it out. But why the heck would I buy an energy saving bulb if I wasn't trying to save energy. What kind of hours are YOU getting? Have you folks in CA switched yet before it becomes law? Also, does anyone know of any light sources that use LEDs for the home? I saw one at Lowe's ( like a Home Depo/Builders Square ) but it seemed to be more for ambient light then to light a room or task lighting. But some kind of device with a few dozen LEDs in it that screwed into a standard socket would be pretty cool. I hear that LEDs are as more efficient then fluorescent. Don't know if it is true but I THINK I saw something that claimed the difference in efficiency between LEDs and fluorescent's was about the same as the difference between fluorescent's and incandescents. But that doesn't seem right to me because fluorescent's are in the 90-95% efficiency range, right? Again, I don't know, but I have started my search for better fluorescent and LED lights. But I would like your feed back - mainly on the life of your fluorescent lights, but all the other stuff too. ( Got to remember to take the ambien after I write the emails. Wait, did I take it yet? Well, better to be sure and take one more.) Thanks Bonnie lass |
#2
Posted to alt.home.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Spiral fluorescent lighting - not getting anywhere near the 5 to 7 year life - anyone else?
I got some of those GE brand ones at Walmart and all I have is trouble
with them. I just installed one about 5 weeks ago and last week it began to go on and off all the time. I have some of the original straight U shaped CF's that have been in my home for 5 years and they still work fine. One of them is left on all night every night. These new spiral ones are garbage, at least the GE brans sold at Walmart. I just complained to the company, and they said they want me to send the bulb and a receipt. I can send the bulb (as long as they payt the shipping), but I dont save receipts for small items. I got more important things to do with my time than collect paper. I think I am going back to common lightbulbs. On Tue, 03 Apr 2007 01:51:58 -0400, Bonnie Peebles wrote: I swapped out my incandescent lights for the spiral fluorescent lights. They are rated for 5 years (some maybe 7years) at 4 hours usage per day. In both my old house and in my new home, I am not getting anywhere near that. My longest one, the one least used lasted 2 years. With the initial higher cost of the bulb, I'm GUESSING I would need the bulb to last close to at least 4 years to pay for itself. The bulbs run about $7 for 3ea 100 watt equivalent (they use 26 watts) Maybe someone could help me on this math or show me how to figure out how long they'd need to last to be a better buy then incandescents. Is anyone else using these fluorescent lights? I get them at Wal-Mart so it is whatever brand they carry. My current bad bulb is made by Commercial Electric. It had a 7 year guarantee. It was installed 2005-01-06. At the rated 4 hours a day, I should have gotten 10,192 hours of use. I had the bulb for about 19,000 hours. If I ran it non stop, day and night, I could have burned it out. But why the heck would I buy an energy saving bulb if I wasn't trying to save energy. What kind of hours are YOU getting? Have you folks in CA switched yet before it becomes law? Also, does anyone know of any light sources that use LEDs for the home? I saw one at Lowe's ( like a Home Depo/Builders Square ) but it seemed to be more for ambient light then to light a room or task lighting. But some kind of device with a few dozen LEDs in it that screwed into a standard socket would be pretty cool. I hear that LEDs are as more efficient then fluorescent. Don't know if it is true but I THINK I saw something that claimed the difference in efficiency between LEDs and fluorescent's was about the same as the difference between fluorescent's and incandescents. But that doesn't seem right to me because fluorescent's are in the 90-95% efficiency range, right? Again, I don't know, but I have started my search for better fluorescent and LED lights. But I would like your feed back - mainly on the life of your fluorescent lights, but all the other stuff too. ( Got to remember to take the ambien after I write the emails. Wait, did I take it yet? Well, better to be sure and take one more.) Thanks Bonnie lass |
#3
Posted to alt.home.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Spiral fluorescent lighting - not getting anywhere near the 5to 7 year life - anyone else?
|
#4
Posted to alt.home.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Spiral fluorescent lighting - not getting anywhere near the 5to 7 year life - anyone else?
Bonnie Peebles wrote:
I swapped out my incandescent lights for the spiral fluorescent lights. They are rated for 5 years (some maybe 7years) at 4 hours usage per day. In both my old house and in my new home, I am not getting anywhere near that. My longest one, the one least used lasted 2 years. Fluorescent light lifetime is affected by how often it gets switched on and off. They're most effective when used for lights that stay on for a long time once they're turned on. It only takes the equivalent of about 20-30 seconds worth of electrical power to turn on a fluorescent, but the more frequently you cycle them the faster they die. Chris |
#5
Posted to alt.home.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Spiral fluorescent lighting - not getting anywhere near the 5to 7 year life - anyone else?
Chris Friesen wrote:
Fluorescent light lifetime is affected by how often it gets switched on... Each start uses up about 6 minutes of their 10K-20K hour lifetime. It only takes the equivalent of about 20-30 seconds worth of electrical power to turn on a fluorescent... No. Less than a second's worth of electrical energy. Nick |
#6
Posted to alt.home.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Spiral fluorescent lighting - not getting anywhere near the 5to 7 year life - anyone else?
|
#7
Posted to alt.home.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Spiral fluorescent lighting - not getting anywhere near the 5to 7 year life - anyone else?
Chris Friesen wrote:
It only takes the equivalent of about 20-30 seconds worth of electrical power to turn on a fluorescent... No. Less than a second's worth of electrical energy. I'd love to see your sources on that. The lowest I've seen is about 5 seconds worth of running energy to turn it on, with most places giving the numbers I presented. Where did you find those numbers? :-) Nick |
#8
Posted to alt.home.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Spiral fluorescent lighting - not getting anywhere near the 5to 7 year life - anyone else?
wrote:
Chris Friesen wrote: I'd love to see your sources on that. The lowest I've seen is about 5 seconds worth of running energy to turn it on, with most places giving the numbers I presented. Where did you find those numbers? :-) Just did some more digging. Mythbusters did an episode where they actually measured it. http://kwc.org/mythbusters/2006/12/e..._fall_lig.html They found that for a standard fluorescent lamp (they didn't specify ballast type) it took about 23 seconds to make up for the startup surge. With a CFL, however, it took 0.015 seconds. Some other sources specified a 5-second time for fluorescent lamps. However, these also looked at the deterioriation due to the actual switching and concluded that once you factor in lamp replacement you're better off leaving it running if you're going to need it in 15-20 minutes. http://lightingdesignlab.com/article...luorescent.htm http://www.eere.energy.gov/consumer/.../mytopic=12280 http://oee.nrcan.gc.ca/energystar/en...=N&printview=N Chris |
#9
Posted to alt.home.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Spiral fluorescent lighting - not getting anywhere near the 5 to 7 year life - anyone else?
On Tue, 03 Apr 2007 01:07:02 -0600, Chris Friesen
wrote: Bonnie Peebles wrote: I swapped out my incandescent lights for the spiral fluorescent lights. They are rated for 5 years (some maybe 7years) at 4 hours usage per day. In both my old house and in my new home, I am not getting anywhere near that. My longest one, the one least used lasted 2 years. Fluorescent light lifetime is affected by how often it gets switched on and off. They're most effective when used for lights that stay on for a long time once they're turned on. It only takes the equivalent of about 20-30 seconds worth of electrical power to turn on a fluorescent, but the more frequently you cycle them the faster they die. Chris SO, if I go in the bathroom for a total of one half hour per night and have two 60W indecesant bulbs in the fixtures, then I consume a total of 60W per day. If these same two fixtures each have 15W CF bulbs (equivalant to 60W), but have to leave them on 24/7, I am using 720W per day. That is far from being a savings, particularly when you consider the CF bulb costs $3 or so, and the indec bulb costs 25 cents. Until they come up with a CF bulb that can last as long as advertised, and can be turned on and off as needed, I will not buy any more of them. Besides the one that I mentioned yesterday that lasted 5 or 6 weeks, or less than 100 hours, I have had another one flare up, causing sparks and a bathroom filled with stinky smoke. Luckily no fire, but the smoke was terrible and seeing sparks blowing around the room is not my idea of fun. Additionally, this is not the first bulb that has died before its rated time. In fact, almost all of these spiral types are dying in short time, whereas the original straight CFs seem to last and last and last. I dont even see that type sold anymore. |
#10
Posted to alt.home.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Spiral fluorescent lighting - not getting anywhere near the 5 to 7 year life - anyone else?
|
#12
Posted to alt.home.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Spiral fluorescent lighting - not getting anywhere near the 5 to 7 year life - anyone else?
Mark Lloyd wrote:
BTW, I always thought that "24/7" stuff sounded stupid. That's 'cause you left off the /365 part. -- Music hath charms to soothe the savage breast. That's why stereo has two channels. |
#13
Posted to alt.home.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Spiral fluorescent lighting - not getting anywhere near the 5 to 7 year life - anyone else?
On Wed, 04 Apr 2007 14:59:56 -0500, clifto wrote:
Mark Lloyd wrote: BTW, I always thought that "24/7" stuff sounded stupid. That's 'cause you left off the /365 part. As in "24/7/365"? I get the idea people who use that think they're describing one year, not the SEVEN that are actually there (365 WEEKS). -- Mark Lloyd http://notstupid.laughingsquid.com "Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups" |
#14
Posted to alt.home.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Spiral fluorescent lighting - not getting anywhere near the 5 to 7 year life - anyone else?
On Wed, 04 Apr 2007 12:26:01 -0500, Mark Lloyd
wrote: On Wed, 04 Apr 2007 01:36:28 -0500, wrote: On Tue, 03 Apr 2007 01:07:02 -0600, Chris Friesen wrote: Bonnie Peebles wrote: I swapped out my incandescent lights for the spiral fluorescent lights. They are rated for 5 years (some maybe 7years) at 4 hours usage per day. In both my old house and in my new home, I am not getting anywhere near that. My longest one, the one least used lasted 2 years. Fluorescent light lifetime is affected by how often it gets switched on and off. They're most effective when used for lights that stay on for a long time once they're turned on. It only takes the equivalent of about 20-30 seconds worth of electrical power to turn on a fluorescent, but the more frequently you cycle them the faster they die. Chris SO, if I go in the bathroom for a total of one half hour per night and have two 60W indecesant bulbs in the fixtures, then I consume a total of 60W per day. If these same two fixtures each have 15W CF bulbs (equivalant to 60W), but have to leave them on 24/7, I am using 720W per day. That is far from being a savings, particularly when you consider the CF bulb costs $3 or so, and the indec bulb costs 25 cents. Until they come up with a CF bulb that can last as long as advertised, and can be turned on and off as needed, I will not buy any more of them. Besides the one that I mentioned yesterday that lasted 5 or 6 weeks, or less than 100 hours, I have had another one flare up, causing sparks and a bathroom filled with stinky smoke. Luckily no fire, but the smoke was terrible and seeing sparks blowing around the room is not my idea of fun. Additionally, this is not the first bulb that has died before its rated time. In fact, almost all of these spiral types are dying in short time, whereas the original straight CFs seem to last and last and last. I dont even see that type sold anymore. I put a string of 35 yellow LED holiday lights in my bathroom. These give off enough light I almost never need the regular light. But but but........ Yellow poop is a sign of jaundice, or is it leprocy !!!!! Those lights consume about 1.8W. Multiplied by 24 hours, that's 43.2 watt-hours. BTW, I always thought that "24/7" stuff sounded stupid. It's ALL THE TIME! |
#15
Posted to alt.home.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Spiral fluorescent lighting - not getting anywhere near the 5 to 7 year life - anyone else?
On Wed, 04 Apr 2007 23:21:51 -0500, wrote:
On Wed, 04 Apr 2007 12:26:01 -0500, Mark Lloyd wrote: On Wed, 04 Apr 2007 01:36:28 -0500, wrote: On Tue, 03 Apr 2007 01:07:02 -0600, Chris Friesen wrote: Bonnie Peebles wrote: I swapped out my incandescent lights for the spiral fluorescent lights. They are rated for 5 years (some maybe 7years) at 4 hours usage per day. In both my old house and in my new home, I am not getting anywhere near that. My longest one, the one least used lasted 2 years. Fluorescent light lifetime is affected by how often it gets switched on and off. They're most effective when used for lights that stay on for a long time once they're turned on. It only takes the equivalent of about 20-30 seconds worth of electrical power to turn on a fluorescent, but the more frequently you cycle them the faster they die. Chris SO, if I go in the bathroom for a total of one half hour per night and have two 60W indecesant bulbs in the fixtures, then I consume a total of 60W per day. If these same two fixtures each have 15W CF bulbs (equivalant to 60W), but have to leave them on 24/7, I am using 720W per day. That is far from being a savings, particularly when you consider the CF bulb costs $3 or so, and the indec bulb costs 25 cents. Until they come up with a CF bulb that can last as long as advertised, and can be turned on and off as needed, I will not buy any more of them. Besides the one that I mentioned yesterday that lasted 5 or 6 weeks, or less than 100 hours, I have had another one flare up, causing sparks and a bathroom filled with stinky smoke. Luckily no fire, but the smoke was terrible and seeing sparks blowing around the room is not my idea of fun. Additionally, this is not the first bulb that has died before its rated time. In fact, almost all of these spiral types are dying in short time, whereas the original straight CFs seem to last and last and last. I dont even see that type sold anymore. I put a string of 70 yellow LED holiday lights in my bathroom. These give off enough light I almost never need the regular light. But but but........ Yellow poop is a sign of jaundice, or is it leprocy !!!!! Or eating too much corn? :-) Those lights consume about 1.8W. Multiplied by 24 hours, that's 43.2 watt-hours. BTW, I always thought that "24/7" stuff sounded stupid. It's ALL THE TIME! BTW, I edited my quote because of a mistake. It was 70 lights, not 35. I never edit other people's quotes. -- Mark Lloyd http://notstupid.laughingsquid.com "Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups" |
#16
Posted to alt.home.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Spiral fluorescent lighting - not getting anywhere near the 5to 7 year life - anyone else?
|
#17
Posted to alt.home.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Spiral fluorescent lighting - not getting anywhere near the 5 to 7 year life - anyone else?
One of my old PHILIPS CFL bulbs finally died after 12(?) years of service. I opened it up to do an "autopsy", and I was amazed at the number of electronic components. Two circuit boards, tiny transformer, couple of electrlytic caps, SCR, transistor, dozen mini-resistors and caps, a few diodes,...etc.etc. Haven't opened up a modern CFL, but, I'm sure they've cut the component count. rj |
#18
Posted to alt.home.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Spiral fluorescent lighting - not getting anywhere near the 5 to 7 year life - anyone else?
|
#19
Posted to alt.home.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Spiral fluorescent lighting - not getting anywhere near the 5 to 7 year life - anyone else?
This decrease in lifespan due to short on-off periods really needs to
be indicated on CFB packaging - a recommendation by the mfr. that compact flourescents' usable life may be adversely affected if turned on and off several times a day. Until then, I like Jim McLaughlin's suggestion of keeping the packaging and receipt and when the bulb blows in six months sending a letter to the manufacturer asking for a replacement... On Apr 3, 3:07 am, Chris Friesen wrote: Fluorescent light lifetime is affected by how often it gets switched on and off. They're most effective when used for lights that stay on for a long time once they're turned on. It only takes the equivalent of about 20-30 seconds worth of electrical power to turn on a fluorescent, but the more frequently you cycle them the faster they die. Chris |
#20
Posted to alt.home.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Spiral fluorescent lighting - not getting anywhere near the 5 to 7 year life - anyone else?
If they did add a decreased life span warning for on/off, they could
not make the claim that the lamp will last 7 years. It does say on the package that the estimated life is using the lamp for 3 hours a day. This suggests that the lamp is designed to be turned on/off daily. On 22 May 2007 09:54:20 -0700, Kyle wrote: This decrease in lifespan due to short on-off periods really needs to be indicated on CFB packaging - a recommendation by the mfr. that compact flourescents' usable life may be adversely affected if turned on and off several times a day. Until then, I like Jim McLaughlin's suggestion of keeping the packaging and receipt and when the bulb blows in six months sending a letter to the manufacturer asking for a replacement... On Apr 3, 3:07 am, Chris Friesen wrote: Fluorescent light lifetime is affected by how often it gets switched on and off. They're most effective when used for lights that stay on for a long time once they're turned on. It only takes the equivalent of about 20-30 seconds worth of electrical power to turn on a fluorescent, but the more frequently you cycle them the faster they die. Chris |
#21
Posted to alt.home.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Spiral fluorescent lighting - not getting anywhere near the 5 to 7 year life - anyone else?
Bonnie Peebles wrote:
I swapped out my incandescent lights for the spiral fluorescent lights. They are rated for 5 years (some maybe 7years) at 4 hours usage per day. In both my old house and in my new home, I am not getting anywhere near that. My longest one, the one least used lasted 2 years. ... The first ones I bought a few years ago did not last that long (at least some did not), they were not as bright as expected, they did not come up to full brightness very fast and overall were not all that good. Those I have bought this year (three different types two brands) have done everything well. I will be using more in the future. -- Joseph Meehan Dia 's Muire duit |
#22
Posted to alt.home.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Spiral fluorescent lighting - not getting anywhere near the 5 to 7 year life - anyone else?
On Apr 3, 6:40�am, "Joseph Meehan" wrote:
Bonnie Peebles wrote: I swapped out my incandescent lights for the spiral fluorescent lights. *They are rated for 5 years (some maybe 7years) at 4 hours usage per day. *In both my old house and in my new home, I am not getting anywhere near that. *My longest one, the one least used lasted 2 years. *... * * The first ones I bought a few years ago did not last that long (at least some did not), they were not as bright as expected, they did not come up to full brightness very fast and overall were not all that good. * * Those I have bought this year (three different types two brands) have done everything well. *I will be using more in the future. -- Joseph Meehan *Dia 's Muire duit well they dont last as promoted, and I have had 2 burn out when waxing living room tables, the aerosol spray mist appears to fry them. needless to say I dont do hat again, one went poof with a little flame and I wasnt spraying in the bulb, overspray did it in |
#23
Posted to alt.home.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Spiral fluorescent lighting - not getting anywhere near the 5 to 7 year life - anyone else?
"Bonnie Peebles" wrote in message ... I swapped out my incandescent lights for the spiral fluorescent lights. They are rated for 5 years (some maybe 7years) at 4 hours usage per day. In both my old house and in my new home, I am not getting anywhere near that. My longest one, the one least used lasted 2 years. With the initial higher cost of the bulb, I'm GUESSING I would need the bulb to last close to at least 4 years to pay for itself. The bulbs run about $7 for 3ea 100 watt equivalent (they use 26 watts) Maybe someone could help me on this math or show me how to figure out how long they'd need to last to be a better buy then incandescents. Is anyone else using these fluorescent lights? I get them at Wal-Mart so it is whatever brand they carry. My current bad bulb is made by Commercial Electric. It had a 7 year guarantee. It was installed 2005-01-06. At the rated 4 hours a day, I should have gotten 10,192 hours of use. I had the bulb for about 19,000 hours. If I ran it non stop, day and night, I could have burned it out. But why the heck would I buy an energy saving bulb if I wasn't trying to save energy. What kind of hours are YOU getting? Have you folks in CA switched yet before it becomes law? Also, does anyone know of any light sources that use LEDs for the home? I saw one at Lowe's ( like a Home Depo/Builders Square ) but it seemed to be more for ambient light then to light a room or task lighting. But some kind of device with a few dozen LEDs in it that screwed into a standard socket would be pretty cool. I hear that LEDs are as more efficient then fluorescent. Don't know if it is true but I THINK I saw something that claimed the difference in efficiency between LEDs and fluorescent's was about the same as the difference between fluorescent's and incandescents. But that doesn't seem right to me because fluorescent's are in the 90-95% efficiency range, right? Again, I don't know, but I have started my search for better fluorescent and LED lights. But I would like your feed back - mainly on the life of your fluorescent lights, but all the other stuff too. ( Got to remember to take the ambien after I write the emails. Wait, did I take it yet? Well, better to be sure and take one more.) Thanks Bonnie CFLs are not yet commodity items. Brands count from my experience and if you just buy on price, performance is likely to be poor. I put in CFLs about 4 years ago and haven't had a burnout as yet with several of the lamps on 4-6 hours/day. Got the lamps at Target, but all were Energy Star listed. That means the lamps are tested for life, light output, color, etc. and you can complain to Energy Star if they don't perform. I always return lamps that fail prematurely to the manufacturer (address is on the carton typically). Not only do they replace the lamp, they usually include a coupon or extra lamps -- at least the name brand companies. LEDs are improving rapidly and make sense for certain applications (see www.lightingfortomorrow.com ) for some examples. But they are heat sensitive and packing them into something that looks like a standard light bulb isn't a good application for them. And, it will be an expensive device for some time to come. White light LEDs deliver about 30-40 lumens/watt right now compared to 70-80 lumens/watt for CFLs. If you want to see an incandescent to LED replacement that might work, go to: http://www.ledlightingfixtures.com/ and notice the heat sink. We'll see shortly if the company can get beyond press releases. TKM |
#24
Posted to alt.home.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Spiral fluorescent lighting - not getting anywhere near the 5 to 7 year life - anyone else?
On Apr 3, 7:56 am, "TKM" wrote:
"Bonnie Peebles" wrote in message ... I swapped out my incandescent lights for the spiral fluorescent lights. They are rated for 5 years (some maybe 7years) at 4 hours usage per day. In both my old house and in my new home, I am not getting anywhere near that. My longest one, the one least used lasted 2 years. With the initial higher cost of the bulb, I'm GUESSING I would need the bulb to last close to at least 4 years to pay for itself. The bulbs run about $7 for 3ea 100 watt equivalent (they use 26 watts) Maybe someone could help me on this math or show me how to figure out how long they'd need to last to be a better buy then incandescents. Is anyone else using these fluorescent lights? I get them at Wal-Mart so it is whatever brand they carry. My current bad bulb is made by Commercial Electric. It had a 7 year guarantee. It was installed 2005-01-06. At the rated 4 hours a day, I should have gotten 10,192 hours of use. I had the bulb for about 19,000 hours. If I ran it non stop, day and night, I could have burned it out. But why the heck would I buy an energy saving bulb if I wasn't trying to save energy. What kind of hours are YOU getting? Have you folks in CA switched yet before it becomes law? Also, does anyone know of any light sources that use LEDs for the home? I saw one at Lowe's ( like a Home Depo/Builders Square ) but it seemed to be more for ambient light then to light a room or task lighting. But some kind of device with a few dozen LEDs in it that screwed into a standard socket would be pretty cool. I hear that LEDs are as more efficient then fluorescent. Don't know if it is true but I THINK I saw something that claimed the difference in efficiency between LEDs and fluorescent's was about the same as the difference between fluorescent's and incandescents. But that doesn't seem right to me because fluorescent's are in the 90-95% efficiency range, right? Again, I don't know, but I have started my search for better fluorescent and LED lights. But I would like your feed back - mainly on the life of your fluorescent lights, but all the other stuff too. ( Got to remember to take the ambien after I write the emails. Wait, did I take it yet? Well, better to be sure and take one more.) Thanks Bonnie CFLs are not yet commodity items. Brands count from my experience and if you just buy on price, performance is likely to be poor. I put in CFLs about 4 years ago and haven't had a burnout as yet with several of the lamps on 4-6 hours/day. Got the lamps at Target, but all were Energy Star listed. That means the lamps are tested for life, light output, color, etc. and you can complain to Energy Star if they don't perform. I always return lamps that fail prematurely to the manufacturer (address is on the carton typically). Not only do they replace the lamp, they usually include a coupon or extra lamps -- at least the name brand companies. LEDs are improving rapidly and make sense for certain applications (seewww.lightingfortomorrow.com) for some examples. But they are heat sensitive and packing them into something that looks like a standard light bulb isn't a good application for them. And, it will be an expensive device for some time to come. White light LEDs deliver about 30-40 lumens/watt right now compared to 70-80 lumens/watt for CFLs. If you want to see an incandescent to LED replacement that might work, go to:http://www.ledlightingfixtures.com/ and notice the heat sink. We'll see shortly if the company can get beyond press releases. I would think that shipping cost would cost as much as the replacement. Do they pay shipping too? I was thinking about trying to take them back to Walmart next time they fail. Walmart is pretty good about returning stuff if you have the receipt. On a side note. I have heard that having the lamps with the base at the bottom lasts longer than having the base at the top. ie desk lamp vs ceiling light. Extra heat on the electronics. |
#25
Posted to alt.home.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Spiral fluorescent lighting - not getting anywhere near the 5 to 7 year life - anyone else?
I've also noticed that the life of my 7 yr bulbs is closer to 90 days for many in the pack. I now keep the receipts and bulb packs. Recenltly I bought a pack of 3 and 2 of them were defective (very dim). You should recover the cost in less than a year with normal use. On Tue, 03 Apr 2007 01:51:58 -0400, Bonnie Peebles wrote: I swapped out my incandescent lights for the spiral fluorescent lights. They are rated for 5 years (some maybe 7years) at 4 hours usage per day. In both my old house and in my new home, I am not getting anywhere near that. My longest one, the one least used lasted 2 years. With the initial higher cost of the bulb, I'm GUESSING I would need the bulb to last close to at least 4 years to pay for itself. The bulbs run about $7 for 3ea 100 watt equivalent (they use 26 watts) Maybe someone could help me on this math or show me how to figure out how long they'd need to last to be a better buy then incandescents. Is anyone else using these fluorescent lights? I get them at Wal-Mart so it is whatever brand they carry. My current bad bulb is made by Commercial Electric. It had a 7 year guarantee. It was installed 2005-01-06. At the rated 4 hours a day, I should have gotten 10,192 hours of use. I had the bulb for about 19,000 hours. If I ran it non stop, day and night, I could have burned it out. But why the heck would I buy an energy saving bulb if I wasn't trying to save energy. What kind of hours are YOU getting? Have you folks in CA switched yet before it becomes law? Also, does anyone know of any light sources that use LEDs for the home? I saw one at Lowe's ( like a Home Depo/Builders Square ) but it seemed to be more for ambient light then to light a room or task lighting. But some kind of device with a few dozen LEDs in it that screwed into a standard socket would be pretty cool. I hear that LEDs are as more efficient then fluorescent. Don't know if it is true but I THINK I saw something that claimed the difference in efficiency between LEDs and fluorescent's was about the same as the difference between fluorescent's and incandescents. But that doesn't seem right to me because fluorescent's are in the 90-95% efficiency range, right? Again, I don't know, but I have started my search for better fluorescent and LED lights. But I would like your feed back - mainly on the life of your fluorescent lights, but all the other stuff too. ( Got to remember to take the ambien after I write the emails. Wait, did I take it yet? Well, better to be sure and take one more.) Thanks Bonnie lass |
#26
Posted to alt.home.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Spiral fluorescent lighting - not getting anywhere near the 5 to 7 year life - anyone else?
Bonnie Peebles wrote:
With the initial higher cost of the bulb, I'm GUESSING I would need the bulb to last close to at least 4 years to pay for itself. The bulbs run about $7 for 3ea 100 watt equivalent (they use 26 watts) That's $2.33 each. It would pay for itself in H hours at C cents/kWh compared to a 50 cent incandescent if HC(100-26)/1000 = 233-50, ie H = 2493/C hours, eg 249 hours at 10 cents/kWh, eg 618 days (1.7 years) if used for 4 hours per day. Is anyone else using these fluorescent lights? Sure. I get them at Wal-Mart so it is whatever brand they carry. My current bad bulb is made by Commercial Electric. It had a 7 year guarantee. When I called Commercial Electric with the 800 number printed on the CFs I bought at Home Depot and gave them the date code on the dead bulb, they sent me a new one, free. Nick |
#27
Posted to alt.home.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Spiral fluorescent lighting - not getting anywhere near the 5 to 7 year life - anyone else?
|
#28
Posted to alt.home.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Spiral fluorescent lighting - not getting anywhere near the 5 to 7 year life - anyone else?
On Tue, 03 Apr 2007 14:08:43 -0500, deke wrote:
I have in front of me 6 power companies and their kwh cost. Not one of them approaches10 cents. According to the EIA, the average retail price paid by residential consumers last year was 10.4 cents per kWh. Source: http://www.eia.doe.gov/cneaf/electri.../table5_3.html Cheers, Paul |
#29
Posted to alt.home.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Spiral fluorescent lighting - not getting anywhere near the 5 to 7 year life - anyone else?
"Paul M. Eldridge" wrote in message ... On Tue, 03 Apr 2007 14:08:43 -0500, deke wrote: I have in front of me 6 power companies and their kwh cost. Not one of them approaches10 cents. According to the EIA, the average retail price paid by residential consumers last year was 10.4 cents per kWh. Source: http://www.eia.doe.gov/cneaf/electri.../table5_3.html Cheers, Paul Posted rates don't tell the whole story. There are service charges and taxes added on, for example. Take your total bill and divide by the kWh used to get your actual rate. Mine was $0.132/kWh in March. A friend in western New York, however, just paid over $0.30/kWh on vacation home because the fees and taxes swamped the cost of the low kWh use. TKM |
#30
Posted to alt.home.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Spiral fluorescent lighting - not getting anywhere near the 5 to 7 year life - anyone else?
Bonnie Peebles writes:
Also, does anyone know of any light sources that use LEDs for the home? I saw one at Lowe's ( like a Home Depo/Builders Square ) but it seemed to be more for ambient light then to light a room or task lighting. But some kind of device with a few dozen LEDs in it that screwed into a standard socket would be pretty cool. I hear that LEDs are as more efficient then fluorescent. There are companies selling LED-based light sources. TIR Systems (http://www.tirsys.com) is one that's located a few miles from me. They were recently purchased by Philips. But so far they're more expensive than other light sources. It's worth it if you need the ability to change light colour, but they are *less* efficient than CFL. They're more efficient than incandescent, even halogen incandescent, and still getting better so they may pass CFL one day. Dave |
#31
Posted to alt.home.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Spiral fluorescent lighting - not getting anywhere near the 5 to 7 year life - anyone else?
|
#32
Posted to alt.home.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Spiral fluorescent lighting - not getting anywhere near the 5to 7 year life - anyone else?
The benefit of fluorescent lights is reduced greatly in places where
they are only used for short periods of time, such as in bathrooms. For several years, California has had a building code requirement that requires general lighting in bathrooms to be fluorescent. Creative builders meet this rule by providing a CFL integrated with the exhaust fan while having an incandescent light bar over the mirror. |
#33
Posted to alt.home.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Spiral fluorescent lighting - not getting anywhere near the 5 to 7 year life - anyone else?
On Wed, 04 Apr 2007 01:04:47 GMT, Bob wrote:
The benefit of fluorescent lights is reduced greatly in places where they are only used for short periods of time, such as in bathrooms. For several years, California has had a building code requirement that requires general lighting in bathrooms to be fluorescent. For heaven's sake, WHY??? Creative builders meet this rule by providing a CFL integrated with the exhaust fan while having an incandescent light bar over the mirror. |
#34
Posted to alt.home.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Spiral fluorescent lighting - not getting anywhere near the 5to 7 year life - anyone else?
Bob wrote:
The benefit of fluorescent lights is reduced greatly in places where they are only used for short periods of time, such as in bathrooms. For several years, California has had a building code requirement that requires general lighting in bathrooms to be fluorescent. Hard to believe this, except maybe for public bathrooms; I really haven't paid that much attention. But in private residences I almost never see fluorescent lighting. I've lived here 45 years. If the code exists as you say, it obviously is ignored. Paul in San Francisco Creative builders meet this rule by providing a CFL integrated with the exhaust fan while having an incandescent light bar over the mirror. |
#35
Posted to alt.home.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Spiral fluorescent lighting - not getting anywhere near the 5 to 7 year life - anyone else?
On Mon, 09 Apr 2007 21:40:05 -0700 Paul MR wrote:
Bob wrote: The benefit of fluorescent lights is reduced greatly in places where they are only used for short periods of time, such as in bathrooms. For several years, California has had a building code requirement that requires general lighting in bathrooms to be fluorescent. Hard to believe this, except maybe for public bathrooms; I really haven't paid that much attention. But in private residences I almost never see fluorescent lighting. I've lived here 45 years. If the code exists as you say, it obviously is ignored. Well, as he says, it's only been for a few years now. I don't have any idea what the actual code is, but what I've "heard" is that the requirement only applies if you don't have automatic (motion sensor) light switches. -frank |
#36
Posted to alt.home.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Spiral fluorescent lighting - not getting anywhere near the 5to 7 year life - anyone else?
Frank Cusack wrote:
On Mon, 09 Apr 2007 21:40:05 -0700 Paul MR wrote: Bob wrote: The benefit of fluorescent lights is reduced greatly in places where they are only used for short periods of time, such as in bathrooms. For several years, California has had a building code requirement that requires general lighting in bathrooms to be fluorescent. Hard to believe this, except maybe for public bathrooms; I really haven't paid that much attention. But in private residences I almost never see fluorescent lighting. I've lived here 45 years. If the code exists as you say, it obviously is ignored. Well, as he says, it's only been for a few years now. several = few? This is new speak. Paul in San Francisco I don't have any idea what the actual code is, but what I've "heard" is that the requirement only applies if you don't have automatic (motion sensor) light switches. -frank |
#37
Posted to alt.home.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Spiral fluorescent lighting - not getting anywhere near the 5 to 7 year life - anyone else?
On Tue, 10 Apr 2007 00:25:03 -0700 Paul MR wrote:
Frank Cusack wrote: On Mon, 09 Apr 2007 21:40:05 -0700 Paul MR wrote: Bob wrote: The benefit of fluorescent lights is reduced greatly in places where they are only used for short periods of time, such as in bathrooms. For several years, California has had a building code requirement that requires general lighting in bathrooms to be fluorescent. Hard to believe this, except maybe for public bathrooms; I really haven't paid that much attention. But in private residences I almost never see fluorescent lighting. I've lived here 45 years. If the code exists as you say, it obviously is ignored. Well, as he says, it's only been for a few years now. several = few? This is new speak. gimme a break, yes several = few. |
#38
Posted to alt.home.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Spiral fluorescent lighting - not getting anywhere near the 5 to 7 year life - anyone else?
On Mon, 09 Apr 2007 23:13:15 -0700 Frank Cusack wrote:
On Mon, 09 Apr 2007 21:40:05 -0700 Paul MR wrote: Bob wrote: The benefit of fluorescent lights is reduced greatly in places where they are only used for short periods of time, such as in bathrooms. For several years, California has had a building code requirement that requires general lighting in bathrooms to be fluorescent. Hard to believe this, except maybe for public bathrooms; I really haven't paid that much attention. But in private residences I almost never see fluorescent lighting. I've lived here 45 years. If the code exists as you say, it obviously is ignored. Well, as he says, it's only been for a few years now. I don't have any idea what the actual code is, but what I've "heard" is that the requirement only applies if you don't have automatic (motion sensor) light switches. Found it. http://www.energy.ca.gov/title24/200...rds/index.html Beginning 10/1/05, "high efficacy" (can be fluorescent but also other high efficiency technology) lighting MUST be used 100% in bathrooms, UNLESS an occupant sensor is used to control the light. So, only for about a year and a half now, not "several years". -frank |
#39
Posted to alt.home.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Spiral fluorescent lighting - not getting anywhere near the 5to 7 year life - anyone else?
Frank Cusack wrote:
I don't have any idea what the actual code is, but what I've "heard" is that the requirement only applies if you don't have automatic (motion sensor) light switches. Found it. http://www.energy.ca.gov/title24/200...rds/index.html Beginning 10/1/05, "high efficacy" (can be fluorescent but also other high efficiency technology) lighting MUST be used 100% in bathrooms, UNLESS an occupant sensor is used to control the light. So, only for about a year and a half now, not "several years". -frank Thanks so much for locating these regulations, Frank. As a mere home owner and not a professional in the building trades, I am dumbfounded by the extent of the minutia contained therein. Paul in San Francisco |
#40
Posted to alt.home.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Spiral fluorescent lighting - not getting anywhere near the 5to 7 year life - anyone else?
On 4/3/2007 8:04 PM, Bob wrote:
The benefit of fluorescent lights is reduced greatly in places where they are only used for short periods of time, such as in bathrooms. For several years, California has had a building code requirement that requires general lighting in bathrooms to be fluorescent. Creative builders meet this rule by providing a CFL integrated with the exhaust fan while having an incandescent light bar over the mirror. Florescent's lifetime is governed by the heater used to excite the plasma, the gas that floresces or glows. Incandescents by the thermal shock of the filament when it's turned no or off. When turned on, the filament expands; turned off it contracts. An incandescents longest life is when its never turned off (hmmm...maybe when it's never turned on?). The florescent's life is 'total time on'; efficiency is greatest when left on. I'm probably in left field again but just my 2 cents (definitely not sense). -- Ted I wasn't born in Texas but I got back here as soon as I could (Don't forget to take out the trash) If you never try anything new, you'll miss out on many of life's great disappointments. |
Reply |
|
Thread Tools | Search this Thread |
Display Modes | |
|
|
Similar Threads | ||||
Thread | Forum | |||
Fluorescent spiral lights, why not inclosed? | Home Repair | |||
Fluorescent lighting | UK diy | |||
Fluorescent lighting | UK diy | |||
Fluorescent lighting | UK diy | |||
Fluorescent lighting? | Home Repair |