My AC was struggling to stay at 78 degrees this weekend while the
temperature outside was 88. In fact, it seemed to run all day
without stopping because it could not get the house to 78. It was
hanging around 79.

I noticed a few things. First, the air pressure coming out of the
vents seemed low. I recall being able to hear the air at times in
the past. Now I have to put my hand over the vent to see if the air
is on. Second, the air coming out does not seem that cold. Third,
the secondary drip pan, under the unit in the attic had a lot of
water in it (not sure if that is meaningful). Fourth, I openened a
vent in my crawl space and the air under the house felt very cold.

Everything I have read so far suggests that I need a coolant
recharge. And that I probably have a leak. Does that sound right? If
so, how do I go about finding the leak myself? I prefer to try to
cut down on the cost of the repair.

The other thought is that I might have leaky duct work under the
house, hence the cool air there.

Thoughts? Opinions? How much does a recharge cost these days? I live
in the Raliegh NC area.

Thanks!
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Check the air handler filter first. Changing that may solve your
problem, since it sounds like your fan isn't moving much air. If that
doesn't help, then you're only out the cost of a filter (which is
something you should be changing regularly anyway).

" wrote:

My AC was struggling to stay at 78 degrees this weekend while the
temperature outside was 88. In fact, it seemed to run all day
without stopping because it could not get the house to 78. It was
hanging around 79.

I noticed a few things. First, the air pressure coming out of the
vents seemed low. I recall being able to hear the air at times in
the past. Now I have to put my hand over the vent to see if the air
is on. Second, the air coming out does not seem that cold. Third,
the secondary drip pan, under the unit in the attic had a lot of
water in it (not sure if that is meaningful). Fourth, I openened a
vent in my crawl space and the air under the house felt very cold.

Everything I have read so far suggests that I need a coolant
recharge. And that I probably have a leak. Does that sound right? If
so, how do I go about finding the leak myself? I prefer to try to
cut down on the cost of the repair.

The other thought is that I might have leaky duct work under the
house, hence the cool air there.

Thoughts? Opinions? How much does a recharge cost these days? I live
in the Raliegh NC area.

Thanks!
--
----------------------------------------------
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----------------------------------------------

Not sure where you conclude you need a coolant recharge, everything you
describe points to a damaged duct in your crawl space dumping the cooled
air into that space. Suit up and go in and inspect the ductwork for
damage. Could be as simple as a broken duct clamp.

Pete C.

OK, I assume avg Joe here. You don't meant the intake filters in my
house that I replace every 3 months do you?

J
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Is there something better to patch with than duct tape? That sounds
stupid, even as I type it.

J
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" wrote:

Is there something better to patch with than duct tape? That sounds
stupid, even as I type it.

J
--
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The proper duct tape is the metal foil variety. The "common" duct tape
isn't for ducts.

Pete C.

Yes, that's the one. If that's not your problem, I think PeteC may
have a good suggestion in his reply below. Even if the filter does
help it probably wouldn't be a bad idea to crawl under and look for
leaks and to insulate the ducts. If cold air is getting under your
house instead of inside where you want it, you're wasting money.

On Mon, 17 Apr 2006 12:19:48 -0500, Hot ) wrote:

My AC was struggling to stay at 78 degrees this weekend while the
temperature outside was 88. In fact, it seemed to run all day
without stopping because it could not get the house to 78. It was
hanging around 79.

I noticed a few things. First, the air pressure coming out of the
vents seemed low. I recall being able to hear the air at times in
the past. Now I have to put my hand over the vent to see if the air
is on. Second, the air coming out does not seem that cold. Third,
the secondary drip pan, under the unit in the attic had a lot of
water in it (not sure if that is meaningful). Fourth, I openened a
vent in my crawl space and the air under the house felt very cold.

Everything I have read so far suggests that I need a coolant
recharge. And that I probably have a leak. Does that sound right? If
so, how do I go about finding the leak myself? I prefer to try to
cut down on the cost of the repair.

The other thought is that I might have leaky duct work under the
house, hence the cool air there.

Thoughts? Opinions? How much does a recharge cost these days? I live
in the Raliegh NC area.

Thanks!

There are quite a few other problems that could cause the symptoms you
have. The only way to find out what the actual problem is is to call a
local company to look at it. as for finding leaks, there are
electronic leak detectors for that and they are quite expensive.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ +++++++++++
spam protection measure, Please remove the 33 to send e-mail

Update:

I have crawled around in my crawl space inspecting all of the AC
duct work and I can't see a single problem. Some of my flooring
insulation has fallen down (an easy enough repair and unrelated),
but everything looks good so far.

I plan on calling a _local_ AC repair company eventually, I am jsut
gathering recommendations now. Also, I just want to be prepared. If
I can find a problem before I have them come, then that works better
for me.

One other note. I had a national company check my system when this
first happened (end of last summmer) and they said everything looked
good. Mistake 1: I believed them. Mistake 2: I didn't call them on
it when I discovered it.

Any suggestions on what to check next?

J
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"Hot" wrote in message
...
My AC was struggling to stay at 78 degrees this weekend while
the
temperature outside was 88. In fact, it seemed to run all day
without stopping because it could not get the house to 78. It
was
hanging around 79.

I noticed a few things. First, the air pressure coming out of
the
vents seemed low. I recall being able to hear the air at times
in
the past. Now I have to put my hand over the vent to see if the
air
is on. Second, the air coming out does not seem that cold.
Third,
the secondary drip pan, under the unit in the attic had a lot
of
water in it (not sure if that is meaningful). Fourth, I
openened a
vent in my crawl space and the air under the house felt very
cold.

change you filter now

"Hot" wrote in message
...
snip

Take a digitial thermometer with an external probe (like one of the
indoor/outdoor thermometers), put the probe inside the vent and measure the
temperature... Measure the temperature at the warm air exchange (where the
filter is) also... There should be a minimum of 12-16 degreees F difference
between the temperatures... The more difference, the quicker the house will
cool... My current house has a 20 degree F difference and it is able to keep
the temperature at 73F rather easily even here in Hot Ass Houston... If your
temperature difference is sufficient, the problem is not with a freon issue
and also probably not a compressor issue... From there, I would start
looking at the possibility of it being an air handling issue... Maybe
insufficient air being sent throught the system (filter clogged, fan
bearings wearing out, etc)...

" wrote:

Update:

I have crawled around in my crawl space inspecting all of the AC
duct work and I can't see a single problem. Some of my flooring
insulation has fallen down (an easy enough repair and unrelated),
but everything looks good so far.

I plan on calling a _local_ AC repair company eventually, I am jsut
gathering recommendations now. Also, I just want to be prepared. If
I can find a problem before I have them come, then that works better
for me.

One other note. I had a national company check my system when this
first happened (end of last summmer) and they said everything looked
good. Mistake 1: I believed them. Mistake 2: I didn't call them on
it when I discovered it.

Any suggestions on what to check next?

J
--
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----------------------------------------------

Did you have the fan running when you inspected? A duct leak could be
hidden under duct insulation and not be apparent without the system in
operation.

You indicate low air flow from the vents which tends to indicate either
a leak, a restriction or a blower problem. You've not found a leak so
you should check the condition of the blower in the air handler and look
for any possible restrictions in the system. In the case of a
restriction it would likely be near the air handler since it if was on a
particular duct you would likely have high air flow to other ducts.

Since you indicated there was water in the secondary drip pan, that
would tend to indicate the main condensate drain might be clogged though
that is likely not the source of the problem unless perhaps the blower
motor is straining trying to spin the blower in water.

The water in the pan also implies that the refrigeration is working and
that an air supply is getting to the A coil in the air handler. If the
refrigeration was not working the water would not be getting condensed
and if there was an air restriction on the intake side there wouldn't be
a supply of moist air to keep condensing water out of.

Best thing to do is to open the air handler (should just be a couple
screws) and inspect. A squirrel cage blower trying to run partly
submerged in condensate from a plugged drain certainly won't be able to
move much air. A piece of internal duct insulation in the air handler
could have come loose and clogged the output. Certainly should be
relatively easy to inspect.

If the air handler has a belt for the blower it's possible it could have
broken and the air handler is essentially moving no air. You might have
felt a slight flow just from convection.

Pete C.

louie wrote:
Yes, that's the one. If that's not your problem, I think PeteC may
have a good suggestion in his reply below. Even if the filter does
help it probably wouldn't be a bad idea to crawl under and look for
leaks and to insulate the ducts. If cold air is getting under your
house instead of inside where you want it, you're wasting money.

A couple of things to check.

Filter as mentioned.
Also if duct work is in crawl space, could have come loose if seemed
cold, would also be pulling more mist air from outside instead of
recyling and therfore could be the extra water in the drip pan ?

Also check promary pan for the A-coils, mine rusted out last year and
had to fabricate another, got a lot of water in the secondary pan,
noticed after blew out my fan motor with all the water leaking down
through the furnace (furnace checked out fine)

also see if outside condensor coils and unit needs cleaning, may be
dirty no allowing enough air flow to remove all the heat.

I stongly agree that you should open the air handler and physically look
at the cage motor, belt, and make sure it's blowing properly. I don't
think your freon level is low either. Maybe just down the line in your
duct work possible a diverter has shut off ?? If the air is flowing
properly at the unit then go down line past the first split and cut a
small say four inch square opening that you can fold back. Check the
air here. If it's OK bend the metal back and tape it up. Then keep
checking down the line.

J



Grumman-581 wrote:
"Hot" wrote in message
...
snip

Take a digitial thermometer with an external probe (like one of the
indoor/outdoor thermometers), put the probe inside the vent and measure the
temperature... Measure the temperature at the warm air exchange (where the
filter is) also... There should be a minimum of 12-16 degreees F difference
between the temperatures... The more difference, the quicker the house will
cool... My current house has a 20 degree F difference and it is able to keep
the temperature at 73F rather easily even here in Hot Ass Houston... If your
temperature difference is sufficient, the problem is not with a freon issue
and also probably not a compressor issue... From there, I would start
looking at the possibility of it being an air handling issue... Maybe
insufficient air being sent throught the system (filter clogged, fan
bearings wearing out, etc)...

wrote:
My AC was struggling to stay at 78 degrees this weekend while the
temperature outside was 88. In fact, it seemed to run all day
without stopping because it could not get the house to 78. It was
hanging around 79.

I noticed a few things. First, the air pressure coming out of the
vents seemed low. I recall being able to hear the air at times in
the past. Now I have to put my hand over the vent to see if the air
is on. Second, the air coming out does not seem that cold. Third,
the secondary drip pan, under the unit in the attic had a lot of
water in it (not sure if that is meaningful). Fourth, I openened a
vent in my crawl space and the air under the house felt very cold.

Everything I have read so far suggests that I need a coolant
recharge. And that I probably have a leak. Does that sound right? If
so, how do I go about finding the leak myself? I prefer to try to
cut down on the cost of the repair.

The other thought is that I might have leaky duct work under the
house, hence the cool air there.

Thoughts? Opinions? How much does a recharge cost these days? I live
in the Raliegh NC area.

Thanks!

My guess is your ducts are leaking like crazy, probably near the
evaporator where the pressure is highest.

--
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"Hot" wrote in message
...
My AC was struggling to stay at 78 degrees this weekend while the
temperature outside was 88. In fact, it seemed to run all day
without stopping because it could not get the house to 78. It was
hanging around 79.

I noticed a few things. First, the air pressure coming out of the
vents seemed low. I recall being able to hear the air at times in
the past. Now I have to put my hand over the vent to see if the air
is on. Second, the air coming out does not seem that cold. Third,
the secondary drip pan, under the unit in the attic had a lot of
water in it (not sure if that is meaningful). Fourth, I openened a
vent in my crawl space and the air under the house felt very cold.


If the air flow is low, you can have several problems. Check the air filter
to see how dirty it is. Look where the lines comming from the outside unit
go into the air handler. If there is ice then you may need the unit
recharged with the refrigerant (freon) . Seems strange, but low refrigerant
will cause an ice condition for a while. Also see if it feels cold on the
larger line. YOu may also have a leak in the duct work. Check to see if
the fan in the air handler is turning up to speed.

On Mon, 17 Apr 2006 12:19:48 -0500, Hot ) wrote:

My AC was struggling to stay at 78 degrees this weekend while the
temperature outside was 88. In fact, it seemed to run all day
without stopping because it could not get the house to 78. It was
hanging around 79.

I noticed a few things. First, the air pressure coming out of the
vents seemed low. I recall being able to hear the air at times in
the past. Now I have to put my hand over the vent to see if the air
is on.

If the air pressure is low, your neighbor may have tapped into your
AC. Look for air ducts between your house and his.

They may be buried, so look for signs of recently dug trenches. Such
as damaged grass, unlevel soil.

Second, the air coming out does not seem that cold. Third,
the secondary drip pan, under the unit in the attic had a lot of
water in it (not sure if that is meaningful). Fourth, I openened a
vent in my crawl space and the air under the house felt very cold.

Possibly your children are stockpiling cold air there, because they
heard that the price of oil will be going up. This is a much talked
about remedy on teen chat lines.

Everything I have read so far suggests that I need a coolant
recharge. And that I probably have a leak. Does that sound right? If
so, how do I go about finding the leak myself? I prefer to try to
cut down on the cost of the repair.

The other thought is that I might have leaky duct work under the
house, hence the cool air there.

Thoughts? Opinions? How much does a recharge cost these days? I live
in the Raliegh NC area.

Thanks!

Grumman-581 wrote:

"Hot" wrote in message
m...
snip

Take a digitial thermometer with an external probe (like one of the
indoor/outdoor thermometers), put the probe inside the vent and measure the
temperature... Measure the temperature at the warm air exchange (where the
filter is) also... There should be a minimum of 12-16 degreees F difference
between the temperatures... The more difference, the quicker the house will
cool... My current house has a 20 degree F difference and it is able to keep
the temperature at 73F rather easily even here in Hot Ass Houston... If your
temperature difference is sufficient, the problem is not with a freon issue
and also probably not a compressor issue... From there, I would start
looking at the possibility of it being an air handling issue... Maybe
insufficient air being sent throught the system (filter clogged, fan
bearings wearing out, etc)...


Check to see if the evaporator coil is iced over. Check the blower to
see if it is operating in condensate water, as stated!
That will burn out the motor, so pull it and dump the water before
operating the unit again.
When operating with normal airflow and a clean blower wheel and
evaporator and 400-cfm per ton (12,000-btuh) the temperature drop should
be around 16 to 20-F. A heavy humidity load will cause a less or lower
temp difference/drop. A graph on a couple of my web site pages
illustrates the latent load effects.
http://www.udarrell.com/air-conditio...tent-heat.html

Second Graph-Pages loading ultra slow, wait if problem with Server!

If the evaporator ices over after running it a while with normal airflow
until then, it could be a refrigerant problem.
Run the furnace for a short while and then shut everything down until
the A/C tech comes.
http://www.udarrell.com/ac-trouble-shooting-chart.html
- Darrell

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Send the Free Dish Satellite link to your friends. - Darrell
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your cooling coil may be clogged with dirt... the blower gets dirt on
em that cuts flow also..best to clean the outside and inside coils,,and
fan blower...if it still wont cool after that, get a tech to look at
it...

http://www.minibite.com/america/malone.htm

On Mon, 17 Apr 2006 16:56:09 -0500, Still_hot ) wrote:


One other note. I had a national company check my system when this
first happened (end of last summmer) and they said everything looked
good. Mistake 1: I believed them.

Did you pay them? How much?

Mistake 2: I didn't call them on
it when I discovered it.

What do you mean "when I discovered it"? What have you discovered
since the end of last summer when they were there?

Because I don't know the details, I'm not sure what you mean by saying
you didn't call them on it.

But are you sure it's too late? Did you pay them for an inspection
and that payment was supposed to be applied to the cost of repairing
it? Maybe you can still do that, but I think you actually have to
find the problem. (Are there more than one?)

Do you just want a refund because they didnt' find the problem? You
haven't found it either, so we don't have evidence there is a findable
problem. I'm guessing you won't get a refund at all, and certainly
not this much later, except maybe by the most dutiful company, and if
they are that good, I'd let them do the repair.

Any suggestions on what to check next?